Mini 1566: Lunar Silver Star Story Complete (Game Over)

[BROseidon]

YOU STOLE MY FIRST.

VOTE: SANGRES

[BROseidon]

OP strats!

[BROseidon]

I should get on this game!

[BROseidon]

Mara says Bro always thinks she's scum and so does AJ.

oh also sangres and i are mason lover vig doctors

discuss!

Do I?

Only games I remember having with her are my first newbie game (town read her for most of day 1 when she was scum), Syry's hard-boiled game (she was scum, I don't remember having a read on the her/jiffy hydra before getting NK'd N2 for being the tracker), Emp's game before your cross-game referencing forced me to replace out (and she was a claimed mason so...), and NY167 where we were scum together (btw I still haven't collected my Mara hydra).

That's a bizarre thing for her to think, then, unless I'm forgetting something.

[BROseidon]

AD has played with me twice

Does that change things ?

No, it doesn't.

wat.

VOTE: Mac for now.

[BROseidon]

Cause they posted it in the form of a question. It struck me as odd so I'm rolling with it. It's a gut thing, you wouldn't understand.

Do you generally find that people's gut-reads misalign with yours?

[BROseidon]

wtf like 5 posts.

Let me finish catching up jesus.

[BROseidon]

hmph...
SMP where are you? Why have you only had ONE post all game? I don't even think I'm usually this quiet, especially in a fast moving game like this.

Why the tunnel on SMP when I'd been equally inactive up to this point?

[BROseidon]

bro where the fuck are you?

lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala

I was going to be active last night, but then I stayed up till after 3 playing LoL with AP.

[BROseidon]

Bad bro bad

Bad

[BROseidon]

I don't know how I feel about Jake's replace out bit.
It doesn't seem like he would manipulate the mod in order to make a replacement more likely to go through, but I could be wrong about that.

Jake pulls that sort of shit as either alignment, iirc.

[BROseidon]

AD has played with me twice

Does that change things ?

No, it doesn't.

wat.

VOTE: Mac for now.

Please try again.

While I'll be switching my vote presently, I'm going on the record saying that the strength with which you and AD are town reading Mac is a little bizarre. Like, relative to the giant pile of null/null-scum that's this game, the read's not terrible, but it feels a bit gun-jumpy.

[BROseidon]

AD and sangres are my strongest town reads right now, and even that's, like, fairly marginal as far as read strength for page 11 goes.

VOTE: phd

[BROseidon]

bork's not being as frequent with VC's as I'm used to :/

[BROseidon]

Your line of reasoning there was illogical.

[BROseidon]

Is it still opportunistic if AD has never played with Jake before?

AD has played with me twice

Does that change things ?

Not sure if "opportunistic" is the right term, but AD voting for someone for doing something that they always do, and that AD should be aware of them always doing, is worth noting. The context of AD having played with Jake does change things, and you brushing it off like it doesn't is a bizarre line of reasoning.

[BROseidon]

AD and sangres are my strongest town reads right now, and even that's, like, fairly marginal as far as read strength for page 11 goes.

VOTE: phd

why are you voting phd

He's a scumread, and he's getting wagoned.

[BROseidon]

If everyone could stop making tons of posts at a time in a row (4 from Mac, 5 from the cat, 7 from Bro...), that would be absolutely fantastic.

Walls are anti-town. I'd rather have a person's catch up split into 10 posts than having it be in a single massive wall.

And the thing I was complaining about isn't that there's a lot of posts, it's that there's a fair number of votes moving b/w the VCs, which means I have to manually track some flow stuff later.

[BROseidon]

Jake's replace-out thing is null. It wasn't a very strong threat, real or not.

Aegor going for a policy lynch on Hello Kitty bugs me, unless he has some meta reason to think their hydra behavior is a scum tell. I haven't seen any explanation from him. Happy with my vote for now.

Be useful.

[BROseidon]

AD and sangres are my strongest town reads right now, and even that's, like, fairly marginal as far as read strength for page 11 goes.

VOTE: phd

why are you voting phd

He's a scumread, and he's getting wagoned.

Why am I a scumread though?

Hyper defensiveness, mostly.

I would write a full case if I weren't lazy.

[BROseidon]

If you multi post, but say walls are anti-town, to make your posts a wall, you just take out the lines separating them. And I'm not talking about all your posts, just the 10 in a row that are all one liners taking up half a page, which makes the whole thing much more annoying to read. You could at least just make it into 2 or 3 whole posts, just to meet halfway. But saying you have no problem with posting a bunch of one liners in a row, but that walls are anti-town, doesn't add up at all.

Anything's more annoying to read in a wall.

Posts should be like paragraphs, one post to one idea.

[BROseidon]

Err, Nothing's more annoying*

[BROseidon]

But I'm not brushing it off like it doesn't exist, I'm talking about it regardless. It didn't have to be Dan, it could been you, me or any player. Perhaps it's the wording.

I don't get what you're gunning at.

This point seems tangential to the original conversation.

[BROseidon]

Excuse me, but I'm uncomfortable with PhD lynch as long as catboi is voting to lynch him... Not one half-decent post so far from catboi, and a bit of a reversal in the two posts above. I'm under the impression catboi might just be really bad at scum and posting short/forgettable posts on purpose. Also, how quickly he followed onto this wagon, especially before this wagon was really a thing, makes me worry even more that catboi == scum && PhdScar != scum.

While I don't agree with the "I don't like the people on this wagon so let me get off" logic (LET THEM BUS THEIR PARTNERS, I SAY!), I thank you for that quote juxtaposition.

VOTE: cat

[BROseidon]

I'm gonna lol so hard if HKC and Jake are scum together.

AD, I want your opinion on that.

[BROseidon]

your new avatar is disturbing.

Dodger has the most swag.

[BROseidon]

What makes you think they could be scum together?

Jake just came out of a game where scum-him and scum-dramonic cross-bussed each other for the entire game. AD was also in that game, so I want his opinion on whether he's getting the same feeling from the nature of Jake's push here as he did in that game.

[BROseidon]

Should've lynched scar when you guys had the chance.

Yo, talk to me.

[BROseidon]

Should've lynched scar when you guys had the chance.

Yo, talk to me.

Nevar.

>:C

[BROseidon]

457-459 is bizarre.

[BROseidon]

SMP isn't playing like his other 2 completed games where he was town

This. Sample. Size.

I can't.

[BROseidon]

Oh look Jake found more games.

I still don't like the lack of scum meta to compare to.

[BROseidon]

VOTE: SMP

hmph...
SMP where are you? Why have you only had ONE post all game? I don't even think I'm usually this quiet, especially in a fast moving game like this.

Why the tunnel on SMP when I'd been equally inactive up to this point?

[BROseidon]

VOTE: SMP

hmph...
SMP where are you? Why have you only had ONE post all game? I don't even think I'm usually this quiet, especially in a fast moving game like this.

Why the tunnel on SMP when I'd been equally inactive up to this point?

Same for you. Why you posting elsewhere but not here.

Eh?

I've been fairly inactive site-wide.

Also this game bores me.

[BROseidon]

He just got here?

[BROseidon]

Hardly? I was barely active in games over the past 3 days...

[BROseidon]

Hardly? I was barely active in games over the past 3 days...

33 posts over 3 dats between posts here is hardly ?

A fair number of those are in Speakeasy, and that's still pretty low for me.

[BROseidon]

The other players I'd consider lynching are kdub, Aegor and AJ. Which is part of why I liked your catch-up. SMP is a maybe, which could firm up tonight, but I doubt it.

Had you mentioned any of these before the Anti replace-in?

[BROseidon]

and inconsistent shit since SCUM DON'T MAKE FUCKING CASES

I think I've written more cases per capita as scum than as town?

[BROseidon]

This game is the worst.

I'd vote Jake to make this game less terrible, but I think he's town :/

I'm still fine with my SMP vote.

pedit: It's not, but I was reading.

[BROseidon]

Given the playerlist, scum are probably 2/3 in the group with fewer posts than me.

[BROseidon]

Given the playerlist, scum are probably 2/3 in the group with fewer posts than me.

I don't understand this, other than the fact I find it particularly ridiculous?

That's it for now, I'll be back tonight or tomorrow to catch up

This is positional off of sangres-town, Jake-town, and HKC-town reads.

Scum have a lot of noise to misdirect behind. No reason for them not to.

[BROseidon]

Vote: Shroomish

I'm going back here. My lean-townread has been utterly obliterated over the course of this page.

Mac, did you get scum this game? This post is bad :/

[BROseidon]

20 hours :/

I want the SMP lynch, but wouldn't be crying any rivers as long as it isn't me/anti/sangres/jake/HKC at this point.

[BROseidon]

Vote: Shroomish

I'm going back here. My lean-townread has been utterly obliterated over the course of this page.

Mac, did you get scum this game? This post is bad :/

You can explain why if you want, meanwhile here's why my townread was decimated. Shroomish agreed with sangres townread of me a few pages back, preceded to never mention me again until the vote and, despite two people asking,

is still yet to explain his vote.

This is a characteristic I'd associate with newish scum who forget how they faked their reads and I think it ties in here - since he hasn't given a direct read on me, he's forgotten that he agreed with sangres townread of me. The "shit, 24 hours" comment followed by starting a brand, shiny new wagon felt extremely fake and the lack of explanation & follow up to it has left me feeling rather uneasy with the whole thing.

Vote: Shroomish

It's how strongly you stated the read was destroyed, despite the fact that it wasn't a strong read in the first place.

[BROseidon]

You fuckers should have given my my SMP wagon yesterday.

[BROseidon]

Although it's bizarre that the main associative I had on SMP is with the slot that's 1v1ing him right now.

Oh well, I'll take being right for the wrong reasons.

[BROseidon]

Also, nobody put SMP at L-1 for threat of self-hammer.

I want to do some more reading/engagement today.

[BROseidon]

Trying to read this game is the worst :/

[BROseidon]

Well that wagon formed fast.

Seems unlikely scum would bus at this point, or let pressure on a buddy build this far. Mac-town implies one of {Anti, Jake, Aegor} scum, and then probably 1-off for the other scum.

[BROseidon]

So:

{Mac, Anti, Jake, Aegor}

{Squirrel, HKC, kdub, zMuffin}

Will start there when I do some rereading, etc.

[BROseidon]

Will get to this later today.

[BROseidon]

Someone summarize the mac wagon for me.

[BROseidon]

p-edit: because when BRO ups his game, he's an incredible asset to the town. I've never really played with you. Do I regret the decision? Given his lack of content here, obviously I do.

shhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[BROseidon]

Seriously, though, everything on Mac's claim checks out fine.

The amount of theory fail b/w anti and jake is lulz.

[BROseidon]

Last time I said, "scum are clearly pushing bad theory to get a mislynch on a town pr," it turned out to be mostly town players (and relatively strong ones at that, HI FFERY) who were fucking up in really stupid ways.

VOTE: SG holding my vote here for now.

[BROseidon]

V/LA through Monday

[BROseidon]

I'm with zMuffin, we should mass claim at this point.

[BROseidon]

I'm gonna spend all weekend either drunk or with my bf so... (Haven't seen him in 2 months)

[BROseidon]

inorite?

[BROseidon]

lalalalalala just ignore me not providing content.

[BROseidon]

Although we should just mass claim at this point.

[BROseidon]

Everyone's had that urge all game lol

[BROseidon]

I'd set an order, but:

1) I'm not the boss of everyone (as much as I'd like to be) and

2) I don't remember who other than me hasn't claimed yet.

[BROseidon]

Cop cleared BRO.
BRO has decided to coast after that and stop trying.

Ruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude. I could never be doing things intentionally, ever.

If I'm the only one unclaimed, I kind of want to fuck with scum and stay unclaimed, but it's kind of moot at this point.

I'm a VT.

[BROseidon]

After his claim of Miller Doc I and others voted HKC, and other people and HKC voted for me - I personally think this makes me obv. town also, though less than Jake or BRO.

Is this because scum-designated mislynch (and if so, who was the scum designating it), or because probability (in which case, your logic is bad and you should feel bad)

[BROseidon]

Maybe it is more the fact that a "confirmed" inno has survived this long without doing anything and does not even respond to requests to do so.

Dat logic, though.

[BROseidon]

I just do not think he should be allowed to live to lylo.

lol.

If I'm alive at LyLo, then this scum is very brave.

[BROseidon]

V/LA though next Monday for finals

[BROseidon]

You guys should really just let me coast.

Mac confirms himself on the self-watcher, since that creates a stronger innocent than the one on me (Unless he's changed his policy, he doesn't let scum use their own ability and the factional nk).

Will have more thoughts when I get time to sift through this game.

[BROseidon]

carry me pls mastin.

I have finals through Monday, but them I'm done with college for ever (although senior week is gonna be a drunken stupor because lol).

[BROseidon]

Pretty sure last scum is kdub or Aegor, though.

VOTE: kdub sheeping mastin is fun!

[BROseidon]

I'm in finals period and playing with what the gamestate was before the crash, as much as I was following it then (which was more than I let on, but still not super-intense).

Mac is confirmable on penguin, both are very likely town.

You're probably town.

SG was probably SDML yesterday.

So many options left...

[BROseidon]

Don't got nothin'.

[BROseidon]

@BRO - why aren't you replacing out?

Why are you being unreasonably rude?

[BROseidon]

BRO, why are you voting me?

PoE

[BROseidon]

@BRO - why aren't you replacing out?

Why are you being unreasonably rude?

Also, I would have used nastier language here, but I respect bork too much to force him to warn me.

[BROseidon]

@BRO - why aren't you replacing out?

Why are you being unreasonably rude?

Also, I would have used nastier language here, but I respect bork too much to force him to warn me.

I don't feel I deserve harsh language and I also don't think I'm being rude.

Conter question -

do you find your play up to snuff for a confirmed town?

Because if your answer is 'yes' Then *I* need to replace out.

"As confirmed town, you should make yourself as big of a threat as possible so that scum nightkill you, instead of making suboptimal kills!"

[BROseidon]

Your play isn't "ruining my fun," since I've been finding mafia unfun for a while and am taking a break after this game, but for you to insinuate that I'm not playing with some semblance of strategy towards this game is remarkably insulting.

[BROseidon]

Now, if you want to contest that the strategy I've used this game is suboptimal, fine, go ahead, but fact of the matter is I've baited scum into at least 1 suboptimal kill while having been on a scum wagon day 1 (which I would have been on day 2 had it not been a flashwagon).

[BROseidon]

Replace out if you're going to be a whiney bitch about me using a strategy that you disagree with.

[BROseidon]

Like, seriously, starting the game playing like a protective PR to bait an NK as a VT is a valid strategy.

Playing post-inno weakly to bait scum into shooting elsewhere to remove scum hunting pressure from the rest of town is a valid strategy.

The fact that you're playing dumb on this and trying to antagonize me about it is either:

A) Incredibly stupid or

B) Scummy, because you're trying to calibrate whether I'm a worthwhile NK target.

[BROseidon]

Did you not read the part where I think it's you or Aegor, and I think you're more likely scum than Aegor?

[BROseidon]

And, like, mastin isn't cleared, but I have a town read on the slot.

[BROseidon]

Makes passive-aggressive comment about my play.

Gets upset when I call her out on it.

ftr–if you're scum looking for an easy way out of a losing game, I'm blacklisting you. I'd be tempted to do it off your behavior even if you're town, but it doesn't qualify as "cheating" in my book (which is the only thing I blacklist for)

[BROseidon]

Waiting on penguin to post content :/

[BROseidon]

But I wanna chat with penguin

It's been a while since we've shot the shit, since we haven't hydra'd together since Street Racers: Vegas.

[BROseidon]

@Mod, going to Europe on vacation, V/LA through the 23rd.

Not a lot interesting happening here. I want the kdub flip at this point.

[BROseidon]

3 options:

1) Mac is scum who used his other ability on penguin to "confirm" himself.

2) We have a 2nd protective PR in play that hasn't claimed

3) Final scum is a ninja.

[BROseidon]

We've already mass claimed, so if it's option 2, that person should probably claim.

[BROseidon]

I don't see why scum would NK at this point other than to try to bluff one of the above three.

[BROseidon]

If you all lynch me because I "might" be a godfather put into the game to compensate for a 1-shot cop, then y'all seriously need to get your heads checked.

[BROseidon]

Did some VCA skimming based on my memory of the various gamestates, and I'm getting some wonky stuff.

I'm not gonna decide on a vote today until I have a chance to sit down and do a full reread, which probably won't happen till I'm back in the states Monday or Tuesday.

[BROseidon]

BROseidon's additionally far more likely to be town than not thanks if nothing else to what I said. It might be a bad tell, but I feel like it's a legitimate one. BROseidon, in Tales, was among the strongest advocates that AP was town throughout the whole game. He had a result on AP. Thoughts of AP being the godfather were dismissed. And even post-game, BROseidon defended his decision, saying it was correct by the math to trust in the result. Now maybe, BROseidon is capable of isolating games so that what he said in that game was entirely detached from this game. Maybe, what he said was a mathematician's answer in that he meant it for this game too in that the result in general should be trusted even if in this specific case it was wrong. But I really don't think so. I really think his attitude there is reflected in his lack of being scum-GF here.

I'd call this "wrong logic, right conclusion"

I'm pretty sure I'm the most numbers-driven player on this site. Before I come off hiatus, I'm probably going to program an excel spreadsheet that tells me how I should push things based on the conditional probabilities I assign to people being town/scum based on other people being town/scum, and the utility of a lynch given a town or scum result (doing that out by hand would be way too much work).

[BROseidon]

Is there any vehement opposition to lynching Mac? Where is everyone?

I want to do a full-reread once I'm back from vacation, which will happen with plenty of time left in the day.

[BROseidon]

Gonna get to a full reread tonight. Will post thoughts then.

[BROseidon]

Okay, fell asleep before doing my read-through. Doing it now while I watch USA vs. Germany.

First thought is that Aegor is town based on 116. Aegor-scum would imply Jake-slot town, and with Jake-slot applying early pressure to a scum buddy that just got discredited by the most reputable slot in the game, it wouldn't make sense to increase that pressure. The bus could wait a day or two.

[BROseidon]

Wish Sangres was alive so I could ask them about 129

[BROseidon]

So I got bored reading the whole game, and decided to do some partite stuff.

Why would AD get killed N1? He had 26 posts, and scum either figured out he was a PR, or his death strongly implies that mastin is the last scum.

[BROseidon]

but, no. I need time to process this claim which seems to be entirely plausible, and time to figure out wtf dan had gotten killed last night

This makes me want to read less into that NK, though :/

[BROseidon]

well obviously someone in mafia figured out he was the DV, not that hard cause that is who I thought the DV was and if I can figure it out, people way smarter than me certainly did.

Grossssssssssssss

[BROseidon]

hm was brushing teeth and started thinking

if he was roleblocked, why did he claim a result? even if he is scum, smart option is just to be honest and claim roleblocked

so if he is scum, either he is what he claimed he is and got lucky guessing my role and is lying stupidly about it when he knows somebody blocked him orrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr he's scum who doesn't have an action that he'd know was blocked in which case that's a really weird fake claim

or something i'm not thinking of right now

anyway. sleep time

grossssssssss

[BROseidon]

Actually not that gross. I'm dumb

[BROseidon]

Actually, I need to think about that post more as to what it means. It's a valid point that leads to bizarre bizarreness.

[BROseidon]

Jakeslot is probably town, I think.

[BROseidon]

I wish mastin and penguin replaced into the opposite slots. Is it too late to have this happen?

[BROseidon]

From a game-flow perspective, it'd be a bizarre choice for Jake/HKC as scum together to say, "Hey, we just lost one person, let's cross-bus really hard instead of going mislynch->x-bus"

[BROseidon]

vote: mac

when smp was getting run up the first time, he had like 5 votes and mac was defensive of smp and trying to smear my name. He also was lightly defensive of SMP during the anti/smp claim thing but said smp is the only viable lynch. Given smp fliped a scum pr, this defense stands out to me.

The people most likely partners with SMP are in the group of mac/hkc/zmuffinman with mac/zmuffin the most likely pair.

Looking at the interactions between the 3, smp/mac/zmuffin REALLY make sense. Somebody check my work

wait wtf

[BROseidon]

Looking at the interactions between the 3, smp/mac/zmuffin REALLY make sense. Somebody check my work

Not sure if I buy into Mac.

Want to run up Muffin instead? I buy into Muffin.

lollllll

[BROseidon]

Guys, should I read the Jake/Muffin pissing contest?

[BROseidon]

From my POV:

I get 2 lynches out of 5 people. That's a raw 40% chance of catching scum.

All the other townies have 2 lynches out of 4 people if they don't get mislynched themselves.

Right now I'm in the realm of:

beastcharizard
Mac

mastin

penguin
Aegor

In terms of most->least wanting to lynch.

[BROseidon]

Maybe swap beast and Mac.

[BROseidon]

Anti, not sure if you're following the thread, but next time you're a role blocker, you should say, "I WILL ROLEBLOCK X PERSON IF WE GET A SCUMFLIP" so that we could have a 2nd conftown after your death :/

[BROseidon]

I suppose this in particular is also setting off alarm bells.

I'm displaying a trend, quite strongly, that you perceived in Anything Goes. Not only is the trend similar, but virtually identical, in that you have a confirmed role yet I'm thinking you're scum in spite of that. The timing's even the same: not pushing you yesterday (two days before lylo/mylo), but pushing you the day before lylo/mylo with a self-admitted backup-plan of sorts. (It should be fairly obvious that a scuMastin is going to set up an Aegor/PA lylo. Because if PA continues to townread me, it'd lead to victory, and if not, if she voted me, then a scuMastin would gamble on paranoia that she's not conftown and plead to Aegor about it, pointing out the town trends and emphasizing all the town things I've done.
Oh. And did I mention the waffling, under the guise of paranoia? That, too.)

And yet, in spite of that...I'm just a possibility? Even your language usage is implying that you think I'm faking stuff. ("quit the charade" is not a phrase you mutter to a town player often, yaknow.) Aegor's at the top of the list, in spite of the fact that by all reasonable accounts, you should be having me as much more than just a possibility. Why so little focus on me? Why just default to Aegor? Like, you said why you haven't bothered sorting me...but why not, when I've shown what to you should be a red flag warning sign?

I don't understand it coming from a town-you. I can't see how, not even in apathy, you'd just casually think, "eh, Mastin may be scum"...
...ESPECIALLY knowing my skill as a scum player. If the possibility existed for me being scum, why instantly just place Aegor above me when simply put, Aegor's not nearly as competent a scum player as I am? When leaving a scuMastin alive a day could spell the town's death? What makes Aegor that strong a read, and me such an insignificant one?

I don't get it.

Why this soft of a response here, when, when I called you out on something similar in Tales of You (your response to AP's entrance from AG in Tales being the same across both games) you responded more pointedly?

[BROseidon]

Why would AD get killed N1? He had 26 posts, and scum either figured out he was a PR, or his death strongly implies that mastin is the last scum.

Umm...I replaced in day four, not day one?

(As if we needed more proof BROseidon was town, this is a fairly huge townslip.)

Uh, AD was tunneling your slot.

[BROseidon]

VOTE: Mac

[BROseidon]

I did it?

...I did it!

I did it!

You have no clue how much small victories like this one help me.

And we managed to do it without turning on each other and ruining the game!

[BROseidon]

Also, Jake:

1) Me being alive reduced pressure from other players in their scum hunting. From everyone else's POV, they only had to get 2 good townreads for town to have an auto-win after the HKC lynch.

2) It's not like I wasn't reading the game and not giving reads. I put down votes and was generally decently on-point with them (got the HKC wrong, but I had SMP early and consistently in day 1, had highshroomish as "not something we should lynch right now," which was better than the rest of the game, and ultimately pushed the game in the right direction on Mac while strong-townreading the one guy that was giving most other people trouble)

3) I did all of this while

not

being a highly toxic force in game and causing large amounts of disruption. Jake, for as strong of a scum hunter as you are, every game I've played with you where you've been town has been unfun while you've been alive (granted, n=2 here, but that doesn't seem to be unique to those games given what posting I've seen you have elsewhere). Yes, Muffin can be a huge dick and also needs to learn a lesson in toxicity, but at the end of the day, you both acted in highly inappropriate ways that were detrimental to your wincon and forced you both out of the game, which put undue pressure on Bork to find a replacement.

[BROseidon]

And now I can go on hiatus on a high note, at least.