A lady from the child protective services comes to check on the Gallagher family. Inside, she finds:
Fiona covered in dirt after digging up a dead body in the yard, Mickey sprawled on the kitchen table having a bullet removed from his buttocks and Debbie bragging about almost drowning a city girl.
good news is i think im good to go for this game, yessir
Anen ISO first because he's a wagon
Spoiler: getting a handle on the narrative of this game
In post 89, Aneninen wrote:2. Making exciting a game by shooting a conf-townie? ^_^ Okay, here's something else. Realizing that a scum was fake-claiming at L–1 by analysing his parallel online activity.
In post 157, Aneninen wrote:If Tiershift gets lynched and he flips town (I don't think it'll happen but what if I'm an idiot in this game?), I'll be able to move on and start doing something useful. If I get lynched, I'll flip town (yes, you can't be sure about this but this will happen) and two things can happen later. If Tiershift's scum, he still can be caught later (via investigation, confirming townies, interaction, whatever). Maybe together with his partner. If Tiershift's town too, by lynching me the town can get rid of a player whose presence is detrimental.
Either lynch can reveal plenty of things about others too (VCA, interactions, etc.)
In post 157, Aneninen wrote:I'm pretty much aware of the fact that I can't imagine any possibilities withouht a scum-Tiershift. (I'm not sure whether it is called conf-biasing or tinfoiling or something else.)
I also understand that some of you are scumreading me because of that.
Regardless of your reads on me I don't think I'll ever be able to townread Tiershift in this game.
So, for me it's a kind of "either you or me" situation.
Therefore, if most of you think that I may be right about him, let's lynch Tiershift. If you think I'm a scum deathtunnelling him, lynch me.
you werent making sure you have your bearings straight before going down this Tier rabbit hole
Way too much ISOing to do, so I'm skipping the middle part for now to get to the "case" on TS.
(1) He acts as if there had been only the Page1 slip about him. He's been posting many times things like
"either you think it was a slip or not and if not, you have nothing against me"
. This, in this form hasn't been true for a long time.
(2) He keeps misrepresenting me, I pointed out it eg. in my last post.
(3) As I explained a couple of days ago, he can be scum with our without Shos.
(4) He launches a Setup speculation. Scums usually do that.
(5) Despite he said many times that I was scumhunting by finding the team before getting a scumflip, he's been doing the same with ThisChristmas and me.
(6) His style. I saw that in a game where he was scum. He's much more "grumpy", eg. suggesting ThisChristmas to replace out.
I know that I could have written more about this but (1) I'm tired IRL and (2) I'm a bit frustrated because it seems that noone takes my case against TierShift too seriously.
In post 917, Aneninen wrote:I don't have time to respond everything now, but I must point this out: the scums are lining up so as to get me lynched.
Everyone, who's town: assume for a short while at least that I'm town and check who thinks that I'm scum. Check their ISOs next. The scums are there.
(And I'm pretty sure that TierShift is one of them.)
Remember: it's almost sure that they're only ONE single mislynch from winning.
I just looked at Page 1 and I Don't see a slip. I don't know why you're remarking that scums are lining up to get you lynched. Leave that trash-posting for me to do because that's what I say. Just kidding!
And I just read that you're going to explain why Tier is scum since you say it's not the slip that's causing you to scumread him. I don't know if I or you are misreading.
I also don't understand what you meant by how either Shos or Tier has to logically be scum. I don't think they're together, because I think if they were scum together, I think they are in decent enough positions where they don't need to put each other at risk like that with what they're doing today.
For me, too much information can be a burden. This game, it isn't the case, I have just been extremely demotivated. I think you're null because I think there's a barrier that keeps me from getting your stances clear. But your play has been loads better than mine *laugh*
When you remarked that you feel like scum are lining up your lynch, I want to know what you think about me saying that you haven't generated discussions and then followed them up after letting them manifest.
Off to read other people's ISOs. Like I said I should be really active the rest of the way. Luckily I'm still alive LOL
In post 968, Toon Fighter wrote:Why I think anen is a good lynch? Well, the fact that both shos and TS are supporting it, that the claim does not work well in the setup after my analysis this afternoon, my previous scum read on him came back, and, damn, am i not allowed to change my views? Also, have you looked at the way anen reacted to the (building of interest in the) wagon? It raised some scum-radar hairs in the back of my head. Mostly that. I'd rather support a popular lynch that I actually believe might be scum than a player where I am not so sure and has no popular force behind.
in all seriousness, what did Anen claim again? I'm looking again for that. How does it not make sense? Again, mine didn't make sense apparently because of WHO my character is, so knowing that, I Don't really hold cases based on "his flavor doesn't match" with high regard. If it's his claim, I understand but there are always red herrings.
OH sorry. So it looks like Anen claimed commuter. Commuter, voyeur, gun smith, 1 or 2 shot tracker are the claims? Anyways, commuter if limited kinda negates the tracker.
Voyeur is Tier, and his role seems powerful enough so that town isn't super weak, even if the tracker and commuter are limited (I'm guessing the commuter is)
In post 964, Toon Fighter wrote:Focus, guys. After my analysis I am more confused than ever. All I know is that TS is more likely town than scum, shos is 99% town, and between the other 3 scum is somewhere. Ranked by most likely to least:
anen
Alch
TC
But GAH! This game! I feel so invested right now. And the thought of guessing right today and having to suffer through two more weeks of this... OMG I CANT EVEN
how is it suffering when you're actually engaged? i hate to say this, but do you know how bad i would kill to be in your position of being caught up and engaged and in the moment? would be so much more fun that way
Plenty of nulls, for a long time. Maybe that Toon-vote is a null too? (140 and around).
Promises a change in 167 but nothing really happens.
The Shos-vote in 232 is without any reasons.
The ToonFighter vote in 395 is similar. Just as 431 for TierShift. And Alchemist in 600... (Need I go on with this vote-analysis?)
Dodged Estival's question in 407. 633 is a "readlist". Yet again, no content with it.
Having read 756 again, I don't understand the question. (Shos was the one who talked about getting roleblocked first.) 760's
"I don't know what the plan is. But scum are in total control. They are earning this win. I'm not doing enough. End of"
– ???! 867 – and now he has internet problems. He was shopping before. And being busy IRL before that. Isn't it weird?
Summary.
Surprisingly very little content. Basicly nothing town-ish. The only problem is that I've seen such useless townies before, just as lurkscums. If it weren't for our bad situation I'd join this wagon (if we still didn't lynch TierShift) but now I don't know what to think.
Very inconclusive. props to combing through the game and my posts. im reserving judgment until i understand WHY you are voting tiershift right now. your posts seem very impulsive Given how you've been full throttle at times iwth Tier, even proclaiming he slipped.
but if you just looked at my ISO, how can you say "i dont know what to think."
So, you either think I'm overwhelmed sheep and town who does squat. Or, I'm lurkscum.
i dont really see Anen-scum, either im gullible or he just is lost and doesnt have the fundamental grasps of whats going on in this game cos IRL
In post 912, Toon Fighter wrote:anen, what is you opinion about TS's claim? Does that make him more or less scum in your POV?
In post 915, Toon Fighter wrote:TierShift, I was just thinking about your claim. Why did you target shos N1?
In post 891, Toon Fighter wrote:TS is in a very bad light here. Wouldn't be upset if the wagon went down on him.
Wait. Why? Because he voted Anen while everyone was twiddling their fingers without voting in a likely MYLO? A vote wouldn't lead to a quickhammer in that case. He did not just jump on a wagon on a whim. So what did you not like about his vote?
In post 889, TierShift wrote:ugghhhh shos you are the one not talking about my suspicions
In post 890, TierShift wrote:PLEASE TELL ME ABOUT YOUR CONSIDERATIONS SHOS THEN I'LL CONVINCE YOU OF THE SCUMTEAM AFTERWARDS
In post 886, TierShift wrote:Yeah, I'm ready for this to go down. TC obviously isn't even going to try to defend himself or solve the game. Anen has the knee-jerk reaction of discrediting me and basically says he's pretty sure I'm scum and that the case is soon to follow, but two days later, he admits he hasn't even read the game.
VOTE: anen
These are the posts before you called TS scum. The vote was just so rough and awkward, and Tier has been bragging about his completed scum games. I don't see him-scum that much.
I don't know what ot make of the meta he brought up once Shos voted him, but Tier even if you think he was baby-talking Shos, was actually participating in some degree of reasonableness in that exchange in response to the vote. So that's another net positive for me.
got stuff to do for meditation/tai chi class tonight, shit i forgot about this for a while
but i did not forget about this, i will be here
woah alchemist's iso is so remarkably... unremarkable with the exception of a few pointed paragraphs towards Tier and Anen
he does write that he tends to choose to focus on certain players
to recap
- so in #782 he has Toon and me as scum. that is still his stance. he has everyone else as town, including Anen because...??? - edit: ah found it. spoilering some stuff for my future reference
- early in the game voted shos at one point for refusing to read enough and get in the game
- today he has spent time pointing out interactions and exploring pairs that could lead to "teams"
SO
looking at his reason for strong-townreading Anen - based on him being able to relate to Anen's paranoia:
how does that signal town intent at all??? there are more creative ways if scum to spin an Anen read, but this?
im also a bit flustered by a few other things, but yeah this is basically defending Anen for virtually no reason. and if you really believe Anen is town, you arent making your vote count for something so far all day, and trying to advance a lynch
ESPECIALLY considering you and others are in agreement that this day will likely end in a lynch (not a no-lynch)
Spoiler: random stuff to help me remember what i just looked at - dont click please
Is this @me? Tbh his tunnel isn't out of the ordinary imo. I argue with my scumreads a lot when I'm in tunnel mode. Actually, looking at how he has cased TF and been voting elsewhere, I'd say he's been lighter about tunneling than I usually am when I tunnel. As far as the perceived slip goes, he hasn't really been contradictory about it. Yeah, he thinks you slipped, but that doesn't mean he'll get others to see it that way (and he probably won't unless one of you actually flips scum because it's a highly contextual point). He's still scumreading you, which makes sense from the POV if him thinking you slipped.
@Anen, I do feel I need to point this out though. The only way what Tier said was a slip is if he's scum with the Dodgy/Droog slot. You're considering AA9 and TF scum possibilities, so you already have some belief that you could be wrong. I need you to take a step back, clear your head, and ask yourself if you can still keep pushing your point against TierShift knowing that the slip only makes sense in a highly specific situation. Remember how I deathtunnled Siv in our last game together? I feel like you're doing the same thing to TierShift, and it could potentially be just as damaging to the Town.
Plenty of nulls, for a long time. Maybe that Toon-vote is a null too? (140 and around).
Promises a change in 167 but nothing really happens.
The Shos-vote in 232 is without any reasons.
The ToonFighter vote in 395 is similar. Just as 431 for TierShift. And Alchemist in 600... (Need I go on with this vote-analysis?)
Dodged Estival's question in 407. 633 is a "readlist". Yet again, no content with it.
Having read 756 again, I don't understand the question. (Shos was the one who talked about getting roleblocked first.) 760's
"I don't know what the plan is. But scum are in total control. They are earning this win. I'm not doing enough. End of"
– ???! 867 – and now he has internet problems. He was shopping before. And being busy IRL before that. Isn't it weird?
Summary.
Surprisingly very little content. Basicly nothing town-ish. The only problem is that I've seen such useless townies before, just as lurkscums. If it weren't for our bad situation I'd join this wagon (if we still didn't lynch TierShift) but now I don't know what to think.
Sounds like you agree with the rest of us here for the most part. I've seen Town be useless lurksacks too, but they've always come alive at lylo and meaningfully contributed to the Town. TC hasn't done that. He's pretty much derped around, and I think as Town he would show a lot more concern at all these scumreads on him at this point in the game.
(1) He acts as if there had been only the Page1 slip about him. He's been posting many times things like
"either you think it was a slip or not and if not, you have nothing against me"
. This, in this form hasn't been true for a long time.
(2) He keeps misrepresenting me, I pointed out it eg. in my last post.
(3) As I explained a couple of days ago, he can be scum with our without Shos.
(4) He launches a Setup speculation. Scums usually do that.
(5) Despite he said many times that I was scumhunting by finding the team before getting a scumflip, he's been doing the same with ThisChristmas and me.
(6) His style. I saw that in a game where he was scum. He's much more "grumpy", eg. suggesting ThisChristmas to replace out.
I know that I could have written more about this but (1) I'm tired IRL and (2) I'm a bit frustrated because it seems that noone takes my case against TierShift too seriously.
It's kinda hard to tell that you had more against Tier than the slip, since a lot of the arguments you had against him went back to it.
The first things you said were misreps look more like a semantics thing with what is defined as a slip; I'm not sure about the one about not reading the thread though.
Setup spec is pretty null imo because I've seen plenty of players do it because that's their thing (i.e. Mathdino and Titus).
Is number 5 referring to a post before this phase? Players tend to start looking for associatives between living players at lylo because they're trying to make sure they get scum. Open 584 is a recent example - we had flipped 1/3 of the scums, but we were still looking for associatives between living players to try and catch the remaining two.
I'll need to look back at your reasons for (3), and I wouldn't know about (6).
Also, what is your current opinion on Toonfighter?
My strongest Townread is Anen. I know people don't like his tunneling on Tier, but he's shown paranoia about it that I'm pretty sure comes from Town because I've been there plenty of times before. (Seriously though, Anen you do need to ease up and focus elsewhere. At least consider where you reads will be at if Tier flips Town.)
Shos is a Townread of mine now, partly because of his gunsmith claim, but more because he has the same idea about the Tier wagon that I do. I'm seeing things more his way in regards to the flavorclaiming, and I'm sure if he hadn't been forced to claim yesterday he would be refusing to nameclaim now too.
Tiershift is another Townread because of that EoD wagon. Like I said before I'm sure scum would have liked that lynch pushed because he was V/LA and couldn't defend himself.
Droog/This Christmas are the ones I feel are the scum candidates on the Tier wagon by the nature of how they joined the wagon (no explanation for voting a V/LA player is super scummy). It actually doesn't help that they're both breathing down my meck right now. (Inb4 omgus accusations)
AA9 is a scumread for the reasons I've already given. She's almost certain the game can be broken in some manner by flavorclaiming. I think she wants the nameclaims because she can match them to PRs, so this is a form of rolefishing from her. It might not be so bad if there was an attempt tohunt with other means as well, but she's been super focused on the flavor claims here.
In post 968, Toon Fighter wrote:Why I think anen is a good lynch? Well, the fact that both shos and TS are supporting it, that the claim does not work well in the setup after my analysis this afternoon, my previous scum read on him came back, and, damn, am i not allowed to change my views? Also, have you looked at the way anen reacted to the (building of interest in the) wagon? It raised some scum-radar hairs in the back of my head. Mostly that. I'd rather support a popular lynch that I actually believe might be scum than a player where I am not so sure and has no popular force behind.
Finally, I excluded anen before because the claim looked plausible. But, when I look more into it, I just don't think it fits as well. How does a commuter interact with a voyeur, Gunsmith, 1-shot tracker? It just makes their roles useless. Plus with the RB and mafia? 1-shot commuter seems like a neutral to negative town utility in this setup. At it's best, turns odds to evens. At it's worst, ruins a Gunsmith's nad/or voyeur night's work, makes the tracker literally a VT. Finally, thinking like a scum, a two scum team whit both fakeclaiming VT would look odd. I think one of the scums would fakeclaim. And the most likely of the two (between TS and anen) is anen.
That's pretty much it for my case on anen. What do you think?
ok something to think about, because im not done reading your ISO. and then i gotta read the actual game in its whole form
ok so you pushed an Anen lynch in the last few hours of Day 1, it looks like. you voted shos at one point on D1. youve professed Anen as a scumread recently (and prior to that).
you havent necessarily been joining popular wagons for most of this game (i think?) - like the switches onto Tier and Anen last minute Day 1 (Which were weird considering DL).
but it's like, let me wait no. i have one question first
when you decided to veer off course D1, were you thinking harder because there were scummy people like me on the Day 1 wagon(s)?
In post 380, shos wrote:And PLEASE FFS DO NOT NAMECLAIM PEOPLE THAT IS STUPUD AND ONLY HELPS SCUM
If the game is well designed and the scum have fakeclaims and the names are not automatic giveaways, nameclaim should never be a liability, for either town or scum. That is also why I suggested nameclaims, I thought it might lead to a more interesting and 'in-character' game, but it apparently just blew up in my face.
In post 364, shos wrote:So explain to me again, why did you, as a VT Carl(which fits, supppsedly) feel the need to suggest massclaim and nameclaim?
See above. I wanted to have some fun and, if it was badly designed, break the game for town (assuming every gallagher is town).
In post 383, shos wrote:How the fuck am i still the leading wagon.
Im a gunsmith. Please can we proceed with lynching TF?
AA9 and those voting TS are automatically scumreads of mine if I disregard the game, btw, juat becauae they posted this close to DL and started anoyher vanity wagom. Scum benefit from NL.
Id like to be watched tpnight.
In your other post you said you would do anything for Ian. Does that include anything role related?
Looking at your claim, I don't feel comfortable lynching you anymore. I think you are telling the truth. However, TS is not here and can't claim, I don't want to vote myself and it's very late for starting a new wagon. I'll try that though. I prefer NL than lynching you, but Anen is my other option.
(better than lynching shos, I think TS might be town, but it's better to lynch him rather than shos)
shos, even if I give you the point that massclaim was a bad idea, that was your whole case against me. I don't think it was the most 'scummy' (I don't think it was, but you apparently do) thing that happened today. Please, consider lynching Tiershift
UGH i am going down this hole and responding to this but i dont really want to
Anen's play has been aloof this game. Who knows why, or if scum or not scum.
unless you think another wagon will suddenly spring up because I (the not-townread-est player outside of MAYBE Anen) started posting, and then Anen will actually escape the lynch because I don't really see Anen-scum. that doesnt seem likely at all
im basically dead if Anen actually flips scum. But I mean, then I have to fight Day 4, so I hope Anen flips scum if he's lynched. And I might be forced to hammer or risk another no lynch today since likely 4 v 2. that would be a real pickle.
so my starting to post because IRL really is coincidental. It has been looking like Anen is the wagon of destiny since at least 5 days ago when it was between Anen and me. so those two things are unrelated
TC, we are experienced people here, nobody is going to rush this mylo. I can see you're working hard right now, keep at it, get to the best decision you can at who scum are. You're not doomed.
