Mini 1730: Suikoden U-Pick GAME OVER

[BRantz]

VOTE: Titus cause its the right thing to do.

[BRantz]

Nothing, I just really wanna be friends with titus this game. We had a neighborhood last game and that was pretty cool.

Except then she was scum ;_;


Moving on

I'm really disappointed not a single person took my scum claim seriously. Like did no one notice that? I did it twice.

I'M SCUM LYNCH ME

Aye, Aye, Cap'n!

VOTE: Elbirn

[BRantz]

Been busy the last couple days, will catch up when I get home tonight.

[BRantz]

Bleh, sorry everyone, will catch up on this tonight/tomorrow.

[BRantz]

Through page 28 I don't like Jeanne at all. The case Titus has made on her is very similar to my thoughts. Plus every time I have been in a game with Jeanne when she is scum, she threw a fit any time someone suspected her. This looks very similar to that Jeanne. Plus there is AtE oozing from all of her rage posts. Though, her continued craziness makes me think maybe she is town. Null for now? I guess?

Titus seems very town, but I don't know why you she outed her gambit right after doing it. I feel like information could have been gained by leaving the gambit in the dark for a bit.

Ranger makes a really good point about BM in 752. I like how rationally ranger has approached the game so far, probably town.

It may be awful, but I will not be tricked again, get it?

Also, the proof I am town is that I wouldn't be voting LQ if I am scum.

This post is so bad. How does this possibly prove anything?

I was having null-scum feelings about wguerts, but I like his reads post 836 a lot, and he is null-town for me now, plus his discussion with Jeanne/LQ has me leaning town there too.

I like 902 by RR a lot.

I'm not convinced of the LQ scum thought process, but he certainly has some off posts. Titus, where did you think he was rolefishing again? (Oh never mind, this is covered in 1065)

BM seems likely to be scum, post 1076 is just awful, and an easy way to try to look like they are doing something while adding absolutely nothing to the game.

VOTE: Blackest Magick

Also, I have been going back and forth with myself on whether to talk about it, and have decided that I should. I should not be alive at lylo for the good of the town. My role is particularly volatile there, and so if we are indecisive at the end of a day we should lynch me.

[BRantz]

@Jeanne, what are you looking for here? You yell at people for ignoring you/doing things you find hypocritical. Then when they try to work with you, you yell at them for that too? Make up your damn mind about what you want.

[BRantz]

@jeanne: What is your case for LQ scum then? (feel free to quote it at me if you have posted it before)

[BRantz]

*exhales* forget that last post......I am enraged right now. The way that you guys seem so blind really makes me mad.......LQ is clearly spinning his lies and playing all of you for fools yet your are treating him as confirmed town and myself & Ranger as confirmed scum just because our playstyle is a tad different from the norm.... *bangs head on the wall repeatedly*

Its posts like this that make me want to vote you Jeanne. This is just awful AtE rolled up in a complete misrep of how people are treating LQ. No one has called you confirmed scum either. In fact the only person saying someone is confirmed scum is you about LQ.

[BRantz]

Oh, and by the way, BRantz is also among our scumreads.

Oh my, I tell you I suspect you, and magically I am in your scum reads. Tell me again why LQ is wrong to accuse you of just omgussing everyone who suspects you?

[BRantz]

Oh, am I supposed to be scared of your use of the our pronoun?

How does Appeal to Majority have anything to do with how people feel about LQ?

[BRantz]

Also I don't particularly care if you are scum reading me, I've straight up said I should be lynched before lylo, so if you would like to do that feel free.

[BRantz]

That isn't how appeal to majority works... Appeal to Majority is someone saying "You all think LQ is town, so you should also think this similar thing!"

[BRantz]

Absolutely no one you have been yelling at, has said anything even remotely resembling that they believe everything LQ has said.

[BRantz]

You do understand you don't have to believe someone 100% to think they aren't the best lynch candidate for the day right? Like, just because I don't agree that he is the best lynch right now, doesn't mean I think he is infallible or that I believe everything he says. Your points don't even make sense.

A small dose of paranoia is healthy, you are completely off the deep end.

[BRantz]

And how about the fact that wgeurts posted a vig kill that DID NOT WORK. How do YOU explain THAT?

Are you serious? It was either a reaction test, or a gambit and the only person who can tell you which is wguerts.

[BRantz]

Alright, lets try this. Jeanne, who isn't scum in this game?

[BRantz]

Oh, and 'let wgeurts tell you which, cos wgeurts cannot be lying'

smh... like I can't even believe you are serious about this right now... Are you just trolling every one, is that what's going on?

[BRantz]

Okay... I am literally done trying now. I will not interact with you for at minimum at least the rest of the day.

[BRantz]

No I'm wondering if the reason jeanne is getting so frustrated is that she KNOWS LQ is scum because of something game-mechanic wise, if that's so I'm asking her to say so but not say how as that could reveal useful abilities

I can state for certain this is no. You wouldn't believe me if I said why Jeanne was pushing LQ's scum so hard. It's something so off I'm reflecting on it. Town or scum wouldn't actually put forth the reason Jeanne's so confident.

Are you saying that Jeanne's reasoning is irrational? Or are you saying that neither town nor scum would say what the reason is? If the latter why?

[BRantz]

I'm not saying her reasons for LQ are bad for LQ being scum, but she's real likely confbiasing if town. Her rabid desire comes from something no one should actually have...

Okay, so why is LQ scum for you then? (besides the rolefishing)

[BRantz]

I mostly agree with what Titus said. Your case is full of confbias, and is extremely convoluted.

@Titus: any chance of you answering about why you think LQ is scum (besides the rolefishing thing)?

[BRantz]

I have to go to work right now, but will iso them together when I get home.

[BRantz]

@Titus: So RR only mentions Klingon a few times, but they seem to have hydra dissonance about her. From what I can tell Cerb is lightly town reading her (from his post about her "content") and Drixx has a gut feeling scummy read. But the fence sitting about it is somewhat bothersome, you would think by now they would have decided which of their thought processes they wanted to pursue on her. And Klingon only really mentions RR to give them a flimsy town lean read. I think if we lynch either of them and that one flips scum then we should potentially pursue the other the next day, but I am not convinced that either should be on the block today. (I am null-town on RR right now, and null-scum on Kling, but my feelings toward both aren't very strong)

[BRantz]

VOTE: Blackest Magick

Jeanne, please listen to Suzune and chill today. Even though you were right yesterday, 90% of what you did was create noise that is distracting and harmful to the rest of the town. Talk to me about Klingon, do you think it is more likely her or RR are scum?

[BRantz]

Thats fine as long as you are posting things that add something to the game. 90% of your posts yesterday didn't.

[BRantz]

ebwop: I don't know why I even tried again... you are just completely a crazy person.

[BRantz]

I still think BM is super scummy, I am also scum leaning on Klingon, but am not as sure about it as others seem to be.

I have a town lean on RR, and think that given the way yesterday went there is almost 0 chance Jeanne is scum. I find you fairly town as well mostly because you have been inquisitive and trying to get information out into the open. I also think Ranger, Elbirn, and Firekari are likely town.

I am mostly null on pistachion (he has posted almost no content), wguerts goes back and forth for me, but I am slightly leaning town there right now

[BRantz]

Also, why do you help the scum so much, Suzune. Mine and Ranger's gut wasn't wrong on the first day, so what makes you think it'll be wrong on the 2nd?

This is completely a logical fallacy.

[BRantz]

I mean, Jeanne has been using deliberately inflammatory language for the entire game, why would she stop now?

[BRantz]

I'm still around.

[BRantz]

I still think BM is super scummy, I am also scum leaning on Klingon, but am not as sure about it as others seem to be.

I have a town lean on RR, and think that given the way yesterday went there is almost 0 chance Jeanne is scum. I find you fairly town as well mostly because you have been inquisitive and trying to get information out into the open. I also think Ranger, Elbirn, and Firekari are likely town.

I am mostly null on pistachion (he has posted almost no content), wguerts goes back and forth for me, but I am slightly leaning town there right now

I did too respond! I was starting to wonder if everyone was just ignoring me! lol

[BRantz]

No comments for me Suzune?

[BRantz]

I was just curious because you asked me the question and then were ignoring the answer. It felt strange, and your reaction to me asking you about it doesn't make me feel better about it.

[BRantz]

Rephrased: If you had no intention of following up on your question why ask it in the first place?

[BRantz]

That is understandable, I misunderstood your purpose as well. I thought you were trying to create dialogue to start the day, so found it confusing when you seemed to ignore what I wrote.

As for my scum reads:

BM: Their posts are a lot of commenting on things irrelevant to the game, and asking questions that they never seem to follow up on (569 is a prime example of this). Then in 1083 they finally give some reads, but it is all surface level stuff and OMGUS (specifically in the case of Titus you can see this). Couple this with their very few posts, and I can't possibly see them being town. Their posting today remains non-committal as well, and I think that is worth noting.

Klingon: Has said they are confused at multiple points in the game 273, 287, 426,438, etc. I often see this used as an excuse to do nothing, and coast along in a game while being "active". Then her reads post in 452 gives almost no actual reads. Just comments on things people have been doing, the only even semi read she gives there is on wguerts (lean scum) which I think is worth noting for later, but she does addend that pistachion is a scum lean as well in a later post. I am also thrown off by her continually talking about Bright instead of the other "players" in the game. Then she continues "sorting" her reads until the end of the day despite people asking her to give more info the entire time. Basically my scum lean comes from the fact that she basically sat on the sidelines all of day 1, and never really took a firm stance on anything. The only reason it isn't more than a lean is because I've seen her do this before as town.

[BRantz]

I was typing! lol

[BRantz]

UNVOTE:

I'll do it since I'm here. I agree we shouldn't lynch yet.

[BRantz]

Lynch Order:

Blackest Magic
Pistachion
Brantz
FireKari
Suzune
Ranger
Jeanne
Me/RR

We need 5 people to agree to this to work as a bloc and then stick to it ignoring all others trying to break the plan as that's what scum needs.
Quote and say aye if you're up for it, I'm one so that leaves 4 more. I'll hammer once this is settled.

Aye.

What about klingon?

[BRantz]

VOTE: Blackest Magick

L-1 again.

[BRantz]

VOTE: Blackest Magick

L-1 again.

Happy Birthday!

Thanks!

[BRantz]

I've said it before and I will say it again. In the event that this game has a chance to go to lylo (which at the moment I don't think it does), I should be lynched before then. If it happens today while we definitely have mislynches to spare I am fine with that. Ranger, you are awful at reading me, you do remember that I made the case on BM for lynch yesterday right?

[BRantz]

That is fair Elbirn, I thought about doing it in my response to ranger, but didn't want to out anything else if people didn't want that.

Claim: I am Georg Prime.

I am a VT until lylo, at which time, I turn into a survivor.

[BRantz]

@wguerts: I don't think do, but as far as I understand it my role isn't bastard. I know when and how my alignment switches, and isn't it only bastard if it is an unforseen alignment switch?

[BRantz]

Okay.

@wguerts: the role us not bastard then, based on when my alignment actually changes, but effectively in lylo I am a survivor.

[BRantz]

I am fine with being vigged too.

VOTE: pistachi0n

[BRantz]

Okay.

@wguerts: the role us not bastard then, based on when my alignment actually changes, but effectively in lylo I am a survivor.

So, you are a survivor. Except if you are killed before lylo, and town wins, you get to win as well. So, modified survivor that can be played to either help town win before lylo happens, or who gets too play kingmaker in lylo.

You're not town though. :p

-Cerb

This is actually a pretty good explanation of how my role works.

@Elb: it isn't actually bastard because of when my role actually changes. But effectively I am a survivor in lylo.

[BRantz]

Then BRantz is lying confirmed

My role is not bastard by the definition given by Varsoon, but you won't believe me as to why that is the case, so just lynch me like I said to, and this can all be ironed out later.

[BRantz]

No it doesn't though. My alignment actually flips right at the end of the game. Which is why I keep saying effectively.

I turn into a survivor if I am the only member of the town still alive. So the actual alignment switch happens right at end game, but for all intents and purposes it is true in lylo as well

[BRantz]

@guerts: What is confusing you about my role? In lylo I am effectively a survivor because I no longer care who wins the game as long as I don't get lynched I will win the game too. But my alignment doesn't actually switch until the game ends. If I am the only remaining town aligned player at the end of the game I win as a survivor.

[BRantz]

@guerts: What is confusing you about my role? In lylo I am effectively a survivor because I no longer care who wins the game as long as I don't get lynched I will win the game too. But my alignment doesn't actually switch until the game ends. If I am the only remaining town aligned player at the end of the game I win as a survivor.

Alignment changes are bastard. Period.

Furthermore, what you are describing is even worse for town than a usual survivor. If allowed to live, such a role would just vote at LYLO and have zero incentive whatsoever to help the town.

No matter what your claim requires you be lynched.

~Drixx

That first sentence is just flat wrong based on the question asked and answered in this game. Mid game alignment changes are bastard. My alignment change isn't mid game.

As for the rest of it. That is why I have been telling you guys to lynch/kill me this whole time. Did you think I was joking? I'm not fighting against my lynch. I am answering the questions asked of me, that is all.

[BRantz]

I would self hammer, but that is "playing against my wincon", and I don't want to take the lolhammer pleasure away from guerts.

[BRantz]

Mid game alignment changes are bastard. My alignment change isn't mid game.

Correct me if I am wrong, but an random end game alignment change would also be bastard because it would change the dynamic of the final lynch should it get there.

I think this is a discussion definitely worth having, but under the current description for what is bastard I don't think it applies? But I don't know for sure.

[BRantz]

I would self hammer, but that is "playing against my wincon", and I don't want to take the lolhammer pleasure away from guerts.

How is self hammering playing against your wincon but asking to be lynched isn't?

There is a fundamental difference between the two pistachi0n.

Lol trolled by ranger. Just do it suzune, why are you trying to look hesitant about this?

[BRantz]

He got the PM saying that Ranger had marked him. That seems to be the confusion here. Pistachi0n is obviously paying almost no attention to the game, or at least trying to appear that way.

[BRantz]

Sorry I wasn't around to talk in the dead thread, was out of town for thanksgiving and such. But I actually thought the role was really interesting. I had initially planned on only mentioning that I should be lynched once at the very beginning, but the way the game started to unfold with the accuracy of the town and the communication that we had both in and out of the thread it just made more sense to get myself lynched. I like the idea of potential alternate win conditions fir a town player, but it definitely walks the line between non and bastard.

Great game town.

[BRantz]

I would like to pre-in for SU Varsoon. I agree with Elbirn, the thought you put into your games shows.