Open 623 (White Flag) - A Moment in Time (Over)

[Cerberus v666]

Cerberus r u being srs

Absolutely. What part of my post do you think isn't serious?

[AlwaysInnocent]

1. Maybe you tend to read newbies more harshly (except for Dewy ).
2. You must think we're stupid, too.
3. Not to mention your case is really weak.

Give me some specific examples of SirCakez being obvious town.

1. Nope. Welcome to life outside the newbie queue. You do things that scum do, you get scumread. I am not the sole voter.
2. Absolutely not. I am reading you as desperate scum, not stupid. Why did you feel insulted? Do you feel your scumgame has been bad?

3. Why would you have 5 votes if my case was weak? It isn't. You'd be at L minus 1 but Cerb never votes so we have to wait on subs.

Town know Sir is town.

Also, I didn't explicitly say this before, or at least not in the detail I should have, but..your case is weak. Super duper weak. Not strong. "RVS push plus retraction claiming it's a joke is scum!" I mean sure, I get the logic, town wouldn't feel the need to be extra defensive there and pull super far back from an RVS vote, and would instead just shrug it off because it's fucking RVS, but why the hell can't it just be a personality quirk? SS and yourself know each other, is it really so unreasonable for him to feel the need to clarify that his suspicion on you was a joke, given that he might have enjoyed playing with you before and wanted to cooperate rather than be antagonistic from P2?

That btw, is how weak I think the RVS vote is a joke thing is, btw. I think even the chance that someone I don't even know might just have a personality that inclined them to make a joke about it outfuckingweighs that "tell".

The only reason why I might consider SS as scum is the move to vote the counterwagon to himself. That is survivalism, which might be alignment indicative, depending on how far it goes.

I sort of understand your POV, so I am going to put you at fence-town.

[Cerberus v666]

1. Maybe you tend to read newbies more harshly (except for Dewy ).
2. You must think we're stupid, too.
3. Not to mention your case is really weak.

Give me some specific examples of SirCakez being obvious town.

1. Nope. Welcome to life outside the newbie queue. You do things that scum do, you get scumread. I am not the sole voter.
2. Absolutely not. I am reading you as desperate scum, not stupid. Why did you feel insulted? Do you feel your scumgame has been bad?

3. Why would you have 5 votes if my case was weak? It isn't. You'd be at L minus 1 but Cerb never votes so we have to wait on subs.

Town know Sir is town.

Also, I didn't explicitly say this before, or at least not in the detail I should have, but..your case is weak. Super duper weak. Not strong. "RVS push plus retraction claiming it's a joke is scum!" I mean sure, I get the logic, town wouldn't feel the need to be extra defensive there and pull super far back from an RVS vote, and would instead just shrug it off because it's fucking RVS, but why the hell can't it just be a personality quirk? SS and yourself know each other, is it really so unreasonable for him to feel the need to clarify that his suspicion on you was a joke, given that he might have enjoyed playing with you before and wanted to cooperate rather than be antagonistic from P2?

That btw, is how weak I think the RVS vote is a joke thing is, btw. I think even the chance that someone I don't even know might just have a personality that inclined them to make a joke about it outfuckingweighs that "tell".

The only reason why I might consider SS as scum is the move to vote the counterwagon to himself. That is survivalism, which might be alignment indicative, depending on how far it goes.

I sort of understand your POV, so I am going to put you at fence-town.

Is this one of those "subtle but not really" LAMIST moves? "I see where you're coming from, so I'm thinking you might be town, because expressing a POV I can relate to means you're more likely to share my alignment...which is town, btw guys. Totally town."

I mean, I don't really see why expressing something which should be obvious to everyone should give me any town credit with anyone at all. :/

[AlwaysInnocent]

Is this one of those "subtle but not really" LAMIST moves? "I see where you're coming from, so I'm thinking you might be town, because expressing a POV I can relate to means you're more likely to share my alignment...which is town, btw guys. Totally town."

I mean, I don't really see why expressing something which should be obvious to everyone should give me any town credit with anyone at all. :/

Yes, you're right to be skeptical, which makes me even more confident that you are town.

The thing is that you say things that scum would be hesitant to say. If we allow ourselves to assume that Something_Smart is town, then we can say that scum are less likely to point out that Something_Smart didn't really say anything that odd.

Also, scum are generally happy when people townread them, so they are more likely to keep silent about this. Town are more likely to argue against undeserved townreads (as you would call them), because sometimes scum buddy up with town players like that, so it can be used as part of their scumhunting game.

[PhantomCobalt]

AI be shooting left and right b o I sti

[AlwaysInnocent]

My RVS strategy and post-RVS strategy basically amounts to mudthrowing at as many people as I can.

[PhantomCobalt]

My RVS strategy and post-RVS strategy basically amounts to mudthrowing at as many people as I can.

Good to know

[pistachi0n]

What an interesting wagon composition.
Cerberus are you willing to place a vote yet?

Could you comment on what you find interesting about it?

[Something_Smart]

Something_Smart is probably town.

Speaking of buddying look at that first sentence.

Actually, I get the feeling that AI is more whiteknighting me. I could definitely see a SirCakez-AI team playing both sides of the wagon and soft double bussing.
Cerb and Titus on the other hand feel town to me.
Phantom is annoying and could go either way. Rhazh as well.
Pistachi0n is ok, seems honest and genuine enough.
Yonom's done very little except jump onto L-2 with scummy reasoning. Also, interestingly, she made almost the same joke as me, and caught no flak at all for it...

[Titus]

I think you're scum with SS. Discuss.

I think you're trying too hard to jump into conclusions.

This is not a "joke" at all.

Second, the Always Innocent is a joke based on the name. It's a standard RVS joke. Your "joke" was about content and behavior and thus not a joke at all. You're only calling it a joke because you got caught reaching.

[Something_Smart]

Best to just play the game naturally instead of planning out our strategies D1. If I don't know what I'm doing the Mafia surely can't counter my play.

I think you're scum with SS. Discuss.

I think you're scum with Rhazh and you're distancing.

I think you're scum with SS and Rhazh and you're all distancing.

[Titus]

Oh that one is clear it's a joke because of the emoticon.

[AlwaysInnocent]

Something_Smart is probably town.

Speaking of buddying look at that first sentence.

Actually, I get the feeling that AI is more whiteknighting me. I could definitely see a SirCakez-AI team playing both sides of the wagon and soft double bussing.
Cerb and Titus on the other hand feel town to me.
Phantom is annoying and could go either way. Rhazh as well.
Pistachi0n is ok, seems honest and genuine enough.
Yonom's done very little except jump onto L-2 with scummy reasoning. Also, interestingly, she made almost the same joke as me, and caught no flak at all for it...

Lolz. The paranoia sure makes you look town.

[Something_Smart]

you know what
VOTE: AlwaysInnocent
This is both whiteknighting and buddying, and it's unacceptable.

[Something_Smart]

also townreading someone who is scumreading you is fine
but townreading someone FOR scumreading you is scummy.

[Drixx]

I'll post a moment in time here for a bit of flavor in a bit.

[Yonom]

Yonom's done very little except jump onto L-2 with scummy reasoning.

Scummy reasoning? How?

And yes, it was

just

L-2. Forces you to speak for yourself a little more and give us more text to analyse. Honestly, I don't think we should lynch you just yet since there aren't too many good reasons for that. I still think you've been acting the most suspicious of all.

It would be dumb for mafia to hammer the vote. If someone did that, they would rise too many suspicions and definitely get lynched on D2. So that wasn't a worry when I decided to vote for you.

Sorry if I'm a little shy, I've been reading everything and I'll make sure to let you know if I see something interesting. Lots of the accusations made so far are kinda lame (esp. the ones about the random votes lol), I tend to look for more serious reads.

[Something_Smart]

I kinda have to agree with SirCakez and PC here, Something_Smart seems to be jumping on conclusions too fast and too randomly.

VOTE: Something_Smart

This was your only explanation for your vote. It seems like a weak buddying attempt and a crap explanation that could easily apply to several other players (how is the flashwagon on me not jumping to conclusions?). What I did was neither too fast (barely out of RVS) nor random (I gave reasons for each vote), and that qualifies your vote as opportunism.

[AlwaysInnocent]

you know what
VOTE: AlwaysInnocent
This is both whiteknighting and buddying, and it's unacceptable.

[NotAnAlt]

SirCakez wagon is really ugly.

Lurkers commenting on the ugliness of small wagons. It only makes me more confident that at least one of you is scum.

Oh I'm sorry, I guess I should have checked to make sure I'd surpassed the minimum-number-of-posts-required-within-the-first-24-hours-of-the-game-before-I-can-have-an-opinion threshold before posting that!

1. Nothing. I just noticed it.

Not really what I was looking for here. Were you aware of how new everyone was before Titus voted them? Did you look at the players after she voted them? What was your motivation for pointing it out or did it not mean anything?


Will have more time to post in a few hours. Don't lynch SS while I'm gone.

[Something_Smart]

Yes, I usually look at how experienced the people I'm playing with are.
I pointed it out because I thought it was possible that Titus reads newbies more harshly. I still think that's part of the reason.

[Yonom]

I kinda have to agree with SirCakez and PC here, Something_Smart seems to be jumping on conclusions too fast and too randomly.

VOTE: Something_Smart

This was your only explanation for your vote. It seems like a weak buddying attempt and a crap explanation that could easily apply to several other players (how is the flashwagon on me not jumping to conclusions?). What I did was neither too fast (barely out of RVS) nor random (I gave reasons for each vote), and that qualifies your vote as opportunism.

Pfft, buddying attempt? If I were trying to buddy, I would do it in

style

and not like that. SirCakez is the 2nd scummiest on my list and don't think I would want to buddy them.

Now, back to why I voted on you:
Like I already explained, I wanted to increase pressure on you and see how you will react. Town wont get anywhere in this game if we all idle and wait for a miracle. I did refrain from voting for you earlier on when the first few votes were cast, because I was waiting for better options but nothing really good came up. This is not how I would behave if I were trying to sieze an "opportunity". I still don't have the intention to fully lynch you and if you already were L-2 back then, I wouldn't be putting down my vote on you right now.

If you disagree with my argumentation, I'm cool with that, but know that I'm not the only one in town who thinks you are scummy (see the other votes). Don't make too much out of it, it's just a vote. Anyway, what I see that you're trying way too hard to save your ass, you're focusing on attacking and calling out players that have a vote on you. Seems very egoistical, not how I expect town to behave. I don't think you will get too far with this strategy...

[Titus]

I am going to wait until y'all see this yourselves or I can prove said tell is a tell.

Peace out, love you. I would rather not pull out the sledgehammer.

[Something_Smart]

Yonom, why do you not expect town to be scumhunting? I am focusing on the players I think are scum. It just so happens that two of the three I don't like are on my wagon, a wagon which half the players who have posted are on.

If you don't think that's how town should act, please tell me why what you are doing is any different.

Aside from this, there are several inconsistencies in your most recent post. The claim that I am first and foremost attacking people on my wagon is not even accurate. My vote is on one of the TWO players actually defending me.

Secondly, you spent an entire paragraph saying why your vote is to increase pressure and you don't necessarily want to lynch me, and then turn around and say I'm scummy, with only confbias as a reason.

Right now, my biggest scumreads are AlwaysInnocent and Yonom. If other people could let me know what their thoughts are regarding these players, I would appreciate it.

[SirCakez]

I'm busy right now, will post here tomorrow.