Newbie 1769: Happy New Year! (Post-Game)
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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...yeah i dont understand mbg here at all and im calling this confscum
this is an indefensible push on a slot thats clearly weak to pushes (as ive already pointed out more than once) and i cannot see any town reason for not sharing his arguments with the rest of the players
literally nothing but "OH HEY GAMESOLVED LYNCH THESE" with nothing to back it up and no reason to buy into the reasoning
do you really expect town to sheep you because "lol the scumteam" come on man
VOTE: mattblackguy
p-edit: mbg is really pushing this hard and considering his pushes on other unpopular slots (one conftown) also shared this sort of venomous tone which isnt at all in keeping with the rest of his ISO, im more and more certain of this
and @ rask imo its a tossup between creature and schadd_ for the partner but mbg is defo-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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mbg doesnt really engage creature actively, theres little discussion between them (poss distancing? also poss NAI, creature doesnt give anyone much to chew on)
on the other hand mbg and -grey- and mbg and schadd_ also make equally as much sense. not so much distancing there though, just a matter of general interactions among those slots. i feel mbg+schadd_ is more likely than mbg+creature on a quick doublecheck
i dont see an mbg + rc team in any universe, and an mbg+gbT team feels like a HUGE stretch -- possible but theyd have to both be playing really well. that narrows it down pretty damn well tbh depending on how -grey- creature and schadd_ react to this turn of events
p-edit: -grey- doesnt feel like scum bussing but im not 100% on this
it DOES read strong town though still, so im confident taking grey off that list
creature and schadd_'s reactions are gonna make a world of difference here-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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i didnt like the d1 hammer but im not seeing it from a scum mindset, so many players saying out right theyll jump the gun on anyone who hammers w/o further consideration? its a suicide play unless youre REALLY SUPER CONFIDENT that you can convince all of them not to lynch you on principle
makes more sense from panicking town seeing a top town read under danger from scumhammer
p-edit: im the one pushing the schadd_ wagon today but -grey- started it d1 so that part checks out
feels like massive buddying tho-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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read as scum rask.
1: casts doubt on own play so when they flip town he can explain it away as "oh... well... i guess i was wrong!" and it tracks
2: have max certainty to see if you can get people to sheep you. there have been a couple examples of what OUTWARDLY appears to be this in this game (re: rc, gbT) but they also had good arguments presented laconically. noobscum might get the wrong impression-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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also really want to hear thisIn post 1378, Raskolnikov wrote:Hey RC can you go into your schadd townread pls thanks-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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been rereading mbg ISO while i wait. rask, you realize he metad you with intent to lynch you before you could get confirmed yeah?
so he pushed with that confident, venomous tone on TWO conftown slots, rask and TB, and also pushed on -grey- yesterday citing other people's work and "no im pretty sure this is totally scum guys" i mean look at 1312 -- and RC now?
if this argument isnt the best one ive ever heard i think im gonna end up dismissing it tbh, this is a recurring aspect and its ALL going on either conftown slots or my strong townreads rofl-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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wrt 320: at that point in time shade was semi active in short bursts. not continuously no, but the bursts of activity were consistent and i can see the scumhunting there. remember that shade joined very late -- iirc, after rakkar. it was a weak but widely agreed upon townread, even from me.
wrt the hammer: i can see that, but it would also be textbook bad scumplay: everyone was saying WE WILL LYNCH HAMMERERS, and if RC flipped town schadd_ would be next up without even a shred of doubt! unsupported townread from confscum? lynch it. thats always a safe bet.
creature's d2 ISO is full of sheeping and deflection of attention (off of me which is cool but still) and creature's talking about a schadd_ townflip being helpful is really ugly when it definitely would not be helpful and you shouldnt lynch someone youre not very very sure of flipping red
not buying this, gonna keep my vote where it is-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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in fact im going to go out and say that the point about the hammering makes this scumteam a no-sell for me
i do not believe it for a second, it would be actively playing against wincon and anyone on town's side assuming anything else ranges from WIFOM to outright ignorance of the way the game is played-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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in fact im so vehemently against this argument that im gonna say it outright: if one of the two is scum the other is town. i cannot accept this scumteam, its so contrary to what i know about the game that to assume its a remotely possible scumteam requires ignoring wincons entirely. in such a case reads are impossible, the game is thrown
i insist mbg is the best wagon of all wagons and wholeheartedly present it to the town as confscum
feast-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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the problem im having with "plausible" here is that all of that plausibility is hinging on one aspect of an otherwise content-free argument in favor of lynching a vulnerable slot, an argument you yourself noted feels hastily constructed
"plausible" on one corner of a structure thats supposed to have three still leads to a falling building, and so it is with this argument
i do agree though, i want gbT on board here before day ends and id like rask to be able to wake up and give conf-town reads on the situation before we hammer
IDEALLY id like to draw the day out to near deadline but im aware by now that this is unpopular and im really really sure of scum!mbg-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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and what precisely about his past few posts has said town to you creature
i cannot see a town motivation here. he sheeped his way around the whole game, no original reads. he pointed at other peoples' posts to come up with solid-looking reasons for why.
this time he has some original reasoning: and his two original points are just "nah i see it like scum" but without much explanation of why. the hammer maybe is a solid point, yeah, but its also the part he could have sheeped off of my earlier posts, gbT, etc... long list of people who really didnt like Radiant hammering.
the explanation that IS there relies wholly on reading as scum to begin with and falls apart if one flips green or even just disagrees with the premises -- for instance just read 1381, how can mbg possibly know why shade replaced out? esp considering shade hasnt posted since anywhere on the forums. (feel free to check if you disbelieve.)
thats NAI, period, but without a solid platform on shade his schadd_ read's original reasoning falls apart and dies (NOTE: not saying schadd_ doesn't look like scum, saying mbg's reasoning is flimsy) and without having the schadd_ read his RC read dies. its nonlinear reasoning couched in the appearance of logic:
Q: why is schadd scum?
A: because shade is scum and schadd_ had a read i dislike on that slot.
Q: why is radiantcowbells scum?
A: because it's the same slot as shade and supported schadd_.
Q: why is shade scum?
A: because he replaced out and i attached scum motives to it.
take shade out:
Q: why is schadd_ scum?
A: because ???
Q: why is radiantcowbells scum?
A: because they supported schadd_
and then on top of that, only jumping on wagons with weight already on them, and more importantly only active wagons, not stalled ones?
concern with appearances d1?
a definite change in tone toward the cartoon villain end of things when hes pushing a weighty wagon?
(if you want references for that last one, i have a couple here, let's see. 913, 1292)
defend a townread of this slot and i will take my vote off. yes, even if my other scumreads can defend it. because i dont think its defensible and if anyone can deal a blow to the scumread i have on mbg i cannot reasonably trust anything i think about this game-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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sorry, but i want an in depth defense of mbg's slot being townread before i even consider a different path here, because i dont see any defensible townread of him
if you can knock down, lets say any three of my arguments from 1418 ill think about dropping that read. i make at least 6 arguments there and i think theres 4 i would be swayed on if you can come up with almost any convincing town reasoning for them, so i mean, this shouldnt be hard at all if youre really solid on that mbg townread and it isnt a plain gutread
until then scum is scum and im here to lynch scum-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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checked my notes
IF mbg flips town (im pretty sure he wont) then rc and schadd_ are top of the list anyway with grey and gbT as runnersup based on his posts to date
i will call this bluff
imo: lynch mbg. in the incredibly unlikely universe where thats a townflip, track rc or schadd (rasks pick) and lynch the one most likely to have been nk based on rasks info
if it flips red, others dead
i can live with this-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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i need to sleep, but i really do want to have those 1442 opinions to come back to. maybe you guys could give folks who come back, catch up and end up seeming to avoid the question or maybe forgetting/missing it a reminder that i really want an opinion there. i think this is critical in fact
@rask id like rc to put his schadd_ townread up too, so dont feel obligated to put this first. i think 1442 is more important but ill take whichever i can get from radiant tbh-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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thank you
VOTE: mbg L-1
i wish that -grey- had chipped in but well
im confident on that townread, -grey- doesnt surprise me anymore, so yeah
REALLY feeling creature or gbT for this team, yeah, schadd_ is dismissive af. i /really/ dislike townreading his slot but w/e ill get over it i hated townreading -grey- and rc too at first-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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In post 1534, mattblackguy wrote:I don't see how selfhammering as town is good play though.THIS-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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actually rc why arent you considering a mbg flipping town world, even if you do in fact think its unlikely? is it entirely impossible from your perspective? or are you just really really sure of it to the point that if youre wrong youll eat the d3 lynch on your wagon, if it goes that direction?
what about you schadd_, lets hear your opinions on the current situation here. how do you feel about this wagon, you like where its heading? you like the folks on board? where do you think the other scum is?-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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so mbg flip tells us nothing? i mean either way theres only two other slots youre looking at and they dont look easy to get a wagon on from here
im sorta where schadd is if thats the case and im not feeling too awesome about an mbg scumflip either because mbg's flip in general is NAI for everyone else it seems, judging by your reads
do you think we should maybe look at another slot, keeping the finger of shame stacked on mbg as a reminder that hes not off of the hook? or do you think that lynching scum that doesnt tell us anything about who their partner is is worthwhile here?-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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it scansIn post 1588, Creature wrote:Hey Cassielle, what's your opinion on this?In post 494, Shade wrote:I can't catch up and post more than this tonight because I'm really busy with a sudden real life issue, and the fact this game has so many new posts is not helping.
@Aeronaut Please don't replace me from the game! I will promised try to be more active.
Just answering to a post I read last night
@gigabyteTroubadour I was suspecting gayreen as scum. That was the main reason I asked questions about your reads cause your read about gayreen felt really weird to me. I don't suspect him as scum with TB necessarily, not sure why you were expecting me to scum read them as a team. The way he kept his vote around as a threat and got confused after TB claim is actually scummy to me but first thing that came to my mind was the way he was asking for permissions to vote [like asking help from a more talented player] and I voted ThinkGig mainly to see what will you and GAYreenHamster do about it (and to actually remind ThinkBig to answer my question) which was disrupted with this wagon on me.
As I think it won't have the effect I wanted anymore UNVOTE: ThinkBig
I will answer anything else which was asked from me later when I have time to fully catch up and comment about stuff and will sort my reads.
Sorry for this, Have a good night
he was having trouble contributing (though his contributions were scheduled and regular) and he ended up replacing out without continuing any site activity. feels town
the TB vote was arguably scummy but its about as noobtown as it is noobscum -- he missed rvs and wanted to play, lol -- and so the unvote makes sense from both ends too. in other words, NAI (or so slightly AI that basing any read on it is really suspect)
also remember mbg's argument for rc being scum relied on shade being scum because he replaced out when schadd_ was under fire. but this implies he was crumbling when TB was under fire and TB IS CONFTOWN
so this argument against shade doesnt track, the slot looks good-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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wrt to these:In post 1603, schadd_ wrote:"This means that you can be mafia as well? I was assuming it's 1 newbie/1 SE team, isn't it?" pretty obviously newbtownie but still is
"What gave you the impression that someone is going to hammer you soon?" @ TB
"why should scum bother to scum read you when they can just kill you? why town can't mistakenly scum read you?" @ me for not liking that gayreen voted me (i don't really get what his thought process was but i think that's townie in this case)
"what is POE ? Point of elimination? If you hate that why you used it last page when you started striking people?" is scumhunty. helps that you're pretty high on my scumlist
a bunch of other stuff like that. it is ultimately a holistic and intuitive read, because i can read through his questions and nothing stands out to me like "no, you don't have an excuse not to know that" or something. that's kinda hard to do i think
NAI
town
towwwwn this is basically saying "town doesnt know a damn thing, do you happen to have knowledge we dont?" i.e. implying schadd_ is scum (scum omniscience tell) and really thats so town that if shade werent obvnoob id say to dismiss it out of paranoia
i dont see the scumhunting-
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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cassielle Mafia Scum
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