Open 785: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Game over!]

[Eevee]

sorry 'm late i was just training first aid and sailing in the lower decks

I find it interesting how Holden places an omgus vote on Votato. Then when two votes are placed (one for Holden, one for Votato) he engages with the player who voted for Votato

I get that conclusion from votato stating that there can be only one majestic equine then voting you. You're wording suggests intent to get a wagon on votato and the only reason for choosing votato seems to be him voting for you. Omgus is still omgus even if it's in rvs and banter. Then you engage with the player who votes votato as well and I also sense a light attempt at buddying this player.

crew mate Raya! i get if you're trying to move us out of RVS but this is

very

reachy - you're talking about the 3rd and 5th posts in the game
i thought it was clear Holden's vote doesn't mean anything alignment indicative so him choosing to engage with someone that isn't where his vote is placed means nothing

i will assign 1 WtP (Walk the Plank) to Raya

~Eve

[Eevee]

hello there

will be around more later

very scummy post - Misty usually enters with a-

hey guys

will catch up in a bit

-as town

~Eve

[Eevee]

i like the donkey sheriff but i may just be charmed by his pirate speak

Mohab's questions about the setup in 9 look more for show and i don't get why she unvoted in 51 - why did you? also i'd argue early wagons aren't pointless but that's not an alignment-indicative discussion to have

1 High Seas goes to Holden
1 Walk the Plank goes to Mohab
VOTE: Mohab

~Eve

[Eevee]

i sure hope our trip to port elizabeth goes well!

VOTE: Homura

well everyone's currently voting to brutally murder people in cold blood so you may want to readjust your expectations

would you like to join Eva and i for the midnight buffet?

Eva's currently trying to microwave some pizza in our cabin but she hasn't realised yet that i switched it out for a safe

~Eve

[Eevee]

Reachy yes, but did we not get out of rvs?

sure but are you now claiming that was your original intention rather than actually thinking it was suspicious from Holden?

~Eve

[Eevee]

Bear with me since I rarely play setups besides the Newbie one, but is Holden being post-restricted? I don't remember which game it was that had a player similarly bound by pirate-speak.

in contrast to Mohab's setup question - this i like

Homura usually plays newbie games and she's apparently played in game where a player had a pirate speak post restriction before so this is a legitimate question to ask
it being a legitimate question means she could've asked it in her scum PT or not suspected it in the first place if scum have said soemthing about the open setup in there

it's minor High Seas points to Homura - let's just say 1 actually i don't do halves

~Eve

[Eevee]

but we don't have pockets we're eevees D:

~Eve

[Eevee]

yes, delightful truly as i shirk my duties to this boat for the next few days within my own cabin. i would hope there’s no olives on that pizza.

when the sea rocks me awake to an awful hangover i’ll pick back up on my tasks.

(i’m v/la until sunday 7/5 @ lovely mod)

of course there's no olives on the pizza! there are however pineapple chunks chocolate and ketchup on there

i'll save a seat for you on the deck lounge for when you've recoveredl

~Eve

[Eevee]

Thank you for the invitation, it made my day.

our pleasure! glad to have you on board

~Eve

[Eevee]

Mohab's questions about the setup in 9 look more for show and i don't get why she unvoted in 51 - why did you? also i'd argue early wagons aren't pointless but that's not an alignment-indicative discussion to have

I know what you mean about the questions, they struck me that way at first too, but I'm habitually oversuspicious of things that look like playing dumb. Supposing she were genuinely unclear about that detail, how do you think the question would be phrased differently? or do you think she would just not ask it at all?

welcome! happy you've managed to paradrop on board after we already set sail

it's hard to articulate what feels off about it since it's mostly gut but the "So, I am just wondering some stuff regarding the setup." is the part that feels unnecessary and more for show - like maybe she'd just ask the questions without that part as town? not a strong feeling though

regarding the questions themselves the first one looks self-explanatory to me (10 town alive so 2 sets of 5 being cleared means everyone is an IC and scum can't win) - it's possible that just didn't clock for town!Mohab but i'm wary of a fake dumbtell when the logic is kinda easy to get like that

~Eve

[Eevee]

Umlaut replaces votato.

I seem t' 'ave won th' duel.
------------

I like th' cut o' th' eevee's jib. Wha' says ye regardin' me ToF point about th' lack o' meta explotation by ray?

If ye needs th' context let me know.

i do need the context sherrif

assigning a High Seas to Umlaut for his question to me and early reads - throwing out so many like that with so few pages as scum is gonna be a huge pain to explain if someone asks
so unless Umlaut is a masochistic it's a town-indicative move since it's harder to fabricate reasons for those at this point

~Eve

[Eevee]

Re. Eevee's reponse to me: it took me a second to think that through too (though I worked it out myself) so I can easily believe someone could have that question.

interesting then the questions themselves are probably NAI

~Eve

[Eevee]

VOTE: unvote

why'd you unvote Umlaut here? your vote on votato was from RVS and not because you thought he was sus i assume so why did you feel the urge to remove it?

alright i think i've scrounged out everything alignment-indicative i can find for now - i'm retiring to my cabin and gonna tag Eva in
she's allergic to cults so please keep those away ok

Pedit: is that a good point pirate donkey sherrif? Raya bringing that point up doesn't mean she's scum since it sounds valid and means - wait do you mean suboptimal or optimal plan? if you propose optimal plans as scum then she's right to point out it's NAI and that does the same thing of getting us out of RVS
i suppose her route was one that requires more substance than a meta read which would be easy to make for scum but it wouldn't be a scummy one to make

~Eve

[Eevee]

Eva's currently trying to microwave some pizza in our cabin but she hasn't realised yet that i switched it out for a safe

So that's why the pizza is still cold... It's been 3 hours, Eve. 3. Hours.

Hello all!!

~Eva

[Eevee]

I don't know what the fuck HoldenGolden is saying, so I'll be ignoring that slot

upon more indepth looking, it's actually kinda comprehensible. taking my last statement back

Mohab, these were made within the same minute; what did you see on the second pass that made you think it was more comprehensible?

~Eva

[Eevee]

holden's take on the mechanics was towny imo it's a bit bold for scum

Which takes do you referring to? And why do you think mechanic talk is "bold" in any circumstance?

~Eva

[Eevee]

yes, delightful truly as i shirk my duties to this boat for the next few days within my own cabin. i would hope there’s no olives on that pizza.

Don't worry, it's a pineapple only pizza!

~Eva

[Eevee]

My stance on the matter is that she's townish, or at the very least telling the truth about wanting to force the game pass rvs. While it's true scum!ray could of pointed it out in a NAI way, I think scum ray could of very easily turned it into an opportunity to actually push me/actively discredit me. The total lack of mentioning it sticks out, and I'm struggling to see why scum!ray would ignore it knowing what she knows.

I think I get your point, and sure, you might have done that as scum, but I don't know if that's a strong enough point to push?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Slight scumlean on Mohab, but not strong enough for a vote yet.

Can you elaborate on this one?

Also: I like Pork, but he needs more seasoning (reads). Craig scares me...

p-edit: :c

[Eevee]

Also: I like Pork, but he needs more seasoning (reads). Craig scares me...

Actually, should clarify: as a person. He feels a little weird right now. I've got my eye on you, Pork.

~Eva

[Eevee]

what's the goal here Craig? you trying to gauge reactions to these shenanigins? i guess we don't see our patterns until they are laid out in front of us

the snow tiger is usually unsure and paranoid early on but she doesn't usually have so many reads at the start so the early list is actually kinda scum-indicative for me based on meta

I am gonna ask a really dumb question but, can there be power roles in this game?

really doubling down on the dumbtelling huh - i don't like it

So, I make an RVS vote, then after RVS I remove it, and suddenly everybody somehow didn't expect that?

your original vote was for RVS - unvoting suggests you think we've left RVS and there's alignment-indicative stuff out there
if so why didn't you move it to someone else?

~Eve

[Eevee]

Too lazy to make a reads list atm, will do later.

(Plus I'm tired for some reason, so being lazy.)

ah yes the classic lazy tell

i'm on to you buccaneers

~Eve

[Eevee]

~Eve

[Eevee]

i disagree with the too scummy to be scum thing but i do think Craig is doing this for fun and the fact it'd be a lot less fun as scum since he might just get suspected and lynched for it means it's town-indicative
like i think it's more fun to troll as town like this than as scum basically

Misty is winning me over with cuteness!!

~Eve

[Eevee]

182 to feels like a town!Ydrasse post to me - same tone and everything

did you like the pizza i slipped under your cabin door Ydrasse?

RCEnigma do you actually think Porkens was the towniest player in the game when you replaced him? why if so?

Correction: end of D4 or N4's start

Pending confirmation they could win by the start of D3. If the wincon for mafia is actually "all living members must escape to win" and not "majority members must escape to win" meaning 2/3. I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

i don't like this post because if you're actually scared of mafia not knowing about this yet by saying "I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something" - then why make this post at all? you're telling mafia they could win by the start of D3 - that's definitely gonna get them thinking and would probably make them realise what you're talking about if they hadn't already - makes me think you made this more for show than actually being concerned about that

~Eve

[Eevee]

Craig is too scummy to be scum

Craig is too scummy to be scum

Even though I know this is a discredited concept I'm having trouble disagreeing.

Yeah, 100%, but he is TOOOOOO scummy to be scum

I'm actually very confused about Craig right now. If they are town it almost feels like they're gamethrowing. It's quite important to get a scum lynch D1 or D2. So I don't understand as town why they're playing like this and drawing votes.

But a similar thing can be said for scum. It's important they don't get lynched D1 or D2 so as scum why would you want to draw this attention to yourself.

It's all wifom but I don't see this being pro-any alignment.

i've kinda just shelved Raya as a High Seas town for doubling down in the middle post and the thought process in the followup - i just get the feeling scum don't commit so hard to a stance like that on prime lynchbait and then reconsider straight after like that

both based on it being a stupid strat and how a confident stance like that really feels like it has a feeling and genuine conviction behind it - don't @ me this is gut i know

~Eve

[Eevee]

Craig i'm guessing you're suggesting Ydrasse is taking the easy approach that scum would which is go for the lynchbait Craigy and not comment on surrounding stuff which is harder to comment on as scum
my townpings on her is for tone rn though

~Eve

[Eevee]

Ok. I townread Craig now

Agreed, because of ~reasons~, but I will say it's not an especially strong read.

assuming i know about this reason (i do) - why is that a reason to townread him?

~Eve

[Eevee]

yep!

~Eve

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

I'm gonna assume everyone is having so much fun, my questions got missed!

I don't know what the fuck HoldenGolden is saying, so I'll be ignoring that slot

upon more indepth looking, it's actually kinda comprehensible. taking my last statement back

Mohab, these were made within the same minute; what did you see on the second pass that made you think it was more comprehensible?

~Eva

holden's take on the mechanics was towny imo it's a bit bold for scum

Which takes do you referring to? And why do you think mechanic talk is "bold" in any circumstance?

~Eva

~Eva

[Eevee]

I don't really like the Pork replace out, mostly he said he was really excited about playing earlier. I also have intel that Porkens might not like scum very much.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Umalut i'd just like you to know that Eva pronounces your name as "omelette"

~Eve

[Eevee]

Huh. I think I know who you are now and it’s really not who I thought at all

who did you think i was? skitter?

~Eve

[Eevee]

If the vowels were actually umlautted that might not be too far off, weirdly enough.

It was just cause it sounded cuter!

Menalque replaces Craig Pelton.

Hello Menalque!

I am going to sleep for a while. Please no loud noises...

~Eva

[Eevee]

Menalque replaces Craig Pelton.

That answers my question.

UNVOTE:

did you unvote because you figured out he was an alt? why if so?

Huh. I think I know who you are now and it’s really not who I thought at all

who did you think i was? skitter?

~Eve

Nah, I never had you as skitter, you honestly were always a confusing alt to me and I never really nailed you down but wanted to play with you quite a lot. It’s weird that you’re who you turned out to be lol

<3
i have some confusing alts littered around actually... but i know you're no stranger to keeping alts hidden for a decent amount of time

why isn't Mohab in your scum grouping?

~Eve

[Eevee]

the hoopla school of thought i see - that's fair i normally believe townslips too as long as they don't look fake this one just gave me that feeling

i'm in two minds about her making 124 after seeing my criticisms about 9 - it looked like a scummy double down to me but she got nothing but negative attention for making 9 so it is a strange route to pursue as scum

any thoughts on the bottom of my 202 RCE?

VOTE: RCEnigma

~Eve

[Eevee]

I have a tentative guess for who you might be too but unsure

Spoiler:

~Eva

[Eevee]

I've played with RCEnigma two-ish times and he seems very different.

Fwiw I don't think Frederick is with snow or ydrasse. Feel less strongly about Frederick not being with menalque.

Strongly believe menalque is not with snow or ydrasse since I know that he would know this is an anti-bus setup.

It seems a bit early to look for partners, no? And I think these conclusions come from very mild shade; not sure they mean much.

~Eva

[Eevee]

These 3 had good tone and I mindmelded on the first two

How could you mindmeld on the first one(!?)

I know Eve hates dumbtells, and while I think I'm more lenient on them, it seems unrealistic Mohab thought there were power roles in this game? It feels like Mohab didn't read the setup at all, so then why did he choose to play this game? Many questions.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Isn't it that no daytalk is the default?

Why do you think this?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Oh my bad, I meant the second one, and it was meant to be a joke...

In any case, I can confirm we sent invites a while after we signed up, and everyone who joined afterwards was invited. Mohab was not invited.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Hmm, I *think* that looks good for Frederick?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Interesting that Eve hates dumbtells, I wouldn’t have guessed that. And idk, but I didn’t do exactly read the setup closely. Maybe mohab received an invitation and decided to accept on the basis of that + a good PL and moderator?

it's less so that I hate dumbtells and more i get polarising opinions about them - i often strongly townread or scumread them

I mean I agree it probably should have been in the rules already one way or the other, and that it's reasonable to assume no daytalk.

actually i think it's reasonable to assume daytalk if there's no mention in the rules - daytalk is the standard nowadays
i have some questions for you: when's the last time you made an omelette, what is your read on Mohab, and would you like to join Eva and i at the midnight buffet - since Ydrasse shut us down?

@eevee: is meta the sole reason that snowblaze gets a little scum ping for having reads so early on? (145) you liked when umlaut provided a reads list that had little to substantiate it. (101) so i guess i don't see how the situations distinguish themselves from one another save for the meta...?

yep in a vacuum the snowblaze early reads i'd like for town but it doesn't work out that way because of meta for her

~Eve

[Eevee]

...
Chemist gets slight townpoints for their only response to Fredrick’s accusations being “wat”, I feel like scum would be more likely to take accusations seriously.
...

I would like to point out that since making that post, Chemist1422 has posted 4 times in Micro 953: Treestump Express as of the time I am making this post. (citation)

you shouldn't talk about other ongoing voyages btw

why have you decided to use cross game activity tells to this extent on today's cruise? i skimmed though your last town expedition and couldn't find you use a single one - do you scumread anyone in this game for their content alone and not those tells?

~Eve

[Eevee]

I haven't made an omelette in quite a while, but I do have some ham in the fridge so I may have to do that later! Thanks for the suggestion.

The thought of Umlaut eating an omelette brings me joy.

I've been feeling pretty detached to this game so I don't really feel strongly about anything. Also some people ignored my questions. I'm gonna try and reread soon though and see if I can get a better feel.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Also really disappointed in the constant replace outs, I know I would've done the same if I had something that made me busy (in fact, I am still considering replacing out atm), but it's hard for me to form any reads properly when the player changes midway.

Honestly unsure of what to do at the moment. can someone provide a summary of what the fuck happened in the last few pages? I don't understand what's going on anymore.

From what I understand: push on holden initially makes sense, but seeing as they're apparently V/LA, shouldn't be a cause for a push anymore.

i feel like you're LAMISTing and dumbslipping so much more than i'm used to from you - like it doesn't feel natural that you're so lost
other than the Holden debacle is there anything else you're confused about?

Menalque you still want to push Holden now knowing he's V/LA? he is btw - i checked

~Eve

[Eevee]

RCEnigma
Mohab
Fredrick

are people i'd to like to make walk the plank

Ydrasse do you think any of these sailors would be a good place to slam down your vote?

~Eve

[Eevee]

no but i mean do you still think it's scummy for him to be absent from the thread

~Eve

[Eevee]

everyone's lounging around on the deck they don't understand the gravity of our situation - i mean who's gonna steer the ship now with our captain dead

RCEnigma was a fine wagon and stock's rising quickly so it's optimal time for any onlookers to hop on

~Eve

[Eevee]

Are those questions really AI though?

Dumbtells individually are annoying to analyze because what are you going to do? Get the person to admit they actually knew the set up and was pretending to be a old sweet grandma who needed a youthful whippersnapper for help? Would you say, for example, scum replacing in would know who their predecessor was and thus wouldnt shade their own slot? Wrong, been there and done it by general accident. Its NAI. Do you think the "dumbtells" are being excessive however is a better train of thought.

Back to the point:

The bottom half feels like a trump tweet; it comes off as shade rather than actually trying to sort the dumbtell. More importantly, eevee already inquired pages prior to this asking mohab about their lack of knowledge about the set up. There should of been more progression, imo, if town!eevee is going back to that point here. Something like: "Mohab ignored responding to my point over the lack of set up info and proceeded to make another dumbtell while trying to catch up. I think this is scummy because x,y,z". Instead there just is a noncommittal hyping over discussing the dumb tell.

I do think so, yes. There is clear motivation for scum to use dumbtells: "I don't know this crucial piece of information and/or I am very disoriented, therefore I can't be scum." I'm accusing Mohab of exactly that, because is it really likely for someone to think there were power roles in this game when the setup is on the first page, and they had to have seen it when they were signing up? And furthermore, why do they need to ask this question in thread other than to show people they don't know this piece of information? It isn't even helpful for solving.

I thought it was fairly clear what I meant as I summarised it as being "unnatural" and I don't like how you think this was scummy just because I didn't type this out.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I rescrubbed the decks again and it was tiring... A50 brings up a good point about RCE - I can see that coming from enthusiastic town. Also, RCE's mechanic's talk which Eve doesn't like isn't so bad since I realised I did something similar recently; I will talk to her about it!

Actually, I like Holden's wall! VOTE: Snowblaze

~Eva

[Eevee]

Correction: end of D4 or N4's start

Pending confirmation they could win by the start of D3. If the wincon for mafia is actually "all living members must escape to win" and not "majority members must escape to win" meaning 2/3. I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

i don't like this post because if you're actually scared of mafia not knowing about this yet by saying "I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something" - then why make this post at all? you're telling mafia they could win by the start of D3 - that's definitely gonna get them thinking and would probably make them realise what you're talking about if they hadn't already - makes me think you made this more for show than actually being concerned about that

~Eve

Almo what do you think of my reasoning here and why does town!RCE make that post?

Holden regarding your thing about me defending Ydrasse - that's me answering Craig's question while explaining my earlier stated reasons for town leaning her - i don't get your qualms
the easiest way to read her properly though is with a reaction test:

Spoiler:

5784

sorry about the jumpscare
how does this make you feel Ydrasse?

~Eve

[Eevee]

I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

then why did you say this part? that gives me the impression you weren't going to make it known scum could kill each other if they could, just in case they didn't realise

~Eve

[Eevee]

hey Misty we're gonna host a great play for the ship later and we need performers - you in? and can you recommend any other good actors and actresses on board?

~Eve

[Eevee]

no Almo you don't follow me

RCEngima tried to give the impression he didn't want scum to realise they could kill each other if they hadn't already, and asked a question privately to the mod
but if that's the case, he shouldn't be making that post in the first place since it could possibly alert scum that they can kill each other

the scuminess of that post has nothing to do with the act of misunderstanding the rules - it has everything to do with the intent of the post and the disconnect betweent the thought process behind it and the actual act of making and posting it
you ask for scum motivation? there doesn't need to be a

specific

motivation for that post - the scum motivation for any post like that is to give out content and get yourself not scumread
you and RCE aren't invited to perform for the play - you can still have tickets to view it though

VOTE: RCEnigma

~Eve

[Eevee]

I mean, if you ask something in public you are opening the door for others to also ask it. If you ask it in private and still mention it in public that is identically the same (except it may open the door for different wording leading to different answers in some cases, but this is an Open so that's not really a concern).

The only way this is scum driven is if RCE wanted to see if he could win as early as the start of D3, and in that case he would have NOT said it in the open at all, but rather asked in the scum PT and kept the answer to himself (and his partners)

again: i am not suggesting RCE could be scum who was actually unsure about the answer of this question - if he's scum he most likely knew the outcome of the question before asking it - probably from a rules clarification in his PT
the scum motivation to ask that is for town points and to look good for it

~Eve

[Eevee]

Now let me ask you this: What is the SCUM motive behind this post, given scum daychat is also announced in the rules. If RCE had doubts or was unclear about the rule (which -again- is not possible from my PoV given it's an explicit win con statement) why wouldn't he have asked in the scum PT?

I dislike this. Don’t you think it’s very very easy for scum to say something publicly that they could’ve said in the scum pt to seem townie?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Also it just occurred to me that A50’s defence was suspicious given the gamestate. Why else do you have RCE as a strong townread, A50?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Possibly against the spirit of the game, but Porken’s replace out being very scum indicative lingers in my mind...

~Eva

[Eevee]

I tried to convince her! But we do have other reasons. Do you see them? What do you think?

~Eva

[Eevee]

well tbh the rep out from Porkens is also very scum indicative but i've been wanting to not bring that up because using reps is kinda dirty and all that - but i feel like i have to at this point for the sake of transparency

Eevii is fine

~Eve

[Eevee]

I would give a speech about not rushing but since we only have three days, I need you guys to speak up. For me, the RCE wagon still seems OK to me. This is fairly hypocritical of me but the low presence or inactive players as well as the replace-outs probably have the bulk of scum in them. I'll evaluate later in more detail and give more precise reads. VOTE: RCEngima for now.

this is what makes me most uneasy about this wagon though

Mohab is close behind RCE at no.2 for not getting to perform at our play - you are of course welcome to watch though Mohab we just heard back from Umlaut and he'll be the main star!

~Eve

[Eevee]

What about the replace-out is scum indicative?

Porkens is nervous when playing scum and doesn't seem to enjoy it as much as town - see his last scum game (treestump 1)

secondly he /inned to two more games straight after replacing out of this one

i'll have a look at snow now Menalque

~Eve

[Eevee]

yeah Snow has been scummy actually
she's playing to her scum meta of having plenty of reads early and there's none of that free flowing paranoia that comes with her towngame
and the fredrick unvote and RCE votes are both bad

don't mind that wagon either

~Eve

[Eevee]

haven't read anything for the last couple of days but i'm liking these recent posts from snowblaze

how confident are you on RCE!town and why S+S?

what about Mohab?

~Eve

[Eevee]

VOTE: Mohab

yeah let's go here - i'll trust Almo and S+S's reads on RCE for now

Mohab is still really scummy for the fake dumbslipping and the scummy double down where he asked if there were any power roles after i thought he was sus for the earlier stuff

~Eve

[Eevee]

look at Mohab's play in partition and tell me this is someone wearing the same aligned uniform - in partition MOhab was clever and even strategically scumclaimed and got people to spew as town because of reactions - she wasn't someone who was this lost and confused

~Eve

[Eevee]

So, I am just wondering some stuff regarding the setup. From what I've read, does scum auto-win once they reach day 5? and why would them getting lynched Day 1 and Day 2 instantly end the game if there are supposed to be 3 players?

meaningless wagon as all wagons are early on. UNVOTE:

I am gonna ask a really dumb question but, can there be power roles in this game?

Can I get some idea of the current wagon? skimmed the last few pages but everything seems so disconnected to me, I am not sure what's going on anymore.

Honestly unsure of what to do at the moment. can someone provide a summary of what the fuck happened in the last few pages? I don't understand what's going on anymore.

From what I understand: push on holden initially makes sense, but seeing as they're apparently V/LA, shouldn't be a cause for a push anymore.

Also really disappointed in the constant replace outs, I know I would've done the same if I had something that made me busy (in fact, I am still considering replacing out atm), but it's hard for me to form any reads properly when the player changes midway.

I would give a speech about not rushing but since we only have three days, I need you guys to speak up. For me, the RCE wagon still seems OK to me. This is fairly hypocritical of me but the low presence or inactive players as well as the replace-outs probably have the bulk of scum in them. I'll evaluate later in more detail and give more precise reads. VOTE: RCEngima for now.

what's even going on anymore lol

all of these posts are scummy imo - confused/lost to excuse lack of content complaining about replace outs and a healthy dose of LAMIST sprinkled in - this doesn't match what town!her is like

this is much more likely to flip scum than Snow i feel - let's vote here please

~Eve

[Eevee]

I don't know exactly how confident. More than I am in anyone else by far, and enough to vote probably anyone else to keep him from being killed today.

The reason is that 599 draws suspicion onto him in return for having a perfect alibi for being on the wagon. By unvoting, he's not revoking the suspicion-- it still looks like a potentially opportunistic vote-- but he is relinquishing the position on the wagon that was presumably very important to his survival as scum. To get back on the wagon he'd have to pretend to be unimpressed by Snowblaze's content and generate a new excuse, which will draw suspicion.

Also, like, he doesn't want to let up on Snowblaze as scum since he's likely on the chopping block if Snowblaze talks herself down. The unvote shows that he's actually invested in letting her give her defense, so either he's doing it as a play to look good, or he's just town. And being not the most charismatic player I would not expect him to try a reverse psychology play like that when he could go the more direct route of just remaining on and trying to get her hammered, which wouldn't have even made him look bad.

alright cool

~Eve

[Eevee]

Menalque would be a possible partner for Mohab if she is scum with the way he called her obvlious town when i just don't get that feel really

~Eve

[Eevee]

here's Mohab's ISO in partition: viewtopic.php?t=83003&f=23&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

it's night and day

vote Mohab if you'd like to perform in the play!!!

~Eve

[Eevee]

fantastic! thank you for moving to Mohab, Ydrasse Raya and Snowblaze - i feel it in my Eevee soul that this will flip scum

we've got just under 5 hours left so let's get that hammer down and get this play started

~Eve

[Eevee]

well we'll find out shortly sailors - 1 hour left so don't miss the deadline please

~Eve

[Eevee]

There was something unclear about it. As I recall there was a detail of the setup that I thought was underspecified as written.

In other news:

I see you, Mohab.

someone hammer her please

the contrast to partiton means her behaviour this game is most likely faked - don't be distracted by snow or blazes - you'll burn yourself

~Eve

[Eevee]

viewtopic.php?t=82755&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go
viewtopic.php?t=83025&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

look at her scumgames and compare them to the level of effort and reads that she's giving out now

~Eve

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

Mohab/Menalque, I think.

I'm not feeling Menalque thinking Mohab's dumbtelling is town-indicative. NAI/not first choice of scum, maybe, but the way he's casing it here and the stance he's taking makes me feel like he's committed to a suboptimal scum stance and can't let go.

@Menalque: what's your progression on our slot? I remember you townreading us in the beginning; when did that change and why?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Otherwise, I +1 to Eve's Mohab read. I was following partition too and I agree she's weird. Snow, I'm gonna have to trust Eve on that one.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Menalque, when you say you’re not trying to force my elimination through... I disagree pretty strongly with that. Asking everyone in sight to vote me counts pretty strongly as forcing my elimination imo.

I agree with Snow here actually; I think Menalque is trying pretty hard to not get Mohab lynched, and I'm not sure what else is there to do that he isn't doing.

And yeah, you kind of faded out, and then came back in to lead a pretty poor push (in its quality) away from my preferred scum choice. It’s kind of similar to what happened with firebringer in the recent JK9++ game — I started off TRing him for being ~*aorund*~ and having a presence then he sort of faded away and I realised what was there was never a strong basis for a TR anyway. This is all obviously assuming that mohab will flop town and that snow will flip scum. If mohab does flip scum then you’re very likely town.

What about the push do you think is poor quality? But the last part is fair enough, I feel the same way about you.

~Eva

[Eevee]

The second game is entirely consistent with the amount of effort she’s put in here. I already meta’d her, what about her play in this game, besides meta, makes you think she is town?

honestly i don't ~townread~ her content and none of her thoughts scream town - i just scumread Mohab and really want that to go through instead
i do have reasons to townread her otherwise though - they're a little weird but here:
Snow is a relative newbie so being wagoned this hard and coming back with all this effort and motivation is town-indicative on its own and i don't think you can see this level of effort in her newbie scum games

look at her last newbie scum game - she made 8 relatively short posts in the last 5 irl days in that game before she was lynched
compare that to this game where she's made 17 posts in the last 3 days - all with extensive thoughts given out and much longer in length posts than that game

especially for newbie players i think people are more afraid to give out thoughts freely and be transparent when scum so snow doing exactly that right now probably means she's town - and i find it unlikely that the first time she decides to do that as scum is in a game with more experienced players than she's used to outside of the newbie queue

~Eve

[Eevee]

@Fredrick: Ydrasse is never happening - move back to Mohab please! we had you cast as the Damsel in Distress and everything (really huge role)

@Smarter_Something: are you against a Mohab lynch? you should vote her if you're not

~Eve

[Eevee]

-Lynches will occur when a majority (>50%) is reached. If no majority is reached before deadline, the player with the most votes will be lynched. Ties will be resolved by wagon seniority. If the day ends with no votes cast, a random town-aligned player will die.

I missed it as well, but this is pretty helpful.

~Eva

[Eevee]

What about the push do you think is poor quality?

The fact that your main point seems to have been “mohab meta looks different here” and despite that being pretty weak on its own mohab has still become a strong counterwagon to snow

That's not all though; it's mainly the dumbtelling, and the fact it doesn't look genuine (backed up by referencing a past game). Do you really think it's not a good point?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Titus you should vote for Maemuki - i'd be very surprised if snowblaze flipped scum here

~Eve

[Eevee]

Umlaut Titus obviously isn't happening - switch back to Maemuki please

~Eve

[Eevee]

Votecount 1.22

Mohab500

............

(6):

Umlaut (596), Fredrick A Campbell (608), Eevee (622), Raya36 (634), Snowblaze (646), Ydrasse (658)

Snowblaze

...........

(5):

HoldenGolden (511), Menalque (532), Almost50 (570), Something_Smart (671), RCEnigma (672)

RCEnigma

............

(1):

Mohab500 (502)

Not Voting

..........

(1):

Titus

With 13 alive, it’s 7 to lynch. The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-07-16 11:50:59).

@Titus: Umlaut and Fredrick were the first two on the Mohab wagon so it's entirely possible they were distancing early but once the wagon actually grew to this size they needed to hop off and not actually get Mohab lynched
and now Fredrick's moved over to Snowblaze - did you lose your way or are you guilty Fredrick?

our play has been delayed like 4 times now North - the food's getting so so cold

~Eve

[Eevee]

There was something unclear about it. As I recall there was a detail of the setup that I thought was underspecified as written.

In other news:

I see you, Mohab.

nah Umlaut's clear if Mohab slot is scum - he made this post when Mohab was at L-1
that'd be suicidal

anyway this preflip analysis is mostly pointless right now - come back to us Umlaut!

~Eve

[Eevee]

what do you think of my newfound VCA skills Titus

pretty impressive right

~Eve

[Eevee]

meta and not believing Mohab playing dumb and acting lost is the gist - i have more substantial reasons scattered through our ISO i think

btw i gotta say you blink at an incredibly consistent rate

~Eve

[Eevee]

what do you think of my newfound VCA skills Titus

pretty impressive right

~Eve

i need validation Titus

good job on lynching maemuki btw - post hammer reaction bodes well i'd say

i'll get the lighting and stage ready for the play

~Eve

[Eevee]

got something you wanna talk about RCE? i'm here for you

~Eve

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

The play is sold out!

Not gonna lie, I think it's just Menalque here, although I will consult Eve about it.

~Eva

[Eevee]

That was @eva specifically you both somehow ninja’d me

Don't get me wrong, I definitely don't want to fast to quick-guillotine you, or anyone for that matter! Who's your top pick for scum right now?

~Eva

[Eevee]

That was @eva specifically you both somehow ninja’d me

Don't get me wrong, I definitely don't want to quick-guillotine you, or anyone for that matter! Who's your top pick for scum right now?

~Eva

Oops

[Eevee]

~Eve

[Eevee]

gut is saying menalque is town but brain is saying we'd be stupid not to throw him overboard

mene do you have an example of a time as scum where you hard pushed for a town counterwagon moreso than you did here - i ask because you keep mentioning that you would've pushed snow a lot harder as scum

Raya why do you think you're not a performer for the play? you still have front row seats don't get me wrong so treat this as a fun question

~Eve

[Eevee]

@Eve

I made a ham and cheese omelette the other day and it was fantastic.

this is great news - Eva will be delighted! btw how do you pronounce your own name? there's actually a lot of ways when you really think about it

This is pretty fair, sorry I couldn’t see you as town yesterday

I’ll have a look at my scumgames. I’m not sure there is off a quick think though, although I think the tendency to go to extremes is present there

it's all good we're playing mafia after all and cool i look forward to seeing them

~Eve

[Eevee]

btw how do you pronounce your own name? there's actually a lot of ways when you really think about it

The dictionary way, which is "

oom

-lout"

oops i was pronouncing it as

oom

-laut instead of lout
i'll try and rewire my brain

oh and forgot to reply to you Titus - let's VCA tag team this for sure! lots of juicy data to analyse

~Eve

[Eevee]

thanks will have a proper look at that later Mene

agree that Almo is pretty scummy

RCE i like for town now

Raya you didn't answer my question on why you aren't performing today )=

~Eve

[Eevee]

looking back at Homura's posts i still think they're pretty towny - even her take on Craig showed nuance
Almo has this habit of hard defending town in a way which looks like white knighting sometimes actually... i wouldn't say he's scummy for the way he defended you
he's more scummy for the reasoning he was using to vote snow towards the end - can't remember exactly but soemthing about proving to Titus that her VCA was wrong by flipping snow?

~Eve

[Eevee]

I have a secret tell on Menalque which is that he would feel bad hardbussing a partner like Mohab. I guess it's possible he was just wrong, but yeah, this what I expect from scum!Menalque.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Something_Smart when you get here let me know how you feel about Almo

~Eve

[Eevee]

Raya why do you think you're not a performer for the play? you still have front row seats don't get me wrong so treat this as a fun question

Sorry completely missed this.

My guess is one of you don't like me or you don't know what my avatar is from to get a cool performance picture

the performers = people confirmed as town lol

~Eve

[Eevee]

Montosh
Menalque
Smarty
Almo
RCEnigma

has both scum probably - as long as we don't mislynch all of the townies in that group we got this

~Eve

[Eevee]

@Menalque, fair enough! Disregard that point then.

~Eva

[Eevee]

<Raya>
<Ydrasse, S_S>
<RCE>
<Montosh, Menalque, A50>

is where I'm at, pending a read of the games Menalque linked. Also want to point out, it's good if we get the unconfirmed to provide reads/make pushes, but let the final decision go with us. Yes? Yes?

~Eva

[Eevee]

There’s a lot of benefit to the unconfirmed giving reads/making pushes btw, it’s not just me wanting to be lazy. If we do all the solving, scum don’t have to give content and content is always good. Also I think their stances today are especially important.

~Eva

[Eevee]

One question though: I said I only had TWO confident TRs. One of them (Fred) is now confirmed. Why would scum me opt to confirm Fred here? Like, I am very much self-aware (people who played against scum!me would confirm) and if I wanted to defend not one, but TWO of my scum!buddies (RCE & Mae) that blatantly then the very least I could have done is keep Fred in the suspects pool.

I don’t get it? What does scum!you have to lose by confirming Fred here? Why does this strongly point away from you?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Personally, I don't see a single benefit to me making any sort of effort. I do look bad and I know it. That means if I try to push someone from the Snow wagon I am being a hypocrite. If I push someone on the Mae wagon I am protecting myself and my partner. If I go undecided I am demotivated scum. I literally can't do shit now, and I think I'll be eliminated either today or tomorrow if we don't actually hit scum

Who do you think is scum right now? Any thoughts.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I already liked Ydrasse, but her latest post makes me like her even more! Waiting on A50 to reply to some things.

Also I've been kind of busy and I think Eve is too, but we will get back to things shortly!

~Eva

[Eevee]

Raya and Ydrasse both commited to townreading me and eliminating Mohab/Maemuki. Neither changed their mind despite being given plenty of opportunities to do so. If either of them is scum they were committing to the bus there.

i agree that there's probably not a busser on Maemuki - you were on L-1 multiple times and for long periods of time so there was apt opportunity for scum to pivot and i think they would given the consequences of a scum lynch

i think all 3 scum were on your wagon and the only reason they didn't manage to lynch you was thanks to your high effort and solving so good job!

~Eve

[Eevee]

not exactly but we just need to not lynch all the townies on that wagon

~Eve

[Eevee]

What did you like about her last post, Eva? That was one of the ones I think I like less from her

Mindmelded on this point in particular:

also i'm gonna be real maybe it's because i'm tired but looking at the talk about what your ~best plan is just feels like a bunch of words i'm supposed to look at and take at face value that you'd do as scum which i'm not doing right now. you can say what you think is the best plan and then just... not do it, lmao.

Am also applying it to A50 "I wouldn't confirm Fred" point because unless that is a major hindrance to scum!him (I don't think it is), it's not clearing and instead makes me think he specifically didn't do this so he could make this point.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I will say I had a dream Ydrasse was deepwolf yesterday! Weird!

~Eva

[Eevee]

MmMMMmmm...it still feels wrong to go for people on the Mohab wagon though, when there's obviously more suspicious people on the Snow one.

~Eva

[Eevee]

So what happens if I do get invested and end up being eliminated all the same? OK, what happens if I do escape the gallows but we eliminate town still?? Like, would it not be best to eliminate the most suspected people first? If you agree, then it's me or Menalque. If you don't, and you still want me to fight back then I guess I'd put my trust in Titus' VCA and vote Ydrasse. Which would you prefer?

If you are town, you are part of a big team that just got a lead. Being miseliminated doesn't make you lose, so why are you demotivated?

~Eva

[Eevee]

I feel pretty good about Raya and probably Montosh. RCE has a lot of things pointing to him being town. Brain says it's wrong to not lynch any of A50/Menalque and Menalque feels kind of townie. Ydrasse and S_S are dropping but they were on the Mohab wagon.

???

I think all things considered (including Titus' VCA) A50 is the best option, but I'm gonna think about it some more.

~Eva

[Eevee]

*Sigh* How many times do I have to explain myself? I am not demotivated because I might be miseliminated. I just don't want to effort and be miseliminated. If I'm going down anyway I'd rather not get too invested (mentally and emotionally). Got it? Effort PLUS miselimination is demotivating. Either WITHOUT the other is fine, and from where I stand it still looks like I'm going to be miseliminated (if not today then tomorrow). However, I am still here, still trying to interact and still trying to do something useful. It's not like I replaced out or stopped responding.

No, what I meant was town want to give reads (effort) so if they’re miseliminated, we can work from them etc. You’re playing in a what seems to be a scum mindset where the game ends when you’re eliminated.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Also I just remembered one thing that pinged me about Menalque was that he found Mohab’s dumbtelling town-indicative yesterday which felt off. Otherwise, he’s charmed me today.

Will discuss with Eve if that’s of importance.

~Eva

[Eevee]

@Titus, I’m also curious about your VCA for interest’s sake!

~Eva

[Eevee]

The reason we shouldn't ignore wagon positioning is that this is a game with significant consequences for scum if scum die early. While bussing isn't possibly it's not something that scum would do lightly and it's something that they likely would look for excuses to avoid

I agree with S_S too; wagons matter because I don’t think they would’ve bussed if they could avoid it, although that might apply to early on more.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I have a theory on this btw, if you’re interested in hearing it. If not the tldr is I think I was confbiased

I’m very curious!

~Eva

[Eevee]

Okay, so basically, I think my general working theory on dumbtells (more likely to be from town than scum) is correct. Especially people who are just oblivious about the setup are likely to be town, especially in complicated games. Yes, scum sometimes fake this, and I’ve been known to like a dumbtell when I’m scum too tbh, but mostly it is town indicative

So I think what happened here was that I got it into my head that the dumbtell was more town!indicative than I should have given how egregious it was. Which meant that I read the following (the opposition to the wagon I wanted) as indicative that I was right that mohab was town and that she was being counterwagoned against the scum I was pushing. And like as it proceeded, it was sort of like a vicious circle. So the slots pushing for mohab were scummy because they were pushing away from snow to try and get her. And why was snow scum? Because I was town and I was pushing her, and because scum were ocunterwagoning on mohab. Why were the scum counterwagoning mohab — to save snow!scum ofc!

Yes, I’m aware that it’s bad logic of a circular variety but that’s why I think I got so locked in. The more resistance I got to what I was pursuing, the more I thought I was right to pursue it, even despite not townreading mohab

Does that make sense? I feel like it’s not the best explained thing but idk if I can be bothered to edit for clarity rn, I might tomorrow if it is really confusing

Spoiler:

Understood. The second paragraph I related to a lot as well because that was more or less the situation I was in, but the other way around.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I am weirdly scumreading Ydrasse, but I don't want to be distracted if it is just A50. May have to reread A50's ISO or something.

@Fredrick, why do you think it's Ydrasse? Titus' VCA?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

Maybe is IS Menalque...!?

Or maybe we shouldn’t try to big brain it and go A50 > Menalque and do a big re-evaluation if they’re both wrong.

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: Menalque

he just has far too much scum equity for hard pushing snow and even trying a titus counterwagon - we can't really afford to leave him onboard

~Eve

[Eevee]

it's tough... it's difficult...

i remember back to that game where i was townreading you but you did a similar thing where you formed a counterwagon against your partner but you never actually voted me (the other counterwagon) BUT you did state a townread on me earlier so maybe you couldn't without feeling bad
and then i think you had some regrets about not doing more to save him(?) so maybe you were learning from your mistakes and really going for it here

idk stop being such a michael corleone ya know

~Eve

[Eevee]

S_S individual top pick for scum

RCE feels super scummy

Montosh is just ???

Raya prob town

Ydrasse I feel is town but I guess it depends how much weight you put in titus’ VCA

A50 I have no idea on whatsoever

i can get behind this though - i don't actually scumread Almo as much as people here do and agree on Raya/Ydrasse

RCE would be my second pick for scum - idk about S_S still don't understand that last minute bus from him
it gives him minimum towncred while being very bad for scum given the mechanics of this game so why?

~Eve

[Eevee]

I actually don’t know which game you’re talking about

Was this a while ago or fairly recently?

fairly recently

the tiger was in it and also townread you

~Eve

[Eevee]

mhm

~Eve

[Eevee]

stop townpinging me so much pls - you're supposed to be scum
UNVOTE: Menalque

idk i haven't read the last 5 to 10 pages so i'll leave the final decision to Eva
maybe the solve is like RCE + Montosh or something

~Eve

[Eevee]

If I haven't done an A50 ISO by tomorrow night feel free to yell in my general direction.

YELL

~Eve

[Eevee]

I got a psychic message from Eve saying she doesn’t really want A50 and prefers Menalque > RCE, Montosh.

I don’t want RCE/Montosh, and am kind of wondering whether we should eliminate both A50/Menalque so... I guess our slot’s compromise is Menalque?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Menalque’s pretty charming, but I remember strongly thinking he was scum at EoD as well and I don’t know if I want to ignore that.

Thoughts?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

~Eva

[Eevee]

i think RCE would be my no 1 preference actually - just for the same reasons i gave from day 1 mostly

nice walls Montosh and Ydrasse

~Eve

[Eevee]

Is it bad I think A50 is kind of townie now?

This feels genuine, and kind of fair, in my opinion.

As a matter of fact, I am not AT ALL good at responding to posts designed to reach a predetermined conclusion, and yours certainly does look like one. You decided I was scum, and you're just trying to justify your push on me to the point I personally feel you're overdoing it.

Did not like Ydrasse’s wall that much.

With Menalque’s post as well, I’m wondering if I’m scumreading A50’s tone cause I kinda can’t remember why I scumread him so hard other than he pushed for Snow.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Maybe the Porkens replacement still kind of bothers me, but I don’t know about the “doing it for show tell,” anymore + that Mohab vote as RCE was gaining steam points away as well.

~Eva

[Eevee]

*wants to take a LEAP OF FAITH and vote Ydrasse*

~Eva

[Eevee]

Also forgot to point out: scum can't bus today, which is why I asked the unconfirmed to make pushes. Not sure how well my plan worked, but I think everyone has been hardpushing A50 which maybe clears him(?)

~Eva

[Eevee]

Anyway, even with this pointed out, they still can't bus.

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: RCE

any takers?

~Eve

[Eevee]

If it’s helpful, here’s Eve’s case on Snow:

i don't like this post because if you're actually scared of mafia not knowing about this yet by saying "I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something" - then why make this post at all? you're telling mafia they could win by the start of D3 - that's definitely gonna get them thinking and would probably make them realise what you're talking about if they hadn't already - makes me think you made this more for show than actually being concerned about that

well tbh the rep out from Porkens is also very scum indicative but i've been wanting to not bring that up because using reps is kinda dirty and all that - but i feel like i have to at this point for the sake of transparency

Eevii is fine

~Eve

What about the replace-out is scum indicative?

Porkens is nervous when playing scum and doesn't seem to enjoy it as much as town - see his last scum game (treestump 1)

secondly he /inned to two more games straight after replacing out of this one

i'll have a look at snow now Menalque

~Eve

Although I agreed with both points at some point, I don’t know how significant the first one is anymore. The second one I guess I agree with? Maybe? But there was a period when the game was very slow so Porkens might have found this game boring.

~Eva

[Eevee]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... lag_Gambit

@eva

I don’t think this is impossible, but less likely because I made sure to mention it later, and without scum thinking we were gonna think that way, it should be less appealing? But the problem is the data is all over the place. Still, I’ll try and look at it soon to see if I can find anything good.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I don't have anything to respond to but if I'm executed over my predecessor choosing other games over this one then screw repping into games.

No sorry, you’re right; this isn’t fair to you.

UNVOTE:

I’m probably against RCE today.

~Eva

[Eevee]

If it’s helpful, here’s Eve’s case on RCE:

EBWOP

Dunno what I was thinking there.

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: Menalque

[Eevee]

I. Don't. Know !! I was talking to Eve earlier and we agreed in thinking even if Menalque's wrong, it's a shot we have to take. And we can't really agree on our more obscure reads.

What's the case on A50? Yesterday, he pushed Snow, but so did many other people, and today, he made a few posts that made people not like him, but I don't know if that's inherently scummy? Umlaut, where do you want to go?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

Or maybe...it's S_S or something... Much lost. Much confusion.

~Eva

p-edit: hmm, okay...

[Eevee]

I went through D2 roughly and I think all confirmed apart from S_S has been okay with A50 dying so unless that's the exact team ??/?/ But S_S is also not doing much to shift it away from S_S so maybe that still counts. I'd say gamestate-wise, it's not A50.

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: Ydrasse

~Eva

[Eevee]

Mmm maybe you guys are right? Eve wanted this anyway so VOTE: RCEnigma for now.

~Eva

p-edit: "roughly"

[Eevee]

Yikes, will get to this tomorrow! UNVOTE:

~Eva

[Eevee]

S_S, you’re online and you were saying earlier that you think it’s insane for scum to bus — why do you think the above logic is wrong?

it's not out of the question that scum thought Maemuki could turn the slot around - she didn't have to be the plank walker the next day if we threw snow overboard

~Eve

[Eevee]

Okay! I don't find Montosh that scummy actually, and have been agreeing with some of their takes. Holden was probably town too so I don't really want them today.

What is going on with this game full of replace outs...

Quick reads: HoldenGolden - I like the flow of this guy's posts if that makes sense? also get the impression scum wouldn't really do flavour like this as to not attract attention (esp. with that point raya mentioned about scum getting lynched having heavy stakes), so I think this slot is town.

Since this is a hot topic, Craig is null, waiting for the our replacement dude to hit us up with some of posts.

Eevee - Don't like their reads or style atm, thoughts do seem a bit genuine though so not sure what to think here. I guess I've seen this more from town rather than scum, so a slight town-lean here.

Umlaut - Doesn't have a lot of posts but I think I can see some solving and content coming out from them even in so little posts. Probably still needs more posting so so far I'd just say I am leaning town on this one (again).

RCEnigma - Seem to be focused on the game mechanics (which I am actually still somewhat confused about?) but yeah they don't have much else to say regarding anything else. This is more of a gut feeling but I am not a fan of this obsession with the mechanics, feel a little like they side-step reading or other discussions in favour of the mechanics stuff. Wouldn't be surprised if this flipped scum.

everyone else is probably null here, so far.

Plus, plus, look at this readlist; Holden is probably TMI town(?)

~Eva

[Eevee]

I think I want to actually go for either ydrasse or s_s. I'm starting to like the idea of 1 scum on each wagon. I still stand by ydrasse likely sharing alignment with me. So that makes it S_S

VOTE: S_S

Where was the explanation for this again?

~Eva

[Eevee]

throwing Ydrasse overboard would be a disaster - her recent posts are genuine and the tone would be hard to fake as scum

we have an easy route to victory here by targetting the snow wagon and misthrowing someone on the Maemuki wagon makes this unnecessarily difficult

remember - snow was kinda obvtown when she was high efforting towards the end while Mohab was compeltely absent - i refuse to believe snow would be so neck and neck with Maemuki/Mohab in terms of votes without a lot of drive from scum on it
there's no world where both scum were bussing based on that and i even think it's kind of unlikely 1 scum was so let's stick to the plan please

RCEnigma or Menalque today

~Eve

[Eevee]

i think Menalque arguing that both scum may even be bussing is very scum-indicative for him and feels like an agenda he needs to push as scum for a chance to win this game

~Eve

[Eevee]

this why i think it's just Menalque:

• hard pushed snow day 1
  
• defended Mohab as oblivious town
  
• started a Titus counterwagon against Mohab
  
• is pushing the narrative that there were 1 or 2 bussers on Maemuki

VOTE: Menalque

~Eve

[Eevee]

join us on Menalque Ydrasse

also is it bad that i pronounce your name as E-drah-say?

~Eve

[Eevee]

Menalque's vote on Titus was the third. Mine was the first.

which makes it worse

~Eve

[Eevee]

｡･:*:･ﾟ★,｡･:*:･ﾟ☆

~Eve

[Eevee]

Okay, but listen to me and titus tomorrow once I’ve flipped town and kill ydrasse

if you flip town then sure i'll deadsheep you

~Eve

[Eevee]

~Eve

[Eevee]

~Eve

[Eevee]

1) you asked others and appealed to specific people to vote for snow many times though - do you mean pushing her harder with stronger logic?

2) i think a lot of the thread were arriving at the 1 on/1 off conclusion so it doesn't throw your cred away
that said it is strange for you to push the idea of 2 scum bussing now when Ydrasse flipping town would immediately discount it anyway so it's not actually scummy for the reasons i thought - i think it's still weird that you could think that's a significant possibility though

S_S could you explain the Menalque townread?

~Eve

[Eevee]

how do you think you have a tell on Ydrasse when she has no scumgames?

~Eve

[Eevee]

Menalque is angling for a loss if he's scum here by putting all his eggs in one basket when he has to survive two more days.

Obviously he'll argue against dying tomorrow if Ydrasse flips town, but I expect that plea to fall on deaf ears because they usually do.

If he's scum he doesn't have a plan to win, unless his plan is to specifically pocket people who think like me by playing 4d chess.

i like that reasoning

what about your RCE read? anything on top of the reasons from yesterday?

~Eve

[Eevee]

how do you think you have a tell on Ydrasse when she has no scumgames?

~Eve

Dude she has a scumgame

oH

this'll be useful

UNVOTE: Menalque

~Eve

[Eevee]

I think Ydrasse is pretty competent as scum and nothing she's said here is out of the realm of what she can do.

That said, there are a few posts I dislike independently, for example 1270 which I feel is her going to a predetermined conclusion. Her A50 push has also taken most of the day, which gives her scum equity with a lot of people. Her recent stances/vote hopping is concerning.

I'm probably leaning there today and will try to make Eve sheep me by bribing her with PokePuffs.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Almost50 and RCE would make sense for ALmo's weird defense of RCE and RCE's scummy posts from day 1

anyway i'm sadly a little burnt out on mafia right now so i have no motivation to meta or even read everything right now - sorry and good luck i'll be cheering on from the sidelines



~Eve

[Eevee]

YES, I WILL BE TAKING OVER NOW VOTE: Ydrasse

~EVA

[Eevee]

@Umlaut, why do you not like the Ydrasse wagon and what do you think of this?

I think Ydrasse is pretty competent as scum and nothing she's said here is out of the realm of what she can do.

That said, there are a few posts I dislike independently, for example 1270 which I feel is her going to a predetermined conclusion. Her A50 push has also taken most of the day, which gives her scum equity with a lot of people. Her recent stances/vote hopping is concerning.

I'm probably leaning there today and will try to make Eve sheep me by bribing her with PokePuffs.

~Eva

Can you sell RCE/Montosh? Besides they were pushing Snow?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Or A50?

I’m starting to wonder if I wrote him off too quickly, but on a readback, I didn’t find him as scummy.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Kind of getting cold feet if I’m honest; I feel like this Ydrasse wagon was mainly advocated by me and I don’t know how good my reads are.

However, I feel like there’s enough scrambling from the gamestate that there’s a chance this is right?

~Eva

[Eevee]

That does give me some confidence.

~Eva

[Eevee]

If we aren’t locking in our decision now, I can come back in a few hours and reevaluate. I still think that Ydrasse post I linked was scummy. Umlaut, can you give it another read and tell me what you think?

~Eva

[Eevee]

fine there's good equity he's either scum with or white knighting RCE

VOTE: Almost50

~Eve

[Eevee]

I thought it was slight overjustification, and something about how hard she was going at it seemed weird - almost like she wanted to pitch us this rather than scumreading him. Also, this type of analysis matches her scumgame.

Honestly, I don't know anymore, I just want to end the day.

~Eva

[Eevee]

But...I like Montosh...

Some of his thoughts are in line with mine too that if we were going for a level zero solve, we should just go A50>Menalque and worry about if and when that goes wrong.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I would prefer A50 if we must, although I still think Ydrasse is a good choice. I could also be swayed to go Menalque - I know a lot of you will disagree because I agree his D2 is very good, but he is also competent!scum and it doesn't erase his D1 actions.

A50>Menalque>Ydrasse for level 1 solve, maybe? Thinking about this game too much was a very bad idea.

~Eva

[Eevee]

i townread montosh but after that case i don’t think i’d be heartbroken if he were eliminated. i’ll keep my vote on a50 for now but i’ll be around.

What did you like about the case?

~Eva

[Eevee]

Eva, can you try to tell me where you think I’m going wrong on my montosh read then?

It isn't so much as there's anything wrong, it just doesn't resonate with me. I also mindmeld with Montosh more than I let on and I don't think he's scum(?)

~Eva

[Eevee]

I still prefer A50.

If we do Montosh today and he flips town however, I am going to deadsheep him because it will give me confidence in my soul-solves. Montosh, what do you think?

~Eva

p-edit: if we lynch town D3, we auto-win?

[Eevee]

if we lynch town D3, we auto-win?

No, if we lynch scum D3 we auto-win

whOoPS! Yeah, that.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Argh, it's fine. Really, the problem is this day has gone on for too long. I think we're still in a good position and potentially any flip is good information so... let's end it, guys.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Spoiler:

I feel like Montosh is a mistake... DOES ANYONE WANT TO GO A50? ANYONE? LAST CALL!!!

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: Montosh

~Eva

[Eevee]

Eevee did bad... Sorry Montosh, I knew it and I should have fought for you harder.

Menalque/Ydrasse

I will probably not be budging on this today; I’m not home right now, but I’ll find evidence etc when I’m free. @Umlaut, I’ll make you see the light.

~Eva

[Eevee]

VOTE: Menalque

E-2

[Eevee]

UNVOTE:

Hang on, just remembered there’s a nightkill today. Could be us, in which case I have stuff to say. I’ll be back in a few hours.

~Eva

[Eevee]

we can throw 3 more people overboard and i'm still of the opinion that [Menalque, Almost50, RCEnigma] has at least 1 pirate in it - so if we target in there we should win
and it's not like i'm just saying this because of the D1 counterwagon thing - there's individual reasons to think all 3 are scummy

Montosh probably would've been my last choice on the Snow wagon but ah well

~Eve

[Eevee]

this game is honestly easy - as long as BOTH scum weren't bussing we just reprimand those 3 and we autowin

it doesn't matter what order we throw them overboard - we just do and we win 95% of the time

both scum were not bussing because:
-Maemuki wasn't defeatist upon entering the game - she tried to convince us and appeal and that's not the mindset of someone being double bussed
-Mohab was scummy and lurked it out when suspicion came her way. Snow was towny and effort posted and townspewed when suspicion came her way. YET, they were both neck and neck and snow was still almost throw overboard at several moments. there's like no way snow was an all town wagon while the scummy lurked was being bussed and it was still that close

let's wrap this one up passengers

~Eve

[Eevee]

I havent read up yet but I guess it's probably menalque.

VOTE: Menalque

yesterday you townread him and would go for anything else so why the change of heart?

maybe i need to host another play to motivate everyone

~Eve

[Eevee]

Actually I prefer Ydrasse. I really dislike the way she sat on A50, switched to Montosh (despite townreading him), was (probably) online when I asked if anyone wanted to switch to A50 (timestamps), and is looking like she’s going to sit on A50 again.

~Eva

[Eevee]

Not to mention pretty survivalistic yesterday, hmmm???

~Eva

[Eevee]

Oh nevermind, you are correct.

~Eva

[Eevee]

p-edit: eva is just trying to give me the least charitable reason and it HURTS my heart... eva we can get along

I wasn’t trying to! Part of it was wrong and I admit that.

We can get along for the price of 10 pokepuffs. Please make sure they arrive at my cabin door by lunchtime.

~Eva

[Eevee]

when i’m around i’ll have fisticuffs and pokepuffs at the ready

Put those away! Someone might get hurt! D:

~Eva

[Eevee]

Maybe we should just deadsheep this and work our way bottom up. For what it's worth, I was quite upset with the Montosh lynch, it was more no one would switch at the deadline. I thought Ydrasse was blatantly refusing to switch, but guess not.

I was gonna post when I got back from work but ended up taking a nap instead so whoops.

I'm slightly concerned about my Menalque read because I'm wondering how much they'd blatantly push a townie but if it to save themselves until they could escape maybe?

Anyway my reads right now look something like:

Town

Raya
RCE

Ydrasse

S_S
A50
Menalque

Scum

With the caveat that I think that A50 and Menalque probably aren't the same alignment.

~Eva

[Eevee]

I find RCE really really townie actually.

~Eva