Mini Normal 2160 | FIA Group B | Endgame

[UnaBombaH]

So uh.. This game started while I was sleeping, and we are now 16 pages deep?
Gotta love it.
HERE I GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[UnaBombaH]

Radio static

There's this loud noise coming from upstairs. I'm going to investigate it. It sounds like a *cluck* *whirr* *clunk*
It's coming from the printer! There's just a whole load of pages flying through it with incoherent lettering on them. Oh! Not this one.
It says: VOTE: sausage
Interesting. I wonder what it means.
At least I now know the electricity is still working here.

Radio static

I'm not sure I'm going to enjoy this gimmick for a longer period of time..
I was once in a game with a poetic crow, and they just kept going and going with their gimmick.
Hard as all fuck to read, and at least to me, couldn't provide much AI-content in any direction.
These gimmicks are good for scum to hide behind (at least early game), and hard to become really townread when actually town.

[UnaBombaH]

oh my god it's like innocentvillager is some kind of self aligned player who wins the game if he gets me to hug him or something I'm so confused

Chuckled at this.
But yea, I was slightly townleaning that early sillyness from IV, but their continued "neediness" towards TW reads as scummy.

I'm not going to put a lot of faith in my own ability to read IV, so I guess I'm gonna lean on someone who feels comfortable with theirs.
IV is something like Not_Mafia to me. Can make a lot of sense at times, but it often gets buried underneath a pile of goof.

[UnaBombaH]

none of these are how you catch scum!ss

You catch scum-S_S because he sounds more wooden than a bedpost

Top kek.

[UnaBombaH]

Zombie this playstyle is not sustainable

+

You're not adding anything new nor you're making it easy to read you

I don't think I've ever seen Saudade act like this..
This is..towny..?...to me.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh my GOD i missed the fucking stop AGAIN

No. Now I'm just calling bullshit.
Had I been around for the first one, I would've sympathized.
Now you're either lying or too dumb dumb to travel.

[UnaBombaH]

Ducky, S_S, thor, whats up y'all? I'm back.

Wait, thor is in this game?
And I don't think I've played with you before, but apparently you know all the right people..

(And btw, Liverpool has always been my favorite team in the Premier League, and Michael Owen used to be my childhood hero when I was still playing football every day..
I had one of those very dark green kits from the early 2000's for Owen..I wore that shit until it literally fell apart. )

[UnaBombaH]

anyone who *doesn't* know who billy pilgrim is should feel bad

OK, guess I'll feel bad now.

[UnaBombaH]

I exclusively phone post

oh i forgot this tidbit!! phonepost squad

Yea, that's me 50% of the time now too! (used to be a lot higher %, but I'm working from home almost exclusively nowadays so..)

[UnaBombaH]

not lying, and there’s 0 need to call me dumb. can we not do this personal insult thing? kthx.

Hey hey hey hey, no need to feel insulted!
I used two "dumbs" to try and lessen the impact. Or was it the use of "bullshit" that made it seem too harsh?

I honestly didn't want to be offensive in the slightest, even if it seems silly to miss the same stop twice just because you're focusing on mafia.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK, caught up.
I just hope people understand that if the posting peak hours are always going to be around the same time, I'm always going to be asleep then.
Meaning I'll continuously be on the backfoot, catching up, if this is how it's gonna be.

So far I have a good gutfeel about BuDucky, and townread most of Saudades reactions.

VOTE: LavarManos - this Charmeleon seems to be in a weird position.
I want to see where it takes us.

[UnaBombaH]

“silly” is fine. saying I must either be lying or too stupid to travel is personal.

Well, guess my interpretation on "personal" differs here.
Just know that I never want to insult or attack people in a game.
Not my style at all.

[UnaBombaH]

So if I understood your edit correctly, this was towards me?

Ur gonna be stuck with me.
Get used to it.

And yes, I have no trouble with this.
At least you are not swedish..!

[UnaBombaH]

off the top of my head I didn’t like billy’s catchup or unabomb’s

Wait, what did you expect from a catchup at this point in the game?
Almost no one had made any significant stances towards others, and even then it was almost 15 pages of noise.
That's just how games usually start.
I also gave two reads that I'm fine going to the bank with for now.
I also laid down a vote.
So I think your assessment of my catchup is currently warped and affected by bias.
And even that bias is flawed, because you absolutely misinterpreted my post.

What motivation do I have to pretend I missed a train stop?

None as far as I can tell?
But the way you somehow got stuck on it makes me feel a little awkward now?
I thought you talking about your train travel -mishaps was as AI-relevant as me talking about Liverpool towards the player who has their logo as avatar.

I don’t really believe that you think I’m lying. So really I think you’re just using that post to try to discredit me because other people are townreading me for it, and you’re calling me stupid to do it.

Or I was just commenting on that post with what felt like a funny thing to say. Had absolutely NO IDEA you would be so deeply wounded by it though.
And funnily enough, Saudade seems to have called that post "bullshit" as well, with nothing else to add.
But somehow you don't feel it's necessary to question them on it?

[UnaBombaH]

Finnish ppl will always hate you and pretend to not speak Swedish, until you tell them you’re not Swedish but actually Norwegian. They’ll start speaking Swedish and be friendly in no time.

As a representative of the finnish people, I do not agree with this stereotype at all.
I'd argue finnish people dislike speaking swedish unless you are finnish-swedish, in which case you like to speak swedish more than finnish. (which is bullshit for finnish people living in certain areas)

But I do think finnish people like norwegian people a lot more than the swedes.
Mainly because you aren't such a thorn on our side in Ice Hockey, and you are a wealthy country with beautiful people.
I mean, obviously we are awfully jealous of you for all of that, but finnish people are always jealous of other people who succeed, so..

[UnaBombaH]

OK, I didn't want to get into this, but you just can't seem to let it go.
Time to chew your posts into shreds and see what's hiding underneath.

I don’t really see a reason to think that Saudade is attempting to discredit me there.

OK. But you know, they ONLY called your post bullshit.
No context, no jokes either.
Meaning that your "attack" on me seems rather misguided when you are leading with

What motivation do I have to pretend I missed a train stop?

and

I don’t really believe that you think I’m lying. So really I think you’re just using that post to try to discredit me because other people are townreading me for it, and you’re calling me stupid to do it.

So them ONLY calling your post "bullshit" is not scummy, but me calling it "bullshit" and saying you are a "dumb dumb"(???) means that I'm discrediting you?
Even in the literal sense, if I was "discrediting" anything, it was your ability to travel by train, not your posting or your "town credibility".. (and even that wasn't my point - I was just poking fun)
And speaking of towncred.

I don’t really believe that you think I’m lying. So really I think you’re just using that post to try to discredit me because

other people are townreading me for it

, and you’re calling me stupid to do it.

What?
You really think people are (or for that matter - SHOULD??) townread you for missing a trainstop while playing Mafia?
How? Why?
I had absolutely no intentions to read anything AI into this whole stop-missing action of yours, but I'm starting to feel really bad about your efforts at shading me.

[UnaBombaH]

your smilies seem pretty passive aggressive in context and I don’t enjoy being told I’m overreacting to someone basically calling me stupid

I'll give you this one, and only this.
I've been told before that my use of emojis is sometimes distracting or annoying, and I guess I'm sorry for that.
But I'm not going to stop using them, and they are always representing how I feel (or want you to think I feel) when I'm saying something.
And if other people are allowed to roleplay as zombie apocalypse-survivalists, I'm sure I'm allowed to spam emojis in the middle of content.

And as my last ditch effort at trying to really reach you.

****please note that when I call people “bitch” it’s in a cute and affectionate way****

Imagine you had called me a "bitch" and I got upset for it. You dropped this cute disclaimer afterwards, but I might've already been offended.
"Too late.
I'm stuck in this mode for the rest of the game now.
Don't even try to reason with me."

How come with a start like this, you cannot see my PoV on calling you "dumb dumb"??????????

So please stop hampering at that post I made - so far you've only come across as reachy and even a little scummy to me.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm honestly baffled.
Did I REALLY come across that insulting?
And am I that bad at explaining my intentions / giving context that I really deserve this from lilith?

If so, I guess it's better I take a break for a few hours.
If not so, I guess it's better I still take a break while someone else tries to reason with her.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh wow.
I'm done with this interaction for now.

Hey hey hey hey, no need to feel insulted!

+

I honestly didn't want to be offensive in the slightest

If these didn't drive the point home to you from the get go, AND after I tried to rationally answer your points towards me..well.

I'm normally very eager to say I'm sorry and admit fault, but if I were to apologize to you now, it wouldn't be sincere.
I feel like you are trying to play the victim here, and almost "bully me" into apologizing.
Which makes it impossible for me to feel sorry for you at all.

Guess I'll try to censor my posts for PG-ratings from here on out.
But I really think you need a thicker skin for this world if I've really managed to insult you this badly.

Now let's stop making noise, and focus on the game.
We can talk this out afterwards if you really feel like it's necessary.

[UnaBombaH]

The Worst is not only reasonable, but most likely has the right rationale in their recent posts.
Their assessment on how it feels from my PoV (and assumedly liliths as well) feels like the correct one.
Plus I think BuDucky is one of few the players on site who really gets me.
Not that I think I'm too hard to understand most of the time, but I can also see that some of my jokes and trajectories might be hard to convey in this written format.
And I honestly feel bad whenever I truly make someone else feel bad.

That all being said - I'm putting my faith in his ability to analyzed lilith here, and also agree that their actions have not been AI

necessarily

.
The reason why I felt like their reaction was blown way out of proportion was more about them reading my post as AI (I guess?) than it was about them being offended.
I guess I can understand that to an extent, but I'm not sure it fits their choice words very well.
I think I now have a slight scumlean on them for their inconsistency - not for the initial reaction.

[UnaBombaH]

OK, I'm off to do some family-helping stuff for ~24hours or so.
Will read the previous few pages and whatever amount of postage you people manage to pull off by then.

[UnaBombaH]

Una, I apologize for mistaking your intentions and blowing things out of proportion.

No apologies necessary.
I honestly just couldn't believe you would've either been offended by my choice of words, or that you couldn't accept my honest explanation for the meaning behind them.
Happens in a game, stays in the game.

If you can muster it, I would also like an apology for inadvertently hurting my feelings.

I'm obviously sorry, and feel bad about hurting your feelings. Try to believe me when I say that I just could've never believed that someone might be offended by what I said, and therefore considered you might've been faking it.

But yea, let's move on from this and focus on the game when I get back later tonight/tomorrow. (still helping my younger brothers)

[UnaBombaH]

OK, going to do my catchup during the next ~8 hours.
Gonna be a lot of walls and thoughts throughout my read, so don't consider any of them "final" until I'm fully caught up.

That's just how I do it the best.

[UnaBombaH]

Found the last post I had read.
Not sure about ZombieKillers readlist at 541, but I'll return to that once we get some flips.
The thing is, I'm really not sure which (if any) of those reads are actually AI or AI-based because of the flavor, but I hope others are more adept at reading them.

If Lavars an alt and not that new its closer to null but the tr is for being aggro in general and indignant about his RVS vote
Imo following two naked votes so early is also a towntell

So if I got this right - Nep thinks Lavar is more likely to be "newb"town based on their actions, but in the event that they are actually an alt, it's closer to a null?
I'm not sure if I'm a fan of these "conditioned" reads. Especially when you give away the conditions and expectations right away.
I also disagree with the argument that an early voting pattern might be a towntell when we have zero flips and both the voters and the targets alignments are still unknown.
I read posts like these as slightly scummy - feels like Nep is trying to create a townread out of "nothing".

can you like.....throw me a couple of quotes which illustrate an increase in frustration for something which is not directly a misunderstanding from that exchange?

Tws taken this no duh.... approach with me earlier and i dont like seeing it again
It makes it sound like hes good faith questioning but it frames who hes speaking to as obviously wrong from the beginning

Reading an argument like that as tvt is common as hell whether or not its right but tw goes straight for the tmi read where id expect a more honest exploration of thought process
Idr if tw was already scumreading norway

Huh.
I read that post from TW as a way to try and "probe" an "easy" conclusion.
Someone throws out a fast read on something -> you ask for any tangible points of information that lead to that read forming.
Seems pretty basic to me?

Oh boy. I am not going to call the argument between Lilith and unabomber ai yet. There is something I have in mind that might make it ai though.

This is sort of a half-and-half post.
I agree that our argument shouldn't be considered AI per se, but I do think there are certain choices of words and approaches that can be taken notes of.
I for one still lean a little towards the scummier side of null on Lilith for now. Not based on the fact that we argued, but more based on their approach and choice words.
I think there's little reason for you to hide what's on your mind that "might make it AI" though. Not outing it now might be detrimental in the event you have spotted something that others haven't.

Zombie Apocalypse, your reads don’t tell me much.

Well would you look at that. I sort of agreed with this.
UNVOTE: - the responsible thing to do for the duration of my catchup anyway?

You have been self-meta to town read yourself the whole game, it's gross.

I get a "scared and panicking" read of off IV myself. Not sure which directions it would lean more: Are they more scared about being scum and getting caught, or being town and uninformed? I've seen both type of players.
I can understand your suspicions towards them, but it's a funny combination anyway.

IV is something like Not_Mafia to me

did I just get compared to NM LOL wow

Well, there was something similar in your early tone.
But tbf, N_M comes across a lot more confident than you do right now.
And I'm not sure if it's a good thing, considering how they usually base their votes on something of a nothing..

It invites the former duck to show why you are town here since it is outside of your scum range, according to him, and by extension, if he makes a good enough case, you.

Getting others to meta you on demand is the same in my book.

I was a bout to agree with IV on this topic, but damn.. you make a very solid point.
I haven't played with TheFourEyedDude before (I think?), but I'm always a sucker for astute observations like this.

[UnaBombaH]

The way I play, every person is a scum suspect until they clear as town. However, I feel as if there is some good bets for scum in Nep, BillyPilgrim and Norway so far, and one super secret read which I need more time to be sure of.

I am much more confident in my town block than anything else, tough.

I feel like there's a minor contradiction in here though.
Or maybe I've just misunderstood you so far?

If you think that everyone is "guilty until proven otherwise", then these three you have named first (Nep, Pilgrim, Norway + ~Mr. X~) are the ones who not only haven't been able to prove their towniness, but have also made some scummy actions that you've noted down. Sure, I can see that with your claimed way of playing.
What puzzles me though, is the fact that you are "much more confident" in your townreads "than anything else".
Already at this point of the game?
With your methods, it would mean that by page 24 you have already townbinned people based on their content, while they have all started from the position of "scum until proven otherwise"?
I bet you have already laid down some of your arguments for them(?), but I'd like to get some insight on what kind of actions constitute such strong townreads this early in the game.

I would literally bet my life on LavarManos being town, by the way.

Ok, please explain this.

Yes, something like this read for example.
And if you are going to use this..

When your are as well read and informed as I, you vote people who vote poorly

..as the basis for your argument, then it would mean that Lavar was already at this point a poor target for voting? Because apparently you think that people who voted for them are scummy.
Meaning that Lavar was already a townread in your books, but you didn't base it on much?
Help me out here. I really think you had a towny-mindset in that earlier post of yours towards IV, but I'm also struggling to see cohesion with your stated playstyle and your actions so far.

I'm talking about you IV and zombie so far

why do you consider Nepenthes lynchbaity?

refusing to cooperate and out her transperent thought process is prime lynch bait material

Or just scum.

Imo the movement around iv is more ai so far than ivs actual posts

The movement is probably AI, but you have no idea which way they indicate.
Because, again, it's all depending on what IV would flip.

I never said Lavar voted someone who was voting poorly, I voted for people who were voting poorly.

Meaning that people voting for Lavar were voting poorly -> Lavar is a poor vote in your opinion -> Lavar is town(y) in your opinion? -> why?
That's where I want you to go.

Just use Norwee as my nickname, that’s what everyone uses.
It’ll keep things simple for the new dudes.

Also Thor is an old school player on the site, not sure how active anymore though.
But I've played with them before, and it confused me a lot to see someone refer to you with that.

it’s just like, I don’t think he’s sick enough to do that as your partner? And if he really is town which I believe anyway I tend to trust these super confident reads just purely by proxy

and it was so early too makes it seem weird that there would be a deepwolf agenda there

Funnily enough, I'm sort of vibing with this.
Scum very rarely share out

strong, early

townreads on their teammates.

Meaning that in my eyes the scenario where foureyes+Lavar are both scum, is the most unlikely.
There's still the scenario where foureyes is town and mistaken about their read on Lavar (=scum), but I'm leaning towards the other two remaining scenarios for now.
Either foureyes=town and correct -> Lavar = town.
Or foureyes=scum and went for the "townread" on Lavar for ~reasons~.

I've played with scum norwee, so my townread on him is meta which is not much of a help to you
una, well, due to his interaction with you mostly. A bit of a weak read on him but im willing to keep him on my town list

Please don't take this the wrong way Saudade, but are you "trying more" in this game than usual?
I mean this in a very good way - not trying to bash any of your previous games, but actually really thinking that your posting so far in this game has been coherent and on point.
I really feel like townreading your effort, but I'm paranoid as all hell about this being scum!Saudades way of going deep into the game.

He was willing to analyze your post and created good content so i tr him for that

I think you have been the only one so far to realize that I actually tried to find logic and reason within the argument instead of reading either of our emotions.
I also think that was one of the reasons why it sort of "escalated".

[UnaBombaH]

I can’t find it now (can someone please help me find this) but someone said that it seemed like lavar was pocketing foureyes, and I actually think foureyes has been buddying lavar for a while now

Maybe they’re just scumbuddies?

This would've been the "transparent" conclusion on it, but I honestly still think it's more likely to be the other way around.
It feels like foureyes is more "in control of the situation" if that makes any sense?
I honestly now believe they are either both town, or foureyes is the scum within equation. (The outlying chance obv. being that Lavar has managed to fool foureyes)
-------------------------------------------
I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE INTERACTIONS BETWEEN S_S AND LIVERPOOL.
It has been going on for a few pages now(?), and I just can't get the hang of it.
I'm not sure if I'm just tired or stupid, but it just seems to me like they are both spinning the yarn and then disagreeing on what the other one has said.
The posts aren't very quotable either, and I can't come up with a line of questioning / deduction based on anything they have thrown at each other.
I do hope there's a finalé to all of this, and someone is there to clean it up for me so that I can salvage something from it.

Right now, I'm interested in pushing Lavar, and I wanna know whats up with Four and this bizarre defense of them.

While I've just stated my current feelings towards Lavar being on the townier side of null, I still think this is a good way to approach the current gamestate.
Trying to solve that combination might lead to more revelations, considering that FourEyes seems to have a level of confidence within their gameplay, and they have already outed a few of their stronger scumreads.

VOTE: Billy Pilgrim

Let’s go here

Why are you going here?

Why are you defending me?

I'm not defending you...

This here.
Am I the only one who finds this hilarious?

Billy, i haven't stated a TR on you. And i didn't do anything other than ask if IV had any reason for changing his vote to you.

Why is that me defending you?

+

That was such a weird comment to make that i wanna go here for now.
VOTE: Billy Pilgrim

+

Eh read too much into it i guess.

Exactly.
I guess we all just need to try a little harder to understand each other's agendas, rather than just read the posts on a surface level. (myself included, obviously)

VOTE: Billy Pilgrim

Let’s go here

Why are you going here?

looks like you’re going here now too

that doesn’t invalidate wanting to know the reasons you’re on the wagon (which I would also like to know)

Was about to point this out too.
IV seems to go for the easy way out here instead of actually engaging with the people questioning him.

If you do not understand it, I believe the issue may be on the side of the reader, rather than the side of the author.

No, fuck this.
You have been dodging these questions from the start yourself.
If so many people are having trouble reading your intentions, then it is no longer up to them to try and read your mind.
It's up to you to explain. That's how teams work in a game like this.
Scumsliding down the hill with my read on you.

iv has been consistently useless

This might be the most accurate read on them so far.
Obviously being "useless" for extended periods of time sometimes reveals more useful information about the players around you, making you useful instead.
And no, we shouldn't all try this out.

he seems alright tbh I wouldn't vote him

+

saud you skipped all the posts I had issues with lmao

if I skipped them then they didnt ping me

The slightest comfort I get from interactions like these, is that it at least feels too silly to be a coordinated scum-theater..

BILLY WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT LILITH SCUMm READING YOU FOR YOUR AWFUL POSTS

Oh man, I think I really like Saudade at times. That being said, they also seem to have an agenda with solving alignments within Liverpool-Lilith-S_S. It's not the most common take on the game so far, and I like it.

[UnaBombaH]

i think ss might be t*wn but i'm not locked

I've watched your play from both town and scum PoV, and seen you play as both scum and town as well.
I feel like I have a good-ish grasp on how you operate.
The downside being that I feel like you need to spam your heart out for your alignment to shine through, and you haven't been doing enough so far for me to feel confident.
One-liners like this don't ~feel~ like town!BuDucky to me.
Convince me that you're town, and I think we might have a winning combination in our hands.

Pretty transparent rolefish here. You worried?

Well, to be fair, Saudade wasn't even softing there. He was straight up claiming or joking, so I don't feel like lilith was doing anything scummy there by asking..

you can play your best I'm getting shot n1

I'm actually starting to think you shouldn't, and won't

I was +1 that it felt like foureyes was buddying lavar. I didn't see the comment that lavar was pocketing foureyes.

Whend you go from lavar scumread to thinking four was buddying lavar

There's 13 players in this list. Lavar is playing strange, defensive, and in ways that don't make sense to me. On top of that you have these bizarre statements from four which basically amounts to hes town because i said so. So maybe its buddying maybe they're both scum.

I feel like I'm eating some sort of crazy-porridge while catching up with this game.
Because the way you just described Lavar in conjunction with FourEyes matches most of the scenarios between the two of them, but the scenario where they are both scum still seems the most unlikely one to me.

Everyone, think about it like this: Unless FourEyes is very very bad at scum, they should know that they were "doomed" to pair their two slots together from the start, and make it

ESPECIALLY

awkward by refusing to put their read on Lavar to simple words. Meaning that scum!FourEyes would basically put the spotlight on their buddy scum!Lavar, and almost guarantee that they both go down one after the other.
I just don't think it's very reasonable.
I think it's way more reasonable for scum!FourEyes to have thrown that read out before town!Lavar gets lynched, or for town!FourEyes to REALLY townread Lavar (regardless of their alignment).
So yea, I still raise my eyebrows for that S/S-theory on FourEyes/Lavar.

Also another pokemon... wtf

Heyheyhey, nothing wrong with that!

Lilith and Umbreon (Una) seems V/V atm?

+

virgin vs virgin

=savage. But yea, I guess Sirius meant Village with that V.
I'm just wondering whether it means something that they used "V/V" instead of "TvT".. Might seem reachy, but I feel like they came up with that conclusion on their own, instead of copying Norwee, if that makes any sense to anyone..

VOTE: billy pilgrim

I can’t get over how much I scumread his opening posts tbh

Yea, funnily enough this is happening with me too.
I've gone back a couple of times while catching up (making this maybe a bit confusing and way too slow), but the more I read, the more I scumlean Liverpool.
And at the same time my thoughts go back to those wonky interactions between them and S_S (who I still don't have ANY read on yet).

I nearly voted billy last time I opened the thread!! Then I remembered I'm voting Nep and I'm crushin it

..and speaking of people I do not have a read on yet..
Normally I'd say that I'm happy to be in a game with both S_S and TW, but as of now you are both starting to scare me a little.
I think your vote on Nep at this point of my readthrough is not poorly placed. I just think you could be a bit more energetic and I'd feel better about you.
(Some kind of ObiWan-Luke or BoonBabe-Powercore would be much appreciated.. )

Lilith and Umbreon (Una) seems V/V atm?

what made you say this?
please report back, this is how the thing I care about the most in this game by a large margin

OK, I guess I'll withhold my judgement until the end of my catchup.

[UnaBombaH]

I can't really remember ottomh I think I was just yelling loudly to get Sausage to do something AI

Sausage IV vote based on pg1 was not really scum indicative in a vacuum, it's just a vote on someone who is being a clown rather than a vote on the people who are likely to acrually be sorted in response to being voted

did you like...think it was a good vote or are you just confused that I was quacking a lot?

+

I'm cool w vanity wagoning scum rn pleaseeeee don't tell me not to engage in vanity wagons like two? days into a phaseeeee we can consolidate when there's better content and we actually need an elim

I'm not sure how stupid it really is, but posts like these two make me lean town!BuDucky more than anything else so far.

If you genuinely think you have caught scum, why aren’t you 1) pushing her more, or 2) attempting to convince people that she’s scum?

This makes me wonder whether anyone in this game is currently REALLY pushing for someone.
During this catchup, it has felt more like people are questioning other peoples pushes more than pushing for their own.
And tbf, I don't think that's anything out of the ordinary.

IV somewhat likely to be town
tfed I'm like super lukewarm town
Sirius I Dont Know
zombapoc I'm probably super weakly scum and I'm so angry about it
bilpil I'm kinda mildly scum and also fairly upset
una is pretty much dead ass null
norw is maybe town
nepz is scum and I'm literally devastated
the worst is town
sausage is kinda towny
ss is probably somewhere under ss/nor but above IV
lavar is a player in this game
you are surface town but I need to go and like read your posts/trajectory once the game is a bit more mature

Note to self. I'll return to this list later.

Also TWs "you" here is Lilith.

she's the player I want to be voting
we have a bunch of time left
I'm literally not itt rn so my reads aren't developing
if this is a problem please raise it with my manager

Sassyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

Goodmorning to everyone in thread except tw
Norwee why is billy thinking you were defending him scummy to you

It reads like he tried to make a lazy shade and it was so unnatural and awkward i could see dcum doing something like that. And also i don’t really TR them so a wagon there is good imo.

Yea, based on that interaction I like Norwee more for town. Or at least logical.

-----------------------------------------------------

It seems like lilith and Nep are both harping on BuDucky for the same reasons that I haven't been townreading them so far. Not sure if it's just a low-hanging fruit that I also fell for, or actually scum-indicative from the Duckster.

I have enjoyed their latest pages so far though, and feel like there have been glimpses of a familiar townie there.
-----------------------------------------------------

I'm trying to illustrate that I can't show alignment indicative read trajectory on myself. Because I don't have a read on myself. & by some tokeb in a social deception game asking me for motive behind superficial things is very unlikely to make me easier to read. asking for reads/trajectory on people who say they have reads on me is likely to help sort both them & maybe even me!

Yea, this sounds real.
And also makes liliths "questioning" seem a little less important and gamesolve-y.

I’m asking what the reasoning for your billy read is

his catchup felt somewhat stiff and very much focused on things which I don't think were alignment indicative. he was asking questions about posts, not asking questions about things people were saying.

then I started wondering if the stiffness is from rust and kinda sighed and remembered other people are already voting him and hey. maybe some of those votes are super slimy. maybe he'll crap himself under the pressure. who knows, the world is a wild place.

This is an excellent post, if you are scum duck congratulations you can fake some wonderful town thought processes

This broke through so much of my exhaustion and made me laughsnort loudly ;-;

Yea, from what I can tell up to this point - TW and Saudade are both likely town here, and Saudade has been amazing so far.

[UnaBombaH]

I am frustrated if youre town bc it looks like youve decided im scum but are both uninterested in pushing it or even talking about it so from my pov youre never going to fix the read

I read this as scum trying to reach a townplayer through some form of "pleading".
Like trying to convey frustration towards "another townplayer", but is actually more like trying to "bargain with a townplayer" for giving you a townread.
If that made any sense to anyone.

We need more activity from the i/a players such as zombie and sirius

Yes, I'm a little disappointed to have seen so little from them during this catch up.

sorry I don’t think I’ve ever felt so bad and useless in a plist :/ I think you guys are too good for me or I’m just terrible

maybe I should stick to newbie games

Do your best and make an effort to catch scum. 90% of the players here cant play mafia and just come to socialise under a guise of a game

Like..what's

wrong

good with you??
I've never had any trouble with you, but I always thought you were a bit of a rabble-rouser. I must admit that you're sort of blowing me away in a good way here.

i mean i think im just one of the people who likes to play but isn't very good at it

shitposting is fun and all especially at the beginning but once you guys started blasting off into all these crazy nuanced thought psychology battles with each other i got pretty lost and only had weak gut opinions, none of which really leaned scum

like lilith and worsty on recent posting would just be obvious townreads for me normally? but like I'm not even really sure here because idk if this just good scum masquerading

i know this sounds dumb and maybe melodramatic because that's literally what this game is about but idk if i describe it better

really don't have any scumreads rn only some townreads but im not even sure about those

but yeah ill just give it my best shot i guess. will try to pore over this on monday or tues when i have a bigger block of time

pedit: lilith I answered this twice already, i literally just voted him for fun and I didn't townread him. i don't know how i feel about him now, ill have to take a deeper look

...OK? At least this seems sincere to me.
Not sure if it has ANYTHING to do with alignment (still), but I think this has to be an accurate enough reflection of what IV feels like.

I think the reasons here seem a little surface/forced but maybe that's just because I disagree? But I also like the whole progression and the timestamps surrounding them, it really does seem like he's taking time to reread and reevaluate real time, they're about 10 minutes apart

You actually went and checked the timestamps? I like that.
IV showing up to the thread = solid.

Haha lilith is bulldozering a half asleep duck

If this is about the past few pages, then we can just all go home and accept that it will not likely get better than this.

I have already accepted that i will get n1ed

Stop it with that already.
But regarding your other postage - don't stop it, because you're on a roll.

fwiw I’m not directly scumreading duck and he’s not straight-up null for me like he was in our last game, which I think is a good sign, but I still don’t particularly think his posts haven’t been fakeable

If this is how you're going to read someone like BuDucky or me, you're just never going to townread us. (sorry to bunch you in with me TW, but I feel like correctly reading the both of us has same kind of qualities to them)
This also feels like fence-sitting on purpose. Are you just afraid of being fooled by scum!Ducky?

And just to add to the previous statement - I feel like there aren't many things I'm uncapable of faking as scum.
There are a few, but I'm obviously not the right person to talk about them.

Hey guy who just finished a scumgame with IV:

Did he ever try to play the newbie/bad player/no idea what's going on card?

A good question actually.
I believe in the S_S that believes in me that believes in us.

It seems quite out of character for you to be bossing someone's votes around, let alone bossing someone around to do something simplistic and one-dimensional that looks superficially pro-town but isn't actually helpful.

Is this just ~words~ or did S_S arrive?
I do not have any meta on lilith so no idea how accurate this might be, but will definitely pick this up for potential use later.

It’s frustrating that I feel like I’m obvtown when town and you know exactly how my scumgame looks and I still can’t seem to figure out how to get myself to come across as town to you.

I can actually relate to this quite well.
There are some players on this site (I think TW should be included in that list, Boonskiies is one for sure) who I feel like SHOULD always be able to tell when I'm town.
So whenever they call me scum, I'm not only disappointed, but I'm immediately paranoid about their alignment, and whether they are just refusing to out me as town.

The problem with this thought process is that it relieves me of all responsibility to play a coherent town game because I could always just call myself obv.town and others either bad or scum..

I think I'm talking myself into townreading this so I'm dropping it for the jury to review.

Lavar actually reads like he cares about the way people are interacting with Nep's slot. His confusion at people lazily scumreading her for no reason is kinda cool in like a really finite vacuum but also

- scum!Lamar with scum!Nep who is picking up heat from sausage who Lamar is ?trying to pocket?/?townbinning to avoid? probably doesn't try to contradict sausage's read on her and if he does decide to I think it's pretty hard to have such a believable approach to contradicting it

- scum!Lamar with town!Nep probably just doesn't bother contradicting his strongest townread (who is the most assertive player on the plist) pushing a townie for kinda funky reasons

this kind of approach doesn't feel like it's coming from a scum mindset. someone please talk me down from this

No, I think I'm getting the same vibe as you are.
Lavar is likely just town, and I feel like there might be an obvious path to take once I've finished this fcker of a catch-up.

Everyones out having a life but me

I post on a mafia forum by my self

Well, it's still interacting with people.
Even if it's just ?~people~? somewhere in the internets.
I've been way too much of a hermit for the past two years myself, and there was even a time when I wasn't able to come here and write to any of you guys..

[UnaBombaH]

Radio static

I can hear something coming from the holding cells. A strange gurgling, grunting sound. I'm going to check it out.
Is that... Oh my goodness! It's VOTE: something_smart! But they don't look themselves. They've got this pale skin and are moving jerkily like they're made of wood. And there's a strange growth coming from their head!
This much be what the brain parasites IV released do. Infect the brain and turn you into some sort of zombie. Is this what happened to the town? Is that why there's no one around? I hope I don't run into anyone infected outside this place, it could get dangerous. The duck doesn't seem to like the smart_zombie at all, he's hiding behind my leg.
We're just gonna let this guy stay in his cage for the time being and go to the shops. It's good to have and axe and cans of beans in a zombie apocalypse right?

Radio static

So we're still doing this then?
Well, at least you're posting something and laying down a vote.
Now I'm not sure whether I should be able to dissect the motivation behind that vote from this post (other than you apparently scumreading S_S's hair and movement?? )

We are not lynching Billy

+

Hes not even a 3rd choice candidate

Not necessarily a fan of this.
If scum!Saudade is able go this deep, this might be him using his "influence" to keep a buddy safe.

Where is Una gosh darnit.

Finland, some ~965km away from you. (if Trondheim is accurate)

I think if scum saw town pushing a wagon on town, they would hop on that wagon (probably in an opportunistic way) and try to push it through, which hasn’t happened

I think this a very one-dimensional way of looking at scumplay..?

The worst / Sausage obvtown.
Innocent Villager / Lilith / Lavarmanos / Zombie apocalypse town
Foureyed / Una null
Billy / Nepenthes / S_S PoE
Sirius trash

JOINK. Picking up another readslist for later analysis.

Feels like this game isnt gonna progress well w me unflipped and saudade tunneled
Norwees vote looks like the scum one though
VOTE: Norwee

Saudade might be deepwolfing while trying to discredit himself early but im not willing to jump down that rabbit hole 10 to 1 hes just town

This isn't your worst post so far.
I'd argue that town!Nep might suggest either scum!Norweg or something like scum!IV.
Based solely on where the focus has been shifting outside of Charmeleon.

Nobody.

ss why are you not participating in this game of mafia
if you cactch mafia lilith will notice u like the big senpai u are

+

im not a weebologist i could be wrong

While I'm laughing at this, I also think that we might need a weebologist from time to time these days.

I've been used : (

You were too emotionally available.

I just dig back through your iso. Your reads seem to have progression and they make sense. Im a bit curious about what you thought was scummy about lillith early on.

Also, you did a quick turnaround on Foureyed? Why? I mean that post where you voted him pinged me, but you and I disagree on that attitude being a scumtell vs. towntell, so why'd that jump out at you.

These are actually the type of questions we should be throwing around.
And furthermore, AT players like Nep who are currently being pushed. Instead of playing "50 questions Free-For-All" amongst all of us all the time at the same time.

I mean the narrative that im making everyone's play fit is the one where I'm town. So that may be why. See you're looking at the wagon behavior to discern the targets alignment while i already know my own alignment. So im looking at the votes to discern their alignment.

Weirdly enough, I'm sort of vibing with this.
When I started on this site my townplay was all about getting attention towards myself, and seeing who scumread me and for what reasons.
The problem with that tactic is that it creates so much irrelevant noise as well, and muddies some reads that need to be clear later.
So I'm nowadays more about trying to broaden my PoV and look at my own play without bias as well.

I'm liking these recent posts from Billy.

Tell me about it.
Based on the struggle I'm having with solid scumreads, there's got to be at least one good scumster in the mix.

[UnaBombaH]

This was written from my phone too so i literally didnt need to fake any thought processes here mr deep wolf hunter boy

It feels like you wrote this in the past for the present-day me of the future!

Foureyed is one of the useless unreadable slots I mentioned above
I ignore Lavar

It's hard to say how long they've been away since I've paid no attention to timestamps, but where did Mr. FourEyes actually disappear?

Also billy you asked abt my lilith sr
It was a gutping early
Imo shes locktown now

OK..?
Well, I guess this doesn't ease my scumlean on you then.

don't worry, ss is town.

You really feel certain about that?
Like something between 75%-100%?

i haven't come up with a reason to scumread her yet haha please help my mask is slipping

???

are you actually saying that this whole time you were just pretending to scumread nepenthes? why?

If you admit to this ducky...

wait are you serious?

HAHAHA no i was trying to be funny

OK, going to do my catchup during the next ~8 hours.
Gonna be a lot of walls and thoughts throughout my read, so don't consider any of them "final" until I'm fully caught up.

That's just how I do it the best.

Can't believe I'm finally here after a whole day at work and then some.
..and then I realize that you crazy beasts have managed ~5 more pages in the mean time..

They're only final when you say I'm town. All other reads are invalid.

It feels like I'm actually getting there.

you worryyyyy too muchhhh lavas is town

Yeah, I got there too. I guess me reacting to your outdated reactions to my outdated reads would be a waste of time?

paraprasing: a wise person i know once said that if sausage is putting his energy into solving the game he's usually town; if he's putting his energy into making people look bad and being harder/more perplexing to read he's usually scum.

I honestly feel like this game has shown me not only the funniest Saudade has had to offer, but also some of the nicest and towniest tones as well.
10/10, would praise again.

Good point, i was thinking the same.
Fact that we shared this thought makes me believe we’re on the same side.

Don't you try and pocket me like this - I'm not that kind of a boy. You need to try harder.

[UnaBombaH]

honestly i don't think una needs to squeeze all that hard to pop these out as scum but i still believe the little gems of cognisance in them enough that i want to call him town

I'm not even sure what you're referring to..
But honestly though, this has been my first wall-catchup-clownfiesta in some time.
And while I can understand people hating on it, I actually feel very good!
Can't remember the last time I've felt the need to do this as town and actually managed to pull myself together and just do it.

if siriuses latest 2 one liner posts count as a prod dodge im replacing out

I despise you, sir.

Yea, I'm just done with this now.
No idea who has voted for what or even if this is a hammer, but I'm just not going to have any of this here.
VOTE: Sirius9121 - scum want this around for lategame way more than town does.
Just get rid of it here, and we can start the game D2.

Also can you explain more what you mean about the SS/billy interactions? I wasn’t really paying attention to those posts so I’m curious to know what you saw.

I believe I put it into words there as well.
I couldn't even find anything concrete to quote within those few pages, but it still felt like S_S and Liverpool were talking AI things about the game.
Yet it didn't feel like it lead anywhere, and I learned nothing from it.
I'll have to return to that with a fresh set of eyes as well. But probably not today.

Ducky’s activity levels and content just scream town to me tbh. I don’t really have more to say.

I'm gonna return to this later as well.

Because BuDuckys activity levels and content DID NOT reflect their townplay until a very specific moment in time.

If Norwegian outed a townread on Ducky before that, there's a possibility of a scum!Norweg trying to pocket the Duckstinator.

God reading una is going to be like trying to read Aristophanes isnt it

Not sure.
Ari is a lot smarterer than me though.

Yes, I’m very paranoid of scum!duck, we just finished a game where literally no one was considering that he could be scum at lylo and he was. There are some small differences here that have me leaning town, but I’m very aware that he’s a good scumplayer and so “fakeability” has been at the back of my mind for him all game

Yea, just try to not get caught in a paranoia-tunnel for the rest of the game.
And that includes fence-sitting on your read too.
Try and sort him accurately, but also give yourself the permit to make a mistake instead of waffling constantly.
Your read on scum!TW might be the most "fresh" take there is, and we really might need your input before the end.

I think I’ve been putting forth enough effort elsewhere that he/others should still be able to read me, it’s not like my sole focus this game has been whining about ss not being able to read me.

Of course not - I was just giving an example of how I can empathize with what you might struggle with.

i'd say una is slightly less friendly, and slightly harder to read

Hold the phone. I'm less friendly than Aristophanes? Yea, I guess that checks out with most of the playerbase.
Harder to read? Sure.

for a powerful plist there is a lack of powerful pushes here
except this plist is mostly powerful because it's fun, rather than powerful because we're all 80% winrate mafia gods with massive egos
so idrk what to think about it.

damn this fence is getting comfy.

That last part I bolded...DANGEROUS. I know that feeling, but I do not want you to stay there if you're town.
I already have some murky thoughts about how this game might pan out..

[UnaBombaH]

worth noting that i very much felt like nep was standing behind lilith during tis push/engagement

True. Which is why I silently marked a bigger "minus" in front of Neps name.

what content???

I’m too lazy to go through and point out exactly what.
I’m aware this will make me sound scummy and i don’t care.

That's how you knock yourself down a couple of pegs..

I've lost track of my gimmick the past few days. Bully

If it isn't as much fun for you as you thought it would be, then I can guarantee it's not going to be a joy for the rest of us either.
If you enjoy it and can make it work, go for it.
If not, please feel free to switch out of a role and just focus on the game.

lilith admit that you are wrong on your billy read and just vote nep

I'm not sure Big-Poppa-Saud.
I'm thinking town!lilith might've found scum!Liverpool and you are both correct with your #1 scumreads..

timestamps

this is a thing i do sometimes when people have really interesting thoughts very quickly, or have thoughts that feel contemplated sometimes and took Time
i wonder if i accidentally taught IV this trick

Look at you, taking your wisdom to the next generation!

it's ok; i was actually thinking that i'm very liable to accidentally slide into your pocket this game. and then realised there's probably a nonzero amount of players on this list who probably feel the same as me.
yay.

Ever since I switched to stretch-materials on my jeans, my pockets have been large and comfy.

i defend my right to fuck up
pretty sure boon retains a 90%+ read accuracy on me as well. he's been wrong one (1) time

Like..this is almost exactly the same with me. (check the sig )

For the record UNA
never in the history of my 2 year career as a mafiascum player have I gotten out of my way to defend a partner as mafia

I can believe that.
Which makes me think you'd do it that once in a gamestate like this.

But to be completely honest, I feel like you just have to be town here, and we are going to have a swell time.

Una is like on the downlow completely cheeky so mindset tells need to be a bit more drawn out/abstract most of the time

Hmmm...not sure if this has any % of loving left in this..

What do you think scum would be trying to do in this game?

I’m self-admittedly pretty bad at scumhunting so tips are always welcome.

I'm not a very good scumhunter myself, but I'd say I'm a decent enough scumplayer though.
If I were to be scum this game, my gameplan would depend on my teammates obviously, but I wouldn't just "hop on a wagon pushed by town".
If anything, I'd be "working the table" to spot any PR-tells, and to see who the power-towns are.
D1 wagons are irrelevant as long as there's a target and your aren't sitting on fences too much.

[UnaBombaH]

Norwee is friendly and charming but i dont consider either thing to be town indicative

I believe my first experience with town!Norweg was a lot more hostile actually..

You really feel certain about that?
Like something between 75%-100%?

like 73.49%

So I'm not at ease yet then.
People shouldn't forget about S_S.
I think I haven't seen their scumgame yet(?), but they definitely have a head on their shoulders.

If this is you at your nicest then i feel bad for the players of your previous games

Just don't fall to his level and remember that it feels worse for you because you are the "target" of his scorn this time around.

I went back and reread, and my thought is that this was pretty characteristic of how I feel about Billy overall. I think your characterization is spot on, and that his posts feel like they are talking about AI things but don’t really have any substance of progression behind them (although I disagree that this applies to both of them). My read on SS is entirely separate though.

I don't want to combine my reads on them either! It's just that they shared that long-ish back and forth and I'm not sure if either of their alignments should've leaked through.
I really like this post from lilith?

I'm not gonna let my present reads be colored by premature associatives, but if one of them happens to flip scum, the other's partner equity goes through the roof.

I see you are there with me then.

[UnaBombaH]

Thanks and sorry for the spam everyone.
I'm off to do some coaching now, and will check the thread before going to sleep.

Ask away if you want something answered today.

[UnaBombaH]

Why do you like it?

Well, let's see.

I went back and reread, and my thought is that this was pretty characteristic of how I feel about Billy overall.

I agree with this sentiment, and it fits my read on you and your play so far very well.
I think you are able to note some "conclusions" that you get from gutreads and other more vague tells, but you might not always even be aware of it all yourself.
Going back and rechecking things confirms your earlier reads and you are later able to pinpoint the cause of said reads forming.
This might seem like I'm saying a lot and nothing at the same time, but I think you have good instincts and you play a lot fast, on your toes, but it's mainly "gut" and "emotions" at first.
The reason and logic comes later, when your brain has had time to process your initial train of thought, and other things have come to light that fit your first conclusion.

I think your characterization is spot on, and that his posts feel like they are talking about AI things but don’t really have any substance of progression behind them (

although I disagree that this applies to both of them

).

I'm not saying this particular trait automatically applies to both of them, but the fact that I was unable to understand S_S's PoV and trajectory on the matter as well bugs me.
I think I have a more than just a few games played with S_S already, or at least they feel like a very familiar player to me.
And I don't think I've associated "not able to understand" with him before.
Hence, why I'm worried about that slot as well.

Why does this affect me liking your post as well?

Because I don't think it was necessary for scum!lilith point out the one part of our analysis' where we disagree on.
I think scum!lilith would've been satisfied with the soft pocket, and the fact that we have a "common read" forming.

[UnaBombaH]

VOTE: Sirius9121 - scum want this around for lategame way more than town does.
Just get rid of it here, and we can start the game D2.

I think this is town unless Sirius is scum

I actually like this notion.

[UnaBombaH]

oh dude this is wild
I wondered whether una would drop Sirius as a scumpartner here and then thought about it and decided maybe not
I enjoy the fact you thought of bussing as well

Oh man, I really love you guys - you really get me!

And to everyone else - this and my previous response to S_S saying this -

I HAVE NO TROUBLE ADMITTING THAT SCUM!UNA WOULD BUS SOMEONE LIKE SCUM!SIRIUS HERE MERCILESSLY.

I'm not normally ~advocating~ for busses on teammates, but damn if one of my scummates would ever play like Sirius is playing here..no regrets, no hesitation.

Self-meta, I know.
But let's just say it would be unfortunate for me if Sirius DOES flip scum here, while it would obviously be better for the rest of us.

[UnaBombaH]

Una why do you call the duck BuDucky

My curiosity has gotten the better of me

I guess TW has always been the social butterfly and the super-likeable awesome dude that he is, but before he was very well known, I was a part of his "newbie-process" so to speak. We had good newbie-games, and I immediately took a liking to him.
So when he adopted that Ducky-avatar that he sort of became famous for, I just started to call him BuDucky.
Guess it was something like Buddy-Ducky or whatever silly, but I sort of like the fact that I can call him that. Makes me feel nostalgic. (although it hasn't been THAT long still)

I think it was TW and Ausuka (who was in MY first game on site as MarioManiac4) who gave me a bunch of nicknames in the sitechat, including "Venusaurs ass" ( ), and I feel like nicknames are a good way to show affection and to appreciate bonds between players.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh, and regarding yourself S_S.
I'm rather confused how much I've actually played with you, because I remember people better from their avatars.

Like for example, I sort of think I remember you the best from having an avatar of Saturnus (or some other planet with the rings?) and maybe even better for an avatar before that (if there ever was one? Something do with two S's?)

[UnaBombaH]

My point was less that bussing was possible (it sure is) and more that that being S -> T was unlikely.

Yea, that as well tbh.
I have no trouble admitting as town that I just want the slot gone before LyLo, while as scum I wouldn't give a rats ass what happens with the slot.
Getting it to LyLo would probably be a bonus for scum, but going for it D1 wouldn't be a problem either.

I'd honestly go to LyLo a day earlier because we'd mislynch someone like Sirius who has done literally NOTHING useful, than have that same slot in a 3-player LyLo and basically holding the hammer.
If someone thinks I'm scum for it, I feel bad for their naive view of things.
Town is often too afraid to mislynch bad/super_inactive slots early, and then they are a burden lategame when you need cohesion and slots that actually work.

[UnaBombaH]

Reads on me billy and norwee would be helpful

I guess my top scumreads are currently wrestling a little with each other, but I can actually see them both being true at the same time as well.
It's between

you (Nep)

and

Liverpool (billy, right?)

I mean, it's still ~just~ D1, but I feel like I've had a good crash-course for those reads to mature while I've done my catchup.
In most of my best towngames I've been playing a lot of catchup, and somehow found my best reads while doing them.
It's obviously a different thing to push those lynches through, and rarely have I been 3/3 or even 2/3 with my initial reads, but I think it's even more rare for me to go 0/3.

Arguments can be made for either of you just having a difficult time explaining yourselves to the rest of the game, but I guess there's another PoV that I sort of "arrived at" during my catchup.

I RARELY HAVE THIS MANY TOWNREADS DURING D1

that I actually feel good about.
* I do not think

TW

has been pulling the wool over my eyes this game (if you have, kudos to you and FU from Finland with love, as well).
* I think

saudade

is almost absurdly obv.town this game.
* My read on

lilith

started on the lower side of null, and while I still think some of their lines of questioning have been a bit "overboard", I think I've managed to catch their playstyle, and understand the need for those questions a lot better as well. Meaning that it feels like a strong-ish read right now, because I feel like it has grown throughout these past 60+ pages instead of just being one sudden realization.

The slots I'm most 50/50 about - and not because they haven't done anything - are

Norweg

and

S_S

, I think.
Both for similar reasons as well.
I think the level and quantity of their content hasn't been consistent with what I was expecting from them, and I think they both have had their share of good interactions as well.
I'm not that familiar with Norweg so I'm relying a lot on just chasing logical chains, and currently I don't feel like there has been too much there (?) to push them too far on the either side of "really not sure".
S_S is feeling closer to a townlean than a scumlean, but it's based somewhat on TWs read on them (I trust their ability to sort the slot), and the fact that I really like their short, sharp observations.

Which actually leads me to my "problem group". (#problem_group, #policy_lynches_and_scummy_lurkers)

innoV, FourEyes, Sirius, Zombie-roleplayer, Charmeleon

^^all five of these slots are somewhere in the murky area to me right now, and I either have to try and salvage a read from them during D2, or just accept the fact that they are null until roped.
* IV is slightly on the townier and more active side (I guess?) based on their earlier content, but at the same time it could just be a nervous "noob!scum". Dunno.
* FourEyes would probably be a stronger read for me, but I only just realized at the end of my catchup that
A) they sort of disappeared from all of the interactions around the time most of my reads on others started to take shape
B) TW pointed out that they DID have a tone and theme to their posting as well, and it might've affected my read earlier. I need to work on this read, but it's probably going to be D2 for me.
* Sirius is the worst of this bunch, and needs rope today unless they are replaced or a magical resurgence happens immediately. Like overnight.
* Zombie-RP has a gimmick that they seem to be fairly committed to, and while I appreciate that in theory, I hate the fact that I'm unable to read them and actually understand them.
* Charmeleon started out very scummy to me, but after my catchup I find it difficult to scumread even their earlier posts. However, the way they have sort of "vanished" from the main-conversation afterwards makes me a little worried. It fits too well with a scumster "getting out of the spotlight" and then taking a breather on top of that.

Sorry if it looks messy, I tried to keep my thoughts organized while just writing my thoughts away.
Slight formatting and bolding added in the end for the people who can't find it within themselves to read everything.

[UnaBombaH]

should read posts

Wait what is happening?

as a collective while reading through that is the feeling I got

Did it break?

from the early 50s in your iso

Is break - someone call assistance!

... that's... that's how he always sounds

Really? huh. Not how I remember him

..still no idea who this is though.
Now I'm just more intrigued, because apparently they aren't exactly new to the site.

[UnaBombaH]

This is a dumb wagon imo. I've seen a couple slots like this, and they are almost always town.

I'll be obnoxious and self-quote something relevant to this I just wrote.

I'd honestly go to LyLo a day earlier because we'd mislynch someone like Sirius who has done literally NOTHING useful, than have that same slot in a 3-player LyLo and basically holding the hammer.

I think saying "sirius is more likely to be town" is a bit of a stretch because they have done NOTHING. Doing NOTHING, vs doing something poorly are two very different things.
They are either scum who don't feel like playing the game, or they are town and don't feel like playing the game. And that's that.
And consider this - no matter their alignment, scum are not going to kill them during a night-phase. Never. Why would they?
So I say we get rid of all the potential WIFOM and paranoia scumgans could use and sow in the later parts of the game NOW, instead of potentially finding us in this same situation a few days later.
In MY experience that's the point where town always loses, because we have "actually scummy" players to lynch, but this one lynchbait-no_use-slot is taking a spot in the upcoming LyLo..

[UnaBombaH]

Scum usually puts in at least a miniscule amount of effort not to be scumread.

I think this is biased.
I've played with a slot that basically always replaced out or got themselves lynched on purpose D1 whenever they rolled scum. (ThinkBig? sorry if I'm being inaccurate)
Not all of us prefer scum to town, or feel the pressure of "letting your team down" or whatever pushes you to do "at least a miniscule amount of effort".

[UnaBombaH]

If I remember correctly, my avatar progression was Saturn -> pixellated map

I think I was around for the globe/map actually, yeah!

The mafia will not suddenly take pity on us and remove Sirius from the game if his play is like this over the course of the entire game.

Exactomundo!

Would it help you if you knew, or do you not really care, Una?

Knew what? Care about what?

I was VLA this weekend, sir.

We'll need a boxing match for this one!

I'll see you in the ring!

Yeah, I'm not scumreading you for not being around.
I'm just saying that my read on you hasn't been able to evolve amongst and in conjunction with most of the other reads, and therefore I don't feel good about sorting you in a more definite manner yet.
I am adept at the sport of fisticuffs though..

Stealing my ideas now to pass off as your own!

The ring awaits!

I've been living in two different times and dimensions during this game...what you perceive as an original idea of your own, might've been a seed planted by me in a different time, before you ever even ousted yours! The order in which we put our thoughts to these same words do not matter - the idea was a shared effort nontheless.

I do like boxing though.

Stop ribbing at Zombie for breaking the roleplay. It's making it much easier for him to actually contribute.

Heyheyhey, don't get me wrong.
I just want people to do what they feel good doing.
But they have been so consistant with their flavor and clearly put in a lot of effort doing it, so the difference is obviously drastic.

The "normal" posting is easier for me to understand as well, so absolutely no problems here.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm super curious, but I'm also super tired.
But I'm also super pumped about this game now that I feel good about my read on Saud and TW.

I think I have like two things I'm going to do this game.
And I think town!TW might be the thing I need to accomplish one of them. Saudade the other.
But I'm also like SUPER tired and need to go and sleep NOW.

Good night everyone!

[UnaBombaH]

Please answer me this before I wake up BuDucky - do you still think/agree that Saudade is almost certainly town?
And what do you think about their melancholic views of what's to come? (if you can catch my thought without being overtly provocative and verbose about it)

[UnaBombaH]

Now I'm just sad and maybe even a little mad.
With all these replacements though, I just want Sirius lynched and we can maybe get the newer players up to speed D2 or something.

The way Pookys arrival has been talked about so far sort of worries me, but I myself have no experience with the slot so far.

[UnaBombaH]

I do not care if Sirius is conf.town with play like this.
Scum. Will. Not. Kill. Him.
And I do not trust his ability to scumread the correct people -> I do not want Sirius around.

Simple as that.

[UnaBombaH]

We execute Sirius today, and start the "actual gameplay based" executing tomorrow.
We probably lose one day but we have a ton of pages and interactions to analyze, we get rid of a useless slot no matter their alignment, and we'll probably have some night-actions to analyze D2 as well.
If nothing else, then at least one scum-kill / town-save to spice it all up.

Vote Sirius, and don't think about it any longer.
This D1 is already long enough.

[UnaBombaH]

I do not care if Sirius is conf.town with play like this.
Scum. Will. Not. Kill. Him.
And I do not trust his ability to scumread the correct people -> I do not want Sirius around.

So don't get to the point where his vote is needed to kill scum, eh?

I'm not sure what the tone is supposed to be here, but I actually expect you to be one of the people who shoud understand my point.

[UnaBombaH]

You undermined your point with the first line. If Sirius were conftown, it would be pure madness to execute him today or ever.

Well yea, OK.
I might've used an extreme example to make my point.

If he were a conf.town, scum might still not kill him though, with the way he has been playing.
And in that scenario all we might potentially get is a LyLo where he holds the hammer, so...

[UnaBombaH]

@Una using an elim on deadweight makes sense if we do not have better leads - I think this is not the case however?

This is D1.
Assume we mislynch on one of our "better leads".
Then what?
Well, we do not want to waste D2 lynching Sirius anymore, because based on that missed lynch D1 we have a push somewhere else (counterwagon/the most vocal pusher etc).
And IF that misses as well, and the scum have played their cards well.
Then we are very close to a situation where Sirius' vote is starting to be very valuable and I for one wouldn't have any trust in that direction.
AND we wouldn't want to lynch him for being inactive at that point anymore, because we have "actual leads".

I've seen this happen so many times now, that I'm going to always advocate for an inactive slot to be the lynch D1.
The threshold for lynching a lurker gets higher and higher as the game moves forward, and I've seen two many townlosses that start people feeling obsessed with lynches D1.
The chances that we are actually lynching scum D1 aren't too high anyway, and the more material we have to analyze, the easier it gets.

[UnaBombaH]

And in that scenario all we might potentially get is a LyLo where he holds the hammer, so...

Yes. And in an equivalent scenario where we executed him, we instead have already lost by the time that lylo would be reached.

Well, I guess both scenarios assume we are going to play poorly then.
But my point still remains the same - I'd rather be at LyLo one day earlier with Sirius gone, than make it one day further with him around.

[UnaBombaH]

And hey, I'm not calling anyone scum for disagreeing with me!
This is just a thing I'm not willing to compromise on myself.

Should the slot have been replaced by this point it would be a completely different thing for me.

[UnaBombaH]

@Una using an elim on deadweight makes sense if we do not have better leads - I think this is not the case however?

Agreed.
I strongly oppose an Sirius lynch today, and believe we can do so much better than that.

So what's your plan for that slot then?
Just let him hang around instead of hanging him somewhere around?

What could you possibly expect from that slot after what we have seen?
They have been asked, taunted, "bullied" and prodded to produce content.
And all they do is return snark and childish reactions.

[UnaBombaH]

Hihi hahaa!

[UnaBombaH]

What happens if we lynch Nep D1 and they flip town?
What happens if we push them to L-1 and they claim a PR?
Where do you draw the line of "useful information" for town vs what we might risk as well?
Do you understand what I'm saying?

If we lynch Sirius now and they flip a PR they have already messed up by not even trying to stop the wagon on them.
Same if they are actually claiming a PR at L-1 - the writing has been on the wall long enough for them to actually do something, and they have decided to not do ANYTHING.

[UnaBombaH]

Guess it's better we stop talking about this then.
You're clearly not going to agree with me, and I do not think you are being realistic with your expectations.

[UnaBombaH]

Unless lilith and BuDucky stop agreeing with me on this, I'm not moving my vote.
I'm gonna read your arguments against a Sirius-lynch, and if I feel like a good enough point is made, well then fuck it.

Nep or Liverpool are still my top2 candidates for "most scummy" right now - if that means anything to anyone at this point.

[UnaBombaH]

But i stand behind what i’ve said.

And I actually respect that.
I'm just a tiny bit worried you do not want Sirius flipped for ~reasons~, rather than reasons.

[UnaBombaH]

I had a thought that Sirius might even be a Vengeful townie with the way they have played, but I do not think it makes a lot of sense after all.
At least then they could've done something useful..

[UnaBombaH]

You think i’m his scum partner.
I would buss the hell out of him if i was FYI. And you know it, you literally stated you would yourself.

No, not his scumpartner.
But scum!Norwegian might play this similarly to how scum!Una would.
And scum!Una would be opposed to a Sirius-lynch based on the very same arguments you have used.

I'd take that baby-Growlithe all the way to LyLo with me and make it an angle for the rest of the game..

[UnaBombaH]

DAMNIT LILITH.
YOU GAVE HIM TOO MANY OPTIONS AND AN OPEN SLOT FOR THE ANSWER!

[UnaBombaH]

Pooky is the new SauDemigod?

[UnaBombaH]

Huoh.
Once more - these slots aren't refusing to make content.
They have provided, and will assumedly keep providing us with content.

If they are scum, they can't help but to incriminate themselves and their buddies as the game moves forward.
If they are town, they are more valuable to us than scum!Sirius OR town!Sirius.
That's my last line of arguments, and I'm going to bed now.

Lilith has already switched off the wagon, but I'll be watching BuDuckys stance on the matter when I wake up.
I know my vote is too valuable to keep on a slot that is simply not going to be lynched D1, but I still urge people to commit to this cause.
I honestly believe it will be better for us in the long run.

Ugh - peace out.

[UnaBombaH]

Im not even at E-1 but NM is in this game so hardclaim pr

Oh wow. Would you look at that?

[UnaBombaH]

@Una what do the bottom two comments mean?

It felt like you were able to make towny-looking posts, and I came to realize that no matter which of you is scum, there's probably at least one here who's capable of fooling me/us/all of us.
So those two quotes are in reference, not only to you, but towards pretty much everyone on my null->scum range who have been able to have these good moments.

i think he's starting to think you might be town and getting anxious about a deeper wolf.

..or you could just say it simply like this.

[UnaBombaH]

Since with a hard pr claim I'm not drawing the night lol with my heavy cringing, I'll just out myself.

Informed townie N_M, and previously Lavar, is town. That's my usefulness. Elim me to make N_M IC, I guess.

Wait, is this serious?
Would make this game a lot simpler moving forward.

[UnaBombaH]

hnerejjehfjejfnnmrmmrmmmrmmmmmm
VOTE: nor

You should realize by this point that my call for Sirius was correct..
Hindsight is 20/20, but we gave scum more by pushing these two slots rather than just going with Sirius.

[UnaBombaH]

Either foureyes=town and correct -> Lavar = town.
Or foureyes=scum and went for the "townread" on Lavar for ~reasons~.

Just wanted to fetch this while I'm still catching up on what happened during last night.
I'd argue these two scenarios are still the only reasonable ones?

[UnaBombaH]

Once informed flips for me, I made it quite obvious what the information I had was, I believe

For whatever reason, I don't have trouble believing your claim, BUT I do disagree with this.
Had you died N1 and flipped "informed", I would've searched your ISO for comments toward specific roles, or speculations towards scumteam-size etc etc. (although in Normal-games the latter isn't much varied I guess)

In my experience, "Informed" has more often been stuff like "You know there's no Doctor in the game."

[UnaBombaH]

I feel pretty decently about duck/iv/pooky/nm/four/una/ss/nep town, leaving just: sirius, billy, norweej, zombie as my POE. I feel good about that tbh

i'm a little bit nervous about ss all of a sudden

and i can't put my finger on why
nep is town on the proviso she obvtowns or sorts via Dying
i'm town on the proviso i obvtown or sort via Dying

S_S worries me mainly because they are very sharp.
I know I'm not allowed to scumread him for not agreeing on the Sirius-lynch, but I honestly thought he would've agreed me on it..and it kind of throws me for a loop.

Might be that I'm just not as familiar with him as I thought I was.

[UnaBombaH]

Can you explain me as your top scumread particularly in light of the last post I quoted from you? Now maybe im misinterpreting that post when you agreed with S_S that you were liking me more, but between that and you seeming to understand where I was focused on people's interactions with my slot reminding you of your early townplay, im not seeing a progression from there to me as one of your top scumreads.

I honestly need to return to this at a later time, but most of my scumlean towards you was formed over a longer period of time.
It didn't feel like you were an easy target to push per se, but there were still multiple people scumreading some of your content.
And the way you formatted your posts and (possibly) censored your words gave me a feeling that you were purposefully trying to avoid AI-statements and hard stances.

I'll honestly need to use your ISO and even return to that back-and-forth between you and S_S to give you the answer that you deserve.
But I'm just not going to find the time and energy this game day.
Sorry.
All I can say is that I'm not going to vote for you D1 - unless I find the time and energy to do that ISO-return before that.

[UnaBombaH]

I am townreading you and una just not to degree that I am townreading everyone else

Huh. Only your bottom 5 is below me though, so...you might have a few townreads too many?

una has long walls that I never really bothered to read and other people are townreading them

Well, then I guess it makes more sense.
Almost all of my actual content is within those walls!
I've been playing catchup every day because of the rhythm and pace this game has, and I catch up the best when I do my walls.

So if you refuse to read them, you will never townread me, I'm afraid.

[UnaBombaH]

Im not comfortable tring una here at all
He isnt scummy or towny hes just playing good so far

Yea well, you shouldn't townread me for playing well, and pushing for objectives that help town.

But I guess Sirius is ~here~ at least on a surface level now, so I'm gonna UNVOTE: for the time being.

[UnaBombaH]

VOTE: Una

I wanna know how I went from town to one of your top two scumreads without anything you felt a need to comment on. Its like my posts dropped out of your focus, but then I ended up as your top scumread with nep.

Now you are being a hasty bugger here.
Did you really read my walls with focus?
And more importantly - did you wait for me to answer these last few questions you threw my way before voting for me for not answering you?

These are the kind of things that stink to me - it gives me the feeling that you "felt a need" to vote me, and this has been you building that vote up with something soft for a base.

[UnaBombaH]

VOTE: Una

I wanna know how I went from town to one of your top two scumreads without anything you felt a need to comment on. Its like my posts dropped out of your focus, but then I ended up as your top scumread with nep.

i'm really not sure if what you're talking about is a scumtell, but i'm also fine with this vote. i just don't think i'll follow it atm.

Wait, what are YOU doing right now Ducky?
Has everyone lost their minds overnight?

[UnaBombaH]

i would like to be part of this townblock

+

did saudade pay for my entry

Actually, sort of yes.
I'm quite annoyed by the fact that Saudade was so transparently consistent with their play, and now you basically have a free pass to be townbinned for the rest of my game.

[UnaBombaH]

why didn't you vote someone else una >_>

Because I hadn't caught up and wanted to see what the voting situation is before I lay it down.
And to be honest, I'm not sure what it is now either.
We def. need a votecount.

Also let me be a brat and say that we really should've just executed Sirius.

Also let me be a brat and say that I felt certain that Nep was going to claim PR.
Doesn't change the scenario at all though.
Nep is either scum or a townPR.

I do not feel good about voting for Liverpool before I've gone back to the time in the past where he and S_S had that interaction that made my brain melt before.

I think FourEyes has less scum-equity than Nep, but I guess either/both of them could still be scum.
So until those two flip or can provide results/etc we can't go there either.
But honestly..I'm annoyed by the fact that there IS a capable deepwolf in the game already.
I'm super certain of it.

One scum in lilith/BuDucky/S_S is almost certain and I fucking hate the thought of it.

[UnaBombaH]

/rant-ramble I guess.
I seriously need some interactions with some of these players in a more realtime-way.
Being on the backfoot throughout the game is starting to annoy me when so much can happen.

[UnaBombaH]

What's the deal with ZombieRP?
If I understood correctly, there are a couple of players who know them well and recognized them already?
S_S? BuDucky?
What's your guys' reads on that slot?

And I know this is probably going to be an unpopular opinion, but I think Norweg is going to flip town this game.
Meaning that there's one scum in IV/Zombie/Sirius.
One scum in S_S/BuDucky/lilith (if two we are probably fucked anyway).
One in the rest. Probably Nep or Liverpool, maybe FourEyes.
And don't ask for reasonings now, because fuck reasons.
For now I'm just writing shit that comes to my mind.
I'm feeling tilted.

[UnaBombaH]

One scum in lilith/BuDucky/S_S is almost certain and I fucking hate the thought of it.

This is shocking.

Who do you think it is?

I don't fucking know.
But it's the same feeling I got in this one old game that I always refer to.
I called out the whole scumteam once their bullshit-claiming began, but was unable to get them lynched.
Got killed N1 and scum admitted to having done it, but claimed it as a Vig-shot or something.

The feeling I get is that there's one capable scum pulling the strings.
My gut says it might S_S who opposed to the Sirius-lynch.
But it might just as well be lilith or BuDucky who followed me there but also jumped off to push for slots that both claimed PR.
Might be that Saudade fking fooled me like a kid and you are a capable manipulator as well.

[UnaBombaH]

Huoh.
So I say that I'm thinking Norweg will flip town this game.
And then I absolutely hate it that NOW Norweg is no longer "opposing" the Sirius-lynch.

Now that we have already pushed two claims out and Sirius has actually appeared and promised(?) to start posting..

[UnaBombaH]

Something_Smart was actually in that game that I talked about earlier.
Blessed Mafia.
And S_S refused to believe town!Una then.
Even when I had laid down some very sophisticated crumbs and faithfully claimed my role D2.
And called out the whole scumteam.
S_S followed scum!Boon over me then.

I'm getting this anxious vibe the more I'm recapping what has happened during D1 in my head.

[UnaBombaH]

this made me like, actually laugh

I didn't want to come across like I was meat riding Saudade too hard, so I didn't quote that joke as well but.. I actually laughed at that whole "emotionally too available"-shit he threw at one point.

[UnaBombaH]

una, why are you townreading norweej?

I'm not even sure anymore.
I don't know anything about anyone.
I'm a fraud.

I'll be doing some coaching again tonight, so I'll check this later before going to sleep.
Maybe then I can actually feel good about my reads again.

[UnaBombaH]

This is interesting, considering that Nep clearly softed VT and that's why my vote is still on her.

Well, see here.

What happens if we lynch Nep D1 and they flip town?
What happens if we push them to L-1 and they claim a PR?

Notice how these are two separate points I wrote.
My read on Nep at that time was basically "PR or scum".
And because of the posts you also noted, I was leaning scum over town.
Didn't change the fact that I knew they were going to claim PR - truthful claim or not.

[UnaBombaH]

Ummm you must be misremembering. I went back and checked. You died at night in that game, and I was trusting you until you did. I never followed scum-Boon, I didn't vote on any of the scum-led mis-exe wagons, and I was voting scum-Ari for the majority of the game.

Well, then I guess that might be where my respect for your brains comes from.

[UnaBombaH]

I was purposely trying to sound like a VT bc unlike what most of site meta seems to think softing your pr all over the place is fucking dumb

This has truly backfired on me only once, and even there I was scum, not town.
My only guidelines that I give to myself, are that I avoid crumbing hard (or at all) when I'm a protective.
If it's a less useful role but can help me become a "named townie" -> heavy crumbing.
If it's an investigative role -> heavy crumbing.
Although my heavy crumbing is always complicated and planned out..

[UnaBombaH]

So either the team is within us four, or there's at least one deep wolf in the townreads if not more.

Would you look at that.
That's why I'm so worried there's actually scum within S_S/lilith/BuDucky.

[UnaBombaH]

Ok, do you have any reason to think I'm capable of being a deeper wolf?

Again, like BuDucky already guessed - not thinking about you.
But the way you have already been able to mix up your posting, makes me more worried about the slots I have been townbinning.

[UnaBombaH]

If you feel like im the type of player that censors my posts do I also quick vote before you answered my questions? Because that doesn't come from the same playstyle like ever.

And youre using these seemingly conflicting styles as both reasons that im scum when i dont get how that makes sense. Im either cautious scum, or I just voted you because I was building to it and didn't care that I left questions out without answers. That doesn't seem like it can come from the same scum mentality.

Now you're just twisting my words for a narrative.

Censoring your posts has nothing to do with you voting me before I come back.
Censoring your posts shows signs of caution and wariness towards what you want to say.
Voting me before I come back is just a gameplay decision - it might seem hasty, but might just as well be planned out.
Those two types of actions don't have a contradiction in playstyle since they could both be a result of premeditation, but the other just seems sudden. (at least if one were to give you the benefit of the doubt and think you might actually be town).

[UnaBombaH]

I fell asleep yesterday almost immediately I got back home.
But I'm not feeling as overwhelmed and depressed about this game anymore, so I might actually make an effort today.

We'll need to re-organize our priority lynches and still try to make it in a way that doesn't push this D1 too much further.
It's gonna be a pain to reread/catch up on things already anyway..

[UnaBombaH]

Now that's an alt.
Let's see what we're dealing with here...

@Waterdispensor - are you willing to read all / most / some of the game so far to actually get into the game, or how are you going to approach this?

[UnaBombaH]

I don’t think Sirius is the kind of player that can fake anything.
He was awkard and stilted in his scum!games and here he behaved a lot differently.
So Sirius is town.
It makes sense.

Your blind fate in this slot is almost "too scummy to be scum."

One game of "meta".
Anyone can fake a game, even two is doable for most.

I'm not saying Sirius has a ton of scum equity here, but they sure as hell aren't obv.town for anything they have done or haven't done.
They literally did nothing.
And to anyone saying "they did vote" or "they did make two serious posts" - no.
They were given multiple chances to show up when they were around, and instead of doing anything remotely useful, they just chose to throw snark and insults.
And it wasn't even cute or funny.
And when they finally decided to extend their trolling by the lowest amount of effort possible, they got replaced.
My bet would've been on them lurking and coasting throughout the game and abusing the rules.

Now if Waterdispenser is here to actually play the game, I am not advocating for the slots execution D1, but do not go around throwing townreads for slots that don't deserve them in the slightest, and then be surprised if people think you are scummy..

[UnaBombaH]

No, but compare it to the above. He's even using a points system and pretending like he knows exactly where his reads are and can be weighted.

He's town here and there's none of that.

I can whip out a point system for the first time for this game only, and then point out something like 10(+?) of my scum games from this site and you'll notice I never did anything like that as scum, ever. And my sample size would 10 times more relevant. Literally.

This is not a valid argument.
Just focus on one slot at a time if necessary, but you are going to have to dig for at least something from the past 2000+ posts in this game if you want to actually get into the meaningful conversation of today.

[UnaBombaH]

Nep and FourEyes are out of the discussion for todays lynch based on claims (almost) alone.
That WaterTap should be given some more time I guess? Not very enthusiastic about lynching that slot anymore, but I would LOVE to see what happens to Norweeg if that slot is ever lynched.

I would appreciate it if people who know or "know" ZombieRP/Elements(?) could give me some pointers or insight on what kind of a player they are.
Their scum-experience perhaps?
I feel like that slot is totally left without attention, and I for one haven't been able to read any tone or intentions from them in this whole game.
Probably just me being bad at the game, but what can I say. I dove the ISO at work and gave up on building a wall, because it felt like I was nitpicking on something that could've been just as much flavor and RP as it could've been AI.

VI intrigues me, but I think they're an easier read with a couple of flips.
They seem like the kind of player who will contradict their D1 "reads" if they are scum, and they can't help it under the pressure, I'm sure.

BuDucky wants me to make some sort of a move apparently?
And I almost feel like not doing anything just because of that.

[UnaBombaH]

There's also this one thing I've been intentionally avoiding. A little detail I've made sure not to talk about yet.
I do not necessarily like the fact that people are just fine with Nep claiming "a PR" instead of something concrete.
Now I've been waiting for some of the more experienced players to take at least some stance on it, and maybe demand a more accurate claim.
But no. And I find it weird as all hell, especially since none of lilith/BuDucky/S_S questioned it any further. I must have misjudged their mentalities on the matter.

Anyone and everyone who were voting/willing to vote for Nep before that claim - why are you satisfied with a claim of just "a PR"?
You do realize, that they are not locked into

ANY KIND

of claim right now, and in the scenario of scum!Nep have free reign of planning their role out with their teammate overnight?

I feel like Nep is still scum, but at least one of the vocal pushers is also scum, and were more than happy to unvote and move on.

[UnaBombaH]

This is interesting, considering that Nep clearly softed VT and that's why my vote is still on her.

Nevermind, is S_S still voting for her?
That would actually mean a lot to my poor brain.

[UnaBombaH]

So it's S_S after all who I should trust, and Ducky's the one I should suspect?
I don't know, I need some food to chew on this.

I believe that scum!Nep was partially bussed, at least one scum on board, but they were happy to jump off once that PR-claim came out.
If this is town!Nep and I'm just being dense about it, scum might still not need a full claim? They'd just be happy to shoot them, no matter what the role is.

I feel like it's townier to want a more concrete claim, at least the kind that can't be wiggled into pretty much anything in a massclaim.
So town!S_S. Probably town!lilith? Town!Pooky (because of Saudade).
Doesn't automatically mean scum!Ducky, but there's a lot of town there already.

[UnaBombaH]

Fck it, who am I trying to fool here.
I just don't want to lose to a scum!Duck and that feeds into my paranoia for no good reason.

[UnaBombaH]

Yes Nep.
That is just the thing, isn't it?

I'll cook something up and think about it in the meanwhile.

[UnaBombaH]

i think we're in a good spot right now, 100 pages is a lot but I do think there's enough to say at least two scum are in {Zombie, Billy, Norway, Water}

when almost everyone mostly agrees that's a good sign

if anyone else is scum my bets are on Una and worsty

I'm trying to be less paranoid because it just cost me a game, sometimes the scumteam is just... that

It's verryyyy interesting that certain people (like Billy, Una) are bringing this up and agreeing with it, makes me think that if either of them flip scum then the rest of the team is likely in this pool

I feel like this comes from a town-PoV..?
Not sure if that pool of 4 is correct though - I have my thoughts on Nep still.
And curiously enough, IV considers Zombie to be in the scumpool as well..interesting.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm still waiting for hjalp towards solving ZombieRP.
Or thoughts / soft meta on elements.
Anyone?

[UnaBombaH]

Well..there has been enough content from multiple enough sources so far, for me to think that not all wagons today have been on town at least.
Slightly lowkey-optimistic, eh?

If we'd been running down on townies only so far, scum might've just laid back and chilled.
I feel like they've had to participate somewhat as well, and there's legitimate difficulty in trying to find a wagon that the majority can agree on.
I think these are good things for the days to come.

[UnaBombaH]

is there anything specific you want me to re-read from zombie or is this a general request?

They used a posting-gimmick in the start of the game, and they only recently broke that character and also revealed their main.
I'ts just that I have no meta on Elements (sorry if I've been butchering that name btw, but I think it was this ), and I simply can't read that gimmick-style in a way that yields me any AI-relevant stuff.

PEDIT: thanks Duck. At least that's something I can return to later.

[UnaBombaH]

this game is gonna be juicy, i can feel it.

But do you really want it to be spicy AND juicy at the same time? Sounds unpleasent.
Spicy juices everywhere....people screaming..."MY EYES, IT BURNS!"...I've got to put a stop to that.

[UnaBombaH]

I have this idea I've been thinking about since yesterday.
But the problem is that I'm indecisive.

[UnaBombaH]

You know what would fit well with a solve of TW/BILLY?
...BULLY!

[UnaBombaH]

We could quasi-leash Nep.
I'm not even sure if that's a thing that works.

But if they want to actually help town, they'd first have to promise that they can actually produce a result/actions that can be confirmed and/or is visible to other players as well.
Then we'd discuss a pool of say three(?) players, and they can choose whichever of the three they like, or think their role fits the best for.
In the case where they aren't killed N1, we can discuss the result and whether or not anything happened to the three players in that pool.

This way we MIGHT be able to close out the scenario where scum!Nep can pick&choose an optimal scenario with their teammates, and we might force their hand in who to kill/block etc.
I have a good reason to think this might work out the best for us.

Thoughts?

[UnaBombaH]

Bully

BULLY!

BULLY!

Bully

Bully

BULLY!

BULLY!

[UnaBombaH]

Billy+Bully just sounds fun.
Nothing deeper than that.

[UnaBombaH]

Honestly?
Why?

[UnaBombaH]

I thought about it like this (in the scenario of town!Nep):
* Scum can't still know exactly what Neps role is, meaning that they can't for certain know which of the three targets Nep is going for. And that might vary spectacularly depending on whether it's an investigative/protective/Vig etc.
Meaning that scum can't just kill their target unless it's with pure luck -> we likely wouldn't get the scenario of scum!Nep where their claimed target might just be dead in the morning etc
* I feel like this in turn might pressure scum into trying to kill/roleblock Nep instead (which, obviously, should be the likeliest course of action for them in the case of town!Nep)
Meaning that even a Bulletproof-Nep might potentially get something out of their role for the team.

Well, all of these pros are the same for town when we do not leash Nep at all, BUT the reason why I was thinking about it was because I do not fully (read: almost at all) trust them to be town.
And leashing/narrowing them even a little seems like a good option in the scenario of scum!Nep.
Plus our other potential PRs might have a better chance of choosing the same target for Tracks/Watching etc.
Meaning, again that scum!Nep has less room to work with if they want to straight up fakeclaim and lie a result tomorrow.

Dunno, it seems to make sense in my head.

[UnaBombaH]

except that it restricts the confines of their narrative
which makes it easier for them to throw us an Adequate narrative

Does it though?
I mean, they'd still have to "guess" a claim and action that isn't called out as a lie straight out of the gates.
Plus they still shouldn't have too much information on what the whole setup is like, so they might also scew up their claim in that regard.

[UnaBombaH]

I don't know then.
All I'm saying is that if they claim a roleblock tomorrow, I personally want their scummy ass dead for a lie.

[UnaBombaH]

Same if their claimed target is found dead in the morning.
"Bad luck" with a fully open-ended claim doesn't exist.

[UnaBombaH]

how do you know the scum do not have a roleblocker?

Didn't say that I do.
But if we are letting Nep do it like this, I do not care if there is.
At least we would get that info on a town!Nep flip tomorrow then.

[UnaBombaH]

for competent scum, god yes
your plan literally tells scum!nep how to structure her fakeclaim

Funnily enough, we seem to completely disagree on this.
Guess this is a discussion for a later time then.

[UnaBombaH]

I mean, i’d vote Billy over me.

But if he flips town

i’m probably going to need a good and long trip to the mental hospital for rehabilitation.

Such a Freudian slip..

[UnaBombaH]

Wait, Billy notices this and they have a short interaction about it?
But they talk it away by walking right past the point?
Are they both just scum and Norwee slipped there??

[UnaBombaH]

I'm not so sure.
To me it seems rather obvious that Norweg is referring to Billy.

[UnaBombaH]

I mean, i’d vote Billy over me.

But if he flips town

i’m probably going to need a good and long trip to the mental hospital for rehabilitation.

Such a Freudian slip..

?? how is this is a slip am I just dumb

Well, tbf, at this point I was more or less joking.
But the way I read that post, Norweg is saying that

"he would vote Billy over himself"

-> with the tone of

"as the last option other than me"

-> Norweg thinks Billy is town.
He then says, and notice here, starts with a

BUT

"if he flips town i’m probably going to need a good and long trip to the mental hospital for rehabilitation"

.
Meaning that those two sentences are connected, and together they make no sense.
I might've let it pass, but the their mutual reaction to that mistake just seems fake to me.
To me it's obvious that Norweg is only talking about Billy in that post.

Now, I normally hate it when people jump up every time there's even a sliver of a chance someone made a "slip".
Scumslip, townslip, whatever.
But this here seems more like the kind of slip that actually happens for scum - especially if they are both scum.
Norweg is tunneling very hard on the point that "Billy is so obv.town to me", but while writing this post their actual knowledge of Billys alignment pushes through for a moment, and they write "town" instead of "scum".
Because they are both scum, but they are trying very hard to force the narrative of town!Billy.

[UnaBombaH]

Now, I only think this means something if they are both scum - and more importantly - Norweg is scum.
With town!Norweg this means nothing, and my initial joke of a Freudian slip is more accurate.
But I really dislike the way they momentarily voted for each other and then just swept it all under the rug.

[UnaBombaH]

At this point I don’t care whether norweej or billy is the elimination for today. does anyone have a strong preference?

If it's one or the other, I'd actually go for Norweg right now.
I still "owe" Billy that reread on them that I promised, and tbh, I'm sort of done doing ISO-dives or catchups for this gameday.

[UnaBombaH]

To me it's obvious that Norweg is only talking about Billy in that post.

Except, the following posts make it clear that he meant Nep and misgendered her?

That's the explanation he used, yes.
But that one post in itself makes no sense if Norweg is talking first about Billy and then suddenly about Nep.

Billy Pilgrim (3) - Waterdispensor, NorwegianboyEE, Zombie Apocalypse

Mod plz, i just changed my vote to Nepenthes.

Read the post with this for context. I think it's painfully obvious that Norweg is addressing the misunderstanding that Norweg would voting for Billy.
He then starts explicitly talking about Billy, and the "but" in the beginning of the second sentence pairs the two.

I do not see how 2663 could've been about Nep.

[UnaBombaH]

So...wait what?
You don't think Billy is scum, right?

Crazy-porridge again.

[UnaBombaH]

I'll finally commit to something tomorrow.
I promise.

I do not like the fact that Norweg is trying to start another wagon on a slot with a very light premise.
I do agree however that Billy is looking a lot more like town to me now.

I'll make my bed with a vote, and will have to lie in it as well.

[UnaBombaH]

Let’s consolidate on someone that’s not me/Billy/Foureyes/NM.

That's like the biggest reason I've been feeling unable to do anything about today after those PR-claims and Sirius' replacement.
I was willing to "consolidate" outside of you/Billy earlier with the Sirius-lynch, but you were one of the biggest antagonist to that.
And now that we had all those claims and both you AND Billy have successfully gone up and down with your interactions, you were hinting at being willing to lynch Sirius' replacement.
That feels like such bullshit to me. We should've done that ages ago, but instead we leaked information to scum unnecessarily, and even then I'm not sure Nep is actually town.
But I do think FourEyes is, and therefore N_M is.

I'm just trying to see the logical reasoning for town!Norweg here, and why that lynch on WaterDispenser would become more appealing now, than it would've been before.
And yes, that is like the only slot I'd be willing to "consolidate on" at this point.

[UnaBombaH]

also doubt scum in his shoes cycle through the super unpopular hot takes of scum!pooky / scum!una

This pretty much sums up my take on Billy as well.
They could've used a ton of different avenues to try and squirm off of the pressure as scum here, but instead they are throwing around soft punches towards slots that are not at all likely to be counterwagons.
I do not think having a "defeatist" mindset is necessarily AI, but I'd assume scum would still be pushing for counterwagons around him.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh shucks..

Not sure if I remember the context correctly, but I still thinks it's a valid argument.

[UnaBombaH]

Yea, no.
I feel like Billy either townspewed hard in the last ten or so pages, or is playing a whole different ballgame when it comes to faking tone and keeping up appearances.

VOTE: WaterDispenser - I've made my mind.
It's either this or Norwegian today for me.
And I do feel like I'm going to run at Norwegian tomorrow no matter what this flips, just being honest with you all.
I do not like their play this D1 at all.
But I think this might actually flip scum, especially now that they threw that stupid line about water bottles and then retracted it almost immediately.
Norwegian is either a teammate who was trying to salvage a lurky buddy in the hopes of a replacement, or just posing as a concerned townie.
But if you look at it from the "result-standpoint" so far - all they managed to do by bodyblocking the Sirius-lynch was multiple outed claims and a situation where no wagon seems to be able to gain momentum.

Norwegian or WaterDispenser is my opinion.

[UnaBombaH]

Stop it with that already.
But regarding your other postage - don't stop it, because you're on a roll.

This was me talking to Saudade before they decided to skip town on us.
I was thinking about giving this same advice to our claimed PRs so that we can actually do something D2, but then realized that there was nothing to stop yet anyway.
I'm looking at you Nep.

[UnaBombaH]

But if you look at it from the "result-standpoint" so far - all they managed to do by bodyblocking the Sirius-lynch was multiple outed claims and a situation where no wagon seems to be able to gain momentum.

You’re blaming me for towns inability to do anything? Seriously? That’s like the dumbest shade i’ve ever seen.

I'm just calling it like it is.
Had we lynched Sirius when I was calling for it, we wouldn't have gotten those claims today.
And despite you being so certain of it earlier, we might actually get a scumflip from this slot - and you even admitted to it being a reasonable lynch later.
I know there were multiple slots that followed you, and left the Sirius-wagon - I haven't forgotten about them either.

I also realize and openly admit that I haven't been playing at the top of my game D1 either, but I am ready to move on.
And Nep is going to get their chance to prove their role tonight, and then we can do a bit better tomorrow.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm off to do my coaching again, but will try and check in on this before going to sleep.
I'm counting on all the rest of you guys to not make it a no-lynch.

[UnaBombaH]

I want to hear Neps result ASAP.
I'm not wasting much more of my time on them unless they can actually provide something for us.

[UnaBombaH]

What makes you think I have a result

You should. Claiming "a PR" only gets you to D2 in my books, unless you can back it up with some results.

If you can't, I'm just assuming my read on you earlier was correct, and you are just scum who got away with a vague fakeclaim.

[UnaBombaH]

Hm
\Well anyways tw, I tried to track Una last night and got rbed/it failed

I can confirm this is 100% bullshit. You are either scum or do not understand what you are playing around with.
VOTE: Nepenthes.

[UnaBombaH]

Like, zero wiggle-room.

[UnaBombaH]

No, vote Nepenthes, she is lying about her result.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm a rolestopper, and targeted Nep last night.
So there's that.
I have modifiers that I'm not going to out yet so that scum can't abuse it, but I've said enough for reasonable people to see where I'm coming from.

The only way Nep could've been roleblocked, is if I was roleblocked first, and then they were roleblocked separately.
So nope.

[UnaBombaH]

No rolestop means I shouldnt have been able to be targeted by any actions last night ie not able to be roleblocked or killed

THIS.

[UnaBombaH]

why did you rolestop nepenthes?

They claimed a PR.
In the case they were town, I wanted for them to be able to prove their role.

I'm PM'ing the mod just in case, but I do know what my role should've achieved.
Barring two separate blocks, Nep is lying, and therefore scum.

[UnaBombaH]

Wtf?
Try to guess out of the whole playerlist who the scum would kill?
Well, let me think.
A claimed PR or just "someone else"?

I WAS protecting you.
From roles and kills.

[UnaBombaH]

Barring two separate blocks, Nep is lying, and therefore scum.

What about if you were rolestopped?

So then you'd suggest two separate rolestops.
Dunno, but two of these stopping/blocking effects would still have to be applied.

[UnaBombaH]

All I'm saying is that if they claim a roleblock tomorrow, I personally want their scummy ass dead for a lie.

This is me

how do you know the scum do not have a roleblocker?

Didn't say that I do.

But if we are letting Nep do it like this,

I do not care if there is.

At least we would get that info on a town!Nep flip tomorrow then.

locking in

Stop it with that already.
But regarding your other postage - don't

stop

it, because you're on a

roll

.

This was me talking to Saudade before they decided to skip town on us.
I was thinking about

giving this same advice to our claimed PRs

so that we can actually do something D2, but then realized that

there was nothing to stop yet

anyway.

I'm looking at you Nep

.

my night-action for last night.

At least S_S and TW should know this is how I operate.
I even tried to drop in my first crumbs during that whole bus-stop debacle, but we all know how that turned out..

[UnaBombaH]

Ok then, now that you have acknowledged that, you still think we go Zombie today S_S?

[UnaBombaH]

I enjoy crumbing my role almost as much as I like the rest of the game.

[UnaBombaH]

I mean, I'm not stupid or blind.
We go Zombie-RP today then, and we all know what should happen tomorrow

if

and

when

.

[UnaBombaH]

Una you saif you had modifiers, is one of them ascetic? Don't claim anything else but that would explain a no result if she targeted you.

You think I would've reacted to Neps claim the way she did if I was ascetic??

[UnaBombaH]

Whats up gang I have a new result
I saw Una visit me

[UnaBombaH]

UNVOTE:
Full transparency - I'm still not sure what to think.

Obviously can't quote the PMs between me and the mod, but the way things went, there's still a chance that Nep is scum and got super lucky.
I got an answer from the mod saying (in my own words obv. but the message is the same): "all the night-results have been resolved according to the Natural action resolution, and I've received and confirmed your action"
Then it took multiple hours for the game to actually be paused.

We then get one replacement (?) - that slot then RETRACTS their claim - and now "Nep has seen me visit them".

It's awfully convenient, but I feel like the timeline is off from my PoV.
I wouldn't be surprised if Zombie was scum, and it was just something regarding their role (?).
Nep might be their teammate, and took advantage of the pause.
Scum!Tracker might've seen me visit them, and panicked at the start of the day when I was adamant about them claiming.
Scum!Zombie might've thought their claim would be thought of as towny, once Nep flips scum!Tracker first.
Dunno.

[UnaBombaH]

No players or slots have been compromised as a result of this, so the game may continue without forced replacements.

I mean, there was also this.
Having a "situational guilty" wouldn't then qualify as "slots been compromised".

[UnaBombaH]

I feel like there's something I need to do before the day ends, but I'm still wary of BuDucky.

[UnaBombaH]

Play with me a little here.
During this exercise I'll be assuming you are town.

If S_S is town, and the Zombie-slot is scum.
We are then in a scenario where we'd be approaching a townblock with rather huge numbers (basing the rest of them on claims here).


TheFourEyedDude -claimed informed
UnaBombaH - issa me, the RowStoppa'
Nepenthes - claimed Tracker, "apparently got the correct result"
the worst - at least for this exercise
Something_Smart - most likely certainly town if Zombie was scum.
Not_Mafia - "cleardd" by FourEyes

Meaning that the two remaining scum would have to be in:
lilith2013
innocentvillager
Froppy
Billy Pilgrim

Now I'm not saying this can't be that "easy", but can it be this easy?

[UnaBombaH]

Sure.
I'm just a tad bit annoyed, and I feel like I'm allowed to be.

If Nep gets "inno'ed" by this, and it leads to a scum!Nep-victory..

[UnaBombaH]

Well, nothing in itself I guess.
But it's just the fact that we likely have more than two VTs as well (???), and the amount of claims/assumed power we already have suggests some shenanigans.

[UnaBombaH]

Then she will have to clear herself into a corner once both her partners are dead.

I guess.
If we hit the other scum first that is.

[UnaBombaH]

why are you writing off SS as lolbus scum?

I feel like everyone should, and talking about it in an extensive matter makes no difference now.
I'd say all we need is a flip from that slot to feel better.

[UnaBombaH]

Wait wait wait.
Do you really think scum!S_S would bus their teammate like this?

Especially since it was that alt that you guys actually knew(?) and liked(??) too?

[UnaBombaH]

Sure.
I'm just a tad bit annoyed, and I feel like I'm allowed to be.

If Nep gets "inno'ed" by this, and it leads to a scum!Nep-victory..

Then she will have to clear herself into a corner once both her partners are dead.

I had to recheck after work, because I had a nagging feeling that something pinged me.
It was this comment, but it was made by S_S.
I'll just pin this up for myself to search for with "nagging" tomorrow - depending on what the Zombie-slot flips anyway.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm afraid IRL just got in the way for this weekend.
Sorry guys, I'll catch up sunday-monday depending on when I actually get home..

@mod - V/LA for the next ~48h.

[UnaBombaH]

Back from the trip.
Drove over night fri-sat and all day today. (~1200km)
I'm off to bed now, and will catch up tomorrow during work.

[UnaBombaH]

Sucks that my chance to prove im actually a tracker today got messed up but osuka fixed it as soon as he could and the fact I posted immediately after thread unlock should add some credence to that
So if youre going to call me scum I would like my proper title of Scum Tracker to be used thanks

I rly tr iv am i just biased bc I have no defenders besides him

Im willing to accept 99% town SS its not worth it to worry about

Yea, this is unfortunately drenched in WIFOM and paranoia for me.
I honestly tried to supply the opportunity for you to get a result, considering the scenario where you are town we really got shafted.
Because you claiming that results means absolutely NOTHING from scum!Nep because I had already provided the answer to you.

Had you been able to claim me visiting you BEFORE I outed myself, we would have a completely different situation in our hands.

[UnaBombaH]

Like I said I'm still confused as to why VT zombie would do something like that. But why else would he do something like that at the start of day 2 without any pressure on him? He probably expected to die n2 to save a real town PR kill

I mean, I

guess

this could be the thing?
And I have this stupid tendency to think that scum never make mistakes like these, so I'm hesitantly leaning at least a little towards beliving you, but..
At the same time. I sort of doesn't matter what your slot/you have claimed or unclaimed.
S_S still seems so adamant about your slot, that I'm going to say you should be todays lynch anyway.

[UnaBombaH]

My stance on policy executions is kinda confused. I'm against them in principle, because they obviate the need to actually form reads, but I will often support them in practice if they get traction because my D1 philosophy is to execute someone I don't townread, and I probably won't be townreading someone if they are policy-worthy.

So why didn't you join the sirius wagon? You weren't tring him, and it had traction at one point.

This is a smart pickup.
I still think D1 would've been way better for us, had we actually just lynched that slot.
It still hasn't done anything, and I have a feeling that the rest of the replacements would've gone a different route as well.

That doesn't make S_S scum outright, but I believe scum benefited more from what went down, and sometimes judging the actions by the results is the right way to go.

[UnaBombaH]

- zombie had already set up this fakeclaim on d1. I think scum are more likely than town to set up fakeclaims early like that.

Well, tbf, I crumb my claims pretty much always.
When it's a straight up protective role like here, I try to keep it "not as obvious" in case someone notices them, but I still crumb at least something.
And to add to that, I never fakeclaim when I crumb. I want to keep that consistent 100% of the time - alignments aside.
So to me, PLUS saying it's a fakeclaim that was crumbed as well...not really liking that.
Not sure if it's outright scummy, but to me it doesn't seem towny at all either.

- maybe that’s what plus is trying to make us think? by claiming something different from their predecessor? that it’s too stupid for newbscum to do?

Or they just panicked and thought that the claim didn't make sense?
It also makes me think that if Plus is scum, it would make more sense if the setup is stacked with power on both sides.

[UnaBombaH]

idk how the worst plays maf so I'd be inclined to take SS's word for it but it still feels pockety to me

Well, if you're town, then yeah my point is it's pocketing/whiteknighting.

I outright dislike this.
Doesn't come across as confident as I had hoped S_S would be.

[UnaBombaH]

So hold on.

How did scum know Una wouldn't be protecting Nepenthes again?

This was my thought exactly.
I only hinted at it once, and since they apparently realized it, I have some serious ponderings about the identity of scum.

[UnaBombaH]

It only succeeds in framing town-Una if Una actually didn't protect Nepenthes.

I honestly thought I should protect you after last gameday. And it's not like I had much of a choice..

[UnaBombaH]

I guess it's a relevant question whether Una could act last night.

Una, you don't have to fullclaim, but letting us know that would be nice.

It's mainly that I couldn't save Nep, and I honestly thought scum would THINK that I'd save Nep, and hence try to kill either you or me.
So I wanted to protect you.

[UnaBombaH]

why did you decide that and when and why did you crumb it o.0

For situations like this..
I usually have a good hunch about what my role "brings to the table", and hence I also often spot the "complications" that may arise along the way.
This was one of them.

[UnaBombaH]

Why didn't scum go for S_S though?
I can't believe they didn't.
Unless they have a roleblocker to use on me (which is very plausible I guess?) they took a chance with the Nep-kill.
Which makes me fret the idea that they were somehow able to see what I'd do there, and played accordingly.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh, a Strongman could work as well.
If they really felt like that Tracker was the bigger threat.

[UnaBombaH]

Thank you for sharing way more information than I asked for, I guess?

Yeah, I know.
I screwed up with that as well.
Shouldn't have claimed you as my actual target last night, just that I couldn't save Nep.
I'm a bit tired, and potentially put us into deeper shit now.

BuDucky might just be scum because of Nep being the kill.
He would be able to guess/know what I'd do last night.

[UnaBombaH]

But hey, you guys nailed scum last gameday!
Yay!

I was too busy driving to nowhere and back and then being so fking tired for this whole week.
I'm still paying for that trip every morning when I wake up (like right now as well).

[UnaBombaH]

Well actually, I was hesitant to crumb anything this game because I was afraid scum!BuDucky might read it all and just abuse it to hell and back.
But then I ultimately decided to do it anyway, and hoped you'd give me the Boon-treatment.
Keep me around, and trust in your ability to manipulate me.

[UnaBombaH]

I just remember the last time scum!Una tried to keep Boon around and manipulate him..
It's all over his signature so he kinda doesn't let me forget about it.

I also have a vague feeling that I've tried to keep you around as scum once and it backfired, but I might just have a poor memory.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm gonna go for....A.

[UnaBombaH]

..riveting gameplay..

[UnaBombaH]

I came to this dayphase ready to claim, but I agree that we ought to claim tomorrow now.
And I'll even be the one to start if necessary.

[UnaBombaH]

_ _ _ _ _ _ _
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

let's hangman it

+

I'm gonna go for....A.

+

no A

..okay then...
I would like to try and solve!

"What is yellow?"

[UnaBombaH]

Why didn't scum go for S_S though?
I can't believe they didn't.
Unless they have a roleblocker to use on me (which is very plausible I guess?) they took a chance with the Nep-kill.
Which makes me fret the idea that they were somehow able to see what I'd do there, and played accordingly.

If roleblock resolves before rolestop then its a scum role. And are we sure that its also protective in addition to making the target ascetic?

Lets not discuss this part of it any further until I fullclaim. Fullstop.

[UnaBombaH]

Yea, I don't understand this logic either.
I'm a town-Rolestopper, and that's not changing.
Scum having any abilities to block ~anything~ with their abilities shouldn't mean anything in regards to that.

Furthermore - why are we discussing any potential roleblocks on me since there should be no reason to suspect/expect anything of the sort?
Was that a TMI-slip Billy?

[UnaBombaH]

So you think scum!FourEyes wanted to make town!Not_Mafia an IC?
Or you think he potentially paired the two of them so obviously?

[UnaBombaH]

Wait, Froppy is the waterD/Sirius -slot?
Who's the leading advocate for that lynch this day and time?

[UnaBombaH]

You were the one that brought up a roleblock in 3867.

Only with the context that IF they have a roleblocker, they could've just roleblocked me and feel comfortable with killing Nep. That's scenario A.
Scenario B is a Strongman or something like that.
Scenario C is that the scumteam knew/guessed my plan for last night.

[UnaBombaH]

Wait, Froppy is the waterD/Sirius -slot?
Who's the leading advocate for that lynch this day and time?

Ducky came in voting it.

OK.
VOTE: the worst - time to solve this shit today instead of me resorting to paranoia every now and then.

[UnaBombaH]

I dont see the town utility if a block resolves before a stop.

Well, I do not understand this at all then.
What is the point of a town!Doc if scum have a roleblocker? (because that's basically the same thing here)

[UnaBombaH]

Ok, can we agree that you are either scum OR a dumbass then? Because if that's OK with you, I'm going to townbin you right away.. (#NextLevelBurn)

[UnaBombaH]

I want BuDucky to talk with me realtime.
If you feel like trying to actually solve the game, let's try and make something happen tomorrow.
I'm going to bed now and will be online next in ~8 or so hours.
See you then if possible.

[UnaBombaH]

Are you townreading froppy?

No, but I feel like Duck needs to activate before I'm gone.

[UnaBombaH]

bro you're meant to be voting scum or pretending to vote scum stopppp

I thought you claimed scum multiple times this game. Not so funny anymore, is it?

[UnaBombaH]

I’m probably also fine with froppy being eliminated but also there must be a third so let’s do some other stuff rather than just going straight to an elimination?

+town points to lilith
-town points for everyone trying to push the elim

Doesn't work like that, sorry.
Even if I'm not pushing you, you shouldn't give out townpoints to me, nor should you give "-townpoints" to everyone pushing you just because.
It's the intent behind the push, and reasons to join/oppose that matter.
But you already know all this, I'm sure.

[UnaBombaH]

And then I thought about it and changed my mind. And I never didn't want to eliminate Zombie slot. The claim was bad.

TBH, initially I really thought there might've been some kind of a scum!gambit going from S_S.
But once I got to the point where ZombieRPs replacement retracted the claim...kek.

[UnaBombaH]

hmm I have an interesting take on una but maybe it's better to talk about it after our dialogue idk

I actually think you should out this "take".
It's the kind of stuff I want to see from you.
I'm not asking you to "tryhard" if you don't feel like doing it - I'm in no position to demand that from anyone.
But I feel like my biggest obstacle with you here is the lack of commitment to an unpopular/new read. Something that might be hotly contested, or might involve some personal insight.

I feel like I saw glimpses of town!duck during my catchup, but at the same time I feel like you are actively forcing yourself to stay on surface-level.
This reads to me like you are trying to stay alive and not be a nightkill, which obviously could mean a multitude of things.
I'm trying to decide whether you just want to keep playing, or if you are actually scum this time around.

[UnaBombaH]

I was actually replying to something else, but suddenly realized why Nep was killed last night.
They literally HAD TO kill Nep.

[UnaBombaH]

Don't over-strain yourself with those posts BuDucky m8! O_O

[UnaBombaH]

secretly i kinda think una's n2 is kinda scum indicative but i think i'll just be able to sort him via dayplay

And what the hell is this about?
If you want to scumread me, do it based on me not committing to the Nep-wagon D1 - not based on my N2 actions.

In all perfect honesty - you didn't think S_S was a very reasonable and a likely target for scum to kill?

If I were to think at least one of you/S_S was town, I might have something like 2630 ways to explain myself discreetly enough to either of you.
But now that I finally understood why Nep absolutely HAD TO die from scum!PoV, I feel like the scumteam could be anywhere, and have "anything".