Mini Normal 2160 | FIA Group B | Endgame

[UnaBombaH]

Take a stance on me Ducky, take a dance with me Ducky.
Be my aussie Steve Rogers, I'll be your finnish Bucky.

[UnaBombaH]

No wait, you were from Australia, right?

[UnaBombaH]

I think the fact you apparently crumbed that you weren't going to protect Nep is like... literally mind-bogglingly negligent

Literally didn't do this.
Read what I've just said and you might understand what I mean.
We need to be speaking the same language here.

[UnaBombaH]

Then you are probably just scum and my vote is in the right place.

[UnaBombaH]

I need you to be pretty level with me.

I feel like I already said too much today unless we just full-massclaim. Scum might already have all the info they need, and delaying the sharing of ours might just benefit them more.

[UnaBombaH]

If BuDucky is indeed scum, then FourEyes+N_M are both town.
I don't think scum!Ducky would need to point any sus. in that direction if FourEyes was their teammate.

[UnaBombaH]

Is there anyone here who would oppose to a full massclaim today?
I sort of was earlier, but since I don't feel like I can townbin Ducky right now I'm wondering whether it'd be better to out everything.

[UnaBombaH]

he dropped a nonsensical theory on someone who is increasingly obvtown (hi it's me) and then left

There isn't much truth at all within this span of words.
At least not from a neutral standpoint and PoV.
I went nowhere, and you becoming "increasingly obv.town" is just something you say to try and suggest it around.

I feel like your position should be pushed and questioned now because otherwise you'll just slide to the endgame and we'll be none the wiser.

[UnaBombaH]

I honestly missed everything and anything tangible you might've said there.
If Ducky is scum, it's mandatory we massclaim today.
But I do think Froppy has to be the lynch today no matter what, simply because that's a slot which is not going anywhere, and not doing anything anyway.
And the way that this might come to a halt just like it did D1, makes me think there's something to it as well.

[UnaBombaH]

BuDucky just can't see beyond my scumread on him.
He has Lilith so deep in a pocket, that he feels comfortable enough to just vaguely skirt around my slot.
If Ducky really wanted, he'd understand my frustration as well.
That vote on me is merely symbolic - he knows I'll be mislynchable from this point onwards.
And yea, my own crumbs likely lead to this, so maybe it's going to be me getting my just desserts.

I'm calling it now - Froppy is town, I'll be mislynched tomorrow because of consequences, and the remaining scumteam is BuDucky-IV.

[UnaBombaH]

Yeah, well this might be the type of thing where scum don't have to be good.
More about town falling apart.

[UnaBombaH]

Fuckitall then I guess.

I'm a Town 3-shot Indecisive Rolestopper.

Meaning that I have 3 shots (1 left), yes, but I'm also unable to target the same player twice in a row.
Hence my frustration with Nep dying last night, when I literally thought S_S would've been a priority target for scum. Not that I could've used my shot on Nep two nights in a row either.
But the part where I really screwed up was admitting that I did target S_S last night. I should've lied at the start of the day instead, and claimed that I was going to protect him the coming night.
Hence my increased frustration.
I then wanted to see whether either of S_S or TW would've been on alert for me to try and directly hint my problem to them, and possibly be able to come up with a plan in secret.

If I were to think at least one of you/S_S was town, I might have something like

2630

ways

to explain myself discreetly enough

to either of you.

I've done this in a game before, but I can't remember which.
And I feel like at least one of the two were present then. Plus I had to re-check and confirm alrady earlier that S_S was present when I did all those "backup"-crumbings in Blessed Mafia.
He even admitted that he was the one who believed me back then, so I felt like this might work.
So, what I had said back in 2630.

I have this idea I've been thinking about since yesterday.

But the problem is that I'm indecisive.

This was D1 before I had fully committed to protecting Nep N1. Shortly after this I followed with the idea of a quasi-leash, but Ducky squashed it.
Obviously you guys didn't know back then what I was aiming at, but I knew I couldn't save Nep two nights in a row.
I just wanted to either get a result from town!Nep N1, or lynch a lying scum!Nep D2 and move on.
When she got her result "fixed", I realized there was nothing else to do but hope that scum wouldn't kill her with the fear of their kill going to waste, but admittedly that was a long shot.

[UnaBombaH]

Now, I'm fully admitting that me crumbing my Indecisive-modifier was a "survivalistic" move on my part, but I felt comfortable doing it for two reasons.
1. I still haven't seen a scummie who checks/notices these things I throw out.
If someone does, it's always a townie who potentially scumreads me and wants to case me, and those are the peeps that basically ~should~ see them as well.
2. I knew my role would be super-strong ungated, and potentially game-changing even with these modifiers, BUT I also realized that this one modifier would be the one that gets me mislynched.
Scum would be very eager to get me lynched based on "poor decision-making" with my night-actions that I couldn't explain without explicitly admitting that I literally CAN'T protect the same target twice in a row.

[UnaBombaH]

I've done this in a game before, but I can't remember which.

Oh, I remember. It was the one where Boon and I were both vigis.

You were also scum there :thonk:

Well, my MO with PRs is pretty much the same as scum and town so...

I can't believe I missed that

But you also basically flat-out claimed indecisive in 3864, so it seems like a waste of a crumb.

But that was a lot later though.
That crumb was a fail-safe for a situation where someone like scum!Duck tries to turbo-lynch me today.
I already admitted that I shat the bed when I claimed to have targeted you last night.
I obviously want to claim truthfully as town as to not cause conflicting results for other PRs, but here it might've been worth to lie a little.

[UnaBombaH]

Oh, and the last part.
I checked it earlier just to confirm, but (paraphrasing, not an actual quote per rules):

All potential rolestoppers in this game follow the Normal guidelines, and therefore cannot block a Strongman from committing a kill, but block all other roles from targeting the same person as them.

So yes, I am able to block kills, and the only way to bypass that protection is via a Strongman, or a direct roleblock towards me.

[UnaBombaH]

Also why I was so pissed off D1 btw.
I was literally hoping for no outed PRs, and the chance to possibly even save my shots for later.
I wanted Saudade to continue being an obv.townie, and no better kill-targets for scum to pop up. I even crumbed my protection on them quite early.
Sirius would've been an awesome lynch for that scenario as well. Then all the replacements happened, and multiple townies suddenly claimed roles before N1.
Ech.

[UnaBombaH]

una what is your read progression looking like rn

Something_Smart
lilith2013
Billy Pilgrim (upon reread doesn't seem to have an agenda. I feel like they get scumread for misinterpretations mainly)
TheFourEyedDude (independent of the claimed Informed)
Froppy // Not_Mafia (independent of the claimed "IC") <---- neither slot has done anything, and I'm annoyed by the fact that N_M is basically coming/going to the LyLo no matter what because he poses no threat to the scum, even if conf.town. -_-
innocentvillager
the worst (combination of gut and trying to salvage an agenda from their posts. I feel like they are still somewhat holding back. We need more decisive actions now, and town!Ducky can be decisive.)

[UnaBombaH]

I literally do not see any other "pairings" than the blatantly obvious FourEyes/N_M.
Which actually annoys me a little.
It's a brilliant gambit for a theoretical scum, especially now that N_M has replaced into the slot.
There's absolutely no use in lynching N_M or even questioning them AT ALL, because flipping FourEyes provides "the only answer that matters".
So if scum!FourEyes could keep a straight face and line in this game until the end, the scum just go ahead and win.

[UnaBombaH]

you know like, TFED being town clears NM

Obviously, but read my latest post.
I do think FourEyes is town -> N_M is locktown, but independent of those claims, they'd rank like that.
Meaning that IF Foureyes is scum, N_M basically has no town/scum-equity at all on their own.

do we policy TFED for the clear on a useless slot?

Of course we don't.
But it means that the two slots in question will never be lynched. It doesn't explicitly mean that they are town either.
If FourEyes is the mastermind with the moves, this is exactly the way it plays out.
Surely you can understand what I mean?
The way that I see that claim working out, is that

WE NEED TO KEEP READING THE TWO SLOTS INDEPENDENTLY OF EACH OTHER UNTIL THE END.

If FourEyes is scum, he has to keep up appearances until the end. In theory, N_M never gets lynched before him you know. Might be NK'd, but not lynched.
You obviously know that flipping scum!N_M -> scum!FourEyes.
But flipping scum!FourEyes means nothing regarding N_M's alignment.

why is lilith your second strongest townread?

Because I feel like scum!S_S would have 0 reason to bus Zombie RP the way they did.
Especially if it was a slot they knew(?) and (I guess?) liked as well.
Scum!Zombie = town!S_S here, or I don't even care anymore. Which puts S_S at the top for me.
Meanwhile, Lilith has been consistent with their reads, and I can clearly see the trajectories behind their moves.
The way I see it, there are no unexplained switches or stops from them, and yet they have been able to adjust their reads over time.
It's either masterful scumplay, or just plain ol' town.
Forming my top2-townreads.

why is innocentvillager actually your scumread?

TBH, most of it is PoE.
Think of it like this. (after I've built my list from the top down)
N_M being scum would mean that FourEyes is scum -> my whole list is off anyway.
froppy being scum wouldn't adjust this read either way, but I feel like one of froppy/IV is scum, and they are scum with someone more effective and experienced. In my mind, that being you this game.
The difference between froppy and IV however, is the fact that out of the two - IV has at least tried to "play the table."
They come across almost "cutesie noob-town" at times, but at the same time they do maneuvres like "this is our lynch today - not gonna explain".
I feel like it's a combination of two potrayals, and while he switches between the two very fluidly, I do not think they should be so interchangeable.
He should either be scared/paranoid as he is uninformed, or he should be assertive and certain. One of the two - not both.

[UnaBombaH]

why are you like thisssssssssssssss

Because I'm really worried that you are actually scummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[UnaBombaH]

my stomach did a eugh thing at that post

why don't you have a read on froppy...

Why did your stomach "eugh" when I'm actually explaining my thought-process?
I feel like I have a very rational, if

slightly

paranoid view of the whole FourEyes/N_M situation.

And I honestly do not have a read on froppy, other than the slot has had a series of lazy/bad players who have all struggled to catchup and get on top of things.
Could be either way for scum/town, and that's all I'm seeing when I look at the slot.

The main-reasons for why I'm thinking it's town over scum right now are you being a scumread, and the PoE following that.
I think scum want froppy dead today, followed by a kill on S_S.

Then comes the mislynch of Una based on Ducky pushing his scumread on me + the "mechanics-stuff" that'll definitely be whipped out tomorrow.

Then either Lilith or another top-townread gets NK'd, and scum!Ducky has a LyLo with a uncoordinated buch of townies.
It seems painfully obvious to me that Lilith has been pocketed, even if they might not see it themselves (and you rarely can see it yourself when you are the one being pocketed - obviously)

[UnaBombaH]

still don't believe you actually scumread me here.

I tried to play a more secretive game with you before here, and that didn't work out at all. So why would I continue doing so here?
I mean, can you come up with any rationals reasons for why town!Una would be parading you as scum here, unless I really had that read?

[UnaBombaH]

dislike this

So if scum!FourEyes could keep a straight face and line in this game until the end, the scum just go ahead and win.

Why though?
We would never lynch N_M before FourEyes here, right?
Meaning that if scum!FourEyes can keep their game together, they are both "safe" until the end.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm at the point with Froppy where I'm so bored of absolutely annihilating her slot and having her do absolutely nothing but complain about not being given a chance despite being actively given an abundance of chances that i want her out of the game about as much as i want a scumflip.

like she's a worse distraction than NM at this point.

Definitely agree with this though. Especially the bolded, but more because N_M just hasn't done ANYTHING.

And mind you, I called this slot out as early as D1, and said that we need to get rid of it as early as possible.
I still think it's not a useful slot to have around, and thank goodness you landed scum yesterday to still give us the option of a "low-stress policy-lynch".
What bothers me more though, is the fact that you were willing to give them so much rope D1.
If you had just "stayed by my side" D1 on that lynch, it would've happened then.

I'm like 75%+ sure that slot flips town, and tomorrow scum will make their actual move based on ~something~.

[UnaBombaH]

this is... literally entirely posturing and still doesn't explain how you actually think i'm scum in this game

Well, sure.
I'll throw you a bone.
This entire same scenario could play out with lilith as scum as well. (they really do seem smart and cunning enough)
And the illusion of them being in your pocket is caused by scum!lilith rather than scum!Ducky.
And just to be certain - I'd never see you both being scum here, and I currently townread lilith above you.
So are you willing to try and sell me on scum!S_S instead? (P.S. not going to buy that)

[UnaBombaH]

outside of that it's like saying "if scum post well sure fine let them win" which ...... to a small extent yes but is also play to your wincon damnit. if you have a read on four, or anyone, fuck the way they're posting - lay into them.

And that's why I tiered them with the asterisks of "regardless of claims".
So far, I think FourEyes just needs to be poked at - N_M does not budge no matter what.
And the reason I put it like that earlier, was jusst because of that: IF FourEyes isn't forced to alignment spew, it doesn't matter if "N_M slips" (which he doesn't btw, because he doesn't post much either )
Because lynching N_M instead of FourEyes never makes any sense. You see what I meant now?

[UnaBombaH]

I mean, if you were reading my posts this phase, I think you'd notice that despite powerdriving a wagon on them I am really uncertain on their alignment and don't feel comfortable with this gamestate and would reeeeeally like them to do something sortable

Well, if you read my posts D1, you'd know that this was literally me D1.

but yeah you know what sure ok I'm the evil scum pushing the scum!froppy narrative good work una well done you got me

Now that's just unnecessary sassssssssss.

[UnaBombaH]

this Froppy wagon seems to be proceeding much like the plusJOYed one Day 2.

What is this supposed to mean?

Wagon has been stalled with very few attempts to change it. It looks like the last Scum wagon we had on Scum who had given up

if you think froppy is a miselim I'm really surprised this post didn't make your skin crawl. it made mine crawl and I'm not even sure if froppy is a miselim.

I'm not sure why though?
Like, this is FourEyes simply stating that it looks similar to how D2 panned out, and we got a scumflip from that, so..?
What am I missing?

[UnaBombaH]

Ok then.
I'll ISO-dive lilith separately during the week.
Can't promise an exact day because coaching responsibilites and work, but I'll do it.

[UnaBombaH]

The one slot that I was most baffled about upon reread was Billy though.
I do not see them being scum here, but at the same time...if I was forced to point at the specific moment where they "town-told" - gun to my head - I don't think I could come up with a post to quote.
It's more of a gradual evolution of everything?

[UnaBombaH]

1) was she sortable eod1? eh not really I was kinda half curious to work to work with the fresh replacement
was she sortable D2? no
is she sortable d3? no

That slot will never be sortable, and I said as much D1.
Even now I'm not directly opposing to it, but I'm more interested in seeing whether people are able to push it through without me.
That's also something I can then chew later with the information of the flip, if I'm still breathing and talking.

[UnaBombaH]

Dunno, I'm thinking I don't even want S_S to claim today.
Keep the scum guessing and evaluating the risk-levels without accurate knowledge.
I'm also openly WIFOMing whether I'm going to holster tonight to save my last shot for later.
So this is me, WIFOMing. #buzzwording

[UnaBombaH]

and scum!una fits with SS’s earlier theory of una being town unless sirius/froppy slot is scum

This intrigues me.
Am I misinterpreting this, or do you actually still think S_S might be scum?
Because I'm reading this post from you as "S_S+Una=scum"..?

Honestly very interested in hearing this out.

[UnaBombaH]

I reread some SS things last night after feeling a bit paranoid about this game and I am like 150% sold on town!SS btw

OK, guess not then.
Then what did you mean by your 4174?
I'm really baffled now.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm null on too many people and I was enjoying my IV townread so much and then una was all like "nooooo he's scum WITH YOU" and I think that is generally a Silly read but I don't really feel all that good about town!IV anymore

Hello, if this is town!Ducky receiving this call, I'm glad you are here.
If this is the wrong number, eat rope please.

^^honestly could still go either way for me.
scum!Ducky building distance because he realized there's something there to be found, or town!Ducky realizing that there have been too many soft townreads and nulls in this game.

billy is still town right

Unless there's zero scum in FourEyes/lilith/BuDucky.
Billy is a very "chill" as scum if he's scum here, and could very well then be teamed with the Sirius-slot.
Meaning that my solve would have been totally off after D1 went off the rails.
Only other scenarios I'm currently not able to process because they are rather weird. Mainly because of how some of the slots interacted earlier.

I feel fairly strongly on town!SS as well

I'm honestly not budging on this.
Read their ISO starting from D2.
That was the most pointless and cold-blooded bus in the history of this game if S_S is scum here.
Two aspects that I can't connect with S_S at all.

I have a nasty feeling that anyone softing any suspicions towards S_S here just wants them to claim as well.
Which is the main reason why I'm fine with them not claiming today.
Maybe force the scumteams hand a little.

[UnaBombaH]

I feel kind of ok with town!billy. like I think somewhere around

SS


duck
billy
una/iv/nm
four
froppy

You really feel set on BuDucky?
I feel like this puts you in a corner D4 if you are scum.
And I hope someone will hold you to this if I'm not able to do so.

[UnaBombaH]

I feel some dissonance with una but I felt a similar way about norweej so I feel like it might just be a language thing? like just the usage and emphasis of certain words is throwing me off? (only slightly related, I was thinking about stuff while in transit yesterday and I could feel myself like bolding phrases in my head the way I think una would.)

I know my emojis and uses of CAPITALS and

bolding

might annoy/distract some people, but I'd also argue that if you really read my posts with the emphasis on those words like I intended them, people might better understand what I'm driving at.

[UnaBombaH]

I do think his conclusions are kinda off but I think I have been too lazy w IV and I can kinda.... Possibly see how that looks partnery given I'm giving a very short leash to most players this game

This is the line that we need to solve.
I'm afraid this will turn into another game where I've focused too much on playing my role, and therefore am "disconnected" from my teammates.
Therefore they will not trust my reads even if they might trust in my alignment.
It was a similar thing in "Blessed Mafia" (once again, a reference to that ) where I called them out 3/3 based on associatives and night results alone, but was unable to rally the rest of the town behind me.

I can't stress the point enough, that while Ducky is an above average heart throb and a darling, they are still a savage murderer and a scoundrel when they roll scum.

Just don't let them off easy.

That's all.

[UnaBombaH]

The N1 kill was saudade’s slot, and I’m wondering if he tried to soft or unintentionally softed by saying “oh I’m definitely the N1 NK” or if that was just him being cocky, because I couldn’t see a reason for scum to NK saudade over nepenthes who had hard claimed some kind of PR

Oh, I thought it was obvious in retrospect why the Saudade-slot was killed.
I was honestly thinking about saving them initially when they started that "I'm gonna die"-talk.
But after the replacement (sorry Pooky) and the claim from Nep, I thought it was more likely that scum would go for Nep, and therefore I locked in my decision.

[UnaBombaH]

OK, this might get me killed before I can use my last shot, but I guess I'll just lay my cards on the table.
There's a reason why I'm almost certain there's a capable, smart scumplayer on the loose.
Someone who's able to spot clues and crumbs, and plan their night-actions accordingly.
I'm also worried that the N1-results point to a certain feathery direction, and someone who also fits the description above.
-----------------------------------------------
After Pooky died I went to check their ISO, like I always do. (the townie that died, always died for a reason, and this time it was even a PR)
So I went ahead and checked for crumbs and especially the kind that scum might've noticed and used as a basis for their nightkill.
I believe Saudade already got some spotlight on them with their "I'm gonna die"-talk.
And then Pooky probably sealed his fate with stuff like this:

I was going to post something game related but I got distracted thinking about

traveling to Norway

-----
I hope this pandemic is over soon so

I could maybe visit.

Also I'd like to say

I'd be very sad if Norwee is scum here

.

This was at the point where it wasn't clear Norwee was about to be the D1-lynch.
Now, once I read this at the start of D2, I realized that scum might actually interpret this as a crumb for an investigative. Very easily.
He later followed with

the solve probly is just ducky/norwee/billy

while Norwee was still at E-3. But this puts billy and ducky in the same pool with norwee, who might've been the originally intended target for N1.
Then, once Norwee was already hammered, Pooky kept going.

I will be quite sad if Norwee flips town here for I did not

do my duty and save him

.

..and then closed out their ISO with..

in case I don't make it,

someone do a norwee appreciation thread if he really flips green today.

If TW does it, just speedlynch him on sight

+

TW-scum confirmed

So here we have a slot that was more or less townread initially (Saudade), and dropped multiple posts later in the day that could be interpreted as PR-crumbs.
Some of them could be taken as an investigative, some as a Doc (that last use of "save" at least I think), but it felt very likely to me that at least one scum was going to be found within S_S/Ducky/lilith.
Now I'm sorry if someone feels offended in the slightest but these are the three slots that strike me as the type who would be able to abuse a situation like this.
Don't be fooled by Ducky not doing it here with my crumbs - he's definitely still

capable

of doing it.

[UnaBombaH]

This also leads to a painfully obvious way to see why I'm town here.

Scum most definitely have a roleblocker in this game.

Nothing else can explain that weird interaction with Neps claimed result changing (now that we know she was really town).
And the fact that she was able to see ME, means that I wasn't roleblocked + she wasn't roleblocked = I am what I claim to be.
I'm like 99% sure the initial confusion was caused by the mod thinking that the rolestop/roleblock can't be resolved together, and therefore there was that initial "no result".

And it fits PERFECTLY with Pooky being the kill.
Think about it.

Scum might've thought I was a Doc or an investigative, or didn't see my crumbs at all.
But it doesn't matter, since they basically KNEW I was going to target Nep if I was going to target anyone.
Plus she was definitely going to be lynchable D2/D3 if she wasn't able to produce results at all until then.
So no reason to kill there -> just keep roleblocking it until lynched.

Regarding Pooky however, they might not have know what he was.
I'm not even sure if most of this playerlist realized they had any PR-equity at all.
And I feel like those last two posts seemed almost threatening towards BuDucky.
My own gutfeel once I spotted them was something along the lines of "weak visitor" or something similar.

So now consider the theoretical scum!Ducky who comes to this conclusion.
There can't be two kills, because then people would most certainly go and see those posts by Pooky -> Ducky eats rope.
So they had to choose which of Pooky/Nep to block, and which to kill, and Nep had more mislynch-potential for them.

And this is something I haven't been able to shake from my mind.

[UnaBombaH]

In fact I'm pretty sure if I had spotted those crumbs as scum I would have pegged Pooky as exactly hider.

At the start of D2, my first two guesses would've been

weak

anything. Visitor, hider, whatever.
And my second guess would've been Doc. And even then, I think scum!Una would've specifically guessed

weak Doctor

.

But it doesn't matter what they actually flipped, it matters what the scumteam initially must've thought.
They thought Pooky was going to be a PR-threat, and that they would be able to roleblock Nep.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm also worried that the N1-results point to a certain feathery direction, and someone who also fits the description above.

Do you have a list of people who you believe could fit the description?

I think I already dropped some names, but I've already narrowed that list based on dayplay.
For example, while I think scum!S_S would've been able to do it, I'm almost 100% certain S_S is town here.
Lilith and Ducky both strike me as the type, capable of pulling that read and plan off.
Ducky has the highest likelyhood in my mind simply because Pooky focused heavily on them in the latest part of their ISO, and the context reads to me like "if it can't be norwee, it has to be ducky".

Billy was also mentioned in Pookys scumpool near the end of their ISO

, but I'm not sure about their scumrange..and I feel like my townread on them is still warranted.

[UnaBombaH]

Also, I still don't get what 2885 has to do with crumbing.

Well, it's his scumpool. Including Norwee who ended up being the lynch, and towards whom he had previously hinted at targeting. (clearly, IMO)
And once Norwee became the lynch for D1, they mostly pointed their posts towards Ducky - another player from that same scumpool.
I don't think it's a stretch for scum to read that trajectory as to mean that Pooky was going to target Ducky N1.

[UnaBombaH]

I would say that 3053 would also then lend the idea to a frame job being done on the worst.

Well, obviously this could be the case as well. (even if I don't think so)
But it doesn't change the fact that I feel like N1-actions were as follows:

Pooky targeted BuDucky. (assumedly got a result but also died)
UnaB rolestopped Nep. (made sure no other actions towards Nep went through)
Nep tracked UnaB. (initially false "no result" - corrected to "UnaB visited Nep")
Scum1 roleblocked Nep (no effect because of my rolestop - corrected to this later)
Scum2 killed Pooky. (assumedly no other interactions because no one has come out with other results regarding this)

+maybe something else that we are not going to discuss now, but we will after the massclaim.

[UnaBombaH]

Also, consider again from the scum!POV.
If someone where to assume a weak-modifier on Pooky.
It would fit Saudades gloomy posting to a T.

you can play your best I'm getting shot n1

+

I have already accepted that i will get n1ed

Although he speaks of "getting shot", it also fits with him being "weak" and intentionally targeting the scummiest player they can think of.

Again, it doesn't matter what he actually flipped - what matters is whether scum potentially saw this/thought of this/kept this in mind.

[UnaBombaH]

idk what’s up with people seriously overestimating me/scum!me, but anyway - this is literally the first time I even noticed pooky crumbing. I straight up thought saudade was VT the way he was playing

Then who do you think would be able to pull it off in this game?
I'm very much certain this was the deciding factor when scum chose to kill Pooky N1, and even if they did it to "frame Ducky" as FourEyes suggested, it would still require a lot of effort and understanding of the game.
One of the reasons why I'm continuosly worried that BuDucky is just scum here.

[UnaBombaH]

“Getting shot N1” /= “being weak” though. That would be stronger if he had said “I’ve already accepted that I’m dying N1” rather than “being n1ed.”

But you know, Saudade wasn't around for the end of the day.
And we also

NOW KNOW

he wasn't "weak-" anything.
But consider that in conjunction with those posts from Pooky towards Norwee, and I feel like it's very much something scum could guess/fear/ponder.

[UnaBombaH]

I think you’re capable as well.

I'm openly admitting that scum!Una could, and definitely would do something like that, but the circumstances in this specific game do not match up at all.

1) I would be leaving myself and my teammates open to a track from Nep N1. I'm open to bussing, but I hate being guiltied as scum, and would never risk that.
2) My initial read on those crumbs D2 was actually "weak doctor" (and I know it's WIFOM here and now), but scum!Una would've arrived at that same conclusion (obviously). And scum!Rolestopper!Una would NOT want to see a weak Doctor flipped N1 in a game where I was already committed to claiming my true role.

So while I COULD go for something like this as scum, I would not go for Pooky N1, but rather for their crumbed target.
Had I spotted these before N1 as scum, I would've wanted a kill on Ducky 10/10 times, leaving us with the assumption that either Pooky would've claimed a result on the player who is dead (easy to mislynch) or not claimed at all, and continued to crumb and give scum targets to kill.

[UnaBombaH]

SS said D1 that you’re town unless sirius (now froppy) is scum. I said I’ve been thinking about that post and maybe that’s right, that you’re scum with froppy. Then I changed my mind based on your N1.

OK, I guess this makes sense.

[UnaBombaH]

Why was it not just the mod getting rolestop and roleblock confused...

Well I guess this could be the case, but isn't that a bit silly?
It makes a hell of a lot more sense to me, considering that I knew what my action was and how it should've played out, that there was some sort of a miscalculation when resolving the night-actions.

Now we know that they initially got a "no result", which was then switched to "UnaB visited Nep".
Meaning that my action was initially not seen by Nep, but became visible upon recalculation.
What could potentially be misinterpreted in a way that stops Nep from seeing me?
A block from a 3rd party (=scum).

[UnaBombaH]

Or osuka thought that the definition of rolestopper meant you roleblocked nepenthes instead of making her ascetic, which blocked her track? I don’t understand what scenario of scum roleblocker leads to osuka resolving actions incorrectly.

This weirds me out...like a lot.
You really think it's more likely that a mod who knows the setup throughout just mixes up rolestopper and -blocker suddenly?
Rather than there actually being another role that could potentially mess it up?

I think it's a reasonable mixup if both roles are present in the game, and they had the same target that night.

[UnaBombaH]

Btw, if this is SvS^^ happening around me - bravo to the both of you!

And if this TvS, I'm going to be a happy camper when one of you slips.

[UnaBombaH]

I also thought rolestopper was the same as roleblocker coming into the game. To me it’s clear that under NAR, rolestopper resolves before roleblocker when used on the same target, because that’s literally what rolestopper is supposed to do.

Then what about a scenario where I was actually roleblocked? (not likely N1, but I think that might've happened last night).
In that scenario, my rolestop is blocked and there's no contradiction even if there might initially appear to be one.
It's not as black and white when you are resolving multiple actions, and we do not know the full role-list.

[UnaBombaH]

It has to be a scenario where osuka’s intepretation of the actions meant that nepenthes was blocked or you were rolestopped also.

I was just pointing out that having both of those roles might also

sometimes

provide scenarios that can be confusing upon first inspection.
I feel comfortable "locking in" that scum roleblocked Nep N1, and my rolestop was initially forgotten/not taken into account properly/whatever.

I'm actually quite intrigued by the fact that you seem adamant on scum NOT having a roleblocker..

[UnaBombaH]

I have to go to sleep now, but I can't wait to check this when I wake up.
I especially want to see how Ducky reacts to all of this.
It's gonna be a mouthful to chew for either alignment I guess, but I do think town!Ducky should have no more questions for why I'm so wary of them.

I also want to hear what others think of this lilith-FourEyes -back and forth.

[UnaBombaH]

SS said the same thing as me. I feel like it’s occam’s razor and the rolestop vs roleblock confusion is the easiest mistake to make.

Except I think occams razor explicitly points to both roles being present here.
I do not think mixing up -blocker and -stopper is very likely in itself.

But I guess that's not too relevant here - I'm off to bed now.

[UnaBombaH]

So I guess everything about N1 is just angleshoot and therefore means nothing and therefore I am either dense or scum for thinking that it might imply scum!Duck?
Whatever then.
Speculating anything about any of those things means nothing. Pooky crumbing anything means nothing.
I'm hereby declaring that anything I have said until this point should mean nothing as well, and therefore I should be dead-ass null instead of anything else.
The only way to play this game is to talk about what has happened during the day.
Everything else is posturing and speculation, and is not "playing Mafia".
Do whatever you want with the rest of this day.
It's not like anyone took up with the massclaim anyway.
I'm done trying for this game.

[UnaBombaH]

we could also just kill una

Sure, this is something that town!Ducky should advocate at this point of the game.

[UnaBombaH]

i could lolhammer this
so much power

It's still better than going for me today.
Like, A LOT BETTER.

[UnaBombaH]

I don't really think it matters what you flip. If you're town, scum will keep you alive until the end of time for the miselim opportunity. I reeeeeeeally don't think froppy giving up like that was towny though.

I normally try not to read much into replacements, but it actually DOES look like scum have possibly given up..

[UnaBombaH]

just realised joyed flipped

so it's lili and four gg

OK...
Aside from the tempo and drawn conclusions being way overboard compared to the time spent reading this behemoth of a game..I actually sort of like this read.
Not necessarily because I'd expect this to be correct, but because it's at least a little different.

[UnaBombaH]

i'm not actually coming @ u today i'd just like it to be noted 4 the jury that i wish i was

Because

posture

is important for your health..

[UnaBombaH]

OK then.
No one has continued the massclaim, and getting more VT-claims out of people who are at L-1 helps no one but scum.
Although I think they have a more firm grasp of what's going on than we do already, so I'm not sure if it helps them one way or another.
I think we just lynch the Sirius-slot until dead, and continue from there.

[UnaBombaH]

Wait, I've been dumb.
Why did I think one of IV/Froppy had to be scum?
Because I thought Ducky has to be?

[UnaBombaH]

Ducky+Lilith isn't a thing, or it's the absolutely grossest thing I have ever seen.

[UnaBombaH]

And S_S still just isn't scum.

[UnaBombaH]

N_M is town is FourEyes is town, but other than that, those two can still theoretically fling either way.
And N_M is as blank of a slate as I have ever seen. Again.

[UnaBombaH]

vanity guess is both scum in {una,iiii,iv} outlier of nm

Since I know Ducky has me here for totally wrong pretenses, I'm just reading this as his solve being "2 scum in 4Eyes, IV, ~N_M~".
I can see that, but if we mislynch today, we need to hit the right one tomorrow, right?

Having a scumread on me doesn't help my trust issues with his ablity to solve the game here.

[UnaBombaH]

ducky is locktown, i dont buy lili claim though, town informed is super rare

I'm not trying to be rude, but it's impossible to take you seriously when you haven't read the game.
Like, you just haven't.
And you continuosly mix up slots for what they have done or claimed.
Ducky is far from "locktown", even if he isn't as much of a scum as I'm painting him up to be.

I just have this feeling that I can't shake, and I believe Ducky was the one who wanted Pooky killed N1 - whether he dislikes my reasoning/speculation for the motives.

[UnaBombaH]

I can see that, but if we mislynch today, we need to hit the right one tomorrow, right?

nah we should be in 2v5 tomorrow

Yea, I'm not sure what I was counting.

[UnaBombaH]

Una, sell town!SS <3

Why don't you try and sell me scum!S_S after how D2 went?
ZombieRP was never going to be the #1 wagon right out of the gates without that "attack" from S_S.
And even when faced with that aggression, there was a claim that didn't faze his scumread at all or distract him.
If S_S was scum here, he could've used that for so much good distance later, and was in no way forced to bus ZombieRP that hard then and there.
If it was a bus, it was a silly one - only aiming for him to become lock!town and to try and win the game solo endgame.
Which would be an unreasonable attempt, because logically he is going to be killed before that anyway.
So it's more about S_S definitely not being scum here, than it is S_S being town.
But since we shouldn't have any 3rd parties or multiballs here (I mean, right??) it's basically the same thing.

[UnaBombaH]

why does being different = town from your pov though

this is bleh

Oh, and this?
This is once again complete shit.
I didn't say it was "town" from my PoV.
I literally said it was different, and I liked it.

I means that you didn't straight up copy it from someone else.
And therefore, regardless of your alignment, it might offer something to us.
That's all.

[UnaBombaH]

you either know me a lot less than you thought you did

or the misrep is intentional

I would never misrep you intentionally as town because I don't want to annoy you, and I'd never do it as scum, because I would never want to incite you.

And that's facts.

[UnaBombaH]

i think I get what you mean with the worsty paranoia but I think you’re overthinking it, i feel like you’re reaching a bit which does seem paranoia town!indicative rather than intentional scum!reaching

OK, how about you go read everything I posted speculating about N1?
If you don't agree with it - fine.
But if you don't see/understand at all where I'm coming from, then you can join BuDucky I guess in the "UnaB sucks"-club.

[UnaBombaH]

froppy + una almost makes sense but does scum!una take such a massive risk to save their partner by shouting about worsty?

If I were scum here, and my teammate was someone like that Sirius-slot.. I honestly wouldn't even know what I'd do here.
I''d probably make a complete clown of myself trying my hardest to flail around.
My other teammate would've been hounded down from the very start of D2, and my other teammate would be a Pokémon-Waterhose-whatever-ShellyNow.
#theDream

[UnaBombaH]

Ego here.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, this guy.

[UnaBombaH]

Una is just town, for like four different reasons.

And for like...four different seasons.. *teeheheeee*

[UnaBombaH]

yeah I noticed the lack of excitement and that was actually part of why I was scumreading you

I think I've been actively calling Ducky out for this..

[UnaBombaH]

actually you tried to call me out for n1 tinfoil nonsense lol

Just saying - if this turns out to have been the truth btw..you've created a monster of a man who will stick to EVERY paranoia-read I will ever make again.
Because I'm starting to let go of this one, but bah gawd if you flip scum here..

[UnaBombaH]

OK.
For now, I'm adding town!ducky to the list, and we work with the assumption this is gonna be "GGez" within two days or so.

[UnaBombaH]

Was a hammer? Was not a hammer?
If it was not a hammer, that interaction between shellyc and Ducky does not look good..

[UnaBombaH]

Oh stop it with you!
I'm jsut yanking your mucus.

[UnaBombaH]

Didn't realize our birthdays were this close to each other! O_O (mines less than two weeks away)

Habby Bday scum_BuDucky!

[UnaBombaH]

I think SS being so sure about zombie D2 indicates a N1 guilty but, as I promised, I will in fact be doing a complete reread and I’ll see if he left any crumbs pointing to someone else

Oh my.. Are we like actually saying things like this?
Did people ACTUALLY not understand that S_S most certainly had a guilty on Zombie?

Why the fuck did you think I rolestopped him N2?
I thought he might get another solid result in a row, obviously.

I didn't buy that "I reread Zombie during the night"-crap at all.
It was painfully obvious that he had a guilty of sorts, which is also why I was annoyed when Nep was the kill-target for scum.
And why I got stuck into that train of thought where scum!mastermind_Ducky had seen my crumbs and manipulated the night-actions accordingly.

[UnaBombaH]

Now, with all that behind us, I think FourEyes and IV are the two slots that need the most scanning today.
I holstered last night, so I'm either dead tonight, or we are fucked unless we land a scum!roleblocker today.

[UnaBombaH]

there is also something very, very concerning about SS' flip.

The fact that it makes a lot of sense with my claim and you still want to suss me?

If a 3-shot rolestopper uses his charges all in a row, that last 4th night shot can't be "protected".

Also the fact that if you want to call me a scum!rolestopper, it would mean that I protected a town!investigative N1 (confirmed by Nep) AND a town!investigative N2 (not confirmed obviously, but didn't kill/block S_S N2 either).
Now calling me scum with those night-actions is sort of dumb, but the remaining scum either have to do that, or kill me tonight.
We will see.

[UnaBombaH]

I holstered last night, so I'm either dead tonight, or we are fucked unless we land a scum!roleblocker today.

funny, i was thinking that too.

I'm sure you were.
If scum dodge a lynch today, I'm the miselim-target tomorrow.
Whether it's scum!Ducky or town!Ducky, IF scum can block me tonight there's like a 75% chance that both me AND ducky are around tomorrow to duke it out.
Hence, why I tried to poke at the idea that "we need to land scum today" YESTERDAY.

[UnaBombaH]

i'm ngl every time i start townreading una it starts getting really stale really fast

You just love the confrontation and excitement..?

[UnaBombaH]

okay, and who did you think was scum at the end of yesterday?

Well. Basically we agreed not to wrestle each other anymore with BuDucky yesterday, so I put that aside.
And once I put that aside, it leaves me with FourEyes/MWNN + IV/N_M.
I'm slightly leaning towards the direction that scum!FourEyes would not pick their teammate as "conf.town", but I'm not going to say that's never the case here either.
I do not think FourEyes was necessarily ever worried of being the lynch D1 - if you go back and check, I'm quite certain they claimed informed even before being on L-1.
Might remember it wrong, but someone did claim early.

[UnaBombaH]

like no shit isn't the whole point that we're trying to eliminate scum every day, it's not like we're out here just picking a random person and being like "YOU'RE TOWN BUT FUCK IT LET'S ELIMINATE YOU"

LMAO i was thinking this but decided to dial back the sass

Well fuck you both for intentionally misunderstanding me at every turn then!
What I obviously meant, was that yesterday was the day to ACTUALLY LAND THE SCUMMIEST PLAYER, instead of going for froppy ~because they hadn't done anything~.
If you can't understand the difference between the two, then I guess you don't have any very strong scumreads?

Now I already felt like IV was "spared" yesterday.
Either to make them the target for today/endgame, or simply because they are scum.
And I'd argue that both of these incriminate the people who were most vocal about flipping froppy.
That's my take on yesterday.

[UnaBombaH]

i'm like almost certain iiii thought he was goin down on d1

This obviously comes with the territory of townreading the slot. But even if the slot isn't explicitly scumread, I think their claim D1 was very neutral on whether they "thought they were going to actually go down".

[UnaBombaH]

I guess you don't have any very strong scumreads?

correct
i thought this was transparent :C

Well, at least to me it became clear the moment you started outing me as your top scumread.

[UnaBombaH]

especially given he would have decided to do it in like his first?? / second???? post.

I think this is stretching it a little.
He might not have decided to claim that right away.
His initial plan might've been to just come up with a defense, or just hope that people back off with some ~gutreasons~ provided.
The claim might've been an afterthought, especially if he came under questioning for having such a read too early.

[UnaBombaH]

But if you think of it like that, he might've just as well claimed later that "I've been informed that the worst is town".
NO ONE, and absolutely NO ONE here can claim that they got that #1. It was such a good "hidden crumb".
So if he hadn't outed it himself, he might've just as well gone with #2, even if it was a more obvious one.

[UnaBombaH]

And come to think of it, IF FourEyes is scum..there's like NO WAY that LavarManos is town.
What the hell were you saying earlier?
Like..why would scum!FourEyes ever plan that crumb FOR A TOWN-SLOT?????

[UnaBombaH]

Yea, they are either both town or both scum with that.

[UnaBombaH]

But if you think of it like that, he might've just as well claimed later that "I've been informed that the worst is town".
NO ONE, and absolutely NO ONE here can claim that they got that #1. It was such a good "hidden crumb".
So if he hadn't outed it himself, he might've just as well gone with #2, even if it was a more obvious one.

same post explicitly says that it's not about an australian tho

Only meaning that he could twist it either way if he wanted/needed to.
I'm not casing scum!MWNN here - I'm just saying that the crumbing alone shouldn't mean one thing or another towards town!N_M until MWNN flips green.

[UnaBombaH]

go ahead and blame other people for eliminating a slot that had like, negative town equity, which I genuinely thought was always going to roll scum. you were just shouting at duck the whole time and then decided that it wasn't a wagon worth pushing after all and dropped it. we're all doing our goddamn best.

Hey hey hey hey, let's not get into this again!
I'm not blaming anyone for that lynch.
I'm just salty that it wasn't lynched earlier, as in D1.
And most of the other nastyness was, once again, tongue in cheek and more about me rattling Duckys cage than an actual "fuck you".

[UnaBombaH]

honestly if it weren't for SS towncasing una I'd probably be scumreading him here based on interactions with duck yesterday.

..instead of scumreading Ducky no matter what. Yea, I got that yesterday.

[UnaBombaH]

I went and re-checked this further.

I would literally bet my life on LavarManos being town, by the way.

This was basically their first post where they actually committed to it.

Since with a hard pr claim I'm not drawing the night lol with my heavy cringing, I'll just out myself.

Informed townie N_M, and previously Lavar, is town. That's my usefulness. Elim me to make N_M IC, I guess.

..and it went all the way to this before they hardclaimed.
And unless I'm mistaken, they were at

THREE VOTES

when this happened.
Pooky, Billy and BuDucky. So not even close to being the lynch.
And even if I promised to ease my read on Ducky, this doesn't look very good to me either. Reaction to that claim:

hnerejjehfjejfnnmrmmrmmmrmmmmmm
VOTE: nor

+

claims for the claim god
i suppose i should have just trusted my intuition on four.

OK, whatever. But this was after Ducky had abandoned the Sirius-wagon I had been heavily suggesting.
Instead, they moved onto Norwegian. Nep and now FourEyes had claimed already.

hnerejjehfjejfnnmrmmrmmmrmmmmmm
VOTE: nor

hello and welcome to the good place

THIS IS THE BAD PLACE. CALLING IT NOW.

Then why not return to the Sirius-wagon instead? -_-

[UnaBombaH]

Meh.
Ducky is just scummier than anyone else to me still.

[UnaBombaH]

And no matter how much I dig in the past, I can't find a reason to scumread OR townread N_M.
So it's always about sorting MWNN first.
And like Ducky so accurately said - today it should be a lynch in "good faith" if at all.

I can imagine a world where scum!MWNN did this whole path of gameplay, starting from the crumbs and all, and initially toyed with the idea of claiming something else completely.
This is still the first time I'm seeing an informed role with the knowledge of someones alignment.
I've seen more along the lines of "this game has no Doctors" etc.
So even if he was informed, and more specifically informed scum, I was wondering what kind of info he might've had.
What if scum knew something like "The town!Cop is N1&N4 only" for example?
Just toying with the idea.

[UnaBombaH]

I can imagine all that ^^ but I do not think MWNN is scum here.

[UnaBombaH]

If lilith is scum here, she's terrifyingly good at it.
Meaning that she could be teamed up with almost anyone - obviously not N_M though - and it wouldn't make any more/less sense to me.
But she's also just likely town.
But if that's the same feeling I'm getting whenever I try to reread Billy..????
Then it's just IV and Ducky.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm honestly thinking IV should be lynched today.
I do not feel like risking it for the biscuit on a MWNN-lynch, because it would most likely mean that I'm mislynched tomorrow.
Upon IV flipping red, it would still require for others to come around on scum!Ducky, but I guess it's more reasonable then than it is now.

IV -> Ducky is my most reasonable solve for now.
MWNN -> Ducky/N_M is like the far far back-in-line 2nd.

We should try and have a discussion about Billy if ANYONE scumreads them here, and maybe see whether there's something to see or just townlock them universally.

[UnaBombaH]

though there's also the consideration that Una's role is negative utility

I was wondering whether you'd bring this up.
I'm honestly very disappointed if you somehow manage to convince others that I'm scum here.
My role makes perfect sense for town, not scum, and I've played it to further towns win-condition - not scum.
Scum having a roleblocker and me using my rolestop at the same time already creates multiple scenarios where there are "blocks" from both to our investigatives.
Not every game starts with a D1 that has a straight up claim for a PR, and then continues into a D2 with a more or less obvious "claim" for a PR-result.

[UnaBombaH]

Like, even just this - I can protect our "IC", or the claimed Informed, but our investigatives wouldn't be able to check him on the same night.
Just imagine if S_S had checked Nep N1 for example.
We do not have "too much power" considering the current way of how Normal games are balanced - town often gets a lot more than scum does.
My guess is a roleblocker+whatever Zombie flipped makes enough sense. (it was about hunting PRs right?)

[UnaBombaH]

IV and either Una/the worst is my best guess.

I think Una is a better chance, I know I'm town and if the town power is too high, it has to be his slot, then.

You are going at it the wrong way around.
The remaining scum are definitely in the VTs, since I do not think it's you.
But like I said, I agree on IV - the worst being a scenario.

[UnaBombaH]

i'm like almost 100% sure lilith is scum

You've actually been thinking this for a while right?
And just didn't want to straight up say it D3?
Or am I wrong?

[UnaBombaH]

Ok then.
Thought it might've explained some of your stances yesterday, if you were secretly scumreading lilith and wanted to see something happen there.
My bad.

Now IF lilith were to be 100% scum here - does that affect your read on IV at all?
I'm most reluctantly admitting that I also sort of dislike the fact that there's very little resistance to them being the lynch today.

[UnaBombaH]

i'm flabbergasted that you, in all your reading, don't seem to have embraced how transparent it is that IV is buddying me

Oh, I'm definitely aware of that.
And it's one of the reasons why I'm willing to say it's the #1 lynch-option for today.
Go see it from my ISO - I've called the two remaining scum IV-ducky multiple times already.
But then again, based on how they've acted anyway, it might just be them being scared(?) and looking for allies/protection?
Dunno. But the fact that you'd be throwing them under the bus today seems wonky to me.
And if you are town, then someone else still is. Ech.

[UnaBombaH]

Thanks bb.
But there's already so much tomfoolery going around that it's nothing to scoff at here imo.
IV buddying you, could just as well be "buddying".
scum!dissociating by the way of fake town!associations.
I originally had this same tinfoil-theory about your interactions with lilith, but decided against it.

If it's town!IV, I'm not sure if they'd try and pocket you without knowing your alignment - my interpretation of them so far suggests that they'd be too scared and paranoid.
Might be wrong on that though.

[UnaBombaH]

Do you think scum!IV would dare do that to town!Ducky?

[UnaBombaH]

Forming a 3-person PoE for me is quite difficult atm. Hear me out.

I'd start by removing myself obviously to make it 6 remaining.
Then, if you agree with me and accept MWNN as town, you also have to eliminate N_M on the side. Leaving us with 4 remaining.
And out of the four, I can't honestly say if I'm able to differentiate between lilith/Billy to leave one more "definitely out of the PoE".
Simply because I do not think either is scum, and the remaining two both are.

And this is how I've been approaching the solve for a while now, hence why I'm still thinking it's IV+Ducky and no 3rd slot is required in the "PoE".

[UnaBombaH]

If either of Billy/lilith flip scum here, I'd be surprised anyway.
Then again, I didn't scumread ZombieRP either and they flipped red.

[UnaBombaH]

una who is scum when I flip green

If you flip green today, I'm probably killed tonight to make sure that scum get to LyLo.
So I do not honestly care much for what happens next if we mislynch today..

If you flip green, the scumteam is gonna be something wild like ducky/MWNN or lilith/MWNN.
In the latter scenario ducky would be their poor victim tomorrow for the final mislynch after I'm dead overnight, and we would've basically thrown the game together for not trusting each other.

[UnaBombaH]

Wait a minute.
lilith with the postage.

[UnaBombaH]

.....aaaand it's over.

[UnaBombaH]

Wild spinball crackpot tinfoil hotshot -theory?
MWNN is scum!informed with the knowledge of "there's a town!Rolecop"?

[UnaBombaH]

what?

Nothing, nothing.
It just felt like you were going places and then you just immediately stopped it with that "I want to townread ducky so badly"

I almost got excited!

[UnaBombaH]

wild spinball crackpot tinfoil hotshot-theories are all I've got to make this game make any sense

Yea, and I'm like almost not-joking, but think about it.
If you were to be scum and

Informed

, and your information tells you that there's a rolecop about.
It would make sense to come up with a crumb for your actual role from the get go.
Did ZombieRP claim any crumbs for their scum-role?

[UnaBombaH]

and I think duck also admitted that he saw SS's post about zombie as a guilty? I'm not sure on that but if so, it makes even less sense for him to unvote zombie there

This x100.
I'm not really qualified to speak much about what happened D2 because I was busy with IRL and basically not around for almost any of it, but...

[UnaBombaH]

what deepwolves?

I'm honestly starting to consider that IV is ~just around~.
Because if I'm right about scum!Ducky, I do not think scum!IV dares to throw them under the bus here..right?

[UnaBombaH]

You're either the most adorable townie (who's admittedly a bit lost, right?), or you are a masterful actor, a true killer among killers and a master of disguises.

[UnaBombaH]

And I need to wash my dishes before going to sleep tonight.
I've been single for the past few years, and it feels like I can live with one plate and a fork for way too long..

[UnaBombaH]

Una has one read and my god will he not settle down until it's heard.

Well fuck me then, right?
I think I've found scum within the remaining playerlist, and I want to lynch the scum.
And the time of you taking defense in just calling my read on you "false" or "silly" should already be over - I'm not the only one who has arrived to that read on their own.

Idrc if he's town or scum atp, he's playing a scumgame.

Why? How?
If you talk mechanically, my play has been EXPLICITLY TOWN.
Tell me what my role is, if not town!rolestopper, and then tell me how my night actions make any sense.
You can't do that, because you can't paint me scum like that.
And therefore you have to devalue the emphasis on mechanics and night action -speculations.

I rolestopped a confirmed town!investigative N1. I openly crumbed doing it, I did it, and they got a result of me doing it.

And I was fking willing to go 1v1 with them D2 for giving a false result!
scum!Una hates one thing more than anything, and that is being guiltied during the night.
I would never risk my own game, OR MY TEAMMATES with a guilty result just because I'd want to "play my role".
Bussing > Being guiltied at night every damn time.

One of my fav tricks as scum is ramping up my NK equity then acting flabbergasted when I'm still alive lategame. I don't really think any of this is outside of the scope of Una's mechplay.

And this is just air.
I don't think there are many things "outside of my scope" in this game.
Doesn't mean I'm scum every time I'm alive lategame.
For example, I usually suck at LyLos and am often mislynchable all the way to the end by people like you.
I'm less charismatic, and that actually plays a huge role on this site sometimes. Way too big of a role if you ask me.

[UnaBombaH]

any thoughts on the balance of the solve?

What do you mean by this then?
If you are not talking mechanics?

[UnaBombaH]

You did ask MWNN, and I think he even gave an answer.
Not sure about lilith though.

[UnaBombaH]

thoughts on MWNN's answer?

Well.

it is lacking enough in conviction

Mmhm.

Truth be told, I feel like almost everyone here is going back and forth with second guessing themselves.
Some might say it's towny to be unsure, but it might just also be scum fence-sitting. (not necessarily MWNN, basically everyone else)

I feel like I'm the only one who has been able to come up with a duo that makes sense to ME, and I feel comfortable pushing to the end.
And yet I'm being called scum for it.
We can't even dream of a solve unless people settle for a read they actually feel comfortable with upon

SOME

reading/discussion.
Second-guessing all the way until the end gets us nowhere.

[UnaBombaH]

I am really really town here BuDucky.
I think you are scum and already know it ( ) but in case you don't - I really am.
If you are town, I am telling you that there is a solve where there's two scum in lilith/MWNN/N_M/IV/Billy.
A combination of two, in that group of 5. And we can't ever win this together if we can't find a solve there together.

If this is indeed a gamestate where we are both town and scum have managed to get us here without being obviously scum themselves - kudos to them.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm super tired, will catch up in the morning.

[UnaBombaH]

Ok then.
While I was busy with things, it seems you guys had a rollercoaster-ride for the whole family.

[UnaBombaH]

I tried to make a ~thing~ about all the votes going back and forth, but couldn't find a thread to really follow there..
Some of it is because of changes happening so quickly after the initial vote, and some simply because there have been multiple "surface-level 1v1s" just within this gameday.

It's really hard to "pair up" any two slots at this point.

[UnaBombaH]

Well, other than MWNN and N_M obviously, but that is like...almost too easy to do.
And I guess that's why it feels so uninviting still.

[UnaBombaH]

Billy still isn't as overwhelmingly experienced on this site as I somehow thought he was?
I'm thinking they are town, and I think this is exactly their "uninformed gameplay" on site.

Whereas I might say the same about IV on a quick glance in almost any other game, but since I'm heavily invested in this one myself, it feels like it could still be faked.
BuDucky seems to be sure though. Which also (obviously) keeps me guessing whether it's too obvious of a pairing to really be true.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm still considering just going for the Ducky today, but I'd like to see an official and accurate votecount first.
I do not think scum are on their buddies as of now - it really feels like the day could still go many ways and I'd argue that any scum would want to make it to a likely LyLo tomorrow.

[UnaBombaH]

If we flip Ducky, and Ducky is town, then surely IV is town as well..right?
In that scenario, scum will likely kill me during the night and there's actually 2 scum within MWNN/N_M/lilith/Billy.
And in that case, I'd almost want to beg beforehand that town will not let IV be lynched no matter what.

In the scenario where Ducky just flips scum today, and IV doesn't wave the white flag during the night..kill it with fire.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm considering a spicy version where we do not flip Ducky today.
Simply because I do not see lilith+Ducky being the team.
And even if I'm a goner tonight, lilith would most likely still try to steamroll Ducky to the ground so he'd probably get stopped tomorrow anyway..

[UnaBombaH]

i feel a lot more cathartic

You feel like you emptied your bowels?

[UnaBombaH]

Also, is that a last ditch effort to bus your buddy IV and go for some kind of a Hail Mary play?
You've been on the both far-ends on that slot so far, that I'm not even sure which version feels scummier to me right now.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm just intrigued by your actions right now.
I feel like if you are scum here, you are not necessarily panicking (not sure if you ever would), but you are definitely running out of paths to take if you really want to win this.
Your "efforts at trying to solve IV" would still fit well with you two being buddies because it would at least give him a chance to win if you go down today.

My biggest problem with that

is the thought that "scum!Ducky wouldn't come to this gameday with the thought of potentially being lynched".
I think scum!Ducky would be more confident in their ability to avoid a lynch today, and therefore gaining "distance" with IV makes very little sense unless IV ends up being the lynch today...but you really don't seem to want that.
Which then leads me back to the rabbit hole of "who else could be scum!Duckys partner here?"

[UnaBombaH]

Huaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhh.
I guess it's just scummy to admit that I just want this day to be over and be rid you and all the question-marks that you bring?

[UnaBombaH]

The only other option might be just lynching MWNN - I really dislike their "willingness to be lynched" here.
That would also reveal the "IC" within N_M if that's actually a thing, meaning that I'd have a simple target for my last shot and you'd probably find ME dead tomorrow..but at least you'd have an IC!
...who doesn't...do anything... -_-

[UnaBombaH]

That would actually just be a Jackpot though.
Lynching MWNN and getting a red flip.
They've been willing to die for such a long time, and we just haven't given them the sweet release of death..
Maybe they have a guilty conscience and it weights on them every day?

[UnaBombaH]

I'm a bit sad to hear that this is what MWNN feels..
And if this is AtE, Ducky was once more jumping off the lynch..

VOTE: MWNN - is this the hammer?

[UnaBombaH]

^^ This either lynched scum speaking to a townie, or a lynched townie speaking to scum.

[UnaBombaH]

I'm gonna protect lilith tonight btw.
#fuckBeingOptimal

[UnaBombaH]

You should know better than to comment on it BuDucky.

[UnaBombaH]

OH HELLO UNA
NICE ROLESTOPPING

WHAT ARE YOU GONNA COME UP WITH FOR US TODAY

LET'S FIND OUT HOW DEEP VENUSAUR'S ASS REALLY GOES

Well, I fucking rolestopped N_M.
What else can I fucking say??????????

Also, good morning to you too BuScummy.

[UnaBombaH]

And before BuDucky comes up with any stupid tinfoil-bullshit - I would've never protected anyone else last night anyway.
Of course I was on the only conf.town.
Everything that was said about it at the end of the day was obviously WIFOM for the sake of at least trying some mind games with scum.
Didn't bank much on it anyway.

[UnaBombaH]

And FYI worsty, you are the only reason I'm even alive still.
Because of all the paranoid and susssssss shit you have spewed about me throughout the game, the scum apparently still think I'm mislynchable/not conf.town enough to die before assumed LyLo.
And if that wasn't by design from scum!Ducky, town!Ducky and me are going to have a catchup after the game. Something like this can never happen again, no matter what your alignment is.

[UnaBombaH]

IV/Ducky is still my only reasonable solve, so...? -_-
I guess I'm going to wait and read what lilith and Billy have to say before pulling too much hair out of my head.

[UnaBombaH]

OK, so if IV were to flip town?
Then you + one lilith/Billy would have to make sense..

[UnaBombaH]

Oh wow.
I was making an honest write up on theoretical alternatives after that joke, and then you up and vote me like that in LyLo.

[UnaBombaH]

Because I'm in no rush, unlike you seem to be?
You are scum to me, and I have made it clear to everyone in here.

The team is IV/Ducky, and you have just made it clear that we begin with you today, instead of IV.
Doesn't make a lick of difference to me.
I guess you are trying to win it today by 1v1'ing me here, and even when you go down today, IV might still have a chance because of how obviously you protected him yesterday.
I'm just counting on lilith/Billy to see the light here.

VOTE: the worst

[UnaBombaH]

Yea, well.
If we lose today, one us HAS played very poorly no matter what.
And you know me - after the game is over I am willing to admit my own faults.
But until the fat lady sings, I'm refusing to consider a world where I'm wrong here.

[UnaBombaH]

I really feel like most of your annoyance is stemming from the fact that you weren't "caught" as scum in this game per se.
You were more or less PoE'd and pushed to the corner instead.
And even my scumread on you doesn't feel justified - I bet.
You feel like I was paranoia-reading you as scum, and then it was just enforced by the PoE of me townleaning everyone else..
I'm also certain now that you were the one keeping your night-actions in check - you have a roleblocker, and you knew that once I outed my role D2 and modifier later I was going to be lynchable at endgame.

That misunderstanding at the start of D2 really played to scums advantage.

[UnaBombaH]

One more thing - I'm certain you didn't ACTUALLY even want me dead yesterday.
Not only was it near impossible because you knew I had a shot left, and I had to be given the "chance to use it", but also because had I been flipped yesterday, you would've been a goner today 100%.
Meaning that IV would've been left alone in a LyLo where you were flipped before him -> almost certainly town lynches correctly there.

This way you have a shot at winning because of how much influence you have over IV, and the fact that lilith might "prefer to trust you over me".

[UnaBombaH]

Well, I'm certain you can't call me a mechanical scumgod either, so..

[UnaBombaH]

I hope that once you flip red we can just chill and laugh about all of this later..

[UnaBombaH]

Hey, I know!
If you selfvote and wave the white flag today, I will change my avatar back to being Venusaurs ass!

[UnaBombaH]

i have no idea why you're so fixated on this idea i've been pUlLiNg ThE sTriNgS

Well, it's rather hard for me to reconsider anything today since you are voting me in LyLo..? Not sure how town!Ducky would act differently..

And when I say that you have been a "PuppetMaster" of sorts here, I just feel like you'd be the more experienced and confident scum remaining in this game, and therefore also the "guiding hand" for your buddy (*cough* IV *cough*).
Guess it hasn't been as much fun for you since you've been feeling some pressure?

[UnaBombaH]

i've been frustrated since long before i was even a consideration for elimination?

Yeah, and it would actually make even more sense with this.
Scumteam of ZombieRP-Ducky-IV.
Ducky knows who Zombie actually is, and likes that player, right?
So he dreams of a magical game where they get to go ham together until the end.
Then S_S comes and guilties Zombo, leaving Ducky to care for the family alone..IV as his protege..and uneasy lies the head that wears

a crown

the boots in the family..

[UnaBombaH]

the game isn't over
I'm finally right
hoooooly fuck

Well, you are sort of clearly scum so the game shouldn't be over yet anyway. And I also see that you have racked some more posts up so maybe I should take some time to post as well, although I feel like it should be better for town to have the other three players sort it out.
If I'm being "fair" and take myself out of the equation for a second - one of us is going to be talking shit anyway, and therefore already might be "WIFOMing stuff" in preparation for tomorrow.
So if Billy/lilith/IV are able to talk things through amongst themselves, I feel like we have a better shot at getting not only todays lynch in order, but also the last one we need for tomorrow.

[UnaBombaH]

if worsty and I are scum we would’ve probably just killed una

, it’s like his only read and he’s a PR

Other than that probably killing NM seems like the most reasonable play for any other team, bc una is not conftown

oh
yeah

killing una like on night 2 would have worked as well

if there's a rn I'm surprised they wouldn't have just camped nepenthes lol

THIS IS IV CLAIMING SCUM WITH THE WORST, IN CASE LILITH/BILLY DIDN'T REALIZE THEY ARE THE TEAM ALREADY.

This is a very obvious setup that has been clearly talked through and coached to IV.

Why would they ever kill me N2 after I had claimed?
We now know they have a roleblocker to counter me (last nights result confirms that).
BuDucky here says that scum!roleblocker would've camped Nepenthes , right? Why?
They had to kill one of me/Nep, and Nep was already the one who had a result, and that was on me.

They killed Nep to set up this road that we are still currently on - the one where you have a decently powerful claimed PR alive in LyLo and Ducky can use a throwaway-line to question why I'm still alive.

It was also painfully obvious that S_S was a PR as well after that guilty on Zombie, so they had to start killing from somewhere - can't control three PRs anyway, and even two needs a kill+block.

[UnaBombaH]

Una has been posturing the same scumteam for 3 days and taking a break only while others push miselims. like at what point have you gone "oh yeahhhhhh una is definitely town with nearly no doubt"

I am the only one who has committed to a read/solve and now you are pushing

THAT

as scummy?
Seriously though, any other you would be obv.scum for almost anyone else simply because you have been yoyo'ing around like hell.
Just think about the Sirius-slot and how that even went.

I wanted that slot gone since D1, and OPENLY ADMITTED that it was for taking out an inactive slot.

Scum!Una would've been happy to keep that around until the end.

But it was scum!Duck who actually started jumping around, and if you go recheck D1, you can see that the worst is the reason why Nep ended up claiming -> MWNN ended up claiming etc etc.

Now Ducky is going to claim that I'm a douche for putting it all on him, but scum!Ducky got everything they wanted from D1 and more.
They still managed to get a lynch with very little associatives (at least NO ONE HAS RETURNED TO THAT WAGON MUCH FOR MATERIAL, because the whole day was a mess) and they got multiple claims from townies.

[UnaBombaH]

If you think I'm scum over some pseudo lurker whose entire game has been 1) fakeclaiming rolestopper well, 2) deathtunnelling some shitty solve without stopping to reevaluate or attempting to stop any miselims (WHICH HE WOULD THINK ARE MISELIMS IF HE BELIEVED HIS SOLVE) you need to go back to the newbie queue or town of salem

Now this is just rude and blatant Ate..

[UnaBombaH]

I'm gonna make a Ducky-quote:

oh worsty how I wish we were scumbuddies this game

iS tHiS DiStanCe?!?

[UnaBombaH]

Damnit dude if you're scum this game, you're a dick, cuz this is soke low shit.

But I think im townreading this.

And like I said, there is at least one scum in you and Una's 1v1. So if youre town, he's scum.

That's exactly what he wants.
Scum aren't always going to try and please you in every way just to make you vote for their 1v1-opponent in LyLo.
Good players like Ducky do shit like this ^^ where they appeal to your emotions - all of them if need be - and make you second guess your

logical

reads on them.
Do not let him sway you with shit like this.
If he ever makes you reconsider this, just think back at how this game has gone.
I got the most significant result, the only one that really matters, N1.
NEPENTHES CONFIRMS IT.
After that I haven't been able to make a difference with my role. Why?
Well obviously because I had to claim D2.
Ducky has been planning to pull me all the way here for a mislynch ever since then because he knew they could just roleblock me if need be, and all our other PRs basically outed themselves very early.

THIS HASN'T BEEN A HARD GAME FOR HIM

- he has just kept talking about how hard/annoying/boring/stupid it has been, to deliver that emotional strike to players like you.

[UnaBombaH]

at a meta level this kind of mindset is starting to annoy me like, are we all so lazy we either lose games to decent scum or resort to getting so frustrated that we're bordering on trust tells? but whatever i'll talk more about this postgame. my strongest townread this phase is lilith and it's principally for conscience reasons. i think i blew my scumrange a while ago principally because i'm really frustrated. i also don't think i can actually graze this sheer
postcount as scum. but a part of me wants IV to be scum just so he & una have actually manipulated something. if it's una/billy and i've just accidentally snowed them by exploding into a spectacular firework of townspew this is gonna be a pretty pyrrhic victory.

Also this. He says he "blew his scumrange" by posting so much and being "this frustrated".
The only reason why Ducky is putting in this amount of work into the game is because he has been building for this endgame ever since D2.
The game is maybe starting to wear on him, but of course he's not going to just give up and let the victory go easily!
Postcount means jackshit here, frustration - real or not - means jackshit here.

[UnaBombaH]

townread me because i'm townier than the confirmed scum i'm voting.

Like wtf????
Now, not laughing, actually HOW?
"confirmed scum" how?
If you insist on talking about "confirms", I have literally the only

confirmed

town-action in the whole game.
Nothing about you is confirmed to anyone other than me.

This is you, again, trying to affect Billy into voting.

[UnaBombaH]

Someone needs to tell me scum!Una's role. The reason I hardtownread him was because he was a confirmed pr. And clearly he wasn't a roleblocker because nep got her result. So we got a claimed pr with no detail. Do we think this was a 2 rolecop setup and he rolecopped her n1 to clarify? Like what plausibly makes sense there for a scum role?

I'm a town rolestopper and Ducky knows it.
I crumbed that role as early as D1.
I was never going to claim anything else.
And he's afraid to push me as scum!Rolestopper anymore because he KNOWS that it makes no sense here anymore.

If "scum!Una" rolestopped Nep N1, I literally risked them guiltying a teammate - protecting Nep from a block AND kill at the same time.

That is bullshit, and Ducky knows it.
He also knows that I have said multiple times in previous games that I almost exclusively only crumb/claim results that are actually there, because I want people to trust my crumbs in every game I'm in.
Even when I roll scum I try to do that every time.
So okay, town!Ducky knows and would admit that I'm a rolestopper here, instead of going off the rails again like

i don't
give
a fuck
what his role is
he's scum for dayplay and i'm gonna kill it

I really want a recap for this "scum for dayplay".

[UnaBombaH]

Do I think that his hammer on MWNN was great? No, I had been coming around on townreading MWNN at the end of day as well. But it took 4 people to kill MWNN, and 2 of those people were lillith and ducky. So like why is IV so invested in using the fact that Una homered as a cudgel?

Because IV has either realized himself or is being told by Ducky that this is still winnable for them today!
They can already feel your legs trembling, and they are certain they can swing you today.
All you have to do is keep calm and vote Ducky.
Then realize the game hasn't ended yet, and tomorrow make sure that IV eats the rope instead of you.
Lilith will likely hold the hammer tomorrow anyway.

[UnaBombaH]

He's clearly got some sort of pr. And whatever pr he had targeted nep on N1. And it wasn't a roleblock. I think that means a much greater chance of town than scum.

This will never get you anywhere with scum!ducky..
You can't argue with him, and he will just keep calling this ridiculous because that's all he has left.
I already did my part of talking about mechanics and night actions D3 I think it was(?) and that's also when I got stuck on scum!Ducky.
And all he had then was calling it stupid, irrelevant, whatever to make look stupid, feel bad and dumb, and to get the spotlight off of him.

[UnaBombaH]

what's preventing rolestopper from being a scum role?

Again, this is the only avenue I am "accepting" as a point of discussion.
I am a rolestopper. That SHOULD be obvious to town!Ducky, but he still refuses to talk about it ~bEcAUsE hE dOeS nOt CARE!_!~.
But the fact is that IF I was a scum!rolestopper, I would've essentially

MADE SURE

that Nep gets a result N1.
It might feel insignificant now because S_S happened to get a hard guilty N1 on scum, but if that hadn't happened, the scumteam would've most definitely killed me earlier too.

[UnaBombaH]

he lolhammers mwnn while vocally pushing a scumteam of tw/iv : )

I wouldn't consider my hammer on MWNN a "lolhammer" when you think about the fact that he selfvoted and then everyone stopped for a hot minute to wonder whether he was "actually" hammered or not.

[UnaBombaH]

Sorry I’m not actually advocating that una is scum atm, I’m just more baffled that billy hasn’t considered at all that una could be scum

But you are still closing dangerous waters with scum!ducky.
Now I guess I don't have to tell you what he's capable of, or how endearing he can be as either alignment.
Just don't get influenced by his AtE, and whatever you feel like doing, just do it.
This game has dragged on for long enough, and I do not intend to be his torture-patient in this LyLo for any longer than need be.

[UnaBombaH]

don't use your nice guy status manipulatively una. there is like a 0% chance i'm going to roll over here.

Out of the two of us...MY "nice guy" status?

[UnaBombaH]

you're fakeclaiming claiming a town protective role and were widely townread my dude

And you had the info and the tools to stop me my dude

[UnaBombaH]

thank you for admitting you noticed SS was a power role

You agree that I noticed that D2 though, right?
It was pretty obvious, right?

[UnaBombaH]

what about your N1 result is significant at all? why is it town indicative rather than scum indicative?

It makes all the difference in the world if you believe I'm a rolestopper.
I just want Ducky to admit it, but he won't because he knows I have been playing this game as townPR!Una.

My biggest crime is focusing too much on nightplay and my own role instead of actually obv.towning in the thread, but I haven't been "blatantly" scummy based on my dayplay either.
That's just a narrative from Ducky.
And I also admit that I got pushed back too easily on the earlier days when I was actually talking about my growing suspicions towards Ducky.
I didn't feel good about being called dumb etc, and actually fell for that defense instead of piling on.

Outside of those two aspects, I do not think I've made any "scummy moves" or played too poorly.
I think our problem as a team here has just been incohesion. We never really "gelled" as a town, so we just ended up throwing around singular scumreads/townreads and then moving on if it didn't stick.

[UnaBombaH]

OH YOU WEREN'T SURE IF HE HAMMERED
SO YOU STOPPED RAMBLING ABOUT YOUR PERFECT TW/IV SOLVE FOR A SEC
TO HAMMER HIM AGAIN
GREAT WORK UNA VERY TOWNY

Because you didn't vote for him?
Calling the hammer scum when that lynch still required so many votes..oh man.
Pot - Kettle, etc.
And the man was SELFVOTING for crying out loud.
I wanted that slot out, and my only mistake was thinking that MAYBE scum wouldn't have a roleblocker after all (I was told so by many people D2 when I thought it was obvious based on that mod-mistake).
I admit that MWNN flipping green -> N_M becoming obv.town was good in my eyes as well, because I felt like protecting that slot last night was going to force scum into killing me instead.

But you obviously already know this, because you planned for it the whole night phase.. -_-

[UnaBombaH]

you're probably a rolestopper. ok. how is that significant? how is that town indicative?

Well obviously not the role itself, but the action I took is.
The one thing I hate above all else as scum, is being guiltied.
And not just scum!Una being guiltied, but

ANYONE OF MY TEAMMATES

being guiltied.
I absolutely hate it - despise it. And I've been vocal about it ~somewhere~ in my recent and also my not-so-recent posting history, but I couldn't find it upon quick search.
But it's there - this is not a made up meta-thing.
That's why I would never use my rolestop on a claimed PR to make it absolutely sure that they get a result, and risk my team getting guiltied.
I would rolestop my teammates 10/10 times to keep us safe, and just kill the claimed PR.

Bussing is a completely other thing - fakeclaiming and using my roles creatively are other things.
But I would not explicitly make certain that a town!PR gets a result N1.

[UnaBombaH]

also pretty sure I called you out for scummy dayplay earlier.

Well, then I guess my own assessment of my own dayplay is poor and biased..?
What can I say?

[UnaBombaH]

I'm a rolestopper, and targeted Nep last night.
So there's that.
I have modifiers that I'm not going to out yet so that scum can't abuse it, but I've said enough for reasonable people to see where I'm coming from.

The only way Nep could've been roleblocked, is if I was roleblocked first, and then they were roleblocked separately.
So nope.

BTW, this post should also be painfully obviously town.
Why would I out my result as scum!Una here?

[UnaBombaH]

you're fakeclaiming claiming a town protective role and were widely townread my dude

And you had the info and the tools to stop me my dude

i haven't been sure til now

Like you are "not able to plan" these LyLos or night actions?
You are unable to notice my crumbs, S_S being a Cop and IV being scum?
It's easier to just deny ever seeing or knowing things, than to actually acknowledge them and come up with townreasons and trajectories for your actions WITH those things acknowledged.

If we were to believe everything you have said to have missed/not noticed/realized, you would be a poor player, blind and stupid.
And just to make sure this is not a burn or a mean slam at you -

you are none of those things.

[UnaBombaH]

like this has been a remarkably hard game for town and you're brushing it off like we should have known what was happening all along or something?

Wait what?
Of course this has been a hard game for town.
But you are not town, so..? Was this some weird faked perspective slip or what?

[UnaBombaH]

i'm basically saying he's spamming night action WIFOM instead of playing the game.

Like this is why I hate LyLos as town.
The scumteam always has so much room to weave their stories and perspectives.
They also have had the luxury of time, because they are essentially the ones who can decide who to bring along.
For example - assume that the scumteam decided to bring along S_S instead.
They kept blocking him until the end, and we have this same LyLo, but S_S <-> Una.
Now we would have Ducky calling S_S scum, and saying that S_S bussed his buddy D2 to gain a ticket to LyLo, and that he has been unable to get any more guilties for us.
He says that I keep spewing night-action WIFOM, but in the end it's scum who are WIFOMing the results to discredit me.
Because they have to do it.
Think about why N_M died.
If they killed me instead last night - who gets lynched today?
I'm willing to bet that barring a "lol!vote@LyLo" from N_M, it's either IV or Ducky. (both scum btw)
But killing away the only ACTUAL conf.town leaves us with the slot that can still be discredited.

[UnaBombaH]

Dunno, Ducky is able to do the same thing to me as Boon is.
I just don't even feel like arguing with him/against him.

[UnaBombaH]

All I can hope for is that Billy isn't swayed by any of this.
I'm afraid that lilith might be.
And to be honest, I wouldn't be losing to a bad player, it's just that I hate losing at all.

If either of you two vote for me, it's over immediately.
If one of you vote for Ducky, the game will not only continue, but it will force IV to either bus Ducky or become obv.scum for tomorrow.

[UnaBombaH]

You should be..?

[UnaBombaH]

Like, just imagine the day ending with you selfvoting and IV pissing himself in your PT..

[UnaBombaH]

I would love it if we could like do a calm discussion about why/how my dayplay has been scummy in ways that your hasn't.
But it's not possible because you just keep saying I have nothing but WIFOM-arguments, and you keep throwing out AtE and shade yourself.

You haven't scumcased me any more than I have scumcased you - in fact I have been calling you scum for your pushes and weird changes in trajectories for some time now but you just discredit all of them because you can't answer them.

[UnaBombaH]

current mood una/IV is a stronger solve than una/BP don't @ me

You had that road to victory still available until you decided to vote for me because ?? today.
I was actually expecting you'd be willing to bus IV today to win it yourself tomorrow, which is also one of the reasons why I was taken aback by your vote.

[UnaBombaH]

you're not like, able to focus on structuring your narrative of IV/me being scum and instead you're focusing on why it would be craaaazzzzzyyyyyyyy for you not to be a rolestopper

It's because I don't have a "narrative" for anything. I'm just trying to make sense of trajectories and the presence people have had on wagons and pushes.
Yours have been worse than your actual level of play should provide - I think you just admitted it yourself?
But just because you admit it now, doesn't mean you are town saying it in regret. I'm saying (and have been saying for days) that you are scum, and this time around you really just struggled with your narratives and ended up waffling around.

I'd love to scumcase your play here but you stopped playing mid D2/early d3 and started blatantly tunnelling me while trying to get town elims. :/

So what you're saying is that you don't...have a case?

[UnaBombaH]

But hey, as much as I like you Ducky, I'm not going to spend my 30th birthday here spinning the yarn.
I just hope lilith/Billy won't drag the game on for too long unless they really need to.

[UnaBombaH]

anyone who can't tell I've laid out the case for why you are scum is blind or not reading on purpose.

Quote it for me then.
All I've seen that's been dayplay-adjacent is my hammer on MWNN, and I don't regret it nor think it was scummy at all.

[UnaBombaH]

oh my god I'm so angrey I didn't see the cake

happy birthday lovely <333 I got you a present but unfortunately it's just a scum loss :*

Go lick a Meganiums ass..
'cause you ain't getting the good stuff anymore.
(no really, thanks )

[UnaBombaH]

(I'm reading these with interest, but will reserve my comments/answers for later. I'll let him finish first so that anyone can just read these in a row if they feel like doing so. but if anyone thinks I'm going to do the same thing about Duckys ISO when there's a close to 800 post difference in quantity.. )