Mini 1836: Space Mafia (Game Over)

[grapes]

tails means no rvs, which implies that is a serious vote so is that a serious vote?

VOTE: TwoFace

Why are you asking a question you already know the answer to?

[grapes]

Yea two face is taking the accusations too seriously.

Wagon harder please.

[grapes]

Are we out of RVS already?

We are now.

VOTE: Toto

[grapes]

What makes you think we're seriously trying to kill you?

[grapes]

@Toto

[grapes]

Well you talked about how you were at L2, and you don't want to keep your vote on a non-serious target.
So what's a "serious target" then?

[grapes]

@Grapes: serious = non-random

So if the wagon on you isn't random what do you think it's based on?

[grapes]

So what's a "serious target" then?

SO... why are you asking a question you should already know the answer to?

Oh Twoface.

[grapes]

Because it was just a misunderstanding - hopefully now toto realizes what I was trying to ask him.

[grapes]

Because it was just a misunderstanding - hopefully now toto realizes what I was trying to ask him.

what you are trying to ask him actually doesn't make any sense

I thought that it did.

Like if you think that there's serious votes out there and the only wagon is on you I'm wondering what gave him the impression of seriousness.
Does that make more sense or was I just trying too hard?

[grapes]

I hope that answers your question.

Certainly does.

You have any questions for me?

[grapes]

and hi grapes

what's up

[grapes]

VOTE: grapes

Ain't no grapes in space.

http://winefolly.com/update/iss-reveals ... ter-space/
Not yet, anyways.

Well aint that some shit.

[grapes]

I can tell this is going to be one of those games where everybody townreads Zach

I'm not townreading really.

[grapes]

him*

zach, do something town

[grapes]

Grapes can't be mafia that would be a STATISTICAL ANOMOLY and I won't stand for it

I'm town.

[grapes]

Did you get coached...? This doesn't really match up with your previous posts

How so?

If somebody coached him to do that then they suck. I'm going to wait for a VC before I vote but yeesh this game has a weird start. Maria and toto have both pinged me out. Dunn's thing about zach was stupid. I like getting early townreads but you guys are making it impossible.

pedit: nice...

Which posts from them pinged?

[grapes]

i'm going to learn hard town on toto right now.

Why?

[grapes]

VOTE: Grapes

srs vote

Go on.

[grapes]

How so?

Went from looking like a vi to knowing exactly what they're talking about

The way they talked was different along with what they were saying

I think you may have a point here.

And yea I'm already voting him.

@Toto I asked if you had any questions for me. Did you ignore me or do you not have any?

[grapes]

Why I'm voting you, for one.

[grapes]

Like I don't care how new to the game you are town just naturally have more situational awareness than this guy.

[grapes]

It's not that I think that people should always care why they're being voted/scumread.

This disconnect is that there are things a town!toto should be wondering about.

I wanna know why he's not wondering.

[grapes]

I think it's too early in the day phase to wonder about that.

Right that's fine. I don't think anyone's been unfair to toto, though. I'll echo your sentiment earlier that he should just do his thing and try to be more transparent with us.

It's just, like you remember opening your first town role pm don't you twoface? Day 1 start that threda unlocked I was hounding people non stop i wanted answers. You vibe a little bit with what I'm feeling about him now? Let me interact with the guy you don't gotta take care of him he seems like a smart guy.

[grapes]

maria why are you townreading me?

[grapes]

maria why are you townreading me?

I don't townread you.

whoops meant scumread*

[grapes]

does anyone have any reads right now?

I have some super weak townreads and I feel a little weird about toto.

[grapes]

@Dunn, why do you think Grapes is town?

This is a good question.

[grapes]

VOTE: Dunnstral

[grapes]

Naomi is also a good vote -- but I don't really think she scumslipped.

Like why are scum less likely to pay attention to colors? They're not. It's null.

But her readslist made me twitch and like ASP said, voting a null read there looks cautious.

[grapes]

hmm not sure if i'd agree with that sentiment @grapes

Are you gonna vote dunn?

[grapes]

Also why are you pushing massive for faux-psychology but disagreeing with me saying that it's not a defacto scumslip?

[grapes]

maria who's scum?

[grapes]

I think if I was, I would be voting him. He's being his usual fuckboy self but we share a SR on Toto.

I think toto towned up a bit and dunn feels prickly and stern to me give the iso another look when you get a chance.

[grapes]

maria who's scum?

If I had the answer to your question I'd be voting them.

Why is it impossible to have a conversation with this person?

lol

[grapes]

Bad reaction

[grapes]

Dunn seems to agree with Grapes and somewhat defensive of her. Not sure why she is reading her town so fast, therefore my question above.

Please point out where I am defensive of Grapes and "agree with them"

You seem to agree I'm scum. I can not find any reference to a post where you say 'I agree with you Grapes' if that's what you mean.

On the defending, I apologize because I thought I remembered something about this, but it must have been the interaction about grapes in space.

Also, can you answer my question, why do you think Grapes is town?

I think you're scummy. You'll note that you haven't even been taking up my primary attention

Your only basis for seeing a connection between me and grapes is that we both think you're scummy on page 7

I'm townreading Grapes because I've played with them where they were mafia before and I think they're town so far into this

Scum talking to town.

[grapes]

He's town.

Which makes your push on him all the more bad.

[grapes]

It's okay to townread me now yea.

[grapes]

gerry is scum too.

[grapes]

@Nos

What's your read on me?

@massive

Pretty meh on you as well. What's town about Dunn's asspulled meta-read on me again?

@Naomi

You still think I'm scum? Any other scumreads? Best townread right now?

@Zach

Vote dunn.

@Toto

I don't think Twoface's defense of you was scummy fwiw.

@XK

I disagree I'm finding myself having to use all my power to

not

just townread Naomi naturally. But when you filter out the lamist stuff, content doesn't feel super genuine.

@Dunn

Why are you still voting zach? You should know he's town by now.

@gerry

Your "tough guy" post made me laugh. Gonna let you live for today.
If you're having trouble on finding solid reads, possibly try a reread? There's enough to get a good grasp on most people I feel. That massive vote was lame as heck like at least sheep me on scum!dunn if you don't have any place better for your vote man.

@pip

Super meh on maria myself but I don't have any problems with your push there atm. I think her post where she townread naomi but didn't prop it up felt sorta town maybe? Either way, I think we should be focusing the pressure on naomi and dunn because nobody outside of them is giving me any sharp cause for alarm.

[grapes]

Neither it just doesn't feel like an accurate representation of my game. Yes the fact that I don't think Dunn thinks he can actually peg me this early has a bit to do with it.
But "make people relax around him" doesn't even make sense and is just some bullshit he made up after toto had to ask him about it twice.

[grapes]

Very nice post selection, ASP.

[grapes]

Matter of fact.

VOTE: Naomi

[grapes]

Actually, explain to me how you can be on my case for thinking Zach is scum and you're town over the course of the game, when Simple Plan has 2 posts and only looked at Naomi

Temptation to vote you again is very strong.

[grapes]

Classic "why me" scumpost.

[grapes]

Classic "why me" scumpost.

i really hope you aren't serious

I am.

He asked me why I'm reading him differently to someone with 2 posts. Straight up scumplaining.

[grapes]

Okay why are you arguing with about one detail that you don't agree with about why dunn's scum when
1) Your vote's there
2) I've got scattered additional reasons why he's a scumlord this game on the very last page and even more in my iso

@twoface

[grapes]

Wait you wasn't talking about me there?

Correct.

[grapes]

And every one of those thoughts also has a counter to it


It's OK to admit you're wrong, you know?

That's also part of the problem.

You're trying to disprove every negative

opinion

I have of you while parked on zach and doing nothing to push him.

You aren't approaching this game from a town mindset.

[grapes]

Why's he scum? Should seem to think I'm one of the more important people to sell. And you havent' tried.

[grapes]

Pretty sure I can safely say Gerry flipped town
But knowing me I'm gonna take back that statement 2 days later right Gerry!

don't try and pocket me.

Also holy hell this is an awkward interaction.

[grapes]

You're not gonna sell me on you not being scum by trying to sell me on you not being scum.

[grapes]

You're missing the point entirely, though.

Sure, town can why me. But they don't tend just compare themselves arbitrarily to a lurker when they're smart enough to realize exactly where the distinctions already lie between how I'm reading the two differently.

It's done less to shed light and more to make a point and get me off his case, is what made me found it scummy at worst and not worth responding to at best.

[grapes]

I'm talking about what we've been tlaking about the last page now holy banana muffins.

Actually, explain to me how you can be on my case for thinking Zach is scum and you're town over the course of the game, when Simple Plan has 2 posts and only looked at Naomi

this
It's also bad because he's trying to shade asp but not really committing to a read.

[grapes]

Simple plan has 2 posts and only looked at naomi

sorry is that implying you think he's town there?

[grapes]

This is black and white.

No, it's a bit more grey.

No, no, this is black and white.

You do you man.

[grapes]

This thread is painful to read.

Pip, you're scumreading zach for stuff he does regardless of align.

[grapes]

Naomi, looking forward to that big readslist!

[grapes]

Alright guys.

Gonna do this.

Gonna read this shit.

[grapes]

Okay So.. Grapes asked me for an update. so.. here is another read list

Toto
<Pre-Iso*> Eh... kinda forgot about them
<Post-Iso*> Ah this guy. yeah I'm getting more Greenish reads off them now, I like there read list and how they took the time to go over the game. There comments seem fair and to be coming from a more !Green focus.

What about toto's reads do you like? Like which reads do you agree disagree with?

I'm really not a fan of you giving town-cred out so easily with regards to it looking like he's going over the game. That's very null.

A Simple Plan
<Pre-Iso*> The guy who's only notable thing was a wall of quotes;
<Post-Iso*> The guy who made 2 posts so far about 2 days apart I dislike them right now. The long gap between posts makes it hard to get a fix on them as any number of posts may changed there opinion on the game between points A and B. There comments also lack focus only really rail roading me for things I can't really say anything about. I don't wanna Red! read them as its kinda omgusy but its hard not to as there comments keep coming after things have resolved so have little to no risk and he doesn't go deep into those things (taking the one post other than the quote wall as basis for this) I hope this improves.

I can sympathize with wanting to give into the OMGUS feelings.

But in this case, I feel like ASP has given you every excuse to scumread him and it looks like you do but also don't want to. His push on you isn't very great at all and I'd be on him about it if it wasn't a read I resonate with.

TwoFace
<Pre-Iso*> I think he has been pretty good, posting every now and then nothing stand out in either direction. but thats kinda cool with me right now.
<Post-Iso*> Eeehh.. nothing bad nothing great very middle of the road.. Very Slight greenish? I feel that reds would made more of an effort to push something with his level of post frequency.

This read doesn't make sense to me because Twoface has made a number of pushes so far to my memory.

And also it's usually scum who... don't like to get their own hands dirty but I believe it's null in his case.

grapes
<Pre-Iso*> I dunno how I feel about them. a little opportunistic could just be brashness..
<Post-Iso> I'm still a bit on the fence after my ISO read. there are a few things that I find a little scummy such as the simple plan vote 440 441 and then on a later post 486 he implys that Simple plan is scummy. I can see him Scum reading me based on how he looked at my stuff though. I'm just thinking its a case of him not playing with me before so.. takes a while for him to switch to understanding how I play. But then there are greenish things like this request for a read list. which was a good idea and something good for the game as it gives more content. So i'm just rather on the fence about this entire thing.

The things you're scumreading me here for make sense. (except i wasn't saying asp was scummy i was showing dunn why his post implied that)

The things you're using to waffle with haven't happened yet.

Like, have I demonstrated that I've gotten used to "how you play" so far in?

Why is asking for a readslist townie?

MariaR
<Pre-Iso*> Pretty much what I expect out of MariaR will be later in the game where I can work her out.. so yeah
<Post-Iso> Sigh.. Okay one of my stronger green! reads. MariaR has played with me before and understands sorta how I act/play the game and If she was !red motivated I feel she would be taking what would be a nearly free lynch on her part. The fact she stepped upto the plate to defend me just confirms her Green status to me. as there is no major !Red motivation for doing so.

She's town because she thinks your town. Am I getting the gist of this paragraph here?

Dunnstral
<Pre-Iso> Still think they are probably Green
<Post-Iso> Wow.. this massive tunnel..

voted Zach page 66 and still on him 600 posts later XD

but placing that on the; NAI Pile lets get back to the ISO ... urgh.. Okay.. not so keen on them now :s I think there reactions are just too.. aggressive? like i'm reading this as a player who was hammered (metaphorically speaking) but a Red player last game so hard that I broke and started ignoring them whenever possible.. and it seems like he is reading both his Red picks mostly on meta, which is cool and all... but at the same time I feel like he ignored the meta for the game we just finished that he modded.. I'm wondering if he read the main thread now.. as I feel that if he was reading along he should of had more of a Green vibe only the color thing standing out, which he ignored anyway. I am curious to know what his thoughts on Red!Maria is in relation to his previous play with them compared to this game though.

@the bold - And I'd like to know what your thoughts on the push actually are.

Let's circle back to Dunn's "I'm green" post. What is he

actually

doing with that post?

[grapes]

Like at the very least it was implied that itlepip would be a policy lynch for "doing nothing" lumped in with ASP and Gerry but that's not even true

I get pip's read on dunn now.

[grapes]

Zach's entire play has been gimmicks that was my whole argument. Either his thing with Dunn which has no basis in the actual game or him jumping on massive early.

Sorting a person you play almost every game with isn't a gimmick.

Look at both of their processes. The path they took on their reads of each other. Zach actually had a path to speak of.

[grapes]

UNVOTE: Naomi-Tan

VOTE: gerryoat

Distraction.

[grapes]

You can lynch me, but unfortunately that won't prove anything about Naomi.

VOTE: Twoface

Distraction.

[grapes]

(Naomi Twoface)
(Gerry Xk)
(Dunn grapes Nos Toto)
(Massive)
(Pip Zach)

Dear god.

[grapes]

Naomi you responded mostly to the stuff I didn't really need a response to.

But yea no. Dunn's "I'm green" post was bad because it's tossing shade at you while trying to ackwardly town-tell and not really coming out with a stance on it until far later on despite

asking

why you thought town was blue reaks of scum waiting to manufacture a stance on something.

Just, like, don't townread him for stuff like that and we'll be all good.

[grapes]

VOTE: Dunn

[grapes]

When I scumhunt. I look for interesting posts and weigh the town-motive vs. the scum-motive.

There just happens to be a lot more reason for you to make that post as scum.

Town motive is to let everyone know you know how to read your role-pm.

Scum motive is to let everyone know you know how to read the OP.
Let everyone think that Naomi may not be green. Ponder it a moment (this is the shade)
Ask about it again.
Pages go by and still no read given on Naomi.
Massive reacts to it right away with a clear stance.
Then you use that as leverage. While pushing zach (he's using the same leverage)

I think with him it's more forgivable, because he didn't find it interesting that Naomi said blue in the first place.

[grapes]

Yes that is almost certainly a potato.

[grapes]

TwoFace (1)- gerryoat
gerryoat (1)- Xkfyu
Xkfyu (1)- Naomi-Tan

Not voting (1)- TwoFace

Can we do something about this?

[grapes]

Massive post strats;

How I read it the first time.

[grapes]

What's your read on Naomi?

[grapes]

I wouldn't really call dunn a consolidation lynch. He's been a scummy scum-butt this game.

[grapes]

Yea but is that worse than jumping from one vanity wagon to another 2 days till deadline?

Have you asked pip why he thinks dunn is town?

[grapes]

Good entrance.

Those happen to be the wagons right now btw.

[grapes]

Well 2 of them.

[grapes]

These reads are a). pretty darn good and consistent

Disagree wholeheartedly. What's town about stagnant reads anyhow?

[grapes]

Kinda doubt pip's scum with dunn and don't really support a wagon there regardless. Like I said earlier I think dunn just tickled his town bone a bit and now he's pocketed.

[grapes]

@Panther

Dunn wagon isn't a runaway. It's had a lot of time to bubble and build up. Which, doesn't make it definitely on scum but it does make me more enthusiastic about it.

[grapes]

Are space neighbors actually friendly?

We will find out soon.

VOTE: Mariar

Dunn, your best play is to bus this.

Would also vote Nos. 1383 is bad and his vote was the worst on the dunn wagon regardless of dunn's alignment.

[grapes]

As for itlepip, most obvious deadline wagon on town I've seen all week.

[grapes]

MariaR - I feel they are green given our previous games. so.. meta.

Wonderful.

Suppose you're no longer here but if you are why not put your vote on nos if he's your scumread besides dunn with the most votes?

Would you vote maria to get a lynch?

[grapes]

He won't.

[grapes]

A better way to "fuck me over" would be to do something that looks remotely town motivated.

[grapes]

By the way zach isn't scum. Game just finished where we were buddies, completely different aura here.

[grapes]

finished a game*

[grapes]

Twoface you down to lynch maria?

We've got 5 fucking hours.

[grapes]

The votes are all concentrated on people who've claimed a PR and someone I'm strongly reading as town.

You see my problem here.

There's enough time for people to get online.

[grapes]

VOTE: Dunn

[grapes]

I love being right.

Doesn't happen much but when it does.

HNGGGGG.

[grapes]

VC 1.22

Dunnstral (4)- grapes, Toto, Nosferatu, Naomi-Tan

itlepip

(4)- gerryoat, PantherPunt, Zachstralkita,

MariaR

Zachstralkita (1)- Xkfyu
Naomi-Tan (1)- massive
gerryoat (1)-

itlepip

Nosferatu (1)- Dunnstral

Not voting (1)- TwoFace

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Voting itlepip up when he's been obvious town and forcing him to claim was SCUMMY

It's no wonder my pals Zachstralkita (Who I've been pushing as scum all game, look at that) and Pantherpunt (Who I've ALSO been pushing as scum with Zach, look at that!~) are both on this together

I got u Panthstral

VOTE: itlepip

Died.

[grapes]

gerry you're talking to confirmed scum.

get with the program.

[grapes]

Naomi, there's no way you could think I'm scum. Nobody else in the game gave you a chance.

Vig and friendly neighbor in the same setup doesn't make a lot of sense to me either but meh. I haven't played an SS game before.

[grapes]

All I got was a daystart pm.

[grapes]

Especially after town nolynched

[grapes]

I'd lynch Naomi if not dunn.

[grapes]

Why is it not equally likely that we'd want to trade, naomi?

Your thought process makes no sense.

[grapes]

I dunn's town then gerry is probably scum.

[grapes]

Who are you talking to?

[grapes]

Panther, I'm town bro.

Haven't really read your stuff on me. But it looks like you actually think I'm scum. Just letting you know I'm not.

I can't really read gerry. But his push on dunn, looks pretty scummy and disjointed. It could be a bus, it could not be.

Still think dunn's scum by play. He's done a good job today, as either alignment honestly, of making me rethink shit. Nothing he isn't capable of, though.

I wanna say XK's heart is in the right place. But I don't know where the confidence comes from that dunn's town here.

Zach has kinda faded into obscurity. Don't really get a sense of what his world is. He should correct this and talk to me when he gets a chance.

Maybe I'm just OMGUSing on Naomi but I still don't really think her defaulting to grapes scum over dunn in this scenario makes sense.

Roleblocker kinda makes sense from what we've seen so far. Friendly neighbor doesn't really fit that well, though.

[grapes]

This game's hard man.

[grapes]

Circling back to day start, though. A LOT of people were really ready to setup a false dichotomy with dunn and I. Is that the town reaction?

And I was quick to jump the gun on him being confirmed scum yea, but I think that that just makes it more likely he's scum and already knows I'm town.

Still our best lynch today I believe.

And after tossing it around in the old hollow skull gerry might just be scum with him. THAT'S the dude acting like he knows dunn is scum here more than everybody else who's keeping an open mind on shit.

Not sure on a third. Probs like massive/nos/naomi - one of those.

[grapes]

Roleblocker kinda makes sense from what we've seen so far. Friendly neighbor doesn't really fit that well, though.

Why does roleblocker make sense?
And what precludes friendly neighbor from making sense?

There's a vig and a tracker for sure. And maybe a friendly neighbor. Scum gotta have something.

It just doesn't sound good with vig. Vig shoots people in the scumpool/mehpool. I'd play friendly neighbor about the same.

[grapes]

Panther, I'm town bro.

Haven't really read your stuff on me. But it looks like you actually think I'm scum. Just letting you know I'm not.

If you haven't read my stuff where do you get that it actually looks like I think you're scum?

Look, I was townreading your predecessor slightly. I haven't took issue with your stuff. I skimmed your points on me and figured "well, this person probably genuinely wants me lynched"

And like, I don't know, I'm not really the mislynch scum would angle for here I don't believe. Could be wrong. Meh.

[grapes]

Huh?

That's more than enough to get a slight read on.

Is this really what you're interested in atm?

[grapes]

Xk why's dunn town?

[grapes]

That's more than enough to get a slight read on.

no it isn't

Yea it is.

And what "slip"?

[grapes]

now i am doubting dunn is town but still would rather flip gerry/grapes first

p.edit - the one that was pointed out earlier and I made a comment about a slip right after. couple pages back i think

Pointed out where? I probably missed it.

[grapes]

Grapes. I believe its a roleblocker. given both your reactions. but if that wasn't a thing then I'd go with You being Red! its far more likely you lied about not getting his pm than him making that fake claim.

Why is it not equally likely

that we'd want to trade

, naomi?

Your thought process makes no sense.

explain what this means and what you're saying here

I'm saying why does naomi's mind go straight to grapes scum; when I'M the one CCing Dunn's claim to have visited me. Who has less reason to lie there?

How is this a slip booger brain? He's asking me a fucking question.

[grapes]

That quip you quoted from zach there is pretty bad now that I'm looking at it.

[grapes]

This game's hard man.

It's almost like everybody is ignoring my reads

Can't imagine it's hard to tunnel on me, leave for 2 days, then say some inane stuff about how I'm scum when someone else is getting lynched

Alright you've been scumreading panther. My b.

And after tossing it around in the old hollow skull gerry might just be scum with him. THAT'S the dude acting like he knows dunn is scum here more than everybody else who's keeping an open mind on shit.

Not sure on a third. Probs like massive/nos/naomi - one of those.

Why are you trying to pair me up with Gerry?
Why aren't you voting Gerry if you think he could be scum?

Are you scum with Gerry?

Because his push on you is bad but I think you're scum.
Because I think you're more likely scum.

No.

Lol.

What am I suppose to be seeing here man?

[grapes]

I pushed you day 1 before any of this shit happened you recall.

And your zach push stems back to meta that I didn't find accurate but if you've developed since then I'm interested in what you have to say.

[grapes]

I pushed you day 1 before any of this shit happened you recall.

Because I was pushing Zach. Who is very likely scum.

This is also the reason I visited you
You said I was "prickly" as your reasoning for the push though.... ok

Man if you're gonna just discredit me then I'm wondering why you're so sure I'm town like...

...You realize there was more than that.

zach's been off my radar for a minute.

[grapes]

17. The Mafia have unrestricted daytalk in this game.

Is there any way we can use this? I expect mafia to be more... coordinated?

What are you getting at here exactly?

Who seems uncoordinated?

[grapes]

Zach who's scum?

[grapes]

Grapes, what is your read on Toto and why?

I'm not really sure anymore. I think if you're town him immediately putting us into a false dichotomy after I CC'd you doesn't look all that good. I was townreading him most of Day 1.

I've fallen out of touch with this game.

@twoface - you do realize dunn and I could both be town yea? Like holy balls vig needs to shoot harvey if dunn/gerry both flip town.

[grapes]

I meant more coordinated than usual. I'm just wondering if there any techniques to scumhunt daytalkers.

Mmmkay.

But you expect mafia to be more coordinated. I'm wondering why your expectations aren't being met. Try again.

[grapes]

I am.

[grapes]

Well it's different for me.

I had the kid lock scum all day 1. And *I* didn't get something that he said he sent to me.

Nobody else really has the same perspective to go at dunn here.

pedit: @toto

[grapes]

UNVOTE: gerryoat

VOTE: grapes

Don't be bad.

[grapes]

Twoface why don't you think RB could be a thing?

[grapes]

Who the fuck else would they use it on?

[grapes]

Yo votes on me or so fucking bad please guys.

[grapes]

Toto could you go back and answer my question last page please and thanks.

Why am I not more sympathetic to your line of thought? Hmm.

Maybe because, in my world. I'm me. I'm town. I'm the motherfucking that didn't get a PM from the mod.

You're a third party observer ready to fall off both sides of the fence.

That's the difference.

[grapes]

UNVOTE:

[grapes]

Twoface why am I scum?

[grapes]

Twoface you're sending me a lot of mixed messages here.

[grapes]

Why's dunn scum again?

Why can't we both be town?

[grapes]

Which question I haven't answered?

I'm the guy that sees that you vote Dunn after he said he visited you. My only (uninformed) conclusion is that one of you is lying so one of you must be scum. Why is that so different? and why is that hard to see? three people posted similar thoughts after me.

If scum really role-blocked Dunn they don't need to send me to explain town the whole situation. They would just wait and be happy for us to kill each other.

I wanna know why you decided to quote the OP and say you expected mafia to be more coordinated. At a time when we were doing a bunch of rambunctious things, I thought you may have been referring to specific reads with that. Go more into why your expectations aren't being met.

But now that you understand a roleblocker existing would create a situation where we could both be telling the truth; you're still trying to push that one of us is scum. And my push on dunn comes from a place of already knowing my own alignment. Your voting him after I voted him shadowed that too great an extent. I understand that you may have pushed him a bit yesterday, but it wasn't anywhere near as loud as I did.

Your conviction doesn't line up for me here.

I don't even know what you're trying to say with the last line.

[grapes]

huh? You were just pushing me

Shuttup and let me recalibrate in peace.

Am I not allowed to ask why he's SURE one of us are scum and is giving reasoning on neither of us?

And is voting gerry?

[grapes]

I think he's scum.

[grapes]

Full disclosure. I haven't been giving this game 100% attention until just recently. That should be obvious.

@Toto
I doubt your reasoning now because I've broken out of my confbias tunnel on dunn for the time being. My "mistake" was being caught up in wanting to be right on the thing I stood for the most this game. And thinking that dunn was being a cheeky scumfuck. I thought I had him.

Yours was one of opportunity and zero paranoia.

[grapes]

Never lynch Xk.

[grapes]

VOTE: Toto

[grapes]

He bleeds fucking town.

[grapes]

Guys seriously let's lynch this^

[grapes]

gerry at least might be bad town

Toto's just scum.

[grapes]

[grapes]

And why's that not an alarm bell for me if I'm town as well?

I like to take in the gamestate and refresh sometimes.

[grapes]

OH WOW

SOMEONE CHANGED THEIR MIND

[grapes]

STRING EM UP!

[grapes]

Let's have a vote then, nos.

[grapes]

Yea because nothing happened in 400 posts.

[grapes]

Toto isn't scum

Gonna need a why on that bro.

[grapes]

I think I get now how town!dunn + scum!grapes could work. UNVOTE: Dunn

Grapes is still my top scum read. I'm also ok with Zach today.

Yea I'd back down from that too after last page.

[grapes]

I've been prodded wow where does the time go.

Everybody's thoughts on a toto lynch?

I'd compromise on gerry.

[grapes]

Dunnstral (1) - Zachstralkita
grapes (1) - Toto

Not voting (2)- Naomi-Tan, gerryoat

Can we do something about this please?

@gerry/zach - Would you be willing to vote toto?

@Naomi - What are your updated reads?

[grapes]

One, that's only one question. Two, you know completely well I'm not talking about actually trading something with him.

You are a troll and you are a scum please direct yourself to the nearest rope.

[grapes]

I'm talking about the fact that CCing dunn sending me something means that if I'm scum lying about it and he flips town I get lynched for it. Hence "trade".

Like, we've been over this already. Conclusions were jumped to.

[grapes]

I targeted itep cause he was my scumread

:/

[grapes]

Damn this means Gerry is probably town. Mafia wouldn't block and kill the same person

He could be lying? He could just be the maf blocker if there is one?

[grapes]

So this means scum within gerry/dunn almost for sure, though.

Or am I going crazy here?

[grapes]

VOTE: Dunn

Beep beep.

[grapes]

Gerry either fakeclaimed the roleblock onto someone who's dead.

or Grapes is mafia.

How's that fence treating your ass?

[grapes]

The first quote is pro usage of "mister disappointed in site-meta"

The second one is healthy paranoia and trying to figure out what's more likely going on here.

[grapes]

Could dunn/gerry be a bus? That thought has cropped up in my brain more than a few occasions.

[grapes]

See guys, dunn is scum. He's just shading me and throwing out shitty omgus votes now. Asking redundant questions.

Where's the solving?

[grapes]

VOTE: grapes

Like, there's no way you're shitty enough to vote me over gerry here.

No fucking way.

You're not retarded.

[grapes]

Meanwhile if gerry is a town roleblocker, which, meh, kinda makes sense I guess. Then his tunnel on dunn starts to make a lot more sense.

[grapes]

Why doesn't that make sense?

[grapes]

Friendly neighbor and town roleblocker are different roles.

[grapes]

Classic "why me" scumpost.

Oh now I remember grapes. He could be scum. This post was horrible

Twoface are you scum?

Like you're on some next level dumb shit right now -- who reads someone based on one post.

I explained to you why my thought process there isn't as immediately mundane as you'd like to make it out to be.

Fucksake we're not lynching me today. Dunn should have been lynched a while ago.

[grapes]

Like if dunn's town here; it should be no question. He knows gerry is bullshitting about being a roleblocker because scum and town aren't both gonna have one.

[grapes]

But he votes me...

Been town as fuck all game.

Gerry makes a weird PR claim.

Now he's waffling and voting me again.

And hasn't explained his scumread on me outside of taking potshots and throwing shade.

Not a town mindset here IMO.

[grapes]

Nope I'm not scum.

Then please remove your head from your ass and think about shit because not a lot of what you're saying makes any sense to me at all.

[grapes]

Dunn either thinks I'm scum; or thinks that there's a scum roleblocker.

He's been on gerry's ass all day. Gerry claims town roleblocker and that he blocked a claimed PR.

But now I'm scum despite him townreading me all game. Even though I called him confirmed scum at one point.

He knew I was town when that shit went down.

[grapes]

Basically my question is, why now?

[grapes]

I'm Town Roleblocker. Which is why I think Dunn is mafia as I doubt both town and maf have a RB. You guys are fucking morons lmao

Okay.. happy with my vote now. There is no valid reason a Green! Aligned player would roleblock dunn. There is 0 reason to prevent a person being confirmed town.

He blocked pip actually.

Which is fucking dumb but I could see town doing that if they had a scumread on pip but it's just such atrocious play that I'm not gonna defend it further.

Whether pip died or not is irrelevant.

[grapes]

When did your scumread on me develop specifically?

Like, when I was pushing you the strongest you kept me at arms lenght.

I back off and give you some space and pursue other shit; then you start squirming around like a scumfuck trying to get my lynched.

What's up with that? Let's clarify the timelines here.

[grapes]

I don't give full attention to people who I think are scumfucks.

We might just be omgusing each other.

I'm waffling on gerry yea but dipshits are hard to read.

[grapes]

Naomi/dunn makes a fuckload of sense tbh.

[grapes]

Okay what the fuck

No really what's your actual reaction to all of this?

You've been super lame day 2.

[grapes]

VOTE: gerry

[grapes]

Why would we lynch outside the claims when there's quite obviously too much power claimed so far for it to all be town?

You guys think town has a:
Roleblocker
Tracker
Friendly Neighbor
Vigilante
Bodyguard

That would eat any scumteam alive.

Twoface calling gerry confirmed town is either scum or really bad town. He's not even accounting at all for the fact that gerry could be
1. Lying about being a roleblocker
2. Lying about who he targeted if he's a scumblocker
3. Telling the truth as scum

It's like he doesn't have any paranoia or something. Plus his vote on me is trash.

Could lynch that today tbh now that I'm thinking about it.

[grapes]

VOTE: gerry

If this flips scum, vig twoface/lynch him

Why?

[grapes]

I missed his claim what did he claim?

[grapes]

I'm also just asking because you really think gerry and twoface are buddies?

I've had that thought. But it seems less likely than other combos.

[grapes]

What's the name of that role?

[grapes]

This is a normal right? Not a theme, so.

[grapes]

I've never heard of an archaeologist and I mentioned theme games because it sounded a bit like you thought you could coast on claiming that you're

"that role where i learn who people targeted the night they die"

So if you KNOW gerry targeted pip (presumably because you know that pip didn't visit anyone when he died; meaning that he must have been blocked) then what does that really tell us?

[grapes]

Who else would scum block?

Do you think dunn or pip was more likely to be protected?

Scum can action + kill yea?

[grapes]

I'm also just asking because you really think gerry and twoface are buddies?

If you're town

And I'm town

I think it's likely

What does both of us being town have to do with twoface and even gerry?

[grapes]

So imo town and scum both have a blocking role or one of grapes/Dunn is lying. Given all the claimed roles it's possible scum has a blocking role

P.edit - scum would have blocked Dunn if they have a blocking role. He can confirm himself so blocking him makes people doubt his claim

Protected by who?

Yes I think the rules say they can action and kill

Yea no shit it's possible scum have a blocking role they probably do. Why can't it be gerry?

Who's the more valuable kill between outed roles was my point. Who's scum gonna be able to mislynch the next day based on stuff. I'd lean towards dunn just because *I* was townreading pip and scumreading dunn.

But now that I'm thinking about it that wasn't really public consensus. Plus dunn isn't easy to push trust me.

Did I mention this game was hard?

[grapes]

Maybe it's a scum jailkeeper and town roleblocker

LOL

pedit: ss gave us another 48 hours

[grapes]

Oh wait nevermind.

That's a pretty shitty circumstance that we've been placed in at no fault of our own like, it's a fucking holiday and the site just went down.

[grapes]

VOTE: Dunn

[grapes]

gerryoat (4) - Naomi-Tan, Toto, Dunnstral, Nosferatu
Dunnstral (2) - gerryoat, grapes,
Xkfyu (1)- Zachstralkita
Zachstralkita (1) - PantherPunt
Naomi-Tan (1)- massive
Nosferatu (1)- Xkfyu
grapes (1) - TwoFace

Not voting (1)-

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

lol

Nos you're a turd

All those bad vanities though.

[grapes]

So how does a non normal role exist in this game?

I am very tempted to vote naomi.

[grapes]

Wait is massive scum?

[grapes]

No it's not.

Town doesn't have that many power roles especially now that twoface is in there as well.

Ball up and lynch the scummiest claim.

[grapes]

Because all the other claims I need to stretch to fit scum motive to. Except naomi's kinda but just because it's a weird thing to claim out of the blue.

Dunn's is easy -- didn't wanna get noosed.

[grapes]

I'd vote zach to get a lynch.

I'm probably hammer the first L1 I see.

[grapes]

Panther we've had this conversation before but in less broad terms. Dunn didn't get lynched because you give people a night to prove a confirmable role.

Guess what he didn't prove it.

[grapes]

Not a fan of the gerry wagon anymore because twoface/gerry don't fit on the same scumteam at all. I also dislike dunn buying into that so fast because that seems like the less strenuous world to push for him atm.

[grapes]

If dunn's town; it makes way more sense for him to push me as scum then gerry.

In other words.

[grapes]

Because in his world, a scum roleblocker exists. And gerry blocked pip. Unless twoface and gerry are a scumteam.

Or pip didn't submit a track.

[grapes]

I'm not leaning Dunn. Given the two leading wagons I'd vote gerry over Dunn; horrible to say as you'd like to believe roleblocker would be more valuable than a friendly neighbor but gerry isn't invested in the game and can't be trusted to actually do anything in the town's best interest.

Sell me on Zach.

Massive, why does Dunn's mind go straight to the twoface/gerry conspiracy theory when he knows that it's far more likely he was just blocked by someone else?

[grapes]

We've got an hour.

[grapes]

Well don't leave your vote on gerry at the very least.

Are you resonating with what I'm putting down about dunn at all? Because this feels obvious to me now that I'm looking at the grand scheme.