Mini 1316 - Last Will Mafia IV (Over)
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VOTE: Malee for flaking on one of my past games (lost in the crash ofc).
Malee is last on my will for the aforementioned reason.
DDD, if you think asking for the last person in a person's will is "useless information," then why did you ask the question in the first place?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 29, Rhinox wrote:In post 27, Lastsurvivor wrote:DDD, if you think asking for the last person in a person's will is "useless information," then why did you ask the question in the first place?
oooh good point
Rhinox, do you always BS your way through RVS like you are now? Or is this just how you play your scum games? (srs question)
Most of your "scumhunting" so far has been related to DDD. By that, I mean deflecting his question back to him and this post above. What do you think of DDD, Rhinox?
DDD, good answer.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 42, Rhinox wrote:So I agreed that you have a good point and you accuse me of BSing? Thats kinda a low blow. I'm going to completely ignore your obviously loaded question even though you tagged it as a "srs question"
I didn't expect much less.
As for your "analysis" of my "scumhunting".. A) its still early in the game, I haven't considered anything I've said to be serious scumhunting, moreso just trying to get into the game and get out of the RVS and stuff, like everyone else.
So you get out of the RVS by making fluff posts? This is your first real post that I'd consider to be content, ftr, and it's defending yourself. Also, don't say you don't post fluff, because when I posted last, a majority of your posts were fluff.
I don't think anything about DDD right now,
Nothing at all? Strange. So even though I made a good point about DDD, according to you, you think absolutely nothing about him?
and C) as for "deflecting" his question, lrn2buzzword kthx. I answered his question, which is directly opposite of "deflecting". Asking him to answer his own question is not "deflecting". Usually when people ask questions in the RVS, they answer their own questions. DDD didn't provide his answer right away, so I asked him for his answer. And now for my big finish, a snarky and obviously sarcastic mocking of your "attack" against me:Lastsurvivor, most of your "scumhunting" has been misconstruing what others have said. Do you always push BS like this? Or is this just how you play your scum games? (srs question)
This is so adorable. <3
UNVOTE: Malee
VOTE: Rhinox
@Alice: It is a RVS vote but it was my first post so...eh. If you want to accuse me of placing an RVS vote during RVS then I guess I'm guilty.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 51, Rhinox wrote:So all I really get out of that is you wanted to make sure someone else was going to support voting for me (fishy) before you would vote me yourself.
I was waiting for you to reply to my first post before I voted for you. I don't give a damn who votes for you before I do. But nice job trying to discredit me just because someone else happened to find you scummy and I wasn't at the computer immediately after you replied.
LOL at making a big deal about "fluff posts" less than 24hrs into the game, while its still RVS time, and not everyone had even posted yet.
I find this interesting. I'll say why later.
(lol harder that you think defending myself is a scumtell)
Did I ever say that? :3
DDD asked a question, that was obviously just a device to spark conversation about something. Not a town or scum tell. It was a good point (not a strong point or a scum point) you had but it says more about you than DDD. DDD gave the expected answer. thus, I am not leaning town nor scum towards DDD (or anyone) right now. Not enough information yet. Anyone that thinks thats a problem 24hrs into a game is either rediculously naive or scum.
But see, it was much more concise to just say I don't think anything about DDD right now, rather than a useless paragraph that amounts to "I don't think anything about DDD right now".
The paragraph tells me a lot more than "I don't think anything about DDD right now," so ty. If you don't think anything about someone I want to know WHY, since DDD has actually posted after all.
In post 49, Lastsurvivor wrote:This is so adorable. <3
There it is, the definition of deflecting . We're gonna end up friends, I can tell already.
Okay, here's what I was referring to earlier. If you think that what I posted was reflecting (which it really wasn't since what you confessed that what you posted was just snarky gibberish anyway), then isn't you just saying "LOL" to my points definitely reflecting?
Um. Anyway, Rhino, are there any players you do have thoughts about? They don't have to be solid (we aren't that far into the game after all), but you've gotta have some alignment indications.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Hm. Rhino's ok for now; my vote's staying because he's the best option atm though. Just gonna reply to a few things...
Rhinox wrote:You certainly implied that it was a negative thing that my first real post (as defined by you) was defending myself.
To clarify, it's just a null tell for all the reasons you provided. Obvs you can't help that your first meaty post was defending yourself if you got attacked. The only reason I mentioned it was because defending yourself is really iffy content. But yes I can see how you'd see those implications etc etc.
Rhinox wrote:No, my last sentence, which I separated from the rest, was snarky gibberish. You chose to ignore/lump in the part about me accusing you of buzzword scumhunting by saying I deflected DDD's question (which I didn't) and using it as part of your justification for why I'm scum. Deflecting is when you ignore/make light of/minimize/etc points or questions you're uncomfortable addressing. I did not deflect DDD's question, but you certainly did deflect the point I was making about you.
Yeah, I wasn't using deflect in the buzzword context. Deflect was the wrong word there, might have been thinking of reflect or reciprocate or something. Basically a word that means to turn the question back to him. If you look at the context of the sentence, you can tell I didn't mean the buzzword at all.
And good answer @ the last bundle of paragraphs. And I totally understand what you're saying about my forced questions but you have to understand that that's exactly why I ask them. I'm seeing what people make out of the little information we have.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Rhinox:
Rephrase: Iffy content compared to other content (questioning players, providing reads etc.) it's still content.
And there's nothing wrong with asking him to answer his question. I never said there was.
In post 66, kortul wrote:I did a quick reading of thread anyway, to submit initial Last Will, so may as well answer two questions that i've noticed. The last name on my will is Alicewondering - i don't know him/her, and his/her presence in this game is practically null so far. And from the player list i know DDD (completed a game together, that is lost in a crush), hiplop and 4nxi3ty (playing in other games with them atm).
How do you know hiplop? And what do you think of their play so far compared to their play when you last played with them?
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VOTE: Sleepless Assassin
Mainly because of the "you seem on edge" accusation he threw out towards fish, and the lack of justification. Here's his justification for reference:
In post 60, Sleepless Assassin wrote:Fish, I don't knoow, it's just a vibe I get from your posts. And I don't remember what I saw from malee. Let me ISO after this post.
Rhinox, id love your vote if I can get some solid reads at some point.
Throw out an accusation to look like your scumhunting -> "Oh it's just a vibe" when asked instead of pursuing the lead.
I don't like how he asked for Rhinox's votes either. Seems like he was trying to manipulate what he thought was a frustrated Rhino.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 81, Sleepless Assassin wrote:Lastsurvivor, I can do the whole quote wall thing when I get to a computer, but from a phone, a lot of my reasoning is going to look very general. Id say check my recent meta but I crashed the site back to november to erase it just so you couldn't see it.
Uh huh...
Is there some reason why I shouldn't check your meta frombeforethe site crash?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 86, Sleepless Assassin wrote:Lastsurvivor, anything you'll find before november was before I spent time away from the site. I was living with my parents then, so I had access to a computer every day and rarely posted from my phone. Therefore, the games before the crash won't show you a lot of phone posts from me.
Is that a reason to not check your meta? I still think it'd be useful even if you might post from your phone more now.
And stop fence sitting. Who is scummier: fishy, malee, or DDD?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Which post are you talking about? The one I pointed out in my vote of him or another?
A thing I noticed with SA at first is that he's talking about a whole lotta nothing. Which is what I pointed out in my original post and his floppy reasoning with the fishy attack. His last post definitely has that as well. If you look at that big paragraph, it's a bunch of fence sitting and jibberjabber. Why expand on the DDD/Nacho conflict if a) you have nothing to say and b ) DDD isn't even your top scum choice? Because it's an easy thing for scum to talk about, that's why.
SA's biggest scum ITT.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Meh. Malee was really scummy as town in the last game I played with her, and she did stuff similar to this. Granted, she was drugged up during that entire game, but still. One man SA BW is where it's at.
@SA:
SA wrote:Last, nothing you are saying about that post makes any sense. Of course I'm going to point out DDD when it catches my attention. If I catch a scum vibe and let it go, id hate to ignore it all game, see him win as scum, and come back like "yeah, he looked scummy. I just never said so". And what do you see as fence sitting in there at all. I felt I was pretty clear with all of it.
The reason I have a problem with you expanding on DDD is because you didn't expand on Fishy/Malee who are your top two scum picks. And don't say you've expanded on them already, because you definitely have not. Shouldn't you be expanding on your vote instead of a distant third choice?
Fence sitting: Your post that I was referring to really doesn't say anything about anything. You say absolutely nothing about Fishy nor Malee except " I'm trying to decide whether fish is still scummier than malee or not," and then you just ramble on about how DDD might be scum. At this point, you've given more reasoning for DDD being scum than your top two picks combined. But you know DDD isn't going to really call you out on it too much because he's not your top scum pick, only a distant third.
In post 96, Sleepless Assassin wrote:As much as I like the malee hate, is reaching really scummy in the first few pages of the game?
What? Didn't you say this was scummy about Malee?
In post 61, Sleepless Assassin wrote:Oh yeah, the whole skimming over reaction thing was what I didn't like about malee.
I could be wrong, but from here, it looks like you're referring to Malee's reaching case (I say I could be wrong because you're kinda vague, going back to that talking about nothing thing). Y so contradicting?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@SA: So you have no idea when you're getting internet back? :/
Yo, funkybike, what's up? Give us your thoughts on, like, players and stuff.
Kortul did you see post 72 (and 73 afterwards).
NVM you answered carry on.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 115, 4nxi3ty wrote:In post 85, Lastsurvivor wrote:Malee's not giving me warm fuzzy towny feelings with this mess of a case on Nacho.
How do you feel about DDD's case?
Nacho definitely needs to do more than just asking questions. Like giving reads etc.
That said, I'm not seeing the cruise control thing (probably because I've never seen him play more).
What do you think of SA?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Yeah that's what I meant SA. Computer/interwebz.
Anyway, I think you could still at least expand on Fishy/malee in the same way you did DDD. If you need to, just point to post numbers (In post X fishy did balbhalbh) and don't quote posts. It's just as effective. And I don't expect a lot since you're on your phone, but some stuff would be nice. More than "it's just a feeling."
I just don't understand, if it's such a problem to expand on Fishy/Malee, why you were able to expand on DDD. Or why you're able to explain your thoughts on other things.
@4nx: So the stuff I've said about him is invalid to you?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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The playing on a phone explains doesn't explain much other than the fact that he makes short posts. What bugs me about SA is that he is able to elaborate on some things (e.g, DDD) but not elaborate on the important things (e.g, his vote).
DDD posted kinda regularly until Friday. Maybe he's just been busy this weekend (was St Patty's day yesterday after all). His posts haven't really been blah though.
Can you point to some things Rhino's done that give you that "forced" feeling? I'm not seeing it.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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K hi.
In general SA is starting to bug me less now that he's actually playing. That said, he hasn't convinced me he's town yet.
Anywho
In post 130, Vincent2128 wrote:This post feels fake to me (see #95 and #97 as well.)
Why?
FTR I like what you're saying about Hiplop.
In post 138, Malee wrote:In post 130, Vincent2128 wrote:This post feels fake to me (see #95 and #97 as well.)
That's very townish to say,but it was genuine. I thought nacho voted you, but even without that vote, he still skimmed. I wasn't paying attention enough, my bad.
This looks like the second best example of pandering so far this game, and the best example of scum pandering so far this game. The casual "Oh, well, that's very towny of you," while going on to disagree lamely. The reason I put this as the "best" is because Vincent's comment wasn't even a towny comment. It was a vague observation. Ergo, I have no idea why the hell Malee would want to point out that it's very towny when it's barely anything.
In post 140, Rhinox wrote:But we talked about the "good point" comment already so I'm not sure what more I can say about it. "good point" probably wasn't even the right wording anyways, maybe "interesting point" woulda been better. But it was all just about gauging reactions from you and LastSurvivor, not that I ever intended suspecting you as scum for it.
Confused. Are you saying that your "good point" post was a reaction test?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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yay funky posted things.
Funky, do you agree with the proposed meta about you (by Rhinox I think) that you enjoy playing more as scum?
Also, why is pandering not legitimate on D1? I think trying to flatter your aggressor would work no matter when it happens during the game. And flattery is definitely a popular scum tactic. People think twice about who they're fighting against if that person calls them townies, compliments their arguments etc.'
Also, Funky, you left out a few people in your reads list. Was that intentional? What are your thoughts on Sleepless Assassin?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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UNVOTE:
VOTE: Malee
L-2.
SA's not looking too bad to me anymore. Malee, on the other hand, is just a mess whenever she appears. The thing that bothers me the most is the pandering. I know I defended her because she played like this in another game, but she never pandered even when she was under fire. I feel like she just saw that in some "how 2 be gud scum" article and copied it.
In post 148, Alicewondering wrote:He's vouching for her in a way that doesn't exactly feel genuine to me.
Why doesn't it feel genuine?
Nacho's stuff on Funky is definitely nice. And, no, I don't really like his reads. Especially don't like the fact that they don't include everyone.
@Vinc: Why did you quote me in your post?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Hm.
Malee, I want a reads list from you. On every player. Looking through your ISO, I cannot tell what you think about a majority of the players.
Feel free to format it however you like, but your thoughts on every single player must be there. If you think nothing about a player, say why.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 166, Alicewondering wrote:Nacho makes an excellent point on funky. Also Kortul. Consider me persuaded, though I'll keep my vote on Malee for now. I'd probably be willing to switch to funky whenever.
Also, I don't understand why SA was suspicious earlier to some people. I like post 151's reasoning, though it does seem a little hesitant to express strong opinions, not a scumtell by itself by any means though.
SA was suspicious because his earlier posting was crap and he wasn't playing the game. Everyone that was on the SA wagon has already said that SA has improved (except hiplop, but meh), so you making that statement is irrelevant other than to suck up.
FTR I find that, along with what DDD said, bad.
While I agree with Rhinox's general sentiment about Malee's site flake, it's not really indicative to alignment. She did it in every game. So don't think that me asking her for a reads list made her crack or anything (although I'm sure none of you were).
That said, her successor has got some work to do and they better give me that reads list.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Funkybike:
In post 147, Lastsurvivor wrote:yay funky posted things.
Funky, do you agree with the proposed meta about you (by Rhinox I think) that you enjoy playing more as scum?
Also, why is pandering not legitimate on D1? I think trying to flatter your aggressor would work no matter when it happens during the game. And flattery is definitely a popular scum tactic. People think twice about who they're fighting against if that person calls them townies, compliments their arguments etc.'
Also, Funky, you left out a few people in your reads list. Was that intentional? What are your thoughts on Sleepless Assassin?
Plz respond k thanks.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Mmm. I'm content with sticking with Malee for now. Malee does have a few more points than just what you mentioned in #194, Nacho. I've mentioned one, and Vincent has mentioned at least one.
In general, I was expecting an exodus off the wagon after Nacho's post. Slightly surprised that only Anx hopped off.
General question: What does everyone think of hiplop?
Also
FUNKYBIKE
WHY ARE YOU NOT ANSWERING MY QUESTIONS? PLEASE ANSWER MY QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE QUOTED ON THE TOP OF THIS PAGE THANK YOU.
@SA: Malee only has 4 votes atm. I'm assuming you didn't realize this?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Ah...now Anx and Alice are off the wagon.
Alice, what encouraged you to switch to funky? That's a textbook wagon hop right there.
Also Alice
In post 160, Lastsurvivor wrote:
In post 148, Alicewondering wrote:He's vouching for her in a way that doesn't exactly feel genuine to me.
Why doesn't it feel genuine?
Plz answer k thanks. Not letting you get away with the "Oh, you know, it justdoesn't feel right," card.
@SA: Alright, good that you didn't realize. But I recall that the difference between Malee and Funky on your reads list was quite substantial. You said Malee was scum, but your conclusion about Bike was that you were "Really not liking" him. That seems like a big difference to me. Is it not as big as I think it is? And if it is a big difference, you really should hop onto the Malee wagon. There's plenty of room.
If you haven't answered my question yet, please do: What do you think of Hiplop? The answers so far are kinda surprising, but I think I may just be misconstruing things. But yeah, please answer thank you thank you.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Alice: K thanks for the evidence.
@Hiplop: Do you still think Rhinox is scum? If not, then pinpoint some scumreads ASAP. If so, then to do some convincing ASAP.
This is why Hip bothers me @everyone who finds him ok. His vote is stuck on Rhinox, but he hasn't really pushed it. And now he's saying that two others might be scum.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 218, hiplop wrote:
Eh, the phrase dream up can have some negative connotation, I don't agree with this, however. Dreamers are what keep the world great.
DDD and Rhinox are scum, imo. Maybe even Nachomama instead of DDD. Nacho is doing what every player who has been "Scum-meta'd" does, "CHANGE THEIR PLAYSTYLE" in heavy air quotes (its more fashionable that way). And quite bluntly, I see a connection between rhinox and nacho. DDD feels independently scummy, some for his lurking, some for his actual posts.
Nothing on Malee or Funky then? I find it uncomfortable that you said you lacked the "competence" to pinpoint which one of them is scum, especially since now neither of them are scum. Also, I feel the connection between Rhinox and nacho can be explained in another way, but I'll let them explain it.
Also, why can't Rhinox, DDD, and Nacho be scum? You act like it has to be either DDD or Nacho.
@Funky: Do you like...read the thread? I'm pretty sure there are other things people have asked you that you haven't answered, and you just stumble in here posting random irrelevant nonsense.
About new discussion topic: I haven't read through the previous games, but I would think that it would be a smart scum strategy for scum to buddy up on townies. I haven't really been searching for it, so I can't say it's a really risky strategy either. Did anyone who played the Last Will games see that scum buddied up on townies?
@4nx: How do you come to the conclusion that funky's town? At this point he's null for reasons I stated earlier in this post.
Also, lampshading (warning tvtropes link may waste hours of your valuable time) the fact that you BW hopped doesn't really make it any less bad.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@fishy: as you said earlier. It appears that Hip is gunning for Nacho/Rhino, so it doesn't seem like he's being apathetic towards the both of them. I just found it odd that, according to hip, both DDD and Nacho were scummy but apparently only one or the other could be Rhino's partner. Was wondering if there was an actual reason or just because it seemed implausible to him that he found the entire scumteam. It seems to be the latter.
@hip: Thinking you have found the entire scumteam isn't arrogance, it's ingenuity and confidence!
Ahem.
I think the scummy difference between Malee and Funky is clear cut, personally. Malee was def more scummy than Funky. Also, just compare their ISOs if you need to refind that connection. I certainly saw a connection by doing that.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Has Vincent been posting in other games? That's pretty lame.
@hip: But you don't think people's play can generally be classed into a "style?" There's a difference between pre-emptive strategy and how someone plays the game. I think the confusion kortul's seeing is that you don't get the terminology.
Spring boarding off of Kortul's question...
DDD, what do you think of Nacho's play style change? Do you think the change was scum motivated?
I dislike Rhinox's disappearance as well as Vincent's. His posts have become rather infrequent.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@hip: Hm, I suppose I wasn't really looking at it in context and thus I was the one being picky about terminology.
Anyway
I think Nacho should really address your point, since I can see a logical explanation for the play style switch and I'm surprised he didn't explain it as soon as you brought it up.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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It's kinda making me sad that all the centers of attention are posting prod dodges or are otherwise absent. I wish Malee's replacement would show up soon, but there are like 20 replacements needed for games. Le sigh.
Anyway.
All those who have recently posted "Prod dodge": I want a reads list in your next post of at least five players. You must find at least two of those players scummy.
GO!Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Rhinox: Your catch up post has placated my hungry wolf desire for content.
@Hip: I mirror Rhinox's last question to you.
People who still need to placate my hungry wolf desire for content via a reads list/catch up post/preferably both: Vincent, Funky, Malee's replacement
But let's be honest, Funky's catch up post would be a reread of the entire thread.
Speaking of that....
SPRINGBOARD
Does anyone find the fact that Funky clearly doesn't read the thread scummy? I'll answer when others answer.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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I really need to reread when I find the time.
First and foremost
@theo: Ty for placating my hungry desire for content.
First and foremost about Malee: All of the problems with Malee come AFTER the post you quoted.
Now, when you ask "Why?" I assume you mean "Why did this big case come up"?
The biggest problem I had with her is her out of place complimenting. In post #138, she says something vincent said was "very townish to say," even though, quite honestly, it was not very townish to say. That sunk the deal at the time. The other points are her mess of a case on Nacho. I.e, voting him even though it's clear that she didn't think he was scum.
Theo, why do you think hip is scummy for having odd scum targets?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 266, Rhinox wrote:I think funky does read the thread, he just only comments on what he wants to, doesn't care what anyone demands of him, and doesn't care if people find him scummy for it. I don't think funky is scummy, I think if you actually read what he is saying, he's been making some decent points.
I can't say I agree with you that he's making decent points.
Ok. let's assume that funky actually does read the thread and sees everyone's questions. Why do you think he doesn't answer them? And don't say "because he doesn't care." Well, I guess you can say that if you want, but I'd prefer you say more than just that.
I really cannot make heads or tails of this Rhinox/hip argument. I feel like Rhino has reactionary tunnel vision on. IMO, OMGUS at this stage in the game has become more of a town tell these days. Hip's behavior is confusing me though, as usual. It kind of bothers me that Hip accuses Rhino of having a lack of competence, when he doesn't even understand that Rhino isn't on V/LA yet (FYI he goes on V/LA on Thursday not today). And I don't know why he's getting so angry.
TL;DR: ATM Rhinox is becoming better, Hip is becoming worse.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Nacho: Hum. If your vote is only based off of a joke I've been making based off of Rhinox's post 254 (read the last sentence and his use of the word "placate," and then look at my avatar and scroll down to #258 where I first used the joke if you don't get it), and a slight disappointment that I haven't changed my vote in awhile, then hopefully you won't mind if I disregard your vote for now.
@Kortul: Yeah, I'm pretty sure I got it right. If she were talking about her own posts, wouldn't she say "That's very townish to say,andit's genuine"? If I'm understanding what you're saying, anyway.
Gonna spend the afternoon doing ISOs. Just replying to stuff directed at me.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@theo: Ah, I see what you mean by the "Why?" now.
Anyhoo, I was under the impression that Malee had gotten over her health issues. You realize that when she was talking about being on medication and such during a prior game from like...January right? (Well, she flaked in January, the game went on until the crash)
I'm pretty sure the reason she flaked was not because she had health issues, but because she was playing four games and couldn't handle it. That's not a reason to excuse any mistakes she made.
Why are you defending her actions, anyway?
And about hiplop: I think I might be misunderstanding you or you might be misunderstanding me. When you said why you thought he was scummy, your reason was, "because of the wavering around on votes / who he thinks is scummy." I took the "who he thinks is scummy" part as having strange scum targets. Are you referring to something else?
The ISOs are going slowly, mostly because I keep on nodding off. <_<Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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I've done all the ISOs but one, but I doubt I'd find anything interesting there anyway.
I've concluded that this hiplop/rhinox argument is town/town and pointless. Honestly, both of them are using arguments that are so illogical that this has to be two people with bad tunnel vision on each other.
Instead, we should focus our attention on Alice.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Alicewondering
Throughout this entire game, Alice has been making contradictory arguments that clearly show she's just trying to blend in. First thing I noticed while going through her ISO? Alice calls me out for making an RVS while, allegedly, RVS has ended.
Spoiler: quote #1
I made that post in post #27. Look at the post below it, post 28 by funkybike. What is it? A RANDOM VOTE.Why didn't Alice call out this random vote as well as mine? Because Alice really doesn't care about finding scum. Why? Because she is scum.
Spoiler: quote #2
Post #102 above is an example of Alice trying to fit in. I had just defended Malee because her play was consistent with a previous game I played with her. Alice made the profound observation above. Obviously, if Malee was scum and I defended her, I would look scummier. But when someone asked her why she made this observation, Alice gave a vague answer instead of an obvious answer. She said, "He's vouching for her in a way that doesn't exactly feel genuine to me". Really? That doesn't really say anything.
Later on in that same post I linked to, Alice says, "Her posts look alittle fake in general (though I hate that sort of reasoning)."
So hold up, Alice? You dislike calling people's posts fake, even though you use that sort of reasoning twice (towards Malee and I)? Why do you feel so comfortable using a sort of reasoning you dislike? Because somewhere along the line, you're lying?
re switching from malee to funkybike: I can see the reasoning, sort of. However, Alice repeats multiple times that Malee is still her top scum read even though she has switched votes. Which, again, I can understand.
What I DON'T understand, however, is that Alice has not interacted with Theo at all. Instead, she is voting Hiplop. It is like she forgot who her top scum read was...or, you know, Malee/Theo was never her top scum read.
TL;DR:
Vote Alice. Four reasons.
1) She does not care about finding scum. See quote 1. Alice calls me out for RVS voting when funky RVS voted the post after mine.
2) Alice is clearly trying to fit in by making observations that seem legit at a glance but really aren't. See quote 2.
3) Alice is hypocritical. See the paragraphs after quote 2. She is ok with calling others out for things that she thinks are fake, even though she does not like using that kind of reasoning.
4) Alice repeatedly stated that Malee was her top scum read, but she has not interacted with her replacement. Instead, she hopped onto Hip's train. See, "re switching from malee to funkybike"Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@Hip: Hey, you should take a step back from Rhino for a minute and read 298 (it's a bit long, sorry). Then read the posts after that by Alice and I. Then vote Alice!
@Alice: Hey, Alice, you interacted with your former primary scum read! It only took...me prodding you. Nice. Alice, why didn't you interact with someone who you said was your primary scum read multiple times until now?
Wait, so now you like Hiplop? Seriously, two people call you out on your vote (Nacho and I) and you back off. At least try to show some conviction with your vote, jeez. It doesn't seem like you have any fake scum reads now, either, Alice.
Also, not replying to any of my argument is nice. "Instead of even looking like I'm defending myself, I'm just going to say 'lol.'" Good strategy. But I'm not going away just because you know how to laugh out loud.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 307, Alicewondering wrote:1. Because I had nothing to say
I find that hard to believe. So what did you think of the post then?
2. Yes
By not saying "Ono lol I'm actually searching for scum," you're only digging yourself into a deeper hole, Alice. Just saying "Yes" was definitely the wrong answer.
3. I have nothing to say. You are just so wrong.
Oh, wow. This is the best answer ever. I am totally convinced.
UNVOTE: The wonderful Alicewondering
...
Jk lol
VOTE: Alicewondering
WHY am I wrong? You're making yourself look worse and worse. Seriously. I broke that post down into four core points in the TL;DR section to make it easier for you. But you're not doing anything other than saying "No! You're wrong! LALALALALALALALALALA!"
In post 311, Alicewondering wrote:- Scum tend to be rather wishy washy about their reads. "So and so is kind of town, but could be scum." This gives them a chance to change their reads in the future where convenient. While hiplop has changed his reads, I don't think it has been done in an unnatural way, and he has consistently been (very) adamant about who his top scumreads are, at least recently.
Scum also find it convenient to have no reads at all. Instead of finding scum, they do useless things like mediate on conflicts that they clearly have no interest in. This is what you are doing.
- Scum tend to avoid conflict and not draw attention to themselves, which is completely the opposite of what is going on here. That's why hip's arguments against you read genuinely to me, though they may be somewhat unjustified.
You are avoiding conflict 100% by saying "Lol you're wrong LALALALALALALA."
I think basically your case is that hiplop changes his votes/reads, and he does not justify his claims.
BUT WAIT!
Wasn't your reasoning for the hip vote something like...
Isn't it possible that Hip just changed his reads? Did you not realize this when you voted him? Why do you enjoy changing your views so freaking much?
Plz more Alice votes.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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PEDIT: Sorry, but I am doing a wall too. :(
Half the ISOs I did yesterday are gone <_< thankfully I got most of the important ones. Just gonna go into it.
4n: Weak town read (Town null lean, if you will). When are you going to justify your Rhinox vote like you said you would here?
DDD: He's being quite lazy. I've only played one game with him, but in that game he was proactive and had a strange methodology. This game he's being quite unspectacular. I feel like his Nacho case generally boils down to "you're better than this" and not much else. His reply to a question I asked him was way too wordy to be comfortable for me and, to be honest, I'm not sure he answered it. I don't like it. I also don't like how he started viciously defending hiphop, even going so far as to attacking Rhino, after Hip hopped onto the Nacho wagon. The Nacho wagon is a lazy wagon, and IDK why DDD is still pushing it.
Fishy: I think Fishy's town, but it's mostly gut. I dunno. He explains himself well, I guess, and usually makes sense. People who seem to be having a problem with him I'm thinking have played with him before, so perhaps I'm just lacking a meta read.
Funky: Sweet jesus Funky is one of the most confusing players ever. I think he's scum though.
Spoiler: quote #1 (big quote)
Lots of things wrong with this:
1) See Malee's read. He says he thinks the Malee case is forced. Then he goes on to say that if her behavior continues, it will be very difficult to dig herself out of whatever hole she's in or something like that. Shouldn't he find her behavior fine if he finds the case forced?
2) 4n's, hip's reads literally don't say anything.
3) Kortul is safely town until proven otherwise? How so? He gives no explanation for this (hell, none of them have explanations)
4) No vote on Nacho. This leads me to my next point.
Post 173: Funky says Nacho provided an explanation for his behavior. If you go through Nacho's ISO...he really didn't explain his behavior.
Spoiler: quote 2
ORLY? He's referring to his random ass question at the end of quote 1. I find this very hard to believe. Why not just vote and then ask the question? Avoiding conflict IMO.
But yeah anyway we've clarified that Funky thinks Nacho's innocent. Except, according to Read 218, Funky agrees with Hip that Nacho's scum now.
TL;DR Funky's scum.
Kortul: Null. There's not a ton of content there. A problem I have is that his initial reads list are mostly neutral. Kortul, could you turn those neutral people to town or scum (I know, hypocritical of me since you have a null read from me, but if you do that you might become town!)
(Now we're getting to the points where I have no notes, so these will be shorter then they would have been...unless the ISOs are short on their own).
Theo: Theo doesn't look good either. His first post looks like he's just defending himself. The obvious example is when he tries to explain his predecessor's actions. But further examples are his attack on Fishy. I don't really get the attack on Fishy, since both the things Theo is attacking Fishy for were explained multiple times. Also, look at the quotes around his attack on SA? What is one word they all have in common? Malee.
Now, this wouldn't really be bad if the case weren't illogical. The "OMG contradiction" Theo notices in 220 comes right after SA did a reread of ISOs and such. Obviously his reads are going to change. Theo is leaning scum, I guess.
Nacho: I had more specifics about Nacho, but they were lost when I lost my notes so...TL;DR I think he's town.
Hip/Rhino: Their conflict says they'e town/town. They've both got extreme tunnel vision and are overly defensive (Rhino proved the latter part to me at the beginning of this game), and they just happened to jump on each other.
SA: I actually didn't do his ISO, but my gut says town. Can't really be sure though, so town null lean.
Vincent: Oh yeah, I almost forgot to do his. There's a lot of narcissism (or what other have called "egocentrism") in his posts, that I actually kind of like. Otherwise there isn't a lot of content though. Weak town read.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@4n: Hip basically did the same thing to rhino (PEDIT: Referring to making big things out of little things in his posts).
4n, read alice's 311, specifically the bottom where she defines how scum plays. Don't you think Alice has been avoiding conflict this entire game? And atm she has absolutely no scum reads at all. She was definitely waffled on her hip read once I called her out on it, for seemingly no reason. Don't you think that's...bad?
Also, don't you think it's odd that she's just saying "LOL no you're wrong," towards my case instead of explaining why I'm wrong? Could she possibly not be explaining why I'm wrong because...I'm right, 4n?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 329, Alicewondering wrote:Well, LS, since you seem so interested in a response, I'll humor you just this once.
Thanks!
Alice wrote:You are avoiding conflict 100% by saying "Lol you're wrong LALALALALALALA."
I'm pretty sure this creates more conflict than posting a proper defense. I'm not really allthatinterested in defending myself right now. I almost always get wrongly accused of being scum, but I haven't been mislynched yet.
Yes, this is true, it does create more conflict. However,youare not the one creating conflict by avoiding it. Others are. You are avoiding conflict. You haven't been lynched yet? Well, most people that defend themselves haven't been lynched. Ergo, I would become more interested in defending myself if I were you.
Alice wrote:Isn't it possible that Hip just changed his reads? Did you not realize this when you voted him? Why do you enjoy changing your views so freaking much?
Misrep here. It's not that hip chnaged his reads, he lied about what he said about his reads previously. That was why I voted him. Changing reads/votes is fine, lying about previous reads is not.fishyshould this point.
Where did he lie about his reads? The way I'm reading it, Hip's reads changed and you were the one misrepping Hip.
@DDD: FTR, in every game I've seen amished tell in, that person was town. But that's not really a lot of games, so meh.
@Rhinox: Why is Alice town? I'm not gonna attack you; I genuinely want to know.
@Everyone who has expressed discontent with the Alice wagon: You better start convincing everyone why your vote is scum, or else we aren't gonna get anything done.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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What do my wagonmates think of this?Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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K everyone Alice is at L-1 if I've counted correctly.
EDIT: Nvm, with Fishy's unvote Alice is at L-2.
Funky's vote definitely leaves me feeling uncomfortable. My biggest problem with a Funky lynch is that it leaves us with practically no information if he comes out town.
@Alice: Weren't you telling me I was wrong when I posted my case though? So now the points are valid?
Also, I find it really hard to buy that you're actually scumhunting since you don't have a vote on anyone. What you're doing now looks like questioning with no real purpose, which we really don't have time for this close to the deadline.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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...Fuck it, an Alice lynch is no good.
UNVOTE: (For realz this time)
VOTE: Funkybike1
I have already stated my reasoning here, but i will extract it for the lazy:
(Note, the bolded point was not in the original post)
In post 323, Lastsurvivor wrote:
Funky: Sweet jesus Funky is one of the most confusing players ever. I think he's scum though.
Spoiler: quote #1 (big quote)
Lots of things wrong with this:
1) See Malee's read. He says he thinks the Malee case is forced. Then he goes on to say that if her behavior continues, it will be very difficult to dig herself out of whatever hole she's in or something like that. Shouldn't he find her behavior fine if he finds the case forced?
2) 4n's, hip's reads literally don't say anything.
3) Kortul is safely town until proven otherwise? How so? He gives no explanation for this (hell, none of them have explanations)
4) No vote on Nacho. This leads me to my next point.
Post 173: Funky says Nacho provided an explanation for his behavior. If you go through Nacho's ISO...he really didn't explain his behavior.
Spoiler: quote 2
ORLY? He's referring to his random ass question at the end of quote 1. I find this very hard to believe. Why not just vote and then ask the question? Avoiding conflict IMO.
Also, it's an irrelevant question. Is that question really important enough to hold off a vote for? I don't think so.
But yeah anyway we've clarified that Funky thinks Nacho's innocent. Except, according to Read 218, Funky agrees with Hip that Nacho's scum now.
TL;DR Funky's scum.
Add in the Alice vote for no original reason whatsoever, and I think we've found lurker scum.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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@4n: You have said that funky is probably town. Why?
@kortul, hiplop: You two should totally vote funk.
@alice: As much as I agree with your points on DDD (hence why I was doubting my read and switched my vote), you're not going to get enough momentum for a lynch before deadline. So you should totally vote funky too.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Good catch on Theo's flip flopping Alice read. Theo, care to explain the flop?
I feel really good about Funky though. The scumminess that he's been caught in is probably the most concrete so far. I really can't see a townie having the interactions he had with Nacho.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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In post 368, 4nxi3ty wrote:I've been mulling over this for some time:Immediately after this post LS decided to ISO some people and than later came up with a case on funky and alice, looks like he was worried he wasn't providing enough content.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlatio ... _causation
Yup, after Nacho voted me I did do some ISOs. But I was going to do those ISOs anyway because I wanted to get some solid reads on people. Sorry if that's scummy.
On one hand LS has been pressuring a lot of people to explain themselves but on the other he has been overstating the scumminess of others.
Once I realized my Alice case was bad I unvoted. If you wanna prove how I'm overstating scumminess on Funky, then I'll buy this point. But please do that first.
On one hand LS has been pressuring a lot of people to explain themselves but on the other he has been overstating the scumminess of others. It has gotten to the point where I feel he is just been trying to get a mislynch going on multiple people while masking his actions as pro-town by asking a lot of questions.
Summary: "My reads disagree with LS so he must be scum pushing for mislynches. He asks a lot of questions. That couldn't possibly be part of his playstyle; he must be scum."
Tell me I'm wrong.
Also, I have no idea how you could think that funky's thought process was logical. He referred to events that didn't happen. I.e, he said Nacho explained himself when he didn't. I don't know how a townie could look through Nacho's posts and see an explanation.
He said he didn't vote because he was waiting for Nacho to answer a question. The question, imo, doesn't seem like enough to hold off a vote for. I think he's lying.
But please tell me where you see the logic. I want to be enlightened.
In post 370, Nachomamma8 wrote:The hungry wolf comment was quoted as an example of one of the times you demanded more content. That would've been clear to you had you read my posting. As for "slight disappointment", it's more than that. I never suggested it wasn't.
Honest question: Do you really think I haven't been providing content since you've been gone? Your argument's irrelevant ATM.
(Also, don't even think about replying that your prodding made me provide content.)
And, didn't even acknowledge your "out of place complimenting" bit. Can we try again and answer people's suspicions against us seriously?
How am I supposed to reply to "This is not ok!!!" especially when I thought it was perfectly fine. How about you quit it with your lazy argument and vote someone else. You told me to shit or get off the pot. I did. How about you do the same?
Nacho wrote:You're looking at the arguments as opposed to the people themselves. This is scummy.
Uh huh. That's why at least three other people were saying it was a town/town argument, right? Were they all my scumbuddies?
Furthermore, how is it scummy. Shouldn't I be evaluating their arguments to see if they're town? You're not making any sense.
----
I want to see Theo reply to the flip flop on Alice, since I feel there is an explanation that town could make. If he explains well, my vote stays on Funk.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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I'd really love some evidence for Funky town that isn't based on crashed-game-meta evidence. Because I've gone through his games that are actually still here, and his scum game actually looks closer to this game honestly.
Theo also needs to show up. He's stalling this game and we're two days until deadline. <_<Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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Lovely.
Just in case it isn't clear to everyone: We're lynching either funky or theo today. If you aren't on either of their wagons, stop lollygagging and hop on.
I'd rather you hop on funky, but you know.
Pretty sure almost everyone is on either one wagon or another at this point, save Nacho and the two wagoned individuals themselves. I could be wrong though.Game(s) where I have in fact been the last survivor, or been among the last survivors: 1-
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