Large Normal 241: Random Pictures and Other Stuff | Endgame

[scamper]

wrt hem: i think nero had a good read on him day 1 when he said he was present but didnt really feel like he was doing all that much. it occurred to me overnight that there was mention of a previous game where he got caught fr being overly aggressive, and as there is some overlap between that game and this one its possible he was trying to avoid being caught on that same thing, but overcompensated by playing very passively instead. his push onto datisi sucks and is lazy, like he picked a tunnel target in the first 10 pages and decided to just stay with it. him shading me for unvoting tsq is also bad.

he posts about vpb, but never commits to a real read on him, asks him a few ez questions and fencesits. i dont ever get the sense hem actually tried to solve vpbs alignment

Spoiler:

Ari, Datisi isn't asking you so I'll ask on his behalf

did you think VP was scummy for not voting Datisi there? do you think it's consistent that Datisi would have assumed what he assumed about you here?

is it just me or ausuka and vpb has this

t en s i o n

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ausuka

oh there he goes

making the first move

VPB is your scamper vote serious

here's my early game list

Ausuka - likely town
scamper - poe
Juice - waiting for arrival
Datisi - poe
humaneatingmonkey - town ofc
Aristeia - poe
Firebringer - pending to mid-game
Gamma Emerald - pending read on me
Nero Cain - poe
Eiralox - poe
fireisredsir - probably town
GuiltyLion - poe

VP Baltar - poe

marcistar - probably town
xofelf - likely town
skitter30 - likely town
Irrelephant11 - likely town
ydrasse - pending read on early game
Dunnstral - waiting
DeasVail - pending question on datisi townread

I've decided Datisi is scum but we should let him live because he's cool

Datisi I'm putting you in the penalty box, you're gonna need to start wowing me with some better reads to get out

GL is top town read.

what do you think of Irrellephant, VPB

since we're both high GL, can we vibe and talk casually about the game

what do you think about vpb

At times it feels like VPB is just going down intellectual lines of questioning for its own sake instead of like, genuinely seeking an answer that will impact his reads - if that makes sense

this is exactly what i felt as well

im figuring out if it's vpb pushing buttons to generate content or scum trying to fake a push

did you feel as if vpb's fixation on your gutread was natural?

VPB where are you on this game

@ HEM - for me it's just like, why even put out a list if like 75% is just saying "poe". I'd probably just say "I'm TRing this person. Or so and so is scummy"

It looks like busy work to post a full list that is just meh.

are you even reading my posts

my posts are nothing but that

I'm only talking about your list specifically. Seemed useless, so why even post it? That's what I didn't care for. Think it was a good call out by Nero at the time.

seemed useless? how do you condense your thoughts in one post efficiently? did you even read it in context?

I count 5 reads out of 19 players. Zero scum, or anything generally that doesn't have the flavor of lukewarm milk. It's a pointless list to make other than it looks like effort. I know you're better than that.

to view it as 5/19 is a choice. first of all, if we're using the same unfair standards as you're putting in through, it would be 6/19. second, i dont understand, what would you have expected me to do? third, do you have better reads at that point in the game?

nero said i wasn't doing anything so i showed him where i'm at. why should i make a list later?

meanwhile this is the most baltar had to say about hem:

Spoiler:

VPB where are you on this game

What an incredibly vague question.

I am voting FB. You should too or push a more serious alternative.

There's a lot of faffing going on this game and I'm kinda bored

VP, when did you start thinkng that I was town?

Part of it is cumulative vibes from you being an asshat, which is consistent with my town experience with you obv. (Though certainly fakeable)

For example, your fight with ari seemed absolutely unnecessary.

I also remember feeling better about you when you said something about HEM's list being kind of wishy washy, because that was my same gut reaction when I read it.

I would feel better if you had actually called out HEM in thread instead of retroactively agreeing with me. Or did you call it out, I just don't really remember you doing it.

I didn't call it out at the time because I'm skimming along while I work and just repeating stuff other people have said isn't super useful.

As far as the attitude stuff, I can be a prickly person too! It's definitely not all on you. As much as I joke, I do want to avoid toxic fights if possible because it's probably good to be a grown up. Sometimes I think you intentionally make insults, but I think it's also maybe just your playstyle to try and get reax.


@ HEM - for me it's just like, why even put out a list if like 75% is just saying "poe". I'd probably just say "I'm TRing this person. Or so and so is scummy"

It looks like busy work to post a full list that is just meh.

@ HEM - for me it's just like, why even put out a list if like 75% is just saying "poe". I'd probably just say "I'm TRing this person. Or so and so is scummy"

It looks like busy work to post a full list that is just meh.

are you even reading my posts

Sure.

my posts are nothing but that

I'm only talking about your list specifically. Seemed useless, so why even post it? That's what I didn't care for. Think it was a good call out by Nero at the time.

here's my early game list

Ausuka - likely town
scamper - poe
Juice - waiting for arrival
Datisi - poe
humaneatingmonkey - town ofc
Aristeia - poe
Firebringer - pending to mid-game
Gamma Emerald - pending read on me
Nero Cain - poe
Eiralox - poe
fireisredsir - probably town
GuiltyLion - poe
VP Baltar - poe
marcistar - probably town
xofelf - likely town
skitter30 - likely town
Irrelephant11 - likely town
ydrasse - pending read on early game
Dunnstral - waiting
DeasVail - pending question on datisi townread

I count 5 reads out of 19 players. Zero scum, or anything generally that doesn't have the flavor of lukewarm milk. It's a pointless list to make other than it looks like effort. I know you're better than that.

why should i make a list later?

Because it might contain useful information later about your viewpoint later.


In other news, I agree with scamper that the Erialox wagon seems Zzzzzz.

Vote FB.

pedit: I see this is unrequested, but I don't care because I'm fooking trying. Datisi, I don't think your reads actually closely align with GL would be my takeaway. 4-5 of his top scum reads are on the town side of your triangle (even if some are lower confidence), so you might want to rethink how you're viewing him.

humaneatingmonkey

- the main reason why i'm townreading this slot if because his thoughts on me and around me make sense, see my 1343. otherwise, this seems like a... quiet-town game from him. what i mean is, i don't get the feeling that he's trying to brute force or shitpush things through, and i feel like there were several moments he could've gone more aggressive (like on his push on me) and did not do that. and my impression of him as a scum player is that he *would* have done that. so i'm fine lowkey townbinning him for now.

monkey is town probably.

he never really gives much of a real read on hem, just agrees with nero when nero calls his list bad, and then they have an incredibly tepid argument that goes nowhere. then somehow in a later post he calls hem town and never elaborates on why

so i think hem looks compatible as a partner with vpb, i dont have any good reasons to townread him, if someone who townreads him could give an explanation beyond "he posts a lot" and "has chill vibes", id love to hear it

I made a post in response to gammas scum read:

Gamma why is HEM scum

he's basically felt fake all game to me, between the overly verbose post I called out early and his approach to me
there's also a slight meta aspect, he feels rather reactive, which I attribute to his scumgame

It feels like you're making a squishy meta feels case here that involves actively ignoring a lot of what HEM is actually doing in order to accomplish it, so the read doesn't feel real to me either.

To me, looking through HEMs posts theres a lot of stuff which is interesting novel thoughts on game and relation to the alignment of others that would be really strange to come from a scum player and hard to fake because they involve breaking the flow of the game which in some cases would be detrimental to scum.

UNVOTE:

while i am still very suspicious of the relly slot i feel like i dont need to dogpile someone who has just replaced in

i wonder if this is a direct reaction to TSQ mentioning that scum loves to dogpile replacements

Take this post, for example. Why would scum HEM feel the need to point this out at this time? Unless you think he and I are buddies there's very little reason that HEM would think this is a good topic of conversation for town to take, because it detracts from the momentum of the suspicion of me. Like, I guess you are saying that you think HEM and I are buddies because its a game solve but when I read back on HEMs iso theres a lot of stuff like this that individually seems like pointing out little things that are interesting for the town to think about.

I don't see a lot of scum motivation for a lot of HEMs posting, and I think its hard to fake because its not like not doing this stuff will get you scum read and the effects on the game are net negative for scum.

oh, i forgot shea made an immediate awful defense of hem that doesnt really make sense

[scamper]

this is a weird point to make

It is. I was going to chalk it up to him being new, but looking at his profile I guess he isn't? But he also probably isn't that familiar with Ari, or he probably would have recognized that she is often seen as a threat.

Do you think it reads like a premeditated argument?

1. i've played a lot with ari, this is an alt (if the whole "pretending to be like skitter" thing was not a tip off, although i'm not doing that as much now)
2. i am aware she is perceived as a threat. i still do not think she is especially likely to die night 1 if she is mostly inaccurate, but i recognize this is not a rock solid argument, but mostly a speculative one

[scamper]

here we go, show yourselves fiends

awoo awoo

fake scum bravado

[scamper]

still sticking to that datisi scumread you decided on back on like page 5, eh?

hes blatantly not attempting to solve the game

his reads have been frozen in ice since 15 pages into day 1 or whatever, he hasnt attempted to process or evaluate anything new

[scamper]

i am basically not going to shut up ever now until there are 9 votes on hem

[scamper]

i'm annoyed reading back that i made that post about hem asking if anyone had any actual good reason to townread him and the only response i got was from shea defending him and everyone else blew it off


and people were acting like i was crazy for saying the threadstate sucks and people aren't really communicating


so i reiterate again: if anyone has actual good reason to townread hem beyond him posting a lot, speak up, otherwise i want u to vote hem

[scamper]

i have ultimately tried being patient and letting other people have their way because i dont like shouting over other people but if someone is going to come in with blatant bad faith attacks i'm not gunna tolerate it

[scamper]

i'm annoyed reading back that i made that post about hem asking if anyone had any actual good reason to townread him and the only response i got was from shea defending him and everyone else blew it off


and people were acting like i was crazy for saying the threadstate sucks and people aren't really communicating


so i reiterate again: if anyone has actual good reason to townread hem beyond him posting a lot, speak up, otherwise i want u to vote hem

i mean i responded in 3103 and i also had 2850 talking about it

but maybe those weren't good enough reasons to be worth responding to idk

don't really love what he's doing rn fwiw but im not really convinced by the reasons for why he's scum

i mean, both of those posts are pretty vague, really, and i don't think "he's playing differently from a game he got caught d1 as scum in" is super convincing because he'd be motivated to play differently

[scamper]

the S_S progression was kinda ??? and i don't really buy that he went from, like, 'no compelling reason to vote ss' to doing it so quickly.

what's the scum motivation for doing this?

it makes me feel like dann is playing inorganically and was trying to fake a chaotic mindset but ended up doing it in a way that isn't really believable

scum don't play to their wincon perfectly or straightforwardly imo

i don't think he's playing inorganiclly or chaotically at all

i read his posts on the last page and they seem fine to me

[scamper]

the S_S progression was kinda ??? and i don't really buy that he went from, like, 'no compelling reason to vote ss' to doing it so quickly.

what's the scum motivation for doing this?

it makes me feel like dann is playing inorganically and was trying to fake a chaotic mindset but ended up doing it in a way that isn't really believable

scum don't play to their wincon perfectly or straightforwardly imo

i don't think he's playing inorganiclly or chaotically at all

i read his posts on the last page and they seem fine to me

i mean, it's fine if you think that way? i dont expect you to agree with me on every read and i don't really expect to convince people, i'm just trying to keep my thought process at least semi transparent. but like, i think i explained why i think what i do, i think the progression comes off bad and am not sure what else to say about it

VOTE: Dannflor

I have reconsidered and I like this actually

the S_S progression was kinda ??? and i don't really buy that he went from, like, 'no compelling reason to vote ss' to doing it so quickly. this made me read his iso and i remembered i do not like his opening posts, particularly his gl and marci pushes

the obscure push is like... fine and not really the reason i'm voting him but i don't think it's really town indicative because like it is pretty easy

hem is a slot im just 'meh' on because i feel like i havent read much of his posts in ages. i guess i can iso him later

okay. again. i am directly trying to argue against this because i don't think it's particularly great reasoning. i think u can say the s_s vote looks surface-level bad but i think scum is way more likely to have a "clean" progression on a vote like that and be concerned with optics where town is going to be more careless and i think his explanation for voting there of not really opposing the wagon is fine. and i dont really care about opening posts, overreacting to opening posts is why i misyeeted conman. i think hes shown a reasonable level of analysis since then. this isnt necessarily for sure town but i dont think your reasons are super strong

[scamper]

hems position is that i am somehow scum for not attacking him enough. lets revisit his posts about this from day 1:

the push seems kind of flimsy

i scumread scamper for this reason tho so it's weird that you townread it

scamper's early push on me felt so persistent i was wondering why he wanted me to be scum so much and now it's fizzled

do u expect me to hold on strongly to a read i had in the first 24 hours of the game?

i expected you to come back to me when you felt like your vote is doing nothing which seems to me like that's where you were before voting irrelephant

yeah. has your read changed about me?

i havent reread your iso yet

u are in the pile of people i am unsure about

you went from trying hard to sort me to leaving me alone

are you even thinking as you type your responses

you ask me why i find it scummy that you didn't get back to me
i answer why

and now you give me this clapback

i asked why u expect me to revisit u

as far as i can tell your expectation is that i should 'default' to a read i had earlier and interact with u more to try to 'solve' u. thats not how i am choosing to play the game rn. i vote wherever i feel is worthy of my attention and when the game is new and theres a lot of new information i am going to change my mind and move around, esp. when theres a lot of players. i have also stated my desire to limit my posting to not make the game unmanageable in length (im not doing great at it tho). as it is, my read on u was a gut based read that i decided to push when maybe 8 people in the game had posted, and u seemed the most awkward. its hardly something i felt strongly about, so i feel no obligation to continue pressuring u. id rather hang back and leave u to ur own devices at this point and read u based on waht u choose to do


this discussion seems eminently pointless so im just going to stop talking to you to avoid filling the thread with white noise, because it is definitely not helping me read u. if u think that makes me scum, i encourage u to push me.

my vote day 1 went from hem -> firebringer -> irrelephant. hems argument is that somehow i am scummy for not returning to voting him. this makes basically no sense because obviously i am going to vote on whatever catches my interest and my view of the game is goig to change on day 1. i am not obligated to keep pushing a read i had in the first 24 hours. and the persistence there doesn't feel like he actually cares about me read on him or is attempting to sort me, he's just trying to snag me on some triviality. i think answering that i am unsure of someone that early in the game is a perfectly valid response

now, its possible hem thought my initial arguments against him were in bad faith because they were (admittedly) reachy. and i wouldnt necessarily fault that suspicion. but i dont ever get the sense he was actually trying to investigate me in that way.

and now he returns to the game after being inactive for days and this is what he has to say:

Something_Smart (6): GuiltyLion, Frogsterking, scamper, fireisredsir, Ydrasse, humaneatingmonkey

in scamper's pov i am lurking scum who voted with him on his scumread so he should probably be unvoting now if his reads are real

{hem, fireisredsir, obscure, something_smart}

oh whats this he reiterated his point

Something_Smart (6): GuiltyLion, Frogsterking, scamper, fireisredsir, Ydrasse, humaneatingmonkey

in scamper's pov i am lurking scum who voted with him on his scumread so he should probably be unvoting now if his reads are real

r u saying i should be assuming ur scum and s_s is town?

it should give you pause

his immediate response is to start shading me for not unvoting because he voted on a wagon and i suspect him.

this makwa literally no sense

. i had not expressed that hem is my most confident scumread, since i was not voting him. i am not going to unvote a wagon in a 17 player game because

one

person i think is scummy is on it. there are two reasons for this: one, i could be wrongon my read of hem, and two, bussing exists. i'm not necessarily saying either of these are likely, but they have to be a consideration. if no one voted on a wagon with people they thought were scummy, you would never get a majority in a large game. regardless, if he is town his first thought should not be that i should be pushing him instead. its pointless antagonism.

"but maybe hem is just tunneled on his day 1 read", you might say

here's the thing about that. hem made this post a few days ago:

honestly i feel like i should have died last night and the fact im still alive makes me think i have townread scum

several people townread hem for this post when he made it, because hey why would scum think this??

but if you actually look at this statement versus hem's actions, there's a complete disconnect

hem says he is worried he is townreading scum but has not tried to re-evaluate his day 1 townreads at all. instead he has returned to trying to push me.

this is because hem is not actually trying to solve the game. that post is purely performative, hem doesn't care about re-evaluating at all, hes just making the same tired push he had on day 1

[scamper]

idk if people townread him for the "i should have died", i thought all the people commenting on how it was weird were saying it was scummy weird, but maybe i misinterpreted

i thought there were some people at the time saying it was towny

i admittedly did not fact check that, but its also kind of irrelevant to my overall point if i misremembered how people reacted to that post

[scamper]

Like scampers post is all focused on the reasoning for making the attack and I agree that HEMs attack doesn't make a ton of sense but theres a missing part where you investigate why coming in and attacking you would be a good thing for scum HEM to do and that's the part I don't see?

why is the assumption that scum always plays optimally/"good"

he saw me, saw me making posts discrediting him, and saw it as a threat and decided to push back

the whole mentality of "why would he do that as scum" is superfluous because scum can do things for any of a million reasons that are not always apparent and the assumption scum has to play to a particular mold is ???

what i am trying to bring out is that what hes doing makes no sense from the mindset of a townie actually trying to solve the game

[scamper]

UNVOTE:

sure whatever

feels like im not really getting anything done this game so will check out for a bit. it seems like wagons are going fine without me so i'll see what happens there ig.

sorry i don't want to feel like i'm freezing u out or anything, i just don't agree

@ausuka

maybe when things are quieter we can talk it over more

[scamper]

hem (6): scamper, guiltylion, fireisredsir, datisi, ydrasse, dannflor

thats my unofficial vc of only the votes on hem

[scamper]

I'd like Nero and Ausuka to confirm there's an up to date reads list in their iso or post one.

i dont have reads rn really. i feel like everything i do is wrong or gets shut down immediately and i dont really know where to go now

it seems like hem is going to be eliminated which like... i suppose i could just iso him later and like i might but i just dont have strong feelings and rn i feel fine just watching

pedit: i don't blame you for trying to win the game scamper and im not angry at you or anything i just feel deflated

well like i hate feeling ignored and i dont want u to feel that way even tho i have had disagreement with u (or have info that goes against a read). and im sorry if ive made u feel that way. just step away for a bit and lets come back to things later

[scamper]

I just don't know why anyone thinks gamma could be town outside of vague tone things which I don't agree with this.

idk

this isnt out of her town range but im somewhat concerned

[scamper]

ok thats not true actually i can make a reads list

i dont think its going to be incredibly helpful but it's something like this

{scamper, dats}
{nero, guiltylion, shea}
{deasvail, gamma, s_s}
{enchant, frog, hem, obscure, marci, ydrasse}
{fire, dann}

fire and dann could basically mix with the second bottom tier but thought it might be helpful to separate it out

any reason in particular on fire?

[scamper]

ftr dont put HEM at E-1 because enchant will hammer the wagon if he's around

[scamper]

I think/thought HEM was town b/c I attacked HEM day 1 over his readlist and VP was parroting me.

my issue with this thinking is that it asumes vpb just doesnt attack any of his partners in any way on day 1, and i dont think thats very likely. im looking at a post of his from keep talking and nobody explodes and his readslist had 2 teammates in null and 1 in scumreads, called his teammates forgettable a bunch. not saying he has to follow that exact pattern but i would kind of expect similar treatment - keeping teammates safely at arm's length

so the question is sort of whether there is actual intent to push behind it and i dont think there really was with hem. i don't think "agreeing with a townie's correct read" is out of the question as distancing


this is maybe a stronger point in favor of the firebringer slot being town, if anything

[scamper]

(maybe even more convincingly that i'm being overzealous on shea...)

[scamper]

am i allowed to vote hem

i thought u were townreading him?

he's at E-2 tho so don't do it now

[scamper]

i mean idk if you saw but earlier i posted about how my conclusion from that same linked post from ktane that he treated MT very similarly to he treated irrel here

but i think shea is more likely town now so idk

ill take a look but hes not a priority anymore

[scamper]

I never said I wasn't. And I have been reading his posts, for the most part; just not as carefully, because I didn't plan on engaging with them much.

I don't like this ambivalence. What are you even doing in this game? Your words suggest you should be taken seriously but your ISO suggests you're just here to troll around every once in a while.

thats not really ambivalence, its snark

which is very slightly +town

[scamper]

like scamper could have built a wagon on me all along, damn

i very explicitly have not been trying to strongarm my reads until now because i dont like doing that and my confidence level has not been high enough to warrant doing so. u would know that if u actually cared to read anything i said. i didnt start calling u lockscum until u started making nonsense attacks on me that show u are not concerned with actually solving

[scamper]

Guys I'm sad and now I'm drinking whiskey and watching football. Who wants to chat?

too busy watching the game myself

[scamper]

lol that ending

[scamper]

okay

ill be back i really need to get off this site

if what i did was 2 anti-town 4 everyone then i guess that's my bad i just wanted to be part of this game

so ur plan for "being part of the game" was to antagonize me for suspecting u and dare me to push u, and that was somehow supposed to get u involved, rather than just catching up like a normal person


suffice to say i am skeptical that was something u actually thought up

[scamper]

Tilt Wagon?

i won't deny that there is a fair deal of emotion driving that push but i think pressure is a useful tool regardless and hems reaction to it is a little ~off~ imo

[scamper]

the argument between hem and shea feels like there's a scum in there, doesn't come across as a town vs town argument where both sides are sincere in conviction and hung up on something unimportant is the est way i can describe it.


enchant unfortunately is probably town

[scamper]

and idk, hem obviously did not take me seriously and did not believe i could actually get a wagon on him when he started taunting me

i think that's true regardless of his alignment


my problem is his response to when it happened felt more like he was...trying to cover his tracks for doing so and apologizing for doing the stuff that made him get voted, and it felt like that was more of an appeal to get people to try to back off him rather than expected townie behavior to me?

[scamper]

enchant unfortunately is probably town

what's your reasoning, I'm not there on Enchant yet

because he has ~some amount of actual solving, stuff about hem feels like a real though

[scamper]

FoS dannflor and xoxelf unless someone can meta town send them for me. I have some limited ability to meta the slot dann replaced into (Eiralox) and their play here is pretty scum for them. I have no ability to meta xo they just look like frozen scum to me.

hey so btw i was reminded of this - was there ever an explanation from u as to why eiraloxs play was scum indicative for him?

[scamper]

FoS dannflor and xoxelf unless someone can meta town send them for me. I have some limited ability to meta the slot dann replaced into (Eiralox) and their play here is pretty scum for them. I have no ability to meta xo they just look like frozen scum to me.

hey so btw i was reminded of this - was there ever an explanation from u as to why eiraloxs play was scum indicative for him?

Yeah I've played with him a couple times, he's pretty game solvey as Town

And prefers to lurk as scum.

was this offsite, or wut

[scamper]

he literally hasn't rolled scum in a game on MS though, so i'm not sure where ur getting the notion he lurks as scum...?

[scamper]

he literally hasn't rolled scum in a game on MS though, so i'm not sure where ur getting the notion he lurks as scum...?

I'm definitely making an inductive leap

u literally said he lurks as scum

[scamper]

like, i have no idea how u get the notion that he is definitely scum by meta off his 8 posts in this game, cuz they were basically all trolling, and he certainly didnt get serious in 2277 in his first 8 posts. his posts in 2279 are basically nonsense (and that was ongoing when u replaced in so its not like it could have influenced ur read), and overall im not seeing how u got a confident meta scum read based on those posts that u have been tunneling on all game now

[scamper]

his posts in 2279 are basically nonsense (and that was ongoing when u replaced in so its

I didn't replace into 2279, I had a correct read on Eir the entire game even against heavy resistance and when he read flipped on me.

i mean when u replaced into this game u couldn't have know he was town in that one...

his posts in 2279 are basically nonsense (and that was ongoing when u replaced in so its

I didn't replace into 2279, I had a correct read on Eir the entire game even against heavy resistance and when he read flipped on me.

And Eir correctly called 2/3 scum on D1 once he started drinking.

okay, but again, he was in this game for all of 2 days and likely couldnt handle the volume, which isnt AI

so this notion of him being strong scum by meta just sounds made up...

[scamper]

if u had said "this isnt like his town game" i could maybe accept that but u made up a statement about scum meta that doesnt actually exist

[scamper]

thats not what u said, tho

I have some limited ability to meta the slot dann replaced into (Eiralox) and their play here is pretty scum for them.

what u said is this

[scamper]

again tho, he literally made up a statement about scum meta that does not exist

like, how is that not just an outright lie?

[scamper]

I have some limited ability to meta

? I was feel like I was pretty up-front from the beginning.

then why did u say "he lurks as scum", something that is completely unverifiable?


further, what is ur actual case on dann as it presently stands?

[scamper]

no thats fine you dont need to do this here


clearly the point i am trying to make is being lost

[scamper]

dannflor has fucking posts, how is he lurk scum

[scamper]

dannflor has 152 posts, how is he lurk scum

EBWOP

somehow deleted the number and not the cursing

[scamper]

those posts look perfectly fine?

again your literal case for your strongest scumread who your vote is currently on, on day 2 with a flipped scum, is "he's active lurking"

like...how is that a real read?

[scamper]

those posts look perfectly fine?

again your literal case for your strongest scumread who your vote is currently on, on day 2 with a flipped scum, is "he's active lurking"

like...how is that a real read?

IDK I think killing active lurkers D2 is a good bet, are you disagreeing that Dann is active lurking?

yes

[scamper]

I feel a bit hypocritical for saying this but part of me is thinking that maybe we should just eliminate HEM.

why

[scamper]

I feel a bit hypocritical for saying this but part of me is thinking that maybe we should just eliminate HEM.

why

Frogster is seeming a bit more townie to me now, plus I think HEM’s play since the wagon formed is more scummy than townie, the refusal to claim particularly so.

ok

[scamper]

I think frogsters claim to know a scum game that doesn't exist squares very much with the other random pronouncements frogster has made this game.

Like I don't understand why scamper is picking up on this now but he was totally fine with frogster when he was saying me asking him to explain a wagon was scum AI.

i haven't been paying as much attention to him as i probably should be

[scamper]

I would argue that Enchant being able to use words isn't town tell. Like he's not some Vi that's incapable of showing a pulse

Making my semi-yearly mafia appearance with a playerlist I'm pretty excited about.

While its great to hear from you it would have been much better if you talked about the first 8 pages.

You going to be this annoying all game or just play mafia?

can I get some opinions on this? Is this VP defending a buddy or white knighting town?

if i had to guess i'd say i'd expect him to be more cautious about a teammate who isn't contributing much but with one post it can really go either way

[scamper]

i don't really trust the claim but w/e, am okay with voting somewhere else today

[scamper]

Whats wrong with SKs?

posts made by a serial killer

Spoiler:

not serious

I definitely thought multiball was just explicitly not-normal

I've had a busy couple days at work. Catching up now

multiball yes but SKs are still allowed in larges

[scamper]

My hackles are still raised about obscure who theoretically should have "checked in about twice" yesterday and didnt see his name so didnt post.

i wuld gladly wagon obscure

[scamper]

Hm ydrasse reaction actually seems super townie to me here tbh.

agreed

[scamper]

i don't really think dv is scum but i'm just kind of tired

[scamper]

and i am increasingly having Concerns about frog

[scamper]

VOTE: obscure

[scamper]

VOTE: obscure

How much of this is because obscure is not posting?

Do you think his relative inactivity is alignment-relevant?

i have raised issues with believing obscure's posting seems fake since early on in the day and little has changed for me since then

[scamper]

omg deas is finally being wagoned!!

also i'm alive. but apparently people want to kill me because i'm busy >.> like i get it, i clearly can't keep up with the game so feel free to just off me, but i'm still a villager.

the length of the phases is just not for me

ftr, the usage of the term "villager" is, like, highly indicative u have played on mafia universe...

[scamper]

hmm

maybe both wagons are right

this post gives me the heebie jeebies though

[scamper]

UNVOTE:

sigh


i don't really feel good about forcing through another compromise elim on a lurker especially when a lot of my reasons are (admittedly) paranoid theorizing

i'd rather just follow someone else's lead for today

[scamper]

@obscure i'm sorry this game isn't working out for you, i feel like this game is not a good introduction to MS for a variety of reasons, the phase lengths might not be for you but i hope you'll at least give it another try in a smaller game

[scamper]

i would be Interested in hearing from ausuka on fire

i'd also be fine with letting nero lead because i think he's town and clearly me trying to have things my way is not going great

[scamper]

I've hated pretty much this whole game.

sorry about that, ftr. realize it wasnt all my fault but i feel partially responsible

hope we can make it better going forward at the least

VOTE: Morning Tweet

gamma has a history of replacing out as scum + his vote on HEM was scummy as shit

will probs just follow nero

tweet feels over-reactive

[scamper]

Sweet, don't say any more, pretty sure you didn't have a PT to catch you up.

[scamper]

So people are just willing to toss aside all the tone reasons they told me about gamma when I was scum reading her now? Can someone explain to me why?

a long time has elapsed and i was likely wrong on a lot of my other reads so im willing to re-evaluate and let others take the lead to see if they have a better idea

[scamper]

hi, i've had a busy day but i'm here

kind of out of it, if there's been any new development lmk

will try to catch up

[scamper]

claim from tweet feels designed to buy time

mb on gamma

[scamper]

oh in that case

VOTE: MT


i would like to reiterate to the vigs i have a clear on datisi so please do not shoot either of us, ty

[scamper]

[scamper]

im all right, hbu

about to make a waffle for breakfast

[scamper]

ty

salt & vinegar is a good flavor, i hope u enjoy ur lunch

[scamper]

I'm going to do a booty dance to every person who kept telling me to stop scum reading gamma because of tone and emotion if MT flips red.

i have pretty much already accepted the loss on that one and that i was too quick to write off scummy behavior as "gamma being gamma" because she was similarly potato-like in another game. for being wrong it desnt hurt too bad ig because its still only day 2 so, like, w/e

[scamper]

VOTE: mena

i read up overnight and i think the comments about obscure from gamma and vice versa look like distancing

there's a little friction but no real attempt to push each other


i want to go here today

[scamper]

also i'm a little annoyed at the enchant shot

[scamper]

Something_Smart (6): GuiltyLion, Frogsterking, scamper, fireisredsir, Ydrasse, humaneatingmonkey

in scamper's pov i am lurking scum who voted with him on his scumread so he should probably be unvoting now if his reads are real

r u saying i should be assuming ur scum and s_s is town?

that seems to be exactly what he's saying
I kinda get the sense he's feeling pinned by him + S_S being in the PoE
VOTE: Something_Smart
I also agree w the anti-spew bit somewhat, plus this is where there's a wagon in the last VC I saw

i dont think this is,like, impossible to be a bus but the vote is pretty icky

[scamper]

Something_Smart (6): GuiltyLion, Frogsterking, scamper, fireisredsir, Ydrasse, humaneatingmonkey

in scamper's pov i am lurking scum who voted with him on his scumread so he should probably be unvoting now if his reads are real

r u saying i should be assuming ur scum and s_s is town?

that seems to be exactly what he's saying
I kinda get the sense he's feeling pinned by him + S_S being in the PoE
VOTE: Something_Smart
I also agree w the anti-spew bit somewhat, plus this is where there's a wagon in the last VC I saw

i dont think this is,like, impossible to be a bus but the vote is pretty icky

what was the vc around the time?

i was just checking this and i think SS was at 1 vote lol

oh, lmao

i was just looking at the iso and didnt check the post number

[scamper]

im actually going to be annoyed if i was right on firebringer and got distracted by hem...

[scamper]

i'm rereading s_s and i feel like i never should have stopped pushing there

[scamper]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: s_s

[scamper]

I greatly dislike that neither S_S or obscure were on Gamma/Tweet yesterday and I don't think it takes a genius to realize Tweet was probably being bussed at the time they replaced in.

that assumes that scum were around to throw gammaslot under the bus, its entirely circumstantial

[scamper]

I love it when people arbitrarily decide what wagons are acceptable.

GL did you just say I was scum for not leveraging my vote?

part of me just thinks is scum. If we let her live and she's scum she'll just claim roleblocked.

Which is a problem why?

these are all the posts from s_s after tweet replaced in

he didnt really address the wagon in a meaningful way at all

[scamper]

I greatly dislike that neither S_S or obscure were on Gamma/Tweet yesterday and I don't think it takes a genius to realize Tweet was probably being bussed at the time they replaced in.

that assumes that scum were around to throw gammaslot under the bus, its entirely circumstantial

What do you mean?

ovscure had entirely flaked on the game so the argument "scum would have bussed" doesnt, like, do a whole lot for obscures slot

[scamper]

You don't think Tweet would do more if it was their job to carry the team?

not really, no

repping into a scum slot in a 200 page game wuld be demotivating for most players and tweet isnt especially motivated as scum. if her teams not doing well i culd easily see her phoning it in. i dont think trying to base reads off that sole event is likely to be too useful

[scamper]

im not, like, saying its *impossible* tweet got bussed by someone but i wouldnt just assume it by default

[scamper]

Like are we not going to talk about frogsterkings play at the end of the day at all? We're just going to go right back to something smart when frogsterking did basically "try to save my buddy and then hammer when it becomes clear I cant 101"

we are on differing wavelengths this game it seems

i was starting to distrust frog yesterday because i thought he was pushing people in a potentially disingenuous manner

im not like, sure he plays that way around the MT wagon though but i'll go back and check

admittedly part of it was i think obscure seems somewhat more likely than him based on gammas posts

[scamper]

I'm not upset about this by the way! TPRs get shot/blown up, it happens, it's their job

I mean, they would have inherited vig and become conftown otherwise...

on second thought im kind of glad enchant didnt become a vig

[scamper]

The dogpiling jokes aside I will give something_smart a chance to get involved in the game I suppose.

VOTE: Gamma

Gamma who are the scum and why

Marci
One of you/obscure
humaneatingmonkey
And maybe someone else

also GL commented on this post but in general I tend to think scum can't resist putting a buddy in their "solve" when asked for a scum team or a list of scum reads. even when they are down a buddy. even when their team isn't in a good position.

I think there's a psychological thing where unless you're an extremely confident player you feel like you're gonna get caught out or feel incredible if you list all town reads. despite the fact that their alignments may all be unknown at the time there's a fear that when they are all flipped you're going to look extremely bad.

so in general I'd expect 1 scum in Marci/HEM/Shea/Menalque

and I don't think it is Shea

i think its generally true and i would expect it to be true for gamma

[scamper]

VOTE: mena

hi!

do u mind explaining why u showed as having a gun last night?

[scamper]

so ur saying there's no way ur role would give a positive result to a gunsmith?

[scamper]

that is a hardclaim, btw

n1 result was obviously dats and i wasnt subtle about it (was a low end townread who i easily could have been wrong on)

[scamper]

ok then what are u claiming

[scamper]

ok

sorry u had to rep into this slot ig

[scamper]

that is a hardclaim, btw

why would you announce you were gunsmith before Mena claimed, giving him the opportunity to fakeclaim a role with a gun?

because it was (somewhat ill thought out) reaction test obviously

UNVOTE:

im not *thrilled* with the response but i dont want to confbias it

[scamper]

was worth a try

Please tell me the datisi clear was not in fact a reaction test

no, i wuldnt do that

[scamper]

because it was (somewhat ill thought out) reaction test obviously

Nah, that's reasonable. But I guess yeah it doesn't really accomplish much if scum-Mena knows his slot already claimed.

wait my slot had already claimed lol

yeah that was partly why i did it

[scamper]

anyway my thoughts on the game are still a mess because i havent done a thorough re-eval, ill try to figure out how i feel about everyone later tonite

[scamper]

Has anyone looked at fireisred/gamma interactions yet?

I am going to do that at some point today (realistically probably late tonight) but I'm thinking about a fire vote myself due to lack of appealing options elsewhere currently and it feels like fire's wim has kinda gone down as the game has gone on

fire what are your overall opinions on the GammaTweet lim, like do you think that was all town and scum got caught off guard or do you think there's any scum who were angling to look good off it

i looked at it early, fire voted gamma early and then back down, they wound up townreading each other later and not interacting much

nothing really concrete

[scamper]

I kind of half want scamper to claim the real target since I assume it's a clear on a generally ??? slot and my PoE is getting tighter.

Unless the gunsmith thing was also just fake. I suppose thats actually probably more likely. Hard to know where the real ends and the reaction test begins.

i dont actually have a n2 result. if people really want to alleviate the ~burning air of mystery~ i can just claim if its deemed necessary

[scamper]

lmfao okay, i thought it was a Hot New Mafia Term that i wasn't aware of

i did note in my mind that if irrel is scum, then he spent a decent amount of time day one loldistancing with his buddies (vpb, gamma), which like, i don't know *why* you'd do that and irrel doesn't strike me as a player who would prioritize something like that as scum

i guess? i'm fine leaving shea alone for now, especially if the majority also says so

he did some token distancing early on in the most recent scum game i could find but it was also from 4 years ago

[scamper]

okay, then do something that is hard for you to replicate as scum?

*gestures at my ISO*

xcuse me? wut have u done this game that is hard for u to replicate as scum?

[scamper]

i should probably read before replying, nvm that

[scamper]

i do not really like the actual reasons in 5950 but w/e this probably isnt helpful to talk about

[scamper]

i have almost no townreads i feel confident about beyond the consensus ones which is fun™. i had GL but the recent pages gave me Doubts and now im a bit adrift

if we can correctly trim the poe down to 6 names we should be good but there's a lot to review

[scamper]

i think DV looks moderately ok from how he was pestering gamma

not, like, impossible to be out of the realm of bussing while knowing he's likely to not get listened to be i wouldnt wanna flip hm right away

i feel like its probably wiser to resolve the 'easy' looking answers before deciding if someone was bussing

[scamper]

I kind of think Menalque might be scum too . I don't townread his reaction to the scamper gambit and think he could have plausibly faked not knowing the slot already claimed VT. he replaced in during the night after all.

i kind of agree but other people were saying it was townie so i thought i might just be crazy

i think he'll probably(?) get easier to read given a little so im ok with not flipping him right away but i'd still have him in the poe especially given gammas handling of obscure

[scamper]

*given a little time ebwop

[scamper]

While I have you scamper, who are the consensus townreads you mentioned in 6129?

nero/ausuka (and dats and u but thats mech obv)

[scamper]

This type of pushing is present in HDP, as well as a lot of promises to deliver invaluable reads on certain players (Galron and Mala in particular). He shows a lot more conventional attempts at scum hunting in his scum game than he does in games like this. In this game and the other Town game I played with him I'd describe his play as agnostic, like he's not convinced players can actually form reads which aren't made up.

im reading he mini normal and he actually did produce reads there (and votes)

[scamper]

I could really use a VC

sure ill just updated the most re-oh we havent had one since day start

ok

[scamper]

unofficial vc 3.1

Something_Smart (5): Nero Cain, fireisredsir, GuiltyLion, Ydrasse, DeasVail
fireisredsir (3): Datisi, Menalque, Thestatusquo
Menalque (2): Dannflor, Frogsterking
Datisi (1): Ausuka

Not voting (3): scamper, Cat Scratch Fever, Something_Smart


note: votes are not necessarily in the order they were placed

[scamper]

@scamper what would it take for you to get reinvested in this game.

i am invested, i've just been a bit busy so i've been in observer mode for a bit. im just not sure i have any startling insights to share at this juncture

[scamper]

even if we want to argue that refire is a "deepwolf" I'm not sure if going for a hero lim is the best use of the days votes. A slot that no one wants to be in (mena) or someone that's had very little activity until today (SS) seems like it would be a better lim, no?

I still feel like GL might have been distancing from VP but eh, we'll see.

fwiw i basically agree with this and think there are at least some form of associations toward both slots

also think most other people have given me *some* reason to think they are towny and those two just havent

and im not a fan of mena going to lurking the moment the attention on him started to dissipate...

[scamper]

vip vote gamma pls

Let's lim GL first, then gamma.

i came back to this post because i wanted to see who was pushing gamma before she did the selfvote and AtE routine (marci and hem so not useful) but i think unless vp was working some sort of 8th dimensional chess routine GL is just town

[scamper]

not to feed the "hehe fire is defending scumpartner mena" narrative too much but

his first and last post were like 2 hours apart

idk if that really qualifies as "going to lurking" or that there's any real connection between attention disippating and him leaving, i think he just had a window where he was actively posting and then he hasn't been posting since then

i think the attention on him has been fairly steady

it has been over 24 hours since he last posted

[scamper]

Datisi, Cat Scratch Fever
Nero Cain, Ausuka
Dannflor, GuiltyLion, Ydrasse
Thestatusquo, Frogsterking
DeasVail, fireisredsir
Something_Smart, Menalque


even wrt DV/fire, they have points going for them that make me doubt as to whther they could be scum...its really just the bottom 2 slots of almost no content, and i dont get why people are even ascribing towniness to an hour of posting from mena when i think the associations between obscure and gamma are pretty bad

[scamper]

i wish i wasn't cleared so that i could argue with people about why my play is definitely town

i mean, i could retract the claim if u want

[scamper]

VOTE: mena

this slot is a problem regardless of alignment but i still believe it has a more than reasonable chance of flipping scum

[scamper]

um, so

[scamper]

hi, i need to catch up again

[scamper]

It's scum looking for that long shot chance

How does that make any sense? Why wouldn't I just push for Mena if I wanted someone to die who isn't me?

I feel like Something_Smart as town would actually be more survivalist here? Voting Nero seems to me like an attempt at looking town.

fwiw i saw that earlier and i kind of agree with this...

[scamper]

im not exactly whelmed by those mena posts, the previous pages didnt give me a whole lot to comment on otherwise

id still swap to vote s_s, me voting anyone else today would take a strongly worded case

[scamper]

I’m at the stage where I think both S_S and Menalque are scummy but I don’t necessarily think they’re scum together and I don’t know how to feel about that.

is there a particular reason u believe they are unaligned?

[scamper]

I’m at the stage where I think both S_S and Menalque are scummy but I don’t necessarily think they’re scum together and I don’t know how to feel about that.

is there a particular reason u believe they are unaligned?

Menalque’s weak reasoning for townreading Firebringer feels a bit blatant for scum
who knows that Fb was scum.

I guess it’s not that unlikely, but idk. It doesn’t feeel like that’s the solve.

i don't necessarily want to get ahead of myself or anything, but *hypothetically* in a world where mena is scum he basically does not expect to endgame and is mostly trying to be confusing. i would put more emphasis on the slot's play from earlier days in terms of looking at potential (un)alignment with other players

[scamper]

VOTE: something_smart

[scamper]

i'm sorry about last game day

i just got frustrated/impatient because the game seemed to be in a holding pattern of stalling to give mena another day to post content and i snapvoted

i didnt really think there would be such a quick pile-on to my vote and thats my bad for not backing off

im still kind of lost and my wim has gone missing but ill try to reset and see what i can do

[scamper]

sorry for being inactive, i had a busy day yesterday

going to try to digest the cases that have been made now

[scamper]

well that downtime certainly did not help with my lack of focus in this game...i think the issue is i've kind of positioned myself in a spot where it's hard for me to interact with or pressure people meaningfully, and idk what to to about that. i thought the points frog was making abt fire made at least some degree of sense but i wanna see whatever case fire supposedly had that was in the works

[scamper]

So are you not willing to full claim today?

y does it matter?

[scamper]

meh. i'm just a mason. i think scum have likely figured this out by now so might as well not be secretive about it. i was ambiguous in an attempt to potentially draw a roleblock or NK but then of course both vigs ended up outing. sorry for any confusion caused by this.

[scamper]

nero pushing ausuka feels really, really bad to me

[scamper]

it's also possible that scum didn't know you were the other mason so great job that. The townplay this game, so stunning.

ok but i had claimed a pr anyway so the difference is...?

[scamper]

I repeat:

So there is no clear on datisi?

there *obviously* is, i wouldn't gambit a play like that

i just wanted to avoid the possibility of him getting vigged because ausuka was tunneling him

[scamper]

I repeat:

So there is no clear on datisi?

there *obviously* is, i wouldn't gambit a play like that

i just wanted to avoid the possibility of him getting vigged because ausuka was tunneling him

So you're saying that datisi is your mason partner and not the flipped mason?

are you not able to understand that there are allowed to be more than 2 masons in a game

[scamper]

like, i'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish here

do u think i possibly could attempt a mason fakeclaim here? as though that wouldn't be immediately outing?

[scamper]

okay, well, i'm going to not take you seriously if you believe that i would make a claim taht would get instantly countered and out me. if u are town this is ridiculous and incredibly unproductive to be focusing on rn

[scamper]

Scamper. During the rxn test on mena you claimed/faked claimed GS. What do you think of Ausuka saying that its dubious that I (and others?) thought you were a GS with an inno on Dats?

i don't think anything of it

y'all are all town can you chill

i am *fine* ftr

[scamper]

...we're a mason trio

i had ydrasse as locktown since day 1 and defended her, this is verifiable


i hid datisi toward the bottom of my townreads because i was hiding him but pulled the claim day 2 because i didn't have the energy to argue down ausuka from scumreading him

like, there are crumbs but given there are two of us alive it shouldn't be that necessary

[scamper]

y'all are all town can you chill

then who's scum

[scamper]

I mean I don't think it's shea

(i don't think he's scum either i just wanted to get fire to give an actual answer)

[scamper]

I mean I don't think it's shea

(i don't think he's scum either i just wanted to get fire to give an actual answer)

i think ive been p clear lately that i think its frog/mena/GL but maybe not idk

why do you suspect GL

[scamper]

Scamper. During the rxn test on mena you claimed/faked claimed GS. What do you think of Ausuka saying that its dubious that I (and others?) thought you were a GS with an inno on Dats?

i don't think anything of it

Well I mean I think assuming that you were a GS was kinda the normal thought here and several others had mentioned that Dats could be a scum doc since I think most ppl were under the impression that you were a GS. Does it not bother you at all Ausuka didn't seem to think you were a GS?

why should it bother me?

[scamper]

I guess where I'm coming from is that most ppl thought you were a GS and if Ausuka is scum that rolecopped you she'd know you weren't a GS but I guess that only makes sense to me.

i think that's a pretty farfetched theory that also relies on the assumption ausuka is completely incapable of hiding being informed about someone's role

[scamper]

anyway...

i'm going to try to review everyone over the next few days to be sure (minus csf and dats), it's just hard when a game is this dense and i feel like things are kind of...disjointed in terms of all the replacements. would be easier when the game is down to fewer names but i really don't have that luxury

anyawy now that info is out in the open i *want* to say this feels like a 5 scum setup just b/c all the masons, the vigs, and the UB are confirmable town roles which is a lot in a 20p although ofc there's room for friendly fire...but i think generally it's best to play assuming a potential worst case scenario rather than hoping for a less powerful scum team. just keep it in mind for the future

[scamper]

This

Its like he saw it was MT who replaced in, knew that MT doesn't try very hard as a scum replace in and decided ok time to go gamma even though all the information that he is talking about had been available previously.

i dont think the vote in and of itself is incriminating tbh but i do think his handling of gamma isnt really as clearing as i thought it was

[scamper]

I am hoping people have had better reasons to town read Nero than just Gamma getting mad at Nero

I've seen Gamma get very emotional towards scum mates more than once

i mean part of it was that i just felt he was expressing real thoughts with the stuff he was going after and getting annoyed that his reads were called bad and stuff, plus in general seemed to be scumreading vpb + gamma


but if you look where his vote actually went and how little effort he put toward convincing people to vote gamma until the replace, its a bit......not great. and i feel like hes been pushing people for shallow reasons and him going after ausuka is pretty icky

[scamper]

I think the Baltar associatives for Nero were good though, I need to reread those but Baltar felt very awkward explaining why he wasn't fighting with Nero and I sorta believe him when he said if they were scum together they'd probably ham up a shitfight

felt very much more like Baltar was playing around Nero

if anything i feel like their conversations were kind of awkward?

[scamper]

idk, i need sleep

back tomorrow maybe

[scamper]

i agree nero's push on me is ??? but like, i felt the same in the last game we played together and thought he was just tunneling me and that turned out to be correct. and i get a similar feeling in this game.

i feel like this sort of stubborness is the sort of thing i expect from town nero?

i still feel like the push on gamma and her replacing out is not the sort of thing i expect from s/s but it seems like people disagree with that

i guess my big reservation wrt this is - how do u expect him to play as scum? bc i would expect that level of "stubbornness" would not actually be all that hard to emulate and im not particularly willing to give him credit for doing the bare minimum of pushing people

[scamper]

VOTE: Menalque

I'm done waiting around for him to do more than he has and I think his latest non-effort felt like a white flag

I want to graduate my townread on Dann from "lazy" to "well justified" but frankly still haven't committed time to do it rigorously yet, but idk the Mena/Frog theory just feels appealing, even if there's a fifth scum the conf pool is large enough that I'm not really worried yet

i haven't gone back to read fire's case yet but my big hangup there is that gamma was doing a thing where he was voting frog while fosing obscure and it seemed unlikely he'd just be bussing both partners in that fashion

[scamper]

admittedly the trajectory on suspicious slots from frog is concerning and a lot of his pushes just feel disingenuous (i went to search his iso and found 5104, which i hate) im just not sure he's scum but i would be fine with flipping him

[scamper]

i think we need to flip mena atp

sorry for being so underwhelming i don't think my brain is turning back on for this game

[scamper]

is titus actually claiming vig because that would kind of explain the lack of csf dying

[scamper]

enchant also feels more like a shot nero would make

[scamper]

if csf is occupying a mafia slot that has been allowed to ride for 3 game days off a vig claim i will blow a gasket


if you are just pulling some weird shenanigans as a replacement i will be mildly annoyed

[scamper]

anyway i guess there is not a *ton* of point in discussing it further, if u are actually a vig then csf should be shot without question. it does kind of mess up potential worldviews that have been developed


ironically this *still* would mean frog is very suspect in my eyes based on stuff wrt hem

[scamper]

anyway i guess there is not a *ton* of point in discussing it further, if u are actually a vig then csf should be shot without question. it does kind of mess up potential worldviews that have been developed


ironically this *still* would mean frog is very suspect in my eyes based on stuff wrt hem

It would.

Can you elaborate on Frog?

basically day 2 i flipped out at hem because he was making awful nonsense shade toward me and was taunting me for no discernible reason, i pulled up a wagon on him and he gave some weird excuse about doing it to help get him into the game, then claimed gated vig, and was pseudo-confirmed by marci claiming a little while later

at the time when i was pulling out the wago on hem frog was trying to pump the brakes on it by calling it a "tilt wagon", which, tbf there was some emotion in it but i did feel like hem being needlessly provocative to me didnt really make sense as coming from town

[scamper]

looking back I wonder if ydrasse was thought to be the actual vig based off her reaction to the HEM claim

ydra had been pulling a thing where she was alluding to being some confirmable role but not hardclaiming it

[scamper]

i haven't gone back to read fire's case yet but my big hangup there is that gamma was doing a thing where he was voting frog while fosing obscure and it seemed unlikely he'd just be bussing both partners in that fashion

yea i remember thinking that felt not S/S/S but like... idk it's probably not out of range for gamma to pull that as scum in an attempted wifom. i dunno if i want to rule them out as a team just off that when a lot of other things make it seem likely

p sure i do remember a certain someone saying that gamma had a bad habit of bussing her whole team as scum

that could be false but i don't want to try to fact check rn

i took a look at lost and it was p conclusively not true there and he tried defending teammates a fair deal there unless they were getting significant pressure in which case he'd bus (which would make that hem vote everyone rightly called gamma out on Notable). that is probably somewhat complicated by it being a hydra but idk not worth spending too much time trying to sort that out

ofc this gets a wrench thrown in the works if csf is scum

[scamper]

We need CSF here to double down on his claim and put out his reads list.

If CSF doubles down, we let bullets do the talking and eliminate Menalque.

csf is a she ftr

[scamper]

I thought Shea was town slipping originally

...
if csf is scum
then that could really explain the shea/csf talk that went on shortly after she repped in where he was like "csf claim" and then he went "well ok she reacted very quickly, i think she's town"

bruh

i am going to break down in tears lmao

[scamper]

lowkey CSF has been scummy since replace in but

she was, but i chalked it up to "conftown feeling burned out" because got knows i'm feeling it too

but

i assumed it had to do with "game is impossibly huge at this point and catching up would be incredibly difficult", which would be completely understandable for most players, but certainly i hadn't realized how little she'd done to this point becaue i had stopped paying attention to her slot

[scamper]

the one thing that's wild to me is how did HEM know to claim modified vig if he's scum
scum must be informed in some way or have a doc or BP something

or they had just rolecopped marci

[scamper]

VOTE: csf

[scamper]

the best part is the person we would need to yell at here is site banned so we can't do it lol

but fucking hell nero

[scamper]

idk do I need to respond to respond to the question about Nero now

obv not lol

[scamper]

i don't think there's much left to say for anyone other than titus/shea, so i'd like the two of you to let us know when you're down. i'd like to keep the game moving along now that we finally feel like playing again

i mean they're both voting csf soooooooooooo.....

[scamper]

personally i would suggesting ending the day and vigging mena before the mod has to replace the slot again

[scamper]

hi guys are we enjoying life

wow this is the most fun this game has been in weeks

[scamper]

how r u on this fine day while we await the mod lock

[scamper]

also hot take but D1 scum flips in larges are usually bad for town motivation long term

eh i think data shows flipping scum earlier is better than later (big shock) but it can be harder to find associatives with an early flip

[scamper]

personally my biggest takeaway is it's probably not good play to let scum claim your role for 3 straight days while shooting and pushing consensus town

[scamper]

how r u on this fine day while we await the mod lock

I am ill unfortunately and feel like a potato

im sorry to hear that! i hope u feel better soon

[scamper]

mafia game where it starts as 5 people and only one of them is mafia

that's not mafia

also yes, a while ago ducky told me that the ultimate strategy as scum in micros is "lolbus day 1 cruise into yeetlo" and they had a point

>:|

[scamper]

....................../´¯/)
....................,/¯../
.................../..../
............./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
........../'/.../..../......./¨¯\
........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
.........\.................'...../
.......''..\................ _.·´
............\..............(
..............\.............\...

[scamper]

maybe titus can finish her vca by the next time the mod checks the site