The Mystery Box Of Silver 5: Clash of Cash death grips
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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oh a survivor claim on page three and then pages and pages of setup speculation how fun
initial reaction was to anything resembling policy stances but then there were so many
In post 67, Fuscosco wrote:A nonslot is a scumslot so far as im concerned anyway.In post 69, Old Dogs wrote:im gonna ballpark and say if we dont catch any scum until D3 we look into that unless there's a vig in which case idkIn post 72, ElevenThirty wrote:Like i dont think ur my go to lynch but i'm not going to protest ur lynch either, and if idk where to vote at deadline it's prob going to be u.
probably some more I kinda stopped counting after a while.In post 198, mastina wrote:Given that this game is explicitly advertised as being 3p heavy though I'll policy lynch any player who unironically suggests lynching third parties.
I took special notice of Old Dogs directing a vig to shoot the survivor without stopping to think that may be a bad idea given
andIn post 56, Chickadead wrote:We've an active ability to help keep us alive.And also Fuscosco taking special interest in said NK deterrents in 123
Mastina not wanting to lynch 3p in a maybe 3p heavy game seems like bad policy
Over time came to like ElevenThirty more and more so far. Got strong town vibes from Voted early on, then bad but still prob town after the first reads list. ZZZX has read as strong town to me so far.
Toog took the most hardline stance on the survivor claim and got the biggest YIKES in my notes so far. 189 stuck out as pretty reasonable logic to me though.
My reaction/notes on the survivor claim:
the survivor claim doesn't feel right to me. The "we're going to be totally aloof and not help anyone so scum doesn't kill us because that's what's best for our wincon" part seems wrong. since when does scum need motivation to not target a survivor? Towns, on the other hand, need lots of motivation to not lynch them, as evidenced by the reactions.
so thats my thoughts on the first dozenish pages more later after lunch-
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I thought you were fishing for info regarding the nk mechanic. I may have whooshed a bit on the context there.In post 1137, pisskop wrote:Ummm not to get all uppity over a small point, but you read the context, do you think said deterrents were the subject of my post?
Forgot? Over the 13 posts and 43min real time between chickdeads claim and your mention of vigging?In post 1140, Old Dogs wrote:i completely forgot that chickadead claimed bp/commuter/self protective lol, my stance on survivors is if you Really Want Them Gone vig them like you would any other empty slot
I understand that's what chickdeads said, it just seems pretty obviously not the correct way to go about claiming survivor but eh not much to get out of dwelling on it nowand rhinox the point of RAS's stance is that by playing normally and not claiming survivor/being useful in anyway, you could potentially give scum a reason to want to shoot a survivor. if a survivor is leading lynches on scum scum arent really going to care about the early lylo survivor is meant to give-
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Toog why would you say this given your claimed role?In post 189, Toogeloo wrote:The setup has been advertised as having multiple third parties, which means that as town, we want as many gone as we can in order to remove the swing potential of the game.-
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Was this not suggesting to any potential vig to shoot chickdead?In post 69, Old Dogs wrote:it's also not +EV to lynch a survivor until day-before-lylo because they count as mislynches when it comes to town wincon :grimace:
im gonna ballpark and say if we dont catch any scum until D3 we look into thatunless there's a vigin which case idk - also im pretty sure the 3p is probably tied to the setup's unique mechanic so we probably dont want to lynch there anyway?-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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This feels like buddying... Err .. pocketing? Is that what the kids are calling it these days?In post 1205, Chickadee wrote:Rhinox - haven't talked about this slot yet, I like their posting so far. Feels gamesolvey
Given your claimed strat is townhunting I'd expect to require more to end up in your townreads-
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Why is zzzx in your scum reads? He was my strongest town read when catching up?In post 1283, Chickadee wrote:It's very close to end of day, it would be super easy for you to come in and coast through the rest of today, hopping on a wagon. Instead you're catching up and questioning things.
Also why are you willing to lunch zeebu? You told zeebu you didn't believe deads survivor claim and then later you said he's likely not group scum so what about being not a survivor and not scum makes you willing to lunch?-
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Oh wait never mind the zeebu part thenIn post 1215, Chickadee wrote:I agree, the survivor claim is low on my priority list, and we should look elsewhere for now.-
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This is like the secret day action equivalent of scum commenting on the night actions at the start of the next day. Do you think it actually indicates anything or is this just posturing?In post 1207, insomnia wrote:Am I missing something or since when do survivors remove votes from them-
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What am I missing all I found was some throwaway line suggesting mastina could be lying and mastina never posted anything more about her acquired ability so what details was she provoked to reveal?In post 1210, The Three Musketeers wrote:Tbh, I'd lynched her just for provoking mastina to give more details on masonizer claim
~Aramis
What do you feel about 1130's post regarding mastina's claim?
In post 370, ElevenThirty wrote:
huhIn post 335, mastina wrote:What.
Why did I just become a masonizer?
I gained that role, but it wasn't the role I started with.
my guess is that someone thinks that your readslist was:
a) serious (still can't tell if it was or wasn't)
b) might prompt you to masonize someoen beneficial to them
the 3 missing people probably had something to do with it-
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Eh the "essentially" seems like a distinction without a difference.In post 1292, The Three Musketeers wrote:mastina changed from masonizer to essentially masonizer after Chicka's "throwaway line". Why would you ever call out mastina here and not leave scum to deal with it for time being? I could understand, if mastina was Chicka's scumread, but that's nit the case
You talk about 370 post from 1130? It's NAI speculation
~Aramis
And here you're saying it's the "calling out mastina" that's the problem. Why did it take 900posts for you to mention this? It wasn't part of your reasoning for initially voting Dee way back here (which was after Dee accused mastina of possibly lying):
In post 388, The Three Musketeers wrote:VOTE: Chicadee
Athos found 284 and 286 scummy, Porthos approved this vote, so here we are
From me, I feel like she's just making empty posts, avoiding taking any stances by herself - like she agreed with my stance on survivor claim, later she liked Voted vote on us. 327 looks really funny after 286. Claims townhunting, but I see no progress there
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But the logic doesn't make sense. There's no downside I can see to drawing attention to it, because if chicka was trying to get mastina to reveal more about her role then drawing attention to it likely prevents that from happening.In post 1298, The Three Musketeers wrote:Just because mastina didn't spill all the beans doesn't makes Chicka's provocation any better - it's scum motivation to figure out if claim is real and they must deal with it or it's bogus and they can ignore it. Town have nothing to do with it, unless they think it comes from scum, but that's not the case here
I think it's obvious enough - I didn't wanted draw attention to it and there was enough other reasons for a vote and scumread. Why I brought it up now? mastina responded to it and I decided to use it to try get this lynch trough since we close to EoD and I need all I can get to get it through
~Aramis
Eh let's continue this day 2 if we have to. I'm not lynching chicka today but I do need to decide realistically where to vote.-
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I scumread insomnia for 1388. Town don't coach their scum suspects on why they're being a bad townie.
I keep finding reasons to dislike 3musketeers posting too for example when re-reading vorkuta just now I saw 3M called out dee for being willing to lynch her townread but said nothing when vorkuta did the same thing a page earlier (1071 and 1073).
If it has to be vorkuta today because deadline I suppose I'm ok throwing the hammer but wouldn't be my first choice for rope if we had more time.-
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not really a big fan of nk wifom.... You're planting an idea here but not doing the leg work on it yourself.In post 1465, ElevenThirty wrote:3 Musketeers is a kinda weird nk imo, if they were it;i'll have to check who they were scumreading when i have a chance
3M lead the chickadee wagon (and that's not really a read anybody needs to wait for a chance to check), what do you make of that?
And am I getting votes because I hammered or...? Bc that's weaksauce if so...-
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Why isn't mastina (and old dogs) like 99% conftown right now?In post 1483, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:I actually don't want to commit to reads on mastina or skitter. you wouldn't believe how town skitter would be if she was doing this one thing you won't believe [*clickbait*]
mastina being lynchbaity can go either way but it doesn't make her scum quite yet I think so *shrug*-
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3M was the vocal leader of the Dee wagon you'd have to been not paying any attention to not know that or feigning ignorance now. 3M really only expressed 1 other player he'd have lynched and I scanned their iso and found that in like 2min before my earlier post tonight so I'm not buying "not having a chance". I'm wondering why you wouldn't have taken the minimal effort to just get right too it instead of "hmm weird nk gee I wonder who 3M suspected". I know you felt Dee was town yesterday so putting on my foil hat to me it seems like you hoped someone else would do the leg work since it would be suspicious for you to just straightforward say "Dee would be the one to want 3M dead" which is essentially the idea you're plantingIn post 1530, ElevenThirty wrote:a) i didn't say i wouldn't do the legwork, i said didn't have a chance for it yet, which is not *at all* the same thing, so this is kinda not great from my pov. like i'll get to it, don't shade me for not having read the iso yet
b) nka is p useful imo and i don't think 3m was the nk and i don't know who would kill them here really so
c) not going to comment on the chick thing until i read the iso because i honestly dont' remember what his reads are
d) why do u think ur getting wagoned for the hammer?
NKA is maybe useful in later days when there is more information available, in my experience it's pretty useless after N1.
Idk why I'm being wagoned I felt like ppl voting me now townread me at least somewhat yesterday the only new info since then is I hammered a townie so... :Shrug:-
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Do I not understand what a masonizer is these days? In my understanding mastina and old dogs are masons now and last I played here scum masons are bastard roles.In post 1491, Old Dogs wrote:mastina's action is NAI as far as i can tell but i think she's town regardless-
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In post 1534, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:For someone who just talked smack about checking an iso you sure have a hard time grasping that mastina is not a masonizer
Are you telling me that I missed that 1459 was sarcastic and old dogs literally just received a peice of fruit?-
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Wait so then how would you know you were targeted by mastina if not masonized and all you received was fruit that you don't know where it came from?In post 1537, Old Dogs wrote:mastina is claiming masonizer but i am saying she's not a masonizer. i do know that she targeted me, i have no idea if she's related to the fruit i received
Pedit: yeah maybe don't answer me and just let me sleep on it maybe I shouldn't be posting tired and slightly inebriated-
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every time I start a post today I get pulled in to work and come back to a few more pages to take in.
VCA:
(8):Vorkuta,ElevenThirty,YAYVIDEOGAMES,Old Dogs,Toogeloo,Chickadeepisskop,,zeebuRhinox
(7):Chickadee,Old Dogs,insomniaVoted,,Toogeloo,ElevenThirty,zeebuYAYVIDEOGAMES
(sidenote: probably shouldn't have picked red but too lazy to change it :shrug:)
{1130, YVG, Old Dogs, and zeebu} + survivorloo core group on both lynches
{Mastina, Wh4t, Creature} on neither
Vorkuta Only: pisskop, (rhinox)
Chickadee Only: Voted
-From the both lynches category I agree with earlier posting that zeebu is likely either town or 3p but not group scum. survivor claim isn't much worth thinking about except when to PL since there doesn't appear to be a vig, but I think the lack of vig and the lack of any expressed doubt on toogaloo's claim (meaning there's probably not really any other survivors) makes it more likely than not he is as he claimed
-{1130, YVG, and Old dogs} on both lynches. I'd rank 1130>YVG>Old Dogs in likelihood of scum.
I don't have a stong case on 1130 but their reads don't seem to follow logical progression. 3 examples:
1) chickadee reads when from town, to nullish, to hard defending end of day to, to "hmm lets see who 3M suspected" (still can't let that one go but I probably jumped the gun calling it out), to ultimately ending up on the dee lynch wagon D2.
2) Insomnia read went from scum, to town, back to scum and calling out anybody who townread insomnia
3) went from calling me p. town soon after I replaced in to scumreading me for nothing stated more than YVG posting "I think Rhinox might be groupscum" and 1130 responds "ok this is interesting"
But I need to take recent information/softclaim into account
YVG I don't really have a case at all. Very hard to sort through, high noise to signal. applauds me for hammering vorkudo D1, comes out D2 voting me, then lolhammers chick D2. I was bad at reading chaotic playstyles even when I was in practice. I would vote here.
OD well I had town vibes early and just kinda kinda let that ride. Will iso at some point but still trusting my first impression.
Initially began the day thinking >1 scum from this group of 3 but their interaction this day is definitely not S:S:S and I don't even think it's even S:S:T now so 1 at most is where I'm at.
From the neither category: Any of the 3 could be scum there's just not enough information, other than POE that this is a group which likely contains scum. Likely 2 IMO.
1 or the other group: well I'm in it, and voted is obvtowned, and I need to reread PK but nothing has stuck out so far.
vote: wh4t
I'm going to try to keep up better this day. I have kids and a busy job (which is why I retired and haven't played in >4years) and the bad timing for day 2 starting (and ending) basically over the holiday is why my activity slowed down. I thought I'd give the game another chance but I can barely keep up with reading the multiple pages per hour game pace of today let alone contributing at that pace so if that's what's going to get me lynched just get on with it and let me fade away back into retirement then.-
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In post 1854, ElevenThirty wrote:Do we all agree {our slot, Old Dogs, YVG} has at least one groupscum, barring 3 mechanical clears? I'm in agreement.
-IrrelIn post 1855, Old Dogs wrote:pedit: absolutelyNevermind you 3 absolutely could be groupscum together
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Help me bus him thenIn post 1879, ElevenThirty wrote:Rhinox wagon was {YVG, pisskop, us}?
I guess that might be a reason to townread rhinox fypov but it's not a reason to clear him as groupscum imo. I could easily see {YVG/pisskop, Rhinox, wh4t} team for example
Yeah why tf is wh4t still alive actually
-Irrel
/s-
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I'm pretty sure I played with PK a long time ago and have been having the same nagging thought here. i almost said earlier I was getting 3p vibes from him but didn't. i don't really think he's scummy but i agree with thinking that his play in this game does not match what I kinda sorta remember of town PKIn post 1928, Old Dogs wrote:i have played 2 games with pisskop and i thought he shat town in both as town - i have no reason to think he's town this game :/-
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In post 1995, Wh4t wrote:VOTE: 11:30 this is better. That push on me is so disingenuous. No sane scum team would kill lurking lynch bait over the active town players.In post 1995, Wh4t wrote:No sane scum team would kill lurking lynch bait over the active town players.In post 1995, Wh4t wrote:lurking lynch bait over the active town players.In post 1995, Wh4t wrote:active town players.-
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no I thought he was voting 1130 as active town player and unvoting voted because he was lurking lynch bait and posted before thinkingIn post 2007, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:you're misreading
it is a reasonable inference that there are active town players in this game, you don't need to be scum to figure that much out
-pikachu-
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this gets a from me in a similar vein as "hmm who did 3M suspect"In post 1930, ElevenThirty wrote:rhinox being the counterwagon to flipped town is scum indicative.
I get all of 2 votes from YVG (option 1 from your gamestate POE) and pisskop and apparently that makes "THE counterwagon to flipped town"??
meanwhile you're on record end of day 2 saying I'm POE'd as scum if chick flips town, then insomnia who hard defended me yesterday gets killed overnight, and there's your vote on me right at the start of day 3.
As for day 2...
Myself and Creature were both wagoned up all the way to L-5 (please do read the first part with :dripping sarcasm: mood) as of votecount 2.2.
By votecount 2.3, chick was up to 5 votes, I still had the same 2 votes on me. First 2 votes on the chick wagon? both voters from the creature wagon, led by old dogs (option 2 from your gamestate POE).
So for my "wagon" to be scum indicative of me then I'm scum with Creature AND Old dogs? or if Old dog's is town (noting that you were conversing as if both town at the time) then scum push on chick somewhere in the voted (consensus town) toog (survivor) 1130 (hmm?) zeebu (3p or town) range? is YVG scum with me for hammering to prevent my counterwagon from gaining steam?
This seems not very well thought out. I read you as a *good player* so when I see casual mentions of things like "the counterwagon to flipped town is scum indicative" without actually thinking it through it raises flags.
unless I'm jumping the gun here again and will see where you thought it out some posts past this one but I'm off for now will check back in later-
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I'm trying to say that you trying to convince old dogs that me being THE counterwagon to chick on day 2 is scum indicative for me is inconsistent with your reads. you're flirting with a "everyone on chickwagon was town or 3P" position which should lead a reasonable townie to a "counterwagon is NAI" conclusion. I think the way you're trying to casually lead old dogs to agree with you on this without you reasoning it out is very likely not town especially because reasoning it out should be leading you to a scum dogs/YVG suspicion (which you've been consistently moving in the opposite direction of), given the rest of the wagon is {flipped town, consensus town, claimed survivor, yourself, 3P or town}In post 2052, ElevenThirty wrote:I'm not sure i follow ur logic here
the zeebu is scum if rhino is scum is a lol attempt at getting out of the corner you painted yourself into since your the one who reasoned out why zeebu can't be scum on D1 for reasons that shouldn't just stop being true when it becomes inconvenient
I will also explicitly say I feel it's a manipulation to call me THE counterwagon to chick D2 because 2 votes without much substance behind them is not really a wagon at all. I didn't feel like a counterwagon. I think the way D2 went down prevented a true counterwagon.-
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this kind of makes sense and explains why I'm reading 1130 as having inconsistent reads that don't proress naturally I guess???In post 2061, ElevenThirty wrote:Also I'm discovering that skitter and I think about mafia really differently - like we understand each other's reads, but come away with very different game plans because I like fast and loose play that I try to corral into something solid later in the gameday and skitter prefers to follow her stronger reads for longer periods of time and while we enjoy playing games together we've already decided we're probably never hydra'ing again.
Btw the unsigned posts were skitter, not me
-Irrel
eh I think its NAI given how everyone seems to be sensitive to "pocketing" in the current meta (or in this game at least). multiple players in this game have become suspicious for being townread without sufficient substance so I could certainly see scum faking that.In post 2066, ElevenThirty wrote:On the other hand does scum actually push someone because "I'm certainly not towny enough to get nightkilled, how dare you suggest I'm towny!"
Someone else weigh in please
-Irrel
i would, however, expect town to at least acknowledge the correction that you were implying lynched instead of nk'd and reconsider their read, instead of digging in as if it doesn't matter what they thought had happened didn't actually happen how they thought.-
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So I went to investigate this and turns out I lied. I did play with pisskop before but he was scum that game and apparently obvscum to everyone but me who did a thing that was tunneling on town titus instead of letting obvscum get lynched day 1. PK also replaced out of that game. I don't really feel his play here resembles his play there so there's that but that was like 5 years ago and my play here doesn't resemble my play there either so :shrug:.In post 2004, Rhinox wrote:
I'm pretty sure I played with PK a long time ago and have been having the same nagging thought here. i almost said earlier I was getting 3p vibes from him but didn't. i don't really think he's scummy but i agree with thinking that his play in this game does not match what I kinda sorta remember of town PKIn post 1928, Old Dogs wrote:i have played 2 games with pisskop and i thought he shat town in both as town - i have no reason to think he's town this game :/
Possibly noteworthy is that how pisskop is reading me in this game is totally on tone with how scum pisskop read me in that game:
Subject: Mini 1556: Greetings Without Spain (GAME OVER FAREWELL)
pisskop wrote:Rhinox. Got nothing of note. Doesnt seem concerned with impressing people. So that.In post 1900, pisskop wrote:rhinix is meh. Not scummy but meh-
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i have a lot more to comment on obviously but no you're not crazy: 2702 and my vote is still on wh4t and I don't know why Old Dogs has such a hard time seeing this either or why wh4t refuses to address it.In post 2281, ElevenThirty wrote:rhinox, voted, am I crazy? Wh4t's tunnel on us continues to be based on bullcrap, no?-
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what's worse?In post 2328, Old Dogs wrote:again im conceding "old dogs is just bad at reading wh4t and is looking at a false positive in terms of towniness" is a very real possibility but im not going to work too hard to address it when someone i actually am good at reading is actively not doing anything in a gamestate where they generally shine
Actively not doing anything?
or
Flipping from not doing anything to doing something badly once real pressure is applied?-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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hmmIn post 2332, Wh4t wrote:I am struggling with all my games. There is no pressure on me except the fake pressure Rhinox is attempting to apply.
I'm fighting a mislynch.
Another mislynch because you guys are this bad.
it is odd in this gamestate how easily we're settling on group not-of-both-lynches here if that is where the scums are with little resistance towards it (aside from you). even creature:
this was his response when discussion was decidedly on-wagon.In post 1848, Creature wrote:You're all begging for a scum stomp, but whatever.
and {YVG,OD,1130} all came out guns blazing SOD with "hey we all agree we're group highprob-scum here right"?
so maybe we are just terribad town, where 2? of {YVG,OD,1130} assumed we were at least competent town until we proved we weren't and decided to curbstomp us instead of bussing as initially planned?
because now too many seem in agreement that {YVG,OD,1130} are 0-1 scum and nobody but wh4t seems too awfully concerned about that from the off-both-wagons lynchpool.
ehh... i'm working this out realtime and not sure I'm convincing myself here that I really believe this. Context will make sense hopefully once i post my past 24hr catchup that is WIP currently-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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it holds. I think I posted early on about being unconvinced of there being more than 1 scum in your group and this was pretty much why. It'd have been an odd as hell gamestate for you three to be 2+ scum pointing at each other while actual town is just apathetically letting you do whatever you want.In post 2348, ElevenThirty wrote:Lol I wish I was scum with Old Dogs and YVG
I would be having the time of my life
But the main reason I don't think old dogs + YVG are scum together is they'd have very little incentive to *play*, given how quiet the average townie would be in that case. They could have stopped being active many pages ago. If one is scum, the other + me have forced them to stay active if they want to be in contention for [not the scum from the group of three]. If we're all town, we're all actively solving because, well, we're all actively solving.
I think this logic holds from an outside perspective but lmk if not
-Irrel
And like I'm in this new not on both wagons lynchpool and I'd probably be more concerned if it were settling on me, but I think I was early in this thinking even though I knew it leads to me being lynchpooled. but where's pisskop? and creature openly mocked focusing ON-wagon. Only wh4t is aggressively defensive of this new gamestate. but pisskop and creature don't care at all.
why isn't there more flailing if we're settling on group scum here? that's what's in the back of my head.-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Catching up post last 24hrs before 2327
(by the way a lot of this is either obsolete or likely contradicting thoughts I've had since 2327 but I'm switching back and forth between catching up and being in the moment to be able to contribute better so :shrug:)
getting a scum flip would be a good start...In post 2073, Old Dogs wrote:how can we solve this game?
I'm becoming uncomfortable with "consensus-town-voted" turning into "suddenly-suspiciously-absent-voted" today.In post 2076, ElevenThirty wrote:Here's where I'm at, and skitter just agreed with most of it
Voted is town for matching his town game in terms of gambits/playstyle/tone
Rhinox is town for making a lot of sense to me this gameday, being strongly townread by others who wouldn't townread a scumpartner like that, and for his grumpy "ugh spamposters" style combined with a willingness to wade through the spam posting. Skitter is not sold, so this is the main difference between our reads
{Old dogs, YVG} has 1-2 town. Regardless of alignments, these two are very hard to lynch, so I'm not going to try rn.
{wh4t, Creature} has 1-2 scum. Both have crappy ISOs and Wh4t's push on us is entirely based on misrepresenting my posts. Creature is not trying.
pisskop remains very difficult to read.
mastina is unreadable except that I think her receiving a role in the same manner as us, and before us, is probably +town for her.
{toogeloo, zeebu} has 1-2 3Ps, and 0 town. Skitter wants to lynch toog if we're aiming for 3P today, I want to aim for zeebu. Both have "wow this proves they're not groupscum!" moments but I've leaned too heavily on those singular moments before and lost in lylo for it. Skitter thinks zeebu is less likely groupscum, but I think zeebu is more likely anti-town.
If there's anyone I'm missing (besides us), I have no thoughts on them and they should not go to lylo
-Irrel
It's bad you're reading the comment as a "push" on you at all instead of the "why are we comfortable letting wh4t continue to lurk through this game?" interpretation the tone implies.In post 2087, Wh4t wrote:
Why either way it's bad. You've been active and prominent enough to have brought it to people's attention earlier without this "frustration" act.In post 2086, ElevenThirty wrote:
Did you read the post where I pointed out that I was referring to my frustration we hadn't lynched you yet, not the fact that you weren't nightkilled?In post 2084, Wh4t wrote:Nope I just read people's pushes on me better than other interactions so I'm happy trying to get you lynched at this point.
-Irrel
See i read 1130's comment as PRECISELY an attempt to engage you. I voted you to attempt to engage you. And here you are posting so attempt to engage = success as I see it.In post 2088, Wh4t wrote:A more townie response would be more attempts to engage me rather than "why the fuck is x still alive" at SOD.
yeah, I hammered. pretty distinctive spot on the wagon.In post 2090, Wh4t wrote:Oh lol. I'll skim Rhinox but was that dude even on the D1 wagon?
is that what happened though?In post 2101, Wh4t wrote:Scumreading me for lurkingis a policy lynch ehich you're trying to make look more than.
Presumably my hypothetical scum partners would have a say? This is bad wifom I'm uncomfortable being the beneficiary of.In post 2104, Wh4t wrote:I dont think Rhinox scumreads then kills them unless he thinks that lynch never happens.
In post 2108, Wh4t wrote:I don't like the way Rhinox damces around scumreading 11.30. I'm not sure what that means yet.In post 2109, Wh4t wrote:That's probably your most towny post so far 11.30.
I lol'd at all that too.In post 2110, ElevenThirty wrote:
lolIn post 2108, Wh4t wrote:I don't like the way Rhinox damces around scumreading 11.30. I'm not sure what that means yet.
pedit: lol
-Irrel
In post 2111, Wh4t wrote:Unfortunately I townslipped so you can believe I faked it but there's no reason to fake because I'm not under any serious pressure atm. *shakes head* either you suck or you're scum. I'll do you the favour of believing it's the latter.
very bad and I'm fighting urge to lock in for this alone.In post 2114, Wh4t wrote:I didn't realise Nero had died or was part of the hydra...pretty sure scum would know who they're killing? I still don't know why they died though because there was a fair bit of suspicion there. Maybe old dogs? I'll have to dig.
what? i don't care who you're meta-ing conviction is never a towntellIn post 2130, Old Dogs wrote:there's actually conviction
but if we're lynching scum, why does this matter in this gamestate??In post 2139, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:creature doesn't obvtown almost half the game after a scumflip though
~ Pichu
*twitch*In post 2144, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:I'm saying that a creature scumflip gives much less info than an eleventhirty scumflip
~ PichuIn post 2150, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:katy
skitter is literally trying to shut you down because she NEEDS the wh4t mislynch
it's too dangerous to allow it to dissipate because that slot is under far too much pressure and creates too many obvtowns, it doesn't matter what her team is because that slot is always the biggest scum presence and losing that AS WELL AS obvtowning this many town slots can't be allowed to happen
she's not approaching this to try to convince you that wh4t is scum, she's trying to convince you that your reasons for townreading her are wrong.THIS IS A SCUM MINDSET
~ Pichu
*from the future* 1130 addresses this quite nicely in 2290
also noting the casual nature of referring to wh4tmislynch
what? it totally matters. they're like, opposite meanings even. and it doesn't make complete sense to feel one way after assuming one meaning, and then no hesitation believing the other meaning generates the same feelings about it. It's confirmation bias at best. Like I said above unless I'm wrong here I don't see how 1130's post should be interpreted as anything more than a flavored "hey lets not let lurkers who lurked through 2 mislynches continue to lurk", and not like an actual *push*In post 2151, Old Dogs wrote:it doesnt matter what this means precisely ("why the fuck hasnt wh4t been lynched" basically means "why the fuck hasnt wh4t been nightkilled" even if one implies that wh4t should be scummy or wh4t should be townie), you can still read into the intention of it being disingenuous. and from wh4t's town pov it makes complete sense to feel that way
the point is not the same. "why is this slot not gone yet via nk" is scummy wifom. "why hasn't this lurker slot been wagoned into contributing" is likely town indicative in this gamestate.In post 2158, Old Dogs wrote:theyre not the same thing, but like the point of "why is this slot not gone yet" is the same?
samey *stuff stuff stuff* between 1130/OD on this discussion I think i've said enough on it by now. trying to get to mastina posting as a pause point because I gotta leave soon
ok that's pretty much this point actually, so i'll pick up on catchup stuff from there later tonight hopefully.
so to summarize to this point I've cooled off on suspecting 1130 because 1) our reads are aligning on things 2) wh4t's case is bad 3) Old dogs is being weird about it 4) YVG is probably the actual scum of the power trio if any.
and
liking my vote on wh4t for real not just for "fake pressure" now-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Hey i'm going on limited access until sunday night or likely monday morning. I'll likely be reading and checking in from my phone but will be busy driving and doing family things so won't be contributing much.
I've read from where i left off til now and don't have any specific posts I want to single out and comment on this time.
i think the gamestate is weird af like everything is totally on script. the main wagon is the same names as D1/D2 + Mastina this time. The same names are mostly just "letting it happen" at this point as mastina put it. So like Mastina from your POV do you see creature NOT getting bussed in this gamestate like would currently be the case from your POV if the power trio is all town?
And this progression from pisskop is kinda weird:In post 2420, pisskop wrote:lets kill zzzxIn post 2421, pisskop wrote:Like we all seem to share the same reads, why are we having such a hard time killing a foo?
like zzzx is creature now and you're not voting creature so that answers quote 2? And is the 3rd post suggesting lynching creature is anti-wincon?In post 2423, pisskop wrote:
Lets please do that thing where we pursue our winconIn post 2422, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:creature is more likely groupscum-
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What narratives?In post 2447, pisskop wrote:I think rhinox is just trying to string together narratives.-
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There's nothing to sort tbhIn post 2498, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:why does that need to be sorted before doing anything else
~ Pichu
Toog is certainly not neutral survivor here-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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I meant wrt toog. I was agreeing with youIn post 2501, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:
....................................In post 2500, Rhinox wrote:
There's nothing to sort tbhIn post 2498, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:why does that need to be sorted before doing anything else
~ Pichu
Toog is certainly not neutral survivor here
alignments?
Others need sorted, sure-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Everything about this post is wrong and I take major issue with 1 part of it.In post 2518, mastina wrote:
While I softed as much, wish I was, and the game would be won if I was, sadly, no.In post 2508, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:mastina claim first so we don't waste our time with a bunch of bullshit? please tell me you're loyal?
-pikachu
I was given a Loud Fruit Vend power D1; Old Dogs was N1, you N2, 11:30 N3. I was given a Visitor power D2; Voted was both N2 and N3. N3, I was gifted an X-shot Vig; I shot Wh4t.
Given that this is almost certainly lylo, 3 scum are alive.
I think that we can all agree, it's not YAYVIDEOGAMES/11:30/ANYTHIRDMEMBER and that there is a MAXIMUM of one scum there.
However, we can also determine that there's a maximum of two scum in Rhinox/pisskop, but also a minimum of one, almost definitively.
The only scumteams not including one of them would be Auto/Toogeloo/Yay, or Auro/Toogeloo/11:30; can we all agree that those two combos are unlikely?
Which would leave EITHER:
Rhinox/pisskop/hydra,
Rhinox/pisskop/Toogeloo,
OR:
Hydra/Toogeloo/oneofRhinoxpisskop.
Can we all agree that one of those five scumteam combos is the final solve?-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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On my phone now. When I get home to my computer I'll say more.In post 2531, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:what's that rhinox
Lot's of cavalier votes being thrown around for suspected lylo...-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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OK first things first Mastina's 2518 she's assuming a 3-person scum team. We know she's assuming that because she's eliminating groupings based on X can't be with Y logic. She's doing this without locking Toog into group scum which is bad and wrong.
3S:3T:neutral survivor is unwinable for town when everyone is playing towards their wincon. I'd be disappointed if this gamestate wasn't just an automatic endgamed. So this makes the majority of 2518 garbage basically. Bad logic at best, manipulation at worst. Mastina is a smart player who has been around here long enough to know what a NS means in a vanilla lylo scenario.
Also Toog is not really playing/thinking like a NS here. A NS wouldn't just be "willing" to vote whoever in suspected lylo/mylo, they'd be actually doing it. If the gamestate were 3S:3T:NS and not endgamed for some reason, then the correct NS play is to vote and keep moving votes until scum pile on and end the game. That's probably the best play for a NS once town can't just PL which may be the case now.
So in a 3player scum team, toog is scum, unless shenanigans.
Shenanigans where toog can be what he says:
-if there's a 3player scum team and NS AND some other mutually exclusive 3P wincon
-if there's 2plyr scum team and NS, then this is not actually lylo (and a toog policy lynch should be considered in this scenario anyways)
In the mountainous world, 10:2, 11:2 is the balance sweet spot. If there's a 2plyr scumteam AND toog is a NS, I think there's still probably at least one other 3P out there, or scum team needs to be buffed up. Actually my secret theory is that town wincon is mechanically impossible already and that's what triggered the 3 non-players to exit the game, and the game is still ongoing because various scum and 3P wincons are possible and mutually exclusive, but this is not a gamestate I want to exist in so I'm going to proceed as if I'm not totally fucked and wasting my time right now.
Back to Mastina's post and time for me to claim. When i replaced in i was an ascetic townie. D3 twilight i received a 1-shot vig and shot zeebu. (side note: for most of the game I assumed my role prevented me from ever receiving an ability but I did so i guess instead it means either the role granting mechanic isn't a normal targetting mechanic, or the ascetic only applies to night actions, or whatever. doesn't really matter tbh)
So I immediately have issues with Mastina's claim because:
-2 vig claims
-Mastina claimed as X-shot when I explicitly received 1-shot
-Mastina claimed to receive the role at night. I received my PM in twilight. I think every other role that was claimed to be received was given day phases or twilight (1130 can you confirm this?)
-claiming to receive a role at night, and then being able to use it the same night. The timing makes that mechanically unreliable and dependent on activity, which (totally outguessing the mod here but) I don't expect from the smooth operator award winning mod.
-shooting wh4t
my reasoning in shooting zeebu is that it seemed we were heading towards a PL day anyways, and I wanted to remove the suspected survivor claim with the most uncertainty around it. Toog seemed very likely to be exactly what he said, seemed more worthwhile to sort out zeebu. wh4t is a terrible vig shot with 2 possible survivor claims in play and the assumption that using the vig shot likely pushes the game to an 5:3 mylo state at best if it doesn't hit scum (4:1:3, 3:2:3 are both endgameable gamestates if 1 or both survivors are/were survivors) where policy lynching the survivors becomes impossible. The correct play is always to vig the 3P here and then lynch scum. Shooting wh4t makes sense if Mastina is some kind of sk or other 3P with a shot trying to eliminate mafia, however, which I hadn't considered until reading some of 1130's thoughts posted today. Initially I was thinking she could be groupscum with toog based on the first half of this post.-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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Yea, it was the role PM I got when i replaced in. No indication of receiving it after the start of the game. I had assumed it meant I couldn't receive a new role
i didn't know what it even was at first. i never saw it before when I used to play regularly. wiki had play advice where it basically said it can be claimed early but there's little downside not to. I went with not to, figured it'd just have been a distraction with 3rd party shenanigans already in play. I almost didn't bother claiming it now for that reason since i'm not even ascetic anymore anyways. If there's supposed to be a standard play for ascetic like how a miller should always claim early, i didn't know about it.In post 2682, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:Why rhinox didn't claim ascetic earlier-
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Rhinox Mafia Scum
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I became 1-shot vig. I can ask the mod but it doesn't really matter since idk how I could be checked either way
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and at night? Mastina claimed to receive her x-shot vig at night and was the only role to do soIn post 2694, YAYVIDEOGAMES wrote:I do think it's fair to think that receiving actions in different phases is probably receiving from different factions. Receiving in twilight id probably from scum, receiving during day is probanly from the trifecta.
-k-
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