HMS Mutiny [Game Over]

[Gimli]

enchant flipped at end of day, how could it be BBT?

[Gimli]

she is faking dumbtells

[Gimli]

I still think eira is town

[Gimli]

I can't believe you people read nancy and think she is still town after today but whatever I guess

[Gimli]

Eira, make Elements make sense as scum after Enchant's flip.

I think they can but probably only with Gimli but Gimli keeps pushing me for either nia things like the dumbtelling for example or even worse my having too many townreads which is actually strongly town indicative for me.

I’m also extremely suspicious that he seemed to know we were town straight out of the gate before he decided we were a great miselim.

YOU LITERALLY HAD SO MANY PEOPLE IN YOUR TOWNBLOCK THAT THERE WASN'T ENOUGH SCUM LEFT FOR A SOLVE

I'm not shouting at you, I'm shouting at elly if whatever elly is doing is a towngame.

[Gimli]

and to whoever townie is still townreading this hydra.

[Gimli]

VOTE: Gimli
where/what did you claim?

I claimed paranoid potato

[Gimli]

you are 10000% scum

[Gimli]

VOTE: Gimli
where/what did you claim?

I claimed paranoid potato

oh sorry, the question was meant to be directed at Eira in a "I've done what you've asked, not you do what I've asked" kinda way

ah

I was happy you asked me anything in this game for a change but of course you didn't

[Gimli]

VOTE: Gimli

that's
eira
you
elly
KJ

I'm E-1 dude

[Gimli]

RR is the only person left who knows what happened to Enchant.

It's actually just Gimli/Elements/Flea isn't it?

you need to realise this solve only works alone, because me and flea are vanilla according to elly. if elly is a townie, then it's very unlikely we are both goons, and we played a scumteam of two goons and a rolecop.

since me and flea only work as scum if we're with elly, you have to look outside of that solve. if elements is a townie, that means probably 2/3 of me/flea/kj pool is town. and one is actually probably a goon.

[Gimli]

KJ please stop talking to me I don't want to talk to scum

[Gimli]

yes mala is so town omg so very town. where is mala? oh yeah she came here and said 'white knight' to eira

so town

[Gimli]

Flea should also be tr me atp. At any rate, we are loyal crew. Idk if there are even any traitors in this setup.

I think you would have accepted your position is not as strong as you think it currently is as town.

Reason I'm not voting you is Gimlis push which is starting to stink as well.

don't townread her cause you don't like my push

re-read the start of today. look at all the things she is missing. she doesn't work a solve, she is not trying to see if teams fit together, she is not scumhunting, she is simply OMGUSing me and townreading the entire game! to the point where she thought elly's claim was solid, then added her to her towncore and said me and you were the remaining scum! two vanillas according to elly's claim!

is anyone reading me?

[Gimli]

RR is the only person left who knows what happened to Enchant.

It's actually just Gimli/Elements/Flea isn't it?

you need to realise this solve only works alone, because me and flea are vanilla according to elly. if elly is a townie, then it's very unlikely we are both goons, and we played a scumteam of two goons and a rolecop.

since me and flea only work as scum if we're with elly, you have to look outside of that solve. if elements is a townie, that means probably 2/3 of me/flea/kj pool is town. and one is actually probably a goon.

ELEMENTS NEVER SAID YOU ARE VANNILA

'different'

and that's between me and mala (claimed miller)

unless me and mala are both scum, then I have to be vanilla right?

[Gimli]

mafia is such a tiresome bullshit

[Gimli]

if you're not reading and are missing important mechanical information, eiralox, then don't come at me all caps lock like you know what you're talking about. it's bad enough having to deal with your unfortunate tunnel.

[Gimli]

I will defend my slot to the very fucking end.

[Gimli]

Gimli, vote mala with me?

She’s town. She’s playing here exactly like she did in Pokemon Large Theme. Mala has been my strongest tr straight out of the gate.

In what world does miller make sense in this set-up?

I have no idea but why does she fakeclaim it? What’s the motive?

got her this far

[Gimli]

mala's second post that game 'I'm town but I've been busy'

argh

[Gimli]

but like that was a dumpster fire this is a dumpster fire so KJ's extremely confident read is still senseless and reeks of TMI if mala is town

re: does it make sense for it to be a miller in this setup? I think yes because it messes with both the town and the scum cops

[Gimli]

(I'm clearing elements)

[Gimli]

(I'm clearing elements)

eiralox is going to be so angry at this

[Gimli]

Stop targeting obvtown.

How do we know you didn’t bus Enchant here? Ooh, seems unlikely you’d ask BBT to shoot your rolecop but I’m not entirely convinced you didn’t have a tmi on Enchant.

He was a dead null for me but for some reason you KNEW he was scum. You have also been hardpushing every miselim wagon: STD, HPE, Gamma.

If you’re actually town, you’d logically be re-evaluating your reads rn but for some reason you aren’t. I have no idea what Elements is but us, Mala and RR are all very likely town and whatever your alignment is, I’m not just going to do nothing when you try to push my most confident trs.

Since when are you still this confident as town after repeatedly being wrong so many times.

Us
BBT
Mala
RR
Bella
Eira

is my current townblock. Not sure on Elements but who’s left?

Flea? Don’t know yet and you?

So, my solve unless I’m forgetting about someone is maybe you + one of them?

There’s no freaking way you don’t know I’m town yet and a potato I think would not be so confident after being wrong so many times in the same game, yet hear you are, still pushing your terrible reads and trying to help scum win.

~Harley

6 person townblock (3 people left with three wolves left)

"not sure on elements"

"flea? IDK"

"maybe you + one of them?"

she doesn't want to antagonize with anybody, it's a bunch of wishy washy and appealing to her "townblock". this isn't solving. this is lying.

[Gimli]

re: does it make sense for it to be a miller in this setup? I think yes because it messes with both the town and the scum cops

I guess but like, is it not mod-wifom at that point
Ugh
I should not have started trying to set-up spec.
Last time I did it ended terribly for me (ask frog and BBT) and I said to myself I wouldn't do it again

no, it's good that you did that, i'm finally townreading you

[Gimli]

but like that was a dumpster fire this is a dumpster fire so KJ's extremely confident read is still senseless and reeks of TMI if mala is town

re: does it make sense for it to be a miller in this setup? I think yes because it messes with both the town and the scum cops

How so? Town don't have a cop that interacts directly with a miller.

you get a 'different' when targeting a miller with a vanilla, so it can be either a miller or a scum PR, it's not as clear as if it was just a VT

[Gimli]

VOTE: flea

if it's flea it's not KJ, otherwise it's too much potato vanillas

and that means probably flea/RR/bella? yeah. those.

[Gimli]

and ofc the miller messes with enchant the hardest because they'll think it's a PR (if goes unclaimed). that also makes it funky where hardclaiming miller at gamestart isn't as optimal as shutting up and letting the scum team kill you thinking you're a PR

[Gimli]

VOTE: flea

if it's flea it's not KJ, otherwise it's too much potato vanillas

and that means probably flea/RR/bella? yeah. those.

I still really really think you’re scum but the one thing that has given even the slightest pause is the way your wagon suddenly blew up but if Flea’s your buddy, this could also be possible distancing?

if you're town I want you to admit you're playing like absolute ass

[Gimli]

Gimli, RR is responsible for enchant's death right?
How does that fit with them both on a scum team together?

we don't know what happened to enchant

but of course that would clear RR

[Gimli]

it was RR because eiralol was townreading enchant

okay

[Gimli]

it was maybe not RR though

other things can happen that we don't know

[Gimli]

Okay. I'm caught up. Sorry to say, I have no idea what happened to Enchant either, it wasn't me. But it's not important right now.

What IS important is that Elements has a potential guilty on Gimli and/or Mala

Malakittens claims Miller. There is no alignment cop in this setup, so the only way Miller can possibly work is inverting other results, which means she should be treated as vanilla for Elements. Meaning the result should have been same, not different.

So either Mala's not a Miller or Gimli's not vanilla. Either way, one of them is lying.

you're a potato

[Gimli]

I can go Gimli

but RR's post was horrendous, man

jesus this game

[Gimli]

and ofc the miller messes with enchant the hardest because they'll think it's a PR (if goes unclaimed). that also makes it funky where hardclaiming miller at gamestart isn't as optimal as shutting up and letting the scum team kill you thinking you're a PR

.

miller can work in a game with no alignment cops. it also avoids the WIFOM awful mech spec you guys are doing, with all due respect.

[Gimli]

HORRIBLE SETUP SPEC

ABSOLUTELY HORRENDOUS

and I'm E-1 over it. goddammit BBT.

pedit: no that's not necessary. it just becomes a potato PR that messes with wolves ability by giving them a PR result and they end up killing the miller instead of actual PR

zzzzzzz RR so bad so very bad

[Gimli]

yes eiralox we get it that was the first thing I said could've happened this game

annoying broken record, you

[Gimli]

Just iso-d mala: if she is scum, it's with Elly.

I'm basically happy to vote gimli

P-edit eira could be right
Pp-edit rat is saying that mler should return an 'opposite' result, basically: so vanilla when miller.

a miller is a miller to an alignment cop, not a 'reverses whatever cop result' thing

oh god

okay yeet me then

[Gimli]

A Miller that knows they are a Miller and flips as such is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. A Miller returns a guilty result if investigated by a Cop, "Miller" if investigated by a Role Cop, and "non-Vanilla" to a Vanilla Cop. The Normal variant of Miller specifically only produces a false guilty to a Cop and Seer, so for example, a Gunsmith will see them as having no gun (unless they have a gun for some other reason).

READ THIS RADICAL RAT YOU POTATO

[Gimli]

A MILLER RETURNS AS A NON VANILLA TO A GODDAMN VANILLA COP YOU POTATO PLAYER

[Gimli]

I thought you thought Elly was scum?

I think she is town now

you don't read anything, none of you, it's so annoying

[Gimli]

But Elly claimed parity cop

a VANILLA parity cop

my god you all

[Gimli]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[Gimli]

it's gonna be a non-vanilla result, are you guys insane? it's in the wiki. I just quoted the wiki.

[Gimli]

I am a Miller, but I also have one shot role.
I have one shot delayed vig.

I’m the asshole who shot enchant.

I was in between him or gimli, but in the end I picked enchant because I had something bugging me in the way he was engaging with me.

nice

[Gimli]

A Miller that knows they are a Miller and flips as such is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. A Miller returns a guilty result if investigated by a Cop, "Miller" if investigated by a Role Cop, and "non-Vanilla" to a Vanilla Cop. The Normal variant of Miller specifically only produces a false guilty to a Cop and Seer, so for example, a Gunsmith will see them as having no gun (unless they have a gun for some other reason).

READ THIS RADICAL RAT YOU POTATO

Yes, that's exactly right. And with no alignment cop, why would one exist?

If you'll scroll down a bit in the wiki you're reading you'll see that Miller variants exist that interfere with other/all investigatives.

If that isn't the case here, then Miller has no reason to exist, meaning Mala isn't one, meaning I'm right

SHE JUST CLAIMED THE ENCHANT KILL

[Gimli]

bella is scum

[Gimli]

Nancy, what do you think a Miller does?

Show up as scum to any AC or alignment-based invest role. I just didn’t understand how they’d necessarily show up as vanilla but I guess makes sense since miller doesn’t actually do anything.

Right. But no alignment based investigatives exist. So it has to be a variant that affects other roles, or not exist at all

only in your head

[Gimli]

I'm E-1

you're gonna kill another VT I promise you

[Gimli]

IT HAZ TO BE A VARIANTZ

no it doesn't, why? cause you say so? it doesn't have to be any variant that messes up with goddamn vanilla parity cops. jesus christ.

[Gimli]

I'm E-1

you're gonna kill another VT I promise you

I thought I unvoted you?

BBT voted me though

[Gimli]

A traditional Miller ONLY interacts with alignment results.

No one in this game gets alignment results.

Therefore a Miller claim MUST either be a variant that affects other investigatives, or not exist at all

IT
MUST
NOT

only in your head

[Gimli]

why is this person town at all?

[Gimli]

IT HAZ TO BE A VARIANTZ

no it doesn't, why? cause you say so? it doesn't have to be any variant that messes up with goddamn vanilla parity cops. jesus christ.

Why would an alignment miller exist without an alignment cop? Explain that, or I'm hammering you.

THE WOLVES
POSSESS
A PR COP

THAT MEANS
THEY GET A PR RESULT
FROM THE MILLER

THAT MEANS
THE MILLER MIGHT DRAW A PR KILL IF THEY DON'T CLAIM

IF THE MILLER MESSED WITH THEIR PR COP CHECK IT'D BE A VERY DUMB ROLE INDEED RAT

[Gimli]

Gimli, you mean enchants role?

yes

[Gimli]

That doesn't answer the question Gimli. If Malakittens is an alignment miller, but no alignment checks exist in the game, why would such a miller exist?

so that your dumb ass can miselim me today

[Gimli]

If anyone else hammers, it's a scumclaim. This one is rightfully mine.

you're a massive potato rat

[Gimli]

I'm signing out you do whatever you want

bella/KJ/RR is my final solve

gl to town you're gonna need it

[Gimli]

actually

that's a lot of killing roles.

[Gimli]

but I don't care, I'm gonna do a eiralox and yeah

eat my yeet and play better next time I guess

[Gimli]

4.03

Votecount 4.03

Gimli (2):

Killing Joke, BlueBloodedToffee.

Killing Joke (1):

Gimli.

Elements (1):

Eiralox.

Bellaphant (1):

Elements.

Not Voting (4):

Bellaphant, Radical Rat, Flea The Magician, Malakittens.

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to eliminate someone.

Day 4 ends in (expired on 2023-02-12 15:30:00).

Co-Mod Notes

• Combined Mod ISO
  
• Squawk

I thought I had more votes lol

[Gimli]

I'm signing out you do whatever you want

bella/KJ/RR is my final solve

gl to town you're gonna need it

What is your read on Flea?

well hi

I think he is scum if you're not. hasn't done anything the whole game and keeps not doing anything this gameday.

[Gimli]

"somehow"

I'm gonna hardclaim VT on d2 as a scum PR with a vanilla parity cop hanging around, that's really smart RR real big brain that you noticed it

[Gimli]

I didn't even bother to check when you said you were at E-1, lol.

Regardless, point stands. You're the lim, unless Mala's role somehow exonerates you.

How could Mala exonerate anyone?

he thinks mala is a special type of miller that would mess with your result, so your parity cop would have to return 'same' instead of 'different' if I'm vt

but I'm a scum PR don't you know, so it went different because mala actually returns vanilla

anyway.

[Gimli]

a miller messes up with thread dynamics and mech spec, you can have a miller in a game with no cops at all if you want!

[Gimli]

Gimli is goon

okay

you all want me dead anyway, that's fine

it doesn't matter what mala is going to say, I just turn from 'scum PR' to goon

just be done with it

[Gimli]

I'm signing out you do whatever you want

bella/KJ/RR is my final solve

gl to town you're gonna need it

What is your read on Flea?

well hi

I think FAE is scum if you're not. hasn't done anything the whole game and keeps not doing anything this gameday.

You need to be way more careful with the pronouns. I’m not, which I have continued to scream ad nauseum to anyone who’s willing to listen.

yeah I'm sorry about that.

okay.

VOTE: flea

[Gimli]

I think I should flip.

[Gimli]

sorry about the pronouns flea, this has been extremely stressful.

[Gimli]

Okay its still KJ

KJ/bella/????

I wanna die I don't wanna do this anymore

[Gimli]

KJ is just the epitome of tmi over mala

Take the hydra down after I flip

Then I think, idk. Bella and someone. Idk. It's impossible to solve when everyone is scumreading you like this, I have no point of reference

[Gimli]

KJ gives me a wave and I already wanna move off her, it's ridiculous

[Gimli]

Bella and RR with KJ

I don't even wanna vote them lol

Pedit: you played this so bad if you're town Nancy, get off your high horse lol

[Gimli]

I feel weird that BBT just assumes I'm a goon here but blerg

It's odd that mafia has no killing power though

[Gimli]

Nobody is clear in this game

We're definitely going to lose

[Gimli]

Don't clear BBT anymore

If you're town stop being horrible, find each other and work this game

I should die so you can solve without me

Pedit: I'm not voting elements

[Gimli]

It doesn't matter what mala says, I'm still gonna be read as the goon

Edit: black spot is their factional Nancy

Jesus

[Gimli]

Idk you're all too dense tbh

[Gimli]

I know I sucked this game but it's hard to read some of these things and not thinking you're all mafia

[Gimli]

All I'm saying is don't clear BBT for the one shot

Mala, RR wants to know if you're a specific type of miller

[Gimli]

The less amount of information that scum has the better. Can we just move on?

Unless you are telling me that I’m scum and enchant bussed me by fishing for my role.

Absolutely potatoes

[Gimli]

Their cop flipped but the less town knows the better about her miller role!!!!!

[Gimli]

Just insanity

[Gimli]

Also I’m not really liking all of the killing roles. I was hesitant when Bella claimed, but if it’s redirect. I can kinda see scum either having a redirect or a bulletproof.

I believe elements is most likely town after the enchant flip tho.

Agreed

I think there's definitely scum between BBT and Bella rn. Game doesn't make sense if scum has no kill power and town has two one shots. It's too unbalanced

[Gimli]

Well, that'd be between mala and BBT. That'd mean BBT wolf here a lot actually

[Gimli]

KJ
BBT
RR?

That's my final solve. Goodbye now go town sorry for all the screaming

VOTE: gimli

[Gimli]

KJ
BBT
RR?

That's my final solve. Goodbye now go town sorry for all the screaming

VOTE: gimli

If you’re town here, congrats we’re going to lose. I was going to vote Flea but hopefully it is you. *prays*

LOL you just voted me in this page

I'm done with this, I'm tired of every townie scumreading me and I need to flip so the remaining townies can solve with the extra info

goodbye

[Gimli]

also I have like 10 posts left. what else can I say? IDK where the scum is, really. it can be any of you potatoes.

[Gimli]

I forgot BBT has the spot

so, okay, it's not BBT obviously.

IDK the game feels unbalanced regardless. two one shots one redirector... and mafia has a goon? because if all these PRs are true, then how can mafia just have a roleblocker and a rolecop and a goon? it does not make sense to me.

[Gimli]

I didn't hammer I'm just saying let's get done with talking about me, I'm flipping and that's gonna be it.

but let's mech spec for a second.

[Gimli]

how can we have a game with a goon, a rolecop and a roleblocker, without extra kills from scum, and town has a parity cop, a miller with a one-shot, another one-shot, and a tracker?

[Gimli]

I'm so tired eira.

[Gimli]

bella's redirector is insane too, she lives forever??

[Gimli]

AISA GIVE ME ANOTHER 200 POSTS

pedit: but if the roleblocker dies they are toasted? and bella is an eternal limpool killer, it's too strong someone is lying

RR since you're so good at mech, do you realise that someone has to be lying here? between bella and mala there's something stinky, I think it's bella.

[Gimli]

I'm so tired eira.

I know! You think I'm not? Really am.
Just vote Elements with me? Ease your strain?

I really think she is town now. I see your case, I made that exact same case as a possibility. she really isn't clear by any means. but it's banking on too many conditionals for it to work...

pedit: okay VOTE: bellaphant

[Gimli]

Bella/RR/flea?

someone tell me if this works

[Gimli]

Explain my play yesterday to me?

Explain why noone else dies n1 if I'm lying about anything.

I spent all yesterday telling people not to clear me. Why wouldn't I be shouting all over that I'm...double soft innod, instead

titus got the spit on n1, I don't know what you're talking about

[Gimli]

AISA GIVE ME ANOTHER 200 POSTS

pedit: but if the roleblocker dies they are toasted? and bella is an eternal limpool killer, it's too strong someone is lying

RR since you're so good at mech, do you realise that someone has to be lying here? between bella and mala there's something stinky, I think it's bella.

I do think scum seems underpowered here.
I don't think Bella's lying though, and then Mala shot Enchant, so can't be her.

There are a couple of possibilities, but it's too great a leap to make without evidence...

I will say though, at this point, I don't think Goons exist.

okay

either elly is lying or someone else is, because we can't make any scumteams if all the killing roles are true AND me/kj/flea are all vts. like there's not enough players left to make a scumteam.

[Gimli]

oh actually

the way bella treated AD seemed uninformed. I... yeah.

UNVOTE:

my god this game is so hard baby jesus save me

[Gimli]

...

This is definitely a bit tinfoily but...

What if Mala's the traitor?

Miller is a pretty solid claim for a traitor to make, and if she's a traitor who doesn't know the main scumteam, Enchant could have just been an accident.

It helps with the PR balance issue, and explains Elements' result... The informed bit could be the existence of a traitor... It all lines up.

Idk, someone tell me I'm crazy here

makes perfect sense to me

[Gimli]

her miller claim isn't making much sense with us having nothing but vanilla cops. I know I was arguing for the other thing, but especifically the fact that she is a one-shot doesn't make sense with her also being miller in a game of vanilla cops, cause all the results will be the same (non-vanilla), than if she was just a one-shot delayed vigilante.

[Gimli]

think I'm clearing rat, after all of this.

don't like nancy's defense of mala here either. scum team will know that one is a traitor, right?

traitor also makes sense with enchant's role, cause it'll return VTs and the traitor as non-officers. that way they won't mistakenly kill their traitor.

if we have all this killing power AND a tracker AND a parity cop, then surely mala can be the traitor.

but then we still have other three scums outside of mala.

[Gimli]

eira I'm almost done with posting for the gameday but I'll save this one post just to tell you this is extremely annoying to deal with your tunneling every single one of my posts. I don't wanna engage with you, you're not talking through anything with me just calling me scum and if you're town you're the biggest potato in the game. go talk to other people and leave me alone now.

[Gimli]

if RR is right, this is literally elim-or-lose.

[Gimli]

ATTENTION EVERYONE

ISO malakittens. ctrl+f enchant. there isn't a single moment in which malakittens scumreads enchant. this is her last post in which she talks about enchant before she kills him:

Idk but Eira feels like scum failing which is weird bc they aren’t under pressure when they stated acting like that,

I feel like Kj is p clear to be town to me right now between Meta and Titus. So not touching there with a 29008493 foot pole.

Elements im kinda ont be fence about. I can see elements being a scum pr.

Enchant is p town imo

Gamma can go either way

Action Dan can go eight way

Radialrwt might be town but idk how they play but I’m townreading they slot

Flea I think is fae town.

Gimli is gonna be sorted out but obv scum js

Bbt might be town but idk

[Gimli]

if malakittens was a townie with a gun she would've shot me and not someone she was townreading

[Gimli]

I am a Miller, but I also have one shot role.
I have one shot delayed vig.

I’m the asshole who shot enchant.

I was in between him or gimli, but in the end I picked enchant because

I had something bugging me in the way he was engaging with me.

you shot him on n2.

there was something about enchant bugging you in the way he was engaging with you on d1-d2? let's check that...

this is all the interaction between mala and enchant that I could find:

OoS sorry this game started at a really bad time.

I’ll be able to catch up definitely tmrw at work.

What officer you are

Did mala claim officer name

[Gimli]

VOTE: malakittens

[Gimli]

Are you seriously arguing that Mala not revealing the vig aspect of their role is AntiTown? That's like accusing a TPR of lying because they didn't claim their role on D1, except somehow you have chosen an even worse argument because in this situation the TPR you're accusing of lying has already shot scum. I don't see how this makes any sense to you and I don't believe you really think so.

~Joker

Both heads of the hydra simply don't pay any attention to anything, it's amazing.

Last post before I go to bed. If there's a traitor, this is 5v4 and they're one miselim from parity. So this blind defense of mala is extremely alarming. They probably figured out who the traitor is by now.

[Gimli]

RR, you're trying to convince scum KJ here. They're close to parity and eliminating me ends the game. Since eira will never stop tunneling me and will never vote mala over me, and I think eira is actually town, this is game over

It's too bad we took so long to find each other and clear each other

[Gimli]

Oh.

Eiralox is scum.

It's eira/KJ/mala

[Gimli]

Flea I'm sorry for the pronouns, don't think it's on purpose, I have never met anyone that's a faer before, I don't know how to write these things, English isn't my first language, and remembering your pronouns while being attacked by the entire game is something hard.

If you're town you need to understand where me and rat are going with this

[Gimli]

Gimli............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Just why?

It's hard to make sense of this game if you're not scum

I have a hard time seeing four of them left, but if I'm clearing BBT and RR, I'm left with the tiny est pool. Like if you're town, the scum team is exactly mala/Elly/KJ/flea???

That would mean two goons?

So eh

[Gimli]

If one of them is a traitor it makes sense for it to be two goons

[Gimli]

Rats is really hard to find as scum

My reads overall:

Town (no particular order here)

KJ
Eiralox
Mala
Bella
BBT

Town lean

Flea

Null

0

Scum lean

0

Scum

Rat* [Traitor I think. I don't think shares a PT with Gimli.]
Gimli* [Noraa scum game.]
Elements

Joker's Poe is as insanely bad as Nancy's. It's a hydra that refuses to pretend they're solving. There's only two scumreads here! And the town pile must contain scum if you think there's a traitor since there's six people in the town pile. Lol.

What do you do when you want to protect all your scumbuddies at emil-or-lose, and pocket the remaining townies? You do a reads list that looks bonkers like this.

If I'm moving off of mala it's on KJ

[Gimli]

Ah I missed Elly in the list

Still, that and what Nancy did is all fake solving fmpov

[Gimli]

You aren't actually reading if you think Gimli threw that out to attract my attention onto Malakittens.

neither is doing that. both heads of the hydra are just pretending to solve.

for reference to whoever is a townie: I was trying to argue with rat that a miller MADE SENSE in the setup, and that elly's results would still be 'different' with a miller in the setup. that was so he wouldn't miselim me and it wasn't me shading mala at all.

I've only come to terms with the possibility of mala wolf after the traitor mechanical speculation became clearer to me from rat's posts. of course, mala being shady about the miller thing helped.

[Gimli]

But let's do a more consensus scum read first and go from there?

Like, if we elim Gimli and Flea, they flip red and the game isn't over THEN we go for Mala? Doesn't that make more sense?

we can be playing a game with a traitor and three pack wolves left. this can be ELO. flipping me would end the game if that's the case.

[Gimli]

The less amount of information that scum has the better. Can we just move on?

Unless you are telling me that I’m scum and enchant bussed me by fishing for my role.

So, to be 100% clear, all it says is that "you are a miller" with no elaboration on what that means?

Yes

I'll let the asshole thing slide since it was apparently influenced by outside forces, and I think that's mostly reasonable.

But these two posts should not exist in the same universe, EVEN IF we allow the possibility of a Role PM that doesn't explain the role.

The first one implies that information exists, otherwise there'd be nothing to hide from scum, and no reason to ask to move on instead. The answer would be "I already claimed everything" or something along those lines. The latter one claims that there was no such information.

And this isn't an instance of hiding a lack of power as bait either, because "I don't know" is completely neutral and doesn't influence what scum can or can't do with the role.

If she'd said she was only claiming miller to avoid the kill, and said so once the results discrepancy happened, I'd even buy that. But she didn't, and it's too late now that she's reaffirmed the claim multiple times.

EIRA
FLEA
WHOEVER ELSE IS TOWN

PLEASE READ THIS AND UNDERSTAND THE IMPLICATIONS

I have 5 posts left.

[Gimli]

Gimli, it's real simple here: Elements is scum.

I don't see how anyone can defend their votes, pushes and lack of concern at this point.

You know who else I believe are scum, but that's moot here: If you voted Elements I would have been willing to believe your current theatrical performance, even if only fractionally.

But you're not scumhutning, you're trying to save the mutineers from flipping at all:

EXACTLY what ya'll did to Gamma while I shouted at the top of my head that it's exactly what ya'll doing with Gamma. If KJ is scum, they're scum with Elements. Vote Elements, But KJ ain't, are they?

I've been really pushing you here, because I know ya'll were hoping that Mala would be mis-ellimable, maybe even thinking Mala wans't the one who killed Enchant.

Whatever.

No way we're voting Killing Joke over Elements, who's happy with offing crew left and right without pausing to even comment on why.

I'm starting to sound like the parrot here and think it's best if I step back, merely because at this point I'm wasting time on what I consider to be a shut case.

it's possible that elly is scum, but then KJ is a goon. it's hard for me to compromise on elly today when I'm more certain on mala/KJ. but let me entertain this elly's scum world.

she can be lying about her pairings, scum had exactly the kind of cop that would give her the results she needs to make a fake claim. that's granted and I said it first in the thread today. but it's HARD, she has to basically bank on the PR hardclaim on d3 to always be true. but then again, if she is scum she has no choice.

if she is scum and KJ is town, then she is a roleblocker and visited KJ to roleblock them. granted as well.

if she is scum and KJ is scum, she visited KJ to... doctor them? doesn't make much sense. maybe? but idk.

so like. she is hardly ever scum with KJ. and the associations from d1 don't really work if my memory doesn't fail me.

I get that she played a detached and scummy game here.

flea/elly/mala/????? could work

[Gimli]

if mala is a miller who's also a one-shot, but the miller type isn't specified, then her miller doesn't mess with the cop that the wolves had, because she'll return as an officer either way. the 'miller' is an alignment miller if it's not specified. if it's anything else, it's specified. that actually means mala has lied and isn't a miller. she is the traitor. the miller claim was to signal to the wolves. enchant's posts to her were signaling to mala. KJ's gameday is signaling to mala. she is a traitor with a one-shot, she took down enchant.

it's crazy but it's what happened.

[Gimli]

the only time we scored, it was an own goal

and this is my final post <3

[Gimli]

actually I have one more post.

I want you all to pay attention to an important aspect of this game: the first time the word 'traitor' was used.

it was by KJ.

out of nowhere, joker starts traitor hunting RR. I think he wants to know who the traitor is, so he is signaling to the traitor that he is scum by bringing up the traitor ideas, by hunting traitors in the thread with absolutely forced reasoning against RR. I want you all townies to read those passages by KJ yourselves, I don't think I can influence your reads all that much anymore. but please read:

I don't believe this makes sense as a fakeclaim. I already just explained why, and why I changed my mind from my initial reaction.

She is claiming parity cop cause she can back it up cause they obviously have a VT cop

Sure, but Neapolitan already exists and is way more likely to have been floated as a fakeclaim than Vanilla Parity Cop. Outside of setups known to have wackier or more convoluted roles, there's just not usually a reason to even think about things like Vanilla Parity Cops.

Why do I not check something I don't believe?

KJ could be whatever mafia role that isn't giving a vanilla result, and you still get a false positive by targeting someone else cause you're a parity cop. Seriously elly

Thinking on it more, the less I think Mafia Vanilla Parity Cop makes sense. My gut reaction was that it's more useful for scum, and since scum are already inherently nerfed by the delayed kill, scum having decently strong PRs makes sense. My mistake though was that Scum will, at least for a while, have known roles to check against, which kinda negates the whole parity aspect. Why not just give them a straight Neapolitan at that point? And from there why overcomplicate things into a double targeting role you need to carefully keep up with all game? Even if the role is just entirely made up with no basis in reality... Neapolitan is just a better claim. Easier to maintain, easier to understand, easier to not do anything useful with.

So I think I'm back to trusting Elements here.

Scum make terrible fake claims all the time, just like they can push weak arguments (like the one above) if they so choose.

If scum!Elememts claimed Neapolitan they will eventually have to face the "...why are you still alive" question.

I messaged mods last night and received confirmation that this setup *can* contain traitors and Rats is *kind of* reading as Traitor to me this game.

I'll also note that openclaiming miller is a great way to signal that you're a traitor.

[Gimli]

VOTE: eiralox

[Gimli]

VOTE: eiralox

[Gimli]

gg scum, you played really well

townies played parts of it well, I'd like to recognise especially two slots

KJ's hydra d1 was brilliant and I'm glad to have replaced in and read those posts.

It takes a lot of skill to notice malakittens was a traitor, and RR's solve was ridiculous. that was mad skill.

thank you aisa and furtive for modding, you are the best <3

[Gimli]

Why were you deathtunnelling me?

you weren't reading my posts with any attention and maybe I wasn't trying to read yours either. just one of those things. I townread your slot the majority of the game but at some point my solve went bananas.

Thanks for modding!
I'm surprised how long my claim kept me alive

you were the best

[Gimli]

mod pt was a cute read! I hope to play in a game you guys are modding some other time