In post 1799, Jingle wrote:Snipped for readability.
The problem with the bolded isn't that you took either stance, but that you took both. Simultaneously. RC and Tora are fighting over nothing, so they are inflating the thread, but ALSO you are happy with letting them fight.
The underlined: No it isn't. It's easier to sort some people when they get to a certain level of angry. In this case, the argument had devolved to "You always scumread me and are an asshole." vs "You won't stop replacing into my games and are an asshole." Both players were arguing from a position of "I don't care about his alignment, lynch him". The only outcomes there are being able to read the fight as not SvS (Already obvious at that point) and the fight making so much noise the thread got choked with it causing apathy. People are easier to read when they're off balance, not when they're raging at each other to the point where the argument isn't about the game. Then it's just noise that people have to wade through to find tiny grains of real content.
Boiling down the rest of my case to the italicized is a major misrep as well. For example "Passively supporting a lynch while simultaneously distancing yourself from it" is by no means a "playstyle difference". It's a scum motivated tool for a lack of accountability. Why?
Well lets look at your current line of argument. The intersect between the two wagons probably has scum. Surprisingly, you're not in that intersect, because despite the fact that you supported the RR lynch, you never placed a vote there. If you'd like, I can go dig up supporting evidence.
Also not mentioned: the mental gymnastics required to somehow paint putting RR at L-1 as towny for baiting a scum quicklynch and scummy for... Baiting a scumquicklynch? And then not doing that.
1. Okay that point is clearer now. The difference being I was strongly suspecting the fight was TvS even before they started fighting. So the fight inflating the thread would by definition be caused by scum. Which is my original point about the inflation. Inflation doesn't happen because scum post nonsense by themselves. Inflation happens because scum continue or start converations about things that are not game-related.
2. The underlined. If you want to argue that real life facts are not true then that is a conversation to be had outside of the game. Angry people are easier to read. That's why there are emotional aspects of interrogations. That's why poker players target people on tilt.
As for this game and this particular fight... there would not be a fight if they didn't scumread each other. So I disagree with your conclusion that they wanted the other lynched no matter what their alignment is. Sure they might get on each others nerves no matter what but they don't start randomly fighting like that if each of them townread the other. A scumread is the spark.
3. You seem to think that I deliberately did not vote for RR so that I later when I make this case can conveniently not include myself in the list.
When the RR votes were piling on I was flip flopping on RR, townreading him for reasons, scumreading him for others, trying to sort him through other ways like watching their interactions with others and engaging him myself. I was considering lynching them for the flip and to have a wagon we can lynch one of in d2 as votes piling on that quickly indicated scum on the wagon. Whether it was for bussing or to lynch a townie. But I wasn't sure if I really scumread them.
When the flicker votes were piling on I was scumreading flicker. That's the difference.
And then the intersect thing is a way for me to focus my scumhunting on a small group of players instead of all 16. All I said about it was that there is scum in the intersect. I didn't say everyone in the intersect is scum. Why do I believe there is scum in the interest? Because there are more scum reasons to join both wagons and unvote than there are town reasons to join both wagons and then unvote both, as I explained to cheeky a few posts back. Mcmenno was saying it was meaningless because any group of 4 could easily contain 1 scum. But the thing is I believe that group definitely contains scum, so it's far more probable than a random pick of 4.
I didn't pick the names randomly.. I picked the names based on the fact that I find it extremely unlikely that 4 townies had the same read on a player being wagoned, then had the same change of heart, then had the same read on another player being wagoned, then had the same change of heart.
And it might just be Elsa being a 3p messing with the odds of this whole thing.. but to equate it to a random pick of 4 was wrong of Mcmenno.
And I'm curious.. if I had voted both of them.. do you honestly expect me to put myself in my own scum pool?
Probably not.. no you're saying I'm scum because I'm scumreadimg people based on something I didn't do.
But I went through like the most diffcult and roundabout way of doing so. Why wouldn't I pick literally anything else that some people did that some didn't?
Let me explain how much effort that was from my pov. 99% of the time I go on MS it's on the phone.. so on phone I had to go back to the first wagon, take the names from the VC, go through the thread counting any additional votes that may have been missed, then do the same thing again for the 2nd wagon, then write up a few posts that actually explain what I'm doing because like I can't just fling a bunch of naked names around, JUST so I can have an additional reason to start a vanity wagon on someone I already had several reasons to scumread which is way more than enough to start a vanity wagon.
I wanted to help people to see why RC/Chara is scum. They don't see it.
I wanted to point out that Toog's lurkiness is on par with TFP and nico and that he has voted only on popular wagons, but that got ignored.
So it's like not even the scum pool thing that I do that most players don't do that people are ignoring of mine, but pretty much every thing I bring forward is being ignored.
So you know what playing my way is not going to work with this playerlist.
So if you're town help me appeal to the status quo better. What should I do?
And if you're scum you should lynch me now because I guarantee you I get harder to lynch as town with time not easier. My cases become much more aligned with what people are used to seeing and I know how to argue them better because I have more information behind the reasoning for them.
And if I end up being right about Chara being scum then this site is in serious need of new blood because people are like letting their friendships mess with their reads.
Hydra of Toranaga and Nancy Drew 39
