Micro 880: A Normal Game - Game Over!

[OkaPoka]

/confirm

[OkaPoka]

hi skitter

[OkaPoka]

is firebringer always like this?

[OkaPoka]

do you have a scumtell

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: sweetnsassy

the more defenseless, the better

[OkaPoka]

sweet n sassy sounds like a hydra name. are you a hydra?

[OkaPoka]

someone do something to spice this game up

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: dunnstral

wagn this

[OkaPoka]

dunn's done

[OkaPoka]

firebringer r u scared

[OkaPoka]

i dont scumread anyone

[OkaPoka]

My SR's still on dunn

wait you are serious about this?

[OkaPoka]

Hot take:temporal lich is town

im reaching the opposite conclusion

[OkaPoka]

That's why its a hot take!

well the odds of him being town are kinda in your favor so its not the hottest of takes

[OkaPoka]

I mean you could say that abou literally any hot-take-townread

i guess we have to use meh takes for townreads

scumreads can be hottakes tho

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: temporallich

Nah I just think him voting Dunn and his scum read is backward rationalization

[OkaPoka]

Is cfj always like this

[OkaPoka]

Bad vote duck

[OkaPoka]

Mr lich is lying about something

[OkaPoka]

How is it artificial and forced?

Explain your whole thought process

You posted the same "I'm town" post twice, once in pregame and once in D1.

You're clearly scum trying to fool the town into thinking you're town, the second post seems to be for those that didn't see your first post.

The same content in the two posts makes it not even seem like you're trying to be genuine.

[OkaPoka]

I can only read that post in the voice of the bald guy from the princess bride

[OkaPoka]

Nah it's way to elaborate and descriptive this early to not have some bs mixed in

[OkaPoka]

Cfj how long does it typically take for you to make a post

[OkaPoka]

I mean you could say that abou literally any hot-take-townread

i guess we have to use meh takes for townreads

scumreads can be hottakes tho

what don't you like about temporal lich?

@oka

he's being excessive with his sr on dunn this early and that other post was scummy like an over justification for doing something that didnt require it

[OkaPoka]

How is it artificial and forced?

Explain your whole thought process

You posted the same "I'm town" post twice, once in pregame and once in D1.

You're clearly scum trying to fool the town into thinking you're town, the second post seems to be for those that didn't see your first post.

The same content in the two posts makes it not even seem like you're trying to be genuine.

that's the post i'm townreading him for; don't think scum actually push the bolded

why did it take you so long to vote him for this post?

nah its too much i think

its like he wanted to vote dunn, realized maybe it'd be too scummy to say little of it and went back to add some extra stuff to make it sound reasonable why he was voting dunn

[OkaPoka]

I mean you could say that abou literally any hot-take-townread

i guess we have to use meh takes for townreads

scumreads can be hottakes tho

what don't you like about temporal lich?

@oka

he's being excessive with his sr on dunn this early and that other post was scummy like an over justification for doing something that didnt require it

what does 'excessive with a scumread this early' mean?
disagree about the other post

i dont believe its possible to truly get a hard scumread on someone who has made like two posts that are clearly shitposty

[OkaPoka]

i think his read was fine for that stage of the game
i don't understand ur scumread on him really

whats hard to understand

[OkaPoka]

it doesnt seem like you dont understand my scumread

sounds like you disagree with me

[OkaPoka]

Hey guys, glad to be a member of the town once again

Hey guys, glad to be a member of the town once again

attacking someone over these two posts and being serious about scumreading it is a fabricated read

[OkaPoka]

me not voting lich immediately is the amount of time it took for me to realize that the dunn wagon cannot be milked for anymore potentially game advancing content

[OkaPoka]

the_worst do you actually scumread me or?

[OkaPoka]

I see from post 123 now you're going with the resistance thing. How much resistance can really be expected if Dunn as scum only has one buddy, maybe two but most likely not? Especially if his buddy wasn't around. Ugh, I type that out and see callforjudgement beat me to that point. I'll leave in in my post anyway and my questions in the above paragraph still stand. Im also curious what you think of the timing of firebringers (why did my phone auto correct to fire fingers?) vote on you and whether you'd consider that to be resistance.

i don't know, i'm just kinda speaking from experience - i've not often seen scum get run up this fast in a micro
i don't know necessarily what their buddy may be doing, i'm just kinda saying holistically after playing a lot of micros i can't think of any offhand where scum got l-1'd that fast

if scum is getting wagoned there's two votes that wont' be on that player
but if town is getting wagoned in a lol-rvs kind of way, there's two scum who would be happy to join the wagon. idk if dunn's town or if there were two scum on him but i think that in that kind of wagon scum are happy to place votes so there won't be resistance

like i guess i'm not really looking at this from the poe of: if he's scum there would have been resistance so what's his buddy doing
but more like: in general in a micro i think it's p easy for town to get run up, esp in a lol-rvs wagon, since scum have little incentive to not vote, so the fast wagon kinda looks like this scenario to me

i hope that explained my thought process

and yeah i thought fire's vote offwagon was some of that potential resistance if it actually is a wagon on scum

thanks for explaining why im town!

[OkaPoka]

me not voting lich immediately is the amount of time it took for me to realize that the dunn wagon cannot be milked for anymore potentially game advancing content

i don't understand what you're trying to say here

wagons make content but once the wagon loses its steam its time to find another wagon

until you start getting reads and stuff

[OkaPoka]

Hi duck

Im phoneposting but I'm interested in what you were trying to accomplish so far

[OkaPoka]

the worst lets chat if ur down

[OkaPoka]

are you related to TheWorst by any chance?

[OkaPoka]

SKITTER how would you rate your towncase on me

[OkaPoka]

time to color ur reads skitter

OkaPoka

(4) (L-1) -

callforjudgement

,

TemporalLich

,

the worst

,

skitter

Dunnstral

(4) (L-1) -

OkaPoka

,

Sleepless Assassin

,

TemporalLich

,

Firebringer

hmm

it fits pretty well with what you are saying

u can be town

[OkaPoka]

ok u can be my second scumread

[OkaPoka]

i dont feel like pushing a new wagon right now because i like where im at

interested in t_w's take on the game tho

[OkaPoka]

because i want to talk to the worst first

nothing to push that hasnt been said already

[OkaPoka]

yes

[OkaPoka]

im getting bored
so tentatively without much thinking and subject to change

{OkaPoka}
{callforjudgement}
{FireBringer, skitter30}

{SweetNSassy, Sleepless Assassin}

{Dunnstral, the worst}
{Temporal Lich}


ama

[OkaPoka]

1. force of habit
2. i like him and he seems to understand my words and agrees with me. maybe im being whiteknighted though but i havent been whiteknighted in a very long time so thats not going to be at the top of my scumreading criterion

now that ive said that whiteknighting is back on the table for suspicion on anyone except firebringer because the well

has been

poisoned

oooh
ahh

[OkaPoka]

now that we've had this talk i think i should bump him up to cfj tier

thanks

{OkaPoka}
{callforjudgement, FireBringer}
{skitter30}

{SweetNSassy, Sleepless Assassin}

{Dunnstral, the worst}
{Temporal Lich}

[OkaPoka]

What are you seeing that I don’t see?

all of his posts feel fake and agenda-y

like he's trying to find reasons to continue pushing temporal and finding reasons to buddy up to you - that's kinda why i don't think you're svs

anyways i'm nominally at work so later

Show me the evidence plz

[OkaPoka]

idk what evidence are you looking for exactly

The part where I'm trying to continue find ways to push lich

[OkaPoka]

Lean scum on both o you because I don't see any signs of either of you scum hunting or trying to scumhunt. It's just barren imo.

[OkaPoka]

Sleepless should be a tr but he uses too many words to say a few things so idk where to put him


Pedit: so where am I pushing lich in those posts

[OkaPoka]

I'm not going to case Dunn

However I can't mark him full scum because from my experience he doesnt contribute much substance as town d1

[OkaPoka]

But he asks a lot of questions that could just be busywork and then goes for lhf so holistically it's a but scummy

[OkaPoka]

Cjf was asking me why I don't start new wagons if I feel like new wagons are good way to create content.

I like where my vote is.

[OkaPoka]

But I really don't see how me leaving my vote on lich and that post can be construed (idk if I'm using that word correctly) as a "push"

[OkaPoka]

Me posting a readslist is also not a push

Pedit: I'd like lich to be lynched but I don't have anything new to add to my existing feelings

Either you liked what I said before or you didn't

[OkaPoka]

Because I'm not canvassing votes not casing him or posting reminders. I'm barely even mentioning him outside the context of my reads

Right now im taking a laissez faire approach

[OkaPoka]

What's yours

[OkaPoka]

So what are these new reasons to continue pushing you see

[OkaPoka]

Where have I posted these reasons to stay on the wagon.

I haven't even cased lich beyond the first case

[OkaPoka]

Ok sure I guess.


What's wrong with me liking where I'm at

[OkaPoka]

SMH can't believe your being all agenda-y and continuing to find reasons to push okapoka.

That's really scummy bc I think okapoka is town

[OkaPoka]

Do you see how that line of reasoning though potentially true is very unhelpful

[OkaPoka]

Yes I want to park my vote

[OkaPoka]

I have a good reason

It's been the same reason

[OkaPoka]

and if you are asking why im not being an active pusher (my definition)

its because sweetnsassy isnt doing anything. once that slot starts doing something then ill try and canvas the two votes of dunn and the_worst and maybe canvas the vote of firebringer

but then again they have their own brains and if they dont feel like that lich post was scummy then i dont know what to say other than its scummy

[OkaPoka]

t_w and lich imma need some readslist from you two <3

[OkaPoka]

im also interested in a cjf readslist

[OkaPoka]

firebringer is scum why?

[OkaPoka]

can u click iso on firebringer and come back to me if you still hold those reasons

[OkaPoka]

umm but then by your admission firebringer explains his skitter sr? even if you think it comes from town more, its still his reasoning?

[OkaPoka]

is this not a good time to post then

cfj can you link me some scum games you feel represent your scum meta

[OkaPoka]

okay i guess im just going to avoid sorting you until later if i make it to that stage

[OkaPoka]

im going to need some reads from sleepless assassin when he comes back

and some general thoughts on the game

[OkaPoka]

because i don't know if analyzing is within scumrange and old games are really bad ways to meta people so ill just scumhunt the old fashion way which is vca/wagons -> reading motivations

[OkaPoka]

ew

[OkaPoka]

i honestly would have liked u more if u naked voted me there

[OkaPoka]

ur firebringer read still has some unresolved issues that need resolving

[OkaPoka]

if you want to scumread firebringer its a free country i think

but your scumread on firebringer is like not logical

its on the basis of him being noncooperative but he's been cooperative, just not mindmelding

[OkaPoka]

talk to me about dunn's slot and why you have him more town than firebringer

[OkaPoka]

by your own admission firebringer talks about his skitter sr

[OkaPoka]

by your own admission firebringer talks about his skitter sr

He talked about it once. Then refuses to explain when asked to explain it in more depth and the explanation is insufficient for me to take it with any degree of heart (but is still enough an explanation to know he isn't just making up reads from nothing)

Also 314 is uncooperative no matter what universe you're in.

sometimes you don't need more than a sentence to explain why someone is scummy, right?

and he literally talks to skitter for the next page so yeah

[OkaPoka]

does that mean im town now

[OkaPoka]

does dunn's original post not suffice

[OkaPoka]

you need dunn to case sns for you to vote that slot?

[OkaPoka]

but does dunn casing sns affect your read on sns significantly or?

[OkaPoka]

does dunn's original post not suffice

I mean I can actually take it to heart so it sorta works, but more explanation would be nice before I consider voting SnS (though it's pretty much moot now).

then what does this mean

[OkaPoka]

hi replacement dont lynch me im at l1

[OkaPoka]

not fake

only forced in the sense that some of the reads were less developed then i want them to be

i can do an updated readslist if u want or would u prefer me to talk to you in the context of that post

[OkaPoka]

FB went from town lean to solid town

and he was questioning why i had firebringer as town and i went more town on him so yeah

[OkaPoka]

if anything i went the opposite direction of appeasing him

[OkaPoka]

thrice

[OkaPoka]

as for why i dont case dunn

dont feel like casing him because i dont see how casing dunn does anything beneficial

i dont want to lynch him rn and he doesnt seem like a slot that will care for pressure

[OkaPoka]

because i have too many slots that need development readswise

[OkaPoka]

he's my strongest scumread but i dont want to push him hard when i have very weak reads on sleepless,dunn,kop,oversoul

like i have leans for yall but it can be dropped on a dime

[OkaPoka]

and if you are asking why im not being an active pusher (my definition)

its because sweetnsassy isnt doing anything. once that slot starts doing something then ill try and canvas the two votes of dunn and the_worst and maybe canvas the vote of firebringer

but then again they have their own brains and if they dont feel like that lich post was scummy then i dont know what to say other than its scummy

Did you change your mind since this post?

Yeah.

At the time I was banking on engaging with the worst and maybe getting a full sort that way but now I'm going to do things more independently.

[OkaPoka]

Forming reads but I'm probs best at pushing reads

[OkaPoka]

Flipping me is helpful probably but my wagon is definitely not hard to gain traction.

With a multitude of slots being afk and kop indicating the formation of sr and the Reformation of scum me it's actually pretty fast especially with a gamestate as lackluster as this one

[OkaPoka]

Meh scum usually don't hard push d1 from my experience


It's like they try to put the minimum amount of effort to mislynch.

Updates readslist later when I'm not on mobile

[OkaPoka]

I'll try mobile list since it might be a few hours

Town: me + firebringer + skitter + cjf(tho will need a reeval)
Null: sleepless assassin + kop + oversoul
Scum: Dunn + lich

There is going to differentiation in the tiers but yeah

[OkaPoka]

You have too much to lose to try and keep me afloat. You can't buddy a dead slot and you will end up being called a white knight. It sabotages you too much and in truth I think more townies have been called white knights than scum actually white knighting.


Pedit: wagon analysis since it's formed up twice

[OkaPoka]

Yeah best bet is temp scum I think. If it's not him it's whoever hammers

[OkaPoka]

Partially why I think getting sleepless reads is very important ATM

[OkaPoka]

Risky as in high risk high reward?

Bc rn I see this as a high risk low reward.

Best case for scum you is you stop a mislynch and get a town ally who probably will town read you but no guarantee of actually working with you.

And you might redirect onto your buddy.

Worst case you eat rope for being a white knight

Pedit: idk. I'm not scum reading him for bad logic, I was scum reading him for jumping the gun too fast and actually being serious about that read

[OkaPoka]

More null than anything

[OkaPoka]

NAI rather*

[OkaPoka]

Noted I guess.

Honestly give skitter the rc treatment. If she is still alive by lylo she is probs scum bc she is too competent not to endgame or draw a bullet by then

[OkaPoka]

Yes I prefer evil alignment

[OkaPoka]

You know I've never rolled Mason in any of my completed games and I feel like Mason would be my favorite role

Behind vengeful

[OkaPoka]

Did sweet n sassy ask to play mafia or did you ask her to play @sleepless

[OkaPoka]

Is there a role modifier that only lets you check people on lynch wagon?

[OkaPoka]

If not I think "Biased" or "Prejudiced" would be a good name.

Prejudiced cop
Prejudiced tracker etc

[OkaPoka]

1) just curious

2) lich was voting firebringer at the time and questioned my firebringer TR?

[OkaPoka]

Kop explain to me in context how I was appeasing lich

[OkaPoka]

@mod vla next 48 hrs

[OkaPoka]

I am preempting the what if firebringer is buddying argument

[OkaPoka]

You have too much to lose to try and keep me afloat. You can't buddy a dead slot and you will end up being called a white knight. It sabotages you too much and in truth I think more townies have been called white knights than scum actually white knighting.

Could you clarify what you meant by this? I'm interpreting this as you asking Firebringer not to defend you because you fear he'll be scummy for doing so, but think I might have misinterpreted. (It can't be a scum breadcrumb/signal, which was my first thought, because scum have daytalk.)

No I'm saying he's town and this isn't likely scum whiteknight because the risk reward of hard town read ing me

[OkaPoka]

returning from vla early

[OkaPoka]

I am preempting the what if firebringer is buddying argument

i don't get everything after point 2 then

im just saying for future reference im not going to townread anyone who defends me

[OkaPoka]

still need reads from sleepless assassin


kop whats your read on everyone, but specifically me?

[OkaPoka]

Scum just a bunch of scared kids

[OkaPoka]

Maybe just maybe we live in a world of all town wagon and scum want to see if I can get lynched wo any blood on their hands

[OkaPoka]

In which case, Dunn+sleepless?

[OkaPoka]

Skitter once I flip town who is scum

[OkaPoka]

What's the game plan when I flip town lich?

[OkaPoka]

Also updooted readslist from you pretty please?

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: SweetNSassy

The avoiding talking about things thing feels scummy

This was her first game. It looks like she just had no idea what to say. I gave her a quick rundown before we /in'd but told her once we have role PMs only ask questions in thread. I think she got overwhelmed. Sucks to see a replacement rather than allowing us to help her figure it out because now she probably won't stay on site and now I don't really have a reason to play but whatever, on with the game I guess.

OK, this seems reasonable

What's the game plan when I flip town lich?

Dumb question

its really another way of asking who he suspects as scum other than me

[OkaPoka]

dunn u just want me to eat rope dont u

[OkaPoka]

skitter's like not getting lynched ever

[OkaPoka]

hmmm


there is like no viable counterwagon to me


thisisfine.jpg

[OkaPoka]

so lich

what makes you flip from me being scummier to fire being scummier

because from what i see

you start to scumread me more as my wagon builds and scumread firebringer more as my wagon withers

[OkaPoka]

happened with dunn too

[OkaPoka]

so barring the first rvs vote from lich (it was on me)

VOTE: Dunnstral

L-1

Hey guys, glad to be a member of the town once again

This also being 86 isn't a good sign.

this ends up being his only sr at the time when dunn is biggest wagon

VOTE: OkaPoka

Maybe, but a scumread is still a scumread

this happens after i unvote dunn which ends the momentum there
so he starts a wagon on me!
after cfj cases me and skitter approves

VOTE: Firebringer

That vote doesn't get with me, and neither does your Oka townread tbh.

this happens after my wagon weakens again during basically an era of nobody has a solid wagon
and skitter srs firebringer here as well ~recently

I townread Oversoul. Very good catch up and logic.

Therefore I will change my vote.

VOTE: OkaPoka

L-1

and back to me at l1


like pushing wagons is townie and all but i think its a bit suspect to change your reads so your top sr always matches your vote

like his votes goes from dunn->oka->firebringer->oka
but his srs line up the exact same, check his iso he puts firebringer at top of sr list

maybe coincidence but me doubt

[OkaPoka]

why r u so confident in dunn being scum?

I've got no other SR's and the game is stagnating.

VOTE: OkaPoka

Maybe, but a scumread is still a scumread

VOTE: OkaPoka

Maybe, but a scumread is still a scumread

Why did you switch your vote?

Oka's new posts don't seem towny.

VOTE: Firebringer

That vote doesn't get with me, and neither does your Oka townread tbh.

t_w and lich imma need some readslist from you two <3

here's a read list I guess

town

- CfJ, skitter

town lean

- sleepless, the worst

meh

- sweetnsassy, dunn

scum lean

- oka

scum

- firebringer

tw and dunn might be one tier too high, meh

I townread Oversoul. Very good catch up and logic.

Therefore I will change my vote.

VOTE: OkaPoka

L-1

What's the game plan when I flip town lich?

I'd vote either dunn or firebringer. You flipping red like I suspect would mean I'd vote firebringer.

Also updooted readslist from you pretty please?

town

- CfJ, skitter

town lean

- Oversoul

meh

- dunn, Kop, sleepless

scum lean

- firebringer

scum

- oka

look at these read shifts

they line up perfectly with his votes

which also line up with how the gamestate is feeling basically

dunn wagon is popular -> i sr dunn

dunn wagon no longer popular ->need new sr -> oka might be hot commodity as cjf cases and skitter approves -> votes oka and srs oka now

oka wagon loses steam -> needs new sr -> firebringer seems to be getting sr by skitter -> firebringer jumps to top sr and votes him (look at iso no mention of sring firebringer b4hand, logically if he wanted a new wagon he'd resolve tw or sleepless)

oka wagon gains steam again -> votes oka and i become top sr again?

[OkaPoka]

oka if you're SRing me because my vote is true, you're scum even if you're town

nah i still think your are voting first and rationalizing later

[OkaPoka]

i dont even understand what thats supposed to mean

[OkaPoka]

i think site meta is at the point where people eat rope for defending lynched townies

i think lich reads+votes swap is too suspect. like voting top sr but look at firebringer example. where was the indication of firebringer scumread beforehand at all? he was showing signs of not liking sleepless and t_w more and the fact that he sr firebringer more than me is a bit surprising with the coming of the vote.

[OkaPoka]

i dont even understand what thats supposed to mean

I'm pretty sure trying to wagon me because my votes match my reads is anti-town regardless of alignment

except it appears that your reads are coming after your vote

and your reads/votes literally follow the momentum of the game with each step

im not seeing indication of your reads before you do it you know?

for example why is firebringer less scummy now than before and what made you at the time put me as less scummy than firebringer? i didnt see indication of these things before it happened

[OkaPoka]

also would like to know the oka/dunn combo distinction. Going ???? on that.

if it's SvS I'll be shocked inside-out.

TvT might be a possibility but I think SvT is more likely.

Oka is the one pushing the Dunn wagon btw

i got that oka is pushing the dunn wagon, i am just wondering why u thought it had to be TvS.

SvS is right out because seriously? Scum Bussing this early is insane!

Oka doesn't seem particularly towny especially in the light of a green flip, 105 and 127 lead me to believe scummy wagon, but scum bussing this early is insane.

idk scum bussing this early really isn't abnormal. but i don't think oka push is much of a buss.

right now Oka is a solid meh

VOTE: OkaPoka

Maybe, but a scumread is still a scumread

this is the best indication of a reads shift where you think that dunn and i are antialigned

but wrt that you still had dunn as your only sr and me at "meh" and you go through the line of logic where if dunn flips town you'll sr me and then once dunn wagon weakens down you push me up to a scumread

and you've basically dropped your dunn sr at this point because your iso ditches the idea of dunn scum ever again and your leave him at "meh"

but its not like you were kidding about that rvs vote earlier because you indicated it was a serious vote

and wrt to this

talk to me about dunn's slot and why you have him more town than firebringer

Despite Dunn's artificial first few posts, he seems to be giving a bare minimum of explanation. Don't like how he pretty much pulls a Firebringer when asked to explain his SnS SR though.

dunn doesnt explain himself at all until post 300 and you vote me post 167

so yeah

vote vote vote

[OkaPoka]

okay point to concrete examples where i do things that scum does with my evil scum posts

[OkaPoka]

posts 385 to 425 is your restriction

[OkaPoka]

firebringer is scum why?

can u click iso on firebringer and come back to me if you still hold those reasons

umm but then by your admission firebringer explains his skitter sr? even if you think it comes from town more, its still his reasoning?

is this not a good time to post then

cfj can you link me some scum games you feel represent your scum meta

okay i guess im just going to avoid sorting you until later if i make it to that stage

im going to need some reads from sleepless assassin when he comes back

and some general thoughts on the game

because i don't know if analyzing is within scumrange and old games are really bad ways to meta people so ill just scumhunt the old fashion way which is vca/wagons -> reading motivations

ill make it easy for you

these are the spooky posts in question

[OkaPoka]

i can because thats where the read flip happened since you said yourself i was making evil scummy posts that you had to bump firebringer up to compensate for my mega evil maniacal scumminess

[OkaPoka]

but lets just say somehow

you townread me more after your posted readslist where you had me at lean scummy

and after that you voted me to put me at l1

what was the point of that play?

[OkaPoka]

lol u sr me for pointing out a gap in your logic?

the one where you sr firebringer for not giving explanation but then you yourself said he gave explanation, it just happens you disagree with it?

[OkaPoka]

and if that post only indicates me being scum with firebringer then how does that bump firebringer up to less scummy LOL

[OkaPoka]

and if that post only indicates me being scum with firebringer then how does that bump firebringer up to less scummy LOL

[OkaPoka]

lol u sr me for pointing out a gap in your logic?

the one where you sr firebringer for not giving explanation but then you yourself said he gave explanation, it just happens you disagree with it?

I can see scum!you doing it to look like you're defending firebringer by attacking me

okay i just want this for the record

you still standby the idea that firebringer is scummy bc he didn't explain his skitter sr even when he did explain skitter sr by your own admission

its loaded but yeah

[OkaPoka]

someone vote lich lol

[OkaPoka]

Here's the timeline.

t_w and lich imma need some readslist from you two <3

here's a read list I guess

town

- CfJ, skitter

town lean

- sleepless, the worst

meh

- sweetnsassy, dunn

scum lean

- oka

scum

- firebringer

tw and dunn might be one tier too high, meh

Firebringer is the most scummy here.

You yourself admit that I made towny posts from that post to 425 (which is your vote on me btw)

You also admit that firebringer is less scummy because I've been so scummy.

But the only post I made in that time that made you feel like was scum motivated, implicates both me and firebringer as scum.

So the questions are

1) When you voted me at 425, was I the top scumread for you?
2) How does me making townier posts lead you to vote me, when I wasn't even your top scumread at the time?
3) How does making a post that implicates me and firebringer make it so I go from second scumread to first scumread and firebringer goes from first scumread to second scumread?

[OkaPoka]

skitter wya

[OkaPoka]

thoughts on my case?

[OkaPoka]

but he doesn't admit it until i laid out the cards for him

and his reads and vote pattern seems very intent on never having any sort of contradiction

isnt that scummy?

i think ur town but im using this interaction to sort you

[OkaPoka]

like look at his response to my case

his first instinct is to make his narrative seem clear

but once i explicitly lay out everything in a concise manner he just is like yeah shit

[OkaPoka]

And it's now even more opportunistic in his behavior

[OkaPoka]

okay but clearly temporal lich is not the type of person to vote people on a whim

by his own admission he had me top scum

and every time he was serious about a vote

[OkaPoka]

which makes me suspect that his readslist with top scum firebringer was fabricated, no?

[OkaPoka]

dunn do u like my case

[OkaPoka]

whats wrong with my case

[OkaPoka]

the way i see it, it really comes down to this for me.

temporal lich is basically displaying signs of backward rationalization, where he chooses the vote and then puts the read. he's been trying to mask his opportunism with his srs and vote changes, but his reads dont actually progress naturally because well, he isn't town. his reads come after his votes. thats why i am making a big deal out of his inconsistencies in between his firebringer and me scumread and how it doesnt make sense because he's justifying things after he does it.

for you however, i don't see clear signs of backward rationalization. maybe you have and ill have to reread you in depth. but its kinda clear from the get go that lich is just making stuff up .

[OkaPoka]

probs should've proofread my above post but the point still stands

lich does his read after his votes

his vote at 425 is a really good example of this, he hasn't actually been sorting me lol

[OkaPoka]

like i agree townies are hypocrites and inconsistent

but i dont think this is a towny inconsistency

[OkaPoka]

hi dunn give reads <3

[OkaPoka]

okay but clearly temporal lich is not the type of person to vote people on a whim

by his own admission he had me top scum

and every time he was serious about a vote

which makes me suspect that his readslist with top scum firebringer was fabricated, no?

the way i see it, it really comes down to this for me.

temporal lich is basically displaying signs of backward rationalization, where he chooses the vote and then puts the read. he's been trying to mask his opportunism with his srs and vote changes, but his reads dont actually progress naturally because well, he isn't town. his reads come after his votes. thats why i am making a big deal out of his inconsistencies in between his firebringer and me scumread and how it doesnt make sense because he's justifying things after he does it.

for you however, i don't see clear signs of backward rationalization. maybe you have and ill have to reread you in depth. but its kinda clear from the get go that lich is just making stuff up .

@skitter

[OkaPoka]

SA you all caught up?

[OkaPoka]

VOTE: Skitter30

I don't like their push

Uh huh

Do tell

I voted you on a whim, without thinking about it too hard

I actually hate this. It's cheeky, but not the sort of cheeky that I really attribute to town. But that might be because Dunn has been missing the last couple of days. Going through and rereading the TemporalLich and Oka feud

so what are ur thoughts

[OkaPoka]

Kop ur opinion?

[OkaPoka]

But skitter, he admits I'm his top sr and he votes with whoever he has as top scum read so it's not his votes that are whim with it's his reads

[OkaPoka]

Votes on*

[OkaPoka]

But it means his reads are on whim

[OkaPoka]

The contradiction is within his reads and it's revealed by his votes.

[OkaPoka]

Why does nobody want to lynch lich?

[OkaPoka]

Skitter ur going to need to explain how temp's actions are town motivated.

[OkaPoka]

I've laid the case out and you can't refute the fact that timeline wise there is an issue with the timeline of your reads

[OkaPoka]

And before anyone asks why is that scummy.

It's because his reads aren't in good faith.

Look at the Dunn sort progression
Look at the firebringer sort progression
Look at the me sort progression

Unnatural

[OkaPoka]

CJF could you point out concrete evidence that makes lich town and could you explain exactly why my case is bad (in as few words as possible)?

I think my case is on solid ground, at least its the best case out there.

Lich's contradictions reveal an underlying issue, being that his reads don't progress naturally.

[OkaPoka]

Actually skitter you are also going to need to explain your issues with my slot.

without going on a tangent about other stuff

[OkaPoka]

oversoul why not vote lich?

[OkaPoka]

i do agree kop is a slot that has done absolutely nothing this game


zzz

[OkaPoka]

@dunn skitter is a vanity wagon join temporal wagon

[OkaPoka]

(expired on 2019-07-11 17:00:00)

kop you have until this timer hits 0 to cast a vote or give intent

or im lynching your ass

[OkaPoka]

okay you can respond tomorrow but

the reason why its scummy isnt because of what you said

its solely because of lich's reads, everything else is evidence of lich's reads being bad

like you can go back to my interaction w lich, i literally proved how it makes absolute no sense for his read progression of me n firebringer ranking and he admits it

[OkaPoka]

he fking admits the contradiction when i literally lay out the cards in front of him

he doesnt back down until he has to

[OkaPoka]

hurr durr okapoka u cant cherry pick ur own townie posts hurr durr

okapoka ur a scumbutt and here's why

these posts literally happen like 5 posts before

he is like oh yeah oops

after i make my post of how it literally cannot make sense for him to have these thoughts and actions

[OkaPoka]

jesus christ

[OkaPoka]

too bad i replaced saudade

[OkaPoka]

ill lynch skitter if it means i can get closer to lynching lich

[OkaPoka]

skitter if ur town please reread my iso and lich's iso

[OkaPoka]

im on the verge of taking back my skitter townread at this point

[OkaPoka]

lmfao both times my l1 wagon fizzled its skitter and temp who remain

[OkaPoka]

literally both l1 wagons on me are the same comp

cfj + tw/oversoul + skitter + temp lich


zzz

[OkaPoka]

lich + skitter?

[OkaPoka]

nah just lich

skitter can move back to null tho

[OkaPoka]

can u click iso on firebringer and come back to me if you still hold those reasons

ISOing him again again, here are my observations:

83 - mild townping for me

111 - unexplained vote

138 - good L-1, but there's 142 so idk tbh

155 - I still think it's a bad idea

204 - eh I guess it works but it's not really an explanation. Probably the best post from firebringer.

228 - I'd say skitter is giving his thoughts as he plays, so no. At least I think this comes from town more than from scum. This is where the "skitter SR" is.

279 - I still despise that vote, and "I pretty much explained my reasoning on town!oka" seems to show unwillingness to change tbh

314 - still a "I refuse to explain my skitter SR" post

316 - negative charisma

320 - another "I refuse to explain my skitter SR" post

firebringer is potentially scum (bump up to scum lean tier) for refusing to explain stuff when pushed.

still leaving my vote on firebringer because honestly refusing to explain stuff is not good for the town.

lmao read this post

the conclusion pretty clearly is firebringer is town from here

especially when you admit that firebringer does explain his skitter sr

[OkaPoka]

so after ur pal skitter decides that firebringer could be town ur going to stop sring him

hahahahahhaha

hahahaha

[OkaPoka]

skitter he's copying ur stances

[OkaPoka]

town: temporal lich, sleepless assassin
town side of null: cfj
null: dunn, sweetnsassy
scum side of null: firebringer
scummy: okapoka

scummy kinda but i have no idea if what he's doing is ai for him rn: the worst

t_w and lich imma need some readslist from you two <3

here's a read list I guess

town

- CfJ, skitter

town lean

- sleepless, the worst

meh

- sweetnsassy, dunn

scum lean

- oka

scum

- firebringer

tw and dunn might be one tier too high, meh

and he swaps votes from me to firebringer in between here so we can probs assume our positions of scumminess are swapped

)))))

[OkaPoka]

its even funnier because i quoted an iso skim where he comes to the opposite conclusion and he could've mentioned 324 in that iso skim

convenient and hilarious

[OkaPoka]

he's copying skitter and it really disturbs me how skitter did the weird ass angle thing with buddying wrt to cjfj and is like lul temp town hehe no buddy

[OkaPoka]

yeah me too

something is rotten there but not both

[OkaPoka]

id go as far to say that they are probs anti aligned

[OkaPoka]

where is kop