Mini 2136 | City That Never Sleeps [Game over!]

[The Limit Does Not Exist]

I think that whichever of Allo/Eve we lynch, the other should be on the wagon.

-Smart

[GuiltyLion]

Hi GL, what's your current read on acryon? I don't think you've mentioned him since 509. Is he still your strongest townread, and can you share your thoughts on his recent posts?

- Smarter

I dunno about 'strongest' towered but I do TR him still and am fine with him being on any wagon. I think the re-evaluation on Allo was much like my own, and the evolving suspicion towards Karnage/nom felt pretty organic too. I realize in writing this out that I'm again giving town credit for mirroring my own reads, but absent any flips so far I don't really have a strong reason to re-evaluate on him in particular.

One thing I don't like (since your post here) is the default back to lynching Allo again - the reasons I have for not wanting to lynch Allo make him a really bad choice of wagon/lynch at deadline here. I thought acryon shared those reasons but now I'm guessing not...

[GuiltyLion]

I'd rather be honest and say that I have trouble reading most of the game rather than pretending to do and prodging and shit.
Just blergh skitter is voting me for a garbage reason kinda makes me want to vote there too now, couldn't we just have voted allo and went to day 2.

nom, can you clarify whether you legitimately thought that was a slip or were just joking?

- Smarter

It could be a legit slip that's why I pointed out.
I'm not 100% entertaining it as a legit slip, just pointing that out right now because slips become apparent in late game.

I feel like whenever I see this type of post it's from scum

a slip such as assuming slots are 'townposting' bc you know they are town either is or isn't a slip, it's not something that 'becomes more apparent' in late game. It's very easy for me to see this as scum dodging taking responsibility for a full accusation yet wanting to keep a lil seed planted to vote/push skitter later.

if you're not willing to call it a slip right now then it's not something you can justifiably later call a slip, IMO. You're saying you can imagine it coming from town!skitter, therefore it's not a slip.

[GuiltyLion]

All of this is happening because I ain't 100% sure about Allo anymore and I was sure about him, and I'm having second doubts and I just can't see the fucking scum in this game.
It must be in skitt/eve/molla honestly, I just don't see it anywhere... I can't just see who the hell is scum here according to this gamestate.

K A R N A G E

I don't know why you TR him in the face of Skit/I bringing up good points against him?? His 'early posts' were so good you can't possibly imagine them being scum?

[Auro]

Do you not think Karnage's willingness to be in the cop bloc is not town indicative?

[skitter30]

VOTE: nom
i thought about it some more and her push on me is awful and i think she's fully capable of making the sorts of posts she made last night as scum

my townread on karnage has all bu evaporated, and i'm kinda starting to see some nom/karnage vibes

i'm confused why we're going back to an eve/allo paradigm

[skitter30]

sarcasm can be a joke.

you realize she all but admitted that it wasn't a joke, right?

[skitter30]

I think that whichever of Allo/Eve we lynch, the other should be on the wagon.

-Smart

do you mean off the wagon ?

[skitter30]

Do you not think Karnage's willingness to be in the cop bloc is not town indicative?

no? pretty much all scum have to say that, it's nai

[skitter30]

i hope nsg is ok
but it looks like she hasn't been on-site since monday or so, so i'm going to pm mariar now about it

[Auro]

But continuously volunteering to do so versus just being okay with it?

[skitter30]

where do you see continuously volunteering, i just remember him saying it like once

[skitter30]

ok actually twice

[Auro]

I'm cool with not being on the wagon

I'm fine with being off wagon

And again very recently.

[GuiltyLion]

y'all please read this progression and see what I see: nom is throwing up a lot of AtE about "I'm frustrated with the game state, I don't know who is scum, just flip anybody", but never actually seriously entertains the idea of Karnage scum, and is willing to throw shade in a bunch of other places that feel viable (Allo/Eve/skit/Molla) while repeatedly refusing to re-evaluate Karnage.

If she were seriously and genuinely so confused/frustrated with the game state, why would she not be looking in Karnage here?

Spoiler: nom's bizarre 'I'm so lost but I know I don't want Karnage' progressions, with Skit posts in between for reference

I don't know I'm lost with this game and all these wallposts make me skip significant discussion
Karnage is like obvtown right? What made you doubt about him?

-asks about Karnage

He's been dipping in and out of thread for the last several days wothout really doing anything anf giving vague 'i looked at his iso and i dont see why he's scum type reads'
Like he had a few takes in the beginning of the game that i kinda liked but those sorts of takes kinda disappeared

-gets a good reply from Skitter about why Karnage might be scum

I don't know I'm lost with this game and all these wallposts make me skip significant discussion
Karnage is like obvtown right? What made you doubt about him?

Are you skipping everything, or just the walls? I think the number of walls is much smaller than you make it out to be.

honestly I'm kinda skipping everything at this point and I just want a flip all this stuff is meaningless to me.
Just make someone flip I'm sick of this.

-"Just flip anybody, I'm sick of this!". Why not... Karnage?

What prevents you from saying "I'm sick of this, just get me one more flip" after D1, D2, D3...?

We get a flip and the gamestate advances.
Right now it feels stagnant and I hate these phases where it feels like I'm reading pages and pages, I retain nothing out of it that was useful in terms of sorting and so on and so forth.
It often happens in larges and sometimes I just replace out if that type of gamestate is sustained, like in undertale.

-more AtE, game is stagnant, etc. Could easily re-evaluate on Karnage here, but doesn't

Eh, fuck it. The fact that skitt actually voted me after stating that karnage is scum and dropping that read really fast is a really big red flag and I am not taking chances.
VOTE: Skitter
bbmolla feels a bit sketch too, I don't know where this day is going and honestly I'm having no fucking clue right now.

-Starts a 1v1 with Skit instead? And shades Molla?

ok
we don't have to make a whole thing but i also don't think i'm going to be unvoting you really

What about Karnage?

-Still aware that Skitter is scum reading Karnage and the thrust of her push on Skitter seems to be 'it's bad that you're voting me when you scumread Karnage', which doesn't feel like a genuine belief to me if she was really THAT lost about the gamestate earlier and actually interested in Skitter's answer to 860

he's not doing looking that great either rn

See the thing is, this kind of post just makes me feel ill at ease.
I just can't find a way to trust you sometimes it's kind of crazy, but maybe you're just scum.
How do you feel about Eve joining my wagon?

-can't trust Skitter because Skitter scumreads Karnage?? Why is Karnage this level of a townread for nom compared to all other slots in the game?

I am paranoid of you should be the root of all of it.
I don't wanna go Karnage... what's your read on bbmolla?

-If not skitter, maybe Molla - still no interest in Karnage

Like I don't know actually the thing is that according to that gamestate Karnage could perfectly be lurker scum buuuuuuuuuut his early posts were just good?
I don't feel confident enough. I would hate lynching a slot I thoguht was conftown before, and it turns out they are town. That's like worst case scenario for me.
pedit: I am confused about where to vote is that really hard to grasp as a town thought?
ppedit: Qualifying something as a "townpost" *could* be a slip from a scum player pointing at other people that's what I was saying.
I could go on bbmolla at this stage of the game

- what early posts of Karnage were

this

town for you if you're so lost about the gamestate?

[Auro]

I see it and not just wrt Karnage but as a general feature of her play this game. I think I've detailed this in a post earlier too

[skitter30]

I'm cool with not being on the wagon

I'm fine with being off wagon

And again very recently.

yeah those were the two posts i saw too
i don't think these are townie, no

[GuiltyLion]

Do you not think Karnage's willingness to be in the cop bloc is not town indicative?

Do you not think Karnage's willingness to be in the cop bloc is not town indicative?

no? pretty much all scum have to say that, it's nai

yeah I agree with Skitter on this

like the only other main option would be to insist on being on-wagon, and I can imagine that being too scary for scum to try. And it's not like Karnage up to this point has been especially likely to be copped when other slots were considered more suspicious for most of the day.

plus I think almost everyone here has volunteered to be off wagon at one point or another?

[GuiltyLion]

GL are you strongly townreading Skitter then?

yeah frankly I just needed to get over being insulted by her scumreading me and I see her as strong town now

[Auro]

The other option would be to not say anything.
I think only Molla actively volunteered otherwise.

[skitter30]

i don't really think volunteering (i guess vs. it being brought up and then affirming you don't mind being off-wagon, which seems to be the difference you're emphasizing) is ai here tbh
or at least i don't think that it speaks much to someone's alignment

how are these volunteering anyways:

Doesn't look like a joke to me.

Thoughts on a cop check between Karnage and nom off the wagon?

I'm fine with being off wagon

f we’re choosing between the two D1 wagons I think it’s gotta be Eve, and switch Eve and Karnage

I still prefer GL in the townbloc over karnage, bbmolla, and rex

I'm cool with not being on the wagon

they're both pretty immediately on the heels of discussion of whether or not he should be on-wagon anyways
i don't think the distinction you're drawing here means much

[GuiltyLion]

sarcasm can be a joke.

this still doesn't make sense also lmao

Skitter says people are 'townposting' instead of 'wallposting' and nom says "hmmm did you just SLIP?"

let's say this was sarcasm and a joke. that means nom is still town reading skitter, by definition. Let's set aside that nom's subsequent posting makes it abundantly clear that this wasn't actually the case.

now forgive me for being a joke-killer by needed it explained, but what exactly is supposed to be funny here? Like, what humor is there in suggesting someone might be scum when you don't actually think they are, when the game we're playing is precisely about figuring out who is being genuine in accusing people of being scum vs who is lying? The only only way there could be a joke there is if it's like an in-joke or reference to some similar accusation that skitter made before in their history together, but like, ... that just doesn't apply here.

Please explain to me what the joke

is

and why it is funny in this situation, because I don't get it!

[Auro]

They're also at points where people were beginning to suspect Karnage more.

[skitter30]

ok and ... ?
i don't see how that makes it townie or makes it anything but nai?

[GuiltyLion]

{Acryon, 1/0, BBMolla, Rex, GuiltyLion, Eve} ideally.

{Nom, Allomancer, Skitter30, Auro, Karnage} -> Probably Karnage can hammer if Eve refuses to self?

I would agree to this plan only if it's understood that TA heavily weights towards investigating nom or Karnage. I suspect Eve flips town here and think it'd be way better to just Lynch in nom/Karnage but I think that hood would be probably all town and would at least put us in a good spot for D2. If anything I swap Auro for Rex