Mini Theme 2182 - Legends of the Hidden Temple III - Over!

[SirCakez]

This challenge thing is really frustrating me because I feel like it's making it hard to scumhunt outside the given pool

[VP Baltar]

This challenge thing is really frustrating me because I feel like it's making it hard to scumhunt outside the given pool

Remember when I said this was dumb?

[SirCakez]

What part?

[Noraa]

Cake why am I scum? You don't seem to have a reason.

[Gamma Emerald]

Just popping in to say Pooky is a dirty cheater at chess.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Because I think starting a neighborhood on trust carries an expectation that Noraa is transparent with me. If she fails to deliver on that transparency, which she proposed, then I will be able to easily see scum motivation. Scum can't keep up the charade indefinitely, and the more she talks, the more I can assess her alignment.

Agreeing to a day of openness is hugely beneficial for me to read her (and I'm assuming that was her intent as well).

why would you think its better for Noraa to post her thoughts in a PT where only you can see it rather than in the public thread where all of us can see it and evaluate it?

[Untrod Tripod]

why would you think its better for Noraa to post her thoughts in a PT where only you can see it rather than in the public thread where all of us can see it and evaluate it?

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[VP Baltar]

why would you think its better for Noraa to post her thoughts in a PT where only you can see it rather than in the public thread where all of us can see it and evaluate it?

First, she's not just posting her thoughts in the PT though. No one has said that's the case. Second, I think I have a greater responsibility -- and frankly ability given the PT -- to assess Noraa's alignment compared to the rest of the town.

If this is back to your point that no one should use PTs to talk about the game with their partners, I don't agree with your premise.

Do you honestly think we are the only two players talking about the game in our PT? If no, do you think that's scum indicative for those other players?

[xRECKONERx]

Because I think starting a neighborhood on trust carries an expectation that Noraa is transparent with me. If she fails to deliver on that transparency, which she proposed, then I will be able to easily see scum motivation. Scum can't keep up the charade indefinitely, and the more she talks, the more I can assess her alignment.

Agreeing to a day of openness is hugely beneficial for me to read her (and I'm assuming that was her intent as well).

why would you think its better for Noraa to post her thoughts in a PT where only you can see it rather than in the public thread where all of us can see it and evaluate it?

what a dope false dichotomy that also ignores the fact vpb said "the thoughts in the PT MATCH the thoughts being stated publicly"

[VP Baltar]

If you're pocketing me reck, it's working.

How about this: how many people who are not in the challenge are using their PTs to talk about the game?

Unrelated question: if Pooky hadn't challenged, which two teams would you send into a challenge rn?

[xRECKONERx]

If you're pocketing me reck, it's working.

How about this: how many people who are not in the challenge are using their PTs to talk about the game?

Unrelated question: if Pooky hadn't challenged, which two teams would you send into a challenge rn?

me n UT are now bc it avoids the noise of the game and talking thru it together helps me sort my reads tbh

honestly i don't have thoughts outside of t he current challenge bc it's all i've been focused on

[notscience]

Bulge has been busy so it hasn’t been much discussion

[VP Baltar]

Bulge has been busy so it hasn’t been much discussion

Ok, but will you use it or do you agree with pooky that any use of pt is anti-town?

[lilith2013]

I think I probably would’ve challenged noraa/vp if pooky hadn’t, but I can’t tell if that’s just because they’re who I’m thinking about already, like reck kinda said it’s hard not to focus on the pool once the challenge is out there

pooky, did you ever explain why you challenged noraa in particular? Was there a reason beyond memeing?

[lilith2013]

I don’t think using a pt is anti-town particularly, it’s not any more anti-town than challenging on page 3?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

First, she's not just posting her thoughts in the PT though. No one has said that's the case. Second, I think I have a greater responsibility -- and frankly ability given the PT -- to assess Noraa's alignment compared to the rest of the town.

If this is back to your point that no one should use PTs to talk about the game with their partners, I don't agree with your premise.

Do you honestly think we are the only two players talking about the game in our PT? If no, do you think that's scum indicative for those other players?

1. I never said she is posting only in the PT and not posting in the thread. My point is that there is not an actual need to hide any thoughts in the PT that you would not post in the thread. Your point about a "greater ability" to assess Noraa's alignment compared to the rest of the town is exactly the point I am making. Why would you nerf the rest of our ability to assess Noraa by allowing her to post thoughts in the PT that she is not posting in the public thread?

2) Ok then propose a logical reason for why anyone would hide something in the PT that they are not sharing with the rest of us. I have made it clear what the case for transparency is:

A) There is no scum night-kill, you don't need to worry about being killed for good reads
B) There's no need to speculate about Power Roles or Softs, this is a fully open MT Game.
C) There's no need to influence scum-nightkills by hiding what your actual beliefs about the game state are.

Show me some good reasons for why people should be posting hidden thoughts in their PT. Don't just say "I disagree" make an actual case for why you would disagree.

3) What the hell type of counterpoint is this? I'm stating why I think it is anti-town behavior to be using PTs in this format, I have made my case why. I would hope everyone would listen to me and actually populate the thread with their thoughts and ideas instead of hiding them in a PT. Now if everyone chooses to not listen to me that's on them. I'm not saying every person who posts in a PT is scum - I'm saying everyone should not do it.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

pooky, did you ever explain why you challenged noraa in particular? Was there a reason beyond memeing?

this is a funny question lili because I'm shocked it took 16 pages before some1 asked me why I challenged them :3

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Like obviously I did it for the memes cuz Baltar was making fun of my team being iguanas

but like looking back now he is pretty shady and I think he probly does flip scum here.

[notscience]

I mean I have used it to

A) Shit post
B) talk about how dumb a page 4 challenge was
C) mentioned my reads early on that have since changed
D) accused him of being scum with agar

[AGar]

SirCakez
lilith2013
Starbuck
AGar
xRECKONERx
notscience
The Bulge

^ this list of people

what are your reads on the players on the table right now? how about the 8 of us talk about this. we don't need to talk about anyone who you can't vote for today. that will clutter this up and distract. just the people on the table.

Townlean Noraa. (posts like 147, 232). I don't love the reasoning for townPooky she gives in 236 and still want a follow up on why, but I don't find that scummy.

Scumlean GE. I really really hate his insistence that the 4 up for yeeting shut up because it creates a situation where 8 of us talk to each other about 4 people who are interacting in a limited way and then with PTs and daytalk allows for a lot of lurking and coordination. I still find his whole thing about Noraa pushing back on a townread from him very very awkward and just there's a thing about it that doesn't sit right with me - it's setting off gut pangs.

Null on VPB and Pooky for two different reasons.

VPB's early posting was kinda fluffy but the game was generally trash so it didn't feel like there was anything he was particularly dodging. Lately he's been mostly :goodposting:. I don't love the deal made, but that's just me in general and tbf I'm not a party to that so whatever. If we come to a point where it's suddenly obvious Noraa or VPB is scum and we can't get the other to vote to yeet because of a dumb deal, we'll burn that bridge then.

Pooky's early challenge set off a few gambit bells with me but then his follow up has been... the opposite of what I would call smart scum posting if he was gambitting.

How about this: how many people who are not in the challenge are using their PTs to talk about the game?

Not really right now. I will likely spew some shit in there later because I find the PT useful in spots generally.

2) Ok then propose a logical reason for why anyone would hide something in the PT that they are not sharing with the rest of us.

The same reason any neighborhood is worthwhile - you can discuss stuff in a limited one on one environment to bounce shit off of someone, a second set of eyes - you don't have to trust them 100% but it can help shit out. You can ask your partner their direct opinion on a topic to get a read on them. You can just work through thoughts. Plenty of people keep notes PTs. It's at worst a notes PT with another voice in there. Besides, if your partner is keeping secrets in the PT you feel should be shared with the town... you can just fucking share that info and put that badge on your partner.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

ok whatever just dont get pocketed by your partner cuz ive seen that happen way too many times to count.

[SirCakez]

Cake why am I scum? You don't seem to have a reason.

i'm not really SRing you very strongly. UT had a decent case for you being scum.

[Starbuck]

Page 10 to 14

Reading back over Page 10 because it was still bothering me after I read yesterday. I don't have a lot of experience with her, but Noraa seems quite overdefensive and borderline unreasonable in 232 and 242. I'm just sensing raised hackles every time I see her address Gamma. That can be attributed to being 1 of the 4 today, but I'm not feeling a genuine sense of outrage. It's like she's putting on a show of being mad at Gamma, especially with the atrocious AtE.

In 232, notsci brings another perspective to the table and Noraa automatically slots him as scum without fully fleshing out his points or having a conversation with him. It's hasty and total OMGUS.

If I don't act high and mighty with confidence in games where I'm heavily SRed, I fucking always die a day 1 lim. Is that hard to understand or something?

This is AtE of the highest level. I used to be an easy Day 1 elim, too, for a long time, but if you act scummy, you're going to get votes. That's how it goes. I think Gamma is completely right with his response in 258. Additionally, I'm not feeling the "high and mighty" in this scenario, but more like stomping of the feet like in 260.

Yeah, after reading through all of this, I have more faith in Gamma town than Noraa town.

What is UT posting in the PT so far, Reck?

he's not. he has one post calling me a bitch that's it

Ahh, so par for the course, then.


No Gamma, stop selfvoting! RE: 280. I know you're frustrated, but there are many other players besides Noraa and her opinion of you isn't the end all be all here.

I could see that? But honestly at this point I'm pissed off about things to the point I'd rather have my slot resolved ASAP, and prove wrong those who think I'm scum here.

No, this is lame and a bullshit excuse. Get your vote off yourself. Who out of the other 3 is most deserving of your vote and why?


It's interesting because there's a Gamma/Noraa 1v1 and a Pooky/Baltar 1v1 happening. I feel like I've sorted the first, but I'm not sure about the 2nd.

god dammit you're gonna make me read a bunch of spammy bullshit aren't you

I'm too old for this shit

This is the quote of the YEAR.

[VP Baltar]

Like obviously I did it for the memes cuz Baltar was making fun of my team being iguanas

but like looking back now he is pretty shady and I think he probly does flip scum here.

No, you're trying to justify your stupid play after the fact. Of the four people you have forced into a challenge, the person who has been the most actively scummy is gamma, but I don't see you talking much about that. You're mad because I called your play for what it was: dumb and anti-town.

Regarding the PTs: I'm not going to keep arguing this with you pooky. I don't agree with the points you've made about why it is anti-town, my position on PT use is clearly in the majority, and I don't care if you don't like it.

You stating a "case" on PT use policy doesn't help us find scum. You're going to keep saying the same things to justify your bad read on me because you're in a shit tunnel, and I'm not going to participate in that. If you want to talk about actual play, or really anything other than what I do with the PT I'm a part of, I'm listening.

[VP Baltar]

If we come to a point where it's suddenly obvious Noraa or VPB is scum and we can't get the other to vote to yeet because of a dumb deal, we'll burn that bridge then.

I agree with this as a policy. If Noraa's obvscumming, you can believe I'll be yeeting her to the sun.