Yggdrasil - Stratum FINAL -

[Titus]

NDMath has been lurking and consistently wrong. Shading and voting town and defending scum.

Their refusal to confirm my action was scummy too.

[Titus]

Their refusal to confirm my action was scummy too.

This is true, but I don't think it's that big of a deal. Seems more spiteful than scummy.

That's the thing, all the scumreads are being dismissed for one reason or another. At some point, it's just scum.

Stop creating excuses for NDMath.

Force them into a 1 v 1 or confirm my role.

[Titus]

Do not associate low post count with lurking.

uh, why not

They're not synonymous but they sure are highly correlated

I could've worded it better. What I meant was that having a low post count does not directly imply one is lurking.

No. They pop in at convenient times to help scum.

[Titus]

That comment wasn't about NDMath anyway.

Which comment?

[Titus]

Do not associate low post count with lurking.

NDMath has 16 posts.

[Titus]

So my point stands. NDMath is lurking and their popins help scum.

[Titus]

Let me say this one more time

Case

NDMath is lurking
Popins help scum
They refuse to confirm my action

[Titus]

I think the assumption about Sigmund is universally fair. NDMath doesn't mention them before voting them and the opposing wagon was anya.

[Titus]

We also started working on a "Why titus is town" meta case, but realized nobody probably cares and it's a lot of effort for little new data. People are very attached to their titus reads this game.

You'll need it tomorrow if both she and I are still alive so might as well get it ready.

If we eliminate NDMath, you won't need it.

[Titus]

Ugh, I might have to move off NDMath as it appears that's not happening.

Murdercat is flipping town.

[Titus]

Ugh, I still want NDMath but I'll hammer Ircher if it comes to that as I'm not townreading him.

[Titus]

He's also against NDMath flipping too.

[Titus]

*sighs* Time to find the other scum.

Ircher reads more self absorbed than scummy.

Something Smart might just be scum.

[Titus]

Sorry, I'm not likely to be on today.

X post all games.

[Titus]

List of people who are better elims than MC:

Dunn, Ircher, titus, notscience, something_smart.

The only one I'd want to do on this list is SS.

[Titus]

Somehow I don’t think he cares for the opinions of those of us on the list Titus

Don't really care. I'll give my opinion anyway.

[Titus]

1. Morph the Cat (fferyllt/Cabd) - town
2. Dunnstral - weak town
4. White Fire (Shiro/Firebringer) - moderate town, downgraded because of absense
5. Lady Lambdadelta - moderate town
6. jjh927 Ircher - weak town based on his reaction to his wagon
7. Artemiana - will always be down to pulverize this unless lylo, faking a guilty on me ruins any trust I can ever have on this slot
8. Sigmund - town
9. Titus - moon
10. Bell - town
12. NDMath - scum, like kill this already
13. WhemeStar - town
14. notscience - moderate town
16. Guillotina - nullscum
18. Flea the Magician - town
19. Chara - moderate scum
20. Thestatusquo - moderate town
21. MURDERCAT - weak town
22. Farkran - null, lean scum
23. Bingle - town
24. Something_Smart - null scum

Updated list to here

[Titus]

Well Murdercat should be moderate town now

[Titus]

Fires definitely been more present than me so I’m not really sure how he got downgraded

Idk shiros meta though, do they disappear as scum?

I don't remember anything fire has done lately

[Titus]

i actually don't like Dunn's reaction to NM now that i look at it. "doublevoter that someone got to name" is wrong obviously, but the assumption that a player named it and it wasn't just a predetermined name from unwnd is actually correct. he could just be town who guessed right, but the focus on NM could be distancing.

i've been thinking about Dunn and his read on me, he seems pretty confident with how i'd approach a partner, and he isn't wrong, but the read kind of sticks out when i'm here accruing scumreads and Dunn then has a correct townread on me he's confident in. at least it contrasts Fark's read on the same topic where he came in thinking i wasn't scum but then became suspicious from other events.

ngl i'm extremely demotivated because i feel like a bunch of town are going to attack me tonight.

I like your thoughts on the naming thing.

[Titus]

NDmath Or murdercat please.

Whichever of those two survive needs to get chopped.

I'm not really interested in an Ircher wagon RN.

I strongly back this up.

If NDMath survives, I will shoot them.

When ND flips mafia, I am not shooting MURDERCAT.

[Titus]

@Dwlee, Just look at NDMath's ISO and the mod's. Then control F anya.

NDMath attacks my scumreads on both anya and you suggesting it's playstyle driven and consistently votes the counter to anya.

I want to see if your slot can actually engage me now that G is gone.

@LLD, Let me see.

[Titus]

Why are you not looking at NDMath, Dwelee?

[Titus]

I'm a medic

my normal ability is to heal people who are missing HP.

I have SP abilities that allow me to make someone ascetic and prevent someone from dying on a given night.

[Titus]

Can you clarify why that's relevant? A role could also have SP without ever using it by not having an ability that costs SP.

Because if NDMath had SP but could not use it, he would still be able to confirm or deny whether Titus had blocked him from gaining it. He claimed that he was unable to confirm or deny that.

Was I around for this?

No.

There was a fake guilty on me. I crumbed my actions. I asked Chara and NDMath to confirm. NDMath refused. NDMath got run up for being scummy. They claimed No SP then they claimed watcher.

[Titus]

If I am right on NDMath (which I likely am) then SS becomes near locktown.

[Titus]

Because watcher?

If NDMath is town then surely scum have some kind of counter for it.

Anya's flavor was Ninja but it doesn't seem like her role particularly countered a watcher? I guess kind of, because she could use her innate attack without being seen, but not the NK.

Because watcher and because you created reasonable doubt but not a slam dunk.

Combine that with Anya's and NDMath's play though.

[Titus]

Or maybe I’m scum with ndmath huehuehue

Doubt it. Scum wouldn't take this vocal of a stance and that's not your usual scum MO (but you can deviate like Team Mafia).

[Titus]

NDMath also had the word ninja but didn't actually bypass trackers/watchers except for their hp loss and that would be 1-2 shot at best. It seems odd to have a full, ungated watcher against that.

[Titus]

Bell, why should we keep NDMath alive?

[Titus]

Why should we keep MCat alive

Because they're scumhunting, even if their opinions are unpopular.

[Titus]

The guy who flat out said he was throwing in the towel

Yes. I almost did with a fake guilty on me. I am having to brute force every scum elimination. Some players can't or won't, particularly if not confident on SRs.

Why should we keep NDMath alive?

[Titus]

Because MCats bell take is the worst thing I’ve seen this day phase

He at least has a take. NDMath has proven wrong reads that consistently benefit scum. Murdercat is not limming Bell so he has nothing to gain as scum by pushing there or focusing there. He'd be better off pushing NDMath or Ircher.

[Titus]

Day is not evolving

I'm still strongly convinced that one of the two main wagons is on scum and on the offchance that ndmath claim is true (it is backed up by sigmund after all) i'd rather lose murdercat first.

If mcat flips town, attack ndmath. If mcat flips red, reassess.

NDMath's claim is not backed up by Sigmund. What are you talking about?

[Titus]

Dwlee might be scum btw.

[Titus]

NDMath's claim is not backed up by Sigmund. What are you talking about?

Well, it is, but just because he's a watcher doesn't mean he has to be a town watcher.

If NDMath is scum watcher, wouldn't that suggest LLD scum?

I suggest maybe NDMath is a scum tracker instead.

[Titus]

Ugh, this game is going to be 10x harder if LLD is scum.

[Titus]

Does anyone disagree with my theory that if NDMath is scum true claiming that LLD is likely scum?

[Titus]

Does anyone disagree with my theory that if NDMath is scum true claiming that LLD is likely scum?

Yes

Why?

[Titus]

I want a VC.

[Titus]

@LLD, I'm not batting 100%, that's why I asked for feedback rather than just going with my theory.

[Titus]

I think the mod isn't notifying or people are not claiming unless necessary.

P.S. I am shooting Math if they live. They are not town. Hate me all you want.

[Titus]

I think if math is scum the noise about shooting math means it’s inarguably better to eliminate there instead of attacking. If math doesn’t die today it’s because we want an additional result, and denying that information by resolving the slot over night is inherently anti town.

Also I’m pretty sure you have other fish you want fried, Titus.

I don't have a scumread as confident as NDMath. It's less optimal to shoot someone who might be limmed anyway, but it's better than shooting town. It's a suboptimal play I would be willing to take.

If Math doesn't die today, it's likely because scum protected them.

[Titus]

VOTE: Something_smart

I'm also inching back to sr Titus. The signals that I think I'm getting doesnt make sense with whats going on in the thread

Why are you trying to start up a new deadline swap?

Also, why are you throwing last minute shade onto me? You already faked a guilty on me which tanked my credibility, otherwise we would have limmed scum by now.

Why did you fake a guilty and why on me?

[Titus]

Out of 6 scum nobody knew or at least thought that no sp abilities does not equal no sp? When it is explicitly written in the mod rules?

I find it more likely that ndmath was told he *currently* has no sp (because he spent them or they were drained) but is able to generate more, and this exhange has been misinterpreted by either or both parts

I have my own issues with ndmath, but i don't understand the pushes based on the potential lie about sp mechanics. It seems a pointless lie to come up with as scum.

+ I'd like to hear from murdercat an up to date analysis on his own wagon, who's scum and why

That explaination for NDMath is unlikely. NDMath claimed they had no SP ever. If NDMath did have SP, spent it, and failed to regenerate it, they could have confirmed my claim as written in the rules. Furthermore, they claimed no abilities with SP so they could never have spent SP in the first place unless they were lying scum.

[Titus]

There was a "guilty" on me at the time. If I could have been lying about my actions, then I could have been scum in the rest of your eyes. Second, the refusal to confirm was allegedly faked as "out of spite" then this new SP claim came up. See post 4321.

If NDMath is telling the truth, then the moderator lied when they said everyone has SP and regenerates it at the end of the stratum.

[Titus]

The fact that there are both scum and 3p makes my role less. A straightforward cop. I dont think its entirely impossible for all those roles to exist aa town and there is strong evidence to be true and you ignore that?

NDMath has information that Sigmund visited LLD. I would acknowledge that much.

I'm not ignoring that at all. Their play, the fact that their claim makes no sense, and the too much power outweighs this.

Second, I am highly limmable right now due to my IRL stress levels. Faking a guilty would not be necessary. You seem to be ignoring evidence that so far my actions have been protown, particularly my push on anya.

Third, you didn't answer why vote SS with the deadline looming. I disagree with a MURDERCAT push but these seem to be the options.

[Titus]

Why do you scumread NDMath Farkran?

I also made it clear there was a "guilty" on me at the time of NDMath refusing to confirm my actions. It might have been a hand caught in the cookie jar thing.

[Titus]

I don't see why you couldn't have been bussing anya. I barely remembered the push that i had to iso you to check your claim amd ar tbe end of the day it was LLD who strongarmed the elimination. The argument of "I'm so pro-town i shouldn't be scum-read" is banal af

The fact LLD had to strongarm the elimination is because I had no charisma in the thread.

You ISOed my claim and saw me trying to push Anya which shows I had no charisma. That undercuts your need to fake a guilty.

Your position is utterly ridiculous and I'd shoot you but people do this shit to me all the time, so I need more evidence to be sure. Particularly when you're a claimed cop.

[Titus]

Mara, it's time to choose. NDMath or Murdercat. We have less than 12 hours.

[Titus]

Why do you scumread NDMath Farkran?

I also made it clear there was a "guilty" on me at the time of NDMath refusing to confirm my actions. It might have been a hand caught in the cookie jar thing.

VCA mostly. I dislike all of the d1 sigmund wagon and i've been trying to identify scum on it. A minor part of the sr comes from toog iso wrt ndmath.

I don't think that his refusal to confirm your action is relevant in any way though - he could very easily confirm it but still scumread you and push you.

If he confirms my action, then it raises the question of why scum would target NDMath instead of Sigmund. It directly undercuts the fake guilty put on me in the thread.

The VCA on NDMath is also terrible. I pushed there for that reason before the mechanic talk.

You don't have to agree with every reason for a wagon.

[Titus]

The backoff when the gambit was exposed didnt feel town either

The exposure of the gambit didn't feel town.

I agree but I really am prone to tunnels. So I want more evidence that isn't related to me before I act there.

[Titus]

So Artemiana is a cop claim right? What were the stratum 0 and stratum 2 results?

They claim no results bc someone fucked with them n0 and then gambit n2.

[Titus]

Why aren't you pissed about a mod lie if you're town NDMath?

[Titus]

That is not really a debuff. Has anyone claimed debuffs?

The debuff role thing was also a fake claim

The only thing I struggle with is why does Arte claim a fake guilty on me as scum?

[Titus]

LLD, NDMath is just scum. There's a possibility they both are but there's no way NDMath is town.

[Titus]

Morph, you may be the decider. Everyone seems pretty firm in their camps.

[Titus]

Mod Event

Votecount 2.8

Adventurers

:

MURDERCAT [8]: NDMath, WhemeStar, Ircher, Bell, Lady Lambdadelta, Chara, Farkran, Sigmund
NDMath [7]: Titus, MURDERCAT, Bingle, Dwlee99, Something_Smart, Thestatusquo, Dunnstral
Something_Smart [2]: morph the cat, Artemiana
Dunnstral [1]: White Fire
notscience [1]: notscience

Not voting [1]: Flea the Magician

With 20 alive it takes 11 to eliminate. Stratum 2 ends in (expired on 2021-06-14 22:25:25).

[Titus]

The people voting vanity wagons need to stop and make a choice to progress the game, even if it's not my choice.

[Titus]

Three days ago. They need a prod.

[Titus]

My vote is OMGUS

Notty, please. It's too close to deadline for trolling.

[Titus]

Morph and Mara please vote for MCat. If he flips green I will shoot SS for you tonight.

If MCat is your choice, please vote MCat.

[Titus]

I realize I am townreading all of the anya wagon and that's unlikely to be correct.

[Titus]

So that's 8 v 8.

[Titus]

Or Murdercat is incredibly off town.

[Titus]

Was he vla? I missed that I retract it

I’m still not voting math lol

Then vote Murdercat please.

I hate begging for votes on a counterwagon but we still need an elimination.

[Titus]

I'd eat my hat if NDMath flips town here LLD. That's how confident I am in NDMath flipping scum.

I'd understand a shot on me if NDMath flips town. I'm not wrong though.

[Titus]

I think it's MC - 8 and ND - 9 now.

I think it's 9 v 9 with Bingle's swap.

[Titus]

Actually not sure on vc with votes on this page.

[Titus]

Mod Event

Votecount 2.8

Adventurers

:

MURDERCAT [9]: NDMath, WhemeStar, Lady Lambdadelta, Farkran, Sigmund, Bingle, Artemiana, Ircher, morph
NDMath [9]: Titus, MURDERCAT, Dwlee99, Something_Smart, Thestatusquo, Dunnstral, Bell, Chara, Flea
Dunnstral [1]: White Fire
notscience [1]: notscience

With 20 alive it takes 11 to eliminate. Stratum 2 ends in (expired on 2021-06-14 22:25:25).

This is where I think the VC is.

[Titus]

That's an inconsistent statemenr. If MURDERCAT's role isn't enough to save him, why would he die at night but for a vig?

[Titus]

I'll hammer reluctantly if MURDERCAT hits L minus 1 if I am around.

[Titus]

Town can shoot people too, I assumed I wasn't the only person with this ability and I believe Dunn has claimed the ability to shoot as well

I have it as well.

[Titus]

If that's a proven lie, I'm changing over to Murdercat and shooting NDMath as the reason it's likely so hard to get a lim is they're both scum.

[Titus]

he's a claimed watcher tho

either he's going to get us something juicy or he's gonna get shot at night no?

NDMath is not going to provide us useful results. He already lied about not having SP. He didn't watch you as the obvious kill target. His ISO consistently protected anya.

Murdercat flip doesn't change any of that.

[Titus]

VOTE: Murdercat

Day is done.

[Titus]

Can someone summarize the recent claims for me? I'm stuck in court and it's hard to follow.

[Titus]

My read on LLD has plummeted for the record.

[Titus]

I am unsurprised the second I indicate Titus might be scum and she isn't in my pocket she starts having a plummetting read on me.

Not true. My read started crashing when NDMath watched you instead of the doctor.

The fact you were pushing town over scum and campaigning to shoot me doesn't help.

[Titus]

This was a great designed game.

It was a problem about NDMath not being able to confirm my action though. The prompt should have said most people have SP, not all. It made NDMath look scummier than they were.

[Titus]

The errors were unfortunate - but as people have flipped, I started realizing just how much you were having to keep track of. Most roles had 2 actions they could preform every night x 24 players = you had an insane number of actions to resolve every single night. And also 24 players worth of hp and sp to track. - you had a monumental amount of things to keep up with, so don't beat yourself up too much for the error :/

+1