Mini Normal 2239 | AQAtPimP | Game Over

[Salsabil Faria]

@Mod

, V/LA for 2 days.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

The purpose of 1540 was to examine 806 better and determine whether that was a post Gamma makes about his partner or about a townie that he is trying to create associatives with. This is a general response to what has transpired since - will respond to most posts individually as well as there seems to be a bit to unpack and I either missed some posts or misread some posts last night

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I think the scumteam has agreed to bus IV and Gamma got concerned that Margot was getting pressure, so they had Margot make that wall post condemning IV since he was essentially a dead man walking already.

I strongly disagree with this take

When Margot posts her "case" on IV at 1192

The VC prior to her dropping that case on him, the VC is

6 votes for T3 (e-1) - NM had just voted for T3 putting him at E-1 (moving his vote from IV to T3)
3 votes for IV

At this point IV himself had not yet voted for T3

He could easily hammer T3 at this point with survival as the excuse.

IV was definitely NOT a dead man walking.

Her case at 1192 made it 6-4 and then Roden unvoted T3 to make the danger of T3 getting elimmed disappear and signaled he would switch his vote to IV in the future which he later does.

Okay yeah all this is correct, going to look back at why I thought the timing was different

[ssbm_Kyouko]

So when I was saying Margot made that wallpost condemningIV I was talking about the "throw the book in his face" post in the 1100s, which is nowhere near 806, so I just completely messed up the timeline on that. I dont think Margot was bussing there. Maybe I saw this post, forgot to quote it or something, I was pretty tired last night, but I think I was definitely referring to the book in the face post. So that wasnt coordinated. I think it seems likely 806 is just a false associative left for me.

I've read through again. Here's my stance.

I stand by my Mewtaph and IV scum reads. I asked for a claim because that is my understanding about what happens at e-1. I didn't specifically angle for IV to be killed n1, but if they were, that would have been fine with me, because I think they are scum, and given the setup is not revealed, the claim would likely not have meant anything anyway.

I still think T3 is likely not scum. I also Town Read the heck out of Datisi. I think the fact that Mewtaph and IV both voted for me is pretty scum indicative in my book, and I'm feeling more and more confident that I've solved two of the scum roles.

This is especially given the fact that all of IV's reasons for voting back at me are bizarre when you actually stop and think about it for five seconds. Like, asking for a claim is scum indicative? Trying to vote out someone you think is scum is scum indicative? What isn't scum indicative in your book IV? Anyone voting for anyone is scum. Is the only Townie in this game N_M?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

With respect to why I almost certainly overreacted after my e-1 on IV, I was responding to the following posts, which are varying shades of 'that looks scummy'.

I was honestly more frustrated that people were backing off the wagon completely, and was probably avoiding blaming myself for it.

Sooo that flashwagon happened and I'm reading IV as pretty hard town after that.

fun fact, that is the third time someone called me Darius on this site
also stop it

VOTE: InnocentVillager

That's e-1. What's your role?

i usually hate using the word, but this actually feels a bit opportunistic, especially with n_m in game. were you suddenly fine with ending the day?

VOTE: innocentvillager

VOTE: InnocentVillager

That's e-1. What's your role?

Explain please....

i need to go eat, i'll read the rest later

first thought is that there's scum on iv's wagon regardless of his own alignment, but i'll see later

Sooo that flashwagon happened and I'm reading IV as pretty hard town after that.

Yeah same, I think it's TvT between

iv

and

Datisi

.
What do you think about

T3

and

MR

's vote on

iv

? I'm always paranoid about

T3

,

MR

's putting them E-1 not liking it, on the other hand

Aris

also vote

iv

which I don’t know if it’s buss or not.... My brain will explode anytime soon!

Sooo that flashwagon happened and I'm reading IV as pretty hard town after that.

Yeah same, I think it's TvT between

iv

and

Datisi

.
What do you think about

T3

and

MR

's vote on

iv

? I'm always paranoid about

T3

,

MR

's putting them E-1 not liking it, on the other hand

Aris

also vote

iv

which I don’t know if it’s buss or not.... My brain will explode anytime soon!

MR's vote is a lot worse than T3's.

Between 564 (E-1) and 612 (concerned people backing off is scummy) I was looking for unvotes/moved votes, because of "backing off" and didnt notice any of these posts you quoted, so 612 makes a lot more sense to me now with context.

I mentioned Dwlee and Roden as people that backed down between those posts because of their posts here:

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Aristeia
Okay so like IV wack but also

What is happening

So I didnt see any follow up on scum!Dwlee and found that suspicious, but I see you weren't talking about him now.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I also don;t quite understand whether you are scum reading either just me, or datsi and me. At various points in your post you seem to jump between the two.

On first brush, other than what I said above, I think that if you want to chalk the whole thing up to theatre, then surely IV spending less time defending against my push, but focussing on Datsi's should take suspicion off of me?

At various points in your post, which I had some trouble following, you seem to be going in multiple directions, and basically weave a story about a wagon on Town nearly succeeding but ultimately being derailed by a wagon pushed heavily by Scum on another Scum because of the theatricality which plays out one way, but then plays out in a different way, in which Scum focussing their attention on a player A is scummy for A, but also Scum giving very little time to player A is also scummy for A.

May I also point out that, the d1 wagon on Town player which I played a big part in derailing got up and succeeded again the following day, which I was explicitly against on d2

It was never just you, the post as a whole was meant to examine you in the context of a Datsi/IV team and see if you fit as a third, because 806 is the type of post that datsi makes about his scumbuddies. However, he knows I am aware of this tell and as scum he might intentionally make this post about a townie in order to create a false associative that I would definitely notice. The reason the story weaves is because at times you look like you can make sense as a partner and at other times you don't. I'm seeing from your and Aristeia's replies though that the posts I thought could implicate you are not scum-indicative, and that I made errors in reading.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Also re 1545, IV spent more time focusing on Datisi (NOT Datsi) and less time on you, in a specific post. I think Datisi is town, so seeing a difference between IV's treatment of you and Datisi is +scum for you, but this could again be a false associative as the evidence comes from a post that IV makes, rather than something you did.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

So your theory relies on, likely just me, unilaterally deciding to actively support a wagon on IV twice, when neither IV nor myself were in danger of being eliminated, and indeed when I was actually creating pressure to put on myself. It also selectively picks out posts to make Datsi look scummy, but only in the world of your theory in which Scum is bussing their team member, a Scum PR no less (irrespective of how useful the PR actually was), for basically no reason.

I don't see how it makes any sense at all, and honestly almost makes me want to reconsider your slot, just by virtue of how odd I find that argument.

1540 is not my Datsi case. That is the post where I am reading along checking if you are teamed with Datsi/IV, or a victim of circumstance. That's why it looks like I'm selecting posts that make Datsi look scummy. My read on Datsi is detailed in a prior post where I vote him, 1534.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

In case it's not clear from replies I've concluded Margot is not scum

[ssbm_Kyouko]

And still want a Datsi claim, and still am voting there in spirit

[Not_Mafia]

All your base are belong to us

[Not_Mafia]

All your base are belong to us

Wrong thread, please delete

@mod

[Datisi]

gonna be another lazy day because i am tired

i thought how if i were forced to vote between ari and datsi, that i would be voting datsi, but i still have a preference for voting outside. datsi's recent play (and lack thereof) doesn't strike confidence though, so i'm fine with getting a claim and going from there.

i guess the reason why i'm getting cold feet there is that datsi just seems unaligned with a lot of people? like, he's not partners with ari. don't think he's partners with kyouko. who's left? salsa, who just decided to votepark her partner today and townbin everyone else (?) chaos, who had 3 scumreads on day 1, 2 of which were his buddies (??) margot, who murdered iv and took away his chance at quickhammering t3 (???)

i guess salsa would make *some* sense as a partner who would be hoping that the town yeets someone else without her help, but eh. i'd be lying if i said i have any better ideas (that i'm certain in) on who should at least be claiming right now.

[MargotRosa]

@Ari, @Enchant, probably @ssbm:

Is there any universe where it's Salsa/Datisi?

[MargotRosa]

Especially given the amount of talk on bussing that's been going on, there's almost certainly some bussing that's actually occurred. Seems like it's on the brain

[MargotRosa]

Never mind. I thought, very incorrectly, that Datisi had been more quiet than they had. Way too much content, and way too Townie, to be a serious Scum runner this late in the game. Thought I might have been getting Roden in Newbie 2076 vibes, but I just don't think so

[Datisi]

come on, i make a show when i'm bussing, this would be way too boring.

pedit: hmm. actually not sure how much of a fan of that post i am considering i've been doing basically nothing since shortly before the end of day 1?

[MargotRosa]

Was on phone, and corrected because of sheer volume

[MargotRosa]

Connecting you to a similar play to Roden isn't just not doing much, which I don't necessarily find scummy on its own, but specifically not doing much, and cropping up only just enough to make sure you don't look scummy and to support other slot's pushes without posting so often, or with enough conviction, that it attracts attention.

[MargotRosa]

Actually, I almost see the more likely pairing for Datisi being Datsi, going purely by the way that d1 went. Specifically, both voted IV early in the day, jumped off at the point that I demanded a claim, and finished the day on the T3 wagon.

But I think if Datsi isn't Scum, then Datisi isn't either, and I think moreso than anything, I may just be seeing through the lens of the pure aesthetics of my evil twins from Korra comment inadvertently picking out scum.

By no means something worth acting on. More something I'm keeping in my back pocket.

I'm also probably going to go through and see if I can make a comment with every single vote tally in the thread in one post, moreso for my own sake than anything else, because I find it useful going through them over again

[MargotRosa]

So, I just noticed this while putting the votes together, which I don't think I noticed first time around. Datisi claims that there is nm-1 in 56 - that is e-2. Still weird that a wagon had built up that much, half the players are still in RVS mode, but I guess if players were looking out for it, could that be something?

As of 55, the vote tally (with order preserved) is:

votecount 1.1.5

Mewtaph (5) :

Datisi ; ChaosOmega ; Roden ; Salsabil Faria ; Dwlee99

Salsabil Faria (1) :

Datsi

T3 (1) :

MargotRosa

Roden (1) :

Mewtaph

Not_Mafia (1) :

Not_Mafia

Not voting (4) :

Aristeia - ssbm_Kyouko - T3 - innocentvillager

[/quote]

Idk, I'm going to keep putting the tallies together. Probably nothing, but it niggled my brain, so thought I'd put it here for completeness

[datsi]

I don’t feel like D1 happens anywhere close to how it did if datisi and IV are partners
Datisi was like 90% of why IV got pressured as much as he did
I also see the call to claim and am stating I am a VT

[datsi]

In that game I was not right about anything so I felt a lack of confidence.

You were right about Prism?

[datsi]

Between this game and that one it seems your best reads are the ones based around seeing emotional manipulation

[datsi]

What happened in mini 2226?

One of Aristeia’s strong SRs (MegAzumarill) was eliminated D1 and flipped town, and D2 she lacked any conviction to her play. This whole game she’s been pushing me and T3 as partners, T3 flipped town yesterday, and she’s shown none of the same doubt she had in that game. And before you ask Aristeia was town in mini 2226.
I also feel like there’s similar tonal indicators to her play in MBOS 13.

my issue with this is that aristeia's pushback against iv being townread for ate heavily reminded me of her pushback against prism controlling the game in 2226. and how does she tonally remind you of mbos?

I do see the similarities in how she pushed IV and Prism. I feel like she’s in that same weird spot she was after RCE flipped where she kinda burned her bridges too much and is now basically railroaded along a path. This entire game she’s been pushing me as partnered with T3 and then conveniently comes in thinking my play D1 was trying to save my buddy. If that was a legitimate thought she had it shouldn’t just be coming out AFTER she miseliminated the previous chain she’d been using to push me.

That thought was constructed during the night phase tbh
And there were others off wagon (but in reality I do think that initial assessment was probably wrong)

can you elaborate on this? like, i know you walked back and said you think it's wrong, but if it's something you started thinking during the night phase, that means there was some more thought to it, no? i'd like to hear about it if possible

also you missed/ignored this

I was starting to get paranoid about Dwlee and I felt like he and Margot might have been dual ro3’d
Dwlee has since flipped town, but I still think IV’s read progression on Margot is a bit jank
Honestly I should actually pay attention to who had what stances on Dwlee because that kill was super weird IMO