Large Normal 240: Baileyposting [game over]

[Datisi]

vote count 1.11

with 17 votes in play, it takes 9 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-07-22 23:00:00).

yeet

MegAzumarill [7]:

PookyTheMagicalBear, Greeting, Firebringer, UNOwen, geraintm, Lowell, Prince of Paterson

bugspray [4]:

Fredrick A Campbell, Enchant, Vivax, Unsure

Andante [1]:

MalcolmTucker

MalcolmTucker [1]:

Andante

Fredrick A Campbell [1]:

bugspray

Enchant [1]:

Dwlee99

Lowell [1]:

MegAzumarill

not voting [1]:

Crescent

mod notes

~ this is a mod note.

flavour

[Unsure]

Crescent
Why chase after Lee despite bugspray, your scumread, being within reach? What's the difference between Lee's slot and bugs'?

[Crescent]

I said nothing about them being a scum read. I just said they're not a townread. DWLee is an actual scumread, but, like 2273, there's already 8 trains out there, and even if I were inclined to vote this early, I'm not interested in creating train #9 (This exact situation happened in 2773, I would not vote George and create a 9th different train, even though he was my top read at the time).

Bugspray is a null waste of a player slot that exists only to be eventually policy voted or cleared through other means. The fact that Fred is trying to lead a policy vote on him for "not trying to find scum" with 9 days left in day 1 is a bad joke because it's a vote that

isn't trying to find scum

with a ridiculous amount of time left in the day.

Meg and Fred are very directly tied to each other through their actions today. Combine this with Meg doing virtually nothing under pressure: I think if one is scum, the other is. The way the day has gone, I believe a Meg scumflip means there's a high chance of scum Fred and town Bugspray, in which case we don't need to waste a vote on policy anyway.

[geraintm]

Oh and in response to this: Meg has no posts in 15 hours,

you still havent got over that other people can have lives that are different to yours, have you?
disappearing for 15 whole hours does mean zilch

(other points still can stand)

[Vivax]

TROLL ALT ALERT

TROLL ALT ALERT

Imo in Trolled mafia tried to pin blame on me exactly for "Enchant doing anything more than shitposting is scummy", which.is ridiculously not true.

Who do you mean?
Unsure?DW99?
Troll as in town troll or?

[Unsure]

Thanks for responding

Meg and Fred are very directly tied to each other through their actions today. Combine this with Meg doing virtually nothing under pressure: I think if one is scum, the other is.

I wasn't here, can you tell me how?

[Crescent]

Oh and in response to this: Meg has no posts in 15 hours,

you still havent got over that other people can have lives that are different to yours, have you?
disappearing for 15 whole hours does mean zilch

(other points still can stand)

It's the fact that they haven't posted in 15 hours AND have barely had any actual reaction to the pressure on them to begin with. It reads to me as someone waiting for pressure to go off of them rather than someone trying to break their way through it.

Scum disappearing under pressure is a ridiculously common tactic that often works. There is nothing Meg has done since getting the train on him that tells me the train is wrong.

[Crescent]

Thanks for responding

Meg and Fred are very directly tied to each other through their actions today. Combine this with Meg doing virtually nothing under pressure: I think if one is scum, the other is.

I wasn't here, can you tell me how?

oh I like Fredrick A Campbell

Fred is my #1 scumread in the game on a Meg scumflip.

The moment Fred got momentum, Meg immediately blew that momentum up, and turned it into a bad train on Andante. Fred was avoiding the train on Meg since well before Fred actually gave a townread of Meg, and has mostly just cycled votes between Owen, Enchant, and Bugspray today. The last vote on Bugspray suggests no process to thinking Bugspray is scum, but to making them a policy vote. It's far far too early in the game for policy votes, and post #596 is bad. He's saying Bugspray is an ok vote because he's not trying to find scum but he's voting him for reasons, with 9 days left in day 1, that aren't trying to find scum.

[Unsure]

how did meg blow the momentum up? im not seeing meg voting fred

[Crescent]

Right now, I think that the series of four posts starting with 188 are the most likely thing to come from scum that I've seen so far. Fredrick A Campbell inserts himself into the main conflict of the game, Vivax vs UNOwen, and tries to add fuel to the fire of one of the sides. The fact that I believe the criticism is inaccurate (UNOwen was referring to post 138, which Fredrick himself has ignored) makes me think it's even more likely that it was a made up reason to join what looks to me like a T/T conflict and encourage it to continue.

VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense. Virtually none of it is actual content and he follows a naked vote on Owen with... Some really awkward looking shade. Third highest post count in the game right now and all I can really say about him is "he exists".

Fred could easily be scum, his commentary so far has been pretty shallow and doesn't suggest he's actually given things much thought (see also 179 which asks Lowell a question pretty obviously answered in context).

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense.

exactly why I just want to lim the slot

These 4 people posted the same agenda in batch at around the same time.

VOTE: Andante

Gut says one of those are scum. Scum loves these kind of wagons that arent necessarily alignment related.
I think this is the most likely.

Vivax points out how Fred got a buncha people talking about him at the same time, and Meg immediately leads a train on Andante, dragging Vivax along with him soon after this. This effectively killed most of the momentum on Fred, yet it doesn't even give a read on Fred. Meg never gives ANY read on Fred the entire time he's doing this.

And the Andante train was the worst train in the early game. She was effectively getting bullied for absolutely no reason on a really forced argument that one of the 4 people Vivax mentioned MUST be scum. If there's any reason I've had to think Meg might be scum, it's the train on Andante.

[Unsure]

Do you also scumread Malcolm Tucker?

if Meg is scum i think Malcolm can be scum too because i think their read on meg is remarkably absent of nuance, which is a signature of

town!MalcolmTucker.

town?MalcolmTucker

?

Or are you saying that Malcolm should always have a nuanced read on Meg and yours is a typo?

im saying town!Malcolm usually plays commentary on events but Meg being the top wagon and in seven votes should have earned Meg at least a defend and a reason (if they're townread by MT). their play was "meg's alright, what gives?" which was underwhelming

[Crescent]

Oh and that reminds me Andante is also most likely town on a Meg scumflip. Can't see that explosion being fake.

[Unsure]

i disagree that fred and meg is correlated in some inverse fashion. i just fail to see the connection.
i do like your thought process on Andante v Meg.

[Andante]

why is andante vs meg a thing?

[Unsure]

maybe if anything, #172 is the real reason imo that fred and meg can be TvS if Meg is scum. I dont think scum (Fred) is likely to tie and rule-out partner connections with other slots? (ruling out Meg with the slots mentioned, except if those slots are scum, ig?)

[Crescent]

i disagree that fred and meg is correlated in some inverse fashion. i just fail to see the connection.
i do like your thought process on Andante v Meg.

I think they're correlated because they've both actively gone against the trains on the other without actually calling each other town, and have both tried to mount counterwagons to each other despite that. Fred completely avoids Meg until Meg's train is already at 7 votes, and he passively calls him town based on something that occurred 220 posts before. If this town read were legit, where was it

before

?

His reason for calling Meg town is in #565 and references #334 and #337. The nearest vote count to these posts has both Fred and Meg at 4 votes each. Why did he not say it then? Why does he only defend Meg when Meg is running away at 7 votes?

Honestly Fred just looks awful, period.

[Vivax]

Right now, I think that the series of four posts starting with 188 are the most likely thing to come from scum that I've seen so far. Fredrick A Campbell inserts himself into the main conflict of the game, Vivax vs UNOwen, and tries to add fuel to the fire of one of the sides. The fact that I believe the criticism is inaccurate (UNOwen was referring to post 138, which Fredrick himself has ignored) makes me think it's even more likely that it was a made up reason to join what looks to me like a T/T conflict and encourage it to continue.

VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense. Virtually none of it is actual content and he follows a naked vote on Owen with... Some really awkward looking shade. Third highest post count in the game right now and all I can really say about him is "he exists".

Fred could easily be scum, his commentary so far has been pretty shallow and doesn't suggest he's actually given things much thought (see also 179 which asks Lowell a question pretty obviously answered in context).

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense.

exactly why I just want to lim the slot

These 4 people posted the same agenda in batch at around the same time.

VOTE: Andante

Gut says one of those are scum. Scum loves these kind of wagons that arent necessarily alignment related.
I think this is the most likely.

Vivax points out how Fred got a buncha people talking about him at the same time, and Meg immediately leads a train on Andante, dragging Vivax along with him soon after this. This effectively killed most of the momentum on Fred, yet it doesn't even give a read on Fred. Meg never gives ANY read on Fred the entire time he's doing this.

And the Andante train was the worst train in the early game. She was effectively getting bullied for absolutely no reason on a really forced argument that one of the 4 people Vivax mentioned MUST be scum. If there's any reason I've had to think Meg might be scum, it's the train on Andante.

Your point being? Something like Fred is mafia because mafia Meg ignored Fred?

Why was the Andante train bad if you don't know their alignment and why do you mention my reasons being the same as Meg's reason to start a wagon on Andante?

This reads like:
"Meg is mafia because she was on a wagon that Vivax suspected"
Even though she voted before me, going by your post.

[Crescent]

why is andante vs meg a thing?

Because the way he led that train on you and the forced reasoning he did it for have never set right with me.

[Crescent]

Right now, I think that the series of four posts starting with 188 are the most likely thing to come from scum that I've seen so far. Fredrick A Campbell inserts himself into the main conflict of the game, Vivax vs UNOwen, and tries to add fuel to the fire of one of the sides. The fact that I believe the criticism is inaccurate (UNOwen was referring to post 138, which Fredrick himself has ignored) makes me think it's even more likely that it was a made up reason to join what looks to me like a T/T conflict and encourage it to continue.

VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense. Virtually none of it is actual content and he follows a naked vote on Owen with... Some really awkward looking shade. Third highest post count in the game right now and all I can really say about him is "he exists".

Fred could easily be scum, his commentary so far has been pretty shallow and doesn't suggest he's actually given things much thought (see also 179 which asks Lowell a question pretty obviously answered in context).

So much of Fred's ISO is nonsense.

exactly why I just want to lim the slot

These 4 people posted the same agenda in batch at around the same time.

VOTE: Andante

Gut says one of those are scum. Scum loves these kind of wagons that arent necessarily alignment related.
I think this is the most likely.

Vivax points out how Fred got a buncha people talking about him at the same time, and Meg immediately leads a train on Andante, dragging Vivax along with him soon after this. This effectively killed most of the momentum on Fred, yet it doesn't even give a read on Fred. Meg never gives ANY read on Fred the entire time he's doing this.

And the Andante train was the worst train in the early game. She was effectively getting bullied for absolutely no reason on a really forced argument that one of the 4 people Vivax mentioned MUST be scum. If there's any reason I've had to think Meg might be scum, it's the train on Andante.

Your point being? Something like Fred is mafia because mafia Meg ignored Fred?

Why was the Andante train bad if you don't know their alignment and why do you mention my reasons being the same as Meg's reason to start a wagon on Andante?

This reads like:
"Meg is mafia because she was on a wagon that Vivax suspected"
Even though she voted before me, going by your post.

I feel like you didn't actually read the post at all.

[Unsure]

so you think it's likelier that Fred and Meg are one scum whiteknighting the other scummy town? (because you've been suggesting Meg/Fred inverse alignment) i guess i dont see why it would be mutual then?
regardless i think we reached the right conclusion, just not sure of how you got there.

[Crescent]

Anyway let's walkthrough it in even more simple terms.

Both of them have directly defended the other in instances without calling each other town, and both of them have led scummy countertrains when defending the other person.

That's the link. It's an obvious, direct link.

[Unsure]

but you said it's TvS so im like ???

[Unsure]

you're describing an SvS relation

[UNOwen]

I doubt it, but will be very sad if Prince turns out to be scum.

[Crescent]

so you think it's likelier that Fred and Meg are one scum whiteknighting the other scummy town? (because you've been suggesting Meg/Fred inverse alignment) i guess i dont see why it would be mutual then?
regardless i think we reached the right conclusion, just not sure of how you got there.

...I've been saying this entire time that Fred is my #1 scumread if Meg flips scum. Why would I be describing a T/S situation? It's conceivably "possible" one is town, but it doesn't stop one from being my #1 scumread if the other flips scum.

If Meg flips scum, the very first person I want dead is Fred.

If Fred flips scum, the very first person I want dead is Meg.

That's what I've been saying.