Mini Normal 2275: Roguelikes - Day 3: Endgame!

[Irrelephant11]

Good morning i slept all day

The people tunneling on loftwing need to stop when scum eira is right there.

I also am untownlocking irrelephant until they can explain where their mind went from Eira to Loftwing - I did not feel good about the last few pages and how they treated certain slots suddenly.

cw what happened that made you untownlock me

[KittyTacky]

Flavor 3.3

Tales of Maj'Eyal

Tales of Maj’Eyal (ToME) is a free, open source roguelike RPG, featuring tactical turn-based combat and advanced character building. Play as one of many unique races and classes in the lore-filled world of Eyal, exploring random dungeons, facing challenging battles, and developing characters with your own tailored mix of abilities and powers. With a modern graphical and customisable interface, intuitive mouse control, streamlined mechanics and deep, challenging combat, Tales of Maj’Eyal offers engaging roguelike gameplay for the 21st century.

The continent of Maj’Eyal lives in a relative peace. After millennia of war the orcs are extinct, the advanced races have allied together, and the evils of magic have been repressed. But there are still untamed forests, cursed lands, marauding bandits, sealed dungeons of undead, and whispers spread of hidden cults of mages. Some even say the orcs are not all dead, and muster their strength in dark places.

You are an adventurer, seeking your fortune in the open world, investigating ruins and mysteries in search of riches and powers. Explore a continent still scarred by the terrible Spellblaze from ages past, teeming with wild beasts, monsters, trolls and giants. Delve through dark dungeons infested by armies of undead, demonic monstrosities and hideous horrors. Uncover world changing secrets, from relics of the ancient and all-powerful Sher’Tul race to veiled cities of magic and concealed psionic beings. Fight with skill and care against undying necromancers, towering dragons, primeval forces, arcane demons and world-threatening powers.

Source: https://te4.org/

Votecount 3.3

Dunnstral

(1): Lowell

Lowell

(1): Confidently Wrong

Confidently Wrong

(1): Eiralox

Not Voting

(5): MalcolmTucker, Dunnstral, Irrelephant11, BlueBloodedToffee, Enchant

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 3 ends in (expired on 2022-07-20 21:02:00).

[Eiralox]

Loftwing saw me townread them and used that to hide behind me but no im scum with them

Town has never hard defended mafia in their life amirite. I guess that tracks with why you think lowell has to be town... you're hard defending them so.they cant be mafia!! Impossible! Would destroy your whole argument on me, if one ignores the fact that it would mean lowell scum and game over.

My case goes way deeper than this. The entire dynamic between Loft and you feels off, as it does with loft kenny but less so to me. Lowell was my top pick for a vote early D1. Since then I locked them town, and there they stay until D4, if both of us are alive and if D4 even comes at this point.

You expected more? No you are lying now. You had your mind set. You can say you're scumreading me, but dont fucking lie to me that you were open to townread me.

I really did. I truly did, like just I expected a more civil discourse at this point. I'm not cussing or insulting you like a dog, and I'm not gonna. That's why I'm wary of engaging with you. And yeah I expected more. If you are town, I really expected more. Right now, and through much of day two and three, I can't shake the feeling that you're scum salty cos their team lucked out with vig/tracker.

Your case is embarassingly filled with bias. It will look extemely clownish post game. My case on lowell is what a proper scumcase looks like that takes into account things you might see as town

Like I said, I don't care. It's you over Lowell right now and that ain't gonna change. And I am a clown, haven't u noticed ; )

Also eira you're not going to convince irrel or dunns for that matrer because they both know ive towntold out my ass because i can continue to produce content which is extemely towny for me. You've never played with me before, people like Enchant and Dunns have.

Good for them. If they can peg CW in a heartbeat, let 'em. Or they can go over what I said, what you said, and reach their conclusions. Im not going to push them either way, as I said earlier, the only hard push I'll make today is against anyone who wanna elim lowell.

'nuf said I guess, peace/

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I'd vote out the Kenny slot before a replacement is even found I'm that confident he is scum

BBT can you go over your scumread of Kenny and whatever read you have on CW?

I had an early scum read of Kenny from early game and it never really changed.

However, upon flips it looks like Kenny has been cleared by Shoshin pushing Loft on his vote/unvote of Kenny. Which you would have seen if you had read my posts? I don't actually think Kenny is scum anymore and I think the last one could actually be CW.

I need to go over Shoshin's ISO

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Also, if I'm completely honest, I thought the no-kill (?) tied in with Kenny being super inactive was just a dead giveaway?

Reflecting on this, I think Mod would have extended deadline if this were the case though? I guess scum could have shot Mala as well as Vig, but meh, I don't see it.

[Eiralox]

VOTE: kenny. It's him or CW and I'm tired of arguing with CW.

@KittyTacky I think Lowell is voting for Dunnstral?

[Confidently Wrong]

Eira im going to be brutally honest. you are not a player who as far as I can tell is some sort of mafia prodigy who has way better reads than other people. If you're along on your island you are probably wrong. Just like how I was wrong alone on my island on Loftwing. You won't listen to that because it's coming from your super duper confident scumread of yours but its the fucking truth lmao and its extremely frustrating to argue with you because like i mentioned before you are both confbiasing your conclusion and working backwards and also refusing to acknowledge logic that opposes your view.

[Confidently Wrong]

Good morning i slept all day

The people tunneling on loftwing need to stop when scum eira is right there.

I also am untownlocking irrelephant until they can explain where their mind went from Eira to Loftwing - I did not feel good about the last few pages and how they treated certain slots suddenly.

cw what happened that made you untownlock me

bc I was extremely tunneled on eira scum at the time and thought you were teamed with them. I thought that much was obvious from the post and the implication of it. Like.. the explaintion is in the post actually now that I reread it ... so not sure why ask me when its right there.

[Irrelephant11]

I'm stunned you think Kenny is town CW

You wrote this based on an early game scumread you hadn’t thought about since d1?

I see that you’re now saying Kenny could be town, I’m trying to understand the basis for what seemed like a very very strong scumread on Kenny that you had until Dunn repped in. To understand your mindset

[BlueBloodedToffee]

This is terrible ^

Like pulling teeth around here. Let’s all call a guy useless and scummy and do nothing.

Cool.

Unrelated: BBT is scum

Dudes loft posted 8 times in the last day and a half, listing all his suspects, what exactly you want from him? Vote him or don’t. BBT is scum, eira is probably town, I have this read in my head and can’t shake it now.

CW, can you talk about why Scum!Lowell makes these posts please?

[Confidently Wrong]

Eira you expected me to not push Lowell and push Enchant. That is exactly what you wanted. You think that as town I will do exactly that. You are

PROJECTING

YOUR thought process onto ME. I am NOT YOU. I hate when people project onto me and it is obnoxious. We are not the same. We do not think the same. You are not going to get me to act like you when you're town. Because I dont act like you when I'm town. I act like this. This is town me. And I've been trying to get you to accept that for a while but hey.

[Irrelephant11]

Good morning i slept all day

The people tunneling on loftwing need to stop when scum eira is right there.

I also am untownlocking irrelephant until they can explain where their mind went from Eira to Loftwing - I did not feel good about the last few pages and how they treated certain slots suddenly.

cw what happened that made you untownlock me

bc I was extremely tunneled on eira scum at the time and thought you were teamed with them. I thought that much was obvious from the post and the implication of it. Like.. the explaintion is in the post actually now that I reread it ... so not sure why ask me when its right there.

Okay fair, that’s not how I read it at first but you’re right

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I'm stunned you think Kenny is town CW

You wrote this based on an early game scumread you hadn’t thought about since d1?

I see that you’re now saying Kenny could be town, I’m trying to understand the basis for what seemed like a very very strong scumread on Kenny that you had until Dunn repped in. To understand your mindset

Sometimes I overstate reads. My previous reasons still apply. Dunn helped me to reeval the slot, sure. As did rereading the ISOs of flipped scum.

[Eiralox]

Eira im going to be brutally honest. you are not a player who as far as I can tell is some sort of mafia prodigy who has way better reads than other people. If you're along on your island you are probably wrong. Just like how I was wrong alone on my island on Loftwing. You won't listen to that because it's coming from your super duper confident scumread of yours but its the fucking truth lmao and its extremely frustrating to argue with you because like i mentioned before you are both confbiasing your conclusion and working backwards and also refusing to acknowledge logic that opposes your view.

like whatever tbh appeal to authority. i'm scum hunting, plain and simple. step out of your panic room and actually approach me or stop whining about my methodology like a goblin with a stick. i'm done for now, ill build my case further and post it but i wont engage with you cos u toxic and that makes me toxic.

id rather have good vibes

And honestly even if im wrong idc. I'm pretty sure which three players scum are in, we have breathing room, so i won't she any tears for a cw mis-elim at this point unless you make some major claim, after the investigative roleclaim you made, which you then retracted. but have fun, and make sure to remind everyone how your irrel read shifted only because toffee townread loftwing ; ) Like i'm not engage with you because there's still D2 and D3, your entire 'case' on Lowell, for me to cover.

Hav fun tho.

[Eiralox]

Eira you expected me to not push Lowell and push Enchant. That is exactly what you wanted. You think that as town I will do exactly that. You are

PROJECTING

YOUR thought process onto ME. I am NOT YOU. I hate when people project onto me and it is obnoxious. We are not the same. We do not think the same. You are not going to get me to act like you when you're town. Because I dont act like you when I'm town. I act like this. This is town me. And I've been trying to get you to accept that for a while but hey.

remember how you almost shouted at me about how i vote wrong day one? welcome to the club bub.

[Confidently Wrong]

This is terrible ^

Like pulling teeth around here. Let’s all call a guy useless and scummy and do nothing.

Cool.

Unrelated: BBT is scum

Dudes loft posted 8 times in the last day and a half, listing all his suspects, what exactly you want from him? Vote him or don’t. BBT is scum, eira is probably town, I have this read in my head and can’t shake it now.

CW, can you talk about why Scum!Lowell makes these posts please?

because distancing exists and the dude is TMIing loft scum. Lowell is also the only one who has not considered anyone in the PoE as town and has tried to ignore sorting within it, I think if you try to focus on what is a hellbus strictly to clear them you are going to get nowhere. Because it was a wild move in a desperate situation that will seem wrong.

I perhaps also understand this is possible because I have pushed over a partner in similar ways for cred and distanced. So it is something I can recognize when reading back and learn to ignore until other evidence shows it is true.

The point is that I don't care that Lowell pushed scum hard. I care that the way they reached that conclusion was congruent with a town thought process and not just scum choosing to place themselves in a nice cozy position around their partner.


You can sort people best when you look at how they push people who flipped town, because pushing scum can look natural and organic the most - which is why I ask people to look at how mainly, Lowell has treated CSF


WHO PEOPLE STILL CANT EXPLAIN WHY THEY DIE IN ANY OTHER WORLD BUT LOWELL SCUM WORLD

but yeah.

[Confidently Wrong]

Eira you expected me to not push Lowell and push Enchant. That is exactly what you wanted. You think that as town I will do exactly that. You are

PROJECTING

YOUR thought process onto ME. I am NOT YOU. I hate when people project onto me and it is obnoxious. We are not the same. We do not think the same. You are not going to get me to act like you when you're town. Because I dont act like you when I'm town. I act like this. This is town me. And I've been trying to get you to accept that for a while but hey.

remember how you almost shouted at me about how i vote wrong day one? welcome to the club bub.

shrug i usually have above average accuracy on d1. confidence usually warranted, was not warranted here.

[Irrelephant11]

I’ve posted why CSF would die in any scum world. General towniness and/or guessing at TPR (they were sorta right if so)

[Irrelephant11]

I think some of my early Kenny scumread might have been a result of a language barrier but fwiw dunn has not towntold so strongly it could never come from scum. He’s posted like a dozen times and was aware he was at E-1 and needed to perform or lose if scum

[Confidently Wrong]

Eira im going to be brutally honest. you are not a player who as far as I can tell is some sort of mafia prodigy who has way better reads than other people. If you're along on your island you are probably wrong. Just like how I was wrong alone on my island on Loftwing. You won't listen to that because it's coming from your super duper confident scumread of yours but its the fucking truth lmao and its extremely frustrating to argue with you because like i mentioned before you are both confbiasing your conclusion and working backwards and also refusing to acknowledge logic that opposes your view.

like whatever tbh appeal to authority. i'm scum hunting, plain and simple. step out of your panic room and actually approach me or stop whining about my methodology like a goblin with a stick. i'm done for now, ill build my case further and post it but i wont engage with you cos u toxic and that makes me toxic.

id rather have good vibes

And honestly even if im wrong idc. I'm pretty sure which three players scum are in, we have breathing room, so i won't she any tears for a cw mis-elim at this point unless you make some major claim, after the investigative roleclaim you made, which you then retracted. but have fun,

and make sure to remind everyone how your irrel read shifted only because toffee townread loftwing

; ) Like i'm not engage with you because there's still D2 and D3, your entire 'case' on Lowell, for me to cover.

Hav fun tho.

Ok Eira - let's lay out the logic here so I can show how ridiculous you are in assuming it is only scummy:

You townread someone really hard. like REALLY hard. They're townier than anyone else. You dont know their alignment though, theyre a scum who is fooling you at that very moment. This can be Player A.

There is a player you scumread really hard for what you believe are good reasons to scumread someone, we can call that Player B. That person is being pushed currently by another one of your townreads, lets call that person Player C. You are sure that person is town but you've never played with them before so you're not quite sure what they're capable of if scum. Let's remind the reader that none of the alignments are known to you at this time.

So Player C shifts from player B to Player A in a way that you feel was possibly with intent to dismantle a wagon on scum, and that they were just distancing and got off when it was hot.

It would then be reasonable to think that Player C is potentially mafia with Player B and not be as sure of them as town.


I hope this very simple explaination makes sense to you because I'm reaching my limit.

[Confidently Wrong]

I’ve posted why CSF would die in any scum world. General towniness and/or guessing at TPR (they were sorta right if so)

no lmao

[Confidently Wrong]

maybe im just good at reading for PRs in general so maybe im overstating my confidence of my VT read on CSF but no.

and in a town Lowell world, theres a player whos tunneling the slot. Mafia don't kill slots that are being tunneled by other townies like that unless there's good reason.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

OK CW, but elimming scum D1 is genuinely awful for scum's overall odds of winning the game. So, it seems suicidal for scum!Lowell to insist on a Loft lim, no?

[Irrelephant11]

CSF wasn’t vanilla though

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Fine. I’ll be white-knighting scumBBTs errand boy if it gets us a vote.

vote Fred

I guess this ship has sailed, but man does that ever seem like a fake-claim. Never heard of a neighborizer—why would it exist in a mini.

Now this could come from Scum!Lowell