Open 875 - The Kindgom of Zeal: The Queens Chosen - GAME OVER
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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Hardclaim potato-
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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I have two reads
I normally see the hypersolving as a townie trait, but I understand that for ranger this is something she replicates as mafia. nonetheless I think the ranger's townread on LLD looks genuine, when I think as a wolf someone would be more inclined to OMGUS' LLD's push.In post 29, Ranger wrote:
I don't see LLD opening this way as scum but it's not worth the effort of debating my alignment with her.
my other read is that furtive is more likely a townie because he is trying to interact with detective penguin - a slot that he had to kill n1 as a serial killer last time - and I think he is more likely to do that as town this time-
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VOTE: redff
I guess hopping on the ranger wagon is not great-
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some other minor things: LLD is a tentative townread cause she is deathtunneling a slot since very early and I don't see wolves doing that enough. sail's scumclaiming post was really awkward but I don't think is scummy. penguin seems intense this game which is good.-
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if you have a read with that vote please share I'd love talking it out with you
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I KNOW I KNWO ITS LAMBDA DELTA
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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why do you think the self vote is gross, if it isn't scummy? I get the idea of self voting being gross when that's tied to an emotional play or something that goes against wincon. but there on p2 it was a meaningless vote so I take issue with you pointing it out as if it's meaningful, and I want you to expand on why you think its gross and why it could potentially be scum indicative.In post 98, Umlaut wrote: Page 1-2:- Very strong town vibes on ΛΔ just from page 1 alone
- Ranger self-voting is gross and I don't like it (but I don't know if it's scummy gross or just regular gross)
- Sail's 31 is so cheeky I want to townread them for that alone
- Intangible scum vibes on Penguin for 35 which their later posts don't help
- Cephrir is dead null, seems like a hard player to read
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they're greek letters you uneducated penguinIn post 101, Detective Penguin wrote: oh math symbols...haha..hilarious-
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I agree it's an overreaction, but I feel like that fits the way ranger plays at a personality level and I think claiming n1 on p2 is more likely than not to be coming from town. I see ranger is getting some scumreads and I don't understand them nor do I think what you're noticing is more likely than not to be coming from scum.In post 108, Umlaut wrote:
On reflection saying "not sure whether scummy" was technically true but I should have been clear I sort of do find it scummy. Not the self-vote itself, because people self-vote as town all the time (even though I think it's dumb), but the self-vote in combination with what came before and after.In post 104, Gimli wrote:why do you think the self vote is gross, if it isn't scummy? I get the idea of self voting being gross when that's tied to an emotional play or something that goes against wincon. but there on p2 it was a meaningless vote so I take issue with you pointing it out as if it's meaningful, and I want you to expand on why you think its gross and why it could potentially be scum indicative.
This all seemed like an overreaction to being suspected. Making a claim and self-voting and saying "I don't see any point in arguing this" seems like something you might do as town if you are on the chopping block already but not in response to one person saying you are scum, so it comes off to me as someone trying to "react the way town would react" rather than just exhibiting their true reaction.In post 29, Ranger wrote:Pretty sure role flips in setup but not night of acting if I remember correctly so will say I act N1. (I should double-check that but full disclosure; I actually forgot this was an open. Thanks to how flavored it was I thought it was a theme. xD)
VOTE: Ranger
I don't see LLD opening this way as scum but it's not worth the effort of debating my alignment with her.
from what I know of both ranger and LLD, if they start arguing with each other over their scumreads on one another, we'll see many very long posts. I think it's reasonable for ranger to try and avoid it, especially if she thinks lld is probably town and not a back and forth that'll help her solve.-
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really, why is that?In post 128, Cephrir wrote: i don't either but i think ranger's response has been decently scummy-
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I don't wanna get into the multiple people part of this other than to say it has to be NAI, right? and I don't think she's been heavy handed with it, surely ranger feels its important that we know she's not someone you talked with before.In post 132, Cephrir wrote: i think she's focused pretty hard on the "confusing me with someone else" aspect and while i understand what she's getting at here, it's easier to hide behind this than to take another tack. furthermore, she accuses me of this when i haven't said anything that implied my vote has to do with who she is or isn't. i did make one post about the rightful order of things but that has never been why i was voting where im voting
also, if she wishes me to see her as someone else, then i think i get to hold her to a standard of explaining reads which i would not hold the person i'm confusing her with to, so i would like to see that
what were you pushing ranger for originally? I see that you're not pushing her for having an overreaction to that 'i wont townread you just for putting things in the right order', when imo she wasn't reacting to a lean or a push, she was reacting to the familiarity in which you were approaching her.-
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with her who, with lld?In post 139, Cephrir wrote:
i can be pretty reliably expected to vote anything LLD feels strongly about on page 1, and then i wasn't super thrilled by ranger's decision to decline any sort of discussion with her-
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but lld isn't saying anything ranger can defend herself from. its 'your scumtells', and ranger is saying pls don't read me on my tells im a different person. there's nothing to work with cause lld isnt engaging with ranger's posts, she's just identifying something ranger does when she is a wolf-
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I'd be unwilling to engage with it as well if someone came to me and said 'oh youre doing your wolf thing' with no elaboration-
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I see. she said she's giving reads and I find her emotions genuine although I did townread ranger's emotions in 2019 game despite her being mafia. somehow this looks different and idt ranger strikes me as a resigned wolf.-
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if you're so sure of it, okayIn post 149, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:
no, she's not resigned. That's the point.In post 145, Gimli wrote: I see. she said she's giving reads and I find her emotions genuine although I did townread ranger's emotions in 2019 game despite her being mafia. somehow this looks different and idt ranger strikes me as a resigned wolf.
this is the precise emotional result she's aiming to engender in you. You can tell it's planned because of the dissonance between Ranger's self vote and supposed give up mixed with Ranger's constant rebuttal of Ceph and I based on meta plural reasons, indictating she doesn't actually want or think she will die today. Infact, she's giving me vibes feeling confident she will live.
So let's take her at her word, yes? She wants to die, she's giving her reads, they'll be here tomorrow if she's dead and town.
But why would we let someone who votes themselves and wants to die, live?-
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so this is your first mafia game?In post 119, Ethel wrote:
I am a... wait, what's the lore of this again? Oh right - I am of course an ambitious young magician from the beautiful city of Enhasa who is honored by this opportunity to serve her majesty the Queen. Although I have been educated in the matter of intrigues and schemes, this is my first time experiencing a scenario such as the current one firsthand. I am still trying to decipher the code most of you seem to use, but not to worry, I'll have it figured out soon enough. Admittedly, I am finding it hard to follow some of the reasonings that have been made about the indentity of any Earthbound Ones, so I will observe and learn before making any such accusations myself.In post 111, Umlaut wrote: Ethel, are you an actual new player or an alt?-
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me watching ranger scumreads like
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reminder to never self vote in a game with y'all...-
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been one of my favorites since my teenage years as well which was a long time agoIn post 168, Detective Penguin wrote:
forgot to say that your avatar is one of my favorite albums of all time. which needed to be said. because.In post 160, Gimli wrote: reminder to never self vote in a game with y'all...
I'm listening to it now since you mentioned it-
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first the obligatoryIn post 171, Ranger wrote:
{Gimli}
{Lady Lambdadelta}
{Save The Dragons, Sail}
{Detective Penguin}
{Korina, (Radical Rat), Umlaut, Cephrir}
{furtiveglance | Ethel}
{redFF}
second of all I really like your reads list, I think furtive is playing to his scum meta so far and agree with the sail townread... I have a little bit of meta with sail and they seem more flowy and posting unprepared posts than when they randed mafia in cannibal game.
I have a town vibe on ethel fwiw, if thats their literal first game of mafia they sound really innocent and open about it. but its just an impression i could be wrong ofc.-
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well the thread is twice as big now, and furtive is playing reserved, like he does everytime he rands mafiaIn post 177, Detective Penguin wrote:In post 78, Gimli wrote: my other read is that furtive is more likely a townie because he is trying to interact with detective penguin - a slot that he had to kill n1 as a serial killer last time - and I think he is more likely to do that as town this time
What changed?In post 176, Gimli wrote: I think furtive is playing to his scum meta so far-
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of course furtive will interact with you when he is mafia right after you caught him in a game, it was a very thin early impression-
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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there are no reads in these posts-
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'furtive what do you think of ceph's wagon?'
'well, its a wagon'
remember that from last game? so, similar vibes. that's his scum meta so far.-
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I didn't say likely town, I said more likely town as in >rand town, for talking to you.-
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I'd love nothing more than an early death, but if you wanna kill mafia I suggest shooting elsewhere-
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@peng: I think I know how you operate by now and I appreciate the thin comb into my progression. its reminiscent to d1 EOD of cannibal game and I'm townreading you for it-
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I agree with both of these takes atm but I wanna give furtive a lot of room to get into the game cause he can be quite the obvtown. last post he made hit his scum meta harder than an overhand thoughIn post 216, Cephrir wrote: i think furtive is scum too
btw if anyone tries to kill ethel today i will unhinge my jaw and swallow them whole. just a heads up
while I do agree killing ethel is really bad, are you defending them cause new player, cause they're towny, or something else?-
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idk why korina?In post 220, furtiveglance wrote: I think Korina and Umlaut are town so far, how's that?-
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I enjoyed ethel's questioning lld on what the meta was for that first post and its funny how much we openly avoid confronting the nature of certain reads. this is the first time someone asks lld for a reasoning on ranger that goes past 'this is your scum tells', it's coming from a player who never mafia'd on a forum before while we put ranger on E-2 mainly on the back of that initial push.-
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townies in (ethel ceph umlaut lld ranger peng sail). more certain on peng not too sure about the others. I like the vibe of ceph's this game but I heavily dislike the way he pushed ranger. same goes for umlaut, though umlaut is giving me more townie looking solvey posts that I can townread them for.
how about this POE for d1: (korina, RR, sail, std, furtive, redff)-
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furtive townreading korina for something that's as close as you can get from reading a player mechanically (posting more scumreads than townreads) is not great and feels informed. I don't agree with sail's take on it but I think they had a towny perspective about furtive and I'm townleaning that approach-
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why? I see you townreading korina for a bunch of 'i like this' 'i dont like that', her reads seem shallow, and your reasoning isn't how I expect you to townhunt.In post 238, furtiveglance wrote:
Gimli seems off, fake, this doesn't look like a real Gimli thoughtIn post 236, Gimli wrote: furtive townreading korina for something that's as close as you can get from reading a player mechanically (posting more scumreads than townreads) is not great and feels informed. I don't agree with sail's take on it but I think they had a towny perspective about furtive and I'm townleaning that approach-
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you're rightIn post 241, furtiveglance wrote: I pretty consistently look for people actively scumhunting to townread.
So your read on me looks like uncharitable
why don't you do any of the many things you do when you're town? are you not feeling this game?-
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almost every game I played in which I thought 'okay why are we killing this player' the player flipped town
ranger's posts, almost all of them, have depth and nuance that I think comes from town a lot
I really like her emotions being dragged as the d1 flip, they seem genuine-
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this is only happening because ranger decided she would be a necessary d1 flip instead of going 'no you don't get to dictate the game', she turned herself into easy wagon and then people went 'lmao she self voted isnt that scummy' no thats not scummy-
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and I'm feeling like disengaging with this game cause I think this game is bullshit-
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redff, furtive, korina (why is this getting townreads?) all better wagons
we're getting nothing out of this-
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furtive and korina strong svs dynamics early I called it first-
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he called you townie for saying 'i dislike that' more than 'i like that' cause that's what your early posting looked likeIn post 311, Korina wrote: Also how do Furtive and I have svs dynamics, I barely answered furtive and need tk reread what Furt said specifically. That just like.
Ugh. Feels super weird for you to say that.-
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In post 154, Korina wrote: Ok some thoughts as I catchup and read:
- Don't like Ranger claiming n1.
- Don't like Ceph's posting on p2.
- Like LLD posting.
- Dislike Ranger self-vote which required me to read someone else's post to find out that Ranger self-voted bc I'm not fully reading the thread.
- Neutral on FF on p3.
- Sail scumclaim is eh.
- Gimli town.
- Umlaut posting ok, I guess. I didn't read it very detailed, but surface skim it seems ok.
I'm still busy lol but my friends got off to eat dinner so here I am now for a moment.
literally townreading that thing cause she disliked more things than she liked, he is just looking for reasons to townread you it seemsIn post 222, furtiveglance wrote: I think town are more likely to do a big list of dislikes, I think scumreads are more +town than townreads, especially early on-
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I'm point at other things in the game we might want to investigate. I no longer want to speak about ranger. so we're killing her? okay then fine-
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*they
I'm sorry korina-
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'sail scumclaim is eh'. what's eh? you think it's scummy? what do you think of sail now?-
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yeah I get it. but if it was nothing of note, why did you noted it?-
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what do you think of furtive townreading you? or furtive in general?-
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wait so ranger and mastina inhabit the same body? ugh I hope that's an appropriate question-
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their posts are pretty empty, its just pointing at things and saying she dislikes them with no substance. and then there's little things like thinking they had to point out that sail scumclaimed when they think nothing of it. why post filler like this? it should lead somewhere if you're noticing it, otherwise why are you posting about it? makes no senseIn post 327, Save The Dragons wrote: Gimli can you expand on why you sr korina
and then people are townreading her so it's a slot I'm looking at and drawing associatives from already-
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this is how I mafia man I'm bad at it but I keep tryin-
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*townreading them-
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wow you and flea, really? damn and you post so hard too, ugh comparativelyIn post 332, Korina wrote: I’ll respond to your question abt Furt later, but yeah, Ranger and Mastina are a system like Flea and us.
At a very layman working explanation that suffices to get the point across but lacks any nuance of the actual thing: meatspace hydra.
There’s LLD’s plurality thread and the Plural Discussion thread in the speakeasy if you have access to that, and I can grab links I posted somewhere else that help explain plurality too if you want.
I do have access to speakeasy, I'll look it up thank you.-
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I think that knowing korina belongs to a system with flea makes me more willing to townread their early start, even though I never played with korina and don't know anything about this player-
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I wasn't making a joke lol sorry. I see what you're saying.In post 338, Korina wrote: Idk if I misspoke or you’re making a joke, but Flea and I are two different systems lol.
I think you’re making a joke but my autism is making me think you’re being serious.
well good talk
so about the game, what you think of furtive? I asked and I don't think you replied-
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In post 354, Ethel wrote:
I don't know if LLD read my question or not, but it doesn't look like I'll get an answer. And I couldn't find it anywhere on this forum. From what I've seen, the vast majority of messages between LLD and Ranger have just been a rather pointless and stale argument. I'm honestly rather surprised how heated this seems to have gotten, I expected these games to be a lot more... civil. At first I thought it was just a part of the game, but surely this kind of hostility isn't considered normal? Maybe this comes too late and things have already cooled down, but I just wanted to say something because this seems to have gotten out of hand for what's supposed to be a fun game...In post 219, Ethel wrote: Could you clarify why that one post convinced you of that?-
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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VOTE: furtiveglance-
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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yeah no I'll just potato this game sorry-
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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ty for the links korina <3
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Gimli he/himJack of All Tradeshe/him
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