mystery box of silver 15: i'm killing hostages (negotiated)

[DkKoba]

Well I'm very willing to outsource my read on hpe, bc of the team Mafia thing. If I had to estimate where I have them rn it's probably still bottom 7 if not still 5
Granted I don't think people being wrong on me = wrong on others. Depends what kind of process / reasoning therefore is. All I currently have against xyzzy is a very scummy looking vote which I can explain away via 'scum might position more intelligently" but on top of that, i indeed have nothing else and they seem disengaged

[The Bulge]

pooky wanna tunnel eachother for like 10 pages and then end up townreading eachother by the end anyways

scum theatre

i was entertaining this thought yesterday and i raised both eyebrows when i read this post and then raised them further when i read yours

[MUSHSHAGANA]

I don't think there's any world where xyzzy's Koba vote comes from town. There's no realistic world where that vote with that explanation is townie. Either scum angling for a mis-elimination, a bus, or (my preferred theory) poisoning the wagon with a really awfully reasoned vote after it's lost momentum. (That last one holds regardless of Koba's alignment, a smarter player would do it to town-Koba, but it's a viable defense of scum-Koba too.)

The town world can't exist, because no one reads the Koba/Ranger 1v1, decides its SvS, and votes Koba without further explanation. They have to elaborate on that, because they have to know they're alone in thinking it -- especially when every active slot says "wow, openwolfing" in response and they STILL have nothing to say.

I'm inclined to let xyzzy coast on it in the hopes that Edman crushes two dingers in this series. If xyzzy doesn't go down from that, there's no way the slot isn't red.

Truthfully, Dannflor, your xyzzy defense is making your own slot drop in my reads. That isn't an ultimatum, I'd drop you further if you immediately about-faced (it'd seem focused on pleasing the crowd over building your own solve-space), it's just a statement.

[The Bulge]

HPE what are your thoughts so far on: mushshagana? skygazer? morning tweet?

MUSH seems to be putting the effort in and this one likes that. 257 in particular is like, the only post of it's kind right now excluding Ranger readlists and gives decent insight into it's thought processes. Town feel on this slot for sure.

This one cannot differentiate drunk Skygazer from sober Skygazer. It's not even sure if there's a difference. Only posts of substance feel like 236 and 237 but this one isn't sure how to read em. Null, probably going to be that way for a while.

Still too early for me to say anything about MT because she's mostly just shitposting and this game is dumb and chill and early-in enough that it doesn't think it needs to be too concerned about a lack of effort and scum trying to coast by on "cmaaaan its a silly game im just bein silly". Big null.

Now, let's mind-meld a bit here. What are

your

thoughts on these three, Bulge?

mostly im wondering why you hadn't provided any reads of your own volition (only koba when they prompted you to, and now these 3 here when i asked)
would you say your normally keep your reads close to your chest as town?

[DkKoba]

Do u think it's healthy to interrogste me and fill more of the thread with discussion related to my slot purely or like are u and orhers capable of looking elsewhere :/ I don't actually remember and I'm not gonna look back now, gut memory says there was some indignation somewhere that was towny, granted I am extremely cautious bc I got hard snowed by the slot in TM.

idk if it's unrealistic of me but I would uh actually appreciate if you did go back and look and figure out what your read on HPE is and why

it's not like this is discussion related to your slot purely, I literally want to know your thoughts on another slot

i kinda thought the way they treated the whole meta debacle was towny in nature ->

Koba bringing up an ancient ass game pings super weird when they most likely have much more recent experience with scum!Ranger but otherwise this one still doesn't super get the Koba wagon.

i literally did this with Ythan in team mafia, i will always find the most recent game I can. The most recent Ranger scumgame was 2016. i must use that game then. I have no other choice.

Fair enough. This one is mostly curious though if you went looking for a Ranger scumgame you were in to compare to, or if you were picking up similar vibes from Ranger compared to that nine year old game and went to grab it to prove it to others.

like this into

Koba bringing up an ancient ass game pings super weird when they most likely have much more recent experience with scum!Ranger but otherwise this one still doesn't super get the Koba wagon.

its dawning on me koba joined in 2020 and was very much not in bloodborne mafia.

this felt like a fairly townie thought progression to have


you interpreted it differently, i have a major achilles heel for nuanced sounding reasoning when people make pushes against me lol.

re: bulge: let me give you the explaination on why i did post that. pooky and I are very successful at finding eachother town (eventually) in games even if its after trial by fire when we are town/town. at the time i thought pooky was just trying to force me to make more content and was pushing me based on being slanky early on, which i felt was realistically reasonable and gave a plausible town world for him, although the way he was pushing me was uncharitable, which was why i wanted to push him first, get him to towntell if he is town, because scum him is not capable of hitting his real towntells, he just is good at manipulating people into thinking stuff that isnt his towntells is.


re:mush while your xyzzy argument has merit, I am leaning that world myself, I do not think just because Dannfloor has a different perspective there that makes them scum necessarily. Maybe he is scum! But linking alignment to disagreeing with a read is a surefire way to make a game super toxic.

[Dannflor]

The town world can't exist, because no one reads the Koba/Ranger 1v1, decides its SvS, and votes Koba without further explanation. They have to elaborate on that, because they have to know they're alone in thinking it -- especially when every active slot says "wow, openwolfing" in response and they STILL have nothing to say.

i don't follow "they have to know they're alone in thinking it" - why is that such a ridiculous thought

what consideration do you have towards a disengaged-town world for xyzzy's vote?

I'm mostly playing devil's advocate here because they have suddenly become a consensus scum read and that seems a disproportionate gamestate reaction to the posts they've actually made

[HighPrincessErinys]

this whole pedantic push against koba feels forced and not real and it would be the slot I'd consider most likely to be scum/scum with koba. I think it's kinda scummy if koba is town too.

like, I don't know this whole thing was such a nonissue. dkkoba pulled the most recent scum game they could find from Ranger's history. The fact that it was an old game is a very easy thing to pick at but what does it actually fucking mean in terms of alignment. I don't believe HPE or anyone actually thinks that dkkoba not finding a more recent scum game because they didn't use a specific search method is actually alignment indicative. And yet, this is the only thing HPE harps on with dkkoba despite a wealth of other content. It feels wrong?

Scum players tend to get excited when they catch other players doing "objectively weird" or inconsistent things but more often than not these things are just townies being weird or NAI. 515 spends a whole paragraph on how objectively weird it is for dkkoba to be lazy? like, as if koba's scum game plan was to specifically find an old meta read and hope no one fact checked it? and then 529 just further cements the "you didn't try hard enough and that's scummy" - which I can see that argument if I squint, but I don't think low efforting is a scum tell to use on dkkoba when they are the top poster in this thread

all in all it just feels like a forced push because HPE found something objectively inconsistent and that is very easy for scum to harp on because it doesn't involve actually thinking about someone's alignment.

This one DID see weird inconsistent lack-of-effort posting and DID latch on, but that's also why it's pulling back because at this point it's realizing that most of that was literally just "Koba did not put in as much effort as they could have with finding the scumgame" as opposed to any kind of bad faith argument and it's really just. Not worth pushing. This one doesn't expect that to exonerate itself to you but it doesn't care, Koba wagon is a "why??" for me again either way.

mostly im wondering why you hadn't provided any reads of your own volition (only koba when they prompted you to, and now these 3 here when i asked)
would you say your normally keep your reads close to your chest as town?

Would say so, yes. Would still like you to perchance give your thoughts on the 3 you picked in exchange.

[Dannflor]

I'm inclined to let xyzzy coast on it in the hopes that Edman crushes two dingers in this series. If xyzzy doesn't go down from that, there's no way the slot isn't red.

I don't disagree with this

[The Bulge]

ok this is gonna be a wild read from my own perspective but I'm pretty sure pooky is mafia bc of the way it feels he is tunneling me.

when he has tunneled me when i have been mafia as town, i can actually feel he believes his read and isnt just reaction testing me or anything like that. i do not remember him ever misreading me longterm when we are both town or even really getting tunneled when he is town and i am town, moreso the opposite


while like getting flashbacks to 2020 coalition pooky tunneling me this is how it feels i think and i feel i have grasped the difference? like its bc it feels like a reaction test at times and is super lazy and all that. granted in coalition it eventually turned into something more srs and thats when i backed off but i should have known.


now to convince 9 other ppl that lazy openwolfing pooky is scum[challenge: impossible] (if that pokemon game is anything to judge by)

the thing about pooky's play that makes him extremely difficult for me to read is that he always just looks like he's having fun and i can't see much deeper motive than that. i'm curious about where you're getting serious tunnel from this. imo it looks like he's just pushing your buttons.

[sheepsaysmeep]

{Meuh}
{SirCakez, PookyTheMagicalBear, Doctor Drew}
{Skygazer}
{The Buldge}
{DKKoba}
{HighPrincessErinys}
{Dannflor}
{Alisae}
{MUSHSHAGANA}
{BlueSnakelet}
{iamveryhappy}
{sheepsaysmeep}
{Morning Tweet}
{RCEnigma}
{xyzzy}
{ofrhz}

P25. Still have stale reads; this is mostly recency bias.

This is scum because it tries to ignore the fact that I am obvious town

[Dannflor]

that's a disappointing post

[The Bulge]

im making weird faces at my laptop rn

[The Bulge]

It's dawning on me that this back and forth is doing nothing for the game at hand, this little song and dance has gotten boring now.

At least make it look like a real fight at this point.

youre not helping with comments like this, go away unless you have something to contribute

I am contributing, this is such contrived theater between you two.

i'd like to think that premeditated theatre would be a little more interesting to read no?

[The Bulge]

VOTE: DkKoba
This one apologizes but that is such a weird fucking move to pull.

what is weird and why is it scummy

This one was briefly under the assumption that you were linking Bloodborne Mafia as it was firsthand experience you had with Ranger, but that is very much not the case and it's wondering why the hell you picked that game while claiming "i will always find the most recent game I can. The most recent Ranger scumgame was 2016." when it's not only much easier to find recent games compared to old games, but you also can just... check her wiki page, and from there quickly find her full list of played games. Granted, that page is very outdated, but it does still list a few newer scum games from her, namely Open 641, Open 644, and Micro 617. It's honestly kind of intriguing how you got to Bloodborne Mafia

specifically

and not one of her much more recent scum games OR one of these three later ones on her Played Games page. Either way it's OBJECTIVELY weird and feels like a very bad faith attempt at getting a metaread agreed with.

not liking the process behind this read at all

[The Bulge]

im making weird faces at my laptop rn

"you're going to get wrinkles" -gf from the other end of the couch just now

[Doctor Drew]

It's dawning on me that this back and forth is doing nothing for the game at hand, this little song and dance has gotten boring now.

At least make it look like a real fight at this point.

youre not helping with comments like this, go away unless you have something to contribute

I am contributing, this is such contrived theater between you two.

i'd like to think that premeditated theatre would be a little more interesting to read no?

Started off strong, but the writers kept rehashing themselves in the second act, and the finale fell real flat.

But ya, as I said I don't think Ranger was actually complicit in it and was just Koba seemingly purposely going over the top.

Actually seems like almost every interaction they have had here in this game, at least as of late has been a head scratcher(Ranger, HPE, Pooky).

It seems like less open wolfing and more they want to draw the lim? I think I even said it as much, but even I don't fully by it.....not to mentioned how often they are throwing there vote around.

Schadd needs to send Koba to the showers after Edman send one into the cheep seats.

[The Bulge]

ok well protip: when someone is getting obviously frustrated at how you are playing because they want to actually read your slot and are showing that, that person is probably town

unfortunately the ranger/hpe push against you is so inane that you don't get cleared off of frustration here :/ sry

[schadd_]

watching baseball

[schadd_]

edman in the box

[schadd_]

shouldve been a 4 pitch walk (lol) but instead it was a fly out to left field slightly away from the warning track

[The Bulge]

ok funny moment but i think ranger probably not rly that scummy after a little meta dive bc all they posted for a little bit in a town game was those readslists lmao


regardless,

VOTE: Alisae

I'm pretty sure that's NAI and just how Ranger posts? Did you check any scum games?

lmao

[Doctor Drew]

shouldve been a 4 pitch walk (lol) but instead it was a fly out to left field slightly away from the warning track

The Cardinals are the worst this year(besides my Mets).

[schadd_]

nolan arenado got a solo home run in the 2nd inning and so hopefully he can chat with tommy about it while they're in the dugout like "yeah the trick for me was hitting the ball very hard actually"

[schadd_]

although realistically he'll be like "yeah the trick for me was not getting v

nevermind post cancelled

[schadd_]

go mets