open 896: describing conker (game over)

[Elements]

elements what's your read on dannflor?

That he's not red team with you
Beyond that not much, haven't really look at the slot though

Also, I use the other pronouns

[Aristeia]

I also believe that Elements doesn't put himself in a hood with Ari/ydra and I town read Ydrasse

Dann can you explain this read of Elements.

like why do you even bother to ask him questions like in 189 if you think they are town just off where they are located.

sorry fixed

[Aristeia]

I also believe that Elements doesn't put themselves in a hood with Ari/ydra and I town read Ydrasse

Dann can you explain this read of Elements.

like why do you even bother to ask them questions like in 189 if you think they are town just off where they are located.

sorry fixed

oops missed some pronouns sorry

[Aristeia]

That he's not red team with you

when did you make this assessment?

[Elements]

That he's not red team with you

when did you make this assessment?

The back and forth you two have had recently

[Aristeia]

like even if you're pretending you have me at lockscum I didn't really do anything to push Dann until yesterday I even called him town off some pretty convoluted logic and you've been following him around for a while before then so that can't be the sum of all the thoughts you've had about his alignment up to now.

[Aristeia]

so you've been following him on voting for Jupiter, Afayeed, Meuh.

but you decided on his alignment as town off what he interacted with me in the last twenty four hours.

ok cool

[Aristeia]

why did you want me to hammer Meuh if you think I'm lock scum btw?

[Aristeia]

like if you're town and you think I'm mafia

and I ask you hey do you want me to hammer this person here.

if she's mafia with me obviously I won't do it.

but if she's town like why would you want me to do it?

[Ydrasse]

ill post l8r or tmrw

[Elements]

I don't have you as lockscum anymore
Dann's push made me less sure of which of you is Red

[Elements]

Sorry I can't go into much detail, I'm in the middle of a panto rn

[Elements]

why did you want me to hammer Meuh if you think I'm lock scum btw?

I thought Meuh was e-2 at the time

I haven't intentionally been following Dann's vote, I've just gone where the momentum has

[Elements]

so you've been following him on voting for Jupiter, Afayeed, Meuh.

but you decided on his alignment as town off what he interacted with me in the last twenty four hours.

ok cool

I don't think dann is town, I don't think you and dann are red together

[Dannflor]

I also believe that Elements doesn't put himself in a hood with Ari/ydra and I town read Ydrasse

Dann can you explain this read of Elements.

like why do you even bother to ask him questions like in 189 if you think he's town just off where he is located.

because it’s not a 100% lock town read?

[Dannflor]

I am always looking for ways to either reinforce or doubt my reads by asking questions

[Dannflor]

and like my reasoning for elements town right now is mostly a combo of vibes, me thinking you are more likely to be scum, and that i think he’d pick an easier small hood for him to thrive in

[Afrayed Knott]

so you've been following him on voting for Jupiter, Afayeed, Meuh.

but you decided on his alignment as town off what he interacted with me in the last twenty four hours.

ok cool

I don't think dann is town, I don't think you and dann are red together

That makes no sense


Where is your vote?

[Afrayed Knott]

Sorry I can't go into much detail, I'm in the middle of a panto rn

A member of the cast or there as audience? Which panto?

[Dannflor]

as far as my thoughts on why you might wanna position to push me

A) i think you are just the type of person who reflexively pushes people who push you as town. I think you know this and would try to replicate this as scum. But, i just don’t believe your scum read on me. It seems fabricated and very weak coming from you and I don’t expect you to have weak reads.

B) it’s possible you might see me as a threat in my current read trajectories and wanna get rid of me

More on the fabrication:

I think your reasoning for dann!scum because I didn’t sort meuh more is like better and more believable, but most of that stuff has been post hoc. Your original focal point for saying im 76% scum was that i was not around to engage with meuh being at e-1. To me that just seems like you wanted me to be scum and were looking for reasons as to why that was the case, not the basis for a scum read.

And now like the elements thing seems so surface level

why am i asking questions of people ive already expressed reads on? Really? have i ever struck you as a person with a ton of conviction?

even if i had been around when meuh was being run up, i probably would have unvoted because i dont actually believe my page 15 solve is enormously likely to be accurate more than average

[Dannflor]

ari who is your pick for scum in the big hood if i were to flip town

[Meuh]

It feels like you’re trying to gotcha me, not sort me

indicative of black being town tbh

You think so?

[Aristeia]

A) i think you are just the type of person who reflexively pushes people who push you as town. I think you know this and would try to replicate this as scum. But, i just don’t believe your scum read on me. It seems fabricated and very weak coming from you and I don’t expect you to have weak reads.

(1) I don't do this as town, I pretty much only push back if I need to sort the player or I think it's likely the person pushing me is mafia. I can pretty easily show games where I just ignore pushes on me as town.

(2) I didn't replicate anything as scum, you are trying to claim the impetus of me pushing you is you pushing me, which is simply not true. My initial reaction to you pushing me was to say I thought you would pretty much never push me with "ari is too nice so she's scum" because its just like kind of ? to say about someone, the implication being that when I'm town I'm mean or whatever. I only began pushing you after watching meuh get pushed and you basically not being here for all of it and being afk. This has nothing to do with you suspecting me and you trying to claim I'm trying to "replicate town meta" by pushing back is simply a verifiable lie and not what actually happened.

(3) Claiming that my reasoning for you not sorting meuh is better than my reasoning for you not being here and saying its post hoc is ?
You not being here to sort is the same thing as you not sorting Meuh. My point is that you didn't sort her.

I have to run but ill address the rest later

[Meuh]

VOTE: Daisy I wanna poke here

[Meuh]

(3) Claiming that my reasoning for you not sorting meuh is better than my reasoning for you not being here and saying its post hoc is ?
You not being here to sort is the same thing as you not sorting Meuh. My point is that you didn't sort her.

Uhhh

and meuh's only real significant contribution to this game is 262 which feels like a scum post

so im happy with a page 15 solve of ari/meuh

like I don't see how town dannflor feels that he's one vote away from winning a game vs me/meuh and just ghosts?

like I guess maybe he was just busy but I also feel like maybe it was just awkward for him to re-enter thread and actually interact with meuh when she's ateing because he doesn't know how to close her without making himself look bad and he hopes Black will push her over the edge for him.

it feels like he doesnt want to be here and I can see why he'd not want to be here if black!town is pushing meuh!town for him and he can just kind of cheer from the sidelines.

maybe he just has a life and has better things to do on a friday night than geek out on mafia message boards in which case im sorry i am needy and stupid

like if he believes the meuh/ari solution, I would think he'd be here to press meuh and sort her

but he doesn't

ok sure let's say its because he was busy with his sister etc

now he's back and he's just kind of casually walking away from it with a comment about it after its happened and he moves onto the next step to respond to me.

I don't think anything he's done with respect to meuh is to sort her or place her.

The groundwork for Dann scum here was him not being there, it's something you made pretty clear? It was specific to the timeframe in which he was not there. Then later you added that Dann's pop in after the E-1 shenanigans still wasn't trying to sort me. Dann is saying that the second argument is better than the first, but that the first was the base of the argument? At least as far as I understand it.