A Dance with Dragons Mafia: A New Dawn!

[Shadow1psc]

(That said, I'm sorry if my post was what tipped you over into replacing out. I just wanted to see more of your thought process.)

Shadow...are you saying you said we shouldn't lynch Minimum because you had a strong town read on me at that point of the game?

What exactly makes you so confident that I'm town?

It's less about me being confident that you're town, but you're someone who tends to put in considerable effort when you can, and why are going to get rid of someone who is at least putting in such an effort and seems (to me) decently easy to read as the game goes on? I don't have a scum read on you, and I know CES is a goofball. Same goes for Tammy, and probably Tierce. I mentioned this earlier.

[Eddard Stark]

Jalabhar Xho, Prince of the Red Flower Vale, is an exile prince from the Summer Islands. He wears a cape of green and scarlet feathers over his black skin.
Apparently here's an artist impression, which I'm only adding because it looks UNREASONABLY BADASS:

Spoiler:

Day 1, Votecount 36

SnowStorm (3) - Regfan, Feysal, Shinori
Minimum (2) - Salamence20, Hasdgfas
Salamence20 (6) - Amrun, Minimum, bvoigt, Mastermind of Sin, Shadow1psc, BBmolla
Feysal (1) - Starbuck
Shinori (1) - Staeg
Shadow1psc (2) - StefanB, Lyanna Stark

bvoigt (8) - Plum's Yo Mamma, greenknight, SnowStorm, Dolorous Edd, Tyene Sand, Pandora, MagnaofIllusion, Benmage

Jal (1) - DCLXVI

Not Voting (4):

Mockingjaye, kortul, Plessiezrus, Jal

With 28 alive it takes 15 to lynch.

• Deadline
  : 3rd September at 11:59pm Ireland time. (GMT+1)
  
• Countdown to deadline
  : (expired on 2012-09-03 18:59:59)
  
• MJ may be V/la for a hurricane.

CHOOSE TO BE A BADASS MOTHERFUCKER

Tyene Sand (1) - Feysal
Dolorous Edd (2) - hasdgfas, Jal

Feysal (8) - Salamence20, Bvoigt, greenknight, Shinori, Mastermind of Sin, DCLXVI, Dolorous Edd, Benmage

Hasdgfas (1) - Shadow1psc
Minimum (4) - Regfan, StefanB, Lyanna Stark, MagnaofIllusion
Starbuck (2) - Starbuck, Staeg
Shadow1psc (1) - Mockingjaye
greenknight (6) - Plum's Yo Mamma, Minimum, Tyene Sand, Pandora, Plessiezarus, BBmolla

Not Choosing (3):

kortul, Amrun, SnowStorm

With 28 alive it takes 15 to 'Choose'. Once a choose has 15 votes it will be locked in but not end day.

ANY MISTAKES MAY BE POINTED OUT.

Prodding Plum's Yo Mamma

[Shadow1psc]

pedit: wanker

Bully for me.

[Minimum]

Ladies and gentleman, Minatown.

So this post

wasn't

you calling me town? "Minatown" means "Mina too talkative to lynch or Choose D1" in Shadowspeak?

[Shadow1psc]

You asked two different questions, and I answered them both, interestingly enough,

before

you even asked the question

1) When I said Minimum wasn't going to be lynched today:

"It's less about me being confident that you're town, but you're someone who tends to put in considerable effort when you can, and why are going to get rid of someone who is at least putting in such an effort and seems (to me) decently easy to read as the game goes on? I don't have a scum read on you, and I know CES is a goofball. Same goes for Tammy, and probably Tierce. I mentioned this earlier."

2) When I said you were Minatown:

"Shadow, how were those posts of mine any more town than any other posts I've made this game?"

- Mina

"Did I say they weren't?"

- Shadow

Please explain to me your confusion on my stance of you. I never thought you were scummy, and your most recent largeposts™ have swayed me into thinking you're more likely town than scum, therefor you're not 'null'.

[Shadow1psc]

I realize you're looking to get a read no me, but feigning ignorance just annoys me

[kortul]

Finished the ISO of

Shadow1psc

. Out of his 70 posts, more than 2/3 are about nothing (that's like two extra pages to read). I just hate this style.

In his first 15 posts or so only 1 or 2 have some thoughts. Then came the period of defending, at first defense was based on the idea that "scum wouldn't act scummy", then it actually become more sensible. One post in particular caught my attention:

How about the explanation of, the game isn't even 3 (real) days old and people are trying to actually use limited amount of interaction in a 28 player game to pinpoint behavior as either 'scummy' or 'town', as if the game has been going on for weeks,

or some mystical mindset is able to actually tell you I am <....>

, much in the way I've been called out for calling Mina town (which I never actually said she was, just that she shouldn't be lynched because Mina is easy to read in later days).

Everyone who isn't Shadow1psc, imagine yourself telling the bolded part. What would you use in place of the word that i erased?

Spoiler:

Then compare the word you used with your alignment, and check what was used in the actual post.

I actually liked one of his next posts, it is consistent with his attitude and style so far. That's about it. In the rest of his posts the noise to signal ratio is awful. And i already addressed his peculiar rection to my neutral statement.

If we both will survive into the later days, and he will start actually helping the city, i will reassess my opinion. Who knows, maybe information from flips he is so waiting for will transform him into the scumhunter extraordinaire. But for now i am more than comfortable with choosing him, and would vote him if his Vote wagon had any chances, he is more scummy than Salamance20.

CHOOSE Shadow1psc

Reading Shadow took much longer than i expected, and it is close to 1 am already, so will read the greenknight tomorrow. Hope to see some answers to my previous question in the morning.

[Shadow1psc]

Finished the ISO of Shadow1psc. Out of his 70 posts, more than 2/3 are about nothing (that's like two extra pages to read). I just hate this style.

So you can concede that more than 20 of my posts are helpful, and you still have less than 15

total

posts. By your own admission I have at least contributed more than you, smaller more insightful posts and misunderstanding of them not withstanding. Even if we were to consider every one of your posts a paragon of town excellence (which, due to your attacks on Snow, we

know

they aren't), you've still done less in this game than me

I can live with that.

[Shadow1psc]

Everyone who isn't Shadow1psc, imagine yourself telling the bolded part. What would you use in place of the word that i erased?

This is also taken so far out of context it actually hurts. This was in response to someone calling me scum, so literally your one point of merit for choosing me is a misrep at best, and scummy yourself at worst.

[Mastermind of Sin]

But for now i am more than comfortable with choosing him, and would vote him if his Vote wagon had any chances, he is more scummy than Salamance20.

CHOOSE Shadow1psc

Uhhh...Shadow had more votes than chooses...why the fuck would you be comfortable choosing him but lament the fact that he doesn't have enough votes to be a viable wagon?

In fact, to further illustrate this point, there are two vote wagons of 8 and 6 right now. There are also two choose wagons of 8 and 6. The competition for a Shadow wagon for both voting and choosing is

exactly

the same. The only difference is that Shadow has more votes than chooses. So why the fuck would you say his vote wagon had no chance and then go ahead and choose him, which by your own logic has even

less

of a chance at succeeding?

Unchoose, Choose: Kortul

Kill it with a fiery passion!

[Plums Yo Mamma]

Sorry for low activity the past few days (was hoping Nacho would do some posting, but well).

Kortul, that scumslip you're implying on Shadow is so bad of you it hurts.

Funnily enough, I don't at all think Sala is Town. I would be more than happy with 2 of {Sala, Bvoigt, greenknight} offed today. Would not be especially happy at this point to see Minimum or Feysal offed.

I don't really want to respond to Bvoigt's response to me, but I may do so briefly (to be short about it, I mislike making 'cases' and 'defending cases'. I just said what was necessary to make it clear that Bvoigt is very much deserving of getting lynched). Firstly, let's be serious, Starbuck nameclaiming wouldn't be anti-Town, and spending time painting it like that is just a bid for Townpoints. Lastly, everything else is trying to excuse things and pretty them up. Good for you, but it doesn't change my feelings nor invalidate the observations. So. I shrug in your general direction. Also.

Actually, despite white I just said about DCLXVI, his posts since then have been pretty scummy. This is an interesting quote:

Was just planning on just reading this thread before bed, but this needs a response.

So he wasn't planning to post, but since Regfan called him scum, suddenly he decides it's too important to wait? This pretty clearly shows that to him, defending himself takes priority over scumhunting. Yes, he also called Reg scum in that post, but it was more of an afterthought than anything. (As town, I think defending oneself and scumhunting are both important, but at most, they're equals. Scum, IMO, might place more of a priority on defense.)

Blah blah blah theory-approved talking points blah blah. People are generally more drawn to doing stuff immediately if it's directly regarding them. Trying to paint this as scummy - well. As a move alone it's at best null and bespeaks naivete. In tone, it's framing up DCLXVI. 'Pretty clearly shows that to him, defending himself takes priority over scumhunting' are just very scummy, framey ways of discussing the behavior in question.

EVERYTHING is conspicuously toeing the theory line of Town behavior in bvoigt's explanations. But it all seems to be done out of artifice because no thought is going into what's actually useful and caring about that.

Sala must show up. Dammit.

Also thank you yes Kortul is scum too.

[Mastermind of Sin]

So let's vote Sala and choose Kortul. 2 for 2 D1s are hard to beat!

[Benmage]

I'll lynch bvoigt or sala I dont care at this point.

But I like Feysal chosen....

We need to lynch someone already.

[BBmolla]

So let's vote Sala and choose Kortul. 2 for 2 D1s are hard to beat!

^This please.

Unchoose
Choose: Kortul

[Regfan]

There's part of me that wants to believe the mason claim is fake but I don't think that's what Snow would fake-claim at his first game on this site where he's relatively unaware about which roles are used often plus the legitimacy of his claim will be much more obvious later.

Nacho, Kortul is town. Very confident in that right now; while his 'scumslip' that he's pushing on Shadow isn't strong it's not something that scum would make up and attempt to push on someone that's easily pushed otherwise like Shadow. Furthermore his replace in posts and content have all been good. Really shocked that you can even potentially see him as scum right now because he's bleeding townienss. I don't really like any of the current wagons all that much. Going to do a bunch of re-looking into Salam and the meta check on Bvoigt but think this is better than both right now;

Vote: Stefan

Amrun

is very un-amrun-like.... Which shit happens... and no way do I see scumAmrun trying to tactically lurk... I digress, not this spot today.

I've seen her strategically lurk as scum before. Might not be the case right now but don't rule her out due to it.

Spoiler: For Mina

Also, didn't Shadow call plenty of attention to himself in AFFC?

I have little to no memory in his play in AFFC, will take a look at it later I suppose though.

I feel like we're reading completely different threads if you thought Plum's Your Mamma looked scummier later on than in the beginning. But I thought Nacho's posting felt pretty town (particularly his reaction to being accused of attacking easy targets, his wanting a strong bandwagon, his interactions with Shadow, his backing away from a scum read of us earlier than they had to).

I didn't/don't fully agree, his cases are fairly sound but the way he brought them up and pushed them looked as if it was just for show at first, I didn't like his period of inactivity between his initial posts and the case, I know Nachoscum likes a good bit of lurking and his play there fitted that with the case being the perfect way for him to be 'active' as scum. Eh. I mean looking at it again yesterday when I re-read over it I don't feel completely the same way; think there's a decent chance of him being town but that posting/section isn't something I understand to change someones scumish/nullish read of him into a town-read.

You posted this on Page 4 of the game. Our most recent post at that point was on page

two

. Did you seriously expect us to state town reads at that point?

Yes. I did. I don't normally post into a game until I have reads/something legitimate to discuss to avoid fluff posting and while I know you and CES aren't the same way none of your early posts showed any real sign of scumhunting.

[Regfan]

Nacho, convince me your Kortul scum-read isn't bullshit.

[Staeg]

I completely disagree with regfan on kortul's posts bleeding towniness - they're just a stack of information and analysis that is half decent and half bullshit.

[Staeg]

Herp

Choose: Kortul

[Shinori]

##Unvote:
##Vote: Salamence

Keeping our choose where it is for now. Think salamence is most likely a better idea than BVO at the moment.

[Minimum]

Regfan, don't waste your vote.

[Regfan]

Choose: Kortul

Thanks for killing my town-read on you Staeg. Post 648 shows that Kortuls actually reading through the game super carefully looking for information, not just information to fabricate reasoning to vote people with but information that would better help him attain reads, it's a very town-motivated mindset and not one that scum take when replacing into a game. His overthrought in Post 795 about the usages of the second kill despite it being spoken by everyone prior to him comes across as him really wanting to state what's on his mind whereas as scum he'd know posting something such as that has potential for drawing fire towards him and know that there'd be no gaining in doing it. His Post 1000 is another townish-tell, previous post of his shows that he still suspects Snow despite his mason claim stating that the reasons he suspects him are still valid so him checking up on the likelihood of his claim being legitimate flavourish is very natural. His taking into account his reads on the wagons in Post 1073 is again a town-tell and his attempt to get more infromation on the bvoigt case is too. Also the fact that when reading through Shadow he didn't just state posts he disliked but also linked to one that he did in Post 1081 is a big town-tell, scum don't go into an ISO going 'how can i find them scum and town', not at all especially not when they're planning on voting the person.

[Regfan]

Regfan, don't waste your vote.

There's a few townish things in Bvoigts ISO that make me think he's town and the case on him seems a lot more 'bad player doesn't know how to contribute' rather than him being scum so not at all inclined to move there so sell me on why Salam is a good lynch right now or join me on Stefan.

[Minimum]

That's pretty much what I said on bvoigt, just fyi.

As for Salamence, see here. Stefan is not a viable lynch anyway.

[Dolorous Edd]

Vote: Stefan

Stefan is town bro. And you're basically throwing your vote away.

Kortual wagon is bad. It's distracting from the main targets.

Bvogit

/

Feysal

please.

Though I would actually also be content with greenknight for any position, and I don't particularly mind a Shadow and to a lesser extent Sala.

Also, a note, Sala was prodded, though he posted on other parts of the website after he received his prod here.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Nacho, convince me your Kortul scum-read isn't bullshit.

Regfan, convince me mine is.