NY Mafia 155 - New Age Mafia II - Game Over!

[JDodge]

vote: umoms

[JDodge]

For serious though, I'm not liking umoms complaining about a slow start while not doing anything to fix it, while also complaining about something that actually *could* speed up the start of the game (aka the agar wagon)

unvote, vote umoms

oh I can probly change my sig now huh

Can you clarify your logic a bit where you seem to be saying that he did nothing to change the slow start despite complaining about it while drawing attention to something that would speed up the start of the game? It seems a bit like you're accusing him of not bringing attention to something while bringing attention to that same thing.

[JDodge]

JD, what happened to the whole "I'll try to keep the sarcasm to a minimum" thing

When did I say that? The fuck are you even talking about? I wasn't sarcastic anyways.

JDodge, how does that last sentence follow?

Pretty damn easily if you read it.

[JDodge]

?How is "accusing [someone] of not bringing attention to something

while bringing attention to that same thing

" significant? (My emphasis.)

You're misinterpreting. I mean that he is both accusing him of bringing attention to it and not bringing attention to it simultaneously.

[JDodge]

i like this wagon a lot less now, actually, a couple of the ways people hopped onto it set off all sorts of alarms in my brain

unvote, vote: nhammen

fos: tierce

58 is a wtfbad post made up of someone trying too hard to justify his wagoning while looking "legit"

66 is fucking awful

[JDodge]

66 is fucking awful

You need to read more Stoofer games, JD~

you're not stoofer and this isn't 2007

[JDodge]

In the event that umoms does not get quicklynched (or that he gets quicklynched as town), I fully support killing nhammen. The whole "let me find a different-bad-bullshit reason to pile onto the wagon" thing is easily the scummiest vote on here.

Buuuut umom's reaction to the pressure doesn't fit. A bit of WTFery is expected, but he's just tra-la-la-ing along like it's no big deal.

He reads like he doesn't give a shit and that (assuming it is a hohum alt) is what I'd expect of a reaction from him. What makes you expect a different one? What reaction were you expecting?

[JDodge]

I mean his modded games.

PS: You are boring.

i mean, feel free to explain at any time instead of just pointing to games you're not even specifying

Yeah... I was gonna say, if it was a reaction test, umoms failed.

What exactly am I supposed to be reacting to? I couldn't really give less of a shit about a page 3 lolynch wagon.

A good start might be to actually address the reasons people think you're scummy.

there are legit reasons people think he's scummy?

wat

[JDodge]

also, UT is hardcore lurking - he's definitely around, just not posting

[JDodge]

also, UT is hardcore lurking - he's definitely around, just not posting

I can't decide how I feel about umoms.

You probably ought to start deciding on something, then.

[JDodge]

What do you think about the point I brought up about umoms?

you brought up a point about umoms? i was under the impression that he called out your bullshit and you chalked it up to wifom

[JDodge]

also as a follow-up, agar, do you have any opinion either way about any player other than umoms, rhinox, or nhammen at this point in time?

[JDodge]

Tierce's posting reads more to me like someone trying to REALLY REALLY IMPRESS US with some sort of bizarre, ill-thought out play more than it reads scum to me, tbh.

Stop trying so damn hard.

What do you think about the point I brought up about umoms?

you brought up a point about umoms? i was under the impression that he called out your bullshit and you chalked it up to wifom

nah man he whined and omgus'd me without actually addressing anything. Idk where you're coming up with this wifom you think happened but I didn't chalk anything up to wifom ever.

More importantly, why are you answering for agar?

Or if you really feel the need to answer you can at least say why you think my point was bullshit. You asked me to clarify my comment which I did. Were you not interested in the answer?

I meant to type OMGUS not WIFOM; rust.

I'm terribly fucking sorry for daring to interrupt your interrogation, sir. I'll have my resignation on your desk by Thursday.

Your comment still makes no fucking sense.

[JDodge]

Also, this redff wagon is bad and people should feel bad. That post was abysmal, but I can't for the life of me see a good anti-town angle for it. Stop confusing stupidity with suspiciousness.

[JDodge]

hey UT

how come i see you around and on scumchat and etc all night every night

but you only post when i call you on lurking, and the only thing you post is a non-committal filler post?

[JDodge]

other things of note along the lines of UT include umoms disappearing with his wagon and iaun not being around (but it seems like he's just not here more than actively not posting)

[JDodge]

I think umoms is town. His reaction to the wagon reads as town more than scum to me because I don't think newbscum would thumb their nose at pressure the way he did. I think we'll find scum as one of the dueling banjwagons that followed the breakdown of the umoms wagon, considering that we can find people trying to break up them both. Of the two, I find nhammen to be a likelier scum than Tierce.

unvote, vote nhammen

Good boy. Have a milkbone. Now try showing up when there's not a fire under your ass.

[JDodge]

...you do realize my playstyle is mostly a half-conscious cobble of the games I read, right? I lift some behaviors more or less in full.

The comment was in the sense that this was your D1 attitude in Space Monkey Mafia, and that despite your alignment there, a similar play could be useful here for town. Admittedly, I didn't think it through a lot in terms of post-event analysis.

You do realize that a playstyle that's mostly a half-conscious cobble of the games you read is absolutely useless, right? I don't want regurgitated versions of opinions and observations that someone had in a game 5 years ago - I want your opinions and observations on this game, right now. Drop the act, tell us what you really think.

What makes you think that Space Monkey, a game build entirely around being a bit of a mindfuck for the players, is a good place to lift behaviours from for a large normal game?

[JDodge]

You know what UT is really really strong scum, his latest post reads 'HI I AM STATING THE OBVIOUS TO SHOW MY CLEAR, TRANSPARENT, TOWNIE THOUGHT PROCESSES; OH AND ALSO DISREGARD THE FACT THAT THIS IS MY FIRST MEANINGFUL POST IN SEVEN PAGES.'

Anyone wanna wagon him?

I kind of like nhammen better still, but it's evening out enough that I'd be up for it.

[JDodge]

Noting that you shouldn't expect anything from me until Sunday evening due to my low likelihood of full sobriety until then.

[JDodge]

Read most of the thread. My eyes tend to gloss over paragraphs' worth of stuff, but, meh.

The last couple of pages were actually entertaining.

Anyway, tally ho.

quick THANKS FOR YOUR THRILLING INSIGHTS MADAM, quick i want to lynch that slot so badly note, quick i can't make a substantial post because my hand is killing me due to bastion speedruns, so i'll get to the actual meat of everything tomorrow prod-dodgy post.

[JDodge]

Not much that can be said about the whole Rhinox situation that hasn't already been said; I can see why one would attempt to obscure a situational immunity like that - it's dumb, to be sure, and it slowed us down and lost us days that we could have been doing something else, but I feel like we as a town keep going after stupid instead of scummy. Speaking of which,

unvote, vote: singersigner

Because I'm sick of that slot being constantly filled with people that are completely useless and not even playing the game at best to intentionally useless at worst.

[JDodge]

Other people that are around but not posting include Shea. Step it up.

[JDodge]

It fucking sickens me that we're going after someone who's legitimately inactive in umoms instead of someone who's outright refusing to play the fucking game like singer. The massclaim idea is eh, I think we have to commit to continuing it or dropping it right now before we've reached a point where we legitimately have to continue it. Rhinox probably needs to die at some point due to his claim, but I'm willing to wait to see what happens overnight before I'd commit to it.

I don't necessarily like Glork's play either but I still want to see us lynching people who are actively stalling this game as opposed to the person who came up with a dumb idea that gave them the excuse.

[JDodge]

actually just realized it's been a week on the umoms front as well after looking back, never was good with time

i'd be somewhat willing to go that route as well but i'd still prefer lynching a slot that's not contributed in the entire length of the game instead of one that hasn't been around for a week

[JDodge]

Tierce needs to step the fuck up as well.

[JDodge]

list of people who need to step the fuck up aside from those I just mentioned: izzy, iaun, stag

so basically half the game is completely useless at this point

also would like to point out redff starting the massclaim while we were still discussing it and then suggesting we stop it - that's putting up all sorts of red flags for me

[JDodge]

vt

[JDodge]

Ok mr. jaydodge, I will now be useful
Quilford, bbm and you are townreads
umoms needs to MC

Aaaand I have no real scumreads

That's not fucking useful. Contribute something, find something that you find odd, or be crushed under the bootheel of progress. I'm not going to have people sitting back and lurking in plain sight.

How about we just move on with the massclaim and agree to lynch Umoms today once we're done? Rhinox can pick someone else, and we can do this shit. The lack of activity is astounding. I have notes (already cleared like five people on massclaim-behavioral tells alone), and would really like to share them with the class when this massclaim is finally done with.

I'm not letting you set up our lynch ahead of time, and I will not go along with a umoms lynch when there are such singer better singer targets singer to singer lynch singer today singer such singer as singer singer singer. Umoms reads a lot more uninterested/busy/not present than he does scum.

list of people who need to step the fuck up aside from those I just mentioned: izzy, iaun, stag

so basically half the game is completely useless at this point

also would like to point out redff starting the massclaim while we were still discussing it and then suggesting we stop it - that's putting up all sorts of red flags for me

Yeah, my role is severely curbing my motivation to act like a townie on account of it being unnecessary since I'm not going to be lynched.

Innocent Child.

Get the fuck over it and start playing.

This is not going to work in time. Forget about popcorning.

You. Yes, you. If you look at the thread, claim.

Gaming night back later etc.

You'd better be back with some goddamned content.

[JDodge]

I'm fucking serious, though. I joined this game because it had an excellent playerlist, and I'm really pissed off that this playerlist is more interested in sitting on their ass complaining about how bored they are in scumchat than they are in posting in the goddamn game they're supposed to be playing in.

[JDodge]

I'm also going to preemptively bring up the idea that Quag has not read his role PM because I remember this being a point of contention in tree stump. Confirm/deny?

[JDodge]

To confirm you had to reply with your role, iirc. Doubtful in that case.

i confirmed with just the word confirm

[JDodge]

I'm also going to preemptively bring up the idea that Quag has not read his role PM because I remember this being a point of contention in tree stump. Confirm/deny?

Correct, I have not read my role PM. But even if I had, I still wouldn't claim.

I figured as much, just wanted at least one of the reasons out in the open. Care to give the other ones?

[JDodge]

That is against the spirit of the game.

I either want the mod to have proof that Quagmire read his role PM, or I'm replacing out. This is not a threat or a bitch fit, this is a flat-out refusal to play in a game where someone deliberately chooses to act in a way that invalidates D1 scumhunting.

This is an honor system; it's enough for me to have Quag state he read his role PM--if he actually hasn't, hell, that's something against him on an ethical level. But I will not play in these conditions, where a player says he's doing something that will affect the spirit of the game and is allowed to get away with it.

can you play in the meantime while we're working out your moral issues? we've had like 2 weeks without those and all i've seen from you is "WELL I GUESS YOU DIDN'T READ SPACE MONKEYS LOL I'M CHANNELING GLORK-SCUM".

[JDodge]

No, it's not. It's a moral issue. We're all on the same ground, but you decided you had the right to absolutely fuck up any scumhunting you do or others do on your slot during, at least, D1. I will not play in these conditions. If you will not fix this, I'm replacing out--so just say the word.

I did nothing of the sort what the fuck?

Okay well, doing a series of ISOs did the following: jd and quil solidified townreads, simenon kinda-townread, red kinda-townread, nhammen kinda-scum; UT was actually scummy as fuck and singer ain't done nothing to improve it.

unvote
vote: singer

good, now start explaining why

[JDodge]

No, it's not. It's a moral issue. We're all on the same ground, but you decided you had the right to absolutely fuck up any scumhunting you do or others do on your slot during, at least, D1. I will not play in these conditions. If you will not fix this, I'm replacing out--so just say the word.

also can you explain exactly what scumhunting you've done that's been RUINED FOREVAR by this? cause i'm kind of under the impression that you haven't really done anything this game and it's making you sound more like you're leaping on an easy way of getting out of having to do anything than i feel i should be thinking at the moment if that makes any sense

[JDodge]

this is pretty much the dumbest shit ever, as a note~

[JDodge]

EWBOP: The premise of the vote is that Quag was required to read his role PM to have confirmed. He's a lying sack of shit.

he wasn't, i confirmed via the word "confirm" so i can vouch for him not having to have stated his role to OGML, and thread was locked during confirm stage. nothing was stopping him from opening his pm and responding quickly

[JDodge]

Can't read the thread tonight, but will do tomorrow.

^

Stop spending all night on MTGO and start spending time playing or you're next in my crosshairs after singer.

[JDodge]

[JDodge]

Read most of the thread. My eyes tend to gloss over paragraphs' worth of stuff, but, meh.

The last couple of pages were actually entertaining.

Anyway, tally ho.

In any case, massclaim shitfest over and all, rereading the thread cuz I forgot everything I read already. Except that I said the last two pages before I replaced in were funny...I wonder if I'll still find them funny...

I still haven't reread, but if I'm getting lynched, I'd prefer not to. Make it quick. None of this hemming and hawing over Nhammen nonsense.

please don't replace into games you have no intention of playing in in the future pleaseandthanks

i am so glad we have such responsible people who decide to replace into a game, act like a bitch, and refuse to actually fucking read said game

[JDodge]

Quick post to note that I might be unavailable for most of the weekend (again), sorry about that folks.

[JDodge]

@JD...how do you feel about umoms?

Said this many times that he's gone from disinterested to absent; that's not indicative of anything thus I have a neutral read.

I would like to take this time to note that I believe I am developing a blind spot towards Tierce; I'm finding it too easy to excuse her behavior as her trying to impress us or trying to use knowledge that I'm not entirely sure she understands, so I'm finding it hard to justify any of her actions as scum. I'm worried that this is a problem for me going forwards.

I think nhammen has been scummy this game, and I definitely agree with Rhinox that his reaction to this has been tragically desperate, but unless I can get a list of the games nhammen has been in and for which this pattern holds true, this case is dumb.

Noting my agreement with this. You guys are going off of a pretty terrible fallacy there - note that you don't have a town VT claim with which to compare as well, and that your sample size is the hilariously insignificant 4.

I'm somewhat pleased with the way singer is responding to pressure by actually playing, even if she's not really getting anywhere and being uselessly antagonistic. NEXT TARGET ON THE ACTIVITY OR DIE LIST

unvote, vote: Bella

Time to step the fuck up, Izzy.

[JDodge]

Also need to note that I don't like the way nhammen has responded to pressure regardless of how awful the initial logic on his current wagon is. Would be willing to lynch when I'm ready to settle down on a scum target instead of a PLAY THE FUCKING GAME YOU ASSHOLES target.

[JDodge]

Also need to note that I don't like the way nhammen has responded to pressure regardless of how awful the initial logic on his current wagon is. Would be willing to lynch when I'm ready to settle down on a scum target instead of a PLAY THE FUCKING GAME YOU ASSHOLES target.

On that note, why are you still voting Bella, even if she isn't PLAYING THE FUCKING GAME? She is an Innocent Child afterall, so even as pressure/point, your vote is literally beyond useless.

symbolic, mostly; i'm committed to getting people to play this fucking game

just assume my vote is already on nhammen, in the meantime i'm not moving it even if it is pointless because you all are fucking better than this and i am severely disappointed in all of you

i am very scared about iaun claiming just cop and then psyche claiming specifically sane

[JDodge]

Oh yeah, why the fuck did JD vote Bella?

symbolic rebellion against how apparently the proper way to play a completely confirmed town role now is to sit back and do nothing

i'll have content probably later when i get home from work, very displeased with bev at the moment and may switch my one-man content crusade over to him when i return

[JDodge]

I'd also like to take a moment to restate how fucking annoying it is that we have an amazing player list and yet it feels like only 3 of us seem to be putting forward any level of actual effort in playing this game.

[JDodge]

Feel like I need to commit to a wagon now with deadline coming closer so

unvote, vote: singersigner

while I finish writing this post/mess around with other stuff and forget and whatnot, with the general note that I feel it equally likely that singer and nhammen are both scum but prefer this wagon because A) it's larger and B) I think if we're wrong nhammen (who's been actively defending himself) will be of more use based on play so far than singer (who has been outright refusing to play and being a bitch about it) will.

Quick note that I plan on paying special attention in the post I'm writing to a scumlist of nhammen, singer, and Tierce.

[JDodge]

I'm going to start out this post by noting that this is a bit of a cash-out of all my current opinions; I feel I'm a bit of a likely target amongst vanillas and feel that any potential inv-immune SKs have a higher incentive to go after strong players than any of the power roles on the board at the moment (if I'm remembering them properly) so I'd rather make 150% sure we have my opinions out fully. Players I would like to see commit to stances on as many people as possible on under the same line of thought include Glork and Quag (aforementioned two other people in the game who seem to be putting forth effort).

Thus this is going to be a long wall of text outlining every little thought I have on every single player in the game in hopes of not only what I just said but also in hopes of getting people to post actual fucking content instead of fucking around whining about how massclaim was a bad idea.

So!

1. umoms/McStab - Promised us a catchup post 2 days ago, hasn't done anything.

Mod: prod/replace plz

not anything worth noting, think one player's lost interest and his replacement's just fucking useless.

2. Glork - Never been able to read, never will be able to read. I think massclaim was a bad idea in hindsight, was kind of apathetic about the idea when it came up so I suppose I can't complain too much about it. I'm not willing to just say that he's town, but my general thought pattern leans that way and at least he's fucking trying to participate.

3. Quagmire - Think nothing he's posted today is indicative of his alignment due to the role PM thing, think he's earnestly trying to play the game in a game full of people who seem more interested in fucking around and thus feel that's commendable.

4. Tierce - Her entire posting today has consisted of two things. It start with a fucking awful gambit... thing that she outright said she was "channeling Glork-scum" for and attributed to a game from 5 fucking years ago. I would like to note how many bad feelings this post:

It's a difficult pick between being called scummy and trying too hard.

gives me. She shows up when she's pressured on now and the rest of the time sits back and coasts - the closest she's come to not doing that was her little replace-threat thing. She keeps offering sort of opinions here and there, saying X is scum or Y is scum in ways that scream "I have a reason for this" but doesn't seem to actually give any reasoning or anything else. It's one thing to say "how can you miss this opportunistic bullshit" and it's one thing to say why the bullshit is opportunistic in the first place - here's a hint, one of those two helps the town, and it's not the one she's picking. Her reasoning in the post after doesn't seem to follow up on opportunistic bullshit - her explanation of "he should be happier!" doesn't really make sense if you consider that perhaps he realizes he's human and maybe realizes he made a mistake at some point.

More content, less acting like you know everything, half-lurking, and threatening to replace out plz. Possible to likely scum IMO, but probably equally as likely worried that she's going to get attacked if she posts any actual opinions since she's been met with a lot of hostility with what she's posted so far.

5. UT/singer - UT's posting can best be described as "showing up when I yelled at him for not being active despite being around". Singer's posting can best be described as someone who refuses to play the game until a massclaim that's going on is over, refuses to claim as part of the massclaim, and all-around acts like a complete bitch to everyone. I feel that she's tied for most likely scum suspect with nhammen, and feel that if this is going to be the quality of her posting as town then we ought just get her out of the way now since she's not going to be helpful later either. I am supremely fucking disappointed in you, I expect better.

6. Bella - the only person who we can be certain of the alignment of. Is doing fucking nothing with it. I am especially disappointed in you, Izzy. You are the most important person in this game right now because you're the only confirmed - your opinion is worth (at least in my eyes) 20x the opinion of anyone else in the game, and you're refusing to actually give it. Please, step it up.

7. Rhinox - I can't read him in a different sense more in the fact that his posts are literally incomprehensible lines full of weird-ass logical leaps and poor conclusions. That being said, I think he's fairly likely town at this point because I don't think the way he's acted so far makes sense from a scum perspective.

8. nhammen - Oh dear

god

is this guy either scum or bad at this game. His reactions to any sort of pressure read like a deer caught in the headlights. His every argument is like a train derailed and smashed into the law offices of Dumn & Asse - a sort of clinical incompetence surrounding people flailing around in the wreckage trying to decide if they want to sue someone or if the baked potato that just insulted them is some sort of delirium-induced hallucination. He sort of drew an arbitrary line on when it's odd people weren't starting wagons while random voting, and has proceeded to just make a bungling mess out of every defense he's tried to make.

The only reason I'm not on his wagon over singer's is that it seems like he's actually trying even if he is completely incompetent at it.

9. scooby - I have no clue, tbh. Just going to skip over this one la la la la la la

10. IAUN/Psyche - I feel that IAUN's supposed catch was complete bullshit, that psyche needs to start posting, and that analyzing him is actually pointless today (less pointless tomorrow) due to the cop claim.

11. AGar - I really, really like his posts when he makes them and wish he would make more of them. Leaning heavily pro-town on him.

12. Stag - Is fucking useless and I'll be looking at him a lot heavier tomorrow.

13. Shea/bv310 - I liked Shea's posting a good deal. I don't like bev's posting at all, and feel that he's been around way more than his activity would suggest.

I am going to put this in big letters for him:

Dear bev, start posting or I will find some way of making my way to Canada and uninstalling MTGO/LoL for you. You have a commitment to this game that you are not fulfilling.

- JD

14. redFF - Is now hyperlurking after his illustrious opening gameplay of fuck all on a stick.

15. Quilford - I like his posts when he posts but feel he's been disappearing a lot, although tbh he might just not be making much of an impression on me and fading into the background noise half the time.

16. SIMSIM <3 - Again, like his posts, but don't feel there's enough of them. We'll see if things pick up once his access improves.

17. Primate - Comes across as being not around much and quite good when he is around, so hopefully he'll be around more in future days instead of just not existing.

18. Flameaxe - I'm giving you a free pass until your semester is over, but once that happens, gloves are off and you're going right into the list of people I am annoyed with alongside bev and Stag if you don't start existing as a player.

19. JDodge - HI I'M DAISY

[JDodge]

as a note, sorry if that post wasn't better/wasn't as in-depth as i'd have liked it, had a hard day today

[JDodge]

I don't see why we're deciding that the VT pool is a better pool to lynch from than the pool made up of players that refused to post content due to massclaim then refused to claim during massclaim and have done fuck all all fucking day.

[JDodge]

vote: singersigner

see no reason to doubt that psyche is a cop and would suggest that if singer has a reason for being so completely obtuse about everything that she should have claimed it instead of dancing around it; people's willful ignorance of the fact that she refused to participate in the massclaim and is now dancing around a supposed reason she has to doubt a claimed cop result without just giving it is bizarre to me (i would also argue that the way she both avoided massclaim while hinting at a role and then used that to start to worm out of this today without actually claiming anything is an impressive idea in theory if executed poorly)

i would like for psyche to actually start playing the game instead of just acting like a pompous moron; i'd put a high chance down that he's going to die tonight, so i'd like his thoughts

before

the day ends

either way, i still don't see a downside to lynching singer although her posts at the end of yesterday made me seriously consider how much i was tunnel-visioning (and have made me to an extent realize that i've spent more time bitching at other people for content instead of making content)

stag is also a contradictory idiot but not innately suspicious

i wouldn't mind a tierce lynch but think that's a tomorrow move not a today move unless something completely earth-shattering comes out


homework for some of you:

AGAR - did you shoot quilford; if so da fuck, if not why didn't you shoot (or shoot our bodyguard, or get roleblocked by the roleblocker in which case i say let's lynch stag tomorrow)
BEV - did you investigate and if not why the fuck didn't you (and if so who)
STAG - who did you block
TIERCE - who do you presently find suspicious and why
EVERYONE ELSE - what possible reason would a claimed cop have for lying on day 2 in a massclaimed game, and more importantly what possible reason would a claimed cop have for lying on day 2 of a massclaimed game

when it's highly likely that their only night result will come from that night due to the lack of protective roles

, with a guilty nonetheless? seriously, that's some fucked logic you guys are trying to use there

this is important information that needs to come out before the end of the day

[JDodge]

i would also like to ask singer why the fuck if she has a role that interferes with cop investigations and was clearly public enemy #2 yesterday and logic would dictate that today is the

only

day that we'll get results out of the cop

why the fuck she didn't claim so yesterday

. think about it, people, she's lying out her ass

[JDodge]

i mean really, if she's town she's just massively fucked the town over with her horrible fucking play and i get angrier the more i keep thinking of it

[JDodge]

tl;dr: While "you can't possibly have a guilty on me" can come from town, the "there is no way you actually

investigated

me seems contrived." Her reaction is terrible, and she is a very unlikely Framer target. Are you investigation immune

and

town? If so, why not claim it yesterday, since that can fuck with cops?

cause she doesn't actually have anything other than not wanting to get lynched

JDodge: Frankly I don't have proper reads atm, I didn't read the game during night. Will get to them today/tomorrow, but from memory, several of the late votes on nhammen seemed quite town, I don't see much reason for a bus at that stage.

I find your continued lack of opinions quite disturbing.

[JDodge]

EBWOP: Well, Tierce isn't confirmed technically, but she's not group scum.

Also, in te event that this lynch turns out to be a terrible idea, we're back to killing Simenon tomorrow, and I'm probably going to go into full on SHUT THE FUCK UP AND DO WHAT I TELL YOU TO DO mode.

I'm not going to let you do SHUT THE FUCK UP AND DO WHAT I TELL YOU TO DO mode, so be prepared work with this town cause I'm not going to let us be railroaded.

I want to lynch Rhinox tomorrow half for his play and half for his claim. It's pretty fucking weird to have a faction-specific immune town neighbor; seems like less of a stretch to have a serial killer neighbor. I feel the lack of a second kill is explainable by (if there is an SK) the SK targeting either Primate or Primate's target (I'd assume that Primate's target was Psyche; if so, then we can assume that the serial killer doesn't have immunity to standard investigations) moreso than it is by Stag blocking whoeverthefuck it was he blocked.

[JDodge]

I'd also like to note my increasing apathy towards this game due to the fact that it still feels like only 3 (4 now that hoops is here) of us are actually willing to play it. I'd like to again note how extremely and incredibly pissed off I am at Izzy for being confirmed fucking town and using that as an excuse to just skate through the fucking game, and would like to ask her if she's not willing to play to ask for a replacement so we can actually get someone who's willing to be here into that slot. I'd like to again note how pissed off I am at Tierce for posting lots of fluff and not any substance. I'd like to again note how pissed off I am at bev for spending more time playing on MTGO or whatever than paying attention to this game, only showing up when he's either called upon or has something big to react to. I'd like to note my incredibly annoyance with Sim/BBM for their limited access stuff. I'd like to note my annoyance that it's taken this fucking long for people to wake the fuck up on singer

to the point where they were more willing to assume our claimed cop was lying than lynch her

, because it makes me feel like all the effort I'm putting into this game is completely and utterly fucking wasted. I'd like to note how dumb it was of AGar to shoot Quil and how sickly that makes me feel in general about our town's chances of winning. I'd like to note how completely fucking useless Stag is.

I'd like to lynch red, scooby or Rhinox tomorrow.

Sorry guys for running out of fucks to give.

[JDodge]

Also sorry if I sound really weird and post less but I'm having a rough couple of weeks so I'm not in the best state of mind right now.

[JDodge]

The thing is, I didn't believe psyche's guilty until singer went "JUST IN CASE I GET A LYNCH ON THE DUDE GOING AND HE FLIPS COP, DIS BE EXCUSE OK?"

Can anyone explain why there was ever a good reason to disbelieve Psyche, because it seems pretty fucking obvious both in the first place and essentially in hindsight that he's just a massive tool.

FINALLY IZZY HAS JOINED US IN PLAYING, REJOICE GUYS

[JDodge]

:/

I really didn't

know

it was thar important to say stuff like that in my first post. I mean, you guys should've known I'd scanned someone last night.

I'm sorry if that makes me a terrible person who should feel terrible.

IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER WHETHER OR NOT WE KNOW YOU SCANNED SOMEONE, IT MATTERS WHO THE FUCK YOU SCANNED AND WHAT YOUR FUCKING RESULT IS.

stop being such a fucking douche and start acting as part of the town. as of now your only contribution to this game is that you actually pulled your head out of your ass for long enough to submit a night action.

[JDodge]

One kill N1 (+ Quilford-AGar), one kill N2--those scooby votes make no sense.

As easily explainable by two anti-town parties killing the cop on N2 and the cop not dying on N1 due to successful roleblock. I still think it reasonable to assume that there's another potential killing party on the cards but think it's unreasonable to act on that line of thought until tomorrow night now that the obvious NK targets have exhausted themselves (with the potential exception of Stag-if-town).

Speaking of which, thinking over the night has lead me to not want to go after Tierce; I don't think she's by any stretch cleared, but I do think that she's cleared enough to not warrant going after today.

Vote: Staeg

because the way he's acted in regards to his results are fucking weird. He claims to have roleblocked Tierce last night when acting purely from a logical standpoint she is

literally

the worst target he could have picked aside from Psyche/Bella. He took a good delay yesterday before claiming his target of scooby - and, based on his vote today, still suspects scooby enough to start out voting him

but decided to target the semi-cleared person instead

. His actions around his night actions are fucking weird.

I've decided that I less find Rhinox actually suspicious and more have a great dislike for his play and think his claim is fucking janky as shit.

I'd love to hear an explanation for that vote, considering that bv claimed gunsmith and cleared me N1.

I cleared you from being scum, but not from being Serial Killer. That said, I really doubt that scum +SK shot the same two nights in a row

vote: Simenon

Why? We have a claimed cop on the board and no guarantee of SK night-immunity. The idea of an SK shooting at the cop 2 nights in a row, however, only works on the assumption that scooby is an SK due to assumed Primate-protect; the only other possible explanation is one shoots Primtarget and other shoots Prim (or both shoot Prim) which feel like serious logic fails on whomever's part.

I don't see the case on Simenon; I'm pretty damn apathetic about the whole thing. Bev, state case on Simenon now.

[JDodge]

I really doubt Staeg would act that irresponsible as scum and risk the night strategy with poor daystart.

More sim votes please.

I want to force his head into the game so I can get a better look at it. Pressure's going to be the best way of doing so.

Go ahead and state your case on Sim, too. Now that we're in D3 with 2 nights worth of info I'm shifting my activity ass-ridin' over to people making statements about wanting to lynch someone without content on why. Time to really start playing, folks.

[JDodge]

It's almost like he changed his mind over the course of the day and continued to be suspicious of nhammen while thinking singer was a better lynch or something.

Why aren't you going after me too, then?

[JDodge]

because your posts are town?

i really hadn't noticed you did the same thing... I usually dont iso my town reads but basically asking why I dont suspect you?, just made you painfully town

"Because your posts are town" is a complete line of bullshit and you know it. The reason why I am apathetic to a Simenon lynch while continuing to lean town on my reads on him are because his posts seem to follow almost exactly the same line of logic mine do while also being consistent with a lack of access on his part - and I see no reason for him to lie about access problems. You guys are going to have to do better than "because your posts are town and his aren't" when for the most part we've been saying the same exact things all game. So far the only real differences I can find are:

1. I've been more angry and in general more focused on getting town activity up;

2. He disliked my (self-admittedly) pointless vote on Izzy;

3. He said he wanted to look into a you/Quag lynch today whereas I said I wanted to look into you/red/Rhinox (now Stag/you/red).

Vote: Staeg because the way he's acted in regards to his results are fucking weird. He claims to have roleblocked Tierce last night when acting purely from a logical standpoint she is literally the worst target he could have picked aside from Psyche/Bella. He took a good delay yesterday before claiming his target of scooby - and, based on his vote today, still suspects scooby enough to start out voting him but decided to target the semi-cleared person instead. His actions around his night actions are fucking weird.

This delay was caused by me waiting for the mod to see if my action went through (I missed the deadline by a bit and yeah). Re: blocking tierce - I forgot that she's cleared.

Then you're at best a fucking useless idiot and I still see no downside to lynching you other than numbers if I'm wrong.

[JDodge]

basically same line of logic doesnt mean shit... regardless of alignment, everyone can have the same opinion on individual scumminess

i hunt motivations, subconscious tells, consistence, posting styles. its painfully obvious I would prefer 1000x a sim lync other than your lynch just based on aggressiveness.

i dont plan to be an smartass or anything, just let you know Ill play whatever the the fuck I want to play

cool

unvote, vote scooby

[JDodge]

Bev - Worthless for the most part, but I'm seeing the claim as townish for now. This read leans to the null side of townreads.

I think bev's been turning into a really strong player and would be a very good asset to the town if he would just

fucking say more

instead of waiting for the opportunity to influence things falls on him.

[JDodge]

I'm going to go ahead with a bold assertion and say that Quag shouldn't claim unless his claim will have an incredibly obvious immediate benefit to the town; I believe securely in his towniness and feel that bit of uncertainty that we can have over the scum is quite nice at this point.

[JDodge]

As easily explainable by two anti-town parties killing the cop on N2 and the cop not dying on N1 due to successful roleblock. I still think it reasonable to assume that there's another potential killing party on the cards but think it's unreasonable to act on that line of thought until tomorrow night now that the obvious NK targets have exhausted themselves (with the potential exception of Stag-if-town).

That's my point; it makes no sense to go after scooby for a claimed roleblock on him when we're not even certain if there are multiple killers in play aside from AGar. He can be scum, but that'd be a weird reason to vote him.

Nobody at any point said they were voting Scooby for the roleblock N1. What the fuck are you talking about?

she's not saying that, she's commenting on a percieved (although unintended) implication in my post that people were

[JDodge]

Shameless prod-dodge, content coming tomorrow.

you said that yesterday

STEP UP SON

[JDodge]

Also dodging a prod. I need to review Sim. His strong favoring of a singer lych over a nham lynch isn't as egregious anymore.

Noteworthy: Scooby was one of the very last people voting for

neither

nham nor singer.

How was it egregious for him and not egregious for other people doing the exact same fucking thing? This is a question that nobody has been able to actually answer and I'm starting to find it extremely annoying.

[JDodge]

Why favor a goon over another goon? That's not remarkable in any manner.
(I'm also failing to see whether you mean "egregious" as "good" or "bad"; you people have a stupid language.)

it's still pretty obvious given context, start reading more thoroughly

[JDodge]

Scum reads on AGar, Rhinox... and Glork's given me a bad gut all game long.

AGar is a confirmed killer - how can you classify him as mafia?

There's no way Glork proposes massclaim as scum here. I think it's obvious he did it because he believed town could get an edge from it, rather than trying to secure town credit from the ploy. If he were to do it as scum, he'd probably have to warn his buddies pregame and plan for it - because you really risk trapping your buddies if they react badly or claim poorly (like singer did). So, if they did plan for it pregame, why would singer fuck up so badly D1?

There's a slight theoretical possibility of some form of dual scumteams still on the table as well. I think we're not really as prepared for today as we are for tomorrow if that makes any sense.

[JDodge]

Rhinox is town. He's trying to shoehorn a scumread in, regardless of night results that make his theory outlandish--he's not afraid to present them. I've been in that position; scum don't really do Wild Mass Guessing, it's something town do because town is not afraid they'll be laughed at. The extra information scum have on who their buddies are and what power they have (especially in this setup) means they're not too likely to make this kind of insane speculation, because it would simply be too out of left-field and they think it would be dismissed with laughter.
With a lot fewer players, when the game is on the line, it's a different thing, but the fact he's doing it now says town.

scum engage in wild mass guessing all the time to create more confusion and attempt to push through lynches on targets that they don't want on the board/easy targets

your tell is more one of he's either pushing ineffectively or is making insane claims, and is not indicative of alignment

i will start posting more once i stop having these horrible horrible headaches

[JDodge]

(note that in the eventual case of a SK being in the game, town means not-mafia; I am completely incapable of finding SK-tells)
Hoopla town.
Glork null-town.
Quagmire scum (it's mainly a mix of gut and him just brickwalling any attempts to lynch scum (unsuccessfully) - D1 his read on nhammen is town-town-null-interesting-ogod its deadline better hammer). He also kinda contradicts himself - in post 807 he says that iaun caught nhammen, but beforehand he'd said that he doesn't actually believe the catch. Quagmire gunsmith claim doesn't give me any sort of vibe at all (could be done by either alignment).
Tierce null (but town due to bev town).
Rhinox null-town.
Scooby null-scum (general not having done anything followed by some more of that; also dislike his votes).
Agar very town.
Bev very town.
Red town.
Simenon null (I reviewed it and the relational tells are kinda eeeh).
BBM null-scum (the doing-nothing followed by the horrible case on rhinox). Was initially gut-town, but that feeling's faded. In case of Quag-scum, BBM-scum becomes a lot more likely.
JD town.

Why the fuck are you voting Simenon if you have a null read on him but a scum read on Quag, especially when you believe that Quag-scum makes another more likely to be scum (and thus his lynch gives more information to you than a lynch on Simenon would)?

Wake the fuck up or die.

[JDodge]

JD, why do you keep parking fairly useless votes (Bella, Staeg) on people?

How is Stag a useless vote at this point considering that at this point he's either ridiculously ineffectual and not paying attention or scum?

I explained the Izzy vote. I am still not satisfied with her contribution. I want her opinions out because she's a likely NK target at some point in time before endgame.

[JDodge]

VOTE: Rhinox

- The claim is pretty much a safe-claim for scum that gets him out of the vanilla pool since the only way to disprove it is making him dead.

How is "mafia-immune neighbor", which I've decided is the

entire reason

why I suspect him as a note (and thus why I'm not comfortable with him being lynched today when we have the luxury of getting rid of suspicious dead weight instead of people who are posting actively), a safe claim for scum because "it can't be disproved unless he's dead"? Do you know how much of a weird area that puts him into as a claim? There are literally only two situations in which that claim exists - both require it being true. It's way too out there to consider as a "safe-claim that gets him out of the vanilla pool".

- D1 he'd rather lynch Singer over Nham. D2, when a guilty is in play, he'd rather not lynch Singer and instead question the guilty.

I put that down to the entire town seeming to catch the retard bug overnight that made them think that the fucking cop gambiting at the start of day 2 having claimed on day 1 was more fucking likely than him having a guilty result on a likely investigation target.

- Distracts himself from posting real shit to get into a fight over whether fake V/LAs are ethical or not. Not even touching that with a 20 foot pole other than this is time wasted posting non-content.

What are your thoughts on Tierce?

- Jumps on the lazy scooby wagon, showing no real effort to give any fucks about who is lynched today (If Rhinox is scum, scooby is pretty much guaranteed town).

Feel free to back up how Rhinox being scum makes scooby town.

[JDodge]

Glork get your ass off of LoL and start posting. Same to Izzy. Same to bev (again). It's like pulling teeth trying to get this fucking town to work.

I will settle for a scooby or red lynch today because I want to trim people who are at most dead weight as town and at worse are scum. I see absolutely no reason to lynch anyone else when we have such a massive advantage off of our days 1/2. It is those two that I am willing to go for because nobody seems to be willing to go for Stag and pushing on Izzy is fucking pointless.

[JDodge]

What exactly are the objections to a Stag lynch?

I dunno, probably the claim. Just seems like people aren't that willing to go for him and I don't really have the willpower to fight for that right now because I'm continuing to lose all interest in a game with a stellar playerlist that'd rather be playing something else.

[JDodge]

The claim is a stupid reason to ignore the fact that he's scummy as all hell and should be dead already.

I agree, but I can't seem to bring myself to give enough of a shit to do anything about it anymore. I'm half-considering asking for replacement so that hopefully we can get someone who's still interested in playing this game into my slot, cause I'm really not anymore and I'm playing like shit.

[JDodge]

unvote
Vote: Quagmire

I was in a hurry when I made that post, so uhh, sorry, I guess?

BULL FUCKING SHIT.

You're either waiting until

day fucking three

to come up with some fucking opinions or you're talking out of your ass and I am sick and fucking tired of it.

Unvote, vote: Stag

Sticking here until you either all wake the fuck up or the day is over. I'm sick of this shit being let slide by.

[JDodge]

I had planned to make that post all day and when I finally stopped procrastinating, something showed up which cut my time off by 30 minutes, which then led me to clicking submit because I'd already missed my own set deadline (which was yesterday) and I didn't want to procrastinate until after I'd returned from the doctor. So, which part of it is bullshit?

The fact that you're either taking until day 3 to start having some goddamn opinions or the fact that that entire post is bullshit because it took you until

my prompting

for you to move your vote over to someone you were actually fucking suspicious of.

[JDodge]

And the fact that if you are waiting until day 3 to have some goddamn opinions, you're throwing them together in 10 fucking seconds and not bothering to give any form of rationale, content, or reason whatsoever.

[JDodge]

This is way consistent with Stagscum, too, on top of all the other things that make him worth lynching.

Explain

[JDodge]

Okay well, doing a series of ISOs did the following: jd and quil solidified townreads, simenon kinda-townread, red kinda-townread, nhammen kinda-scum; UT was actually scummy as fuck and singer ain't done nothing to improve it.

unvote
vote: singer

This was the post where I first compiled a list of reads after doing an ISO of every single player. I didn't list the null reads.
The reads I posted earlier today were the other time I've given actual reads. The townreads don't have any rationale behind them because they don't

need

rationale unless they're about to be lynched. The scumreads have all the rationale I have to give and it's enough. I didn't throw them together in 10 seconds, it was more like 40 minutes.

Which part of "I had to go, didn't think of the vote part" did you miss, again?

PE: izzy, no, stop.

Because you paying attention to the fucking game is important and we don't need a player who we can expect almost fucking nothing from maybe once per day.

If that's you taking 40 minutes to play this game, find a different fucking game to play.

[JDodge]

Go install MTGO or play more LoL like all the other people in the town who aren't participating.

[JDodge]

JD, question. Would you say that you play more by your gut or by logic?

Neither.

[JDodge]

The thing is, what you're doing now is basically saying that I should spend way more time on this game. Doing what? Reading so deep into people's posts that my laptop's screen breaks, to have a ~0.0037% chance of finding scum through something I hadn't noticed before? To go meta every single game of all players and look for any possible patterns in their play? Well, I suppose that could work, but that would take me about 150 hours to do, so yeah no. Should I spend more time making posts along the lines of "Ok, this player who is actually scum isn't scum, here, have a better target"? Should I fly to OGML's house, sell everything I own, hire a bit of muscle and beat OGML to near-death so that he gives me daycop powers?

Give some actual content and actual reasons. "Gut" doesn't cut it in a game that isn't filled with complete morons.

[JDodge]

i honestly don't care if we lynch derp play at the moment, i'd rather have the info free-flowing when it matters than dealing with a group of people that'll be like getting blood from a stone that may or may not be scum

there's a bit of an assumption that since stag claimed roleblocker he must be a roleblocker

[JDodge]

Also, I'm having second thoughts on JD. His "RAWR BE ACTIVE AND DO WORK" crusade is getting to the point where I feel like he's been no less helpful to

actual scumhunting

than some of the people he is calling out. Whining and bitching about Izzy, me, et al has made for a great smokescreen of not actually trying to push a lynch on his prime scum suspects.

Maybe it's just paranoia. But it's been bothering me since yesterday when I started paying attention to the game again.

I'll be the first to say I'm playing like shit right now. I'm pissed off at most of the people in this game, I don't have any solid reads because I feel like the people who are actually contributing at the moment are town, and I feel like my decisions are starting to be based more on getting rid of people I just don't want to deal with the fucking idiocy of any longer. I've also been suffering really, really fucking awful headaches on and off over the past week and a half or so - it's easy for me to be angry with people for not posting and harder to scumhunt when it hurts to actually think - and that is also affecting me.

I wouldn't even necessarily say that my prime scum suspects are entirely suspicious because they

aren't playing the fucking game

. I'd almost go as far to say that I'm practically just going off of the lynch all lurkers idea right now - we have mislynches and despite what Tierce says about it being day 3, we have plenty of room for policy cleanup at this stage.

Bev, that's your first post since Monday, which was essentially you just saying you were prod-dodging. Step the fuck up or ask for a replacement if you're too busy, because I believe you're town too solidly to want to just lynch you for it.

[JDodge]

And don't you dare for a second say that I'm bitching and not pushing my prime suspects. You were right up until she flipped more ready to believe our fucking cop was lying than believe me when I said UT/singer was scum from day fucking one.

[JDodge]

Doesn't anyone else think it's at least

slightly

suspicious we have a mafia-NK-immune player in a game with zero evidence of an SK and only one

one-shot

vigilante? I don't even know what Rhinox has done that's scummy (outside of refusing to jump on scooby a few posts above), but that's a giant red flag in itself.

it's pretty much my entire basis for assuming there is another anti-town killing party that we just haven't seen yet (lack of evidence is explainable by a lack of investigation immunity), actually

[JDodge]

My account is fixed! Time for a last thoughts sort of thing since I've been forced to ask for a replacement due to a change in my work schedule this coming weekend and a general lack of interest.

Firstly, completely forgot about deadline - wasn't around because I was doing other shit and missed stuff. The Flameaxe wagon out of nowhere was fucking awful.

Secondly,

vote: redFF

on the way out. The fact that he keeps asking why I'm annoyed when we've caught scum the first two days and continued uberlurking are indicative that he has no interest in actually scumhunting at best, which makes him a safe lynch. Scooby wagon is good. Rhinox wagon is fucking awful given his posts over the past couple of days. Stag's play was disgustingly bad and I take that idea with me on the way out; my initial plan was to wait until later and change more towards deadline when it actually, 100% mattered.

Hoops is town. Quag is increasingly worrying.

[JDodge]

(10:19:36 PM) ahallucinogenic: i would like to take this time to note two things
(10:19:43 PM) ahallucinogenic: 1. that was what i consider my best scum play ever
(10:20:10 PM) ahallucinogenic: 2. my frustration with that game was completely and 100% genuine and glork's point that i wasn't saying much of anything while bitching about people being inactive is bullshit
(10:20:15 PM) ahallucinogenic: because i didn't have anything
(10:20:17 PM) ahallucinogenic: to fucking comment on
(10:20:21 PM) ahallucinogenic: because nobody was saying anything

don't give a shit what the official word is, i won this game

[JDodge]

I just want to know, did any of the scum know I was a traitor?

I played like shit, not proud of this game at all. Just in general, I can't play as scum. I don't know what to do, and I don't know how to get better at it, I don't know how I'm supposed to interact with the town as scum, or how to interact with scum partners, and it didn't help being scum but not being able to converse with the scum team at all. I wasn't inactive due to apathy, I was inactive because I literally couldn't type anything without being so transparently scum apparently. I just didn't know what to say. Pretty much consider me retired due to just not being able to play this game anymore.

i'm retired due to the fact that none of the cool people are actually willing to play in games they're in

\o/

[JDodge]

as was the stagnation near the start

and the middle

and the parts in between