NY 160B - Welcome to Castle Zar - TIME FOR FIREWORKS!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I like how you didn't vote anyone but Joh outside of RVS and you're saying my voting pattern sucks...

[Baby Spice]

Vote: AA

You need help.

RVS vote was an early bandwagon vote with what appears to be an insult. What's to like?

Vote: Empire

/serious vote.

Poor vote on player who made an obv town vote. No reason given, but again a bandwagon vote. When pressed a rubbish reason given. What's to like?

Mmm empiretown.

Vote: Mehdi

Blatant bandwagon vote. Admitted blatant bandwagon vote. Don't think you ever gave a reason. Again, what's to like.

Then the dbl voter stunt. There is nothing to like about that.

You spent D1 jumping onto bandwagons and apparently not caring what your read on the wagon actually was. Once you admitted to not reading the game before jumping on a wagon. Even putting out there that you thought Medhi was going to flip town.

You give every appearance of not caring who got lynched D1, and there is no way that that is a voting record to like.
and a voting record that can't be liked puts you towards the scumside.

Vote: MoI

This is happening.

You're only decent vote, since you actually interacted with him. Until I noticed that I'm your highest scumspect that is. Or that NS is your number two. Why vote your number three?

[roflcopter]

baby spice can die after moi. and deasvail.

[Empire]

Ugh, waiting for certain people to check back into the thread before I wordvomit.

[DeasVail]

Rofl, do you have a good reason for ignoring me?

[roflcopter]

Rofl, do you have a good reason for ignoring me?

yes, because your questions have been nigh worthless

but fine, i'll humor you

mehdi being town means that your dancing around the edges of the wagon (oh, yes you should claim! oh, no that wasn't an intent to hammer!) is even scummier. it also makes moi's refusal to take part in the wagon while leaving his useless unsubstantiated vote with no attempt to garner support scummy. as has been pointed out by other, better spoken voices than mine.

so kindly shush until its your turn to be lynched, thank you

[DeasVail]

The reason for me-scum feels contrived.

[roflcopter]

The reason for me-scum feels contrived.

calling something "contrived" as a defense feels contrived

[Zar]

The Castle Crypts were dug underneath the Dungeons and consist of the greatest part of the underground floors of the building, extending beyond the Dungeons and the Castle storage rooms. All bodies of the members of the Zar family were exhumed from the Old cemetery within the woods and transfered to the crypts to prevent vandalism of their sacred lairs. It is believed that some the sightings of specters in the forest belong to the souls whose peaceful rest was disturbed during the relocation of their remains.

Day 2, Votecount 3

MagnaOfIllusion (3): Ser Arthur Dayne, roflcopter, Konowa

BabySpice (1): Johhog
Johhog (1): BabySpice
Kingmaker (1): Tammy
SnowStorm (1): DeasVail

Not Voting (5):

SnowStorm, Kingmaker, Empire, MagnaofIllusion, Nobody Special

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline

: Thursday, January 5th, 2013 12:15 PM New York Time. (GMT-5)

Countdown to deadline

: (expired on 2013-01-05 12:15:00)

Nobody Special is V/LA until Thursday

Ser Arthur Dayne is V/LA until Thursday

Johhog is V/LA until Saturday

[Konowa]

I can get behind MoI.

Vote: MagnaOfIllusion

rofl, why is DV scum? I'm not seeing it.

I take this question back. I think I was being slightly blinded by some confirmation bias as I would have expected scum DV to pick up 433 and run with it Today. The fact that he didn't made me slight town read him. However, after 605 and 606 I take that back.

Johhog, how does gut fit into MoI largely ignoring the Mehdi wagon, other than to criticize Dayne for trying to debase it after his [Dayne] L-2 vote on Mehdi? He spent some time discussing -your- reactions to Mehdi, but never bridged over to Mehdi himself. Most of D1 was spent with discussion revolving around Mehdi and MoI didn't have anything to say about Mehdi's alignment other than it would be pro-town to use the quote function. I don't think I've ever played with MoI as scum, but town MoI I've played with has always had his fingers in the pudding.

[DeasVail]

Ok, this is ridiculous.

[roflcopter]

let me get this straight dv. by saying my reason for calling you scum feels "contrived," are you implying you think i'm scum?

second question, why did you need me to elaborate on my scum read of you? so far you haven't actually said what you've learned from my explanation, and it sure as hell doesn't seem like you're actually trying to figure out anybody's alignment.

third question, why did you insist i include reasons for moi as well, when you then totally ignored what i said about moi?

[DeasVail]

I think it's scummy, because it's the kind of reason that you could say regardless of Mehdi's alignment, and I think it's just mentioning something that you consider to be bad, and saying it's scummy without actually thinking about what it means alignment-wise.

I'm still not sure about you, however, because despite scum always suspecting me and this extra thing, your posting does generally seem townish and others have said you are like this as town.

My question was because of you going 'MoI and DV are scum with Mehdi!' and then the next day 'MoI and DV are scum anyway!' just seemed like you planned to have us as scumreads all along. The reason you had for me supported this, but as I said above, I'm still not sure about you. The MoI reason is fine and something I agree with (although I think he's town for other reasons), but I think he still needs to answer my question.

I haven't said any of this yet because it's not really saying anything and I'm still deciding on my read.

[SnowStorm]

Also it's weird that snowstorm never made a comment on kingmaker, especially with how lacking kingmakers play has been. This is somewhat worrisome.

Kingmaker's play is usually lackluster, especially on day 1... So it wasn't really worth commenting on, unless we had Mehdi's flip, because it was a post I could see him do if Mehdi were innocent. Now that we're sure of that, here's the post:

As he has the highest post count, I'm starting with Mehdi.

His early stuff is meh. Interaction with Johhog is not making my read about him better. I don't know why he is taking vig direction thing so seriously though, I assumed it was a joke. Anyway, vig power belongs to vig(assuming there is one, of course) and it is his decision. I'm okay with vig shooting anyone who is not VPI/CI.

Only thing made me worry was his high activity, since mafia usually avoids it, especially at first day. But since he said his town and mafia play are not so different(IIRC), I can count that off too.

I'm okay with Mehdi lynch, and I can hammer after I finish all of my reads.

It was the first of his reads and the most complete. I find it suspicious that he picked Mehdi as his first read not because he was the top suspect but because he had the highest post count. It sounds like he was trying to make it look like he was posting his reads in an order as to not look opportunistic. I also don't like the read. The vig comment is fluff, lots of people commented on it, but he only brings it up in Mehdi's read and he doesn't really say if it's scummy or not. Apparently it wasn't scummy, because in the next paragraph he says the only thing that worries him about Medhi is the high post count, which doesn't really worry him after all because Mehdi had said his town and scum play weren't very different from each-other. Overall the read comes out as pretty null, but in the last line he adds that he's fine with the lynch and that he'll even hammer, but only after he finishes his reads. What's the point of doing more reads if you're already set on hammering someone? This tells me he was making those reads not to scumhunt but to appear town; make it look like he cared, when he had basically said that those reads would have no influence in his vote. His vote on ArcAngel kind of proves that.

Picking the easy target now, aren't we? And is she really the right vote if you considered her null until now? You get a place on my suspect list.

Easy target? I could have hammered Mehdi there and move the game to a date that is more comfortable for me(after my exam, that is), but I didn't?

Voting a null for pressure and etc. is not so rare thing and often useful? It's not like I can't move my vote or something.

He didn't vote her because he suspected her or because he thought she'd be a better lynch than Mehdi, he did it to add pressure on her. It didn't add any pressure though, since he had already said he would vote Medhi. It was a pointless vote that only served to make it look like he was doing something.

All that said, I'm placing my vote on him for now.

VOTE: Kingmaker.

[SnowStorm]

So... scumreads.

Snowstorm- His Mehdi-vote starts off as just a feeling , but he never really seems to be trying to consider his alignment. I think a lot of his questions are designed to incriminate rather than gain information from the answers. An exception to this is 321, but his next post is something that could be said regardless of what Mehdi's answer was (and I don't think his answer there was scummy), making the whole process seem really fake to me.

Another thing is that I get the impression of him being in "Lynch-Mehdi" mode and just being negative towards him in every way, which I think is likely from scum. Examples are 506 and his over-reaction to the claim in 510.

Could you give us an example of the questions I "designed to incriminate Mehdi" and what gave you that impression? Because I didn't do that, and it would have been kind of pointless to try to incriminate someone who was already a sure lynch. And I asked him questions even when I knew I wouldn't vote anyone else. I was trying to understand him and try to make sense of his actions. By the end of the day I knew there was a chance he'd flip innocent but he was our best lynch choice. I was more annoyed than angry on #506, dragging the claim the way he did was stupid and pointless. And #510 was far from an over-reaction, it was more of an expression of my annoyance towards him plus a little joke to lighten the post since I knew it wasn't entirely his fault that I missed his claim.

[DeasVail]

301 is an example, and although I like to ask incriminating questions sometimes, I get the impression that the purpose of the questions was not to read Mehdi, but to attack him.

Why did you put effort into understanding Mehdi if you knew you wouldn't move your vote?

[Baby Spice]

Ugh, waiting for certain people to check back into the thread before I wordvomit.

Whom?

[Nobody Special]

nobody special

- what is your read on moi?

I have never been able to adequately read MoI -- partly because he intimidates me, with his knack for reading my alignment so very well (he's hardly ever wrong about me), and partly because I just can't.


So, null. Or something.

[SnowStorm]

301 is an example, and although I like to ask incriminating questions sometimes, I get the impression that the purpose of the questions was not to read Mehdi, but to attack him.

Why did you put effort into understanding Mehdi if you knew you wouldn't move your vote?

In that example, the purpose was to try to understand why he was talking about speed-lynches and if he was using it as a point against or in favor of anyone. I just wanted to get a clearer picture of his intentions and reassure my vote. I ended up being less sure of my vote than I was before, but he still was the best lynch option.

[Zar]

Prodding Kingmaker, MagnaOfIllusion, Tammy

[Zar]

Based on player's request, management is looking for a replacement for Kingmaker.

[Tammy]

Sorry. I kept looking to see if the people I was waiting to hear from had checked in and if there was anything to add, but forgot to prod dodge.

I'm still waiting to see what moi brings today; I hope he's all right.

[Tammy]

nobody special

- what is your read on moi?

I have never been able to adequately read MoI -- partly because he intimidates me, with his knack for reading my alignment so very well (he's hardly ever wrong about me), and partly because I just can't.


So, null. Or something.

What does him being able to read you have to do with your ability to read him? so, you got over this paranoia then?

You never answerd how the question to baby spice helped with your read on her. What is your read on her btw?

[Empire]

Whom?

MoI and Kingmaker's replacement.

[DeasVail]

So, I'm still thinking Snowstorm. Add to my earlier stuff his lack of comment on MoI (which I think town would be likely to do considering that he's the main wagon). And I remember thinking there was something else that was scummy that I wanted to wait to say, but I'm tired (get-togethers with ALL the relos are exhausting!) and I may just be imagining things, so when I'm more with it I'll get back to you maybe?