NY 166: Knight-Errant 18p - Game Over!

[KX]

vote: roy

y u no confirm?

[KX]

Hello my fellow players, I know you've missed me in my absence, but I believe I can finally grace you with my presence!

First off, not strictly relevant, but this is actually my seventh game here on mafiascum, 8 is you count a marathon game. Of those seven, I subbed out of one early on, so really doesn't count, was force subbed out of a second since I couldn't keep up, and subbed into one late game. So yeah, I think I count as being a player on this site, though it's true I probably wouldn't have joined this if not for Fege.

Moving along, posts #132 and #133 are interesting to me.

ABDEL BANDWAGONING ME IS NOT SCUMMY. IT'S AN RVS WAGON, I DON'T MIND BEING BANDWAGONED EARLY GAME, BECAUSE SOMEBODY HAS TO AND IT GETS US SOME INFORMATION.

Specifically, what about this I don't like is that some of the information we get from the wagon which fegelein talks about

is

that abdel is scummy, and yet fegelein uses the fact that abdel gave us information that he was scummy as a reason for why he isn't scummy. This is just exceptionally poor logic, and I'm curious as to if there's an explanation.

Also in #132,

An annoying part of this game is that majority of the first 6 pages of posts are stupid fluffy posts.

QFT.

@Vifam,

10 bucks says KX is scum also

at the time of that post, I had a total of one post in the game. As far as I can tell, the inactivity is the only thing you could use for the read. I'm not certain about others (can be if you wish) but I know for sure that the same could be said of at least HD, so why make a post about me? The only thing I can think of was myself being mentioned in another post recently, where it was said that the person would like to hear more from me. If that's it, then my question becomes why only evaluate players called out by others, not the entire game?

Also, to comment on some other events, while I find Abdel's behavior to be quite scummy, as far as I know, regardless of alignment he tends to think of himself first, and not be the most thoughtful or experienced on in the bunch, and so can't get a read on him yet. What I want to know is why others of the "group" have failed to mentioned this fact.

Oh yeah, VOTE: notscience, you've proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that you're here, do something. I've played with you before, you aren't this fucking bad. Same goes for Vifam to an extent, though at least they've shown a few opinions, and no meta I believe.

[KX]

@notsci, where is my scumread exactly, aside from you yourself?

@vifam, in that case, please check meta, I tend to do that a lot rvs.

@fege, how did the logic gap I pointed out make sense to you?

[KX]

So then what information is there to be gained from an early game bandwagon, simply reactions to it, you can't judge people who either jump or don't jump on it at all?

[KX]

Do you think you reacted to it well?

[KX]

What do you define reacting to it "well" as anyway?

[KX]

What do you define reacting to it "well" as anyway?

@Fegelein, What I meant by this was, in general, what do you think reacting well is, and after that was going to ask "if you have a clear cut idea of what reacting well is [and we agree that it's reacting well] in such a low pressure situation, doesn't that mean the exercise should be worthless for determining your alignment?," however, you took it to mean in your personal case, which imo seems like a townie move, even if a misunderstanding, scum would probably want to avoid talking about how they set themselves as town for various reasons. Point being, you can be town.

And, @NotSci:

My mommy says I can be anything I want to be when I grow up

I decided to become a pokemon

You're voting me for PL reasons when you have a scumread, which is scummy btw.

No, he's scum because his role PM says so

What the fuck kind of reaction to being told to step it up and an implication of being scum is this?

Literally, first you fluff, then claim my reason for voting you is bad,

make up

that I have another scum read (read; I didn't say I did, and when asked who he meant, nosci never responded), and then proceed to call the person who called you scum and a bad player scum themselves, except you have no reasoning.

[KX]

God I've started make a post for this game four times in the past two days and gotten interrupted mid way through it every time, I'm going to get this done.

Ok way back on page 11, @Evil Regals, if by case you mean #266, then sorry, but your time was wasted. Your fallacy is false cause. while it may be true that not sci hasn't self voted as scum, (you have an incomplete sample size so even that can't be said for sure), there is no reason at all why he

can't

self vote as scum, and so that defense completely fails. More then that, I really don't know what to say to you. As for my case, he is here, he has been doing next to nothing helpful, he lied about me to make me look scummy and reacted to getting called scum by calling the accuser scum, and then didn't defend or explain himself about any of it. I don't care if you're town and trolling because you want reactions, you can't use that as a clean-all excuse for everything scummy you're doing. Until he explains himself and does something, he can be nothing but scum in my eyes.

@Shattered, why are you wasting time by asking about the puzzle, and what's wrong with HD?

@Fegelein, what has Shattered done other then next to nothing and being annoying, like quite a few others in this game?

@Beast, iso me, check what I say about notsci, tell me how it changes your opinion.

Also @everybody what the actual fuck I've been looking over ISOs and it seems like half our players have posted nothing of value in the last 100+ pages. There were actually some other things I wanted to do, but give me a little while to think about them.

[KX]

@beast, while I admit I haven't been very influential, I have spent quite a bit of time on this game and have reads, or at the very least thoughts, on most players. However, a player named Wisdom has managed to convince me it's not best to share all reads you have, so now i'm trying to figure out how to test those reads. In addition, my main reason for stating people need to do more was that many haven't posted in so long, and I think the fact that I said it proves, in that regard, that i'm doing better.

@NotSci, so you're claiming that you're going to continue in activity which does the town no good, and at

best

is distracting? Seriously, I can understand a "no scum would be this bad" attitude, but how has this not gotten votes? He might as well be claiming scum. Heck, claiming scum would be better than this since at least it would be funny, and he might be doing other things.

On another note, i'm pretty proud of myself, I typed this on a DS.

[KX]

Eyup, this game is going to be a total clusterfuck. Embrace the madness Fege, embrace it.

Serious question though, why do we have to limit ourselves to a select few people? Wouldn't having a large range of different, diverse opinions to manage be better for scumhunting, even if it's more work to analyse?

And one question for all town or town-lean reading NotSci, how has anything he's done pointed to him being town? As far as I can tell, the only way to get to that reasoning is either Meta or some variation of "no scum would be that scummy" and it really seems like a lot of people are completely disregarding him due to that.

Anyway, not in the mood to post any sort of in depth wall right now, but I'll try to get to it later tonight.

[KX]

Ugh sorry for the inactivity, I swear I'll post something tomorrow, I keep putting stuff off because I know it'll take a long time, but I've been putting it off for days now, so no more. So that this post actually has a point, assuming I'm not remembering incorrectly, I think Katarina is quite likely scum, and

unvote

, thank you notsci, now just don't troll any more and keep up the /better/ work.

[KX]

Only dodge here saying I am still here, very sorry for the inactivity. If I haven't made a really good post in 48 hours from now, it means I simply don't have time to keep up with the game, and I'll request a sub.

[KX]

My deepest apologies Mod, replace at your discretion. As I have a few free moments, the very least I can do is post something I have in this game.

What I was talking about earlier with regards to Katarina seeming scum was was that

Eh, tbf I don't have a super set read on you and Vifam atm. I'm entertaining the possibility of masons because..

You two fit that the most at the moment.

You asked for my opinion, you got it. I'm just entertaining the whatever I had in mind. You both shitposted clear enough to at least entertain the possibility of it, or a scum team.

While in this obviously scummy due to the potential role-fishing involved, the logic behind it doesn't really add up either. The obvious reason to assume two people trolling as masons is that they'd get a lot of reactions from it, and so information, and in the event that one of them were to be lynched, the other could then claim and prevent a mislynch from happening. However, no reason is ever given, at then in the second quote, that possibility is directly contradicted. The logic that would could claim to avoid a lynch doesn't work at all for scum, since claiming scum would just make the person even more likely to be lynched. That means they must have drawn their conclusion of mason in some other way. This way can be found by comparing what scum and mason's have in common, however, all they have in common is the ability to talk to each other, and I at least don't see how two people being able to talk to each other would make them any more likely to play similarly, and even if it did, I don't see why such a weak accusation should be throw out when in effect it's also role fishing of a kind. From a scum perspective though, it makes a modicum more sense, trying to pin down power roles, and when it falls through trying to dismiss your attempt with another comment, and throw some suspicious on the people in question. To support the latter theory, looking at the tone of the two posts, the first is somewhat hesitant in nature as if trying to tread carefully on the issue, while the second has an instant hint of hostility. These things, in addition to other things, makes me believe them to be scum.

Also, I know I've done this to death already, but NotSci is seriously ringing scum, not just for the PL-style stuff. Somebody needs to make an actual case against them. 5 am right now though, just wanted to say what I noticed that I don't believe anybody else mentioned.

[KX]

Also KX you didn't vote kat....

This was because I believed I was going to be subbed out, and didn't see the point in making a pointless vote. As this is not the case however,

Vote Katarina

.

With regards to Shattered, please look at his meta. Even a quick glance shows that this seems to be his play-style, and while I admit that some of his logic is just plain bad, such as

I should NOT be the lynch for today, primarily because there has not been substantial interaction between me and other players. My flip (which will be town) will not be as information-rich as, say, Katarina's flip. Or notscience's flip.

which is basically "I've not doing much so don't lynch me, and a little redirection." Also, as a counter, the mere fact that you're up for a lynch means people will be giving opinions on you, and so are interacting with you. Point being Shattered does seem scummy, but the main reason people seem to have is actually null, and what more there is is minimal compared to Katarina, or even other suspects.

Major scum points to Beast if Katarina flips scum.

[KX]

Also, NotSci, stfu, in the event that Katarina goes town and I have to flip things around, you move to #1 scumread.

[KX]

Hey Katarina, it might help your case if you would defend yourself a little, try to explain some of the reasons people have for calling you scum and such. Also, for Metal, the breadcrumbing thing seems at least not out of the ordinary, and I'm not really seeing how he's more controlled, his posts just have a little bit more relevance while not being walls. That said, I love you too Metal.

[KX]

mah god this game. And also, just in their own right, I think NotSci is scummier than SV. However, if Katarina flipped scum, then I seriously doubted she and Not were both scum, hence not going after him.

[KX]

still kinda hoping you flip scum and are just trolling down to the last second btw.

[KX]

V/LA for a few days

Also god I feel like half this town is scum. Will sort it out and explain later.

[KX]

KX is V/LA until the 20th.

Glad to see you finally got this right

Anyway,

V/LA for a few days

Also god I feel like half this town is scum. Will sort it out and explain later.

This one deserves death.

Why?
On Purple rose actually:

He doesn't think they are a scumteam, no, they look like masons.

Same reasoning used for some of the Katarina vote, why mention a scumteam when a mason would be the obvious conclusion, so while the reason has been proven to not be definitively true, still makes me somewhat suspicious. Figured I'd point this out.

@Shattered, why are you wasting time by asking about the puzzle, and what's wrong with HD?

This is the scummy way to respond to a question. It might work with your mother, here you have to look like a grownup.

Ignoring the obvious insulting, how is it scummy? I think it was legit point, and even if not, how is it scummy? Also, to top it all off, the question wasn't even directed at me specifically, so it's not a bullshit question dodge like you seem to be implying.

KX was not on my radar but definately earned a spot.

This was posted after the first quote. I'm glad to know Rose is excluding people who make scummy actions from her radar.

Oh yeah, and I figure I should add in that reading over Rose's iso, she seems kinda scummy in general. Almost all of her posts are just quoting things and then saying "this is scummy," not really pushing things, only stating opinions. While stating opinions isn't scummy, quite the opposite in fact, it's scummy when it's all that you do. Makes it seem like you're doing things while not really contributing. Also, her reasons for the Fegelein vote were dubious at best, and there's quite a bit of hypocrisy in the statements she makes about Abdel.

That said,

Vote: NotScience

, this still needs to happen. Will prob be making a case for it next post.

[KX]

@Marquis, in the event of a fake bulletproof claim, a commuter could counter claim, and bulletproof can also counterclaim a commuter. Also keep in mind that the mafia gets two power roles of their own from that table, so they would know the set-up in part. For instance, if the mafia had a watcher and a godfather, then they'd know for sure that there isn't a town doctor or tracker. Another thing to keep in mind is that commuter is a role which has a very convenient excuse for not getting nightkilled, so if we were to lynch beast we should probably do it sooner rather then later. The only thing is that if we were to lynch him, we should wait one night, and if anybody has a gun use it. There are only three set-ups which include a commuter, and based on fegelein's death we can assume it's not the JK one. Other options are a town cop or a gunsmith, and a shot/lack of shot would prove there is/isn't a gunsmith. If a player with a gun does shoot and doesn't hit, then it's still a win situation since the only way for a shot to fail would be hitting a bulletproof, and all bulletproofs with a commuter are scum. Point being, if there is not a shot and nobody claims a shot failing, we can assume that Beast isn't likely to be a commuter. Of course things could still go wrong with it just being an inspector/commuter setup, the jk being dumb and not going on fegelein, a gunsmith not using their action/using it on a scum, the shooter's kill overlapping with a scums, etc, but all of those are unlikely while it would offer additional assurance for a lynch to go though.

[KX]

@Marquis, because vacation, no more having to get used to school. Also, on the SV issue, people seem to be taking his hammer as a major scum tell, and while I admit it's scummy, I don't think it's as much so as everybody is saying it is. It's not like he tried to hammer before a claim got out, and he didn't even hammer, could have been planned as a reaction test. He mentioned hammering in the post as well, so it's definitely not like an accidental thing. My point is, he saw Beast's claim, hammered anyway, and left no doubt about hammering. Tbh, I think the hammer actually makes a lot more sense from a town perspective then a scum one, even if the voting without giving other people the change to change opinions is undoubtedly anti-town. Let's face it, if Beast flipped town after a post like that for hammer, the main debate of the next day would be are we quick-lynching SV or making use of the day. For a scum, voting a partner right after they claimed, before even seeing if people bought it or not, would be pretty dumb, and I doubt a scum would commit suicide to vote out a PR, especially when the team is already down by one. For a town though, if they were really convinced Beast was scum, I could see it happening, and if you thought the person would get away with it afterwards, you have the chance to take the entire power of the village into your hands, why not. It's selfish, but if that's how you think, so there's a possibility for it to make sense. Only other possibility is mafia hammering somebody who they know is SK or vice-versa. Anyway, point is, one of the two should probably die today, but don't think we should be hasty with deciding which.

and @Beast, no, just if somebody has a gun to definitely use it. Also checking role PMs, fuck, turns out gunsmith is an investigator, screw that. Why would a firearms maker have the ability to check if someone has a gun, and only once per night? I was acting under the assumption that gunsmith was basically a nightkill/daykill inventor, nvm. For your reasoning though, in the second case, how would the scum take out 2 town PRs?

[KX]

I like how shattered conveniently disappears afterwards. In the event that it was a fakehammer, he'd definitely want to stick around for the repercussions. Also, looking over Beast's ISO, I'm inclined to believe his claim due to the PR mention earlier on, don't see why how he was supposed to react as a PR would come into the thought process otherwise. The ISO does confirm a scumread on beast thought. Also, even if it seems completely contrary to normal thought, can we lynch SV first and if he flips anything aside from scum lynch Beast? Will elaborate later.

Also holy fuck, thinking about my reads, that moment when Metal Sonic is near the top. This is going to be a fun game >.>

[KX]

@Marquis, what is the problem exactly?

@HD, nice contribution.

@Eddie, can I assume that list is composed of all your scumreads?

also, forgot to do this last post,

Vote: SV

[KX]

It's called priority NotSci. I'm near positive one of (or both of) SV and Beast are scum while you're simply the scummiest single entity. Don't worry, I'll get around to it. If I get the free time tomorrow, I can even make the case then.

[KX]

I see that you are all painfully unfamiliar with my patented fakehammer gambit.

And I like how, after supposedly fakehammering, which would be done for information and reactions, he shows up and what he says is not what he gained from the fake hammer, but that of course it was a fake hammer.

@Eddie, my question is kinda an important one for you.

[KX]

How do you get me as a lynch option, and why is Beast/NotSci not an option? And Vifam subbed out for Metal. Another question, how do you get Concombre as scum?

also, @NotSci, yeah, I think that's common knowledge at this point.

[KX]

Holy fuck shattered, you've now made a total of three posts after your fakehammer doing nothing but stating the obvious to defend yourself. If you're so interested in getting information and being helpful that'd you risk yourself, why not be helpful now and

do something useful?

. If I hadn't already decided to vote you on theory before, I'd vote you again now for just being scummy.

And why is Metal the one with the most votes atm? Unlike in NotSci's case, while the trolling bugs me, I think MS reads town lean/null at least. Seems the main things he's done that are scummy/could be found scummy are the softclaim, trolling, and then this vote. The softclaim wasn't really a softclaim at all, and imo it seems like pressing something perceived as a softclaim would be the more harmful thing, the trolling was quite obviously trolling, and given the posts MS made after voting SV, it's clear he thought it was a failed hammer attempt. Meanwhile, for town, a lot of my personal read is meta, but at the least he seems to be trying to actively scumhunt. On that though Metal, some more relevant content would be nice.

[KX]

Oh god there is so much wrong with your vote on me. If I'm getting this right, your reasons are: My attacks on SV are bad, I've over-explained myself, I had a gut read, and PV lurked D1 so you believe me and HD are scum as well.
Let's do this in order.

1. You have yet to say why my attack on SV is bad. I believe I already explained my reasoning in previous posts, if you're not able to understand it though, tell me and I'll restate it in a simpler fashion.
2. In the specific case you cited, when two people are trolling, and you state one is town, and one is scum, if that's it, there's something wrong with you. I'm not an idiot, and was able to see quite clearly how one might take that. I preemptively answered any questions related to it that may have been asked. More in the next answer, but I have history with Metal, and his trolling caused me to mess up big time once, so it's something I would think about when considering him. On top of all that, considering thinking your posts over isn't even inherently scummy, though I can see why you'd question it. Also, the whole point of posting something like that is to convince people, so tbh it's really dumb to not think about/care at all what people think.
3. I normally avoid gut reads for the reason you stated plus they're not that helpful in convincing other people, however, I've hydra'd with Metal, played in many games with him, hosted games he's been in, been in games he's hosted, and more outside of a mafia context, so yeah, I can't help it if I can get a gut read on him. Also, my read wasn't only due to gut, I made several solid opinions about what I think of actions people call him scum for, and gave one reason for why others might want to consider him town. Point being, I'm specifically trying to avoid just saying "because gut," since I know it's not helpful.
4. Just because one scum acts in a certain way doesn't mean all scum act in that way, in fact it's a logical fallacy, so your entire premise is, put simply, bs. However, on top of that, I believe I have a legit excuse for inactivity over that time period, and multiple outside sources can verify that I was inactive over that time period in all factions of the internet. Also, unlike PV, who (I believe) was active in other place on this site before death, or HD who's been generally inactive and remains inactive (hosting a game though), notice that now that my reason is gone I return to activity.

k, thanks, come back with a better case.
And tbh I agree with you on the HD thing, though there's not really much to go on atm, mainly inactivity/not living up to meta/a few bad posts.

@NotSci, fucking fine, I get it, you want the case. It'll be here soon. Also, fuck you, I'm not a newb ether.

PEDIT: hang on, new marquis post, will get to that in a hour or so, busy now.

[KX]

@Marquis, NotSci isn't a scum read do to gut. NotSci is a scum read for reasons I'm listing next post. Metal is mainly a town read do to gut, but him and maybe HD are the only people I have gut on at all.

@NotSci, true, but you only objected to HD being called a newb.

[KX]

My apologies, I've had a busy weekend.

Anyway, lotta stuff to respond to, but it's late already, so I'll hold off until tomorrow. As promised, the NotSci case:

Spoiler: Case File

Basically, NotSci has been having his way with this game, and because you all suck, you fall exactly how he wants you to. Pretty much, any attempt so far to question him has been met with equivalently the following: I'm playing badly, and so (OMGUS) thinking I'm scum means you're scum or stupid. Of course, actually saying that would get somebody lynched on the spot. So, NotSci phrases it differently. Instead, from NoSci, it goes: Well, you can only be voting me for PL reasons, and we all know only scum and bad town support PL, so are you scum or bad town? I think

And lol, anyone who pushes my wagon is either a) Scum or b) moronic town

sums it up pretty well, and I'm sure anybody who's been reading over NotSci has seen that come up multiple times. The thing that NotSci fails to mention is the reason why you seem to only be able to vote him over PL reasons. That reason is he

hasn't given any content

that you can judge him on otherwise. For the record, NotSci currently has 184 posts. Seems pretty good, right? Well, I went through and divided all of those posts up into "good" posts, which help the game in some way, "troll" posts, which contribute nothing and are disruptive, and "worthless" posts which are A. fluff (most) B. a vote with no explanation (explanations or votes with explanations are put in "good") or C. a post were NotSci "defends" himself. I've also taken to liberty of counting how many times NotSci uses his "NotSci logic" to dismiss a claim somewhere. If any part of a post is considered good, it is labelled a good post and nothing else. In total, there were 26 troll posts, 106 worthless posts, and 52 good posts. When viewing these statistics, keep in mind about 75% of the worthless posts were fluff, that about 20% of the good posts were repeats of things said in other good posts, that 4 good posts were saying somebody was inactive, and that 11 good posts were only NotSci asking somebody else to contribute somehow. Throughout these posts, NotSci logic was used a total of 22 times. Also of note is that NotSci's first good post was his 14th post, and post #101 in the thread. Anyway, there's some other stuff I could say, like about how NotSci said he'd give detailed reads once he got some flips, and now that we have three, one of which is scum and one which NotSci himself helped to get, he still has yet to give a detailed read, or some of the more ridiculous cases of him using NotSci logic, but basically, if we look at NotSci without all the annoying fluff, he's an inactive player who throws random votes without committing and calls his attackers scum, and when you consider that he isn't that, but instead somebody like that who's proven to be around and flooding the thread with spam, I'm pretty sure you don't help the case. I feel like I haven't explained this very well, but I think you should all be able to figure out what I mean. So, NotSci, I want you to defend yourself from claims of :active lurking, lack of committed or explained reads, exception a townie who you lynched, and hypocrisy on calling others out on the first two counts while you yourself are guilty of them. Note that none of these things are PL reasons, none of them go into your intentionally acting in an anti-town manner, and none of the deal with only a single petty or small incident. Note that counts were done at 12 am, and are only correct within a 10% margin or error

[KX]

Oh yeah, and I forgot the most important part, while a lot of you may just dismiss NotSci as a hopeless troll, think about how ingenious a strategy it is for mafia, and rather then holding NotSci above everybody else as a troll, judge him on par with everyone else.

[KX]

Yeah, sorry to say this MS, and no offence, but it's true, you're basically a VI who can scumhunt.

Also, seriously guys, we need to pick a lynch now, deadline incoming. I'm fine with literally anybody but Marquis, but I would strongly, strongly prefer it to be one of SV/Beast/NotSci

[KX]

:active lurking, lack of committed or explained reads, exception a townie who you lynched, and hypocrisy on calling others out on the first two counts while you yourself are guilty of them. Note that none of these things are PL reasons

Active lurking-

I don't do things your way. I do them mine. That does not mean lurking, especially when in your "case" you edit the facts to help it.

please tell me where I edit the facts to help my case. If you mean the whole treating fluff posts as not-existing, once again, taking into account the large amount of fluff posts actually makes you seem scummier, but since it's a kinda PL reason, I haven't included it.

Lack of committed/explained reads-

I've said who I find scum, what else do you need? Explanations are overrated anyways.

"I really hate when people just go "because gut" (example: eddie) because it allows for scum to throw out town sounding reads without fully committing to any reasoning that takes genuine town motivation to write up and that could be read into later on." Gut, and no explanation at all are basically the same thing except with gut you can possibly be making a decent meta argument.

I have no clue what exception a townie means

reading over, I thought you seemed quite commited to the Katarina lynch. I'm saying, with the exception of her lynch, you didn't really press any other reads.

Not really guilty of them, but nice try though

No shit he is, he's lurking the uck out of this game

I believe this is the first post you made that doesn't fall under worthless/trolling. Yeah. That's called hypocrisy.

Comments on the actual game, please.

though not an originally listed reason, I call that post pretty damn hypocritical.

Why exactly am I scum?

I like how you demand people give specific reasoning about why you yourself are scum, but often don't give explanations for your own scumreads.

Everyone not posting content should start because only I'm allowed not to :>

You even fucking admit the hypocrisy right here, so don't go back on it now.

See, NS, given the fact that you are trolling and such, it makes me see you heavily as Anti-Town... And my gut just screams you as scum...

1) Antitown=/=Scum

2) If that's your case on me being scum you're probs scum without a logical townie reason for a vote

3) Give some content or else

I just fucking love this quote, it's amazing really. Anyway, there are probably more examples, but I'm going to stop now. I definitely see how you aren't guilty of being a hypocrite NotSci.

These are PL reasons.

Active Lurking is definitively scum because it gives the impression of activity without actually producing anything. Not committing to reads helps a scum because it makes reading the scum harder, and allows them to cast votes without having to come up with a legit townie reason for voting. Hypocrisy is bad because if you find somebody scum over something, and you yourself are doing that thing, you're basically saying either your tell is wrong, or you yourself are scum/a bad player.

A Policy Lynch is one that is done for arbitrary reasons. Most commonly, it describes the lynch of a player who is not found to be particularly scummy, but because the player's bad play will hurt the town later on.

All of these reason make you scummy. None of the reasons are about bad play. Please learn the meaning of Policy Lynch rather then just screaming it any time somebody accuses you.

And @Hop, Irdc if you do or don't, posturing about it is a waste of time and space in the thread.

Also, I love that this is how you end your post. "I'm not a hypocrite!" "Hopkirk, posturing about it is a waste of time and space in the thread"

Fuck it, maybe one of SV/Beast is scum, but this right here is definitely scum.

Vote: NotScience

. I want everybody who isn't voting NotSci to explain why they don't think he's scum.

[KX]

@Meeps, why do you think the reasons I've listed, which are accepted as scummy, are not scummy in NotSci's case?

@Oriole, refutation coming soon, but to answer the main question, I believe an actual hammer to be a more town-minded action provided there are no extenuating circumstances. However, the more I think/thought about it, the more I doubt it would have been a hammer based on reads alone, and instead that there was some other motivation based around Beast's claim.

@Metal, for your post about what I and a few others thought, your wagon is bad (imo), and the mixed reactions towards your trolling vs NotSci's trolling by other players seems pretty damn weird. What do you think of the latter point?

[KX]

@Evil, Metal is always an I, regardless of the V or not. And until somebody can explain to me how the fuck NotSci is town, I'm not stopping.

[KX]

My case on his before discards the trolling aspect entirely.

Why

does he seem town? How do you even get a town impression in the first place? Do you mean to tell me everybody has a town gut read on him? Because if so, that's some bullshit.

[KX]

Nice parrot. How am I tunneling? I was requested specifically to deal with a certain player who I outlined as scum, and have been supporting the case. As for the getting pissed off part, not only is that not a scum tell, if anything it's closer to a town tell, emotion shows caring etc, but when you have a very strong scum read on a player, and the best people can give you for why said player isn't scum is "gut," then who wouldn't be pissed off? Also, no offence Beast, but is that really the best you can give when suggesting a specific target for lynching with only two days left? Also, so far you've said Metal and me are good lynches, care to give anything else?

[KX]

Wut Marquis. Though it's a little hypocritical, is now really the best time?

[KX]

@oriole, tbf, it's a scummy game.

@beast, why do you think emotion is scummy?

hey guys

I can't defend myself

so I'm going to, without reason, call it all PL

and then imply my accuser is scum

these are town actions, right?

[KX]

Dopog, wasn't that, like, fuckin' exactly my theory, except mine covered more cases, the subject fit better, and overall it made more sense? And if you really think Eddie is SK, shouldn't we lynch him first, eliminate a kill etc?

VOTE: HD

not one of my top three, but oh well, I don't object, kinda like it actually, and no last reads is pretty damn scummy.

[KX]

Last reads is generally more then just a few vaguely stated scumreads, just fyi.

[KX]

Somebody seems mad. you realize cross-fire is something

good

for the town, right? you still haven't been able to defend yourself btw. can I take that as a confession of scum?

[KX]

tbf, that was four pages ago when you didn't have any votes on you. And around that time you criticized Marquis and Abdel as well, going so far as to imply Marquis as scum. There are four scum left in the game, so thoughts on people other then those three? And any strong town reads you wouldn't like to see lynched? Idk HD, I'm just not seeing any wish to help at all, which is weird for you.

[KX]

@Oriole, the three main points you seem to have are: A. the contradiction between saying that a fakehammer was obvious, but in other places showing doubt in it and using it as a reason for my suspicion. B. showing doubt in it being a fakehammer, and then saying an actual hammer attempt seemed townie, but still calling scum. C. NotSci being the single scummiest person, but my not making a case for him ASAP.

Should be relatively simple. For A, it's just a misunderstanding. What I meant when I said the fakehammer was obvious was that SV

claiming

it was a fakehammer was the obvious choice for him. Even if a legit hammer attempt seems more like something a town would do, it's also extremely anti-town in nature. And as for the lying problem in saying something other then what it was, if you'd lynch somebody like that, I doubt you'd have any qualms with lying.

B. The key there is that a hammer like that only seemed townie if it was based purely on reads. I doubt it was actually a fakehammer, reaction doesn't seem right at all as if it was, and so I'm guessing the more likely option is that SV knew Beast's claim was a fakeclaim. Now, it could be because SV is a PR, Scum, or SK, doesn't really matter. Either way, Beast is confirmed PR/Scum, while there is a slight chance SV is just an idiot townie, hence why SV should be lynched first. If SV is a PR, then he just claims before lynch, and Beast is lynched instead. If it is either of the SK or Scum possibilities, then good for us, it pretty much confirms both players as scum.

That kinda brings me into point C. I personally think some form of counter-claim option is far more likely then a fakehammer, and still more likely then an idiot townie, meaning odds are both SV and Beast are scum. You'll notice I was planning on having a NotSci case be my top priority until the fakehammer thing came up. I personally think two likely scum, one of who would be SK, is a better option then one player who, I admit, could be just plain awful at this game.

Does that explain everything?

[KX]

Hey Beast, we got two hours left, why are you not voting?

[KX]

Beast, you're drunk. vote properly and then go home.

[KX]

And I'm serious on this, I know you just posted a completely coherent message in another game a mere three minutes before making that post. Literally nobody actually types out vote tags, the only way they could mess up like that, so don't try to bullshit your way out of voting with me.

[KX]

ok cool he logged off, I'm just calling it now, Beast/HD/NotSci scumteam 2013. SV would nicely fit into this as SK as well.

[KX]

hey meeps, I heard you like no lynches.

[KX]

hey meeps, hint, anybody who isn't confirmed town is a better lynch then a no lynch. at worst we lynch an inactive town and gain information, and at best we lynch scum. this is basic, a no lynch is almost the worst thing town can do in a NOC.

@HD, I suppose not, but wagon analysis is pretty common among those about to be lynched. Thought maybe you'd have gained a little insight. Did you know, HD, that implying town reads are scum can be pretty damn confusing for those trying to find your opinions? And you still haven't explained who your pick for the fourth scum would be.

[KX]

also, I figure it would be a good idea to mention that Beast posted in another game at :27, so he's confirmed avoiding HD's wagon despite claiming to be fine with voting HD to prevent a no lynch earlier on in the game.

@HD, are those three reads neutral, scum lean, town lean. please, detail. And I suppose asking for reasons would be too much? Forgive me, I had no clue you didn't like wagon analysis. And forgive me, you're right on the second point, I misread #1139

[KX]

kk. well, at this rate, you're living to see the light of day again tomorrow.

[KX]

well, unless another wagon suddenly pops up (thought after Beast's misvote I'm not sure I'd change), it seems like HD's the only option. one hour left btw.

[KX]

oh yeah, I figure it's worth mentioning that Beast showed up one more time, and still didn't do anything. @meeps, might be about time to vote.

[KX]

indeed. why the fuck are people not around at deadline when there's a contested lynch? also, if HD does end up flipping scum, I think we should insta-lynch beast.

[KX]

once again, not sure if that vote counts beast. dopog/meeps should also vote just to be sure, make sure there's no doubt.

[KX]

vote: beast

on it metal !

but srs, this guy is confirmed scum after his play near HD. the only question we should have is do we lynch him now and make use of carry over time, or try to have a normal day, just the lynch is predetermined.

[KX]

ms . . . I can't tell if you're stupid, brilliant, both, or neither. Why the fuck not claim when he was at L-1 >.> As far as I can tell, it'd "clean" you just as much at that point. And now, with Beast basically conf-scum anyway, the only advantage of possibly bating a kill would be gone. Seriously, if not for the fact that scum are down by two, so it wouldn't make sense to counter-claim now as scum, and that Beast is, as mentioned, basically conf-scum, I might consider voting you.

marquis . . . no question here, plain stupid. ok, so let's recap. we have two people counter-claiming each other, meaning one of the two is confirmed for scum, and one of these two people

twice

made fake votes against a flipped mafia with mere minutes left until deadline, in addition to making excuses for not being present in the thread while being present in other threads. so, what do you do? you vote the player who you know will go to extreme lengths to get a lynch, going to far as to vote people who's lynch they highly disagree with, or posting during the night and risking godkill to protest a no-lynch, and who you

hosted

a game for in which they lost simply because people weren't around for deadline, with reasoning no greater then "this desperateness seems like bussing, and they haven't done anything very town." May I remind you that you yourself called me helpful earlier on, and also, what happened to the reasons you had for voting me previously? I'm sorry, but now it's my turn to ask what the actual fuck?

[KX]

hey NotSci, have you managed to come up with a defense for yourself yet, or are you gonna keep ignoring it and praying I go away?

[KX]

@NotSci, your logical fallacy is Ad Hominem. Ad hominem attacks can take the form of overtly attacking somebody, or more subtly casting doubt on their character or personal attributes as a way to discredit their argument. The result of an ad hom attack can be to undermine someone's case without actually having to engage with it. Using Ad Hominem is generally regarded as something exceptionally scummy. So, I'll take that as a no, you haven't come up with a defense yet. Also, since when am I not trying to lynch you, and care to back up your claim of me as scum with reasoning?

@Metal, you are aware of this games set-up, correct? There are four PRs, two Masons, who are guaranteed to be in the set-up, and then two other PRs who's roles are determined by a chart on the first page. Also, I believe that the serial killer has a one-shot strongman, so you actually aren't killproof.

@Marquis, what the actual fuck again. There are only two mafia left. Beast is obviously mafia. Therefore, if I have a partner, that partner has to be Beast. And nowhere do I say "that's not fair, stop targetting me." Instead, I question your vote's anti-town nature, and show why your "reason" is shit. In regards to calling out HD, since when do me and HD play at all alike, and I believe I already explained why the D1 lurking thing was stupid. NotSci actually doesn't need to defend himself, since everybody appears to believe he's clean and I'm scum, but in general when somebody calls you scum, you either explain why you aren't scum, or get lynched for being scum.

[KX]

@NotSci, can't remember what it's called, but basically it's a Fallacy in Debate where, because of the way an opponent states something, you discard what they've stated. Maybe if you stopped making logical fallacies, there would be less condescension?

[KX]

@Marquis, how am I discrediting you? And if you really think, after yesterday, Beast is SK . . . wow. I don't see how you can think beast is so town the votes by him don't mean anything, but so scum that compared to metal he deserves lynching. I keep pushing on NotSci not because I want his logic to match up or for him to townread me, but because I want other people to take notice of the fact that his logic doesn't match up, and want to keep that an active topic instead of letting it drop away.

@NotSci, my genuine apologies, thinking it over I realize I was rather mean to you, sorry for doing so, I was frusterated and in part took it out on you knowing you couldn't defend yourself.

@Metal, your claim isn't for nothing, a set-up were the town has both a bulletproof and a commuter is impossible, meaning it's still a counter-claim.

@All, beast's sentances make very little grammatical sence anyway, isn't it possible he's simpky talking about that of the two setups with a commuter and roleblocker, one also has a mafia bulletproof? That said, if you'll belive this mistake condemns his as scum, how can you believe his activity yesterday didn't make him scum? And on yesterday, I must say beast, valiant effort even if it didn't work.

[KX]

@Marquis, I'm really looking forward to what you can point out. Since so far, I can't see you having done anything of value in your pushes but show you own ineptitude at reading. If my tone changed, it's because following D3s I lost all respect for this game, actually considered subbing out, but fuck it, I'm playing this though.

@Beast, lol, somebody seems mad. A+ flailing as well. I loved the part were you said Metal tried to shoot you and it failed, but you also tried to shoot me, and yet despite those things there was a kill. Oh yeah, and that you're still claiming town after saying you tried to shoot somebody. That was a stroke of genius.

@NotSci, this is a question for you, answer it if you'll please. Why do you think Beast's error in #1284 is a scumclaim, but think his

two

voting failures against a scum don't make him scum. Also, another question, why did you say that the mason should claim earlier on? Didn't get around to that earlier on, but it was really a dumb move. If mason were to claim now, then they can be shot at freely by scum, while if they wait until they need to, they either get a scum lynched by counterclaiming, or have the same effect as claiming now but better since it guarantees they wouldn't be shot unnecessarily? Also, this may be a little rude, but are you scum, or just incompetent like most of this game seems to be? After my last game with you, I thought you were decent but with an annoying playstyle. But seriously, making simple logical failures like this is either the sign of n00bness, or an absolutely brilliant scum. And, tbh, I'm kinda doubting brilliant scum would get into your situation in the first place.

@Dopog, my thoughts on the players you mentioned D2 are:

Oriole: Based on his posts content alone, I'd say town, he's one of the few players in this game whose been consistently logical and made sense. With that said, he only has 16 posts, and in a game that just passed the 1300 post mark, that's a pretty bad thing which hurts a record that would otherwise make him strong town.

Eddie: I kinda like eddie tbh, and his scum reads are decent enough. His pushes on scum reads certainly could be better though. Also, the read lists filled with nulls early on were kinda weird. A few other posts are weird or make don't make much sense as well, and the appeal to authority reasoning against beast was pretty bad. He'd be something around town-lean.

Abdel: Nube basically says it all. The one thing that I kinda don't like though is, as far as I can tell, he basically completely dropped off the radar once D1 was over. So scum-lean. However, taking into account other people in this game, he not high priority scum.

@Mod, flavor pl0x?

[KX]

So, Eddie, you're seriously claiming that you'd rather policy lynch somebody then vote out a confirmed scum?

[KX]

gg. I think I'll do something kinda interesting next post. Also, I figure there's no point in stating the obvious flaw in beast's last post, right?

[KX]

Meeps, don't even try. Recently, I read a game in which a player, when confronted by somebody they couldn't stand, decided to simply act as though said player was no longer in the game. This is the approach I shall now be taking. Seems there is a point to the post then. In #1307, Beast claims that he decided to kill me, but the kill failed, meaning I have to be SK. If you look though, in that same post, he also says that SV is basically a confirmed power role over the fakehammer on him, and yet despite that, during the night he tried to kill me. It does make sense to kill a JOAT serial killer rather then a power role, but based on his own role Beast would know SK had a bp vest, so intentionally killing the SK would be dumb. So for what Beast said to be true, he would have had to, while knowing a power role, kill somebody other then the power role who he didn't think was SK. I mean, yes, I was pushing extremely hard for Beast's lynch at that point, and had pushed for HD's though that was more out of policy, it doesn't make any sense.

[KX]

Though neither of these two are the interesting thing I mentioned before, while looking over vote counts I noticed dopog, NotSci, and myself have been on every successful lynch so far. Also, fuck the ignoring policy this once, NotSci, if I had seriously given up, why would I mention forthcoming posts, and ask about needing to clarify a defense. I know it's hard for you, but try to think just this once.

[KX]

there are two scum, I'm not wasting time on a lynch nobody will accept. town is a democracy after all, and I could be wrong. it'd be one thing if there was only one scum left, but seeing as that's not the case, trying to decide if SV really is the SK or not. Beast's flip definitely helps with the theory, but I haven't looked back on the issue in a while. Also planning on looking things over for associative tells between the flipped scum.

also, would somebody mind explaining why I'm scum?

[KX]

seeing as how you want to hammer me, you must have reasons, right? elaborate on them?

[KX]

so basically Marquis you don't have any reasons but just want me dead? you know, there's a word for people like that. it's scum. holy fuck, now wouldn't that be a twist, if you were scum . . . and here I've thought you seemed town all game and so haven't looked you over too closely.

also, to add on, to the cop, they shouldn't claim unless they have scum, or have inspected half the current players.

[KX]

I already said why NotSci is scum. Nobody gave a fuck. I could restate what I previously said but with more eloquence, but the content wouldn't change very much. Next push would be one on Marquis. Considering SV's claim, and assuming nobody counter-claims, he can't be SK, so I have to cross him off, and there are a few things about Marquis looking seriously bad. Can't post now, but weekend coming up, so I should have time during it. Also, can anybody explain why to me why my explanation of why Beast's claim on me is bull, and can NotSci and Marquis elaborate on if they think I'm scum or SK, since Marquis seems to be saying I'm SK while NotSci is saying I'm scum. As for Muffin, please read asap. @Evil, Metal, and Shattered, assuming you two aren't just bandwagoning, why do you think I'm scum? Final note, if there is a Roleblocker, they really should claim, since the lack of kills basically confirms that they're going on scum.

[KX]

If Beast were the last on his team, I'd agree with you, but he wasn't. He still had a reason to lie in that it might help his remaining partner. How does bad scumplay mean he can't be lying? If anything, the fact that he lies badly makes the bad logic leading up to why he'd kill me makes it seem like a lie even more.

Scummy how? You can say whatever you want, but without reasoning it's bullshit. I want my vote to mean something. What's the point in voting NotSci if he's not going to get lynched. Where do I scumslip? Ok, so yesterday I go on a passionate rage rant taking out my frustration with the NotSci case, and it's scummy, and now I've given up voting him, and it's scummy. Also, because I'm SK, I need to scumhunt since it helps me as much as town, but obviously my scumhunting is faked and only done for town-cred. One more thing, I apparently give up, and then become interesting again in the game because there are subs, despite the subs happening before I supposedly gave up. Good job.

[KX]

once more; why would beast kill me if he knew another power role? and forgive me, might not get around to making the main posts tonight.

[KX]

Well Metal, based on the lack of you getting killed, the nightkills obviously aren't based on roles, they're based on opinions (on that, somebody should probably check over what the dead have said), so if ER is spot on while you're a while away, then him getting killed would be likely.

Anyway, Marquis, three main things that have seemed kinda off about you are: first the reluctance to vote mafia, iirc you hesitated to vote HD when he appeared as the day 2 lynch until the last second, despite saying you thought he was scum, and the defending of beast early on, followed by not voting him D3 when he was obviously scum. second is with your recent preposition of Cop as the last power role, I really don't see how you could have gotten that, looking at the table it seems clear there were other options, however, if you were SK and so knew all the role in the game, then you could think that with three dead you could finally not have to worry about concealing said knowledge, and accidentally slipped up. tbh, this one is pretty weak, but it followed by meeps's post about role and considering outside of SV for the SK is what really got me thinking on you. final thing is, reading over an iso of you again, the progression of your case against me is really, really strange, starting out with "I don't like KX, here's why" and progressively decreasing until now, when we get to "KX must die and let me hammer." Anyway, tbh, I just don't see how that mindset could be form normally. There are some other things to point out, but I'm tired, and this is a brief overview, will get back later in more detail. A few closing notes though, first, the one problem with Marquis as scum is if you notice, they treat Beast and HD in very different fashions, openly appearing to call the less conspicuous HD scum while taking a less aggressive stance against the more obvious scum beast, which wouldn't make very much sense as scum.

Also, one last thing, on the issue of my supposedly giving up, there's one more thing I forgot to mention, in a game I was previously in, when it looked like I was going to be lynched and having spent days arguing with a few annoying players, I gave up to the point were I self-voted to L-1, and then after things with me died down I even ended up subbing out since said point when I gave up killed my motivation. And all this was as town. Basically, what my point is, is that even if I had given up (which I didn't), you claim it would confirm me as scum, when I've done it as town. So even if my explanation for why saying I gave up was shit wasn't enough, even if you think I'm lying and just don't make any sense, it still wouldn't be scummy.

And, for the love of everything, can

anybody

tell me why I'm scummy.

[KX]

welp. fuck you too man.

(but srs, hopefully once I'm done looking this thing over, [19 days etc], we'll have something better on the table so I'm not the only lead for scum. and others could help with that effort too, you know.)

[KX]

@Muffin, I said I don't plan on pushing NotSci. Not that I don't plan on pushing scumreads. In fact, I actually specifically said earlier on that I planned on pushing Marquis. So thanks for reading. And on the subject of NotSci, why do you think he's town?

[KX]

oh yeah, and @Marquis, in case you somehow managed to forget both the rules and what happened last day, only a week is carried over at max, so lynching now and lynching in 11 days time gives exactly the same amount of carry over time. asking for a lynch now severely limits the time we have to deliberate and hunt. however, given the current situation of you just saying "KX is scum, don't question" I can see why things like deliberating and scumhunting would seem pointless to you.

[KX]

@Mod, shouldn't a living player be allowed to PM a dead player provided that the dead player doesn't say anything back? In that way, no living players receive any additional information or opinions which could influence their play from outside the thread.

[KX]

Don't worry Metal, thing will be happening soon enough, I just need to get a large chunk of free time. and @Muffin, already stated I think, but upon reading through the thread you'll find my reasons for thinking NotSci is scum, plus a couple dozen posts after it of NotSci flailing uselessly, which just proves the point more.

[KX]

This is the first time I've said you're flailing NotSci. Thank you for you immense dedication to the game, going so far as to make sure what you're saying is correct, and not just fantasy existing only in your head. It must just take so much effort, I don't know how you do it.

@Crash, NotSci wants to hammer me, and I don't see the point in voting him as everybody in the game appears to townread him. I'd rather cast my vote somewhere that it'll do good.

[KX]

You seem to be mistaken about a lot of things NotSci, glad to see you've finally admitted to one count.

Previously listed reasons still stand btw, as "it's the way I do things, don't hate" isn't a valid defense. And you never did explain to me how active lurking and noncommittal reads are policy lynch reason. Btw NotSci, not sure if you're aware of this, but stupidity isn't a towntell, otherwise I'd be with you on the obvtown as holy fuck part. Thinking about it, there was actually quite a bit to the case outside of the few tells I threw together in the end, and I bet I could make something good out of your recent posts. Maybe Metal will get his show after all.

[KX]

meh fuck it wanted to see if I could draw this out longer, but oh well. Figures I die just as some decent players get into the game. Live long metal buddy. Wonder if my cop prediction turns out to be correct. Anyway, last scum is Marquis fyi, can't believe NotSci is actually playing like this as town. Remind me to policy lynch you D1 if we're ever in a game again together Not. Oh yeah, and dick move Beast. Final regard, MVP ScumSlayer JOAT SK KX is out.

[KX]

oh yeah, and let the kid have his hammer on me, I think it'd be some nice irony.

[KX]

Yes, I've been responsible for one kill every night this game. I used a bulletproof action on both nights there was only a single kill. Given the agony I was causing the scum, I'm assuming that's why their kills failed. Peregrine was a scum snipe. Purple was a PR snipe. Hopkirk was a cop snipe attempt. Metal didn't die because I like him, he wasn't a threat, and it'd leave the option for the serial killer being the ones who's action was failing, not the scum's, the scum's killing likely failing because it was aimed at the SK thus making beast being truthful. And well played Marquis, I must say, if not for my cop I wouldn't have placed you. The push today was a little desperate though. Understandable after wasting two kills, but still.

[KX]

Also lol I like how I go to length to not antagonize the scum after peregrine, saying Marquis is town, putting SV above beast in lynch preference, etc, and then beast and hd play so badly I have to get rid of them anyway, making us enemies. Sucks how life goes, doesn't it? Ah well.

[KX]

Also Marquis, tell me, why the fuck did you try to kill me N3? I mean, N2 I can understand, you thought I was going to off Beast the next day, and after my play with HD, but by N3 you would have known I didn't kill beast while also knowing I was serial killer. I thought that'd show you I didn't want aggression, and yet . . .

[KX]

Nuuuuuuuuuu

Honor an old man's dying wish. Let NotSci be the one to finish me, the hero of this tale alongside the invincible Warrior Metal Sonic and the reserve cavalry of our pro subs, good spirits that they are, subbing in and reading for such a lackluster ending. Btw, @Mod, lack of flavor makes me disappoint.

[KX]

obviously that's what I'm doing, I love you Marquis. I thought you knew by now.

[KX]

did you read #1488 as well?

[KX]

btw, just to confirm, there is no chance at all that you guys are gonna just suddenly disband the wagon and let me win for my stunning intellect, amazing personality, dashing good looks, and impeccable play, right? I mean, the odds are pretty low and all, people tend to be selfish and not allow those who deserve to win do so if they can profit themselves instead, but I figure I may as well appeal to you all just the same.

[KX]

See post #1485. And though I suppose I kinda started things be killing Peregrine, one thing about me is I don't care if I started it, if somebody messes with me I mess back. Also, for why I didn't kill Marquis last night following Beast's actions, I still had a 1-shot distract, so if it did come to us both living this night, I could distract+kill to live. I believed the cop to be a bigger threat, and wanted to take them out asap, every night I let them live I risked more, and on top of that, I still held a faint hope that Marquis wouldn't go Beast's path and would kill somebody other then me. With your quoted post, it looked like I would end up the day's lynch, and so wanted to go with something I thought would succeed. Unfortunately, upon ISOing Marquis, I realized I couldn't force a lynch on them without looking the same way they looked pushing a lynch on me. The purpose of stating that specifically is as scum, I try to make my impressions of things be legitimate no matter what, and couldn't help but notice it. My inactivity over these past few days has been me searching for another target, with limited time online, to no avail.

Anyway, it's 1:23 am, and I have to get up early tomorrow, so if you have any more questions, either trust the hammer to get delayed, or ask them now.

[KX]

*see post #1485 for why I don't think my reveal is a dick move.

I started typing #1498 right after #1494 was posted. Btw Marquis, why the rush for hammer? We still have six more free days to spend before we start losing carry-over.

[KX]

If I were lying about who I inspected, I most certainly wouldn't claim that the person I thought was the cop was my scum target. All they'd need to do is claim "Cop here" and the mislynch would be averted, making my death for nothing. Nobody could risk counter-claiming since there'd be only a single scum left. And you haven't answered my question Marquis. Been taking lessons from NotSci?

[KX]

dashing good looks,

bro I don't even know how you look like

bro do you even photo album thread [on PO]? For crash test, problem is, Beast was already post hammer, making a modkill worthless. Anyway, apologies for ending the game so swiftly, but I felt it was justified, and you guys have a cop anyway, so.

[KX]

Matias you suck I fucking handed you the inspector, and your only chance to win, on a giant flag, and then you don't kill it

Ah well, good game everyone, very fun, I quite enjoyed my role, so thank you as well for the awesome game Mod!

[KX]

Rooting for KX in any case. But, I'll always root for a Serial Killer anyway.

<3 I love you too mod

And I suppose Marquis wasn't that obvious or I would have killed him N3, but I thought 1500 might as well have been a claim. As for myself, I felt that I handled the situation with Beast somewhat awkwardly, and something about my playstyle didn't seem right, almost a little to open I guess you could say. Other flaws would be the lack of variation in my reads, looking over some people isn't normal for me, I just could never motivate myself to do it though.

[KX]

Don't worry man, I'm just joking around, my picking of Hopkirk instead of Marquis kinda screwed the scum teams over no matter how you look at it.

[KX]

And on that Marquis I seriously have to say, remarkably good play this game, well done, though you could have worked harder to come up with a decent case against me.

[KX]

Because if somebody were to be paying attention, it'd out your role as cop, as it did to me, and overall it's just lazy, unpoetic play. Though, tbf, acting scummy enough to avoid nightkills and badwagons is exactly what you're supposed to do as cop, hence my saying well done.