Newbie 1546: Binary Trolls (Game Over!)

[Bulbazak]

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Vote Count

Toolenduso (0):
BlueBloodedToffee (0):
Luca Blight (0):
VictorDeAngelo (0):
Goodmorning (0):

Not Voting (5): Goodmorning, Toolenduso, BlueBloodedToffee, Luca Blight, VictorDeAngelo

It is day 3. With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Day ends on Wednesday, December 3 at 12:30pm EST. Countdown: (expired on 2014-12-03 12:30:00).

[toolenduso]

I’m in a meeting right now, so this post – which I wrote over the night phase – is the only one I’m going to be able to make for several hours. I obviously removed Nether from my reads list.

So, I'd just like to throw this out there. If you guys want to lynch scum today, good. We can work together and lynch scum.

However, I don't really expect that to happen. TGGC's flip probably reinforces the beliefs many already had that I am TGGC's partner. If I survive today and we lynch town, I will be a liability in LyLo because town will still suspect me as TGGC's partner and scum will be able to use that to their advantage.

Also, we've earned an extra mislynch by lynching scum.

So my proposal is basically this. If the majority of the player list excluding me thinks that I'm scum, you should just go ahead and lynch me so I'm not there as an easy mislynch in LyLo.

That being said, I'm not going to vote myself because I don't believe you should ever do that as town.

Here are my thoughts on who we should lynch today if it's not me:

Luca: I have Luca as a townread. His play style looks scummy (easily switching reads based on other player's arguments mainly), but he has done a few things that make him seem very town to me. One is Luca's switch from Shiro to VDA in post #841. Shiro was at L-1 at the time and I see no reason for scum to do this. Another is post #1466, in which Luca asks me to hammer because GM can just catch up overnight. This strikes me as towny because, A) Wouldn't scum rather try to look towny by gallantly jumping on to be the voice of reason and say we should wait until the lurker's posted?, B) Scum would already know what TGGC is going to flip so they wouldn't be so anxious to see the flip, and C) The main reason Luca gave for wanting to see the flip was so that he could form reads. This is a towny mentality -- one not too hard to fake, but nonetheless strikes me as being genuine. It just looks like a townie who has run out of things to consider and needs more evidence to influence reads.

VDA: VDA was the first reason to vote TGGC on D2 (post #1227), and for good reason. I just don't see scum in this position with their partner. My previous case on VDA was based on inferences from his posts; voting pattern trumps that as evidence. VDA is most probably town.

Blue: BBT has bad, bad, bad interactions with the Carli/TGGC slot. Posts #223, #230 and #326 are defenses of Carli after she replaced out, with 326 being the most damning piece of evidence because Toffee is defending the discrepancy between Carli's VT claim and TGGC's doc claim without really saying why. #1216 is BBT pushing for us to lynch somebody else besides TGGC, which makes sense from a scumbuddy perspective because it puts town in LyLo the next day. Obviously I did this as well, so it's not the greatest piece of evidence, but it adds to the record. In #1293, Blue says he's ready to vote TGGC. Then in #1302 he says TGGC could be town and goes back to saying we should lynch somebody else. In #1326, he's "ready to lynch TGGC already" and then in #1331 he votes GM. He finally hops on the TGGC wagon in #1414. To summarize, Blue defended the TGGC slot early and often, then waivered just enough to cast doubt on a connection between him and the scum partner he was sure was going to get lynched. Again, my read on Blue was mostly based on inferences from posting before and voting/interaction patterns surrounding scum trump that as evidence. As for Dyslexicon's vote on Carli, I see no reason why that couldn't be scum bussing without serious intent to lynch.

GiF/goodmorning: Early pushing of Carli looks more like it has to do with GiF fulfilling his IC responsibilities than it does like scum interacting with scum or town interacting with scum. Defending of Carli/TGGC slot begins in #43 with GiF saying that it didn't look to him like Carli was buddying. Post #110 is a defense of Carli's VT claim. #119 is a defense of Carli's "survivalistic" attitude. That's it until GM replaces in. #1374 gives GM's thoughts on the TGGC slot, which don't amount to much of a clear stance and could come from either scum or town. Shies away from getting in on the TGGC suspicion in #1379. Gives an indication she might go for Nether instead in #1456. Overall, GM was pretty noncommital about TGGC and the wagon against him. Now, this can be somewhat explained by the fact that GM never caught up fully, but we do know that GM saw the thing about TGGC "not understanding" that scum would know each other's roles and decided that that wasn't scummy.

Carli/TGGC: I don't see anything from Carli's or TGGC's interactions with any of the surviving players that really have meaning.

I like Blue for lynching today.

VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee

[Luca Blight]

I think GM is probably the other scum, but I will take a bit of time to reflect.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

VOTE: GM

I agree with your points about me, Tool. I'm in a pretty bad spot right now regarding my interactions with TGGC.

GM is TGGC's buddy though.

[VictorDeAngelo]

I have nothing to add until Goodmorning posts.

[Luca Blight]

Is GM due a prod?

Her inactivity is killing this game.

[Luca Blight]

Fuck it.

VOTE: GM

[Luca Blight]

L-1

[toolenduso]

Why GM, Luca? What do you think of Blue?

[Luca Blight]

Blue is certainly a possibility, but GM is my gut feeling.

I think her townread of TGGC was unreasonable - I tried to see it from every angle, but could not see how she, as an experienced player, could have have arrived at that opinion.

She has stalled the fuck out of this game, has had no clear direction in her play, no scumreads. If she is town then she ought to be disappointed with how she has performed.

I said yesterday if she hasn't caught up properly by day two there is no excuse, and I stand by that. If she comes back with something decent then maybe I'll consider unvoting, otherwise I can't see past her, despite the decent case you have against Toffee.

[Luca Blight]

by day three*

[Luca Blight]

So, I'd just like to throw this out there. If you guys want to lynch scum today, good. We can work together and lynch scum.

However, I don't really expect that to happen. TGGC's flip probably reinforces the beliefs many already had that I am TGGC's partner. If I survive today and we lynch town, I will be a liability in LyLo because town will still suspect me as TGGC's partner and scum will be able to use that to their advantage.

Also, we've earned an extra mislynch by lynching scum.

So my proposal is basically this. If the majority of the player list excluding me thinks that I'm scum, you should just go ahead and lynch me so I'm not there as an easy mislynch in LyLo.

That being said, I'm not going to vote myself because I don't believe you should ever do that as town.

Why did you feel the need to post this, Tool?

I wasn't particularly thinking you were scum following the flip. It seems like paranoia, and as if you're trying overly hard to appear town, and has me doubting my read on you now.

[Luca Blight]

I mean, Tool, if you are town then saying that is really bad.

By saying you are an easy mislynch and a liability in lylo makes it a reality. I wasn't having these thoughts about you before, but they are now in my head.

It feels like you're playing mindgames, and I don't get why town would do that at this stage, when we're seemingly in a healthy position. If I were in your shoes, I wouldn't focus on the possibility of my mislynch occurring, I would only have my eyes set on finding the remaining scum.

Your post disturbs me.

[Luca Blight]

By PoE I had written you and Victor off as Town, and now I've noticed that part of your post, it has me doubting myself.

You say you don't expect us to find scum today, why is that? Were you that convinced of being mislynched yourself? You seemed to have conviction in your Toffee read, but that undermines it a bit.

[toolenduso]

I wrote it for exactly the reasons I laid out in the post. I'm actually pretty surprised by how little people seem to want to lynch me right now because I feel like most people were suspecting me at the end of the last day and most of the reason for that was based on a suspicion that I was TGGC's partner. AfterTGGC flipped scum I figured that suspicion would only increase.

I said that I didn't expect town to lynch scum today because I expected to be lynched today.

Why did your read on me change to town after the flip?

[Luca Blight]

I don't think there was as much suspicion on you as you're making out. I suspected you a little at one point, but then considered GM's weird play and the case against Toffee and thought I could rule you out as probably town, now I'm not so sure.

I mean, you have that case on Toffee which as you say is pretty damning, but expect yourself to get lynched over him? And over GM who has given us nothing but a weak defence of scum?

I just got a bad feeling from it. I don't see something like that coming from town at this stage, as I said it feels like mind games. It leaves me unsure of whether we should call your bluff and lynch you now or go for the more obvious choices.

Either way, GM needs to weigh in.

[toolenduso]

I don't think there was as much suspicion on you as you're making out. I suspected you a little at one point, but then considered GM's weird play and the case against Toffee and thought I could rule you out as probably town, now I'm not so sure.

I do not see the post in your ISO where you stopped scumreading me before D3. Here's what I saw going into the night:

-The surviving scum almost certainly kills TGGC because not doing so means they are risking putting themselves farther away from victory either because of a no kill or a doc protect. Then we have an extra day to find the remaining scum.

something something RB something if he isn't Doc then you might something something potential scumslip

I find this summing up of my catchup really scummy.

Just reflecting on it now, I am going to narrow it down to Tool/GM being TGGC's scum partner.

Gut feeling is saying Tool at the moment

2. If TGGC will flip scum, we'll have 5 players tomorrow, 1 of them will be scum and 4 townies. So we'll basically have 2 attempts to find the scum.
I ask you to start with tool. I'm really sure he's TGGC's partner. His entire play during D2 was full of subtle attempts of moving the spotlight from the TGGC. And when TGGC will flip scum, there is really high chance tool will be scum too.

Why

wouldn't

I think I was getting lynched coming into today?

[Luca Blight]

There is some reason for you to think that, fair enough, but given how dodgy GM and Toffee look I don't see why you would be as convinced as you were for being lynched, that you felt the need to pre-prepare the stuff about being a liability at lylo, and that we should lynch you now if we're still unsure etc.

When there are other clear options for the lynch, why, as a townie, would you offer yourself up at this stage? There is clearly as much doubt surrounding the other two I have mentioned, meaning they would also be as much a liability in lylo for the same reasons.

@Mod, I believe GM is due a prod now.

[VictorDeAngelo]

ptap. Still not getting involved in anything until Goodmorning delivers this long overdue catchup.

[toolenduso]

There is some reason for you to think that, fair enough, but given how dodgy GM and Toffee look I don't see why you would be as convinced as you were for being lynched, that you felt the need to pre-prepare the stuff about being a liability at lylo, and that we should lynch you now if we're still unsure etc.

Well to be honest I haven't had a whole lot of faith in this town since the end of D1.

When there are other clear options for the lynch, why, as a townie, would you offer yourself up at this stage? There is clearly as much doubt surrounding the other two I have mentioned, meaning they would also be as much a liability in lylo for the same reasons.

Because I felt like I was the top suspect, not GM or Blue, and that it would be super easy for scum to push a mislynch on me if I made it through today and we went to LyLo.

And they're only going to be "liabilities" if they're town, which I strongly suspect is not the case for both.

[Luca Blight]

Ok.

I'm not sure what to think about it, tbh. I still think there is more chance of GM/Toffee being scum than you.

If you are town, though, then saying what you said is not good at all. It is essentially WIFOM mind games and just muddies the water.

[Bulbazak]

Goodmorning isn't due for a prod, but she is getting poked.

[Luca Blight]

She hasn't posted for seven days. Take away three days for the night, that leaves four days of day time since she last posted.

I assumed this was how it worked anyway, maybe it gets reset at the start of each day.

[Bulbazak]

It gets reset. Makes it easier for me to keep track.

[Bulbazak]

Bump.