[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/ext/alfredoramos/seometadata/event/listener.php on line 114: Undefined array key 6657057 [phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/ext/alfredoramos/seometadata/event/listener.php on line 114: Trying to access array offset on value of type null The Mission - 1 (Human Victory!) - Mafiascum.net
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Post #13 (isolation #2) » Mon Mar 09, 2015 3:04 am
Postby foilist13 »
No, I was asking Titus. "...
force
the first captain to
elect
without consult."
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's basically asking us to random elect a captain and force them to choose a team.
What is gained from this? Nothing. Read Archaebob's analysis of "eliminating possibilities" in the previous thread. The only gambit here is the captain is forced to choose from those that elected him/her. Either we blind luck a win or the mission fails. If the mission fails, what is learned? The captain or someone who voted the captain is scum. Maybe there are two scum, maybe one. Maybe the captain or maybe not. We learn only that the mission we just tried won't work if we try it again
and
we deliberately rob ourselves of any conversation or information.
It's... literally a freebie for scum.
This flies in the face of all the lessons we learned in the last game. Wtf?
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #20 (isolation #4) » Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:57 pm
Postby foilist13 »
No no no, nothing gets eliminated except the possibility we try in that exact moment. We only gain qualitative information which is only useful if we also have conversations and gut reads.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #29 (isolation #7) » Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:30 am
Postby foilist13 »
*foilist13 takes out his gun and shoots Titus again, notices that her blood is purple and that she still isn't dead, panics internally, shoots her several more times until the gun is empty and SHE'S STILL MOVING! OH GOD!
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #33 (isolation #8) » Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:13 am
Postby foilist13 »
This game is not resistance. It is explicitly structured so that no information is gained by POE. Titus knows this, yet she is voting for a mission that she will not be on, guaranteeing a strike against town (assuming she's town as she's pretending to be). We learned two major lessons from last game. First, never allow a mission you're not on. Second, there is no information to be gained from missions you are not on (or any).
Even if a player is going every time and the missions keep failing. Blackberry went on all but one mission last game and he was town. Even a player who never goes on a mission and we start to think they must be town. Titus didn't go on a single one until we thought that and she was scum. WE GAIN NO INFORMATION.
The only usable info is playstyle and gut. Period.
And I thought my reaction was funny dammit.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #45 (isolation #11) » Fri Mar 13, 2015 1:56 pm
Postby foilist13 »
Ok, so I did read the rules.
Vote: foilist13
So I'm the captain until I declare a team or one of my supporters (Vettrock and/or Mitillos) unvotes me. At that point my vote and theirs are negated and I stop being the captain. The day isn't over. I have no intention of declaring a team any time soon. Additionally, I can only declare a team from among my supporters, i.e. the people voting for me. Titus and McMenno can still vote me and become supporters up until I actually declare a team. Once I do declare a team that's it, the day is over and the mission happens. Unvotes at that point will be meaningless.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #50 (isolation #12) » Sat Mar 14, 2015 4:11 pm
Postby foilist13 »
Right, I can only pick from my supporters, but I don't have to pick until deadline, and my pool of supporters is subject to change.
@Titus, I'm not sure. McMenno is a Townsperson, which means he's new to the site. That makes him harder to read. I have liked Mitillos and vettrock's play thus far though and wouldn't be opposed to taking them.
@McMenno, if you vote me right now you will be among the pool of supporters. The fact that I've already been elected doesn't matter.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #59 (isolation #14) » Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:39 am
Postby foilist13 »
We aren't playing mafia.
What does information look like in this game? It doesn't come from lynching people or "catching" people. It comes from missions and going/not going on missions. No one has an excuse EVER to not be on a mission, so the ways in which we fight to be on missions are where it is most important. The scum mindset in this game is NOT to kill town, it is to get themselves or a buddy on a mission. The key difference is that individual scum don't have to be on a mission for it, and in a sense they have to play more of a long game than town since town can win on any day, but scum cannot.
So:
Patterns in posturing to distance or buddy with players can be alignment revealing. Fighting or not fighting to go on missions can be alignment revealing. Trust placed or not placed in particular captains can be alignment revealing.
Tell me I'm "posturing" all you want, I want to have a good game and I want to make sure people understand how to play. Only you and I played last time, and between the two of us I'm apparently the only one who learned anything.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #61 (isolation #15) » Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:11 pm
Postby foilist13 »
Why McMenno over Mitillos?
And I said Scum are in the long game, not town. Scum have to be on every mission.
True, town can sack a mission or four for... what? What's the incentive to let any mission slip by? We should be sending our best guess every time, especially because so little information is gained via failure.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #68 (isolation #17) » Tue Mar 17, 2015 8:01 am
Postby foilist13 »
@Mitillos: I see what you mean.
Titus seems weirdly certain that this mission will fail. Either she's town and is that convinced I'm scum from what play there's been so far, or she's pretty fucking sure her partner is going on the mission. That makes me lean towards taking McMenno and Mitillos despite my pure gut leaning towards Mitillos and Vettrock.
And why the fuck would scum as captain stall out a mission? Refusing a consensus after failing to get elected captain is a much stronger move since all eyes are on the captain. As captain you go on a mission no matter what your alignment is.
That said I actually had not realized deadline was so soon. I am declaring my intent to declare a team tomorrow morning. Mitillos is a pretty solid shoe in. Vettrock vs. McMenno will take some thought.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #78 (isolation #19) » Wed Mar 18, 2015 7:18 am
Postby foilist13 »
I am strongly tempted to take McMenno over Vettrock, largely because McMenno is a bit of a wild card. He's new to the site and has posted almost nothing. Vettrock is solid and not scumreading to me, but Titus has to be scum with someone (assuming she's scum at all) and jumping on a newbie partner at the beginning seems like an odd play. Maybe they distance from one another for a bit so we always take on of the two, but why make it extra difficult at the beginning for your partner to get on missions at all? Between Vettrock and Mitillos, Mitillos seems to have more original content and decisive positions, so I'm townreading him more strongly.
Last chance for thoughts. Mitillos?
Titus isn't coming. Thanks for the vote though
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #89 (isolation #24) » Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:38 am
Postby foilist13 »
1) You can't self vote except to hammer.
2) I asked for input at least four times, and I made it clear two days ago that I was certainly taking Mitillos and debating between Vettrock and McMenno. No one chose to comment usefully, least of all you. Fuck you, madame and your plan.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #92 (isolation #25) » Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:54 am
Postby foilist13 »
I don't know, I guess I was hoping that by posting my intentions and directly asking you for thoughts you might commit to an opinion on them. I guess I was wrong.
Taking McMenno was not motivated by my read on McMenno since I largely find it difficult to have one. It was more strongly motivated, as I said, by how Titus is playing assuming Titus-scum. That was the part I hoped you'd respond to.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #97 (isolation #27) » Wed Mar 18, 2015 1:48 pm
Postby foilist13 »
I don't know if I'll go so far as to call that a scum tell, but that's fairly weak. I told you what I was most likely to do and you waited until AFTER the mission failed to be upset about it. Scum you would profit from that move since voicing objections beforehand might derail the mission that was already going to succeed from your end.
Still, not the best move since scum you would cause the mission to fail regardless and derailing the mission so close to deadline might yield you a freebie.
It just feels like you didn't give it much thought at all when the cards were down and a scum already going on the mission could afford that.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #102 (isolation #28) » Wed Mar 18, 2015 4:08 pm
Postby foilist13 »
I'm not whoooolly opposed to Mitillos as captain, but from a strict game theory perspective there is no reason to let anyone else be captain other than yourself except when that simply isn't an option, so for now I'll avoid putting him at L-1. I'm not sure how to pursue my line of questioning further just yet, but it still doesn't sit well with me.
Vettrock, any updated read on Mitillos, or do you feel the same way you always have?
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #109 (isolation #32) » Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:27 am
Postby foilist13 »
Really? My bad on that, but we're really missing you in the conversation. Can you respond to the things said about yourself, and I am interested in your thoughts on Titus and Mitillos.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
In post 134, Mitillos wrote:@Titus: According to you, I've basically been stalling, too. Does that also make me scum?
No. You have not been stalling. You have articulated why you are stuck between options. Foil just said he did not want to.
In post 78, foilist13 wrote:I am strongly tempted to take McMenno over Vettrock, largely because McMenno is a bit of a wild card. He's new to the site and has posted almost nothing. Vettrock is solid and not scumreading to me, but Titus has to be scum with someone (assuming she's scum at all) and jumping on a newbie partner at the beginning seems like an odd play. Maybe they distance from one another for a bit so we always take on of the two, but why make it extra difficult at the beginning for your partner to get on missions at all? Between Vettrock and Mitillos, Mitillos seems to have more original content and decisive positions, so I'm townreading him more strongly.
Last chance for thoughts. Mitillos?
Titus isn't coming. Thanks for the vote though
I'm sorry, what?
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #140 (isolation #36) » Sat Mar 21, 2015 4:35 am
Postby foilist13 »
1) Do you see me going after Mcmenno? No. I'm yelling at him for not posting, but I haven't been grilling him nearly as much as I've questioned Mitillos. What could I scum read him for if he doesn't fucking post?
2) You read those two quotes pretty much perfectly.
All your arguments and predictions have been blatantly wrong.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #150 (isolation #38) » Sun Mar 22, 2015 5:53 am
Postby foilist13 »
Mitillos has been on all the missions, Mitillos is now cooperating with Titus. This is exactly what Mastin and Titus did in our last game and it went swimmingly for them.
Your perspective is no longer interesting to me, Mitillos, since it does not appear to be a town perspective.
So, my top scum teams are now:
Mitillos/Titus
McMenno/Vettrock
McMenno/Mitillos
If foilist13, vettrock, and McMenno fails then Titus is pretty much town barring her being scum with me, but I would find that shocking. Those willing to do their homework
read the previous game.
Titus' scum play is exactly the same.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #165 (isolation #43) » Thu Mar 26, 2015 5:12 am
Postby foilist13 »
@McMenno: Vote Vettrock. Vettrock can vote himself and become captain or vote Titus and go with the asshat plan. Either way we get some forward momentum in this game.
Pls come back to us McMenno
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #186 (isolation #49) » Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:00 am
Postby foilist13 »
@Vettrock: You're seriously voting for Titus? You're joking... I suggest you unvote Titus, and vote for me or wait for a vote on yourself and become captain.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #196 (isolation #51) » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:03 am
Postby foilist13 »
McMenno and I failed utterly to utilize the day talk or to collaborate at all really. I think with stronger play we could have taken this to at least the fourth or fifth mission.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
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Post #199 (isolation #52) » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:26 pm
Postby foilist13 »
Yeah, McMenno never really responded to me on the daychat, so I did my best to coach him in game? I was hoping my persona would kinda carry it, but no such luck.
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."
"If you are going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you."