Mini 1792: Baccano! Mafia [Game Over]

[Nosferatu]

TFW HATED

VOTE: NOSFERATU
MY TUMMY HURTS

SAME

VOTE: NADHIA
HOLY SHIT HOW CAN ONE PERSON BE THIS SCUMMY VOTE YOURSELF

[Nosferatu]

Leave for a few hours and I miss a szil claim
VOTE: flore

[Nosferatu]

If you think flore is loved then run her up to lynch and if she doesn't die then we were wrong this isn't very hard

[Nosferatu]

Oh nvm
UNVOTE: flore

[Nosferatu]

@mod: since we're confirming modifiers pls confirm mine ty

[Nosferatu]

tfw mod doesn't confirm my modifier

daily days why

[Nosferatu]

if the assassin loses the game I will honestly be very surprised. Like I wish I rolled that shit, easy win.

@Mod: if maiza dies will town lose?

[Nosferatu]

VOTE: alban
post more.

[Nosferatu]

@Mod Do the members of the mafia faction know Maiza's identity?

The answer will essentially be no-comment.

I don't think mafia would know, or else it would give them too much of an advantage, because they could too easily out this information to the assassin when they are about to get lynched.

no mafia wouldn't know because that would be confirmed knowledge on a player's role. It's giving an informed minority even more knowledge. Also don't discuss things the anti-town factions could do to detriment town.

[Nosferatu]

that did not happen as expected :/

[Nosferatu]

VOTE: Dwlee

Yes, except I only have one vote

I think Nos created a state in which the assasin could fall into and reveal themselves which Dwlee did.

I have literally zero idea what you're talking about. You should think really hard and re-read thread maybe?

[Nosferatu]

I almost think you or Thor is scum for pushing on the assassin to claim. Like, scum wants to know who is Slizard more than anyone else at this point because they really don't want to waste a nightkill hitting them. Also the Flore vote is bad, friendo.

p-edit no no no stop THERE IS A DOWNSIDE.

If I asked what this post was about would that defeat its purpose?

[Nosferatu]

fate just claim assassin

[Nosferatu]

It's just that since Maiza has a king modifier, I'm worried that his loss is a town loss but I wanted to ask the mod but they apparently don't like me

[Nosferatu]

LMAO

[Nosferatu]

Camn saying he's an investigative.

OOPS CATS OUTTA THE BAG NOW

WE ARE ISSAC
TOWN BAD DRIVER

ONCE DURING THE GAME, WE MAY CHOOSE TO CRASH OUR CAR INTO A PLAYER
WE WILL BE NOTIFIED IF IT IS SZILARD

LYNCH AHOY

Camn repeatedly saying that fate is confirmed szilard.

Oh you're now reduced to calling the wagon on you a petty revenge wagon?

Like we have no plans on letting a confirmed 3P live. It is a net positive for us, we get a confirmed bulletproof townie out of it.

Now that you've outted our role we outed our result HOPE YOURE HAPPY WITH THAT

I am nota threat to town

PURGE THIS WITH FIRE

ANYONE NOT VOTING THIS IN THEIR NEXT POST MIGHT AS WELL CLAIM SCUM

Untrue.

We said we would keep Sziliard alive under certain circumstances.

Fate, you are Sziliard, yes?
Are you willing to scumhunt with is or need we lynch you?

NEVER TRUST FATE HOLY SHIT

WE

DO

NOT

NEED

CONFIRMED 3P ALIVE

WHEN WE CAN GET A FREE BULLETPROOF IC FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE GAME

I live to scumhunt Aristo.

Katsuki even agrees with me on Thor

Can you talk some sense into Issac

YA BUT WHO CARES ABOUT SCUMTHOR WHEN WE CAN HAVE OUR SCUMFATE LYNCH????????????????

Anyway in all seriousness, shouldn't we like, not lynch the 3p that doesn't have any nightkills?
Also I completely buy camm's claim as town tho so that's radical.

VOTE: Aristo

Decent vote.

WE SHOULD 100% LYNCHED THE CONFIRMED SZILARD SO THAT WE CAN HAVE A BULLETPROOF IC FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE GAME

LIKE WHY IS THIS SO HARD???

MAFIA LITERALLY CAN

NOT

DISPOSE OF MAIZA AFTER FATE IS LYNCHED

We can't lynch Fate. He'll take a stab at Maiza if we try to. Why not put it off and lynch for mafia now? :T

SO LET HIM WHILE ITS STILL EARLY ENOUGH INTO THE GAME THAT HE PROBABLY WONT HIT MAIZA LMAO

WE GET TO LYNCH 3P

AND HE HAS A LOW CHANCE OF HITTING MAIZA

Fate did not flip as szilard. Camn is a dirty liar who fucked up this game for town, if he is town, for no fucking reason, and he doesn't deserve to continue to play.

pretty sure he can't invest during the day and he didn't claim that he used his ability on fate did he?

[Nosferatu]

You're assuming that every one uses the mod as the only way for someone to be confirmed. Unless he says he has a guilty on Fate I wouldn't call it faking a result.

[Nosferatu]

Oh? Do you know what I call a conclusion one arrives at regarding someone's alignment, without being informed of said alignment due to mod communication?

A read.

EBWOP.

Any read which is passed off as a guilty, or confirmed information of any sort, is a faked result.

Ok? Are you Camt? Are you literally every mafia player that had ever lived? Are you an omniscient deity? Are you implying that your definition of a faked result is the one used by each and every player in the game? Well I'm sorry to inform you that you're incorrect. To me a faked result is a claim that they investigated someone and received a result that they did not actually receive. Camt did not do that. So unless you have some other reason they should be lynched that isn't essentially a policy lynch, I'd suggest you tell the crowd.

[Nosferatu]

tbh itll be a lot funnier if we lynch Fate before he gets a chance to eat so pls vote accordingly guys

I refuse to eat.

I won't allow my Ghoul nature to take over

But I will find a way to live in harmony with it

Ye ok fate was totally oozing "not szliard" wasn't he. Fate LITERALLY said he was trolling. He had basically no intention of playing seriously and was basically trying to get lynched.

[Nosferatu]

isn't essentially a policy lynch

What's wrong with a policy lynch?

I don't like to lynch people for non alignment indicative things if I can help it.

[Nosferatu]

btw this is probably why tsuki started calling Fate conf 3p, since after this is when he starts referring to him as such.

Staeg there's uh

a few things that would interfere with my ability to read Katsuki.

THis game unfortunately includes one of them

We can lynch White Light or Thor.

Unvote:
Vote: White Light

Thor will probably have less traction and he's a slippery son of a bitch, so here we are

LOOK AT THIS BACKTRACK LMAO

FATE SCUM WOULDNT BACKTRACK LIKE THIS
AND FATE TOWN WOULD NEVER HAVE PUSHED US IN THE FIRST PLACE

G FUCKING G

[Nosferatu]

2) He said something about not giving in to his ghoul nature and eating. That is CLEARLY a joke. There is no argument that can be made that he intended that be interpreted as a claim to be Szilard.

This argument, unlike the defense of camn's terrible play, goes far beyond semantics alone.

SHUT THE FUCK UP ISSAC

OOPS CATS OUTTA THE BAG NOW

WE ARE ISSAC
TOWN BAD DRIVER

ONCE DURING THE GAME, WE MAY CHOOSE TO CRASH OUR CAR INTO A PLAYER
WE WILL BE NOTIFIED IF IT IS SZILARD

LYNCH AHOY

This is also pretty obviously a joke.
He literally just claimed to be the person that fate referred to him as. Exactly what happened when fate talked about refusing to eat after tsuki said it would be funny to lynch him before he had the opportunity to. These have the same progression but you reached different conclusions for essentially no reason.

[Nosferatu]

isn't essentially a policy lynch

What's wrong with a policy lynch?

I don't like to lynch people for non alignment indicative things if I can help it.

I have never seen a policy lynch applied to anything that isn't excessive lurking, lying, or solid anti-town play.
If someone is actively playing in a way that benefits scum (which is why it's called anti-town) isn't that alignment indicative of them being less likely town?

No. There are townies that just act in anti town ways. Policy lynches are just lynches for a reason other than the content of their posts. Something better if avoided.

[Nosferatu]

Did you forget that Cerberus claimed page one? Even if Cerb didn't care about the game, we shouldn't just vote out someone that is more likely townI didn't forget it, I still never read it - why do you think it makes him more likely town than not?

I find that when someone claims immediately right at the beginning and there is no counter claim, they are most likely town. Would you disagree?

Ascetic is a modifier, not alignment indicative at all. Scum can have a modifier as well as town.

[Nosferatu]

No. There are townies that just act in anti town ways. Policy lynches are just lynches for a reason other than the content of their posts. Something better if avoided.

So we can agree that the player plays in a way that hurts town when they are town, and hurts town when they are scum.
I fail to see how the idea of lynching them then doesn't pay attention to the content of their posts.
If a player is hurting my wincon, then they're a good lynch, yeah?

not exactly, I'm not saying you shouldn't policy lynch. If kaintepes was in this game, I'd be all for lynching him. My argument is they shouldn't be prioritized over an actual lynch.

[Nosferatu]

No. There are townies that just act in anti town ways. Policy lynches are just lynches for a reason other than the content of their posts. Something better if avoided.

So we can agree that the player plays in a way that hurts town when they are town, and hurts town when they are scum.
I fail to see how the idea of lynching them then doesn't pay attention to the content of their posts.
If a player is hurting my wincon, then they're a good lynch, yeah?

not exactly, I'm not saying you shouldn't policy lynch. If kaintepes was in this game, I'd be all for lynching him. My argument is they shouldn't be prioritized over an actual lynch.

What is the actual lynch you're suggesting we prioritize over camn?

can you find the word camn in any of my responses to thor's questions?

[Nosferatu]

@Nosferatu - Why not answer his core question instead of playing a dance, who is your current top lynch desire?

don't have one atm

[Nosferatu]

I swear to god every single game

[Nosferatu]

I can do that as scum fam

[Nosferatu]

1. Oh, snap, sorry, didn't realize I need to continually prove that I don't drool on myself.
2. I said unvote him if you weren't - you told me to sod off, if by that you meant 'but I am scuma-reading him!' then I submit you need to work on how you express your beliefs.

No, you just need a consistent display over an extended period of time. Your inability to understand that when I comment on a demand you make that is not, in and of itself, a statement one way or another about how I feel about the slot in question, is messing with the consistent part of my expectations.

I'll spell it out for you: I'm scumreading him, but fuck you if you think I give a damn about whether or not you want me on a wagon.

Is that clear enough now?

I'm going to have to ask you to prove your competence by telling the class why camt is scum and not why he should be lynched. So far you have only demonstrated that he exhibited anti-town play.

[Nosferatu]

Wait alright alright alright
Nosferatu's iso is actually devoid of any non-semantics content after an early florestan vote
literally empty

semantics are scummy why? I argue over semantics literally every game.

[Nosferatu]

1. Oh, snap, sorry, didn't realize I need to continually prove that I don't drool on myself.
2. I said unvote him if you weren't - you told me to sod off, if by that you meant 'but I am scuma-reading him!' then I submit you need to work on how you express your beliefs.

No, you just need a consistent display over an extended period of time. Your inability to understand that when I comment on a demand you make that is not, in and of itself, a statement one way or another about how I feel about the slot in question, is messing with the consistent part of my expectations.

I'll spell it out for you: I'm scumreading him, but fuck you if you think I give a damn about whether or not you want me on a wagon.

Is that clear enough now?

I'm going to have to ask you to prove your competence by telling the class why camt is scum and not why he should be lynched. So far you have only demonstrated that he exhibited anti-town play.

Is being anti town not a reason on its own to suspect scum?

anti town and scummy are different

oh.

Had you not considered this turn of events?

I didnt expect nos to just say they could do that as scum

I've done it to you as scum

[Nosferatu]

Yo nos, somehow I missed your 27 pagebottom. when did you make a case while you were scum like that?

red neighborhood.

[Nosferatu]

mfw I'm still burdened by proficiency because of a game >6 months ago.

[Nosferatu]

dwlee what the fuck are you doin fam

at least day 3 for VCA maybe longer in a mini

[Nosferatu]

@staeg: if you look through any game I have you'll probably find a section of my iso heavily focused on setup spec. I guess my first game on site was like that, but that was a weird game for me, I had a pretty big post count uncharacteristic of me. As scum, I don't think I've ever focused on setup spec.

[Nosferatu]

That isn't VCA. What the fuck are you doing?

yeah, someone earlier said it was VCA so I assumed it was. Just read up, I still don't like it. Has this ever worked for you? You never used this in the games we've been in.

[Nosferatu]

Warning to nosferatu: Yes this is VCA on Day 2, deal with it.
Fate (7): Dwlee99, camntsuki, WhiteLight, Nahdia, Aristophanes, Thor665, Florestan
Thor665 (2): Nosferatu, Fate
WhiteLight (1): Staeg
camntsuki (1): AlpacaAlpaca

Not Voting (2): heuristically_alone, Cerberus v666
One of ari/flore who are on the wagon scum.
And then Alpaca or HA are off the wagon scum.
Now that I think about it nosferatu and staeg could be scum as well. Still mostly suspicious of the 4 people on the other list but I could see nos or staeg being scum.

well this isn't even VCA now

[Nosferatu]

so this is the first time you've done it?

[Nosferatu]

@staeg: if you look through any game I have you'll probably find a section of my iso heavily focused on setup spec. I guess my first game on site was like that, but that was a weird game for me, I had a pretty big post count uncharacteristic of me. As scum, I don't think I've ever focused on setup spec.

Setup spec is nowhere near my main gripe, so let me reiterate. I asked about the semantics thing. You said you do it every game. Please link me a game where you've done it before, since I did not succeed at finding one.

It was harder to find than I imagined, since this one didn't come up when I just typed in '+semantics' into the search bar

[Nosferatu]

I don't like you staeg.

[Nosferatu]

There was nothing for me to defend. I defended against everything they had said and they just ignored me and continued to scream I was scum lol

But than why was it than when people were saying you are scum and are going to die that you didn't say this than. If the accusations were baseless than you should have refuted them when they happened not now, or maybe even counterwagon one of your accusers on the grounds of them pushing an innocent town. I just don't like how you responded to the accusations. If you did defend and they kept on pushing than you keep on defending not just say lol.

so you basically expected him to flail?

[Nosferatu]

VOTE: cerb
rolefishing? Despite the fact that he's at L-1, the game is stagnating and there's more than a week left in day phase; there's no reason for dwlee to claim now.

[Nosferatu]

claim should be when there's an intent to hammer.

[Nosferatu]

but muh vote on cerb

or any vote on heuristic

[Nosferatu]

S C U M H A S B E E N F O U N D

[Nosferatu]

Maiza's bulletproof so there's no reason to hide his identity at this point no? Even if maf don't know, they can't kill him, and I don't discount possibility that there are more uninformed townies.

[Nosferatu]

I feel like if scum didn't know they would claim that they did so we would out it, and therefore let them know who to not shoot.

[Nosferatu]

I don't want him in LYLO, either.
I'm at the point in the game where I envision a 5p lylo with me, thor, and 3 other players ... god forbid they are Florestan/Alpaca/nosferato.
I don't want any of them there.

Don't worry, I'll obv town, lynch scum, and die immediately afterwards long before then.

[Nosferatu]

That's frustration and just depends on alpacas personality

[Nosferatu]

Yeah we need 6, right?

Plu we need Nosf and Cerbrus to take a pre-flip stance here, too.

Flore is probably scum. His attempts to swing attention back on alpaca, the opposing lynch, is really scummy in particular. Also doubt that loved and hated are on the same team. I don't like staeg and very was givin me some weird vibez so I might check them out.

Also as camn was saying, you guys actually need to kill me before LyLo. Me in LyLo is pretty much auto scum win cause hated.

[Nosferatu]

On that note

VOTE: Flore
Claim, yadda yadda yadda; this is L-1, you know the drill.

[Nosferatu]

mfw i just now realize me and florestan both have quotes from the same book in our sigs

[Nosferatu]

Also doubt that loved and hated are on the same team.

Why?

Also as camn was saying, you guys actually need to kill me before LyLo. Me in LyLo is pretty much auto scum win cause hated.

So you'd like the Vig to shoot you, is what I'm hearing?

1. Mostly gut, just weird.
2. Whatever it takes to not let me get into LyLo.

[Nosferatu]

Staeg lynch I could really gel with

[Nosferatu]

But does flore is scum too?

[Nosferatu]

But flore is scum too?

Phone error

[Nosferatu]

Vote one of them, you're not voting anyone so, y'know, vote a top scum read?

On that note

VOTE: Flore
Claim, yadda yadda yadda; this is L-1, you know the drill.

Uh huh.

[Nosferatu]

ayo VOTE: staeg

though if this flips town it does look really bad for flore because it means twice he tried to survive by jumping on an alternate wagon and that should probably be lynched.

pedit: flip a coin tbh

[Nosferatu]

WTF, Dwlee?
Rolecops are scummy af at baseline.

Besides, he actually means "Rachael, Scum JOAT, one of which is a rolecop, the others too scummy to express, please lynch me"

truly.

1-shot rolecop, gunsmith, or anything that doesn't strictly alignment indicative is actually really just a JOAT claim.

[Nosferatu]

dodged

[Nosferatu]

caught up, nothings changed. Still good with staeg or flore, and possibly cerb.

[Nosferatu]

so the rolecard snafu from the mod prompted me to look at my rolecard, and it turns out, in MyLo/LyLo I lose my hated modifier.



whoops

[Nosferatu]

jsyk I don't have any other abilities, so continue with the mass claim as you will

[Nosferatu]

ffs nos. Why did you claim? Did you not see the order?

because I was just clearing up the mistake I made yesterday.

[Nosferatu]

I'm a 1-shot bodyguard, I call bullshit on your claim
VOTE: Alpaca
That is a scum claim.

your claim is the most suspicious. why the fuck are you the only x-shot in this game?

[Nosferatu]

Hello,

Staeg

, and welcome to Baccano Mafia.

Rachel, Town 1-shot Rolecop

You have the following abilities

• At Night, you can PM me the name of the player. If you succeed, you will learn their Role Name, but not their alignment. You may use this ability only once.
  
• You know that alban is Maiza Avaro.

Win Condition

: You win when all players aligned with the

mafia

are dead and at least one player aligned with the

town

is alive.

Rachel, 1-shot rolecop, shot not yet used.

eh don't hammer

UNVOTE:

I'm considering staeg confirmed town atm.

nosf pls

I haven't been thinking straight lately. Should probably sleep for once.

[Nosferatu]

lynch alpaca, if town dwlee bgs me, if I die, dwlee lied. If dwlee is telling the truth, then last one is cerb. gg.

[Nosferatu]

*if town, dwlee bgs me

[Nosferatu]

lynch alpaca, if town dwlee bgs me, if I die, dwlee lied. If dwlee is telling the truth, then last one is cerb. gg.

Why Alpaca first, why not, for instance, a Cerb first?
Cerb even said he should be lynched - I tend to instinctively support that, because I like to punish it as a gambit.

same difference.

[Nosferatu]

my mind went to alpaca first because IC BP and BP on the same team is kinda fishy.

[Nosferatu]

So you think town Ascetic to block one shot rolcop and one shot bodyguard doesn't seem fishy?

nomenclature is my argument here, not utility

[Nosferatu]

we could follow my strat and be guaranteed a win, but if you wanna try and nail it today, go ahead.

[Nosferatu]

we could follow my strat and be guaranteed a win, but if you wanna try and nail it today, go ahead.

How exactly is this a guaranteed win when alpacas alignment is stil unknown, and scum can easily choose to not kill tonight?

true, I was assuming dwlee to be town here. breaking strat is ded.

[Nosferatu]

yes dwlee the mod put both loved and hated on the same scum team. We have no night abilities or proper passives, and we've been left to dodge a vig, a suicide bomber, a veteran, and a role cop through pure ingenuity and skill.

no.

[Nosferatu]

Well if you missed it I'm luck

Going by just flavor you're scum fam.

Dallas.

[Nosferatu]

I don't know anything about the flavor. Can you explain, nosf?

florestan flipped Luck's fiancee

[Nosferatu]

ah yeah, true

I was like 10 when I read this so yeah

[Nosferatu]

ye cause you're literally the only person who can die.

[Nosferatu]

unsure if it's between alpaca and cerb or alpaca and dwlee

[Nosferatu]

My thing is why would town have two BPs?

[Nosferatu]

@thor: It's very true, Cerb's role doesn't make much sense. Ascetic is a scummy sort of role, but it might just be a red herring. It actually makes a lot of sense that scum would have a role that wouldn't get targeted by an investigative role, but there's only a rolecop, so that doesn't make much sense. Also based on the fact that the rolecop died, I think that scum is susceptible to it. That's why I doubt alpaca more than cerb.

[Nosferatu]

Ok so how I see it now is when you guys lynch me and i flip town than during the night whoever is scum will probably end up killing dwlee, or Cerb than you are left with 1 confirmed town and 2 potential scum candidates which seems like a bad place to be. If you lynch me at least consider that scum might not be Cerb since if you mess up it's a scum win and if the confirmed town votes the wrong person than scum will jump on it. However if Cerb is scum it is always possible to have fake claimed ascetic, though that would be pretty ballsy to do early D1 so if it is a fake claim I applaud you Cerb, but if he did fake claim it than we have one role unaccounted for and who knows what that could be. If Nos is scum than he can easily kill Dwlee and hop on the Cerb wagon that Thor seems intent on making the next day. If Dwlee is scum than I assume he would kill Cerb and go on the fact that basically everyone is townreading him the next day to lynch Nos.

but you rolled a scum role pm so none of this matters?

[Nosferatu]

Eh, maybe scum were given a strongman just to offset the perma town PR if the SK derped, and then maybe town was given another BP to help justify scum's killing power boost, but that's about it.
I will say I did continually like Alpaca's play, but...that setup seems unlikely. Not insane, just unlikely.

I mean what would be the point of adding a BP if scum have a strongman to bypass it? It's effectively the same as just adding another member of the town.

[Nosferatu]

What's the point of a Cop if there's a GF?
What's the point of a tracker if there's a ninja?
Simply because counters exist does not invalidate the existence of roles, or that mods often use them in specific conjunction with other roles that preclude them.

but you're suggesting a counter to offset a problem, and the counter doesn't fix the problem. If there's a scum strongman to get rid of the IC BP, putting a BP in the game isn't really fixing that. It also doesn't mesh with the subplot of the game: the assassin trying to find the BP. If scum can just kill the BP, that completely destroys a whole alignment, and from florestan's flip, scum knew about you being the BP, but didn't do anything. It's just, why?

[Nosferatu]

Wayo, I did something

[Nosferatu]

More like helped really :/

[Nosferatu]

Confession: the thought that there is a dead thread constantly berating my play pleasures me greatly.