Newbie 1764: Wind Game Over

[mhsmith0]

Votecount 1.08

Ramcius (1)

Charloux ,

DeathByWobbuffet (2)

Gamma Emerald , Ramcius ,

Gamma Emerald (1)

Mewtaph ,

Charloux (2)

Van_Veacesalv_Dulca , Accountant ,

Accountant (1)

nydushermain ,

Not Voting (2)

Pepchoninga , DeathByWobbuffet ,

Day one deadline is Sunday December 25, 11 AM PST. (expired on 2016-12-25 12:00:00)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch!

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[Gamma Emerald]

Yep, so I already feel out of my depth in this game :/ Sorry everyone for being inactive, I have been a little unreliably attached to the internet for the last 2-3 days.

@Van: So, to be clear, you think that forming lynches on players is okay, but you think mindlessly hopping onto wagons is bad, right?

Yes, I think mindless wagon hopping is bad. Forming Lynches is more case by case dependent. If I think someone is town, but people are forming a lynch on them and I can't understand the argument, I will become suspicious of those players, and equally so those that vote for the player without adding their own thoughts.

I still hold my suspicions on Charloux, and Accountant, though could someone correct me if I am wrong on Accountants [quote="In post 83 but is this an example of wine in front of me? I don't fully understand the concept, but the only other game I played (different site), people told me wine in front of me was scummy because it reduces the ability to properly argue against it or something along those lines.

I am also suspicious of Gamma for town reading me? I didn't think I had done enough of anything to form a solid read on me. - Nevermind, sorry, I missed a few posts it seems I haven't decided if this point is mute yet though I am leaning no, that seems very little to go off of in my opinion

owo

I understand the concern about the townread, but what I did was I formed an opinion on every player in my catch-up, no exceptions. Your concern actually makes me think you're town even more.

[Mewtaph]

I end up being a burden to town in most of my games, i feel kind of pathetic.
There is a way for my actions so far to be seen as town, but most people here are too paranoid to think about it. Now then, telling the whole truth will reduce the chance of town winning a lot. Getting myself lynched would have the same effect, so i think i'll risk it and hope i don't get lynched.

There's something about Charloux's recent posts that feels more genuine to me than a normal display of anger, it feels like a sombre, subtle tone of frustration, towards himself that feels town to me.

I have a few things I'd like to get sorted out though.

I'll go on a limb here and say you are using an alter-ego in this game, or you are just bad with pressure hence taking an aggressive approach to fend off any potential attacks on your slot.

I don't see town mentality there.

I disagree with the angle you're trying to take on Ramcius so far. I think that the mentality that he's showing can belong to both alignments, and I'm getting the impression that he would act like this regardless of alignment like it's his sort of meta he's already developed. I think that it might be a combination of both because he strikes me as more confident than scared, it doesn't seem like an either/or situation to me. Can you see this?

I like the idea behind what you're trying to explain, that you were trying to test Accountant because we can't get him in conventional ways which I can understand where this thought comes from. The problem I have is that I don't think that it was particularly clear that Accountant was supposed to recognize what you're saying at all, so it just comes off as if you're thinking a bit too much about PRs than you really should be imo.

[Mewtaph]

Yep, so I already feel out of my depth in this game :/ Sorry everyone for being inactive, I have been a little unreliably attached to the internet for the last 2-3 days.

That's alright, just get your thoughts into the thread, you don't have to feel extremely confident about all of them. Generally, more conversation = good.

@DBW: You previously expressed distaste towards Gamma's wagon being at L-2 in your second post, could you expand on this thought a bit more? Can you pinpoint what exactly made you feel uncomfortable about the Gamma wagon?

And speaking of Gamma, if you're still around, do you want to talk with me about anyone you feel particularly strongly about? I don't have a big impression on you atm. (town lean for read transparency) I think I need more than a rainbow read list to get a strong read on you, I agree with your Ramcius + nydus townreads, maybe not that strength on Ramcius but I want more from you on your other reads.

[Mewtaph]

Thirdly, a lot of what I am doing right now is trying to get into people's mindset. Ramcius is paranoid. Gamma is enthusiastic.

Mewtaph is trying to game-solve.

Some of these things are indicative of certain alignments. Some are not, but they help me understand where a player is coming from so it's easier to determine their alignment in the following posts.

Secondly, you claim that I do not have a decent set of reads. Again, I am not sure where you got this impression. I do have quite a few reads - specifically I read Gamma as slightly scummy, Ramcius as town, and Charloux and

Mewtaph as moderately townie.

Granted, these are not complete or particularly strong, but it's unreasonable to expect very strong reads on page 3.

@Accountant: I was rereading for things that feel off to me and I don't feel great about your 69 where you basically say, "Mew is trying to game-solve = moderately townie." It just seems a bit lazy to me that you aren't really bothering to sort me even now like I kind of expected. I understand that you posted that partly to explain yourself to nydus early on even though the reads were premature, but I'm assuming these reads are still reasonably accurate. I really don't like how you and Gamma aren't trying to actively sort out your hard nulls + moderate townreads, that may just be a personal preference but I put a high priority on trying to sort these reads into essentially anything else ASAP.

[Mewtaph]

I believe that what Accountant is doing is provoking people to show there true self. Questions in mafia are not asked for people to get answers but to see reactions. Ways they answer are hints to who they are. Tho this can also be used as a great protection. Xe almost talks like all his actions till this point are all made in the benefit of town. While other members are showing some motives and are even demonstating there playstyles, Accountant is being calm and collected, asking questions and then leaving them at that, without taking actions or persuing people who he belives are not town to further pressure them.

FoS: Accountant

Has Accountant's posts 69 and 83 eased your suspicions or "FoS" on Accountant in any way? Why/why not?

[Mewtaph]

I asked something similar to nydus in 129, which I think both of you need to sort out in some way or another if either of you want to continue pushing Accountant in a meaningful manner.

[nydushermain]

I asked something similar to nydus in 129, which I think both of you need to sort out in some way or another if either of you want to continue pushing Accountant in a meaningful manner.

Sorry I must've missed it. I find it interesting that accountant is almost avoiding giving a read on me even though I was the first person to push on him and he's asked me questions (which is, if I recall him saying, his attempts at determing people's alignments by making them reveal their true selves). Maybe I missed it because I'm not taking notes but I find it really odd. I also read a couple of his past games when he was town and he was way more aggressive. It feels like in this game, he's playing it a lot more laid back, and it seems like he's just trying to avoid getting in a major conflict with anyone.

[DeathByWobbuffet]

that makes 0 sense

why? we need find mafia, you do nothing to help, how that not makes sense? we can misslynch 2 times and still win, so i'm totally fine with PL on someone, who do nothing

What I meant is that I can't understand your English.

[mhsmith0]

Votecount 1.09

Ramcius (1)

Charloux ,

DeathByWobbuffet (2)

Gamma Emerald , Ramcius ,

Gamma Emerald (1)

Mewtaph ,

Charloux (2)

Van_Veacesalv_Dulca , Accountant ,

Accountant (1)

nydushermain ,

Not Voting (2)

Pepchoninga , DeathByWobbuffet ,

Day one deadline is Sunday December 25, 11 AM PST. (expired on 2016-12-25 12:00:00)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch!

[/size]

[nydushermain]

I think that an accountant wagon would be good and maybe it doesn't have enough traction with just 1 person on it (me) so I think pepchoninga, if you voted on him, it would be very helpful.

[Accountant]

Sorry, but i won't reveal all my cards without a fight.

Unfortunately, claiming that you have secret motives is not something that makes me think you are town.

[Accountant]

I still hold my suspicions on Charloux, and Accountant, though could someone correct me if I am wrong on Accountants [quote="In post 83 but is this an example of wine in front of me?

83 is not WIFOM. WIFOM is saying "I'd do X as mafia and Y as town", but I am claiming that I'd do X as both mafia and town. It's the opposite of WIFOM. WIFOM isn't scummy either, unless it's used to obscene excess.

[Accountant]

@Accountant: I was rereading for things that feel off to me and I don't feel great about your 69 where you basically say, "Mew is trying to game-solve = moderately townie." It just seems a bit lazy to me that you aren't really bothering to sort me even now like I kind of expected. I understand that you posted that partly to explain yourself to nydus early on even though the reads were premature, but I'm assuming these reads are still reasonably accurate. I really don't like how you and Gamma aren't trying to actively sort out your hard nulls + moderate townreads, that may just be a personal preference but I put a high priority on trying to sort these reads into essentially anything else ASAP.

This is not the way I scumhunt. I focus on my scumreads first, like Charloux.

[Mewtaph]

that makes 0 sense

why? we need find mafia, you do nothing to help, how that not makes sense? we can misslynch 2 times and still win, so i'm totally fine with PL on someone, who do nothing

What I meant is that I can't understand your English.

??

[Mewtaph]

@ny: The game being shorter if Accountant wasn't posting is more indicative of Accountant being town imo

Then why is Accountant null on your readlist?

[Gamma Emerald]

@ny: The game being shorter if Accountant wasn't posting is more indicative of Accountant being town imo

Then why is Accountant null on your readlist?

ny's reasoning was that if Accountant hadn't posted the game would be shorter amd she was scum for that and I felt the logic was off. My catchup was based on content, not activity level, so that caused a mismatch.

[nydushermain]

@ny: The game being shorter if Accountant wasn't posting is more indicative of Accountant being town imo

Then why is Accountant null on your readlist?

ny's reasoning was that if Accountant hadn't posted the game would be shorter amd she was scum for that and I felt the logic was off. My catchup was based on content, not activity level, so that caused a mismatch.

No you misunderstood. My reason for calling accountant scum was for other reasons. The only reason I lied and said he was light scum (instead of saying for sure scum) was purely for activity reasons. It was pretty much my way of saying I would give him somewhat of a break because of activity but other than that, there was nothing. So yeah, opposite of what you said. I gave him townie points for activity instead of scum points.

[Ramcius]

Ny, are you saying we should lynch accountant, cause he was asking questions and being active? That's a red flag on you now

[nydushermain]

Ny, are you saying we should lynch accountant, cause he was asking questions and being active? That's a red flag on you now

What? Have you not read anything I've said about accountant?

[nydushermain]

I literally said that he was scum for other reasons and the ONLY reason why I didn't think he was an automatic lynch was because of his activity.

[Accountant]

What is this other reasons?

[nydushermain]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 7#p8632534 That's my ISO

[Accountant]

Well, I'm very tired and I just had a very tiring week. I am not in the mood to play ISO games. Please link to the exact post where you outline your reasons.

[Charloux]

VOTE: DeathByWobbuffet
Nothing really stood out as really scummy that much for me, so i think its a good idea to drag the words out of this guy here.