Micro 687: Vanilluxe Mafia - Mafia Victory!!!

[Eddie Cane]

So you're scumreading me for being sitewide VLA?

sure. if that makes you happy.

Lowell, join me.im not voting gl.

[Eddie Cane]

dead



still waiting on comments from sbf and Bella.

@Eddie - if you want more content from me ask me questions. I've been trying to keep my reads closer to my chest than in previous games (for various reasons) but I'm still happy to work with y'all if you think I haven't been providing enough info.

thoughts on my case against frogger? any other game thoughts?

Spoiler:

[Lowell]

So you're scumreading me for being sitewide VLA?

sure. if that makes you happy.

Lowell, join me.im not voting gl.

Why not GL?

[Eddie Cane]

I scum read frogger a lot more

[Fro99er]

I scum read frogger a lot more

do you scumread GL?

[Fro99er]

This where I'm at right now

{bork}
{SS, GL}
________
{TTT, Bella, SBF}
________
{EC, Lowell}

Of the null tier I think I'd lean town on TTT the most for a few things he said earlier in the day

[Eddie Cane]

bork

sbf (came back from being idle with a vengeance)

bella

Lowell

GuiltyLion
tttt

Sobolev
frogger

[Fro99er]

talk to me about sbf

[Eddie Cane]

good attitude, good content (with just about no filler), rubs me the right way.

[Lowell]

oh he knows how to rub you the right way, does he?

tee hee

/shows self out

[Eddie Cane]

it's a girl so it's even better!

[TTTT]

@eddie
plz tell me every thought you've ever had about Bella

[TTTT]

for two people who know each other well, between frog and bella i see a lot more evidence of the former trying to read the latter than the reverse

^twuth!

Bella is a bad bad girl and needs more votes.
It's easy
just copy and paste...

Code: Select all

[vote]Bella[/vote]

[TTTT]

@TTTT, no, seriously, no one ever thinks I'm town D1. You are suspicious.

maybe I'm ace day1 town-reader
maybe I'm wrong (but I doubt it)
maybe I'm scum (but I'm not)
maybe it's maybelline (it is)

[GuiltyLion]

I could get behind a Bella wagon

Fro99er / Eddie looks very much like a TvT to me, and the Lowell comment on Fro99er in 524 just doesn't ring true at all. I'm like 100% in agreement with what bork said in 503

I'm here
town: {bork, eddie, Fro99er, TTTT}
meh: {SS, SBF, Bella}
scum: {Lowell}

response to the SBF case forthcoming

[GuiltyLion]

You're arguing that it's scummy to not have a sincere and thorough scumread 160 posts in the game, which I find hard to believe. I had no townvibes whatsoever from your opening two posts, saw no evidence of game-solving, wanted you to get pressured/wagoned. That's entirely different from saying "I am very confident that SBF is scum", which feels like the arbitrary and disingenuous standard that you'ree trying to impose on me.

1 )

No townvibes = null. Significant scum vibes = SR. A SR is literally "I am confident this slot is scum". This is extremely straight-forward. There is meaningful contradiction in your stances and you can't talk your way out of this no matter how far you bend over backwards.

Your radar for Town motivation is either miscalibrated or not being used in this game, sorry. Talking to my townreads to try to get them to understand/townread me is not "purposeless".

2 )

I find your manner of discourse ultimately purposeless as the information provided by the exchanges does little to nothing to sort alignments according to any method of scumhunting I understand and it is far too early in the game to begin digesting reads with mutual TRs in the effort to reach compromise. There is simply no way to be sure enough in your reads on Day 1 for this and it is nonsensical to begin focusing on compromise when most of us have not even solidified our reads yet in the first place. Talking in this manner is, however, an excellent way to be TRed without actually producing content that advances the game state or roots out any scum. In short, your content lacks any meaningful Town motivation that I can detect.

And so what my vote isn't on you anymore? Why does that matter?

3a )

Because it makes no sense to move your vote off your SR immediately after finding fault in all of their content, and it makes less sense to vote the slot you previously townleaned because of an argument that your SR also made. If you weren't aware that I was calling you opportunistic I can only assume you were selectively reading my post.

No you didn't, if you called it opportunistic please show me where you did. And this entire section reads to me like you care more about "scoring points" in the argument about my alignment more than honestly and openly assessing my play and my alignment.

3b )

288: "His SR on this slot lacks any semblance of authenticity and he basically just followed Cane."

My read on Lowell changed because of his continued scumread on me for weak reasons. I changed the read. Why do you think that makes me scum, why is that something that cannot come from Town?

3c )

See above and my previous post for the answer.

a) I can and will put my vote wherever the hell I want, thank you
and b) I will continue responding to every single post you make, so don't give me this bullshit about "not wanting focus on our exchange".

4 )

Yes, you're forced to, given that I called you out. Changing your vote in the way you did strongly suggests that you wanted attention elsewhere, however. I don't believe that you lost your scumread on me after my post and gained a scumread on Lowell strong enough to warrant moving the vote, I believe that you moved your vote onto an easier target.

like SBF's argument boils down to

1) GL voted me but didn't believe it
2) GL moved his vote off of me when I pushed back on him
3) he must be doing this because he doesn't want attention on me calling him out

1) is because it's early and I usually don't have much conviction in my scumreads early unless I find something extremely compelling, which hasn't happened this game
2) was due to the fact that I hated Lowell's reasons for scumreading/voting me and I did think SBF made a good point about SS which made me question whether they are operating from a town mindset
3) is just assumptions and completely made up

5 )

This is a pretty sad attempt at a misrep, honestly. The fact that you're appealing to others in this way is highly suspect.

1 )

is not really how I play the game and make reads on D1, sorry. My axiom is more townvibes = less likely to be scum. I put you lower because you were not posting and had absolutely zero townvibes, whereas while some things Fro99er said pinged me on a gut level, I also thought there were some possible townvibes as well.

2 )

again, this seems like more of a playstyle issue. D1 for me is about nailing down some solid townreads without letting any scum into my personal town-block. In a game with 6 town and 2 scum, it's much easier to correctly find town than scum, and I find playstyles like yours (tunnel relentlessly on one player) to be extremely counterproductive as it only requires 1 or 2 misreads to suddenly put yourself in LYLO and with no foundation to work with and understand the other players. I also disagree that "wanting to be TRd" is scummy, everyone wants to be TR'd regardless of alignment. I think it's bad play to be mislynchable, especially in a setup like this one with no PRs.

3a )

Why is it so hard for you to understand that I actively found Lowell's posting much scummier than yours? That doesn't mean I suddenly townread you, it just means I wanted a Lowell wagon

even harder

.

3b )

And I don't see that description as being "opportunistic". Sheeping eddie on an early L-3 wagon is opportunistic how? It's not like you were in immediate danger of being lynched.

3c )

You kinda ignored the point of the question here, which is why aren't you considering any town motivation behind my posting? I get why you can frame it in a scum narrative, but I'm missing any evidence that you're genuinely evaluating my play as possibly coming from town too.

4 )

See point 3a.

5 )

I said this before, but if you're gonna call something a misrep, I'd like you to explain exactly what you feel was misrepresented.

[GuiltyLion]

His entire case on me amounts to "Lowell thinks in extremes and said someone is null. CONTRADICTION!" I can make his case against me better than he can, and it only took me one sentence.

also, HERE is a good example of a misrep. The "null point" is honestly the least important and weakest part of my 'case' on Lowell (I also don't really feel it's a case, just a few succinct damning points). What Lowell omitted and ignored are the two better reasons that I already gave in thread:

1) I don't believe town!Lowell would consider my early D1 play - at the time of posting 279 - to be genuinely "opportunistic". I made one vote on SBF.
2) the description of me "pocketing SS" makes no sense either, and reads more like Lowell is trying to frame my behavior than interpret it

[Eddie Cane]

@eddie
plz tell me every thought you've ever had about Bella

can you ask a more focused question please!

[Lowell]

Okay back to bella, that seems to be where the pent-up angst is in this group.

VOTE: bella

My 1v1 with GL bores me. GL has permission to continue it, though.

[borkjerfkin]

town: {bork, eddie, Fro99er, TTTT}
meh: {SS, SBF, Bella}
scum: {Lowell}

probably very close to where i am (still think I like SS more than you do, TTTT is definitely better than before but not ready to hard town him and none of my scumreads are confident ones)

I liked bella early game (specifically her reasoning behind her initial thing between GL/me) although rereading 215 something that pings me is

seee, tonally I liked Lowell for town, but his post with his vote for me in it didn't look like it should end with a vote for me. but

VOTE: bella

Kara! Good to see you again. Sorry you flipped red this time.

is super tonally weird - kara is a reference to a recent survivor game, and i'd expect it to be an rvs reference, but then 'i flipped red'. ugh.

feels not genuine. ["I liked generally the tone of his posts. What I didn't like is this particular post where I didn't like his tone, the thing I just said I liked"] and it just reads instead to me like it's a combination of two dissonant parrots (the former of TTTT's 158 and the latter of Frogger's 121) instead of an organic read

part about GL in 285 seems like it's objecting for no really good reason other than so she had something to talk to frogger about; the fact that she's asking about it seems like she takes issue with it but the read matches his (even with the 'looks contrived' comment you seem to be coming town on a "GL is most likely town" conclusion) whereas if she wanted meaningful conversation both on reads on others and on frogger himself i'd expect her to ask about TTTT (a read that they differ on) or lowell (one that she's wishy washy on and he's less so)

p-edit @lowell vote: was actually a little worried about lowell-bella due to early game hard pressure making way for only soft grumblings. this makes me feel a little better

let's see what goes interactionwise
VOTE: bella

[Sobolev Space]

Sorry for the absence all. Will read what I missed and post thoughts.

I want to be on the record as thinking Lowell's last post is terrible though.

[borkjerfkin]

Sorry for the absence all. Will read what I missed and post thoughts.

I want to be on the record as thinking Lowell's last post is terrible though.

not really sure if I agree; enough people were digging their heels in against the GL wagon

[Sobolev Space]

@TTTT - I'd like for you to go back through your notes and explain your later TR on Lowell

[Sobolev Space]

thoughts on my case against frogger? any other game thoughts?

You v Frogger looks TvT. Given the content of your arguments I'd say its largely a clash of playstyles. I disagree with both of your cases but can see them coming from a town mindset.

[Sobolev Space]

good attitude, good content (with just about no filler), rubs me the right way.

Disagree with this. SBFs content has been tunneling the hell out of a few people with bad arguments which I've seen mostly used as a scum strategy.