Open 675: Pick Your Power X/Y (Game Over!)

[bangthemafia]

Hi Lil Uzi Vert, davesaz, alban, Spade_Ace, Transcend! Great to see you all again!!

Hello others! Hope to have a great play with you all!

Spade, LOLL, how do you manage to get more than 1 votes in the RVS?? Sorry for all the tunneling the last game.

Transcend, why not? Thats what we have got right now. And since a lot of time has passed in pregame, I am sure there must have been some, if not lot of, thoughts put into the draft.

I agree with 2 things-
Scum team will not pick the same numbers
Scum mindset is more likely to pick higher and unusual numbers. But not for the reason that they arent interested in PRs. Having PRs never hurts. I think mainly it will be bacause the higher number you choose, the more likely you will not go into duplicate or triplicate slots. So you actually climb up the ladders. But you can WIFOM this all day long.

For now,
VOTE: alban

Just because there is no Grey and Not_mafia in this game, and you are!

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: Spade_Ace

I'm thinking that scum are more likely to pick a higher number like that since they don't feel as personally driven to get PRs.

I also think we shouldn't lynch in 1's atm but I'm not so naive to believe there can't be 2 scum picking 1 when 5 people picked 1

I always wanted to do that............ but I'm always TOWN in these setups

I mean I'm not dismissing the possibility and I think that there's probably one scum at least in the 1s but I really don't think scum would take doubles of their own.

With the amount of PRs I feel like this game would get really nasty for scum if they didn't get any powerful roles.

Either i m getting paranoid or there is a major contradiction there. So what do u think? Mafia want PRs or dont want PRs?

[bangthemafia]

@Prince, also explain your Uzi vote. Interesting u voted for him just after Spade said atleast 1 scum is between Uzi & Whemme.

[bangthemafia]

Mafia want PRs just as much as town do.

Can we please stop speculating the draft and doing what me/Persivul are doing and reading players via the actual progression they've made this game, and not the number they selected for a silly drafting process?

Dont completely agree. The number players select will also have a direct bearing of how desperately they want PRs.

[bangthemafia]

I also think we shouldn't lynch in 1's atm but I'm not so naive to believe there can't be 2 scum picking 1 when 5 people picked 1

I always wanted to do that............ but I'm always TOWN in these setups

Wrong! With the amount of time mafia has received after alignment PMs, they would have decided on their numbers after consulting each other. Why would 2 members put in same number and decrease their chance of getting PRs?

Also don't like your capitalized TOWN!

[bangthemafia]

@Prince, also explain your Uzi vote. Interesting u voted for him just after Spade said atleast 1 scum is between Uzi & Whemme.

Yes, I did. Because Spade said that and I wanted to see where the vote would go. I don't understand what point you are trying to make.

So why would u not wait for Spade to clarify what he wanted to say. Why would you just change your vote immediately to one of his 2 suspects? I am not making any point, I m trying to see your point

[bangthemafia]

Mafia want PRs just as much as town do.

Can we please stop speculating the draft and doing what me/Persivul are doing and reading players via the actual progression they've made this game, and not the number they selected for a silly drafting process?

Ok Mod!

[bangthemafia]

Yeah but both by the nature of being informed and wanting distinctly different things than individual townies, there will be notable differences in the drafting process.

I'm not saying to only do draft but it's definitely something that's worth looking at given that nothing is really pinging me as scummy besides maybe Wheme.

What about Whemme?

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: bangthemafia

i got a false positive on him reading open 657 but this feels different

Hunhh complete your homework. Go read Open 664 & 671.

[bangthemafia]

Hey Schadd, if you are not mafia, then there is a good chance for you to be the target of the night kill tonight. Just putting it out there.

Haha, try however hard I may, you do manage to raise my antennae!! Everyone knows that PRs are distributed by the draft. Why do u hav to lay it down on table?

[bangthemafia]

Prince looks suspicious (page1-2)
Keep transcend in the game. No PL. He is useful in later rounds.

Who said anything about a PL? Did I miss anything? And your post implies u r townreading Trans. Why?

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: bangthemafia

i got a false positive on him reading open 657 but this feels different

How? I have played many games with him, and one thing I have found is I can never read him. I think every statement of Bang's can come from a scum or a town team.
Spade, you agree with Schadd on Bang?

Haha, thanks, but you overestimating my skills. And hell, I get fully stressed out when i m a scum!!

[bangthemafia]

Either i m getting paranoid or there is a major contradiction there. So what do u think? Mafia want PRs or dont want PRs?

do you think a seemingly obvious contradiction like that is scummy though?

bang what do you normally find scummy?

I hav burnt my fingers enough and quite recently to know nothing is too obvious to be scummy. Yes, scum will be more meticulous and cautious and measured than the reckless townies. But then scum do slip and cover up later with "you really think a scum!me would have done that?" But in general, I do tend to give benefit of doubt to people thinking "is this something thats so impossible for a town to say/do". Having said that I do tend to get fixated on people. Read open 671. So on day 1, I am learning to make more observations, and seek clarifications and make less judgements

[bangthemafia]

giga is town, unless someone can convince me otherwise. Trans is town, unless someone can convince me otherwise. Uzi is scum until he starts showing his town game.

VOTE: Uzi

Explain dudes, explain! Why giga, trans town? Why Uzi scum? Enlighten us

VOTE: alban


sheep me or prepare to be utterly dEsTROYed

Explain please!

UNVOTE:
VOTE: schadd_

Explain please!

[bangthemafia]

Hi Bang! Sorry about 664

No hard feelings bro! Great you are here!!

[bangthemafia]

Bang do you think scum would take the risk of choosing the same draft number? Is it possible to definitely say scum won't choose the same number?

No, i dony at all think that analyzing draft numbers is pointless.

And I would never as scum go for same draft number. Period. Simply because PRs are always good for scum. And by choosing same numbers, scum is doing a suicide on PR front. Scumteam will choose different and odd numbers to avoid duplication. But these are just my thoughts. This is my first PYP game so i dont know if in reality my theory is true

[bangthemafia]

shut up i dont need to explain anything

Great. So we hav another Kaintepes = Grey type of player! Bless us.

[bangthemafia]

Sorry guys. Been incredibly busy in real life. Need to catch up from as back as page 9. Will try to read today and make a concise post or two tomorrow.

[bangthemafia]

Page 10-12- Things that caught my eye-

Buddying up of Kill and Trans
Daves appearing only to post I have read everything.
Transcend’s too many vote shiftings
Talk about Prince and Titus being alts?

im going to trust you on this and never lynch you the rest of the game. if im close to lynching you, just quote this post and i probably wont lynch you.

probably.

Dont like this buddying. Assuming right now it is in a jokular way.

Mod, V/LA till 23rd.

Startegic time-out huh, alban?

This is throwing shade for a NAI reason

agreed that davesaz's one post was sketchy. will like to see that slot contribute. same goes for titus

also i can confirm that prince lyon is titus

I guess I should have like altered my speaking or read posting patterns or something because this is clearly not working.

for a bit i thought you were someone else tbh

it's more what you know about me that gave it away

Dont get this at all. Alts are basically alternative accounts, right? So if Prince and Titus are alts, doesnt that already clear them? Isnt it like masons?

[bangthemafia]

I'm not worried about getting outed ftr because I've said things that would confirm myself to about 2/3 of the game and the identity that I was pretending to be just replaced in.
I was trying to imitate the way that Titus speaks to lay her as a false trail but overall this is more just trying to play without the baggage or the constructed personality of my main.
I suspect that winrate wise I will perform worse as both alignments but I feel like playing the way that I usually do just isn't working anymore.

LOLLLL! Sorry. My bad! Understood now. That you were trying to fake Titus' playstyle. Lot of these terminologies are knew and I have to keep going back to Wiki.

Like the vanity wagon below. Had to check it on Wiki. One vote wagons, to me, dont mean anything. It could be a townie, not convinced enough to put his vote anywhere. Like a game we just completed. On Day 1, there were 2 wagons- 11 players equally divided in 5 + 5 on each of the 2 wagons. A lone guy was voting for a 3rd player. We lynched scum D1 itself. Day 2 started with everyone going for that lone guy. He turned out to be a townie! Trans was the mod!

I'm not worried about getting outed ftr because I've said things that would confirm myself to about 2/3 of the game and the identity that I was pretending to be just replaced in.
I was trying to imitate the way that Titus speaks to lay her as a false trail but overall this is more just trying to play without the baggage or the constructed personality of my main.
I suspect that winrate wise I will perform worse as both alignments but I feel like playing the way that I usually do just isn't working anymore.

oh ok

also i missed titus's post from earlier but i don't understand how vanity wagons springing up suggests alban town? to me that just implies that either town doesn't trust each other to wagon, we're still feeling things out, or scum are trying to push a cw and are struggling to find one that works?

I would actually get the opposite interpretation in that it would likely be scum attempting to push counterwagons.
VOTE: Titus
Do you understand why I think that you and Alban are highly likely to be scumbuddies here?

The vanity wagons, to me, suggest that mostly town are wagoning town alban, if not completely town. It could be scum trying to save Alban (I lack the data to make a firmer conclusion), but that's what my VCA mini suggestions tell me.

Note to self: Go through Prince's ISO.

but how does that translate to alban town?

i would think that means that alban could be late-game lynchbait town (that phrase doesn't make sense but i think you get my point) or scum if it's a town motivated wagon from that - meaning my conclusion from the get-go would be "i need more data"

so i don't get the thought process here

[bangthemafia]

Trans, what are you? Pouncing on anyone that comes your way?

My bad again. Usually I like to keep commenting as I catch up. But I thought this time will read everything, ISO everyone and then post my reads. But got thrilled at this "Alt" thing and thought I must post!

[bangthemafia]

Guys, seriously! Just let me catch up and post. You are focussing at the wrong place
Pedit: Dunn, bad vote.

[bangthemafia]

Ignorance is not scummy. Jumping to conclusions is scummy. There are many here who know my playstyle. I have not even got to see the vote count. Still if you guys are voting, just let me know at L-2

[bangthemafia]

I would like to point out that BTM tried to find a ridiculous reason to clear Titus and also discredited the push on Alban so if you think he's scum you should want to help me pressure the Titus/Alban pair.

Seriously. You guys are so high on Adrenaline.

I did NOT know what or how "Alt" functions before posting, ok? I thought its somewhat like masons. I also didnt know the vote count.

Also, I know Alban and his playstyle. Have to read everything people posted before making mind, right? I am telling you I was planning to do ISO on every player and then post my reads. Its just that I saw Giga post saying he knows Prince is Titus. What do I make of that?

[bangthemafia]

I am going back to reading where I left- page 13. Be good people and wait

[bangthemafia]

Idk. I don't think it's something that we deal with right now. If a scum watcher flips though we pretty much autolynch Spade.

@Prince, please explain this for lesser mortals like me! What has a scum watcher flip got to do with Spade?

I have no idea what you guys are rambling about. Stop overanalyzing my posts.

I thought it would bring a wifom situation essentially. Me saying protective powers please protect Schadd, means they can choose to protect or not. So mafia would have to take a risk in trying to night kill Schadd.

Sheeesh!!!

I know Spade's style too. This is just his playstyle. Though those posts about Schadd being Nighkill target were unnecessary, I dont think Scum!Spade is naive enough to suddenly come into limelight by making these posts out of blue.

So you find the above two reactions as town but the below one as scum? Care to explain it further?

The others are less cautious and follow the more likely path of starting with the lurker might be scum (though that's a site meta that needs some serious fixing imo). Though Persivul's is more the skeptic path, it's still a "this might be scum" kind of reaction which is weakly townie. You on the other hand seem to have a preconception that I'm town, which only scum should have.

Seems like you are just going along with what everyone is saying.

Who or what sayings am I going along with? Are you concerned about something here?

Diasgree. A pissed off Town!Spade can talk very curtly. Nothing scummy about it

[bangthemafia]

By the end of page 15, my scumleans are
Daves for throwing shade on Spade out of a small reaction of "Your thoughts?"
And Kill for buddying Trans

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: Spade

This was a BAD vote and without any reasoning. Thats BAD.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

That was a quick wagon!

That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.

I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow.

Why do you say that? Do you feel Schadd is scum??

I can see people jumping on Spade for those 2 posts. But I dont think that was scummy. Like, yes, Spade could still be a scum, and he is quite good at it. But I am not ready to suspect him for those 2 posts right now.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Titus

That was quite a quick change of mind!

[bangthemafia]

Sorting Uzi will be unnecessary, except as it relates to Titus.
I think Titus is very unusual this game. Upbeat entrance "let's rock this" or something like that, and then she fell flat. Which is kinda what Uzi did too.
That is informative, but unfortunately it may not be AI.

At this point, Spade wagon had started dying with 4 votes on it, and Titus wagon had started building it.

Just few posts back, Daves had agreed with Titus about Titus's Spade vote with "Kinda agree, but give your reason". Still Daves himself was not voting anyone. Now, that the Titus wagon started building up, this post (405) looks an attempt to fence-sit. Saying "yeah, this is unusual, but may not be AI". Like a background work to go whichever way the balance tilts.

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: Titus

not really liking the refusal to explain why alban's town when your answers haven't been clear

spade vote also seals my tr of that slot

^that's L-2 if my count is correct

Agree and like this thought process.

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

also i want to say this is town

but now that i am 99.9% sure that lyon is who i think he is and he scumreads it i really want to know why he didn't like this slot earlier

Not so confident as Giga, but for this same post, Whemme leans townier to me.

VOTE: Titus

not really liking the refusal to explain why alban's town when your answers haven't been clear

spade vote also seals my tr of that slot

^that's L-2 if my count is correct

According to you, i am scum. Why? Coz I posted very suspicious content. How long was the content? All of 3 lines. Have you posted scummy posts yourself? Check. Have others done that this game? Check.

Who else is scummy? Titus and their slot must be scum. Why? Coz they think i am town.

Point no. 3. Spade must be town. Why? Coz Titus thinks Spade is scummy. Titus, who is scummy because they dont think i am scum, finds spade scummy, hence spade must be town.

As if the scums can't fake any of these things just for your convenience.

You are one of the most confidently naive players i have seen in my 1 year on the site.

Either that, or all this bad play style us a facade.

I know it sounds weird, but I agree with alban too. I feel alban is not unusual in any way in this game. I have had a very bad experience with scum!alban my last game. And still I maintain, this is alban's usual playstyle. His frustration here comes from a town mindset, is what I feel.

VOTE: Titus
So unlike town!Titus I've seen many times. The one time I've seen Titus avoid she was scum and I called it.
L-2

This is bussing!

[bangthemafia]

According to you, i am scum. Why? Coz I posted very suspicious content. How long was the content? All of 3 lines. Have you posted scummy posts yourself? Check. Have others done that this game? Check.

Who else is scummy? Titus and their slot must be scum. Why? Coz they think i am town.

Point no. 3. Spade must be town. Why? Coz Titus thinks Spade is scummy. Titus, who is scummy because they dont think i am scum, finds spade scummy, hence spade must be town.

As if the scums can't fake any of these things just for your convenience.

You are one of the most confidently naive players i have seen in my 1 year on the site.

Either that, or all this bad play style us a facade.

first point, length of content has nothing to do with scumminess? forced reads are forced reads. you could write essays and i could have a nullread on you, you could make 1 post all game and i can have you as my strongest town/scumread. so you completely miss the mark on why i even scumread you but let's keep going

i don't think titus is scummy for thinking you're town. i think titus is scummy for not engaging with me on the specifics behind that read when the reasons they've given can make the read go either way. you could be town and titus scum, your alignment has nothing to do with titus's. yes, i think you're both scummy but it's not associative at all. your logic here seems to suggest it is

spade is town because i didn't like the way titus voted for them. it didn't look like a bus to me. that read is a little associative, but there's nothing naive in thinking that a wagon is on town lynchbait because people are overplaying how scummy he is and a scummier slot is jumping on him.

so i have no idea what you're trying to insinuate here

This seems more like the post hoc analysis rooted in being tunneled. Every single point in your 'essay' points to a presumptuous and naive rhetoric. This is still nai. Maybe a lil bit scummy. Right now i am not sure if you are a tunneled and patronising townie or aggressive scum pushing a less active slot.

Cant shake this feeling that this is town vs town

[bangthemafia]

oh shoot bang might be mafia ;-;

Completed reading everything. And cant stop laughing!!! Understand why everyone jumped on me!

The thing is that I keep feeling getting influenced my last played game. Of course I can be wrong, but I tend to keep thinking the frustrations usually arise from town mindset. Whether that applies to Giga-Alban interaction or not, I am not confident. Nevertheless, I just hope it is not a scum-scum charade. Right now, I will ISO each player and then make up my mind.

By the way, my reads till now-
Strong town- Transcend, Prince Lyon, GigabyteTroubadour
Town lean- Alban, Spade_Ace
Null- Dunnstral, schadd_, PenguinPower, WhemePlay
Scum lean- davesaz, Killthestory, Persivul, Titus

VOTE: Davesaz

But I will shift to Titus if that wagon builds.

[bangthemafia]

gonna see if i want to respond to anything more in-depth later but

bang why does alban's frustration ping you as town?

Because thats how he is. He gets tunnelled on someone quite easily, engages in one on one, and also gets frustrated easily.

[bangthemafia]

also bang im not a he

she or they is fine for me

Sorry. And sure!

[bangthemafia]

didjebwnsufurheh

srceenplay ilu lmao

What's this? Some cryptic breadcrumbing??

PEDIT: Giga, scum!alban is usually very measured, less fixated, and more cautious. I feel this is his town play. But sometimes i get biased by my last game. Like sometimes I start with suspecting the player who was scum in my last game, as the game progresses I tell myself that this is the shittiest logic, so i tend to give them too much of towncred. So maybe I need others' opinions. Spade, Daves, Trans all hav played with him. Trans even had the birds eye view as mod.

[bangthemafia]

UNVOTE:

In this setup, first seed (Titus) should be here obvtowning herself. Disappointing that she isn't. That said, I'm not lynching first seed on D1. Gotta give her the opportunity for a night action and see what happwens.

Generally I don't read into replace outs, but this one was weird. Personally I play this setup because the draft mechanism is unique. Someone winning first seed then saying they can't get into the game is bizarre.

by first seed do you mean the top portion of the draft

because schadd_ is technically the first seed...?

I shouldn't play sick. Was looking at the player list, not the draft...

That makes the replace out less weird.

@Perci, if the first post was your reason for unvoting titus, and you immediately got a comment from Giga, which seemingly convinced you, why didnt you put your vote back? I would think voting back would be more natural reaction here!

[bangthemafia]

We are townier to BTM, plus they will shift to Titus if the wagon builds!!!

VOTE: Titus

L-2?

What will happen next?

Lets do it, then.

VOTE: Titus

[bangthemafia]

Nothing much in last 6-7 pages. Somehow I still feel alban is town. I would love someone to walk me through his scummy points. Spade, your reason of scumreading alban because he is not scumreading you sucks totally. Is there anything else?

I am posting here whatever I could find in last 6-7 pages reading post by post. Have also done some ISO's and post them separately.

I am fine lynching someone from my scummiest reads- Titus > Davesaz > Whemmeplay > Killthestory = Persivul = Spade.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Spade

You both need to explain your votes.

My VCA mini too early theory says you're scum. The fear response is noted.

@Titus. please explain this.

Looking at draft numbers and VCs, bang is likely the third.

Hows this? And who arethe other 2 you scumread?

Titus is at L-1. Please claim.

@Spade, why do you expect a claim? Do you feel Titus has a PR? I am not sure but I think you agreed to someone's theory of Uzi replacing out due to vanilla frustration. Also, how does a PR claim decide alignment? If mafia were higher up in list, they would also get PRs, right?

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

Didnt understand this.

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Thats important information. Thank you. But can someone else who has played with Titus earlier confirm / refute this?

wait, this is te game with bangthemafia? yeah let's lynch him,

davesaz always a viable option

penguinpower always a viable option

I am frustrated. Why cant you guys give reasons for your reads? I thought thats a common way of letting the town assess your thought process and whether they agree to it or find faults with your thought process.

WhaT THE he'll sheLl where IS MY VOTE .

VOTE: bang

You are just useless. No point even engaging with you. You haven’t done anything towny for me. Just sending your one liners, commenting on others’ posts, being mildly aggressive, jumping your votes all over, without giving any solid reasons, you haven’t even given your complete list of reads.

[bangthemafia]

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

This was for Titus voting for Spade. So he agrees with Titus about Spade. But doesnt vote for Spade.

Sorting Uzi will be unnecessary, except as it relates to Titus.
I think Titus is very unusual this game. Upbeat entrance "let's rock this" or something like that, and then she fell flat. Which is kinda what Uzi did too.
That is informative, but unfortunately it may not be AI.

Throws shade on Titus, but keeps options open by saying its NAI. Timing of this post is bad. It is at the time when Spade wagon started dying and Titus wagon started picking up. More like basework for future voteparking. If Davesaz flips scum, I would suspect Spade as his scumbuddy.

VOTE: Titus
So unlike town!Titus I've seen many times. The one time I've seen Titus avoid she was scum and I called it.
L-2

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Need confirmation from others.
Plus that Davesaz is the scummiest guy in the 1's. So if there is atleast 1 scum in 1’s, it is Davesaz in most probability.

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Titus

UNVOTE:

In this setup, first seed (Titus) should be here obvtowning herself. Disappointing that she isn't. That said, I'm not lynching first seed on D1. Gotta give her the opportunity for a night action and see what happwens.

Generally I don't read into replace outs, but this one was weird. Personally I play this setup because the draft mechanism is unique. Someone winning first seed then saying they can't get into the game is bizarre.

by first seed do you mean the top portion of the draft

because schadd_ is technically the first seed...?

I shouldn't play sick. Was looking at the player list, not the draft...

That makes the replace out less weird.

How does that make him scum??

How can you ask such a bad question?

VOTE: Spade

I did scumread Persi at this point, first due to quick voteshifting frm Spade to Titus but without giving any reads, then unvoting Titus for wrong reasons and going back to Spade. With Spade townreading him, it could have been a bus from scum!Persi. Plus the fact that final vote for "asking a bad question" meant, he could anytime unvote too without evoking much suspicion. So again, if Spade flips scum, I am gonna look at Persi and vice versa.

The only problem is that following 2 posts i.e. 557 and 579 look quite townie and genuine scumhunting and attemots to futher the game. So am putting Persi in a "To be looked at later" list-

why should we be obvtowning ourselves?

In a typical setup it's reasonable for PRs to want to lay somewhat low, as they don't want to be so obvtown that they take the NK. In this setup, the top slot (you) is definitely a PR, and the next couple probably are. If you're town, there's already a target on your back, so no need to lay low. So, obvtowning yourself is helpful. IIRC in one of these we lynched the cop (top slot) on D2 because she thought that, as cop, she shouldn't draw attention to herself, which in fact did draw bad attention to her.

I do. So what?

So devote some of that time to this game obviously.

[bangthemafia]

I can't find who said it but
Someone posted about schadd being a target tonight but pr protect them.
That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.
Why would they say that or try to lead protectives?

So he suspects "someone" who said that (Spade in his 116 and 118)

there's a certain thing i'm thinking about 116 & 118, and i'm wondering if anyone else sees it

I don't think I'm seeing what you see. But I see those posts as useless. Makes no sense to post them IMO.

Now those posts are "useless"

I also don't see enough to vote Spade

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

Again suspecting Spade just on those 2 posts, suspecting enough to vote. After that unvoting, voting Titus, again going back to Spade-

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

The only town role she can claim is VT, if she is a scum. If she claims any other town role, would you not be swayed??

VOTE: spade

Just to bend completely backwards, this could be an undecided townie in like a rare world, but in all other worlds, this is 1 obvscum.

[bangthemafia]

Am ready vote for one of the Titus. Davesaz and Whemmeplay.

[bangthemafia]

The only problem is that following 2 posts i.e. 557 and 579 look quite townie and genuine scumhunting and attemots to futher the game. So am putting Persi in a "To be looked at later" list-

I'm having difficulty getting into this game because: as noted I was sick (starting to improve now); giga's constant posting.

Noted. Hope to see more thoughts from you.

giga dave and titus can die

i tr the rest

Dave & Titus I agree. Why Giga?

Giga seems too at ease to be scum.

Not only that, but also genuinely scumhunting unlike many other Shitposters. Wow, I like that word!

Off topic: Giga reminds me of Minideathstar, one of the best analytic players I hav seen on this website. @Transcend you started off with us in 657 on day 1 before getting replaced out, right?

[bangthemafia]

I actually explain in those 6-7 "useless" pages.

I am a very strong student of VCA.

Alban is probably town driven by town. Scum have zero interest in drawing attention to themselves by countering alban, who is town. They can always come back to Alban if they cannot discredit a scum wagon. Then, they blame town if Alban is lynched.

I am at Persivul Shade Bang. Shade being the mist confident.

And Persivul feels you become a student more when yiu are scum.

Great, you caught us! Coincidentally I m right now town leaning Persi & Spade is null to townlean. Your throwing shade in them kinda clears them for me.

By the way, how about Titus- Davesaz-Whemme?

[bangthemafia]

Sorry again. Have been awefully busy in real life. Everytime I come to this game, its 10-12 pages to read! I read very hurriedly from 27 till page 42. So just posting few thoughts right now, will read more soon and comment page by page

1. @Spade, thanks for pointing out my busy schedule to others. But your VT claim was just bad. We have discussed this so many times. It may not affect you directly, but kind of brings town PRs out in open for the PR-hunting scum by process of elimination.

2. @KTS, I am in India, so my time is never gonna match with the free time of most of you. If you have any questions for me, please post whenever you are online. I can reply whenever I have time. My case on you was not a strong scumread. But I just fail to understand why the town is just blindly townreading one line posters. I have seen enough to know its NAI and scum can very well take advantage of this "activity is NAI, so lurkers are not scum" mentality. In my last game, where many of the players were there and Trans was the mod, we lost the game to a very very inactive and almost lurking werewolves team!

3. I also fail to understand why people are townreading top seeders in the draft. There were so many posts on that speculation. Alignment is decided before distribution of power roles. So a top seeder has as much chance of being scum as town. Also, why VT is the only conftown claim? If you guys meant that player will not have any night action, a vanilla mafia goon can and will claim VT only. So spade's claim, then people clearing everyone above Spade was all bullshit IMO. I thought a lot about the draft and for me, the only way the draft helps is after a few flips, because I firmly believe the scumteam will just not take the chance of bidding for the same number. That would be like deliberately throwing away PRs. For a scum, any and every PR would be a value addition.

4. I am very wary of Persivul wagon the way it just built up without any explanation. I had ISOed him till page 27 and posted my thoughts as post 671 , and then he responded that he was sick etc. All that sounded quite genuine to me. I ISOd his posts after my #671 because he is the current lynchbait. Will post that ISO as a separate post, as I don't know how to use many of the MS features on my phone. But it should suffice to say that his later altercation with Prince & Schadd looked genuine too.

5. With the above post I had also posted Whemmeplay's ISO till page 27 in post 672 . Lot of pages have passed after that, but I found a glaring inconsistency in their early posts. Either I am paranoid or town is too sure of themselves or scum just didnot let that wagon build.

With the genuinity with which Titus has engaged in last few pages, I am less and less sure about him being a scum (will explain later with Persi's ISO). Right now, I am fine voting for Daves or Whemmeplay.

Pedit: Persi, you already claimed??? WTF

[bangthemafia]

I have ISOed Persi and will post it. But at this point, I feel quite sure he is a town. So I buy his VT claim and his further explanation about Prince and top 4. There is sure a scum in top 3 or 4. Rolecop is something that scum would bid for. Town would hav bid for the regular cop.

VOTE: Whemmeplay

[bangthemafia]

Should I reveal what PR I missed out on??

Probably, but wait awhile and see if there's protest.

No. Wait. The town amongst the 3 above u will get exposed that way. Scum in them knows who the town is. But scum will mostly not know what PR they hav. U will likely expose that. But this is my opinion. I m playing PYP for the first time. Take other experts' opinion.

[bangthemafia]

@Prince, whats wrong with 570? Lurkers are scum or not, or scum wpuld lurk or not is always a wifom. I can see both the points. But why would u giv a free pass to lurkers? And more importantly, if someone disagrees with ur reasoning, why is that a scumtell for u. I think the more rigid/tunnelled/closed/monosyllablic townies become, the more we harm town.

@Spade, I really dont know. Till now I hav not been able to see anything really hard-scummy there. I know he is extremely busy, travelling to cities and has joined new job. But apart from the activity, which is really NAI, I didmt see anything unusual. As I said few tens of pages back, I start almost every game scumreading my last game's scum. Then i tell myself not to get tunnelled and overdo that. So i think right now, unless i see something really scummy or unless there are some associative tells after few flips, i m not for alban lynch so early.

By the way, what do u feel about my 672 post and Whemmeplay?

[bangthemafia]

Do u guys still want me to post Persi's iso- part 2? I think he is quite obvtown.

[bangthemafia]

Alright it doesn't feel like Alban is happening today and I'm not having another game where I caught Titus scum and didn't lynch her because of personal reasons.
I would rather lynch Alban if we can get a wagon going there but

VOTE: Titus

I really need something from you if you're town here because everything that you've done today points to you being scum and even if you're town you're likely wrong about Spade_Ace.
I want to point out that you disagreed with me about how to correctly gauge your reads but I correctly ignored you in 200 and also correctly pointed out in the open that your Grey read was likely to be correct.
So if you're town here you are wrong here >90% of the time and need to do something else.

Come vote up Alban with me?

Why did you want Titus to vote with you when you just voted her, and believe that "everything that you've done today points to you being scum"?

Why do you keep trying to work with someone you scum read?

this question is how confirmation bias happens

How so?

You don't find it odd at all that he strongly scum reads and votes a person, yet in the same post asks that person to vote along with them against a third? It's bizarre behavior.

Do you think that I'm scum for voting you Persivul?

I'm more concerned about you simultaneously claiming to scum-read Titus while also trying to buddy up to her.

I agree with Persi's point here. Prince's post was quite contradictory there. But more than agreeing with it, I like how Persi noticed that and brought on table and persisted woth his questioning. Seemed genuine scum hunting.

i mean, you're really just proving my point. you're not making any effort to convince me that the interaction between lyon and titus is fishy,

Should I be? Why are you so important?

i'm an eleventh of the town, and an eighth of a lynch. do you only want to convince important people?

No - I'm not trying to convince ANYONE at this point. I don't have strong enough reads. I rarely do before a few flips.

These all look Town vs town interactions. Following are some more posts that I felt were fully town-motivated-

Yeah so what I was thinking was that like my behaviour around Titus slot is the kind of thing that scum could push on if they needed to because it does directly involve me going against my reads
but it's the kind of thing that doesn't really make sense as scum and that I wouldn't expect anyone to scumread, particularly if they know who I am.

That sounds like you're saying you were laying a trap.

i don't think he was trying to trap titus though i don't really get that?

Not Titus - me, or anyone who would question why he would scum read and vote someone, then in the same fucking post plead with the person voted to vote together on a third person. It's completely stupid play. About the only thing dumber than that is scum reading someone for questioning it. Traps are bad, but I can at least respect the attempt. If it wasn't a trap, he's just a fucking idiot. You push your scum reads, you don't hold hands and sing kumbayah with them.

alban is my top choice but that wagon doesnt seem to get momentum any more

Because it's high in the draft. The first couple of people are highly likely to be PRs. It's the middle people, like spade and me, that scum want to figure out. They're not really concerned about the mislynch yet - still lots of time for that.

alban is my top choice but that wagon doesnt seem to get momentum any more

Because it's high in the draft. The first couple of people are highly likely to be PRs.

It's the middle people, like spade and me, that scum want to figure out.

They're not really concerned about the mislynch yet - still lots of time for that.

no

VOTE: persivul

VOTE: persivul

VOTE: Persivul

VOTE: Persivul

VOTE: persivul

At least one scum in {schadd, Titus}

Who is most scumread amongst 4 people above you?

Actually I asked that but I don't really feel enthusiastic about wagoning Dunnstral right now. I'll take that as a gut read and follow it.

VOTE: Schadd

Yeah, why give the top seed a night to produce?

VOTE: Prince Lyon

VOTE: persivul

^ Scum vote.

It's D1, you're town, you've been taking some pressure and just got voted again. Then someone sticks up for you. That gives you a feeling of relief. Yeah, you know buddying is a possibility, but you don't turn on the person in your corner that quickly.

Strange vote, Schadd.

[bangthemafia]

@Prince, you are just moving in more and more shittier murk. You were quite a strong townread for me. But i can't understand these voteshifts. Almost looks like jumping on whoever posts. But its still fine. Coz I usually tend to keep "tunnelled townie" possibility till someone compells me to think otherwise. So u want to give reasons for ur vote?

[bangthemafia]

Well, then we just agree to disagree

[bangthemafia]

This is idiotic. Can someone explain what's scummy about alban, coz I just cant seem to see it. Spade, Giga what were your cases on him? Sorry but can you repost?

Also why not Wemmeplay? If Persi and Spade are telling truth, which I feel they are, we hav a rolecop/UB in the top 3 which I dont feel is something for which a town that high in draft would bid for. Whemme is the scummiest of them. Why are we not lynching that shit of a hydra?

[bangthemafia]

What WK u r talking about, Trans/Dunn?

A flash wagon builds up on alban so close to deadline. I hav been very clearly saying i don't find him scummy just as i dont find some of u scummy. Of course I can never be 100% sure. Thats why I asked people on that wagon to explain their case why Alban is so scummy. But I think thats too much to ask from this town.

On top, u vote me for differing opinions!? So townreading ur scum reads or scum reading ur townreads is bad, is it?

Dont focus on the wrong guy (now I m talking only of myself) so close to deadline. It will create nothing but confusion and waste precious time in rebuilding another wagon.

For the last time, vote whemmeplay. He is the bloody scum. I m also open to Daves or maybe Titus wagon

[bangthemafia]

LoL. Thats almost a rainbow!!!

[bangthemafia]

Stressing me out. Walking away.

Asses

Your are a town tracker

LoL. Come back and atleast be clearer and more expressive in your claim.

how can someone role fish when you've already claimed

dude i don't understand where you came from but you need to pull a spongebob and burn all the files in your brain about mafia and learn fresh

Haha. ROFL

Role fish some more huh

You do realize that you had the ability to prevent it from getting to this point had you answered

any

questions that had been asked of you...right? This wasn't role fishing...7 players ran you up because of your unwillingness to participate with town. There are less than 7 scum.

I don't feel like unvoting right now.

Exactly my feeling. Whemme, you had pretty much time. Without even coming anywhere near to claim, you could at least respond when some of us pointed out your inconsistencies. Like you never responded to my 672.

Are we done spamming now? Can we lynch Spade ace?

I would prefer you anytime.

VOTE: Titus

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: bang

Trans, whats the fuck with you. You are ready to jump on everyone that gets wagoned? Remember that rainbow post of yours? What has happened after that to make you vote me? Scum is just fucking trying to get people to claim before night 1, it looks like.

Whenever wagon built on me, I have been very clearly telling that I m not your guy. Dont waste your time on me etcetc. If town is so careless and bloodthirsty, just stop voting when I m at L-2 and wait for me to online.

[bangthemafia]

Trans, what are you? Pouncing on anyone that comes your way?

My bad again. Usually I like to keep commenting as I catch up. But I thought this time will read everything, ISO everyone and then post my reads. But got thrilled at this "Alt" thing and thought I must post!

Guys, seriously! Just let me catch up and post. You are focussing at the wrong place
Pedit: Dunn, bad vote.

I would like to point out that BTM tried to find a ridiculous reason to clear Titus and also discredited the push on Alban so if you think he's scum you should want to help me pressure the Titus/Alban pair.

Seriously. You guys are so high on Adrenaline.

I did NOT know what or how "Alt" functions before posting, ok? I thought its somewhat like masons. I also didnt know the vote count.

Also, I know Alban and his playstyle. Have to read everything people posted before making mind, right? I am telling you I was planning to do ISO on every player and then post my reads. Its just that I saw Giga post saying he knows Prince is Titus. What do I make of that?

Idk. I don't think it's something that we deal with right now. If a scum watcher flips though we pretty much autolynch Spade.

@Prince, please explain this for lesser mortals like me! What has a scum watcher flip got to do with Spade?

I have no idea what you guys are rambling about. Stop overanalyzing my posts.

I thought it would bring a wifom situation essentially. Me saying protective powers please protect Schadd, means they can choose to protect or not. So mafia would have to take a risk in trying to night kill Schadd.

Sheeesh!!!

I know Spade's style too. This is just his playstyle. Though those posts about Schadd being Nighkill target were unnecessary, I dont think Scum!Spade is naive enough to suddenly come into limelight by making these posts out of blue.

So you find the above two reactions as town but the below one as scum? Care to explain it further?

The others are less cautious and follow the more likely path of starting with the lurker might be scum (though that's a site meta that needs some serious fixing imo). Though Persivul's is more the skeptic path, it's still a "this might be scum" kind of reaction which is weakly townie. You on the other hand seem to have a preconception that I'm town, which only scum should have.

Seems like you are just going along with what everyone is saying.

Who or what sayings am I going along with? Are you concerned about something here?

Diasgree. A pissed off Town!Spade can talk very curtly. Nothing scummy about it

VOTE: Spade

This was a BAD vote and without any reasoning. Thats BAD.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

That was a quick wagon!

That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.

I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow.

Why do you say that? Do you feel Schadd is scum??

I can see people jumping on Spade for those 2 posts. But I dont think that was scummy. Like, yes, Spade could still be a scum, and he is quite good at it. But I am not ready to suspect him for those 2 posts right now.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Titus

That was quite a quick change of mind!

oh shoot bang might be mafia ;-;

Completed reading everything. And cant stop laughing!!! Understand why everyone jumped on me!

The thing is that I keep feeling getting influenced my last played game. Of course I can be wrong, but I tend to keep thinking the frustrations usually arise from town mindset. Whether that applies to Giga-Alban interaction or not, I am not confident. Nevertheless, I just hope it is not a scum-scum charade. Right now, I will ISO each player and then make up my mind.

By the way, my reads till now-
Strong town- Transcend, Prince Lyon, GigabyteTroubadour
Town lean- Alban, Spade_Ace
Null- Dunnstral, schadd_, PenguinPower, WhemePlay
Scum lean- davesaz, Killthestory, Persivul, Titus

VOTE: Davesaz

But I will shift to Titus if that wagon builds.

Nothing much in last 6-7 pages. Somehow I still feel alban is town. I would love someone to walk me through his scummy points. Spade, your reason of scumreading alban because he is not scumreading you sucks totally. Is there anything else?

I am posting here whatever I could find in last 6-7 pages reading post by post. Have also done some ISO's and post them separately.

I am fine lynching someone from my scummiest reads- Titus > Davesaz > Whemmeplay > Killthestory = Persivul = Spade.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Spade

You both need to explain your votes.

My VCA mini too early theory says you're scum. The fear response is noted.

@Titus. please explain this.

Looking at draft numbers and VCs, bang is likely the third.

Hows this? And who arethe other 2 you scumread?

Titus is at L-1. Please claim.

@Spade, why do you expect a claim? Do you feel Titus has a PR? I am not sure but I think you agreed to someone's theory of Uzi replacing out due to vanilla frustration. Also, how does a PR claim decide alignment? If mafia were higher up in list, they would also get PRs, right?

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

Didnt understand this.

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Thats important information. Thank you. But can someone else who has played with Titus earlier confirm / refute this?

wait, this is te game with bangthemafia? yeah let's lynch him,

davesaz always a viable option

penguinpower always a viable option

I am frustrated. Why cant you guys give reasons for your reads? I thought thats a common way of letting the town assess your thought process and whether they agree to it or find faults with your thought process.

WhaT THE he'll sheLl where IS MY VOTE .

VOTE: bang

You are just useless. No point even engaging with you. You haven’t done anything towny for me. Just sending your one liners, commenting on others’ posts, being mildly aggressive, jumping your votes all over, without giving any solid reasons, you haven’t even given your complete list of reads.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

This was for Titus voting for Spade. So he agrees with Titus about Spade. But doesnt vote for Spade.

Sorting Uzi will be unnecessary, except as it relates to Titus.
I think Titus is very unusual this game. Upbeat entrance "let's rock this" or something like that, and then she fell flat. Which is kinda what Uzi did too.
That is informative, but unfortunately it may not be AI.

Throws shade on Titus, but keeps options open by saying its NAI. Timing of this post is bad. It is at the time when Spade wagon started dying and Titus wagon started picking up. More like basework for future voteparking. If Davesaz flips scum, I would suspect Spade as his scumbuddy.

VOTE: Titus
So unlike town!Titus I've seen many times. The one time I've seen Titus avoid she was scum and I called it.
L-2

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Need confirmation from others.
Plus that Davesaz is the scummiest guy in the 1's. So if there is atleast 1 scum in 1’s, it is Davesaz in most probability.

I can't find who said it but
Someone posted about schadd being a target tonight but pr protect them.
That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.
Why would they say that or try to lead protectives?

So he suspects "someone" who said that (Spade in his 116 and 118)

there's a certain thing i'm thinking about 116 & 118, and i'm wondering if anyone else sees it

I don't think I'm seeing what you see. But I see those posts as useless. Makes no sense to post them IMO.

Now those posts are "useless"

I also don't see enough to vote Spade

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

Again suspecting Spade just on those 2 posts, suspecting enough to vote. After that unvoting, voting Titus, again going back to Spade-

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

The only town role she can claim is VT, if she is a scum. If she claims any other town role, would you not be swayed??

VOTE: spade

Just to bend completely backwards, this could be an undecided townie in like a rare world, but in all other worlds, this is 1 obvscum.

@Prince, whats wrong with 570? Lurkers are scum or not, or scum wpuld lurk or not is always a wifom. I can see both the points. But why would u giv a free pass to lurkers? And more importantly, if someone disagrees with ur reasoning, why is that a scumtell for u. I think the more rigid/tunnelled/closed/monosyllablic townies become, the more we harm town.

@Spade, I really dont know. Till now I hav not been able to see anything really hard-scummy there. I know he is extremely busy, travelling to cities and has joined new job. But apart from the activity, which is really NAI, I didmt see anything unusual. As I said few tens of pages back, I start almost every game scumreading my last game's scum. Then i tell myself not to get tunnelled and overdo that. So i think right now, unless i see something really scummy or unless there are some associative tells after few flips, i m not for alban lynch so early.

By the way, what do u feel about my 672 post and Whemmeplay?

All I am seeing in Bang's iso is that he is scum. He is using on of my favorite scum strats, acting oblivious, to deflect attention. He is going against people for acting friendly but with the way I see things, a Bang Spade team is a serious possibility. Everything seems thought out and detached, no emotion shown.

VOTE: Bang

I would be willing to go Spade as well if that is how th rest of the town wants to go.

Dude you just suck, did anyone tell you that? Go read the games Spade posted.

[bangthemafia]

Let's lynch in this and see if anyone has any complaints: {Dave Titus bang Alban PenguinPower giga}

I am not sure about anyone else hitting a scum. I m comfortable voting only for Dave or even Titus.

[bangthemafia]

Sorry for forgetting to use spoiler tags in 1590.

[bangthemafia]

Transcend -
Why do your reads keep changing constantly? You town read bang, scum read him, then went back to town reading him, and now you are voting him.
Your other two votes after your read list I am fine with, because you put me and Titus in your scum reads and voted both of us. I want to know why you are voting Bang though, I think the idea of voting people and making them claim then moving on to the next person is really dumb. Which is what I feel like we are doing right now.

Gigabyte -
I think your town. You have been telling people to slow down and think at different points in the game. Don't think scum would do that.

Alban -
Post #185 is me.
I think your town, GJ.

Arona -
Keeps posting in this pink color font, strong moderator read here.

Bang -
Can someone please tell me why we are voting Bang? His ISO makes me think he is town.
I have never been so annoyed at how my name's been spelled.

Davesaz -
You're just cruising along this game. You got 20 posts in 61 pages. Really? Scum reading you.
Your second and last vote was you sheeping lol.

Dunnstral -
Why is Bang scum besides "he is awkward scum". What does that even mean?
Why'd you ask in 1260 why people are voting Alban and then vote him in 1261?

KilltheStory -
I like you for now.

Titus -
Why the vote on Bang??? I don't get it.
Definitely feel like if you were scum your vote would of been on me. Makes me think your town.

Taking a break for now. Part 2 will most likely come tomorrow, I am tired and this is a long read.
This isn't really a readlist, more of what I think right now. Im not done though, this can change.

-Wheme

Good that you finally started talking. And I liked how you are asking reasons for people's reads. But dont white knight me. Its very clear to me that there are only 2 reasons for my wagon-
1. Maybe my way of reacting to people/post is different. I write as i think and usually keep second guessing my reads as town. I also observe, ask questions before making reads, so people feel I m not taking a stand.
2. There are a few "Mr know it all" one line posters in this game who will spend pages trolling or discussing non game things, but will not giv reasons/explanations for their reads, and still will think no end of themselves amd their reads!

[bangthemafia]

Forget it Lyon. I understood.

Yeah so I know schadds role if others are telling the truth.

Yes. So Schadds has the role that you wanted. Thats why I didn't want you to disclose the role you bid for. Since you know that role, you can also try to think the utility of both those role options from town and scum point of view. If its something that benefits scum much more we have some leads for day 2

[bangthemafia]

Damn, really thought I was going to get a pro town power role but ended up with Vanilla Townie.

bro, I am vanilla town. CONFIRMED

DUDE I AM TOWN.

It IS OBV

Same here! Didnt they tell you I am a confirmed town? Well, I am saying it NOW!

[bangthemafia]

Bang as Town - 674 , 671

Bang as scum - 657

Bang is probably town.

Thanks Spade! The town game, though was not 674, but 664 instead.

[bangthemafia]

Really don't think Davesaz is scum.
I feel like it's 3 of
{Momo/Wheme/Schadd/KTS/Alban}

A bunch of things.

this is pretty terrible

there's potential for like one scum there at max but 3 isn't even reaching at that point. It's just trolling.

VOTE: killthestory

LOLL. Great vote!! Love it!!!

[bangthemafia]

VOTE: Momo

I feel his reads are opportunistic.
- First he suspects bang and me
- Then he says bang, me and alban.
- Then when transcend and I said bang is town. He shifts to alban and me
- Then when KTS starts scumreading Lyon he too starts suspecting him.
- When Lyon suspects KTs, he votes for KTS

Haven't played with him b4, so don't know if this is his style. Started TRing Persivul towards the end. But his replacement feels scummy.

Agree. I too TRed Persi in the end. But this Momo guy is just scummy. Maybe Persi hid his scumminess and this one cant. Or maybe Momo had too much to read and just couldnt plan his strategy well. He had to engage in active discussion as soon as he joined. People started asking him reads and reasons. Maybe that flustered him. Prince-Alban-KTS was the weirdest interacting scumteam I could think of ever.

GUYS I AM VT.

IF YOU DONT BELIEVE ME INVESTIGATE ME TONIGHT!!!!

Hahaha!

Has anyone said anything about why Dave is town?

Dave is my scumread too. Made a case like ages back somewhere between pages #20-30. ISO me if you want that.

Our best town strategy for early game deadline in this setup is to lynch a claimed VT if we can't agree on scum. Lynch the VT claims and let scum resolve the PR claims for us (or at least make them try to). For darn sure, this late in the day stay away from unclaimed. Running someone else up to a claim would be sub-optimal at this time, unless we're really sure they're scum.

Yeah, it sucks if you're the sacrifice but this is one setup where that's actually the VT's job. And who knows, the claimed VT we pick might still be scum.

Yeah, I'll probably draw a scumread for this post because I'm posting setup-based IIOA, but someone has to step up and tell town how to play it. I don't see any signs that y'all will wise up on your own.

This is not completely senseless idea, but should be our last ditch effort near the deadline.

yeah i expected as much because anyone whod even think about me and lyon being on a scumteam together would have to be mental but luckily 4 u u used ur feelings grats

LOL.

Well, I am ready to lynch anyone in Titus, Dave, Momo. Not anyone else for today. If you guys decide a policy lynch of VT, I am going to vote for Momo.

[bangthemafia]

Wat bigger wagon you are talking about, Giga? Last vote count had alban, me, KTS, spade, wheme, all were at 2 each and Momo, Dave, Titus at 1 each. This is the craziest town divide i hav ever seen.

We dont want a stampede near deadline. With so much doubt in everyone's mind, I think voting for a claimed VT looks the best town play right now.

VOTE: Momo

[bangthemafia]

Lynch sucks

Trans, I know. I said this is our last ditch strategy. What other option we have got- with such a divided town 36 hrs prior to deadline? Just look at the vote count.

We hav seen this multiple times now. Town builds a wagon, we get a claim, wagon fizzles out, town discusses for a long time, people here have weird fixations that nobody wants to bend down, so town remains divided. Another wagon slowly builds up and follows the same trajectory.

So though this lynch sucks, this is our only option right now unless we want a blind stampede near to deadline. Plus it wasnt that Persi didnt hav a wagon. His wagon died coz he did act responsibly. Momo has been weird since his entry. Spade summarized a case on Momo and all the points were valid. Plus I hadnt thought of this earlier but Daves has a point- the call for investigation could come from a possible PGO. This is a win win. We dont out another PR claim here. We dont lose much niggt action if momo is town. But if his VT claim is false, we just hit scum

[bangthemafia]

also fyi spade knows what schadd_ took now so the theory that

he

was scum baiting a watcher/rolefishing is dumb since he doesnt need to do much to figure that out

@Giga, who is "he" here? I assume Spade. If you are talking of his advice to Schadd at the beginning of the game, at that time he didnt have the information about other slots. So what is your point?

also fyi spade knows what schadd_ took now so the theory that he was scum baiting a watcher/rolefishing is dumb since he doesnt need to do much to figure that out

unless he took ub/rc but idc what it is i just wanted to point out this is likely the case

@Giga, I thought Titus claimed UB. So do you mean you dont believe Titus claim irrespective of their alignment?

Fair enough though. Maybe they just wanted to kill the tracker anyway.

idk that was a terrible kill bc it was such an easy mislynch

@Prince, I disagree. Wheme kill seems to be more than "just kill the tracker". Simply because tracker is quite a weak role till late game. At this early on just first night with so many possible PRs, tracker would have been completely confused. Plus agree with KTS here that Wheme was a very easy mislynch. Just look at the way a wagon built up on him EVEN after Momo was hammered! LOL!!

I need time to ISO Wheme, and again everyone. I feel Wheme was killed because he sensed atleast 1 of the scums.

If a vig shot Wheme they should claim instantly yeah.

Absolutely. If a Vig shot Wheme, they must claim coz then the townie that saved the kill would instantly know the scum.

Actually that's not true. Some of the "NKA" related posting is bogus. Not sure whose.

@Daves, please explain.

Hi Titus

Can you talk to me about your reads?

I like PP as town, particularly his reactions here.

I am willing to sheep on davesaz. I gotta be wrong somewhere.

explain? i can agree davesaz is scummy but I think schadd_'s argument was good enough for today

we could also compromise on bang i guess but i think pp's push is worse and would rather vote there

Explain your case on me, Giga, so that I can respond. I havent seen any solid case from you or anyone on me. Just empty suspicion will lead to nothing. You are just pushing me to the wall

[bangthemafia]

ok wait

so

davesaz is a likely candidate for a nk................................. and there's a small possibility scum are pushing him for the easy ml............... and that whemeplay was possibly killed to frame him....................

how does that transition to a vote on him

like your vote has way too much "he could be town!" but it also doesnt make sense from a scum perspective it's just incomprehensible to me

nO that's WRONG

i said that davesaz was likely TO MAKE the NK. He's far more likelier to have done that than be framed, but if I were smart, I'd be pushing him and have killed Whemestar without any associations relating to me to completely make it seem like a baseless and stupid kill other than the obvious aspect of killing a PR. Then, I'd push the most likely candidate in town's mind (davesaz) and mislynch him. I'm thinking of potentials here because the kill doesn't make sense in my mind other than those two things to have happened.

Too much of WIFOM there. Cant be sure. Daves has been quite scummy on day 1. But Wheme's constant push on Daves when Momo wagon was building up made things complicated. It created a possibility of mislynch for town!Daves.

desist immediately

Strange! Giga was trying to understand your statements. Did not understand this aggression.

Alban. Your thoughts?

Why would your first post in the new day be asking for someone else's thoughts. You usually start with your analysis of nightkill and possible scum. Where are your thoughts?

what if whemeplay was a vig shot and scum failed their kill

Are you soft claiming Vig? In that case i feel better to clearly spell it out so that the town because of whom the scum kill failed, can use that knowledge into deducing some conclusions

[bangthemafia]

Also if we have a watcher who is town and chanced upon something, good idea to point out. Or maybe they are already doing that by putting a vote!?

[bangthemafia]

@Spade, what do u think of alban this game? I dont know why but i just fail to understand this bloodthirst for alban. What case others have for his slot?

@Everyone, somehow in this game, I see there are some players who are being scumread by others without any solid reason. Also there are some players who are being written off as conftown by some again without anything solid. I dont know about how others look at this, but the moment someone townreads me without much reasoning, I tend to reflexly get paranoid. I think town has to avoid falling into this trap of town reading those who townread us. I mean we need to work together, agreed. But nobody is a conftown unless they hav a town result by cop or they are masons. Even neighbourizer could be scum.

I dont have time next 2-3 days. But deadline is still far away. So as soon as i get some time, i m gonna ISO wheme and few others in hope to find out something.

@Spade, to be 100% honest, I m not even sure about u. U are acting quite different. Maybe you are trying to change your meta or something. I am not going to get tunneled on u as I hav a bad experience of last game where you were black goo.

[bangthemafia]

if they wanted a tracker via UB (???¿? ub is dumb for scum) then theyd take rolecop which does the same thing but better

spades point makes sense though

@Giga, please explain.
1. We have only Titus's word that he got UB. He cud hav chosen rolecop for all u know
2. I disagree. Role cop just tells scum that this guy has some sort of night action. Tracker tells u night action (by virtue of movement) PLUS by knowing the target and their subsequebt behaviour next day, some more things can also be deduced. Eg. If tracker's target visited scumkill and the kill fails, tracker knows his target is a protective role.

So yes, scum does hav interest in acquiring tracker. If scum is in slightly mid to low position in draft, they can try UB/RC and then try to get their desired PR by lynching/killing. Dont forget Wheme was the only other claimed PR.

[bangthemafia]

UNVOTE:

I have a better idea

Titus tracks me tonight, and outs where I go.

If she picked Role cop, she'll know my role but not where I went.

I liked your idea and thought process. I had done a similar suggestion to check Spade's claim in our last game. Only problem is that you almost softclaimed your PR. Secondly in this plan, a town!titus will waste 1 precious night in just proving himself. Thirdly scum!titus may later say i decided to track someone else at last minute. How does that prove he is not a town?

[bangthemafia]

Tracker can't find the prs worth finding in this set-up, e.g. UB and vigs.

cop and doctor is all that it can find that matters and you dont really need to know WHO is targetted for those most of the time

also if she went with dunn's plan but then "changed it at the last minute" thats basically a scumclaim

1. Why is that? Are vigs immune to tracker? I thought they are not.
2. And i didn mean scum would want to know WHO is targetted. I meant by knowing WHO was targetted by their target, tracker can quite often guess the exact role of their target. Wont the scum love that extra info?
3. So u suggest Dunn's plan should be implemented?

[bangthemafia]

spade what do you think of alban?

@Spade, what do u think of alban this game? I dont know why but i just fail to understand this bloodthirst for alban. What case others have for his slot?

Alban appeared to be playing quite different from his usual style. Whether as scum or town, he usually gives solid logical points. Offers his comments and thoughts about diff people and usually plays with an agenda. He seemed quite random in this game. His vote on me, just after I claimed VT, without any comments; his vote on Lyon, they don't add up. When I said that I scumread him for not scumreading me, he immediately wrote a long post on why I was scum. That was his only substantive post in the game.

As he is busy in IRL, I was waiting for him to find time to post his thoughts. Kept asking him "his thoughts", so that we could have a clearer understanding of his alignment. But all his catchups lacked content. The way he replaced himself out also seemed "over the top".

Anyway, will wait for his replacement to post before deciding whether to vote him or not.

Still not convinced All this is NAI to me. I know he is busy like hell IRL right now. You also knew that coz u only said he replaced out of all his games. Then why do you find him scummy? His different play seemed out of busy RL to me. But even you hav a different play this game. I will try to point out what i mean. Vaguely remembering, I found your reaction after Wheme claimed a bit different, plus you are very less analytical than ur usual self.

[bangthemafia]

i put dave in my lock townreads since on a meta read he's obviously town

he pushes cases and talks about rl way differently as scum

I am not like confident in it but I think that Davesaz is town.

@Giga,@Prince, explain why you find Daves "Locktown".

giga, who do you think we should be focusing on right now?

I'm kind of lost

I don't want to lynch: Giga, Lyon, Spade_Ace, prob not schadd, transcend


VOTE: alban

??

yeah that's good i basically have the same list + davesaz pp.

I think you are throwing around townreads too easily. If you go by this, your lynchpool basically means- [Titus, Me, Alban, KTS]. I know I am town. I am also not convinced about alban. KTS is only mildly scummy to me. And Titus has claimed PR. So there is something shittily wrong going on here. Maybe I havent got enough time so I couldnt go through people's meta, and so couldnt understand what you mean, but I think some of you seem to be heavily basing your reads on meta. And too many people are getting pocketed too easily. Anyway, since last 48 hours nobody posted much and I didnt want to post just for the heck of increasing my post count, I looked at VCs of day 1. Will post soon.

Giga, who is "he" here? I assume Spade. If you are talking of his advice to Schadd at the beginning of the game, at that time he didnt have the information about other slots. So what is your point?

that it's silly to scumread him for it

I believe titus's claim, but spade could have drafted ub/rc and not gotten it so he wouldnt know schadd's role

I don't have a strong case on you, bang, besides the fact that I think the people who were on both titus and whemeplay were wagonning them for claims. voting you as a compromise might help me better establish a read on you based on who follows and reacts

@Giga, you say you dont have a strong case against me, then why am I in your lynchpool?

@Spade, what do u think of alban this game? I dont know why but i just fail to understand this bloodthirst for alban. What case others have for his slot?

@Everyone, somehow in this game, I see there are some players who are being scumread by others without any solid reason. Also there are some players who are being written off as conftown by some again without anything solid. I dont know about how others look at this, but the moment someone townreads me without much reasoning, I tend to reflexly get paranoid. I think town has to avoid falling into this trap of town reading those who townread us. I mean we need to work together, agreed. But nobody is a conftown unless they hav a town result by cop or they are masons. Even neighbourizer could be scum.

I dont have time next 2-3 days. But deadline is still far away. So as soon as i get some time, i m gonna ISO wheme and few others in hope to find out something.

@Spade, to be 100% honest, I m not even sure about u. U are acting quite different. Maybe you are trying to change your meta or something. I am not going to get tunneled on u as I hav a bad experience of last game where you were black goo.

Coloured font is what I was talking about

I will post soon. Giga, you wanted to know who scumreads Spade. Well, I for one, will never completely clear off Spade. I will post separately some of Spade's posts that have been worrying me. Just to remind myself, his posts after Wheme's play and his post inviting investigation at night

[bangthemafia]

These are the important vote counts and biggest wagons of day 1-

Spoiler:

Vote Count 1.4

Titus (5):

PenguinPower, Prince Lyon, Transcend, Persivul, gigabyteTroubadour

Spade Ace (4):

Killthestory, schadd_, Titus, WhemePlay

alban (1):

bangthemafia

bangthemafia (1):

Dunnstral

Not Voting (3):

alban, davesaz, Spade_Ace,

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

alban is on V/LA until 2/23.

Vote Count 1.5

Titus (5):

PenguinPower, Prince Lyon, Persivul, gigabyteTroubadour, davesaz

Spade Ace (3):

schadd_, Titus, WhemePlay

alban (1):

bangthemafia

bangthemafia (1):

Dunnstral

davesaz (1):

Transcend

Not Voting (3):

alban, Spade_Ace, Killthestory

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

alban is on V/LA until 2/23.

Vote Count 1.6

Titus (5):

PenguinPower, Prince Lyon, gigabyteTroubadour, davesaz, WhemePlay

davesaz (2):

Transcend, bangthemafia

Spade Ace (2):

schadd_, Titus

bangthemafia (1):

Dunnstral

Not Voting (4):

alban, Spade_Ace, Killthestory, Persivul

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

alban is on V/LA until 2/23.

Vote Count 1.7

Spade_Ace (4):

schadd_, Titus, Persivul, WhemePlay

Titus (4):

PenguinPower, davesaz, bangthemafia, Transcend

alban (2):

Prince Lyon, gigabyteTroubadour

bangthemafia (1):

Dunnstral

WhemePlay (1):

Spade_Ace

Not Voting (2):

alban, Killthestory

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

alban is on V/LA until 2/23.

Vote Count 1.8

Titus (4):

PenguinPower, davesaz, bangthemafia, Transcend

Persivul (2):

Prince Lyon, schadd_

Spade_Ace (2):

Titus, WhemePlay

WhemePlay (2):

Dunnstral, Persivul

alban (1):

gigabyteTroubadour

bangthemafia (1):

Killthestory

Not Voting (2):

alban, Spade_Ace

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

alban is on V/LA until 2/23.

Vote Count 1.10

Persivul (5):

Prince Lyon, Dunnstral, Spade_Ace, Titus, schadd_

Titus (4):

PenguinPower, davesaz, bangthemafia, Transcend

alban (1):

gigabyteTroubadour

bangthemafia (1):

Killthestory

Prince Lyon (1):

Persivul

Spade_Ace (1):

WhemePlay

Not Voting (1):

alban

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

Vote Count 1.12

Titus (4):

PenguinPower, davesaz, Transcend, Prince Lyon

alban (2):

gigabyteTroubadour, Spade_Ace

Persivul (2):

Titus, schadd_

Spade_Ace (2):

WhemePlay, alban

WhemePlay (2):

bangthemafia, Dunnstral

bangthemafia (1):

Killthestory

Prince Lyon (1):

Persivul

Not Voting (0):

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

Titus is V/LA until the end of the weekend.

Vote Count 1.13

WhemePlay (6):

bangthemafia, Transcend, PenguinPower, Dunnstral, Killthestory, davesaz

Spade_Ace (4):

WhemePlay, alban, Titus, schadd_

alban (2):

gigabyteTroubadour, Spade_Ace

Prince Lyon (1):

Persivul

Not Voting (1):

Prince Lyon

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

Vote Count 1.14

bangthemafia (4):

Dunnstral, Titus, Transcend, Killthestory

Spade_Ace (3):

WhemePlay, alban, schadd_

Titus (3):

bangthemafia, Spade_Ace, Prince Lyon

WhemePlay (2):

PenguinPower, davesaz

Prince Lyon (1):

Persivul

Not Voting (1):

gigabyteTroubadour

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

Vote Count 1.16

momo (8):

Spade_Ace, bangthemafia, davesaz, PenguinPower, Titus, schadd_, Transcend, momo

alban (2):

Prince Lyon, gigabyteTroubadour

bangthemafia (1):

Killthestory

davesaz (1):

WhemePlay

Killthestory (1):

Dunnstral

Spade_Ace (1):

alban

Not Voting (0):

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends in (expired on 2017-03-04 02:03:00).

A lynch has been reached. Flip coming shortly.

I did some analysis about who all were on a wagon when that wagon was at max votes (>4 votes as L was 8 on D1); and also at any time after VC 1.4.

Dead people are in coloured bold-

Titus wagon-

(At 4 or more votes) PP, PL, Trans,

Persi

, Giga, Daves,

Wheme

, Bang; (At a time when this wagon had 3 or less votes-) Spade

Spade wagon-

(At 4 or more votes) KTS, Schadd, Titus,

Wheme, Persi

, alban; (At a time when this wagon had 3 or less votes-) None extra

Persi wagon (Dead, was VT)

-(At 4 or more votes) PL, Dunn, Spade, Titus, Schadd; (At a time when this wagon had 3 or less votes-) None extra

Final Momo wagon after he replaced Persi (Dead, was VT)-

(At 4 or more votes) Spade, Bang, Daves, PP, Titus, Schadd, Trans

Wheme wagon (Dead, was Tracker)

- (At 4 or more votes) Bang, Trans, PP, Dunn, KTS, Daves; (At a time when this wagon had 3 or less votes-) Spade,

Persi

Bang wagon-

(At 4 or more votes) Dunn, Titus, Trans, KTS; (At a time when this wagon had 3 or less votes-) None extra

Observations-

1. People on each of the 5 major day 1 wagons-

None

2. People on atleast 4 of the 5 major day 1 wagons-

Trans

3. People on atleast 3 of the 4 major day 1 wagons (coz 5th was their own)-

Persi

, Spade, Bang, Titus

4. People on atleast 3 of the 5 major day 1 wagons-

PP, Daves, KTS, Dunn

[bangthemafia]

I am assuming for now, that out of the 7 that voted Momo (8th one being himself), atleast 1 has to be scum, maybe even 2. I know I am town, and others can replace their name with mine, so for me there is atleast 1 scum among-
Spade_Ace, davesaz, PenguinPower, Titus, schadd_, Transcend.

Also, just noticed from Persi and Momo wagons. Persi & Momo were quite different. Persi was quite townread by many. Whereas Momo did lot of weird things after he replaced in. So naturally, their wagons were almost mutually exclusive. The only people who were common on both wagons were- Spade, Titus, Schadd

[bangthemafia]

Am busy for next 2 days till Saturday afternoon. Will try to read and respond in between.

@Mod, please note V/LA till Saturday 11th afternoon

[bangthemafia]

want to see everyone weigh in on the dueling counterwagons before i give thoughts on nancy's last few posts

and i actually need to read nancy's last few posts but it's rly late and i just finished a shit ton of work looooool </3

Sorry guys, didn't get time to read all posts after my last one, but LOLL, I feel both these wagons are shit.

About Nancy, I need more from her as she hasnt posted much and about alban, I have said this many times, but I know his RL issues. Its possible that I am biased by knowing him and his issues offline or that I am biased by last game experience. But the problem is that I really dont think anybody built a case strong enough for me. Its like a mob thats just escalating each other's opinions to form new ones. Give me a strong case and I will sheep u.

On the other hand KTS posts were all weird, one liners. But I am not convinced that translates into scumminess.

I want people to remember Titus being weird for later

Why later? Why not now?

So what do you want me to do giga

i want this day to end in a nancy lynch

Giv me a case first and i might sheep you.

I am assuming for now, that out of the 7 that voted Momo (8th one being himself), atleast 1 has to be scum, maybe even 2. I know I am town, and others can replace their name with mine, so for me there is atleast 1 scum among-
Spade_Ace, davesaz, PenguinPower, Titus, schadd_, Transcend.

Also, just noticed from Persi and Momo wagons. Persi & Momo were quite different. Persi was quite townread by many. Whereas Momo did lot of weird things after he replaced in. So naturally, their wagons were almost mutually exclusive. The only people who were common on both wagons were- Spade, Titus, Schadd

VOTE: Titus

[bangthemafia]

I don't see Titus's towntells either. Avoiding current event issues is what told me she was scum in Pokemon.
I kinda want to know if nancy has posted anything, but I want to hit submit on this first.

[quote="In post 2056, davesaz
Spade_Ace has been doing things that seemed manipulative to me, during d1 for sure and might have seen it d2 as well.

Dave can you point outthe things that seemed manipulative to you?[/quote]

Daves, you realize your thoughts and vote dont match. Do you? Also I would like to hear about Spade's suspicious posts from u.

[bangthemafia]

@Giga,

help me bus

bang or kts then.

Me/Pers was tvt so, at least 1 scum is off the wagon. That's bang or kts. Alban is also cleared due to draft and wagons. Spade was a likely rolefish. Tracker was killed bc tracker.

Help you bus? Is that a freudian slip?

Hunh. Is he tying himself to me/KTS here? The "If i die, i take 3 with me" thingie?

[bangthemafia]

I don't see Titus's towntells either. Avoiding current event issues is what told me she was scum in Pokemon.
I kinda want to know if nancy has posted anything, but I want to hit submit on this first.

[quote="In post 2056, davesaz
Spade_Ace has been doing things that seemed manipulative to me, during d1 for sure and might have seen it d2 as well.

Daves, you realize your thoughts and vote dont match. Do you? Also I would like to hear about Spade's suspicious posts from u.

@Daves, I am still waiting for your reply

[bangthemafia]

want to see everyone weigh in on the dueling counterwagons before i give thoughts on nancy's last few posts

and i actually need to read nancy's last few posts but it's rly late and i just finished a shit ton of work looooool </3

Sorry guys, didn't get time to read all posts after my last one, but LOLL, I feel both these wagons are shit.

About Nancy, I need more from her as she hasnt posted much and about alban, I have said this many times, but I know his RL issues. Its possible that I am biased by knowing him and his issues offline or that I am biased by last game experience. But the problem is that I really dont think anybody built a case strong enough for me. Its like a mob thats just escalating each other's opinions to form new ones. Give me a strong case and I will sheep u.

On the other hand KTS posts were all weird, one liners. But I am not convinced that translates into scumminess.

I want people to remember Titus being weird for later

Why later? Why not now?

So what do you want me to do giga

i want this day to end in a nancy lynch

Giv me a case first and i might sheep you.

I am assuming for now, that out of the 7 that voted Momo (8th one being himself), atleast 1 has to be scum, maybe even 2. I know I am town, and others can replace their name with mine, so for me there is atleast 1 scum among-
Spade_Ace, davesaz, PenguinPower, Titus, schadd_, Transcend.

Also, just noticed from Persi and Momo wagons. Persi & Momo were quite different. Persi was quite townread by many. Whereas Momo did lot of weird things after he replaced in. So naturally, their wagons were almost mutually exclusive. The only people who were common on both wagons were- Spade, Titus, Schadd

VOTE: Titus

News flash: his posts being one-liners has nothing to do with why HE IS SCUM. Why are you even scumreading Titus? I honestly can't make sense of this post.

Then go read his ISO especially from D1. But just for starters, some points I can think of off-hand-

1. People who have played with him hav been saying from day 1 that his actions are weird this game. His usual towntells are absent, whatever that means.

2. His efforts to tie people to him. Like if he flips red, who will be the next lynchbait? Scum love to tie people to them by buddying or tunneling.

3. His lynchpool for D1 was me, spade, persi. Persi flipped green. I know i m a town. And though spade features even in my scumleaning list, Titus' reasons for scumSpade were not convincing to me. His throwing shade on Spade for small & silly reasons like "fear response" looked artificial. If Spade is town, it was throwing shade to create general suspicion. If Spade is scum with titus, it was bussing but of such mild degrees that may not cause much harm to spade but can later be used for WIFOM.

4. Titus was 1 of the 3 votes (Schadd and Spade being the other 2) that continued from Persi to Momo. Post flip it looks more like a vote park for a mislynch. When I posted this, Titus tried to discredit me coz I used colored font!!??

5. What townie picks up a UB wen 3rd in draft? A rolecop on the contrary is so much useful for a scum.

I am still reading but at this stage, I am comfortable voting only for Titus, Spade and maybe Schadd

[bangthemafia]

Maybe. Why tryharding? He's basically just lurking lol. But I can't tell if my read on him is playstyle or he actually might be scum. There's nothing really screaming scum about him but if he's not scum then there might be scum in my TRs. I'll go see why Transcend was TRing him I guess, Transcend always has weird reads though.

pedit Titus and I have history and we both read eachother pretty well usually, like I'm pretty sure it's just a mutual soulread that started right from our first newbie game together.

Emotional Titus = town!Titus, basically. She can fake emotion as scum but not consistently or very believably.

ranscend always has weird reads though.

i started playing mafia at the same site transcend did, our reads are alike and valid 90%+ of the time

Meta related stuff like this makes me uncomfortable coz I usually dont hav time to verify meta based reads and so gav to rely on others

[bangthemafia]

lynch spade because regardless of his flip i solve the game

wouldnt that push the idea to not lynch spade? lolz

associations

What about you making the conjectures of the both possible outcomes of spade flips ? im curious

if spade flips scum scum isn't going to be voting him right now probably titus or another wagon that's stupid like mine tho not nancy.
if he flips town titus is scum.

KTS, I liked your thoughts. But by completely opening your mind and saying this you just created a WIFOM for scum

[bangthemafia]

i'll look over her iso again and see how emotional this is

like i suppose the stuff w lyon is believably emotional but tonally/emotionally she feels the same as the one game where i subbed into transcend's slot and (i'm trying not to dredge up bad blood sorry) she reacted to his insults - like the emotion was genuine but everything else outside of it was still stiff

i don't think i'm that good at reading titus (she was incredibly obvious town in our last game but i don't think she can obvtown the same way here even if she is town)

i still dont feel confident in kts scum - i guess the possibility he's playing against his anti-bus meta is there but he strikes me as a principled person who wouldn't deliberately do that

can we try compromising on bang? that's where I'm finding myself so far

@Giga, this is ridiculous. I hav been asking you whats your case on me so that I can respond to it. Every single time you came out with "nothing solid". If you keep pushing me to wall like this without any reasons, you are not helping town. I hav been townreading you, but I just cant understand why a town!you should do this.

[bangthemafia]

I will post separately some of Spade's posts that have been worrying me. Just to remind myself, his posts after Wheme's play and his post inviting investigation at night

@bang what was your case on me again? I just find you saying spade is scummy multiple times but not providing any evidence to back it up.

I know. I just dont seem to be able to find time to put all of your scummy posts together. Will do that on priority tonight or tomorrow. But just by memory, they were your day 1 posts after Wheme's claim; the ones where you invited some investigation at night instead of getting lynched; your entry posts into day 2; and also lack of your usual analytical stuff. Plus after KTS said this, I crosschecked the VCs, and this is true. On day 1, whenever votes built on you, a counterwagon built up- Titus, Me, Persi, Wheme, and finally Momo.

Also, as I said earlier, when there is a replacement, town mentality would be to compare the behaviours. I would usually second guess my vote whether it was because of a personality trait of the predecessor, and only when I am sure its not only related to personality, I would vote the replacement. Persi was widely townread, whereas Momo was scumread. In hindsight, I would attribute this to personalities. But Titus, You and Schadd were persistent with both wagons. I dont know about Titus and Schadd. But I know your personality and thats against your townplay for me.

also bang the intention of a compromise wagon is to see how it goes to derive a read from you - if i scumread you or townread you i would present a case but the truth is i really don't know

in a vacuum i'd have a shit ton of townreads so the bar is kind of high for me to decide which one i really feel like sticking to - davesaz, lyon, dunn i'm like 100% confident about while pp and cloud are in the 98% sure category - everyone is fair game for me at this point even though i can point out a lot of townie things in everyone else's play

i think the best way to sort you is via wagon but i'm not going to wagon you unless i think i have to

I am fine with that as far as town doesnt lynch me in my absence. With 3 scums around, a "test wagon" even if started by townies can escalate fast. I have burnt my fingers in recent past.

@giga which slot's lynch (irrespective of whether you feel the slot is town/scum) do you think would give town the maximum info?(vca based or flip wise) ....for me this person is schadd....for one i can verify his draft slot....second i dont know why no one is pushing for his lynch....i think if schadd was town, then scum would have actually pressured that slot a lot more....but there is almost zero pressure on him....and it is not like he comes off as an obvtown guy.....

Valid point. So in no world you and Schadd are scumpartners together.

Maybe i am biased cos of the 1v1 we had....anyway, this game is stalling ..not sure whether it is cos scum is playing an excellent game or it is due to the nature of the setup...

I think its more because of a lot of headstrong players who are too sure of themselves as is evident by so many vanity wagons. We are a completely divided town.

I dont mind a nancy lynch...at this point only bang and titus are the only ones who are defending that slot hard...

I am not defending anyone. I just wanted a good case on alban slot which nobody seems to have. Ok, I am listening, walk me through your case if you have one. Else, I would rather focus on MY scumreads.

How is this Town exactly?

i mean tbf that was before i said it was the only non-town thing in his iso but if you read my iso i pointed out a few questions that i thought were generally town from spade

plus the vt claim was town

Why is that? What would a scum do? Fake a power role claim? And then come in focus with a counterclaim? I would rather always claim VT as scum. It provides me immunity from lynch for some duration as many will just believe that claim as is happening right now. Till scumteam succeeds in throwing shades at some players, there will be other lynchbaits, so I can survive the "lynch the useless VT" arguement. It also gives me excuse to be "kept" alive till late game as scum is expected to go for PRs. In fact, in our whatsapp mafia games, this was one of our town tactic to go for massclaim. They were all open games with known setup and roles. So if there are counterclaims, you have 50% chance of catching scum. If there were no CCs, we would just focus on VT claims. Spade knows this as he and alban were part of those games.

@Daves, I am still waiting for your reply

Spade was making comments d1 which looked like they were meant to influence PR targeting so that scum could kill elsewhere.

Didnot understand this. Please explain. Also, if you find Spade scummy, why are you not voting him?

[bangthemafia]

Happy Birthday, Titus!!

[bangthemafia]

Why is that? What would a scum do? Fake a power role claim? And then come in focus with a counterclaim? I would rather always claim VT as scum. It provides me immunity from lynch for some duration as many will just believe that claim as is happening right now.

@bang my vt claim can be verified. It is my alignment which cannot be verified and this is true for everyone else.

To verify whether i am vt or not, i just need to tell the role schadd chose. Schadd can verify this.

But currently he chooses not to reveal himself. So i dont want to go against that.

All that will just verify that you are vanilla, not necessarily townie. You could have been a scum who opted for XYZ role that you didnt get because Schadd picked it. That makes you a mafia goon, not a VT.

[bangthemafia]

admittedly I see bang posting walls and just ignore him

@Dunn, everyone has a playstyle and we all have to adapt to others' styles. I find one liners useless and painful when I hav to ISO someone later as one has to sift through loads of crap. If you dont read everything people post, thats your loss, and in turn town's!

Pedit: Its just 3 days to deadline and we already have 4 wagons. If you are starting a 5th one, it will be great you accompany your naked vote with some kinda case!!??

[bangthemafia]

This is a terrible idea whoever floated it.

A full massclaim will just bring out all PRs in open- we are all doing what scum basically would have done through the rolecop- thats if they had one.

And a partial claim of "not picked RB" is of no use.

[bangthemafia]

but a claim of "rb/doc but vt" helps because we lower the poe pool of rbs :/

Arent PRs complementary to VTs? Bringing VTs out in open also helps scum PoE PRs for their night actions, right?

[bangthemafia]

Why cant we think of something like "watch the cop" on the lines of save the cop? If town got watcher they must watch Schadd.
Giga, I still dont understand nor like this. But if everyone wants to go ahead, we must follow the draft sequence bottoms up.

[bangthemafia]

but a claim of "rb/doc but vt" helps because we lower the poe pool of rbs :/

Arent PRs complementary to VTs? Bringing VTs out in open also helps scum PoE PRs for their night actions, right?

yes

which is why we're not claiming vt UNLESS it's that specific role pair

Lol. Isnt "picked RB, but didn't get it" claim basically same as a VT claim?

[bangthemafia]

This is a terrible idea whoever floated it.

A full massclaim will just bring out all PRs in open- we are all doing what scum basically would have done through the rolecop- thats if they had one.

And a partial claim of "not picked RB" is of no use.

No its not of no use nemo please claim

Wat do u want me to claim?
My role?
Or whether i asked for RB/doc?
And arent we going sequencewise?

[bangthemafia]

Ok I did NOT ask for RB/Doc.

[bangthemafia]

Yes. That's what Dunn proposed.
Also if watcher is with town, they must watch town. That will keep scum away from Schadd and hopefuly we will get a conf cop result

[bangthemafia]

Yes. That's what Dunn proposed.
Also if watcher is with town, they must watch Schadd. That will keep scum away from Schadd and hopefuly we will get a conf cop result

EBWOP

[bangthemafia]

Hunhh, just a day and few hours for deadline and you guys fighting over old games and spamming for over 50 messages?

unless you think schadd is scum there is a confirmed roleblocker. titus is confirmed not roleblocker and you are trying to lynch her.

regardless of your read you must know that play is shit

1) I don't need scum to bus because I am RC
2) Titus is going to flip town

Prince, please explain why and how are you sure about Titus? Is it only about old games, meta, and "I have never been wrong about Titus" stuff?

[bangthemafia]

{schadd, pp, bang, giga, nancy, lyon, cloud, dunn, davesaz} possible rbs/schadd is scum

If Schadd is scum-cop, he would never take this risk of claiming having roleblocked unless scum took RB.
Also we have no proof Titus actually took UB to inherit tracker. He could just be rolecop.
Spade could just be a mafia goon.
All this exercise is not very informative as anybody could lie. We seriously need a flip or an investigation.

First seed scum would absolutely pick cop to deny it to town I think

Completely agree.

[bangthemafia]

{PL}
{Dunn, Gigabyte}
{Titus}
{Cloud, Schadd, Spade, Davesaz}
{BangTheMafia}
{KTS}
{nancy, PP}

How confidant you are about your Titus read?

[bangthemafia]

titus is UB/RC 100% of the time because persivul is conftown and roleswapping with spade or schadd partners is dumb - but good point about spade bang

UB/RC is fine. But didnt still understand why Titus is UB-town and not RC-scum? Especially if Schadd is town?

[bangthemafia]

i dont think scum!bang calls out a spade roleblocker like that but other than that that's a good point

titus/spade also doesnt make much sense from D1 interactions

Naay. Go read Open 664. Spade and his scumbuddy Aelin were continuously fighting and FoSing each other day 1, and voted for each other. Aelin got lynched day 1 and that gave Spade towncredits. What I mean is that Spade is capable of elaborate charades too.

[bangthemafia]

SO who do you think will give max info, Spade?

[bangthemafia]

titus can be rc-scum imo, lyon just townreads titus while i think she's a likely partner to my sr and my rb read. i'm trusting him though and saving her for later

i dont think scum!bang calls out a spade roleblocker like that but other than that that's a good point

titus/spade also doesnt make much sense from D1 interactions

Naay. Go read Open 664. Spade and his scumbuddy Aelin were continuously fighting and FoSing each other day 1, and voted for each other. Aelin got lynched day 1 and that gave Spade towncredits. What I mean is that Spade is capable of elaborate charades too.

if you mean the first point then i dont think you gain much from calling him out and you lose nothing by keeping quiet. i'd keep quiet if spade were my partner and town had the rb pool wrong

on the second point it's more from titus than spade, titus usually doesn't have her partners as top scumreads

Of course I meant the second point.
So, even your townread on Titus OR take that Titus-Spade is impossible is based ONLY on Titus' meta like Prince?

[bangthemafia]

If Schadd is scum-cop, he would never take this risk of claiming having roleblocked unless scum took RB.

Hmm true. Actually, even if roleblocker was his partner, scum!schadd has no need of claiming that he got roleblocked. That is like revealing to town that scum got the Doc/Rb slot. Its not helpful for scum at all. Which means, he is probably town.

Yes, 99% thats correct. Just 1 or 2 rare scenarios can be there. But I dont want to bring that up right now. We hardly have a day and just like day 1, we are again divided on wagons.

[bangthemafia]

10 pages generated in last 12 hours! Need time to read. Can anyone please giv a summary of what's happening after page 110?

[bangthemafia]

pp claimed neighborizer, titus is planned to track him so we can verify his claim and hers too, nancy is probably the lynch

Thanks for the update. I still plan to read all the pages as early as I can, so I might be saying things right now which already might have been addressed. But my thoughts-

This is what happens close to deadline if we remain divided on wagons- a stampede!

I dont really feel nancy would be a good lynch. I was never convinced by the case on alban if there was any. After nancy replaced, she has contributed even more than some of our original players. I would have preferred Spade or Titus. But if it comes to that, I would prefer anyone over a no lynch.

Isnt this hilarious that we are requesting one of the top scumreads of many of us to track another scumread. What if they are scumtogether?

Also, if PP is neighbourizer, who did he neighbourize on Night 1? That player can verify the claim very easily, right?

If town doesnt trust that player OR if PP claimed to not have neighbourized anyone, we can give a target to PP and watcher can watch on that target. That will keep Titus free to track someone else.

[bangthemafia]

i mean if youre the only one calling to shoot scum i might reconsider it but yeah dun has done absolutely nothing and it wouldn't be a bad slot to eliminate at the moment

But I thought Dunn softclaimed a PR

[bangthemafia]

Also, if PP is neighbourizer, who did he neighbourize on Night 1? That player can verify the claim very easily, right?

This is true

We should probably do that

Actually, why does penguinpower take neighborizor if he just lurks all game

LOLL. so true.

[bangthemafia]

This game is really depressing me tbh. I wish my trs would stop fighting but at the same time i feel like i'm wrong on some of them but I just don't feel it.
Can we not let tomorrow turn into a deadline clusterfuck and actually figure something out before deadline tomorrow

Thats exactly what I have been saying

I've had a shitty day irl too and it's kind of just ugh.

their play's been bad but at the same time they've done several things that I really don't see coming from scum

Sympathize with your RL issue. But dont take it out by playing judge to others' playstyle. I am gonna be superbusy near deadline. Travelling for next 5 days. Plus most of you seem to be from US. So you all chat when I sleep. And when I get up its like tons of posts again!

[bangthemafia]

Ok then.
VOTE: Penguin

[bangthemafia]

By the way, whats the VC?

[bangthemafia]

The neihborizer scenario penguin is claiming is completely stupid and inefficient but its an even less likely scenario on a scum slot. What gives credibility to his claim is me confirming that the role is indeed taken and UN CC'D = PENGUIN is confirmed TOWN neihborizer SLOT or ROLESWAPED MEFIA

I dont get this. Hows this? You are 3rd from below so what if PP is scum, their partner scum is neighbourizer and ABOVE you. You will still get denied the role because its already taken.

IMHO, i dont see mefia going for the neibhorizer slot and not neighborizing then claim neihborizer I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS TO BE A MEFIA PLAY

We can always test penguin neihborizing + titus ability to watch in the same night

I seem to be losing it. Titus claimed a tracker. SO they will NOT know whom PP visited. They will just know PP moved. Now if PP is scum, irrespective of whether neighbourizer or RB or vanilla, the scumteam can make PP make the factional kill. Tracker will get a positive. And PP will get away saying they neighbourized the dead person. How will we know anything? In this scenario, even if Titus is town, they will get a positive. We will just be wasting a night.

if he's roleswapping titus catches him if she's town lyon

No. Read above. Even if roleswapped, all PP has to do is make the kill for Titus to track him.

If at all we want to waste a night in all this, maybe we have to give a target for PP to neighbourize, request watcher to watch that target (assuming town has one. Even if scum has it, they cant openly deny town's request); and tomorrow both watcher and the target to confirm that. (Watcher saying PP did visit the target;and target saying yes, I got neighbourized). This is the only 100% way, but I just dont feel like wasting so much of energy on that. Still we can go for this. That way Titus and Schadd will also be free to investigate someone else. Also, if we dont have watcher, then Titus can track PP as already proposed, but additionally, the target for PP needs to be allotted by us and that target will need to confirm tomorrow about getting neighbourized.

its pretty darn easy to catch a penguin fake, someone will have to claim neihborized

Read above

{pl, gbt, titus, nancy}

I will compromise on anyone who isn't in that pool if you guys can find something you agree on

I still feel you are mistaken about Titus because your TR on Titus seems to originate only from a meta. I am ready to vote for Titus/Spade/PP today

[bangthemafia]

i also really don't like how easily everyone's just writing it off because that feels incredibly wrong to me.

sure they're 'confirmable' but I feel like this ends in night after night of them claiming roleblocked and not getting a result whether they're town or scum so

Did PP also claim having roleblocked?

Also, what was the chronology? Did PP claim neighbourizer BEFORE or AFTER Cloudkicker claiming that he asked for that role but didnot get it?

[bangthemafia]

Everyone is so so opinionated in this game, its tiring. I wont be around near deadline as that would be 6 AM in my place. I m voting for the biggest wagon but can shift to Titus or PP if someone is interested. Will check this thread once after an hour or so.

VOTE: Spade

[bangthemafia]

God, its already 17 pages after daybreak! Am right now on official tour so hurriedly read all pages. May not get time till Sunday to be very active. So just summarizing my thoughts-

Giga-Lyon-Dunn-Daves are strong townreads in that order

Trans/Cloud has been quite townie on D1 & till late D2. Cloud's hammer was a shame but as of now i m gonna giv him some benefit of doubt. He seems to be quite a seasoned player to use "sorry, it was a mistake" arguement of all as a defense. Scum!Cloud would also not interact with Titus/PP/Nancy unless he was heavily bussing. I also thought of a possibility of scum!PP who is really neighbourizer and claimed correctly and then scum!cloud claimed refusal neighb to giv credibility to PP. But this seems too too far fetched coz Cloud would be directly tying himself to PP that way.

KTS was the wagon i didnt feel like hopping on day 2. I still feel he is a townie who posts the way he posts as a personality trait. But he can be a scum by PoE. So he is my most shaky scum read.

Nancy/Alban could be a scum but I have said it so many times that I couldnt think of any solid case on them. For me, if they are scum, thats only by PoE. Also if Titus is scum, Nancy is definitely scum.

PP and Titus are the scummiest right now.

I feel either Titus is lying about his "PP visited no one" result coz he is a scum!rolecop and PP is the RB in wich case Nancy is the neighbourizer. Why she didnt neighbourize N1 beats me. N2 she didn't coz she had to support PP's fakeclaim. Or it could be the other way round too- PP neighborizer and Nancy RB

But if Titus is town, its gonna be Cloud-PP-KTS which is like hard to believe.

PL's #3610 theory of PP/Cloud/Nancy is also possible.

In this case, PP is the safest lynch option.
If PP is scum, KTS should vig Titus /Nancy
If PP is town, KTS shud vig between Titus/Nancy/Cloud

If we lynch titus, if he is scum --> Town!KTS shud vig Nancy.
If Titus is town, Town!KTS shud vig Cloud.

Will try to read ASAP and post.

[bangthemafia]

Also, if we hav a 1shot Vig/PGO, we are already in LyLo as a Mislynch will get us down to 3+6. So worst case scenario where all 3 kills go through (Scum, N3Vig, 1xVig/PGO) is scum win

[bangthemafia]

We are locking KTS to one shot in case they're scum. I want that shot to be whichever of nancy/PP that we don't lynch today.
Do you care to explain to me why Cloud is in the vigpool after a PP townflip but not after a scumflip?

Coz I thought CK was scumreading PP. So unless he is a known busser, if PP flips red, I will almost clear CK.

[bangthemafia]

Back from a busy week. Will take time to read. Just saw the night result. I am sure these would have been discussed in the 15 odd pages that ensued after day start, but just to get a better grasp,
KTS whom did you shoot in night and why?
Titus did you say you tracked Dunn? Why?

I'm going to argue that it's best to ignore nancy and try to get a lynch on bang - simply because I believe this game will be easier with more town alive than without

Bad idea for a MyLo with 3 scum + 5 townies!

Lynching nancy today is a shitty idea in general, yes.

Why? I thought Nancy was conf scum after Daves result.

[bangthemafia]

Comments till page 172-

Spoiler:

Did dave actually have a guilty or was he lying?

Dunn visited no one.

Completely beats me why you tracked Dunn. You should have tracked either your scumreads or someone from town's collective lynchpool.
And what makes you suspect Daves was lying?

Why would dave be lying? He was telling the truth

I know I told you a few days ago but why did you track me

Exactly. Unless of course, you both are buddies.

Pretty sure town lost this game when they lynched spade_ace

We are 3+5 with a confscum. And thats not a bad position, atleast not as bad as you make it out to be.

Pretty sure town lost this game when they lynched spade_ace

yeah

I know I told you a few days ago but why did you track me

Anyway we pretty much need to kill nancy here - I have doubts on Titus, I think bang is probably mafia by poe though

titus doesnt have any partners that make sense

agree about bang but idk i don't really have any solid reasoning to call him scum still besides everyone else being obvious town

Thats such a bad reason to scumread me. Maybe you should check your reads again. There is no way I would defend Alban so much if we were partner.

[bangthemafia]

Role Information

Possible Roles

As I mentioned, only one role within each slot can be assigned. Listed are the possible role slot PMs (pasted from the wiki). Upon receipt of the PM, you may choose your role among the two given:

Spoiler: Night 3 Vigilante OR Vengeful

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Night 3 Vigilante OR Vengeful Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Night 3 Vigilante: On Night 3 only, you may select a player in the game to nightkill.
-Vengeful: If you are lynched, you may select a player in the game to vengekill before the game goes to night.

Spoiler: 1-Shot Vigilante OR 1-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the 1-Shot Vigilante OR 1-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-1-Shot Vigilante: On one night of your choice, you may select a player in the game to nightkill.
-1-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner: On one night of your choice, you may elect to "arm" yourself. If you do, you kill anyone who targets you that night.

Spoiler: Cop OR 1-Shot Redirector

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Cop OR 1-Shot Redirector Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Cop: Each night, you may investigate one player in the game and learn their alignment.
-1-Shot Redirector: On one night of your choice, you may select a player to "redirect". If they are using an action that night, they will be redirected to another player of your choice.

Spoiler: 1-Shot Commuter OR 1-Shot Watcher

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the 1-Shot Commuter OR 1-Shot Watcher Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-1-Shot Commuter: On one night of your choice, you may elect to "commute", which will render you immune to all actions on that night.
-1-Shot Watcher: On one night of your choice, you may watch a player of your choice and learn who targeted them (if anyone).

Spoiler: Doctor OR Roleblocker

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Doctor OR Roleblocker Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Doctor: Each night, you may select a player in the game to protect from one nightkill.
-Roleblocker: Each night, you may select a player in the game to roleblock. This will prevent them from using an action.

Spoiler: Universal Backup OR Role Cop

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Universal Backup OR Role Cop Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Universal Backup: After the first power role has died, you will inherit their role. If the first roles to die are multiple people at night, you will inherit one of those roles randomly.
-Role Cop: Each night, you may investigate one player in the game and learn their role. Mafia Goons and Vanilla Townies will both investigate as Vanilla.

Spoiler: Neighborizer OR Fruit Vendor

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Neighborizer OR Fruit Vendor Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Neighborizer: Each night, you may create a neighbourhood with another player in the game. You will now have access to a quicktopic thread with this player for use at any time.
-Fruit Vendor: Each night, you may target a player in the game and give them a piece of fruit. The fruit does nothing.

Spoiler: Jailkeeper OR Tracker

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

Congratulations, you have won the Jailkeeper OR Tracker Role. Please specify before D1 starts which role you'd like to be.

Abilities:

-Jailkeeper: Each night, you may choose to "Jailkeep" someone, which will simultaneously protect them from one nightkill and roleblock them.
-Tracker: Each night, you may select a player in the game to track. You will find out who they targeted that night (if anyone).

Base Role PMs

If you do not win a slot in the draft, you will be assigned Vanilla Townie (if town) or Mafia Goon (if mafia). These role PMs are listed below:

Spoiler: Vanilla Townie

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

You did not win a role slot in the draft. You are a

Vanilla Townie

.

Abilities:

-Your weapon is your vote. You have no night actions.

Win Condition

-You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated and there is at least one town player alive.

Spoiler: Mafia Goon

Sample Role PM

Hello [playername]!

You did not win a role slot in the draft. You are a

Mafia Goon

.

Abilities:

-Factional communication: At any time you may communicate with your partners here: [link].
-Factional kill: Each night phase, one of you or your partners may perform the factional kill. Please note that the player who submits the night kill may not submit another night action.

Win Condition:

-You win when the mafia obtain a majority or nothing can prevent this from happening.

kts claimed night 3 vigilante

1 shot watcher was claimed

cop dead

mafia have control of roleblocker

neighborizer dead

tracker dead

Titus has to be the ub/rolecop slot



The only unclaimed ability is 1-shot vig/pgo - so Titus tracking me means she suspects that I'm mafia and trying to catch the kill?

And she didn't react at all when she saw I went nowhere - I want to know why she chose to track me

You seem to be creating a WIFOM here. Simplest answer to me is that you are scum buddies.

[bangthemafia]

also no one's ever gotten back to me if they think transcend would replace out of a game out of boredom as scum

6who is severa

rc alt #2

lyon is like

#4 i think

I just finished an oddrole where scum replaced out on D1 due to "Boredom". About Transcend specifically, no idea

[bangthemafia]

also no one's ever gotten back to me if they think transcend would replace out of a game out of boredom as scum

6who is severa

rc alt #2

lyon is like

#4 i think

LOL whats the point of do many Alts when everyone knows RC's alts

i still hard townready both giga and dun, i do not townread lyon and i am really comtempling that he might be a mefia, today we shouldnt vote anything but nancy and stop being extremely bad

I was reading posts and commenting in a different window. Will post it in a minute. But if Dunn is not scum, it just doesn't fit if we believe scum didnot take multiple 1's.

[bangthemafia]

Comments on page 173-176:

Spoiler:

Scumteam is Dunnstral/Titus/nancy. There are no other possibilities for me at this point in time. I'm working on my case.

Why not KTS or Cloud instead of Dunn? I am almost convinced Titus and Nancy are scums though.

ctrl + f alban on bang gives 80 results

That's a lot

wow it's almost like they're friends???

ctrl + f alban on bang gives 80 results

That's a lot

Because Bang spent a lot of time trying to phrase their townread on Alban. It felt and still feels genuine.

this too ^^

Alban, me and Spade are friends in RL. Alban got me and Spade to this site!! Before joining this site, we have played mafia on whatsapp and face to face. Maybe that answers my association with Alban. Plus I genuinely felt till Davesaz's result that there was no solid case against Nancy/Alban

Davesaz - talks about alban for the first time in post 1983, says they're probably town, thinks they're scum in post 2056
schadd_ - barely talks about alban but townreads him for the way he talks
Whemeplay - doesn't really talk about alban besides "wow random vote" until post 1522. "I think you're town, gj"
Persivul - barely talks about or to alban, never gives a read on him

@Dunn, whats the point? Why are you using townflips' reads to support yours. They did not get the privilege to see as many flips and associations as we have.

I think it's bang.
Can we talk about why titus and bang can't be mafia together?

Titus, yes, sure. But me? Tell me what is your case on me? Why am i scummy to you?

In contrast, its amazing how Titus has survived till now if he id a tracker. He repeatedly threw shade on me for flimsy reasons and openly buddied Nancy for reasons that looked beyond a tunneled town. Every day a wagon built on Titus, but died. His AtE on D3 about replacing out and then suddenly agreeing to stay back was also scummy. I really dont know his play but vaguely remember that lot of people including some hardtowns on D1&2 did say this is scum Titus.

[bangthemafia]

Comments on page 177-178:

So if Prince and Titus are alts, doesnt that already clear them? Isnt it like masons?

This reads to me as super fake

no it doesnt

it reads like mistranslating something in your head which i do a lot anyway when i have to read in another language

Exactly. And I did explain it as soon as realizes what "alt" meant. Not everybody is super familiar with all the terms used here!!

[bangthemafia]

ctrl + f alban on bang gives 80 results

That's a lot

wow it's almost like they're friends???

Is bang friends with Titus?

Serious question

just plug in names on search on bang's iso - goes up to like 215 on titus

So? You are bordering on ridiculousness now.

[bangthemafia]

ctrl + f alban on bang gives 80 results

That's a lot

wow it's almost like they're friends???

Is bang friends with Titus?

Serious question

just plug in names on search on bang's iso - goes up to like 215 on titus

that's because titus has been his top scumread all game

Exactly. Even now.

i want cloud, bang, and titus to weigh in here

Any specific questions?

My biggest thing was why was I left unblocked. It makes zero sense. If nancy was guiltied, why rb kts? That's a net loss situation as nancy could spew associatives and there's a chance I could catch the blocker.

which is why you can't be blocked in any situation - kts town or scum

if you're blocked and kts is scum that doesn't shoot you're in a 1v1

@Dunn, why is there no chance in your narrative that Titus is a scumrolecop lying all the way about his night actions?

Titus, if kts is town scum need to block him because otherwise he gets a vig shot off on nancy (who's confirmed scum and who kts agreed to shoot at)

And my struggle with that is why not let nancy get shot? Her talking only hurts scum.

Could be another WIFOM from your hat. If you + Nancy are scum with any of Dunn/KTS (Or even cloud? But cloud was after Titus's life, so quite unlikely) it explains why Nancy was not killed and the convenient absence of night results from you on N2&3

[bangthemafia]

The more I think about it, the more I feel KTS is not a good vote. I am almost sure its Titus + Nancy + One of KTS / Dunn / Cloud

Cloud - Dunn / Lyon interactions sounded TvT to me, though. And kinda understood about their PoV of getting an extra scumlynch before Giga dies.

Based on that, my hierarchy right now is Titus > KTS > Dunn OR very less chance of Cloud.

I am voting Titus now, but can very well shift to anyone of KTS/Dunn/Cloud if a wagon builds there.

VOTE: Titus

[bangthemafia]

I will reconsider between Titus and bang - I'm pretty sure kts is just scum

AM fine lynching KTS though am not sure of him as much as I feel sure for Titus. What has Titus actually done this whole game apart from openly defending Alban/Nancy so blatantly and telling us that he will soon bring out his VCA. By the way, I remember Daves telling that Titus talks of his VCAs more when he is a scum

[bangthemafia]

I mean why you guys are so sure Titus IS NOT a scum? Is it all about his meta as Prince keeps pointing out? Tell me something from this game.

[bangthemafia]

but can very well shift to anyone of KTS/Dunn/Cloud if a wagon builds there.

uh, we're in mylo buddy

you'll lynch anyone in a group of 4 where only 2 can be scum?

I know thats why I am voting for my top scumread. I have been scumreading Titus from Day1. But everytime I get to hear only Prince's Meta defense on her, which I am tired of. I dont like to depend on something which is a hearsay for me.

@Dunn, I agree if Titus is a tracker, he should be given a chance. Thats why said KTS is fine too.

Also, I am a vocal hater of no lynch. But if it comes to a completely divided town like the earlier days, No lynch is better than mislynch here in this MyLo

[bangthemafia]

@Dunn, I agree if Titus is a tracker, he should be given a chance. Thats why said KTS is fine too.

but you voted titus

Dude, coz he is my top scumread.

Whole of day 1, Titus scumread Spade and townread alban-

Spade, I'll play along. Suppose you me and alban are town, how the fuck did we get here?

VOTE: Spade

And then, later this-

VOTE: Spade

Sorry man.

Implying he knew Spade is going to flip town?

He has just been lurking with his promises to come up with a VCA that he never really came out with. He did some AtE to replace out. And then first post after deciding to stay in the game-

Mod:I'll stay

VOTE: nancy

Voting for Nancy- that one person for which you said-

Even if you think am scum. I cannot be a RB. And town's optimal play is to lynch someone who might flip RB.

The back half of your wagon ain't town.

Titus if you think my flip can help solve the game using your VCA theory then go ahead and vote. Town is gng to lose only a VT.

But i just think scum will justify their vote on me saying my town play was bad and that is why i deserved to die.

I would only hammer you to save Nancy. Scum flip is needed for vca.

[bangthemafia]

I can consider other wagons but I really don't think that Titus is tracker. She's the only thing I am quite confident in right now.

[bangthemafia]

bang did you claim yet?

Tracker/JK

[bangthemafia]

gigabyteTroubadour Feb 18, 02:06am Mar 27, 01:09pm 0 days 0 hours 900
Prince Lyon Feb 18, 02:07am Mar 27, 01:08pm 0 days 0 hours 798
Dunnstral Feb 18, 02:36am Mar 27, 03:51am 0 days 9 hours 643
CloudKicker Mar 09, 11:58pm Mar 27, 09:07am 0 days 4 hours 603

the thing about a KTS/Titus team that I've been thinking about is it means that all 3 scum were lurking all game.
I've been noticing a pattern with scumteam activity that I don't want to go into but it's somewhat uncommon for all scum to lurk
usually scum want to have a 'face' that's posting more than the rest of them. in dunn/titus/kts that's dunn but for kts/titus/nancy scum really are completely relinquishing control of the gamestate

The faces are cloud and bang, and bang is lurking.

Prod dodge.

You are almost on the verge of OMGUS Titus. And dont do this. You are discrediting me using my activity? When all the game it was you who were lurking. I hav a family and a demanding job. Last week I had a job related travel and when I realized I wont be able to post much, I actually asked for a V/LA. But whenever I post, I always try to be as elaborate as I can- enough to let people know whats going on in my head. So instead of discrediting people like this, why dont you come out with why you find me scummy so that I can atleast respond to your concerns. Otherwise you are just closing the conversation!

[bangthemafia]

Until someone gives a good reason to TR those two, I won't vote anyone else after nancy dies unless mathmatically forced to do so.

Make it the other way round. What exactly is your reason to scumread me, Titus? From Day1, you have been tunnelled on me without even giving any reasons. Dont talk of your gut instincts etc because they seem to suck. You hard scumread Spade whereas for whole of the game till Daves watched Nancy, you have been hard-defending her.

can we all please unvote stuff and actually use the day

We need corpses.
We need dead nancy.
We need my result or corpse tomorrow.
No lynch.
Corpse.

Scum!Titus would never have made this post.

I'll probably vote you next.

Its amusing when people talk of meta. I dont know Titus enough to decide if this is true. But isnt meta a big WIFOM that a player can knowingly change? So tell me something townie about Titus thats not meta related. I mean Titus's recent ISOing of Cloud was the only time when I felt she was really trying to solve the game. But my biggest issue with a Cloud -KTS team is that both picked up 1 in the draft. I still feel thats very unusual, unless it is a known strategy in PYP and someone experienced enough was in scumteam to advocate this. I know Alban and dont think he will advocate for that. Is Transcend / KTS that type of a player who would advocate that? If the answer is no, I will still keep Titus in my possible scumlist.

Yes his townread on Bang is dumb but is that necessarily SvS? I feel like it makes more sense that he'd be white knighting and buddying him

Given bang is the sole living slot that Cloud hasn't linked to nancy or voted, there's zero interaction, and the read makes zero sense....

I know it looks bad. But for one, its not true that I was clearing Trans completely. When most of you kept calling Trans as obvtown again based mainly on meta, I had my scepticism. Later, when Cloud replaced in, we were together in another oddrole game. When he kept saying "Lets not lynch Nemo etc etc", at that time, I was just happy that someone was townreading me. Probably thats exactly what a Scum!Cloud would have wanted at that time.

Cloud/KTS feels really right imo. Cloud's the roleblocker who pretended he picked neighbourizer so he'd have a fakeclaim. KTS was bussing absentee nancy slot they showed up he backed down and let nancy push on him. Claimed 3-shot vig and asked to be leashed for towncred. Cloud isn't nightkilling you because you TR him and me because he wants to get one over on me

Only if you feel Trans / KTS are players who would take same numbers together as scum

[bangthemafia]

Page 10-12- Things that caught my eye-

Buddying up of Kill and Trans
Daves appearing only to post I have read everything.
Transcend’s too many vote shiftings
Talk about Prince and Titus being alts?

im going to trust you on this and never lynch you the rest of the game. if im close to lynching you, just quote this post and i probably wont lynch you.

probably.

Dont like this buddying. Assuming right now it is in a jokular way.

You feel a KTS/Cloud team makes sense here? I dont.

By the end of page 15, my scumleans are
Daves for throwing shade on Spade out of a small reaction of "Your thoughts?"
And Kill for buddying Trans

No way I can be scum with KTS.

Let's lynch in this and see if anyone has any complaints: {Dave Titus bang Alban PenguinPower giga}

I am not sure about anyone else hitting a scum. I m comfortable voting only for Dave or even Titus.

Look at Trans' read list and lynchpool. Why would a scum!Trans put both his scumpartners in his lynchpool if me/Trans-Cloud were a team?
For the same reason and looking at Titus' recent mega ISO on cloud, Titus/Cloud is also almost impossible.

@Giga,

help me bus

bang or kts then.

Me/Pers was tvt so, at least 1 scum is off the wagon. That's bang or kts. Alban is also cleared due to draft and wagons. Spade was a likely rolefish. Tracker was killed bc tracker.

Help you bus? Is that a freudian slip?

Hunh. Is he tying himself to me/KTS here? The "If i die, i take 3 with me" thingie?

How about Titus-KTS?
Also, as a scumpartner I had no reason to bring KTS in limelight here. I would in fact no want anyone to see me/KTS words together!

[bangthemafia]

i'm still exploring every option but with lyon calling titus town i'm going to follow him on that read

so yeah i'm looking in {you, bang, kts} and dunn/titus is my fringe/paranoia option

Cloud is not mafia

Lol nah Transcend fo sho

2377 #kerrigan.mp3

lmao

maybe it is bang/cloud

@Giga, this post and the one above it originates from the fact that you have made up your mind that Prince reads of Titus are correct, and that Titus is town. You are so fixated right now that whatever others are saying, you seem to hav a justification from the narrative where Titus is town. Try to see things objectively here unbiased by others' reads. I cant debate if someone talks of meta or old games coz I dont bloody hav time for crosschecking it myself. But you can check my meta. ISO me and ISO Titus. Just think of what all she has contributed this whole game except last few pages. Anyway i dont want to discredit her coz I cant be 100% sure she is scum. But in the 1v1 between Titus and Cloud, I strongly felt that Cloud's responses looked more townie than Titus's accusations which looked more like she was set out to systematically discredit. If they are both scum, that was a magnanimous charade.

Also, note that Titus was leaning on Bang/Cloud and Prince later suspected KTS/Cloud. Do you really think scum!me would refute that and point out KTS/Cloud looks mechanically less likely coz of same number instead of just staying silent and let the town go in that direction?

What changed since your hard townread on transcend, you hard townread on myself and titus obvscuming in the last 5 pages?

Are you really willing to trust more your rc read, rc's read on titus then your read on my slot?

uh

yes?

pyp was super annoying because no one would listen to me that grey was town despite his idiocy because of how closely i knew him and kraska (his pred) so i could read them like 100% of the time

titus and rc are the same way and if lyon says titus is locktown then titus is locktown

you really think bang/kts is implausible from your pov?

Hunhh! People in this game are just obsessed with metas!!!

bang isn't really scummy right now

this game is really hard; I'm pretty sure it's not cloud here

Its Titus/KTS bloody 90% of the time. And i am not breaking my head on rest 10% because one if these 2 will be there in 90% of that 10%.

nancy being the lynch needs to happen. Always lynch confscum.

Then we lynch cloud.

Classic!!! So that again on Day 5 you can tell us you got no results!!! Hilarious.

[bangthemafia]

Suddenly, a majority was reached: the town was to kill Killthestory. Or, at least, the entity formerly known as Killthestory. The townspeople were relatively sure they were just lynching a social construct, but the thought of this mostly just made them dizzy and a little itchy, so they tried not to dwell on it too much.

In place of Killthestory, a book burned at the stake. Everyone thought it was a great visual pun, and it definitely smelled better than a burning person.

The worst part about violent vigilante justice was definitely the awkward silence that followed afterward, when everyone realized that yeah, they just killed someone and yeah, they kind of sucked as people.

Well, it usually was. Today, a female voice pierced the silence:

"Wellllll wasn't that fun, Titus who is definitely my scumbuddy in crime?"

It was nancy, who had walked up to Titus and placed her arm around her shoulder.

Titus uncomfortably looked at nancy out of the corner of her eye. "This is how I die, isn't it? Under the collapse of bias and misunderstanding."

nancy laughed. "Wow, Titus, you're so profound! I was thinking something along the lines of 'with a knife in your back'!"

Then, Titus felt a sharp pain in her side (nancy's aim was pretty shitty). And then again. And again.

As she laid broken on the ground, she gasped her final words: "So many vote counts...I will never see..."

---
Everything had happened so fast. He wasn't sure if he would wake up the next morning, but at least he could die knowing he was right.

Dunnstral suddenly realized he was very, very wrong.

Then, he felt cold metal on the back of his neck, and he realized he was about to be very, very dead.

"Who was it?" He figured that if he was going to die, he wanted to know the truth, the conclusion to this bizarre mystery.

A quiet voice answered: "nancy."

"Oh, fuck off." He turned to face his assailant. "You...I knew it. I was right about you."

In front of him stood bangthemafia.

bangthemafia smiled. "Well, that means you were half right...and that's still a failing grade."

Then there was a bang, and one more townsperson was dead.

---
If he had to admit it to himself, Cloudkicker actually liked the brutality of town mobs. They were entertaining, someone usually brought food, and they really increased his chances of winning the gardening competition next month.

They were less fun when illicit organizations took control of the proceedings.

"Nemo!" proclaimed Cloudkicker. "You are a bad mefia fish!"

bangthemafia turned away from Dunnstral's corpse, his gun now pointed at the man in front of him.

"Oh, Cloudkicker," he said, "you almost had us...too bad no one listened."

"I died as I lived," said Cloudkicker solemnly. "By the mefia."

bangthemafia paused awkwardly. "You, uh...you sure you want those to be your final words?"

Cloudkicker stared silently at him for a couple of seconds, and then rolled his eyes and nodded forcefully.

"Um, okay. You do you."

Another gunshot rang through the town, and then only four remained.

---
gigabyteTroubadour stood shellshocked as they watched their neighbors fall. With each death, the truth became so terribly clear.

Now they understood how wrong they really were.

"Prince...you can't be..." they stammered, their eyes fixed on the robed figure in front of them.

Prince Lyon's face betrayed no emotion.

gigabyteTroubadour collapsed at Prince Lyon's face. "This can't be true! It's impossible," they cried as they clutched the feet of his robes.

Again, there was no reply.

"I...I...fuck, I killed a penguin for you, Prince..."

Slowly, a wicked smile formed on Prince Lyon's face.

He knelt down so that his face was level with theirs. gigabyteTroubadour felt the sharp edge of a blade against their neck.

Finally, Prince Lyon spoke.

"Thank you."

And then everything was dark.

---
Killthestory was lynched. He was a

Town Night 3 Vigilante

.

Titus was killed in the endgame. She was a

Town Tracker

.

Dunnstral was killed in the endgame. He was a

Vanilla Townie

.

Cloudkicker was killed in the endgame. He was a

Vanilla Townie

.

gigabyteTroubadour was killed in the endgame. They were a

Vanilla Townie

.

---
The

Mafia

, consisting of nancy (

Mafia Goon

), bangthemafia (

Mafia Roleblocker

), and Prince Lyon (

Mafia Goon

), wins!

Oh my GOD, looks like I am late for the party! I am in hospital right now so dont have much time to read and comment. But just wanted to say sorry to everyone who trusted me, especially Giga and Cloud. Sorry Cloud, though I was playing for a wincon, it did feel shitty as hell to betray your trust so much.

Arona, amazing write up of the endgame. Very creative and innovative!! The best and most brilliant I have ever seen- not that I have played too much! And with all the melodrama that you created, I literally felt like an evil anti social element.

Having said all this, this was one of the best games I ever played, so thank Arona for all the VCs especially near deadlines.

Will read and comment more soon

[bangthemafia]

Gosh everyone is sick (myself included and yet im still pulling all-nighters)

bang feel better soon!!

LOL, thanks, but I am fine. I am in hospital not as patient! Treating kids! M a doc

[bangthemafia]

LOLL, do you something in this post? Basically I am a very bad lier. So I wanted that if it comes to massclaim, I should claim a role which is most similar to mine. So that if someone watches or tracks or even rolecops me, I can tell them that yes I am a PR- a town roleblocker. I thought I would feign village idiot who decided RB is better over doc because town RB can prevent not only scumkills but also scum PRs. So I breadcrumbed here-

oh shoot bang might be mafia ;-;

Completed reading everything. And cant stop laughing!!! Understand why everyone jumped on me!

T

he thing is that I keep feeling getting influenced my last played game.

O

f course I can be wrong, but I tend to keep thinking the frustrations usually arise from town mindset.

W

hether that applies to Giga-Alban interaction or not, I am not confident.

N

evertheless, I just hope it is not a scum-scum charade.

R

ight now, I will ISO each player and then make up my mind.

B

y the way, my reads till now-
Strong town- Transcend, Prince Lyon, GigabyteTroubadour
Town lean- Alban, Spade_Ace
Null- Dunnstral, schadd_, PenguinPower, WhemePlay
Scum lean- davesaz, Killthestory, Persivul, Titus

VOTE: Davesaz

But I will shift to Titus if that wagon builds.

This is why I kept saying, if you dont believe me, bring me to L-2 and wait for me to be online. But midway Prince and Nancy completely cautioned me not to do this stunt and NOT to claim RB. SO then I decided to claim VT!

[bangthemafia]

/me hugs bang

THANK YOU FOR BEING MY SCUMBUD BANGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!

Hehehe, and an openly buddying scum bud!

Anyway, thanks Nancy and RC for a great time!!!

[bangthemafia]

@grundy BEST endgame flavour i have seen in my few games here. The flavour + Giga's 'what' reaction, made it awesome

It makes us feel such coldblooded, villainous and bloodthirsty scums!!

[bangthemafia]

The problem is that when we wake up in the morning, its almost always 10-12 pages to read. I just missed the hammer and the reactions in real time!!

[bangthemafia]

[bangthemafia]

Giga, isnt this the longest ever played game? Which game has 225 pages? Have you played large games? Are they this long?

[bangthemafia]

Btw i think i played well and i tried hard but gave up

KTS, you were amazing. You were the only one who smelled inconsistency from Prince.

@Prince, your masterstroke was convincing people like Dunn, Giga and finally even Cloud to lynch outside a confscum Nancy! Kudos!!! Thats where we started sailing towards victory

[bangthemafia]

Btw i think i played well and i tried hard but gave up

Cloud

, you were amazing. You were the only one who smelled inconsistency from Prince.

@Prince, your masterstroke was convincing people like Dunn, Giga and finally even Cloud to lynch outside a confscum Nancy! Kudos!!! Thats where we started sailing towards victory

EBWOP

[bangthemafia]

You were the only one who smelled inconsistency from Prince.

Sorry, SChadd, I meant on the last day

[bangthemafia]

Alts are basically alternative accounts, right? So if Prince and Titus are alts, doesnt that already clear them? Isnt it like masons?

what

I think you took the dumbtelling a step too far my friend because that's pretty ridiculous

Dunn!

[bangthemafia]

i do not think Alban and bang played really well I think they played just good enough to stay out of towns site to destroy themselves

Lyon again played very good

Exactly, they played just well enough, Alban secured Prince's pocket of everyone with their Day 1 interactions and bang did good in the critical moments at the end there to get townread, with only a momentarily slip up.

I had genuine RL issues.

But i thought we did quite well with PL bussing Alban and me supporting him.

However, I dont think Alban was obvscum etc. He was just absent at important moments, people caught onto him for wrong reasons, so I genuinely defended him.

Similarly, people scumread me mainly for less no of posts which was actually due to genuine RL issues. However what mattered was whenever they scumread me (D1- my Titus-PL alt thing was real ignorance, Giga, Dunn, D4 etc) every time i was succesful in changing some people's mind about me being town.

I also feel many time its natural tendency that people equate no of posts, carelessness, one line shit posting with towniness.

Another lesson for me is- never ever let a confscum go unlynched. A bird in hand is always worth 2 in bushes

[bangthemafia]

Idk like I ended up being abrasive when I didn't want to but that's because this was a really frustrating game. None of us played badly but there was a basically unbreakable Dunn/GBT/Trans townblock and we couldn't actually kill any of them because there were six town PRs. I'm not surprised Alban replaced out.

Making perfect night actions brought the game from 'unwinnable' to 'insanely hard' and that just feels really dumb. From the informed postgame perspective there's still nothing that we could have done better and I was stressed about this game every day.

Wrong. As Spade pointed out, Alban replaced out due to severe RL busy schedule, travel etc.

And he, and partly I too, was pissed off because on day 1, when we just had started the day, you screamed in PT not to FoS yoy in any minor way. And few pages later you blatantly started bussing Alban- not sheeping anyone but literally starting a new wagon. That was dual standards and selfish! He got majorly pissed off because you just assumed that he will submit night kill. But thats not why he replaced out.

[bangthemafia]

It was amazing to watch from the sidelines, Prince.

I

really really really really

wanted to spam the game thread with WIFOM after I became conf!scum but Prince wouldn't let me T_T

Oh yeah and when I replaced in the timing was so bad for me, I replaced in the afternoon, had a shitton of stuff to do, slept, came back to Prince saying he was gonna hardbus me if I didn't post asap so I just cobbled together that crap on KTS in like 20 minutes and blurted it out there.

I thought if you started spamming people would just get annoyed and lynch you and I felt like I wanted to go for the game winning lynch with GBT alive.

Basically it was a hard pocketed Giga that did the job for you, Prince. Else many had started raising foubts on and off on your being town. I think Schadd, KTS, Cloud, Dunn and even PP, Wheme all did suspect you at some time point or other

[bangthemafia]

Thanks Arona! Hope we dont ruffle too many feathers!