world.createNew(Utopia everHope); - EPILOGUE (GAME OVER!)

[inspectorscout]

mod please purge my shame

What do you mean?
Also, your V/LA has been noted.

I am replacing Aelita if they don't post within 12 hours.

There is quite some friction in this thread, and just so you know, this isn't an easy situation to resolve for me since I'm kind of personally involved. Because I feel my judgement can and will be biased, I'll take the situation to the listmod and see what their thoughts are.

Regardless of that; you are allowed to be angry, but don't personally insult any other user at any time. Whatever they may have done to you to deserve it - this is my game, and I do not want

any

of it.

Thank you, and apologies for not intervening earlier.
Votecount below.

[inspectorscout]

Being in love is easy. Staying in love is what makes life worth it.

- Anna White

Vote Count 2.4

drealmerz7 -

[0]

Zachstralkita -

[0]

momo -

[0]

gerryoat -

[0]

Clumsy -

[0]

[L-2]

MariaR -

[6] KidAmn, gerryoat, Randomidget, Clumsy, MathBlade, MariaR

Aelita -

[0]

The Bulge -

[0]

MathBlade -

[1]

KidAmn -

[1] Zachstralkita

Randomidget -

[0]

BTD6_maker -

[0]

Peptobislawl -

[0]

RadiantTroubadour-

[1] drealmerz7

Not Voting -

momo, Aelita, The Bulge, BTD6_maker, Peptobislawl, RadiantTroubadour

Mod Notes –

O

With 14 Alive, It Takes 8 to Lynch.

Day 2 Ends In (expired on 2017-04-18 05:52:36).

[gigabyteTroubadour]

don't

if you're town math this isn't just a blacklist this is me committing that i think that you're an awful human being

i've been trying to talk to the mod to get you removed but at this point I think that it's become partially tactical because of how antithetical you are to town wincon regardless of your alignment

I'm out please grow the fuck up please don't be a self absorbed twat please don't think that what you did here approaches okay in anyone's sense of the word. don't whine that people don't want to play with you

you don't replace into a game with someone who has specifically requested that you don't replace into games with them and refuse to leave then be a giant assclown

it really should be enough for you that I've made clear my stance on you replacing into my games and asked you to leave promptly. i shouldn't have to feel like I'm requested mod intervention on my faction's behalf when I ask for you to be replaced because i can't bring myself to post in the game with you here

No that is not a catch 22 it is a perfectly legal action for you given that I don't want you in this game and it has already greatly soured my enjoyment of this game.

You have chosen not to do so because you value your ability to play in a game that I was in first over my ability to enjoy it and I am not okay with that at all

just because you're scum and know that i'm town doesn't make the replace out strategic

if I was scum you should be every bit as willing to replace out because I asked you to replace out. I don't ask people to replace out strategically

that's why you bow out graciously the first time I asked when I've established my feelings towards playing with you rather than make it personal and make this a thing

Hold off on voting.

picking up in our iso i havent read any of it idk if it's even game relevant but rc please post in the hydra

probably wont get to seriously read any of this until tomorrow

[RadiantTroubadour]

don't

if you're town math this isn't just a blacklist this is me committing that i think that you're an awful human being

i've been trying to talk to the mod to get you removed but at this point I think that it's become partially tactical because of how antithetical you are to town wincon regardless of your alignment

I'm out please grow the fuck up please don't be a self absorbed twat please don't think that what you did here approaches okay in anyone's sense of the word. don't whine that people don't want to play with you

you don't replace into a game with someone who has specifically requested that you don't replace into games with them and refuse to leave then be a giant assclown

it really should be enough for you that I've made clear my stance on you replacing into my games and asked you to leave promptly. i shouldn't have to feel like I'm requested mod intervention on my faction's behalf when I ask for you to be replaced because i can't bring myself to post in the game with you here

No that is not a catch 22 it is a perfectly legal action for you given that I don't want you in this game and it has already greatly soured my enjoyment of this game.

You have chosen not to do so because you value your ability to play in a game that I was in first over my ability to enjoy it and I am not okay with that at all

just because you're scum and know that i'm town doesn't make the replace out strategic

if I was scum you should be every bit as willing to replace out because I asked you to replace out. I don't ask people to replace out strategically

that's why you bow out graciously the first time I asked when I've established my feelings towards playing with you rather than make it personal and make this a thing

Hold off on voting.

picking up in our iso i havent read any of it idk if it's even game relevant but rc please post in the hydra

probably wont get to seriously read any of this until tomorrow

when u hydraslip to fix a hydraslip

[Randomnamechange]

don't

if you're town math this isn't just a blacklist this is me committing that i think that you're an awful human being

i've been trying to talk to the mod to get you removed but at this point I think that it's become partially tactical because of how antithetical you are to town wincon regardless of your alignment

I'm out please grow the fuck up please don't be a self absorbed twat please don't think that what you did here approaches okay in anyone's sense of the word. don't whine that people don't want to play with you

you don't replace into a game with someone who has specifically requested that you don't replace into games with them and refuse to leave then be a giant assclown

it really should be enough for you that I've made clear my stance on you replacing into my games and asked you to leave promptly. i shouldn't have to feel like I'm requested mod intervention on my faction's behalf when I ask for you to be replaced because i can't bring myself to post in the game with you here

No that is not a catch 22 it is a perfectly legal action for you given that I don't want you in this game and it has already greatly soured my enjoyment of this game.

You have chosen not to do so because you value your ability to play in a game that I was in first over my ability to enjoy it and I am not okay with that at all

just because you're scum and know that i'm town doesn't make the replace out strategic

if I was scum you should be every bit as willing to replace out because I asked you to replace out. I don't ask people to replace out strategically

that's why you bow out graciously the first time I asked when I've established my feelings towards playing with you rather than make it personal and make this a thing

Hold off on voting.

picking up in our iso i havent read any of it idk if it's even game relevant but rc please post in the hydra

probably wont get to seriously read any of this until tomorrow

when u hydraslip to fix a hydraslip

Lol

[momo]

Can somebody please explain to me why this fight is okay. I don't know anything but RC and Math, you better play to the town wincon instead of fighting. Like it it annoying to wake up and read this...

[MathBlade]

Can somebody please explain to me why this fight is okay. I don't know anything but RC and Math, you better play to the town wincon instead of fighting. Like it it annoying to wake up and read this...

I don't think it is. Trying to move on from it.

Prod Dodge for now.

[RadiantTroubadour]

2, maybe even 3, probably 4 scum if Maria is scum are on the wagon.

We were discussing this in hydra PT but there's not that many narratives that make sense for Maria scum at this point. TL;DR for why I excluded most of them is that this Maria doesn't make this post while she wants to bussed

I've typed subbing out 4 times and backspaced I kid you not I hate this rn so I'ma just go do something else yall hf

This was, for the record, BEFORE Gerry was established as 'the person' pushing the Maria wagon. This is when we were.
I also want to point out that Clumsy, whom I consider basically mod confirmed scum, was a super early adopter of the Maria wagon. So all that's iffy

Then there's this absolutely beautiful post which is the foundation of my current defense of Maria.

Should be L-2 but I don't think anyone should care. I'm interested in the MariaR v Gerry, but we deal with this first.

Wham. Terrible on so many levels. Jumps off of Maria who he still claims is super scum, does so in a scummy way, but most importantly frames it as MariaR vs Gerry.

HE WAS SCUMREADING GERRY EARLIER ON IN THE GAME. HE'S FRAMING IT IN SUCH A WAY THAT IF MARIA IS HIS SCUMBUDDY, HE TOWNFRAMES MARIA.
CONVERSELY, IF MARIA IS TOWN, HE MAKES GERRY LOOK REALLY REALLY BAD.

Also wrt Maria sort of changing tac and fighting less? Town PoV of her deciding fuck this game makes sense, but the

best

answer for Scum!Maria is that the change happened as a result of Gerryoat's tunnel on her. But there's literally no way that Scum!Maria is scared of Gerry; sorry dude that's not ever going to be a thing.

So what I am saying is that

Clumsy is scum

and either:

GerryOat and Maria are both town, and the current Maria wagon is scum motivated
OR
GerryOat and Maria are both scum, and the current Maria wagon is scum motivated.

TL;DR THE MARIA WAGON IS SCUM MOTIVATED. IF YOU THINK THAT SHE'S SCUM SHE IS BEING HARDBUSSED SO LET'S DEAL WITH THE HARDBUSSERS.

[RadiantTroubadour]

And don't get me wrong. I think the narrative of Gerry asking Maria to let her hardbus her and her saying yes midway through D1 makes a lot of sense.

But the fact is that Maria is the wagon that scum want to see lynched and we're not giving them that wagon. Clumsy is scum and we can deal with Gerry/Maria some other time

[RadiantTroubadour]

Like forget the question of 'is Maria scum or not' because it's a bad question to ask right now. The question to ask is 'do scum want Maria dead' and the answer is a resounding yes.

You think scum!Maria selfvotes when her buddies aren't already on the wagon? it's not something you have to think long and hard about there's a reason as a rule of thumb any selfhammers include scum on the wagon.

let's lynch the definite scums and then worry about whether Maria was giving herself up to be bussed later. thanks.

[MathBlade]

Like forget the question of 'is Maria scum or not' because it's a bad question to ask right now. The question to ask is 'do scum want Maria dead' and the answer is a resounding yes.

You think scum!Maria selfvotes when her buddies aren't already on the wagon? it's not something you have to think long and hard about there's a reason as a rule of thumb any selfhammers include scum on the wagon.

let's lynch the definite scums and then worry about whether Maria was giving herself up to be bussed later. thanks.

1) The entire point is to ask if someone is scum or not. If it is scum lynch it. Who cares if scum want to lynch their own or not? If they want to make my job easier of lynching scum I am not going to stop them.

2) Maria self votes and does other things a lot. Take post 29 in PYP she was scum.
Entry post into the game and none of her buddies were voting her. Maria uses a lot of AtE as either alignment and so instead you have to read her by what she does during the AtE. Is she pushing a read? Is she being helpful? In Civ Mafia she and her hydra kept pushing reads while being wagoned. She isn't being helpful she is just AtEing to avoid being lynched similar to PyP.

3) I think if anyone is bussing Maria it is likely Kid. Don't think Clumsy is.

[RadiantTroubadour]

Math if you're scum no one cares about your opinions on who scum is. Math if you're town no one cares about your opinions on who you hum is.

In case you hadn't realized with how exorbitantly uncharismatic you are there is a 0% chance any wagon that you want would get support unless forced by deadline or abetted by scum.

If you are town and continue to stand in the way of good lynches I will policy you to save myself having to deal with you and save town having to deal with your vote.

Oh and KidAmn is very very obvious town and you not seeing it is almost funny it's so ridiculous

[RadiantTroubadour]

Like you being on that wagon should be a red flag to town that it isn't a wagon that they should support and I hope some of them see that.

Gerry, you have expressed your support for both Clumsy and Maria. If you weren't scum posturing about your support for Clumsy you are going to vote them now.

[RadiantTroubadour]

Oh and Maria if you didn't in fact get your wholeteam to hardbus you then help me lynch the scum that are on your wagon instead of fucking voting yourself.

[MathBlade]

Math if you're scum no one cares about your opinions on who scum is. Math if you're town no one cares about your opinions on who you hum is.

In case you hadn't realized with how exorbitantly uncharismatic you are there is a 0% chance any wagon that you want would get support unless forced by deadline or abetted by scum.

If you are town and continue to stand in the way of good lynches I will policy you to save myself having to deal with you and save town having to deal with your vote.

Oh and KidAmn is very very obvious town and you not seeing it is almost funny it's so ridiculous

Not the case.
I am actually pretty good at forcing scum lynches. (Undertale for example where I found the ONLY scum in a large theme)
I just have to be right. Admittedly I am swingy. Some games I am horribly right and others I am horribly wrong.

Why did your slot perform the sudden changes it did with regards to MariaR and Clumsy? I am having trouble seeing the thought progression. Explain that please.

[drealmerz7]

I should get used to just getting ml'd as town and winning as scum *shrug*
VOTE: Maria
Will be back in the morning do as you wish.

town doesn't do this, this is selfish as a player, not for your team
I think this is a move only scum-maria makes, but if she's town, she can fucking die for it too

VOTE: mariaR

[MathBlade]

For example when I got Titus to work with me in Memory we pushed Rach Marie hard. (Granted I was irrevocably wrong on LycanFire) but I got Drealmerz scum and Rach Marie scum and hammered when it counted. That is an example of a mostly right game.

In Civ Mafia I was a trainwreck manipulated by scum. I fully admit that post game.

@Drealmerz how long did I have you pegged for in in memory?

[drealmerz7]

I don't know why your resume is relevant

[drealmerz7]

and if I recall, you had me pegged as SK, incorrectly

[MathBlade]

I had you as scum then Titus said you couldn't be but either way. Not Town.

I caught RM by post 600 something here.

My point is RT hydra and Kid can say I suck and shouldn't be listened to based on Civ Mafia which was atrocious or you can get a blended look that accurately says I am human and learn from past mistakes.

[gerryoat]

GerryOat and Maria are both scum

this is the worst read i've seen in this game by far, and with dreal trying to lynch all towns, that says a lot.

i can't see anyone with a town mindset thinking me and her can be scum together, especially with that bad of a reasoning. if she flips maf pr i'm lynching you before clumsy

[RadiantTroubadour]

As for why Clumsy is scum specifically? Let's take a look.

1) Almost nil game related content in their ISO.

There is a fuckton of active lurking, a fuckton of buddying, but almost no actual game related content in their iso. I'm going to go through the entire game and pin out the parts where they actually give thoughts on other people for alignment indicative reasons. It won't take long.

I'm not liking Rautherdir so far. His posts are coming off awkwardly. Anyone played with him before?

Iso #7 and he finally gives a read on someone and it's to call them 'awkward' then immediately ask for a second opinion.

Fair. I hate earlygame.

VOTE: Mariar

No opinion on the Maria vote.

All of these responses are terrible. It's an early wagon on day 1, and it's IMMEDIATELY AtE. I think my vote is staying here today unless I'm really convinced about someone else.

Clumsy knows that Maria is known for AtE, this isn't a thing.
And 'oh my vote is staying here unless I'm really convinced'? That's a scum qualifier, through and through. And do you really think town!Clumsy declares intent to deathtunnel this early?

drealmerz7 not doing anything day 1 is NAI. I'm a bit wary of Gerry here, but MariaR stands out the most.

why?

I really really don't like this post at all. Radiant, you've played with Maria before, I have not, you said the AtE isn't alignment indicative from them? That's still screaming at me.

Proxying their opinion on Maria's reads to me. The frequency of them doing stuff like this suggests that they aren't comfortable generating their own reads.
I further read this as an attempt to gauge my willingness to get back on the wagon to determine whether they want to stay there; regardless of Maria's alignment.
Note in spite of putting this as 'alignment indicative' it's only such in the absolute loosest sense because all he does is say that Maria's scummy because of AtE.

Wtf why are you claiming this? There's no reason to do so, you're just giving scum info here. If this is true, just wtf

This is a super, super, super hard buddy tell by the way.

Wow.
VOTE: Coke and Pepsiman

Should be L-2 but I don't think anyone should care. I'm interested in the MariaR v Gerry, but we deal with this first.

That move makes Bulge town I think. I skimmed Kid's catchup, I like it but I have a bad habit of townreading catchup posts in general.

Been over this before but it's really dirty.
1) Frames the discussion to continue the Maria BS tomorrow.
2) Calls Bulge town for virtually nothing, no explanation. Gives a really qualified TR on Kid with a really weird qualifier that doesn't make much sense.

So correct me if I'm wrong here, but the progression was "We're Masons", to "We have role flavor that confirms us as town together" to "We are Lovers"? Yeah no, that backpedaling is gross.

This was never ever backpedalling: even I agreed that Cloud didn't understand his role PM. even I agreed that he was town.
It's also really telling that his explanation of the scumread on Alihydra comes AFTER the fact of the vote.

Anyone that isn't on the Pepsiman wagon: do you town read them? If so, why? If not, why aren't you voting them after fake claiming Masons?

Also I feel like half the game is missing.

Again he's framing this as 'LYNCH THEM FOR FAKE CLAIMING MASONS'. Fakeclaiming masons isn't scummy. AtEing isn't scummy. Ali was scumread for their behaviour not the claim and it's a really scummy way to dumb down the discussion and reduce it to a sound byte. It reminds me of JJD in 1875 pushing on me for 'claiming cop D1' while ignoring the complexities.

If we have a vig, can they shoot either BTD6 or Pine please? I love Pine, but they've been doing nothing in games lately, and in Darkest Dungeon where he seemed to start this, his slot was scum. Makes it hard to read him. Rauth, where are your thoughts with the game right now? Have a better vote than no lynch?

Also want to point out that he, in reaction to a vig being brought up, immediately tries to leash it onto lurkers.

Math, can you talk to me more about RT? I've been townreading them, and I don't have experience with Gigabyte (that I know of at least). Is your opening post about them all you're going on?

Also, are you sure about Maria? I was told this play was normal and town from someone (on mobile or I'd check)

Again trying to proxy their read out and use Math as an excuse to change their read on me.

The RC reaction seems really over the top and unwarranted. Math hasn't done anything to slight him in this game. I don't get it. -shrug-

We seem to have quite a few players that seem to not be here. I forgot some were in the game at all.


I'm reading through links right now, but I'm also cool with Maria wagon I think. Who was it that told me I was wrong with my Maria scumread Day 1? Why was that again?

Using a clearly NAI rant that was brought out by stuff outside of the game and was obviously so as an excuse to scumread us is awful.
Also feels like they're trying to tie me to Maria which feels really bad.

Hello, made myself some popcorn and am ready to play.

So I see my slot has never had a vote on them..Any reason why.

Also, I am going to do an ubiased vca...

Pine was completely MIA this game, and Day One was... a thing.

~My case on Kid will come tomorrow or something.

Looking forward to this case.

Because MariaR has a defined tell which I outed and arguments for Clumsy scum rely on a bus so then MariaR has to be scum for Clumsy in those arguments to be but MariaR Clumsy Town can be a thing.

KidAmn read is now null scumlean

I'm gonna need explanation on that Kid read.

I'm not completely seeing the Scum!RT case here. I believe MariaR has 3 or 4 on her right now.
VOTE: MariaR

Wagon on me dies, jumps on Maria with minimal explanation.

[MathBlade]

viewtopic.php?p=8604489#p8604489

Example given

I can and do catch scum early at points

Pedit reading that now

[MariaR]

UNVOTE:
I'm a Doctor

[drealmerz7]

gerry, you and maria both could totally be scum, quit pretending otherwise

I'm not trying to lynch all towns, I'm trying to lynch players who are extremely anti-town, because scums tend to hide there and townies need to learn to quit fucking their team with shit anti-town play, k? it is pro-town to kill anti-town townies, get over it