Newbie 1826 Basketball Game Over

[northsidegal]

Nsg I think what lucca is saying is that you voted no lynch before anyone explained why it was good

oh - i mean, what else were we going to do? i thought it was pretty much a decided thing that yesterday would be a no lynch. i didn't really need an explanation of why a no lynch was good - i gave my own in 925 and i know how mylo works. i'm not that much of a newbie.

[Luca Blight]

Nsg I think what lucca is saying is that you voted no lynch before anyone explained why it was good

Yes, partly, but perhaps I'm not making the other part of my point clear:

In 1085 she said she initially thought the exact same thing as me about Thor's post (that it was bad, anti-town etc).

She made no comment about Thor's post despite her's being the one immediately after it. Not only that, but she also immediately voted no-lynch, which is in-keeping with want Thor wanted, despite the fact she disagreed with him.

Like, if she thought the same as me about Thor's post (that it was bad, anti-town etc) why not at least mention it in her following post? Why just go along with it if she sincerely disagrees?

[Luca Blight]

oh, i get what you're asking now. you're asking why, when i realized the original intent (ie when i realized that thor was suggesting to end the day with no discussion), i didn't say something to the effect of my disagreement, correct?

Not quite - you said you 'initially thought the same' as me - meaning as soon as you saw Thor's post (whatever you thought his intentions may be) you already disapproved of it.

Am I wrong in interpreting this?

[northsidegal]

man, i need to work on my communication skills. when i said "initially", what i was trying to say was "initially when i figured out what it really meant". that's what i was saying in 1099. initially in the true sense of the word when i saw it, i didn't really put a lot of meaning into it. this is my fault really, sorry.

[Luca Blight]

I see, that makes a bit more sense I guess.

[Luca Blight]

Anyone have any thoughts as to why Lucca was the optimum kill for scum?

[Toto]

I guess no one was really scum reading him? Or at least had said so.

[Toto]

NSG - when you can please do that read through you wanted and provide some reads.
Thor - If you are town you need to do more. So far the only thing I've seen from you is the push on Cheeky.
UCV - Please provide the cases as you promised.
Luca - Can you point me to the posts where you gut-read UC as town?

@Everyone: let's agree not to vote for at least a couple days, and ideally not before we have consensus on who we will vote and everyone has catched up.

[UC Voyager]

I will make the case, but probably tomorrow because it is a late night...and I don't think I will get a chance to

[Luca Blight]

@mod, can we get a vc / updated list of players alive?

Not really liking how NSG posts this and leaves without interacting with anyone.

What are you thinking, NSG?

preliminary thoughts: i will probably be treating ucv as town for today when choosing a lynch. i think it's unfortunate that lucca was the nightkill, from what i know about his playstyle and from what he said it seemed like he had a lot prepared to say today.

This bit jumps out at me with regards to the Lucca kill - NSG obviously saw something with Lucca that others missed.

Also, why is she treating UVC as Town today? I skimmed through her previous posts and can't see her mention UVC much, Is she just parroting what I've been saying?

[Luca Blight]

i feel like i have actively ruined this game. i came in, got someone a lot of people townread lynched and will now probably get my own slot lynched. town probably would have had a better chance if i just let myself die. this isn't even to comment how on poorly i read cheeky.

anyways, here we are with our conftown dead and the promised two weeks to sort things out. hopefully we can still make something out of this. if town can win anyways i might be able to make up for it all.

This post feels really weird to me.

Would NSG be saying this if she was Town and genuinely believed her in her case on Cheeky? I mean, everyone's different, but never have I had such self-conscious feelings as Town following a mislynch - if I genuinely believe in my case on someone and they flip town, I tend to be more annoyed at the other person for not conveying their towniness better rather than beating myself up so pathetically in the thread.

I'm just asking what the purpose of this post is? It feels like she has a real guilty mindset, but not in a townie way.

[Luca Blight]

And then she follows it up with more self-consciousness and excuses:

for this game more than others, i think i've found myself thinking "i really want to believe this" a lot. as the deadline grew closer and closer and as we waited in twilight for the flip, i really wanted it to be true that cheeky was scum. if that wasn't true, then not only did it mean i got a townie lynched (and probably myself tomorrow), it also meant that my read on cheeky was totally off. after cheeky had flipped, i found myself really wanting to believe that thor was town. if that wasn't the case and thor wasn't town, it meant that i was getting manipulated

before i was even in the game

. i don't think i'll be wanting to believe things anymore. hopefully i can approach everything from a fresh perspective and get to the core of issues.

a no lynch here is definitely the right choice. no matter who gets killed it's going to be good in terms of information. i'd like everyone to check in and get their thoughts in first before anyone ends the day, but i'm confident this is correct.
VOTE: no lynch

In both posts she mentions that she thinks she will be lynched next. All this explaining her mindset and worrying about being lynched makes her seem survivalistic already.

It just reads really fake to me.

[Luca Blight]

And yeah, that's all I have on NSG so far.

The case on her is mainly gut to be honest - her case on Cheeky was actually Ok, but it's NAI considering she thought it all up before even receiving her role pm. Her reaction to the flip reads fake to me, and I don't see a townie motive behind the posts - she seems like she's just trying to make excuses so people don't jump on her for lynching Cheeky.

I also really want her to explain why she's treating UCV as Town as I didn't see her mention him as a townread anywhere before - it feels like she saw me townreading him and decided to copy my stance.

Anyway, I'll try to get to reasons why I Townread UCV next.

[Luca Blight]

UCV

1) His hammer on Assemble, while absolutely horrid, was not something I see scum doing on D1 as I said earlier, particularly newbscum.

2) His explanation in 324 I think is an accurate portayal of what a a newbscum's mindset would be in this situation. 330 feels like genuine frustration at Assemble's lack of posting that lead to UCV's hammer.

3) 460 is another accurate break-down of the mindset I would expect from newbscum. The quick-changing opinion from AssembleTown to AssembleScum doesn't seem something that scum could pass off naturally.

4) When being attacked by Cheeky, I would expect a player like UCV as scum to become desperate and panic, yet he seems fairly composed in posts such as 492 and 560.

5) I kind of like the way he isn't too attached to his reads - a townread can become a scumread very quickly, and vice-versa (this is something that can also be a scumtell if it comes across as calculated/disingenuous, but it doesn't in this case).

So yeah. Maybe I can delve deeper if need be but I really don't see him being scum this game.

[Luca Blight]

EBWOP:

2) NewbTown, not Newbscum.

[Luca Blight]

I'm inclined to agree with Toto's claim that BlackVoid's replace-out makes him very likely Town (also BlackVoid in general looked pretty Townie, and Toto likewise).

So really from my position, if I have faith in my UCV read, it must mean NSG and Thor are thereby the scumteam.

I need to check associatives and the like just to be sure but this seems legit.

[Luca Blight]

Phone posting so can't go into specifics, but thinking Thor is the safer kill; he is the only one who could theoretically be voyager's partner if I was wrong there, as he put Clemency to L-1 as I mentioned before which I don't see scum doing to scum in that situation.

[UC Voyager]

i could see scum team doing that.

I myself isn't the biggest fan of busing, but i could see another player. i have a NSG case i will post later today! we should wait a few days before doing anything! we should be talking N such. I don't like how Thor hasn't posted much. I want to hear more from him.

[Thor665]

If everyone can give their current reads/thoughts while I catch-up then that would be helpful.

I think Toto is town.
I think we should lynch Voyager.
How would you rule yourself out from being a partner with Voyager?

People should actually stop talking and sheep me.

Vote: No Lynch

This is terrible - a no-lynch is acceptable is this situation, but to want it done immediately without using any of the day to find scum/produce more content seems something scum would wish for.

I don't agree with how you think No Lynch is best played.
If you're no lynching - then by definition town can't have a consensus clear townread (or else town is derp).
In that case, any conversation only helps scum figure out who most people consider town.
So why have the conversation exactly?

NThor - If you are town you need to do more. So far the only thing I've seen from you is the push on Cheeky.

You've actually seen a number of pushes from me, though none as big as that one - but since your area of the game to pull evidence from is 1 real day and 1 no lynch day - yeah, there isn't much. But that's silly to whine about.
I might as well complain that I haven't seen a push from you.
It's true...but...

[UC Voyager]

If everyone can give their current reads/thoughts while I catch-up then that would be helpful.

I think Toto is town.
I think we should lynch Voyager.
How would you rule yourself out from being a partner with Voyager?

People should actually stop talking and sheep me.

Vote: No Lynch

This is terrible - a no-lynch is acceptable is this situation, but to want it done immediately without using any of the day to find scum/produce more content seems something scum would wish for.

I don't agree with how you think No Lynch is best played.
If you're no lynching - then by definition town can't have a consensus clear townread (or else town is derp).
In that case, any conversation only helps scum figure out who most people consider town.
So why have the conversation exactly?

NThor - If you are town you need to do more. So far the only thing I've seen from you is the push on Cheeky.

You've actually seen a number of pushes from me, though none as big as that one - but since your area of the game to pull evidence from is 1 real day and 1 no lynch day - yeah, there isn't much. But that's silly to whine about.
I might as well complain that I haven't seen a push from you.
It's true...but...

why do you think i should be lynched?

[UC Voyager]

Thor

what are your thoughts on NSG/Luca Blight debate

Why do you think i should be lynched. you said that, and failed to make anything of a case on me....

[Luca Blight]

If everyone can give their current reads/thoughts while I catch-up then that would be helpful.

I think Toto is town.
I think we should lynch Voyager.
How would you rule yourself out from being a partner with Voyager?

Well I can personally rule it out pretty easily just by looking at my role PM.

As for everyone else, that's something they have to judge for themselves. I believe Toto is Town so it's up to him if he believes me or you.

People should actually stop talking and sheep me.

Vote: No Lynch

This is terrible - a no-lynch is acceptable is this situation, but to want it done immediately without using any of the day to find scum/produce more content seems something scum would wish for.

I don't agree with how you think No Lynch is best played.
If you're no lynching - then by definition town can't have a consensus clear townread (or else town is derp).
In that case, any conversation only helps scum figure out who most people consider town.
So why have the conversation exactly?

If I was scum in that position I would be happy just ending the day right there and then and trusting my instincts based on the information already available to make the correct kill. It's just less time that scum need to pretend, and to give them a completely free pass is just bad in my opinion.

I don't think you're scum for holding this view as lucca thought the same and he obviously wasn't scum, but that's just my view on the matter.

Thor, you saw my case on why I believe UVC is town. Try and convince me otherwise.

[Thor665]

why do you think i should be lynched?

VCA and your somewhat opportunistic play.
Also, considering the NKs I'm pretty sure no on experienced is a scum, so.

what are your thoughts on NSG/Luca Blight debate

I find it a non debate and pedantic at best.

As for everyone else, that's something they have to judge for themselves. I believe Toto is Town so it's up to him if he believes me or you.

Okay - why do you rule out NSG and Voyager as scumbuddies?
I find it fairly suspect you'll cite Voyager, then soft town read him, cite NSG but want to lynch me first, and the only apparent logic is partner pairings, but your pairings feel strategic rather than deductive.

Thor, you saw my case on why I believe UVC is town. Try and convince me otherwise.

Your case begins and ends with calling him a newbie.
It's not much of a case, I'm surprised it sells you, it certainly doesn't sell me.

[UC Voyager]

Also, I'll be keeping my focus on Zemaj's slot, something seemed off about it to me, but I can't fully place my finger on it yet.

Oh no

Do you not want to play with me?

We all love you, but we know how well you can play scum.

I believe it is actually yeah, shame that Voyager couldn't have included that in his naked vote.

As if that slot couldn't get any more foggy.

They seemed to have a lot of focus on my slot, but filed to explain why.....they just said that something is off. This seems a little scummy, but i would like to see some of his other scum games to compare.

They don't expect to die Night 1?

why wouldn't they. if im correct. This was talking about Assemble, But why would He not expect to be night killed? This isn't necessarily scummy, but it makes no since. Was it just the Early game talk, or did it have a point to it

After the fake Hammer. (props to Demios. I might use that in future games). Clemency posted this. As to why? I dont know. Everything he has said before about me seemed to say he had a scum vibe from me, but yet He posted this after the fake hammer. Wouldn't he think it was a good decision if He had thought I was scum?

While I don't know if I like the idea of Voyager in LyLo(no offense), I feel like I should play a bit of devil's advocate here, so scum doesn't get another free mislynch.

While it may seem scummy, the defense that he simply didn't know he had to claim can't be discredited. Considering how new his account is, I'd assume it's his first game here.
We all had our eyes on Assemble(Well, most of us) and I was about ready to claim intent myself.

I wouldn't blame anyone for hammering Assemble, due to how he was playing so apathetically, like he was just bored scum that got caught early. The 'online but not posting' thing especially got to me.
Perhaps this was due to a lack of motivation, or other matters, but he was the best option at a time.

I don't necessarily think Voyager is innocent, but I want to create a counter-argument so if he's scum, he's taken down by facts rather than gut.

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

This defiantly makes me unsure if he is town or scum because im not sure if playing devils advocate is scummy or not TBH. It isn't like lurking which is naturally considered scummy! Im not eactly sure what to make of this. : p


overall. I think he might be scum. The fact he has done little scum hunting is very weird, but I don't want to overthink something like that. It MIGHT get a town lynched, but I wouldn't want to Ignore it and let a scum live.

Some of my early thoughts on how The NSG slot could be scum!

I'm town. It's most likely Deimos, I lost energy to play this game.

This was his reaction. It seemed fake as hell. We all agreed on that. The wagon on clemency stopped when NSG replaced him!

Xnad or Voyager.

toto is town probably because scum don rage quit like that most of the time, and im town, so it looks like he was trying to target the town

Has to be lucca, since Voyager always acts like that anyway.

Lucca is town......so once again...trying to get a miss lynch!

Vc post to fill in with links in the morning

Votecount 1.Final

Peaches (2)

Spartan117 , Assemblerotws ,

Assemblerotws (5)

Plotinus , XnadrojX , Deimos27 , Peaches , UC Voyager , L-0

Plotinus (1)

CheekyTeeky ,

Not Voting (1)

Clemency ,

Day one deadline is Tuesday October 10, 6 PM PST. (expired on 2017-10-10 18:00:00)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch!

[/size]

Clemency wasn't voting.....HE didn't share many reads, and didn't even vote! It looks to me as if he was trying to look townie for not voting for the person who was lynched! This strikes me as scum!

i feel like i have actively ruined this game. i came in, got someone a lot of people townread lynched and will now probably get my own slot lynched. town probably would have had a better chance if i just let myself die. this isn't even to comment how on poorly i read cheeky.

anyways, here we are with our conftown dead and the promised two weeks to sort things out. hopefully we can still make something out of this. if town can win anyways i might be able to make up for it all.

Kind of hints she is giving up, but later on says that wasn't the case. Im not sure if i should scum read this, town read this, or what, but it definitely seems significant. Town should not be accepting a lynch! If town gets lynched, town loses!

for this game more than others, i think i've found myself thinking "i really want to believe this" a lot. as the deadline grew closer and closer and as we waited in twilight for the flip, i really wanted it to be true that cheeky was scum. if that wasn't true, then not only did it mean i got a townie lynched (and probably myself tomorrow), it also meant that my read on cheeky was totally off. after cheeky had flipped, i found myself really wanting to believe that thor was town. if that wasn't the case and thor wasn't town, it meant that i was getting manipulated

before i was even in the game

. i don't think i'll be wanting to believe things anymore. hopefully i can approach everything from a fresh perspective and get to the core of issues.

a no lynch here is definitely the right choice. no matter who gets killed it's going to be good in terms of information. i'd like everyone to check in and get their thoughts in first before anyone ends the day, but i'm confident this is correct.
VOTE: no lynch

votes no lynch

UNVOTE:

unvotes out of fear it will be hammered early but \/

VOTE: no lynch

revotes it and asks me to hammer it shortly after......

[northsidegal]

i feel like i have actively ruined this game. i came in, got someone a lot of people townread lynched and will now probably get my own slot lynched. town probably would have had a better chance if i just let myself die. this isn't even to comment how on poorly i read cheeky.

anyways, here we are with our conftown dead and the promised two weeks to sort things out. hopefully we can still make something out of this. if town can win anyways i might be able to make up for it all.

This post feels really weird to me.

Would NSG be saying this if she was Town and genuinely believed her in her case on Cheeky? I mean, everyone's different, but never have I had such self-conscious feelings as Town following a mislynch - if I genuinely believe in my case on someone and they flip town, I tend to be more annoyed at the other person for not conveying their towniness better rather than beating myself up so pathetically in the thread.

I'm just asking what the purpose of this post is? It feels like she has a real guilty mindset, but not in a townie way.

i did genuinely believe my case on cheeky and i am town. the reason i felt so terrible is that i enjoy playing with cheeky and consider her something of a friend, so seeing the flip not only gave me the realization of how horribly wrong i had been, it also made me realize that i had pretty much ruined the game for her and subsequently for town as a whole if i got myself lynched. on my case being nai - i said this before. my scumread on cheeky existed before the game but everything i posted (ie all of my words) came after i received my role pm.

why do you think i should be lynched?

VCA and your somewhat opportunistic play.
Also, considering the NKs I'm pretty sure no on experienced is a scum, so.

explain this. earlier in the game it was suggested that making the move to kill the conftown suggested a more experienced player as scum (at the time it was plotinus), which lines up with everything that i've been thinking. what's the rationale for newbies being scum?