Open 702: Vanilla Nightless Game Over

[CultOfAthena]

1. because i dont like repeating shit and you're annoying me. read everyone else's reasons and the ones ive provided. no scumgames that would be relevant, or towngames. its been a while since ive had my head really in the game.

2. all your complaints with luca's play

Are you saying you're just sheeping everyone else's reasons? Also, again - nothing had happened in relation to the UCV lynch when you initially voted me. You can't point to everyone else's reasons for that one.

I assume you're talking about the "lynchpool". There is

nothing

beneficial for town in restricting more than half of the alive players from being questioned. That alone should be reason enough, but I've talked more in-depth about this previously.


I resent the idea that holding this opinion means that I'm not thinking things through.

[Zaraki_Jaegerjaquez]

1. because i dont like repeating shit and you're annoying me. read everyone else's reasons and the ones ive provided. no scumgames that would be relevant, or towngames. its been a while since ive had my head really in the game.

2. all your complaints with luca's play

Are you saying you're just sheeping everyone else's reasons? Also, again - nothing had happened in relation to the UCV lynch when you initially voted me. You can't point to everyone else's reasons for that one.

I assume you're talking about the "lynchpool". There is

nothing

beneficial for town in restricting more than half of the alive players from being questioned. That alone should be reason enough, but I've talked more in-depth about this previously.


I resent the idea that holding this opinion means that I'm not thinking things through.

Excuse me? If you ask me, the very notion of arguing the scum pool to me implies you're thinking this through a lot. Who says you're not thinking through?

[Zulfy]

Blebleblebleb. I´m here.
What have I missed we´ll see.

[Zaraki_Jaegerjaquez]

Blebleblebleb. I´m here.
What have I missed we´ll see.

I'd like to see your thoughts. You've been rather voted for being lurky and I want to hang onto my vote thusfar.

[CultOfAthena]

Excuse me? If you ask me, the very notion of arguing the scum pool to me implies you're thinking this through a lot. Who says you're not thinking through?

also athena,

i get the very distinct impression you aren't really thinking about things too hard.

you have a very traditionalist mindset towards what can and should be done by town and what constitutes as town play without giving much weight to the specific situation at hand. this will continue to be a problem for the rest of the game.

Unfortunate.

This is me.

[Zaraki_Jaegerjaquez]

Uh, did that sound insulting? I wasn't insulting you Cult.

[CultOfAthena]

No, I didn't get that impression from what you said.

[Sesq]

1. because i dont like repeating shit and you're annoying me. read everyone else's reasons and the ones ive provided. no scumgames that would be relevant, or towngames. its been a while since ive had my head really in the game.

2. all your complaints with luca's play

Are you saying you're just sheeping everyone else's reasons? Also, again - nothing had happened in relation to the UCV lynch when you initially voted me. You can't point to everyone else's reasons for that one.

I assume you're talking about the "lynchpool". There is

nothing

beneficial for town in restricting more than half of the alive players from being questioned. That alone should be reason enough, but I've talked more in-depth about this previously.


I resent the idea that holding this opinion means that I'm not thinking things through.

im not sheeping it, i thought up of those reasons and then everyone else said them before i could say them first so there was no need to. stop assuming things

sure, there's nothing beneficial if you think about it that way and no other way. you arent thinking things through because you're holding that opinion. its why.

im not accusing the Z guy with no avatar of doing so because i can tell he actually did.

you guys seem to be very detached from my initial argument. my initial argument is that you're processing things from a very rigid, traditionalist view of mafia, and what is town, and what is scum, and your conclusions are wrong, and stupid, because you wont move past this.

not answering any more questions unless they havent been already

[LaserGuy]

We're going to have to deal with the slot sooner or later. Even if it does turn out to be a Town slot, it's not like they're doing anything to help out. There isn't really any harm in doing this.

VOTE: Zulfy

What's the need to deal with him today as opposed to in the future? Presumably if the lurking is actually due to real life reasons and not an in-game strategy, that should be cleared up sometime later. This seems uncharacteristically concise and nonanalytical, compared to my playerimage of you.

Remember, there is no night kills or power roles in this setup. Therefore the usual reasons for not wanting to lynch lurkers, or even marginally scummy players don't really exist here... we don't risk losing a strong townie voice or PR by lynching them. We just lose a slot that we can't read. It's likely that sooner or later, especially once we get down to only one or two scum left, we're probably just going to have to systematically lynch a couple of the players that people are fairly uncertain about, and that's fine. We have mislynches to spare, and with each scum we lynch, we can afford to lose another townie.

Yes, Zulfy could someday produce some great content that would make it worth keeping them around. Frankly, I think their content will need to be truly speculator to get them up to near-conftown status. Or they could continue to lurk and prod dodge for the foreseeable future. How much time is worth waiting for them to do something on the off-chance that they contribute something of value?

[Zulfy]

Including myself and excluding UVC, there are four other people who gave little/literally no reasoning for their reads. I feel that UVC's meta has blinded you in the order of who you want to lynch, but these should be addressed as well down the line if we're reasoning that poor reads=a larger likelihood of being scum or not.

snip

This also aged poorly, as now that we know UCV is scum, it comes off as Alignment-Informed. "I feel that UVC's meta has blinded you in the order of who you want to lynch, but

these should be addressed as well down the line

if we're reasoning that poor reads=a larger likelihood of being scum or not." I could be wrong, but that bolded portion almost says "once we lynch UCV and he flips scum, we should also scrutinize these people".

On the other hand, it's kind of obvscum to come to the defense of a partner on D1, but Occam's Razor and all....
VOTE: cytheflyguy

If a scum player did a thing, and then other players do that thing, isn't that grounds for some scrutiny?

"b-b-b-b-b but meta bad!"
think once before you post please. if you're town.
VOTE: cytheflyguy
because i dislike reading your posts. they annoy me. also you're pretty scummy. regarding impede, i cant tell if he's dickriding me/luca after day one, he's a really good dickrider of me/luca, or if he really is in his own way. we'll have to see.

this just makes me sad

Haven't actually read a cytheflyguy ISO. Maybe it is as scummy as They've Been Saying. The rebuttals I've seen seem even-keeled tho.

[Zulfy]

Fellas! fellas I'm here. I've been gone but now here I am, see.

[Zulfy]

Seems to me that Luca is letting his success with Voyager get overemphasized when it comes to his other reads.

With that in mind, certainly if I had foreknowledge of UCV's alignment I would set myself up for failure by playing in the manner in which I did.

hey what manner was that?

By the way, here's a fresh take that's sure to get some debate started - there really isn't all that great of a reason for Luca to be as widely townread as he is.

Did you elaborate this point?

he's gamesolving, argumentative, transparent and not doging the issue.
comm is town.

That's his personality you're seeing, not necessarily his alignment. Just because people were scumreading Comm for bad reasons doesn't mean townreading him for similarly bad reasons is a good idea either.

zaraki is prob town as well, very gamesolvy and arguing the toss and being emotional

Are you calling 90 gamesolving?

@cy
Why did you vote Comm in 35?

nevr mind the questions, what are your reads, opinions, analysis?

LAMIST.
*sigh*

Regarding those last two replies:
While the punett square thing was odd that's not the sole contribution of Zaraki, don't know why you'd generalize like that.
And that LAMIST accusation seems hollow. Are you sure you just don't have a problem with Mozamis's attitude?

[Sesq]

i think 585 is un nuanced

[Zulfy]

sure is

[cytheflyguy]

Fellas! fellas I'm here. I've been gone but now here I am, see.

Well, you're here.

UNVOTE:

[mozamis]

VOTE: unvote
the speed of this lynch is worrying.
and impede just "parking" that vote there, when zulfy cant be far from being lynched?
Migth even be Impede signalling to his scu buddies that he wants them to lynch Zulfy "I'm defintely gonna be on this wagon, lads"

[mozamis]

This is the most obvious scum wagon I've ever seen. We are lynching the guy that has posted basically nothing? I get policy lynches and all but we can't find a single candidate better then this? Everyone else on Luca's lynch pool is so much better and more of a quality lynch then the guy that gets us nothing.

i hear what you are saying. why dont we agree to have zulfy as the last minute "compromise" lynch if all else fails.
How do you feel about Cult or Impede?
Cults last few posts once again post very littel in content really, not any reads, just arguing and point scoring.

[mozamis]

This is the most obvious scum wagon I've ever seen. We are lynching the guy that has posted basically nothing? I get policy lynches and all but we can't find a single candidate better then this? Everyone else on Luca's lynch pool is so much better and more of a quality lynch then the guy that gets us nothing.

DEAR FUTURE MOZ THIS IS A TOWN POST, lUCKY IS TOWN!

[Lucky2u]

Dear future moz, if you invent a time machine, tell past moz not to try buddying me so hard. It's one thing to agree with me, it's another to all caps declare to the thread you think I'm town.

But thanks for seeing sense. Let's lynch comm or cy, either one works for me.

[cytheflyguy]

This is the most obvious scum wagon I've ever seen. We are lynching the guy that has posted basically nothing? I get policy lynches and all but we can't find a single candidate better then this? Everyone else on Luca's lynch pool is so much better and more of a quality lynch then the guy that gets us nothing.

i hear what you are saying. why dont we agree to have zulfy as the last minute "compromise" lynch if all else fails.
How do you feel about Cult or Impede?
Cults last few posts once again post very littel in content really, not any reads, just arguing and point scoring.

Ehhh this worries me. I voted to push him. He shouldn't be a compromise while we try and get a feel for his posting and play. If he comes out as more scummy, then yeah, we should use him as a BWCS, but it shouldn't be him right off the bat.

[mozamis]

So do the reasons that you think I'm scum go beyond my relation to the UC Voyager lynch?

THIS IS A SCUM POST.
Scum are always desperate to know WHY people are voting for them, so they can "refute" the point. Town often dont really care why people are vitng for them, or will just tell the other person to STFU etc

[mozamis]

This is why I said that it seems like you're not considering the possibility of bussing.

"it's not fair man, my scum buddy bussed and you suspect me!"

i also several times have mentioned the fact that i thought Impede may have busssed.

[Lucky2u]

So do the reasons that you think I'm scum go beyond my relation to the UC Voyager lynch?

THIS IS A SCUM POST.
Scum are always desperate to know WHY people are voting for them, so they can "refute" the point. Town often dont really care why people are vitng for them, or will just tell the other person to STFU etc

This goes well with my philosophy that town should make scum hunting their priority, not avoiding their own lynch.

[mozamis]

Also, here's a nice little bit of irony that I found looking back through the game:

classic "legalistic, rhetoric" scum
no town motivation for this post, just leaves it hanging "oh, look how Moz contradicted himself". Shade throwing.
this guy is scum.

VOTE: cultofathena

[Zaraki_Jaegerjaquez]

So do the reasons that you think I'm scum go beyond my relation to the UC Voyager lynch?

THIS IS A SCUM POST.
Scum are always desperate to know WHY people are voting for them, so they can "refute" the point. Town often dont really care why people are vitng for them, or will just tell the other person to STFU etc

Not really.

So do the reasons that you think I'm scum go beyond my relation to the UC Voyager lynch?

THIS IS A SCUM POST.
Scum are always desperate to know WHY people are voting for them, so they can "refute" the point. Town often dont really care why people are vitng for them, or will just tell the other person to STFU etc

This goes well with my philosophy that town should make scum hunting their priority, not avoiding their own lynch.

I feel like town ought to give reasons as well, because if somebody is strong scumreading you, you need to explain why not. Y'all are same team, aim at scum, wasting time over town is bad. Scumhunting not townhunting. (usually you can kill 2 birds with one stone and find town while scum hunting) Also, if all townies never defended themselves then they'd be lynched and we'd be lost.