Mini 1972 - Friendship is Magic - Game over

[Havo]

well I won't be surprised if it flips green. will you be surprised if I flip green?

Is there anyone you would be less surprised if they flipped green?

[Havo]

you really believe your read that I'm scum and that, in a 13er setting, I outed myself and my scum partner maki (two thirds of the scumteam no less) by hardclaiming a masonry we both planned ahead and she planned ahead with the slot I replaced into (which you know via breadcrumbs)?

I have never seen scum play like that. it's too risky! there could be checks, actual masons that CC it, and any flip outs the other player. you know those 'let this be resolved at night' situations? this isn't QUITE like that, especially if both you and tchill are town and there's opportunity on a mislynch inside the masonry, but it's close to it. I don't think scum leaves both me and maki alive to see what the hell happens to the game d2.

IDK what to make of your vote, but it's extremely poor as a play regardless of your alignment. if you're actually town, which I think you are, you're setting yourself up to be mislynched when tchill flips. if you're scum with tchill, lol god bless your soul. if you're scum and tchill is actually town, I don't think you can push for my mislynch here instead anyway? so IDK what you're doing Havo, but it's not good.

not to mention I'm obvtown by play alone.

I’m not lynching tchill on Day 1 unless I hard scum read him.

I give you the same respect had you not replaced into the game.

Who is your second scum read? I could most likely vote with you on that.

VOTE: unvote

[Havo]

Where is your justification for claiming on Day 1 without being anywhere close to being lynched?

How is that pro town play?

What are the odds of masons in a 13 person game?

[Havo]

You outed yourself and your partner without any real pressure on you or her and your best guess at scum is someone that you wouldn’t be surprised if they flip green.

See how bad that looks?

[Beefster]

I see what you mean, but I say we let it play out.

[Toranaga]

You outed yourself and your partner without any real pressure on you or her and your best guess at scum is someone that you wouldn’t be surprised if they flip green.

See how bad that looks?

I outed the masonry so the thread wouldn't turn into a pages long back and forth between me and tchill that, at the time, I thought wasn't going anywhere because I could conftown myself and wasn't reading him as scummy.

as for reckless playing style and -policy lynch- post by beefster: IDK how to respond to it. I'm playing the game and posting my reads. I'm trying really hard and my reads may bounce everywhere because it's d1 and things aren't set in stone. For instance, my tchill read went from scummy, to maybe town if havo is scum, to metadiving him and watching him be very safe as scum and think this has to be his towngame as a result, to a re-read on the game where I convinced myself that actually his posting isn't towny at all... and I'm running a theory in my head that tchill has decided to play this game a certain tunnel heavy way that isn't really similar to his towngame, but is widely different from his scum game, so he could push pro-scum things while getting townreads for being too balls to the wall to be scum. if he backtracked on his attitude it would make things complicated, but it's safe to say that tchill is posting with a level of confidence in his reads that he can't possibly have, and the amount of people he hard tunneled this game when it's d1 and there are only 3 wolves is just ridiculous.

sometimes the more you look into things, the more you distance yourself from solving. I may have done some of that this game. when it comes to tchill though, my first instinct was that he was scummy, and in a way I'm going back to this gutread while critically analyzing his posting and concluding that it doesn't seem to come from a towny, gamesolvey mindset.

so hm yeah. I'm sorry I polluted the thread with fluffy posting at some point, if that's a reason to policy lynch me. :shrug:

[Toranaga]

Where is your justification for claiming on Day 1 without being anywhere close to being lynched?

How is that pro town play?

What are the odds of masons in a 13 person game?

something else about claiming is that I was worried with people losing interest with the game for the long deadline before anyone gets lynched, as you and others claimed it would turn out to be true, and while wagons were divided and people going everywhere, I failed to see how we could decide on a lynch in that case. hardclaiming was a way to take the responsibility of today's lynch for me and maki, move the conversation along from pointless reads into my slot and get a player lynched already. since I backtracked on lynching screenplay and on re-read I think he is more likely to be a villager, it took longer than I expected it to take. right now I'm on tchill but I want to hear maki's thoughts too. I know she is going on the -bad town- read and I think it makes sense, but I'm reading tchill similarly to how dunn is reading tchill now.

[Toranaga]

as for who else I'd lynch:

right now I think wavemode is a very good lynch and would only go there as opposed to tchill right now. I think HWS has had somewhat towny posting, I'm a bit torn on UCV and IAI didn't do enough for me to scum or townread him. so... I would lynch that and maki would approve to, so if that's fine with everyone else it's where I'd go.

[Toranaga]

reading UCV's ISO: could lynch.

so wavemode, UCV, tchill for me. pick your poison.

[Beefster]

so hm yeah. I'm sorry I polluted the thread with fluffy posting at some point, if that's a reason to policy lynch me. :shrug:

It's more than the frequent short posts. The wild voting patterns weren't helpful. You just changed your mind a lot, which is actually a pretty strong town tell IMO.
Yeah. It was mostly the shitposting.
There's enough that looks surface scummy that you have to filter out, but aside from that, you're a solid town read.

wavemode should be back from his V/LA by now. Why hasn't he posted?

I haven't looked at UCV's isos, but he does seem to by laying low and popping in and out with the occasional... not really contributing... or something. That's not the right phrase, but hopefully you catch my drift. That's at least from what I remember.

Don't forget Havo. He's been playing strikingly similarly to Tchill, so I kind of read him the same.

HeWhoSwims doesn't seem to be contributing much either.

I'm reconsidering my stance on Jodaxq. I'm going to have to look over her isos to be sure I'm not crazy.

[Apple Jack]

Official Vote Count

Toranaga

(4): wavemode, Jodaxq, Srceenplay, Tchill13

Tchill13

(3): Dunnstral, Beefster, Toranaga

Srceenplay

(2): UC Voyager, HeWhoSwims

wavemode

(1): Maki Harukawa

davesaz

(1): I Am Innocent

Havo

(1): Havo

Dunnstral

(1): davesaz

Not Voting

(0):

None.

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2017-12-25 15:41:24)

[Beefster]

I'm not sure if it's the lack of context talking (from reading isos), but Jodaxq strikes me as opportunistic / reactionary and passive. Who I had a strong town read on before now looks to be a slight scum lean. It's hard to say.

[Beefster]

Dunn looks pretty town IMO

Ok. I need to make a new list. Things have changed since my last one.

[Beefster]

Town

Tora, Maki, Dunn, Dave

Null

Jodaxq, wave (leaning scum), UCV, srceen, Innocent, HeWhoSwims

Scum

Tchill, Havo

This has been a crazy game. I wish I had some more solid scum reads, but nothing really pings my scumdar strongly. Lots of conflicting signals.

[HeWhoSwims]

I'm gonna say I'm townreading Tora for now. 737 has clear and explained reads and 745 just checks out. He's right in that scum would never claim mason. Could be town claiming mason but I doubt it, it seems it was agreed on beforehand and they could still be called out by possible actual masons.

[HeWhoSwims]

(copy paste because mobile won't let me post all at the same time)

I was unsure about vote hopping when I read Beef before in some post about Tchill's pool and I still am not sure what exactly to make of it but combined with Tora's recent posting I think it's pretty townie as it shows the player is overthinking multiple options instead of one or two.
The only iffy stuff about Tora.. is his slot. As someone else said this might be exactly how odd's replacement would play if they were scum. However your recent game solving / townie posts outweigh this for me now.

[Jodaxq]

But Maki, the wagon on Tchill is only Uc Voyager, me, and Beefster, I don't know who you're describing here besides UC Voyager, but I don't think that's enough to not lynch them. In fact, there's a lot of people against the tchill lynch

I really have no idea what you're describing here tbh

What are you confused about?

Anyways, you never answered me joda, what don't you understand here?

I understood the content of your post, but I don't know which post you're referencing. The two Maki posts before this have nothing to do with the wagon on TChill

[Jodaxq]

I definitely believe the mason claim. What Tor is saying is making a lot of sense and I agree that scum likely doesn't approach it in this way.

UNVOTE:

[Jodaxq]

I still think HeWhoSwims is town. I think the posts on page 28 show really good effort and feel towny

[Jodaxq]

I think beefster and HWS have been towny in this page, which reflexively makes me unsure about this screenplay wagon because both are potential scum partners for him and I can't close a 3 person team with screenplay quite as easily anymore.

I suggest we lynch wavemode instead. everyone else posting gives at least some mild town vibes, which increases the scum equity in an otherwise null slot

vote: wave

VOTE: wave
ayyy

I don't think this would be a bad spot to be, but like others I'd like to hear from wavemode first.

[Jodaxq]

I don't place much faith in team hunting before flips. In the absence of a neon sign I think team hunting prunes the lynch pool too drastically.
I didn't like wavemode's posting and he would be in my lynch pool, but I was planning to wait for his return. Waiting for the oddmusic replacement turned out to be the right move.

In the meantime there is other sorting to be done.
VOTE: Dunnstral

This vote seems extremely out of place for what's going on in the game.

[Jodaxq]

I don't think I've seen a game this divided this far in. Pretty interesting.

This seems pretty inconsistent from your "no content past page 2" outlook.

[Jodaxq]

Toras slot is scum read. He comes in takes control of the game. Belittles those that don't agree with him. Speaks highly of those who do. Hmm...

Do you have a reason for not believing his mason claim other than you don't want to believe it?

[Jodaxq]

vote: tchill

not surprised if it flips green but reads as scum and needs to die imo

OMG!

VOTE: Toranaga

Mason my ass.

are you scumreading both me and maki because I'm voting someone you don't agree with? because we'd have to both be scum for her to confirm my claim, and she'd have to have planned the claim with odd beforehand given how she was reading him.

just hm think about this a little.

I don’t believe the mason claim. No.

I’ll believe it when the Mod writes it after one of you flip.

Tchill could be scum, IDK if he is or not, but I’m not lynching a strong player on Day 1 when there are other better choices. You wanting to lynch him while saying “you wont be surprised if he flips green” is garbage.

Toras slot is scum read. He comes in takes control of the game. Belittles those that don't agree with him. Speaks highly of those who do. Hmm...

For once, I sort of agree with you. The fact that he's using his mason claim to do whatever he wants is unsettling. I'm beginning to second-guess the mason claim.

I don't think I've seen a completely uncounterclaimed and believable town role lynched day 1 and it seems horrible to me to do so. If this is an act and Toranaga and Maki are scum then we can figure it out when we have more information.

[Jodaxq]

reading UCV's ISO: could lynch.

so wavemode, UCV, tchill for me. pick your poison.

Of those three I like wavemode the most. You're swinging me a little bit on TChill, but I still don't think I want him lynched today.