Signs and Void (Game Over) [TM2015]
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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hi guys! I'll be catching up over the next couple of hours I hope. I am not sure whose wifi I'm borrowing atm.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I'll be back to catching up sometime tomorrow unless insomnia strikes.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I'm feeling somewhat insubstantial.
Tammy, I look forward to your thoughts on that question.
GiF, why do you think one choice is better than 2?
bulba, why are you bane-ing cheetory?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 121, Tammy wrote:Yeah, I figured you would ^_^
At the moment I'm trying to figure out the mechanics of the game and am submitting my dissertation tomorrow so I'm a bit distracted.
I would also like to see eespy's response or approach first. I could see him trying to get scum, but I can also see ZAR trying to get scum, so.
Could you see Titus trying to get scum?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 14, ChannelDelibird wrote:In post 12, Tammy wrote:But we also need to know signs to use our roles, right?
Right. Whoever gets Baned can (and probably should) be protected.
What was your thought process here?
In post 61, vezokpiraka wrote:The second choice is in case scum use both their kills on the same target or something like that while the first one can give us information if a kill is protected.
why do you think this is the case?
In post 67, Marquis wrote:Bane: GIF
Choice: One
Hello everyone! My name is Marquis and I have decided to attempt to change my patterns of speech for this special special game! Studies show that people who use proper capitalization, limit their usage of punctuation to exclamation points, and perform similar happy acts may be considered more likable than those who do not! And how likable I am has a very good chance of affecting how people rate and review me in this special special game of Team Mafia!
So once again, hello everyone, and let's lynch the scum! Yay!
I don't like this post.
In post 84, Cheetory6 wrote:Everything above the /s was sarcasm. Marquis was obviously kidding around in his first post of the game. I'm not really taking anything from it. I just like joking around earlygame to try and give myself motivation to want to post.
CDB's opener was awkward though and I'm being serious with my vote to want to bane the shiet out of him atm.
I dislike this post so much that my hair is itching.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 132, vezokpiraka wrote:@ffery: if you would have two kills, would you shoot the same person twice with the exact signs, or mutiple people or different signs on the same person?
Your question doesn't make much sense to me, but I think it's because I can't unpack your assumptions. I'm trying to decide if having assumptions I don't have is scummy.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 136, Tammy wrote:Ffery - what do you think of titus though? I'm not going to do much in the way of reads or anything until tomorrow at the earliest, but I'm reminded of serum and steel and the debate day one on removing metal from people. Her approach to people with different viewpoints is rather different, which makes me have an early warm feeling for her. Though I do have moments where I wonder if the candle and Alcuin business was an attempt to get them outed. I'm probably overthinking that though.
she makes me grind my teeth in my sleep more when she's town. I'm leaning slight town but I haven't slept on it obviously.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 137, Tammy wrote:Okay so Trojan horse thinks we should just bane the scummiest player, lynch that player in major day, that way we get the boon and the bane really doesn't harm much.
I want to think of a bane as a pseudo lynch, but I wonder how much pressure a scum player would feel vs a town player?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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oh my word I think deas is town.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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yabbut I never think deas is town. it's kinda scary.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 150, Cheetory6 wrote:@Titus,
Thoughts on these aspects to following through with banes?Cheetory6 wrote:But I feel like something else worth considering is that we don't get a Boon if we don't use a Bane.
I also feel like being able to create wagons via Bane/Boon is also super useful and we lose out if we just say "nah" in all cases because of worrying about just the worst case scenario.
why do you need motivation to post?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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you kinda gave her the answer there.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I'm wifi deficient again. might be able to post tonight.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 191, DeasVail wrote:In post 190, Tammy wrote:In post 141, DeasVail wrote:Cheetory, can you please explain your current opinions on Tammy and Marquis?
Why did you specifically ask him and why me and markee?
To me it sounded like he was townreading (or at least definitively 'not-scumreading') Marquis, yet seemed to be scumreading you, which was odd to me because I thought that the same thought process that would scumread you would also lead to scumreading Marquis, and the same kind of thing if townreading. I also liked his response though, and while Ceph thinks he's scum I'm more undecided and still have UT as my best guess.
ceph played with him in the Advance Wars theme game. I'm also seeing some differences here from his play in that game.
however, I also meta'd some of his offsite scum/town games in that game, and I'm not really seeing stuff that shouts scum to me atm.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Tammy did you consider the wifom that could be generated if you actively sought out scum alignment in this game?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I thought about it too, but just flat out chickened out because of real life being crazy atm, and knowing internet access would be extremely iffy.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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GiF, talk to me about your reads.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Yeah I"m not fond of UT atm either.
I want to leave a strong townbloc behind when I drop dead. I'm thinking about how to go about that.
Zar who is Empire townreading?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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vezok could be scum.
I want to scum read marquis for ignoring me.
I want to scum read bulba but I always do.
lol I'm scumreading empire which is a strange thing.
I am thinking about what extended scum team would be that anxious to get my slot. completely out of the game.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Every player in the game is the tip of an iceberg. I mean the potential scum team consisting of the player in this game augmented by the three other players who are working with them in the background.
There are players who rightly or wrongly would worry about me being in the game more than others regardless of my alignment being confirmed.
And there are players who would see me as likely to lead town in wrong directions.
Anyway.
I'm not sure about Zar, but he seems more tentative than I recall him in our previous game.
Also, I've mostly seen Tammy get it right when she develops strong interaction-based reads on day 1.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 330, Cheetory6 wrote:
Was he scum or town in your last game?ffery wrote:I'm not sure about Zar, but he seems more tentative than I recall him in our previous game.
This is kind of my main concern with the way this argument is going. I don't want this to turn into Tammy vs Empire. I'd rather try and focus on reading interactions between two players who are actually both in this game -.-Zar wrote:I mean, basically I've been playing telephone boy in my time for this game today.
@Zar, can you possibly talk to me about why you decided to make a big thought-out post to respond to Tammy instead of responding to her in real-time?
he was town. I wouldn't be contrasting his play in a negative light otherwise.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 331, Titus wrote:@Fferylt, I am torn here. Tammy is so confident in her Zar read I want to shake it loose and see what happens but I really don't like Mastina lurking.
I don't want to shake the read loose. I know she'll continue to evaluate and test the read.
I think she's town.
I could see regfan getting her wrong as town. That's really the only read on her that Zar's relayed from his team that doesn't give me a horrible case of hives.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 337, GuyInFreezer wrote:I don't know anything about the whole empire state tammy thing but why would empire as scum would make esp go for tammy first when tammy has tendency to obvtown herself quite easily? (No I'm now townreading Zar but I'm just curious.)
I don't understand what espe has to do with tammy? he hasn't even posted yet. Zar brought him up as someone who might have spent a token on rolling scum.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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zar didn't really go after her though, not in a way that looks like he was scumreading her, and not before she pushed him iirc.GuyInFreezer wrote:Esp -> Zar
I was keep getting their names confused and tried my best not to mismention them lol-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 341, Bulbazak wrote:You're never going to let Donner Party go, are you? What exactly is it about my play this game that is making you want to scum read me?
It has nothing to do with Donner Party.
your biggest concern about my getting treestumped apparently was irritation that you might find the thread locked again with your next post. That doesn't feel like town reacting to losing a town player before the game has hardly started.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 412, Zar wrote:Actually if you look at that game you'd see I'm not particularly big on day one in general.
that day 1 didn't last long enough to draw any conclusions about whether your day 1 is big or not. I kinda treated day 2 as day 1 part 2, and I assume so did most town players.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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also I've played quite a few games with tammy in the last year or so. We both like theme games and we like many of the same mods, so our paths cross frequently. We're still kinda working out how we play together when we're town.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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TOWN
Tammy
Deasvail
GiF
Titus
MAYBE TOWN
Marquis. - I don't like the stuff Deas likes. Will ultimately probably defer to GiF
Actiondan. - possibility of scum theater maybe, but otherwise leaning a little town. have a question in to my team about the interaction with UT
T S O - not having a strong read on him is concerning me a little
Gammagooey. - will be soliciting from my team to clarify this read
ChannelDelibird.
Cheetory6.
Mastin2. - this will be a nacho-read probs. Leaning slight town on my own.
Shadoweh. - want input from my team
NOT SO TOWN
Bulbazak.
UT
Vezok
Zar. - here for now because Tammy/Empire.
WHERE THE HELL ARE YOU?
Antihero.
Aronis.
Espeonage.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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MAYBE TOWN is my middle section and that's where Marquis is.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 426, Untrod Tripod wrote:I love how ffer's list only explains her maybe reads
no explanation to her town or scum reads.
great job A+
I don't need to show off how towny I am with a drop dead gorgeous reads list. It'll change out of jammies and bunny slippers later.
Any particular reason why you want to snark at me?
Anything more game-relevant and alignment-indicative you'd like to contribute?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 427, vezokpiraka wrote:@ffery: You think I conspired with bulba and decided he will bus me like hell? Or are you saying those people are scummy individually?
Also I kinda want to see a readlist in which you strongly believe because you are a great town player and will be gone tomorrow.
I don't generally teamhunt on day 1. I mostly townhunt/PoE, which I kinda think you know about me by now.
I threw my current thoughts out there to generate discussion and data for further analysis.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 437, GuyInFreezer wrote:Also UT you so realize that fery is confirmed town right?
he did realize it the night it happened.
Wondering if this is manufactured amnesia.
I'd already be bane-voting him if I had a vote.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 442, fferyllt wrote:In post 437, GuyInFreezer wrote:Also UT you so realize that fery is confirmed town right?
he did realize it the night it happened.
Wondering if this is manufactured amnesia.
I'd already be bane-voting him if I had a vote.
Actually, nope, I'd probably not be bane-voting him. Nacho thinks his assholishness could be coming from town-urgency.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Nacho's comment about UT came before that post, I think. But I seriously doubt that scum would forget I've been defanged. My only question was whether scuim-UT might pretend to forget for possible derptowncred.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 466, Untrod Tripod wrote:because
a. this game is fucking bananas
b. I have a lot of stuff going on in my life
c. it's literally not that important to me, sorry
you can be a dumbass and try to turn that into some kind of scumtell, but unimportant things slip your mind when you're an adult with a job and stuff
Nacho doesn't like you for town so much right now.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Ok, so I don't care whether Zar is baned today or not. Gestalt opinion is that he needs to be lynched at the earliest opportunity.
I think I'm coming around to CDB's idea of baning someone we're concerned about but not concerned enough to lynch with fire forthwith.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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REVISED:
TOWN
Tammy
Deasvail
GiF
Titus
Marquis. -I don't like the stuff Deas likes. Will ultimately probably defer to GiFGestalt townread.
Cheetory6. - Gestalt townread.
MAYBE TOWN
Actiondan. - possibility of scum theater maybe, but otherwise leaning a little town. have a question in to my team about the interaction with UT
T S O - not having a strong read on him is concerning me a little
Gammagooey. - will be soliciting from my team to clarify this read
ChannelDelibird.
Mastin2. - this will be a nacho-read probs. Leaning slight town on my own.
Shadoweh. - want input from my team
UT - moved up ever so slightly
Vezok
Bulbazak.
NOT SO TOWN - lynch asap
Zar.
WHERE THE HELL ARE YOU?
Antihero.
Aronis.
Espeonage.
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Notes:
- Not a seriatim list
- My townreads have been blessed by at least part of my team, and based on the input, I've moved Cheetory6 and Marquis to the towngroup. Marquis is still of concern. his 67 is identical to Fate's entrance to the first team mafia game back at the dawn of time, which pings. But his post 198 has a vague townfeel to it.
deas townread eroded a little on the basis of concerns raised. I am leaving him in town for now. A thing that worries me a little is just the vibe I get from both sides of the deas/marquis interactions. I know that marquis likes to townread the hell out of his teammates sometimes as scum.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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bulba and vezok haven't moved up, but there is a clear difference in degree of scumread between them and zar at this point. Zar has moved down.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 509, Titus wrote:In post 506, Espeonage wrote:In post 502, Titus wrote:TSO, I asked you to read my posts because I felt you were misunderstanding me and I was repeating myself.
You think I lie for no reason???
The booze is for me tonight to try to make sense of this.
@DV, He asks questions, follows through on the answers and articulates his positions well. This is town Bulba.
That sounds like null bulba. Pls don't declare things that aren't true.
hella yeah this game is gonna be easy.
Not in my experience.
Nah, scum Bulba is a lurksack who has trouble faking the same consistency of thought with tone.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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ergh not in my experience. though most of my experience with scum bulba is multiball.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 549, T S O wrote:hey ffery, it shouldn't really bother you that you don't have a strong read on me early-game. I don't think you usually do.
There have been a couple games where I did. I remember townreading you pretty early in red wine and eventually getting so sick of the mutual tunneling you and katsuki were doing that I was willing to lynch you both.
In the Fire Emblem game I also townread you on day 1 for an interaction between you and beastcharizard, I think.
Anyway. You are able to town it up. I'm just a lot more cautious since the alliteration mini.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 576, Shadoweh wrote:It can't be Deevee, he's too cute to be manipulative! Question, do you want to Bane Zar today or lynch him Major Day, Ffery was suggesting not targetting the same person with both negatives. If you want to lynch Zar we'd have to look into alternative targettables today. I don't think Bulbazak would make a bad Bane choice.
I wish one of our strong townreads had jumped on my suggestion. :/-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 623, Empire wrote:SUPRISE!
If you heard that sound, that was the sound of the scum team in this game collectively shitting themselves.
Well, Tammy, you wanted me and now you get the real me, uncut and unfiltered.
You're going to have to make yourself undeniably town to me and to Nacho. Right now, as far as I'm concerned, you're getting lynched at the first opportunity.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 685, T S O wrote:Skipping from page 24 to 28 to say the following: ffery, you're town, I'm town, Cabd would like to collaborate with you for the brief time you're here.
OK. does he have reads to discuss?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I think I need to read it again later. There are reads I disagree with, and some stuff I haven't talked about in the game thread so far that he's echoed some of mine/our thoughts. Also some unspoken reads changes that I've laid down no trajectory on - he's taking the emerging side on some of those changes.
The you-read is utterly mindboggling to me. Nacho and I both are extremely skeptical of the efforts to discredit you, and we expect to see more of the same. And we're totally, totally not liking it, though we don't think it will come exclusively from scum players.
Anyway, it would be really really cool for this to be town-Empire, and I'd feel better about town's chances for an eventual win if it is town-Empire. But I'm not sold.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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This is probably going to be a really long day, and I may not have much time to post in the next 12 hours or so.
Vezok read has changed. We think he's town.
I read GiF based partly on how he forms his own reads (including if and how he goes about sorting me, which has been short circuited in this game). There are some minor things that I want to think a little more about, but I'm still townreading him.
I would probably have entirely backed off my UT read if it were not for his attack of amnesia. I indicated already that the read had moved townward.
I won't be softening my stance on Empire unless the gestalt consensus is that he's town. I'm very concerned about getting that read right and fully understanding the motivations for the replacement.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 744, T S O wrote:ffery, Cabd says Empire is town and that he thinks you should already know that. He also wants to know whether you want him to focus on fringes or you just want a general readslist.
empire may be, though we have some intergame stuff we're considering. tammy is town and he/his team not seeing that concerns us.
General would be good for now. during my middle group up or down is my focus right now.
would especially like to know what he thinks of deas, espe, gamma, tth, etc.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 748, vezokpiraka wrote:Metal sonic told me I should go ape shit at you when you don't listen that Empire is town.
But I won't cause I'm in a good mood right now.
like you, I have a brain trust to call on and represent. empire and ms have more than me to contend with, defanged condition notwithstanding.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 750, Empire wrote:
In post 696, fferyllt wrote:The you-read is utterly mindboggling to me. Nacho and I both are extremely skeptical of the efforts to discredit you, and we expect to see more of the same. And we're totally, totally not liking it, though we don't think it will come exclusively from scum players.
Jesus fucking christ, for what feels like the 800th time, I am not discrediting Tammy. Being suspicious of her =/= trying to discredit her. I still have some reservations about that slot due to the fact that I'm slowly coming around to the idea that she might not be scum here after all, that Regfan still strongly reads her as scum (last I talked to him about it, we oddly enough didn't really discuss her much last night), and that I am a gigantic pussy because I'm honestly afraid of reading her wrong. If you want me to give you the lowdown on her, then I'll do my best to explain what's going on.
There was some thought separation in my mind that didn't make it into the words I posted. I actually am more concerned about other players who have been making discrediting noises since before Zar replaced out. We're noticing it and we don't like it, but we're don't think it's going to be a 1 to 1 correspondence with scumteam. Or I don't, anyway. I'm remembering the Marketplace game and my first huge failure at reaching out to town-Tammy and working with her. It did (and could again) ding her ability to be effective in the game if she's under constant sniping attacks for her reads, and I"m sure that scum will be happy to skate along under all the flying debris.
Also, I want to work with you generally but I'm not super sure re: how to go about doing this (I think this might be the first game where we're actually town together). I know you prefer to keep a lot of things under wraps in order to gather your reads (ex: you would not have been able to post the first paragraph in #696 if you'd have been forward with everything) so I really don't want to be intrusive. Alternatively, I could use you as a conduit to talk to Nacho and Llamarble while you gather info but it's up to you if you want to be put in that position.
Anything that helps me be as effective as possible for town while I'm still in the game is welcome. I"m happy to be a conduit. I'm happy to talk about stuff. I think it will help me solidify my read of you. I'm not holding back a lot of stuff, but it's part of my style to do research and let my thoughts jel before speaking up sometimes. There's a tension between that tendency and the desire to be transparent and work with townreads, so I wind up doing a little from column a and a little from column b and a little of those odd moments where a lightning bolt strikes when I'm driving, sleeping, etc, and my view of the game gets unexpectedly transformed.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 774, Empire wrote:Re: ffery's #760 - I can definitely understand the approach to Tammy and that's part of the reason why I'm more than willing to give her space right now (I know I definitely benefited from the shitstorm when I was scum in Marketplace III). If you want to talk about reads, could you tell me pretty much everything Llamarble has on this game? (Nacho, too, I guess, but that depends on where he is with his process).
llamarble hasn't commented much about the game yet. I'll convey your interest in his thoughts.
Nacho has been more in the moment. One of the reasons I've been somewhat slow about semaphoring reads changes is because we're still in discussion on a couple things. I'll probably be posting a big ol reads list update tonight sometime.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 781, Empire wrote:ffery, Regfan just popped and I'm talking with him right now. He wants me to ask you to explain your strong townread (ahnd Nacho's if he has one) on Titus because he definitely doesn't see it.
Titus, maybe later (although thanks for the law school flashbacks).
I don't want to talk about Titus in detail right now. I'll definitely talk about her in a few calendar days. I'm townbinning her for now mostly based on her expressions of frustration and how she's adapting and working around stuff that was frustrating. Nacho pointed out post 148 as something he thought was more likely to come from town-Titus than from scum-Titus.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Empire can you explain more about why Regfan is scumreading Tammy?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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titus please don't do stuff that will make me hate my limited time in the game.
being pedantic will definitely make me hate my limited time in the game.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 975, GuyInFreezer wrote:fery is a VT so there's nothing she can do by detecting sign. Tammy is my next-in-line townread.
I don't think I can be given a boon. and I'm sure I can't use one. I'm essentially a treestump.
I'm not liking Espe much at all.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I think so. will post shit tonight when I have laptop.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1008, Empire wrote:Tammy Re: #851:
1) Yeah, I forgot to mention the dissertation stuff in that post you're responding to because I was a zombie yesterday, sorry :/ I guess part of it is that I don't really remember playing with you in a super mechanically complex set-up (correct me if I'm wrong) since I tend to avoid heavy mechanics like the plague so I'm not really used to heavy mechanics talk from you.
Marketplace III-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1053, Espeonage wrote:In post 998, fferyllt wrote:In post 975, GuyInFreezer wrote:fery is a VT so there's nothing she can do by detecting sign. Tammy is my next-in-line townread.
I don't think I can be given a boon. and I'm sure I can't use one. I'm essentially a treestump.
I'm not liking Espe much at all.
Anything I can do to help?
If I tell you what you can do to help it doesn't count.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1063, Shadoweh wrote:extended family
interesting (though not really relevant to anything) that you used this word. I've been talking about extended families to Nacho wrt these games.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I want input from my team but I'nm thinking boon vezok.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Great job ignoring the confirmed town you guys wanted to hand the boon decision to earlier.