Open 876 - Fire and Ice - Postgame

[usesPython]

I thought it was Black, maybe that vc was outdated.

I still think Black is very sus but I can move if need be.

What's the voting at?

Hop in, we're wagoning Bulge

-A

[usesPython]

Enchant you too, are you willing to get on a Bulge wagon instead of a Drew wagon?

-A

I really don't care k

You don't care because you sr both or because you just want a lim and are willing to wagon whomever?

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Bulge/Drew scum

(Where's the Kokichi img when you need it )

-A

[usesPython]

I mean, you were already completely wrong chaining a townie to someone....

And this might be a stupid question Python, but is the sole crux of your scum read of Bulge this supposed associative with me?

For an openwolf enjoyer you really need to learn that the fastest way to catch openwolves is through associatives on both ends of W/W interactions (or the glaring lack of interactions in this case). Also I'm wagoning Bulge instead of you because Bianco isn't willing to vote you and the solve is Bulge/Drew, we're sorry you're the one bringing down the Bulge/Drew team

-A

That's not a very town mindset. Does Mafia bore you or something?

Didn't Lorne in DN have the same mindset? Something not being a townie mindset doesn't mean they're scum

-A

[usesPython]

btw Drew are you phoneposting?

-A

[usesPython]

btw Drew are you phoneposting?

-A

I have been house sitting all week, so I only have my phone to post.

Is it that obvious? Lol

When it takes 7 minutes to write 4 sentences it's either phoneposting or AI lol

-A

[usesPython]

Just wanting a lim and not really caring who it is seems so wild to me

Honestly I respect the grindset of joining to have fun instead of winning

-A

[usesPython]

Spoiler: Just

In case 333 didn't make it clear, we're reading through the entire game instead of ISOing. Also I kinda tr Kokichi so I'd be actively against a Kokichi flip if Black flipped town.

-A

Okay, sooooo... if you're doing a proper read of the game, why'd you ask how the Kokichi wagon formed? I'd think you'd have started by reading the setup, which would make it clear that no such thing need have existed!

smh keeping track of multiple games is hard, I asked it as shorthand for "how did the rest of the town come to the conclusion that Kokichi was scum"

Spoiler: Another

This case makes no sense unless Bulge is scum. Unless I'm missing something, this should be reason to lim The Bulge before Drew instead of the other way around

Drew thinks Bulge is town though, so him immediately jumping to defend himself and discredit the Bulge/Drew connection instead of just defending his townread creates a contradiction. I think it's just Bulge/Drew here but on the off chance we're wrong Drew has a higher chance of flipping scum than Bulge so that's where I want to go first.

-Nameless/A

Can I just say that I don't get this at all?

Like, that snarky comment about interacting with furt is totally something I would say. It's just a snarky comment because the situation seems obviously ridiculous. And I kind of agree, from what I understand of what this so-called Drew/Bulge case is supposed to be. Did we do a deep-dive of everyone's iso to see who they haven't interacted with? I bet Mala hasn't interacted with half of the game! Trying to go "oooh, they haven't interacted thus scumteam!" two days in to a game makes no sense to me. A few game days, okay, try to go back and look for those, but real-life game days? Really?

That was just the latest at the time, go look at stuff like 537 for more

Spoiler: Brick

Mala's kinda just existing this game

-A

furtive and icedragon and aureal as well

'scuse me, why are you lumping me in with the people who have both far fewer posts than me and far less content in them? Or is this just your handwaved way of talking about people who aren't currently getting voted? I mean, you didn't include bianco in there and I've definitely got more posts than her.

extremely peculiar thing to get defensive about

1) I try my best to contribute so it stings when people accuse me of not doing so.
2) I think that statement is pretty clearly wrong* and could be a way of throwing shade to justify a wagon at some point.
3) I have quite recently BEEN mislimmed, by some people in this game, on that sort of grounds. After I went to a great deal of effort to point out exactly how an actual mafia was using that sort of argument as a distraction to avoid having to produce content of their own.


* like post count is a totally objective measure and ours weren't even in the same ballpark, but if we're going the "what can I remember about this person" route I think people like you and Oclax would also pretty well fit into the "uh... IDK, lemme go check the ISO" category

Oclax is the main hunting hater, Osuka is the "grr everyone is shit but me"

Also we need to be limming the same groupscum today and tomorrow, can the people doing individual scumhunting start looking into what partners make sense with their scumreads and focus on solving for pairs?

-A

No.

Unironically why?

Spoiler: In

Mala's kinda just existing this game

-A

furtive and icedragon and aureal as well

'scuse me, why are you lumping me in with the people who have both far fewer posts than me and far less content in them? Or is this just your handwaved way of talking about people who aren't currently getting voted? I mean, you didn't include bianco in there and I've definitely got more posts than her.

extremely peculiar thing to get defensive about

1) I try my best to contribute so it stings when people accuse me of not doing so.
2) I think that statement is pretty clearly wrong* and could be a way of throwing shade to justify a wagon at some point.
3) I have quite recently BEEN mislimmed, by some people in this game, on that sort of grounds. After I went to a great deal of effort to point out exactly how an actual mafia was using that sort of argument as a distraction to avoid having to produce content of their own.


* like post count is a totally objective measure and ours weren't even in the same ballpark, but if we're going the "what can I remember about this person" route I think people like you and Oclax would also pretty well fit into the "uh... IDK, lemme go check the ISO" category

I think the point they were making is that there are many people here who 'appear' to not be contributing(not saying you aren't). And the way I see it Python seems to pick and choose who they call out for certain things.

Stop twisting our words by taking stuff out of context. This all started when you talked about how you're not interacting with Furtive, Kokichi, or Aureal in 537, as part of our retort we mentioned that Aureal's barely here, Aureal took issue with that and then we explained deeper why we held the opinion. We're already hitting 50 per day just talking about stuff that's immediately relevant, there's physically not enough attention span for people to read any more than that

Spoiler: The

Pretty sure also that Black was defending you, furtive...

Missing the point

It's more like you're not making your point clear enough. What about me talking about you did you not like?

And yeah I realize this gives me fishy associatives with furtive if he is scum here but I feel like this information can be useful in determining his alignment

Scum don't know how to treat their non-buddies in multiball...lol

Black's worried I'm the other scumteam

This is pretty clear? It's basically the same thing Python has against Drew, scum!you is putting a guard just in case we end up flipping furtive and is otherscum

I don't understand this argument. Nobody knows the alignment of anyone else here except for the two scumteams knowing their partner's alignment. Mafia don't know that everyone who's not on their team is town like could be expected in a normal game. Therefore they may well put up their guard in case they're wrong about a townread, because they literally are trying to read everyone else. That would make them just like town, who don't know anyone's alignment, therefore need to be guarded against everyone.

You're acting like it's not normal for town to be wary that their townreads could be wrong though.

And I'm not even really sure any of this is applicable here because I don't think Black is even townreading furtive, I think she didn't word that quite right because the argument is that furtive's behavior is NOT useful in determining his alignment (to be mafia). It's NAI (and I agree with that, I remember Turf Wars, lol.)

I disagree because there's a subtle difference that'll show up in behaviour: town are worried about being wrong but don't mind associatives as much, scum are worried about associatives but don't mind being wrong as much

Spoiler: Wall

I think the point they were making is that there are many people here who 'appear' to not be contributing(not saying you aren't). And the way I see it Python seems to pick and choose who they call out for certain things.

I think we're all gonna 'appear' to not be contributing with the way Python is flooding the zone. I know that's how they play but... yikes. I hate having to play catch-up like I'm doing because I can't keep up with the mile-a-minute way the game's been rolling while I'm at work; and I hate even more that I think at least half my responses are to Python. x_x

Sorry, we'll try to not hyperpost as much but it's kinda hard to limit our post count when we're simultaneously defending ourselves from a wagon and also having to be the leading force on the Drew/Bulge wagon and also trying to solve for the other scumteam outside Drew/Bulge and also talk about mech and the overall gamestate

-A

[usesPython]

Aureal and Black, can you walk us through why you're on our wagon instead of Bulge/Drew?

-A

[usesPython]

Kokichi you sr Black, who do you think the other scum are?

-A

[usesPython]

I also want to repeat myself that Drew isn't happening today, not with my vote. I have a very strong gutread there that scum!Drew and town!Bulge is not a thing.

Can you walk us through this read?

-A

[usesPython]

As far as Bulge, I do agree it is odd that they have seemingly danced around discussing me, especially given the discussions surrounding the Bianco wagon and by proxy HPE as well.

Why do you think Bulge would do this?

-A

[usesPython]

Ugh I don’t know which one I want.

Can I get a quick summary of the wagons

uhhh we're mostly being wagoned cause people don't like Nameless mechposting and me metaing

Black's getting wagoned by Kokichi cause apparently she was obvtown in DN and isn't in this game

Bulge wagon is part of a Bulge/Drew solve. Bulge's pretty much refusing to give any reads on Drew even in places where it'd have been extremely natural to do so, Drew's supposedly tring Bulge but doesn't really seem to care if they get limmed and is more focused on distancing himself from the Bulge/Drew associative. Bulge is getting wagoned over Drew here as a compromise cause otherwise Bianco doesn't wanna be on the wagon

-A

[usesPython]

General consensus for scummyness seems to be Python == Bulge/Drew > Black > Drew > Bulge

-A

[usesPython]

Also we're really sorry about giving you so many pages to go through, would you prefer a quick rundown on opinions of the people on wagons instead?

-A

[usesPython]

Why people are on the wagon they're on:

1. Spoiler: Black

   I SR python and Drew btw so I'm cool with either wagon

   I will literally self-hammer d2 if it's not Bulge/Drew
   
   -A

   I don't believe you, but I'll still join your cause
   
   VOTE: Drew

   Shrugging your shoulders and going "welp nothing I can do about it" instead of actively fighting against consensus to keep your tr's alive is not townie behaviour
   
   -A

   I mean in his defense you would just accuse him of defending his wolf mate. And I'm also not sure how valid this point is. If I barely have a TR on someone I'm not gonna fight tooth and nail to make sure they don't get limmed

   I'm not really a fan of python backing Drew into a corner here
   
   Might reconsider my vote

   
   That's what the nightkill is for isn't it? Why go for a "Flip Black and then flip me if Black flips town" gambit as scum here?
   
   -A

   Going back to this with python's recent posts in mind, I'm having a really hard time believing that they can't see the benefit of scum proposing a gambit here. I'll even go as far as to say they are deliberately acting obtuse about it
   
   If what python thinks is true that town basically loses if we lim town here, it would make

   complete

   sense for scum to propose a gambit. That's one townie down and there isn't even a guarantee the scum gets limmed D2. It's so easy to get out of a gambit
   
   I think this contradiction in python's logic suggests they are a wolf
   
   VOTE: python

   I actually think a python/Kokichi team makes a lot of sense if I'm solving for pairs

   
   
2. Spoiler: Python

   Bulge wagon is part of a Bulge/Drew solve. Bulge's pretty much refusing to give any reads on Drew even in places where it'd have been extremely natural to do so, Drew's supposedly tring Bulge but doesn't really seem to care if they get limmed and is more focused on distancing himself from the Bulge/Drew associative. Bulge is getting wagoned over Drew here as a compromise cause otherwise Bianco doesn't wanna be on the wagon
   
   -A

   
   
3. Spoiler: Mala

   
   Not on a wagon
   
   
4. Spoiler: The Bulge

   Which when combined gives the chances of
   

   Town

   : 8/12 (66.67%)
   

   Mafia

   : 4/12 (33.33%)

   lmao

   colourcoded and everything and not a single useful mechpost to be found

   Also glad to see you're ignoring 223 when you're just straight up wrong in 247, explains a lot
   
   -Nameless

   223 is entirely based on false premises/nonsensical assumptions (ie, scum shooting at random, doctor healing at random, groupscum have =rand accuracy, whatever youre saying about "full control over the lim"?) and your other posts considering nolims are pointless bc why would we ever do that. these mechposts are a waste of time at best and an active distraction from any actual scumhunting/townplay at worst

   If actions and reads aren't random then the double target = no nightkill rule is even more likely to go into effect, go do the damn math if you're gonna hold these positions
   
   -Nameless

   my position is that your math is a waste of time and a distraction from actually doing anything useful, and also that no limming is a stupid idea

   are u capable of making game-relevant posts as scum?

   
   
5. Spoiler: furtiveglance

   i looked at two votes on dragon + hpe saying it wanted to vote and made a decision without reading why ppl were voting it.

   

   its ok to not have an opinion

   anyway
   
   VOTE: python

   Sus posting, unexplained vote at the end being the worst
   
   VOTE: The Bulge

   I'll get a bit of momentum going here, sure. Drew tends to be a bit more jokey as scum I think, and I've seen a bit of that here.
   
   VOTE: Doctor Drew

   Bulge is very likely scum, I'm gonna move back.
   
   VOTE: The Bulge

   Bulge is very likely scum, I'm gonna move back.

   I'm not getting these vibes...can you elaborate?
   
   A quick look at his ISO and he seems kinda townie to me. He's definitely putting in some effort to solve

   I agree that he's pushing, but I see an agenda.

   1.14

   Votecount 1.14

   
   
   usesPython (4): Oclaxian Empire, The Bulge, Aureal, Doctor Drew
   Black (3): Kokichi Oma, HighPrincessErinys, biancospino
   The Bulge (2): furtiveglance, usesPython
   Malakittens (1): Enchant
   Kokichi Oma (1): Black
   
   Not Voting (2): Malakittens, osuka
   
   With 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to secure an execution.
   
   The day deadline is in (expired on 2023-04-20 18:48:28).

   Python town. I can vote Black if need be

   Actually I think this is coming from a mech misunderstanding: Just because groupscum can do something that is -EV for town doesn't mean that it's +EV for that groupscum. Your argument that we're forcing a 1f1 with a town does get that it'd be +scum winrate in that scenario but it misses the point that it'd be -groupscum winrate (e.g. If we were Ice Mafia then it'd cause Town and Ice Mafia win rate to go down while Fire Mafia win rate goes up)

   That's assuming the 1v1 actually results in both players getting limmed. Like I said it's too easy to get out of a gambit, so proposing the gambit on D1 should be a viable scum tactic to you
   
   And I think it's something you as scum would propose here. We now know you think the town essentially loses if we lim green D1, so it makes perfect sense for you to propose a gambit based off of weak associatives to try and push a mislim here
   
   

   And you'll just come up with some mech BS or find a way to wiggle your way out of your end of the gambit D2
   

   This last line seems really uncharitable and disproportionate
   
   VOTE: Black

   VOTE: The Bulge

   
   
6. Spoiler: Enchant

   VOTE: Drew
   
   Counterwagons are funny

   VOTE: Bulge

   Enchant you too, are you willing to get on a Bulge wagon instead of a Drew wagon?
   
   -A

   I really don't care k

   You don't care because you sr both or because you just want a lim and are willing to wagon whomever?

   Second

   Also this is day 1, i literally don't care.

   
   
7. Spoiler: Doctor Drew

   Yes I did explain the push on Bianco initially, and didn't like how they discredited my questions I had to HPE.
   
   Also, python how did I really push HPE? I took what Black said about HPE's voting style and ran with it, yes I poked/prodded/and pressured, but I never was really thinking of wagoning them. In fact, in retrospect given how Black has been acting, Black could have just been throwing shade at HPE hoping that I WOULD start a push and wagon on HPE(that thought kinda just popped in my head while typing this).
   
   As far as Bulge, I do agree it is odd that they have seemingly danced around discussing me, especially given the discussions surrounding the Bianco wagon and by proxy HPE as well.
   
   Pre Edit: Actually Black my initial push was just off Bianco voting Ice in the manner they did. But my scum read gained strength how they acted after my initial suspicions. And an early game wagon isn't just to figure out the person you put on the wagon, but how everyone else reacts as well.
   
   There was something else about Bulge, but I am phone posting and I want to get this post out and then make sure it was actually Bulge who said it.

   Oh yes it was Bulge, but more about userPython.
   
   I joke around about 'ugh, mech speak' but I get that in certain game types it can come in handy to break things down like that. But it seems like the main conclusion is that 'hey, we should hunt scum'. I think Bulge said it best here
   

   your other posts considering nolims are pointless bc why would we ever do that. these mechposts are a waste of time at best and an active distraction from any actual scumhunting/townplay at worst

   Especially since others have rolled their eyes at the mech speak, and python seemed to double down on it. Almost seems like they are purposely obfuscating the game under the guise of seeming so obvtown on the surface.
   
   Pre Edit: Open wolfing is my play style lol

   Pre Edit: Open wolfing is my play style lol

   If this is the case then Drew not mentioning Bulge and Bulge not mentioning Drew until now looks really bad
   
   -A

   I also haven't mentioned you until now, or Furtive, or Koki, and barely Aureal. In fact, most of my game here has been Bianco and HPE, with a bit of Black and osuka in there as well. Are they all my scum buddies? Are you?
   
   I only talked about Bulge because you(or someone here today) asked me about them. There wasn't much for me to say that wasn't already said, and I repeated. The mech speak post they made was an 'oh ya there was one thing now that you reminded me' sort of thing.
   
   You are attaching me to the Bulge for them not really discussing me, and puts me in a spot where they is no way to defend against that.

   Bianco knows how to butter me up, and I may just fall for it.
   
   But after sitting on it for a bit, feel a bit more confident about this given today's interactions.
   
   VOTE: python

   
   
8. Spoiler: biancospino

   Ok, I'm going to put my foot down here. I do

   not

   want a Drew lim today.
   I may be amenable to a Bulge lim instead.

   VOTE: Bulge

   
   
9. Spoiler: HighPrincessErinys

   This one thinks it trusts Python, and of course it's got a scumread on Ice for his vote on Mala, but otherwise it's... rather lacking in reads honestly. Need to give this game a look over sometime and try to come up with SOMETHING.

   Why does it seem like you're afraid to vote?

   Because that's what you're interpreting me as feeling.
   But also because 1) Python is a townread and 2) IceDragon is a scumread, yes, but for something that's very inconclusive on it's own. He hasn't given us much else which, to be fair to you, is probably worth an eyebrow raising too, but... either way, not in a hurry to get a lim when we still have alot of discussion time available.

   This one thinks it trusts Python, and of course it's got a scumread on Ice for his vote on Mala, but otherwise it's... rather lacking in reads honestly. Need to give this game a look over sometime and try to come up with SOMETHING.

   explain python read.

   Just getting town vibes from them but its not exactly concrete. 'Trust' might've been minor hyperbole but it's still a bit of a townlean atm.

   VOTE: The Bulge
   This one supposes it's willing to vote here.

   
   
10. Spoiler: Aureal

    Hmmm. You've played a lot with bianco, then? I'm kind of surprised. What do you think of bianco's turn against Black?

    Is weak reasoning(again), seems a bit of wagon hopping as well.

    
    Yeah, there's something kind of fuzzy about the logic and I'm not quite putting my finger on it right now. That vote and Python's willingness to sheep Kokichi's meta read after remembering the one game we played with Black had her as mafia are both sticking out to me as particularly fishy. Not really feeling the furtive vote that much anymore, though it'd be nice if he'd do a little more, so how about a VOTE: usesPython.

    Elaborate on the fishyness
    
    -A

    
    Hmmm. Well for one, I don't recall you trying to use other people's opinions on meta before. And I'm not clear whether you're actually reading DN to try to figure out whether Kokichi's assessment is valid. Are you just skimming ISOs there?
    
    But I guess the thing that's making me most twitchy is the way it sets Kokichi up as a fall guy if his read is wrong. Yes it's his idea to flip him next if he's wrong but it's not protown to encourage that. My last two games had situations like that where I got into a "one of us is town and one is scum" showdown (HI ENCHANT) except we actually were all town.

    Okay seriously, WTF. Bulge I'm not familiar with but I expect more checking of your facts from

    you

    . I had over three times as many posts as furtive had (and still more now since I'm doing a long day's work worth of catch-up now) and it's clear our ISOs aren't even close to comparable. He hadn't managed more than three sentences in a post! I'm wrecking his sentence record with just this modest post!

    Drew how did you know to wagon Aureal so fast
    
    You're doing the same thing Black was doing in Newbie 2111 where you're just kinda...

    there

    ? Like you're posting but it's not really going anywhere?
    
    -A

    
    Not really going anywhere? Not sure what you mean- I remember in that game you accused Black of not being first on any reads and I totally was first reading the post where HPE voted Black as HPE being town. Which a bunch of people, including you I believe, then sheeped.
    
    Oh, and there didn't really seem to be a lot of resistance to the Black wagon for a while there. Then I decided I didn't like it, and now somehow it's not really a thing whereas

    your

    wagon is. Hmm.

    
    
11. Spoiler: Oclaxian Empire

    i'm gonna read and post some light thoughts from the last 10 pages as well. i may or may not be able to remember why i thought these things in the morning.
    
    - i don't like koichi gambit
    - i don't like black being pushed for meta reasons, and i don't like python for that, but i've already expressed anti-meta. i mildly dislike hpe from it, but that's more so disagreement of opinion rather than content of post.
    - i'm mostly skimming over the meta argument, but i do like the kokichi vote, but i also disagree w/ the idea of koichi doing it. but i think it's just like, strictly worse to try to gambit out yourself on this if you're scum, unless you really think your partner can deepwolf the rest of the game?
    - i don't know what to make of koichi being so dead-set on black being scum? nor like, really what it's being based off of. koichi, would u please like to explain that?
    - osuka posting feels townie, i think? i didn't sit down and read it, more so skim osuka and just go "yeah that looks townie i think"
    - i think python becomes more scummy for icedragon saying he wanted to play differently on this account, and trying to use meta for that on an alt is just still - scummy, but it could also just be the actual vehement *hatred* we have for stuff like that making us think it's scummy.
    - python and us are both systems. we just sign our posts less often, and aren't signing because its hard to tell who's actually fronting.
    - bulge v python feels ok to me. i think bulge is probably town, but i was already tring bulge from what i could remember of this game.
    - koichi claiming to want to be scum in this setup / not reading the setup feels townie? i think its mostly bc town might look at the numbers of the setup and go "that looks fun" and not look at special mechanics, where scum are forced to look at special mechanics?
    - hi enchant!

    
    
12. Spoiler: Kokichi Oma

    I thought you were bragging in one game that you never flipped scum before? Unless you have an alt i'm not aware of I guess. Either way you're scum here.

    I think you might be confusing me with someone else? We only played Death Note together. I've finished 5 games on site and 3 of them were wolf games lol

    Maybe I was. Either way, I think you're scum here

    Cause the time she was town in the game I played she was OBVIOUS town. And she's not that here. It's a gut feeling. And my gut feelings are right 50% of the time
    
    

    Vote black today. If they don't flip scum, you can vote me tomorrow. that's how strong my gut feeling is

    VOTE: Dragon
    not random

    Good, no more RVS. Why?

    I believe others made it clear already, but 45 leaves a bit of an unpleasant taste. It's latching to Aureal's question in a sly fashion. And weakly reframing the question as an accusation

    I agree that 45 is bad, but I don't think it's enough for me to vote them yet

    Out of RVS on page 3. I love it
    
    I don't have an issue with Dragon's 45 nor do I have an issue with the wagon that formed off of it
    
    My only issue atm is HPE's 54 where he says he's on board to vote Dragon but doesn't want to turn it into a wagon?

    Oh no.. You finally flipped scum didn't you
    
    VOTE: Black

    See, if you did find 45 bad, but not enough to vote, and you did vote in response to 79, then you must have found 79 even worse right? So you should be able to point to what's wrong with it, and the answer should not be gut.
    I've already asked this to you way back then btw

    I don't have experience with Dragon. I can do so with Black. Which is why it's different

    Since you all seem scared to vote Black today, if I die make sure Black is the vote the next day

    
    
13. Spoiler: osuka

    
    Not on a wagon
    

If you're feeling misrepped please just correct any errors, summarizing the opinions of 13 people is hard

-A

[usesPython]

Hey Black, other than your Kokichi/Python solve who are you scumreading right now? We've got 2x2 scum to be hunting here

-A

[usesPython]

Hey Black, other than your Kokichi/Python solve who are you scumreading right now? We've got 2x2 scum to be hunting here

-A

Idk

Flip it around then, who do you think is town?

-A

[usesPython]

I don't know python

Ok we know post count != effort but how do you have 165 posts and 0 townreads? Actually lets simplify it, what do you think of the flashwagon on Bulge? Are the people there that aren't me town or groupscum or other groupscum?

-A

[usesPython]

Getting a lim through requires more than just repeating "X is scum!" and then ignoring everyone's attempts to get you to expand on that

^^^^
Obvious fact that is somehow not obvious to a surprising amount of people.

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Bulge and Drew are scum!

-A

[usesPython]

I think the hydra is pretty town, as well as Bianco

Oclaxian is plural, not a hydra

-A

[usesPython]

I townlean Bulge and that's where the wagon is. Drew I dunno about but it seems beside the point with where things are. You seem to have answered your own question a bit later regarding voting you.

And I'm not even going to try to respond to your wall post from mobile, yikes.

If we flashwagon Drew instead wanna join us?

-A

[usesPython]

Uh, even if I said yes, and that is not what I am saying yet, why try to swap Bianco's vote for mine? She made it clear she's not voting Drew here so even if everyone else went back that's still no more votes.

Trying to get a sense for your reads here

-A

Uh, even if I said yes, and that is not what I am saying yet, why try to swap Bianco's vote for mine? She made it clear she's not voting Drew here so even if everyone else went back that's still no more votes.

Good point

Python/Bianco associatives?

If it was Bianco/Python then Nameless would be too busy spamming the PT with mech to post mech here

-A

[usesPython]

Also Black, to address the Python/Kokichi team: if it was real it'd mean that I managed to solo generate a counterwagon on Bulge while the entire other groupscum were trying to prevent it. We're good but not

that

good

-A

[usesPython]

If it was Bianco/Python then Nameless would be too busy spamming the PT with mech to post mech here

Idk...I think it could be a valid scum tactic to drown the thread out with mech as you two have done

I kinda think Bianco is town though so I'm not sure how confident I am here

There's only been like 5 pages worth of mech this game, I wouldn't exactly call it "drowning the thread out with mech"

-A

[usesPython]

btw the "Why swap" question is pretty simple: I scumread Drew harder than Bulge

-A

[usesPython]

Please look at the wagon on us and tell us how we live past d2

You're smart. I'm not putting it past you to figure it out

We forgot to ask this earlier, but where exactly is this conception of us coming from?

-A

[usesPython]

We weren't asking you

-A

[usesPython]

Like wtf is even the point of quoting a question that's not even for you just to call us an idiot, what the hell's your problem

-A

[usesPython]

But, full apologies again for taking it a step too far, realized it as soon as I hit submit, and I hate
to be the mean asshole type.

Apology accepted

-A

---

Also Black, to address the Python/Kokichi team: if it was real it'd mean that I managed to solo generate a counterwagon on Bulge while the entire other groupscum were trying to prevent it. We're good but not

that

good

-A

Furthermore, you really think that Kokichi posts

If you out doc, you can kill doc? or is there some mechanic i'm not aware of

in a Python/Kokichi game?

-A

[usesPython]

grim: also lorne was banned for ban evasion lol

Quoting to give a notification

Oclax when you come back you mind rereading Drew's 523/534/537 and seeing if you can see what we're seeing wrt being more focused on breaking any associatives instead of defending his tr?

-A

As far as Bulge, I do agree it is odd that they have seemingly danced around discussing me, especially given the discussions surrounding the Bianco wagon and by proxy HPE as well.

Why do you think Bulge would do this?

-A

btw Drew since you're here you mind answering this?

-A

[usesPython]

Oclax when you come back you mind rereading Drew's 523/534/537 and seeing if you can see what we're seeing wrt being more focused on breaking any associatives instead of defending his tr?

-A

More specifically he notes the oddness in 523, forms the tr in 534 and then does pretty much nothing with it and immediately pivots to breaking associatives in 537

-A

[usesPython]

You've pretty much done absolutely nothing to defend your townlean since then, it just reeks of not caring what Bulge actually flips.

-A

[usesPython]

Like Bulge hits E-2 and you don't have anything to say about it?

-A

[usesPython]

grim: ig here's the question too: what about that makes u think drew/bulge are aligned w/ one another? bc i'm more so seeing it as drew trying to setup bulge to be in a worse spot post-flip

That one's kinda harder to explain mostly because it formed from a sense of how the thread was flowing around 247 and only later solidified into something more obvious. Essentially it came down to glossing over Drews 203/206/208/212 without having 268 for context while still deciding to comment on our posts in 253/255 which from our perspective the posts commented on seemed pretty normal?

It's only later that the associatives became more obvious in posts like 275/278 where they basically refused to give any sort of opinion on Drew, the only time they did this game is in 522

-A

---

Unironically why?

Skill issue.

Do you think I'm lying about my inability to see wtf you're going on about with this Drew/Bulge association?

I'm asking why you're not partner hunting, not why you don't see the Drew/Bulge team

-A

I disagree because there's a subtle difference that'll show up in behaviour: town are worried about being wrong but don't mind associatives as much, scum are worried about associatives but don't mind being wrong as much

Mm. I... suppose that could make sense. I think. Isn't... being wrong about someone... an associative? Or being right. Or not having an opinion. Or basically everything...

We can't really think of a better way to explain it without basically just repeating ourselves. For town, the scenario of being wrong about a tr is "oh well it looks bad but we caught scum so still good"; for scum, the scenario of being wrong about a tr is "shit the game's about to go into X/1/1 or X/2/0 and the pocket failed, not good"

-A

---

i mean that's pretty much spot on but also what the fuck? and where did that comment come from? you quoted a post that has nothing to do with that

Spoiler: Birds nest

Mala's kinda just existing this game

-A

furtive and icedragon and aureal as well

'scuse me, why are you lumping me in with the people who have both far fewer posts than me and far less content in them? Or is this just your handwaved way of talking about people who aren't currently getting voted? I mean, you didn't include bianco in there and I've definitely got more posts than her.

extremely peculiar thing to get defensive about

1) I try my best to contribute so it stings when people accuse me of not doing so.
2) I think that statement is pretty clearly wrong* and could be a way of throwing shade to justify a wagon at some point.
3) I have quite recently BEEN mislimmed, by some people in this game, on that sort of grounds. After I went to a great deal of effort to point out exactly how an actual mafia was using that sort of argument as a distraction to avoid having to produce content of their own.


* like post count is a totally objective measure and ours weren't even in the same ballpark,

but if we're going the "what can I remember about this person" route I think people like you and Oclax would also pretty well fit into the "uh... IDK, lemme go check the ISO" category

We're refuting the point that you and Oclax are in the "lemme ISO" category

-A

Spoiler: Cave

btw Drew are you phoneposting?

-A

I have been house sitting all week, so I only have my phone to post.

Is it that obvious? Lol

When it takes 7 minutes to write 4 sentences it's either phoneposting or AI lol

-A

or, you know, literally anything else including but not limited to: thinking about what you're gonna write, answering the door, getting distracted, or going to the bathroom and taking a shit. timeliness isn't ai

809 took 7 minutes in the editor to post from start to finish since he mentions getting sniped by Oclax, it

could

have been all of those things but if it wasn't phoneposting it'd have been more likely AI than not to take that much time to post something that short

-A

---

grim: so, radical idea osuka, vote python?

so i'm torn, right

on one hand, i think python has been nothing but noise all game. there was a lot of completely useless mech talk just to get to a "conclusion" that's so obvious anyone in the newbie queue could've come to in about 30 seconds, and i can't recall anything really interesting or obviously solvey coming out of that slot. just a lot of shit flinging in what seems to me a desperate attempt at staying alive after having dug themselves in a fucking hole. i'm not sure the initial push here was warranted though, because to their credit they DID advance the game state a fair bit, which i don't know if scum would be particularly willing to do.

on the other hand, black went from really scummy to actually sorta townposting, to getting hyper tilted in not that long of a timespan. that slot was pretty likely to be scum in my mind, then it wasn't, and now it's just a big question mark where a read used to be. i haven't got a really good idea what the fuck's going on there either. she's clearly tilted so i doubt we'll get anything out of that slot in the near future.

and then there's bulge - i have never been able to actually confidently read bulge and that's at least partly because there's so little content. whatever content is there is typically of good quality (regardless of alignment) and it generally makes sense, which makes it hard for me to read that slot because that's exactly what i do as either alignment. i have the distinct impression that much like myself, bulge is actively trying to burn his fucking meta to the goddamn ground every time he plays the game and he does that by making good logical and intuitive sense as either alignment. my hunch is that he's town here, but i can't confidently say that either.

i do think the python wagon came about in a fairly strange way, though. normally i'd be happy to just vote that slot out because 1. i think the slot flips red and 2. i will lose fewer brain cells every time i read the thread because i can't take any more of the mech talk, please make it stop it's too many numbers my brain can't take this i'm losing my mind. i swear to fuck if i have to read some shit about expected values again i will fucking combust

This is big and I kinda need you to work through this thought today because I know damn well you're not gonna go back to read d1 after it's over. First off, if you look at 773 onwards we could have very easily stayed on the Black counterwagon and stayed alive to keep 1v2ing Bulge/Drew; we specifically worked on getting a Bulge/Drew wagon instead because we think we're more likely to hit scum there. Does that seem like the play scum!Python does if we only care about surviving?

Second off, we really need you to look hard into

why

the Python wagon feels weird. From our perspective Drew/Bulge are there for survival purposes, Aureal's there because she's metaing me off of a game were Nameless was fronting, Black's there cause of OMGUS + misunderstanding mech, and Oclax is there cause of a scumread that feels like it formed due to a playstyle clash. How is a wagon that's

this

disorganized and meh so big if there aren't scum on it?

-A

[usesPython]

Also osuka and Oclax, we're very much willing to flashwagon Drew instead Bulge since we feel it's easier to see the associatives once either of them flip scum if we can count on your votes there

-A

[usesPython]

I disagree because there's a subtle difference that'll show up in behaviour: town are worried about being wrong but don't mind associatives as much, scum are worried about associatives but don't mind being wrong as much

Mm. I... suppose that could make sense. I think. Isn't... being wrong about someone... an associative? Or being right. Or not having an opinion. Or basically everything...

We can't really think of a better way to explain it without basically just repeating ourselves. For town, the scenario of being wrong about a tr is "oh well it looks bad but we caught scum so still good"; for scum, the scenario of being wrong about a tr is "shit the game's about to go into X/1/1 or X/2/0 and the pocket failed, not good"

-A

More specifically, this is the immediate reaction post-flip. The underlying worries between town and scum in multiball are still different though

-A

[usesPython]

Also since it looks like the limpool for today is pretty solidified we might as well reveal the tell we were talking about earlier

Having said that though, there's a very specific scumtell to multiball that can still be used D1. We'll reveal it towards the end of the dayphase instead of right now to see if anyone falls for it

-Nameless

@Python - ok...so how is that different than normal mafia? Everyone is looking for scum D1 and there's no real way to tell the motives yet. The people on my wagon could be townies pushing possible scum, scum pushing a possible townie, or scum pushing possible opposing scum. How do you tell the difference?

Yeah everyone's trying to lim mafia, but who are people trying not to lim

-A

Properly scumhunting d1 in multiball has nothing to do with mech. To state the real obvious, the only mech you need to know to scumhunt d1 in multiball is:

• Ice Mafia's
  preferred elims today are:
  Fire Mafia
  ,
  Town
  ,
  Ice Mafia
  
  
• Fire Mafia's
  preferred elims today are:
  Ice Mafia
  ,
  Town
  ,
  Fire Mafia
  
  
• Town's
  preferred elims today are:
  Mafia
  ,
  Town

To make it very explicit:

• For scum the only unacceptable lim is a lim on their own groupscum, if town gets limmed then they're still tied in first place for winrate in an X/2/2 scenario so they don't really mind a town mislim if preventing it means they have to stick their neck out for them.
  
• For town, a lim on any scum is acceptable and a lim on any town is unacceptable.

In otherwords, the strongest scumtells in multiball outside of awkward S/S interactions are:

• Refusing to townhunt (Weak tell, could come down to playstyle)
  
• Not doing everything in your power to defend people you consider town (Strong tell)

[usesPython]

Yeah that's the biggest reason why we'd rather flip Drew over Bulge today

-A

[usesPython]

I mean from our perspective 1/3 of the scumreads on us are scum being survivalistic, 1/3 of the scumreads on us are basically a policy lim, and the last 1/3 are people metaing us as a singlet instead of a system so we can kinda see were you're coming from

-A

[usesPython]

VOTE: python

e-1

Can you elaborate? We haven't really gotten anything from your slot this game

-A

[usesPython]

Idk I’m sheeping

Baaa

Sheep the towncore and get on the bulge/drew wagon

-A

[usesPython]

Actually thought experiment since this tends to be the fastest way to stop powerwolves: There's people who aren't ok with our lim, who here is NOT ok with a Drew lim today?

-A

[usesPython]

Bianco we know about your opinion on that but the wagons today are Drew/Python so you get to decide if a Drew/Bulge or Python/??? solve is more likely

-A

[usesPython]

Kokichi you sr Black, who do you think the other scum are?

-A

Mala is on the opposite team. IDK about anyone else

What're your thoughts on the Drew = scum argument?

-A

[usesPython]

Idk I’m sheeping

Baaa

Also Mala ngl if you're town here this is pretty fucking upsetting from our point of view. We're basically in a position where we need a supermajority of town to have a correct read so you just plopping in here putting us at E-1 having done basically nothing this entire game with the only reasoning being "sheeping" (who are you even sheeping?) is pretty disgusting

-A

[usesPython]

If you feel the scumreads on us are uncharitable you're welcome to unvote y'know

-A

[usesPython]

Enchant plz no, furtive has a case

-A

[usesPython]

And no one cares to unvote it's hilarious.

Cause 2/3rds of the thread is asleep or at work

-A

[usesPython]

Bianco we know about your opinion on that but the wagons today are Drew/Python so you get to decide if a Drew/Bulge or Python/??? solve is more likely

-A

No, they aren't? Are there really 2+ people willing to vote Drew but not Bulge?
You're just essentially blackmailing me now. If and when it gets to literally biting the deadline unless I decide to get on one of those wagons, I'll throw my stone

Oclax is willing to sr Drew but not Bulge and Osuka tr's Bulge but not Drew. We're asking now to see if there's a workable wagon that can happen on the Drew/Bulge solve and where we need to focus our effort to make it happen

-A

[usesPython]

Like yeah we prob could have expressed it better but in our defense our thoughts were kinda scattered after hitting E-1 in an Enchant game

-A

[usesPython]

I disagree. For, if the Bulge is town, you're basically saying that scum!Drew is either actually tr'ing him but still putting up a guard in case he happens to be otherscum -- which Drew would think won't happen, because tr--; or is pretending to tr him, which would make very little sense as we've extensively established that scum wants to lim otherscum.

One thing to point out in this case: scum!Drew can throw a tr towards unaligned!Bulge because the gamestate of buddying Bulge benefits him even if Bulge is null (or even a scumlean depending on his other reads). Basically, why are you assuming that Drew is actually serious about his tr on Bulge if he's not really doing anything to defend them?

-A

[usesPython]

Like keep in mind that scum also have to avoid getting nightkilled during the night, if you think someone is scum then buddying up to them as otherscum is a decent strategy to avoid getting nightkilled. Giving out tr's means you've either tr'd town (in which case you get a new buddy) or you tr'd otherscum (in which case they don't shoot you because you're keeping them alive)

-A

[usesPython]

If it's a scum!Drew + unaligned!Bulge game then think of the gamestate after Drew'd push Bulge for the weird associatives if Bulge flips scum: suddenly Drew looks townie as hell because he called out scum being scum and then either gets shot or gets people wondering why he hasn't been shot.

Like yes scum limming other scum is great for scum but there's downsides to getting tr'd too early that I think scum!Drew'd be aware of, especially when you can buddy them instead and push them later when the +town is more useful

-A

[usesPython]

I think the problem that both you and Nameless (and me a little too) have is that you're both getting lost in the EV sauce without really thinking about the real gamestate that comes out of those EV equations

-A

[usesPython]

for something that was pitched as being game-changing and defining for d1 this is unfathomably underwhelming and again, patently obvious to anyone who bothered to think about it

Yeah but the question is how many scum this game just saw "scumhunting always good" and went on autopilot without thinking any deeper (especially with how many people in this playerlist are allergic to any sort of mech)

-A

if it was a drew/bulge scumteam, it makes zero sense that drew wouldn't come to bat for bulge. if it's NOT a drew/bulge scumteam, then i struggle to see half of the reason we got drew to e-2 in the first place.

When you think about it, Drew doesn't

need

to go bat for Bulge in a Bulge/Drew game if just getting me limmed does the exact same thing. Like imagine if the day ended on like page 30 before the Bulge flashwagon, was anyone seriously gonna do anything other than pretend d1 never happened?

-A

[usesPython]

I mean from our perspective 1/3 of the scumreads on us are scum being survivalistic, 1/3 of the scumreads on us are basically a policy lim, and the last 1/3 are people metaing us as a singlet instead of a system so we can kinda see were you're coming from

-A

this is false. nobody said anything about a policy exec and the meta defense is pretty shit. i'm even willing to overlook the "scum being survivalistic" bit even if that's probably untrue, but you know whatever fuck it

We're being petty at this point but how else are we supposed to take this as?

-A

2. i will lose fewer brain cells every time i read the thread because i can't take any more of the mech talk, please make it stop it's too many numbers my brain can't take this i'm losing my mind. i swear to fuck if i have to read some shit about expected values again i will fucking combust

[usesPython]

E-3 for mala. I can't see why python and bulge are/were the biggest votes so far today

Bulge happened because 1/3rd people tring me and hopping on the wagon, 1/3rd Enchant finding counterwagons funny, and 1/3rd Bianco and I having an sr there; plus another 1/2 me coordinating people to make the wagon happen

Our wagon happening we can't really explain without scum interference so take that how you will

-A

[usesPython]

All mech talk i saw is:
MAFIA WANTS TO ELIMINATE OTHER TEAM MAFIA AND DON'T WANT TO ELIMINATE SELF.
TOWN WANT TO KILL MAFIA

And dumb numbers which "confirm" it.

To beat a dead horse here, there's mechanics in play that functionally give every townie (and this only applies to townies) X% Bulletproof which is what started the mech talk

-Nameless

[usesPython]

Seems like every wagon we start up is going to sit at E-2 until we have a consensus that we actually want it go through because E-1 puts it into Enchant lolhammer range.

Keeping Enchant at E-2 to prevent them from lolhammering themselves

-A

[usesPython]

I'd prefer to lim inside Drew/Bulge but we can settle for Mala

-A

[usesPython]

I'd prefer to lim inside Drew/Bulge but we can settle for Mala

-A

Mostly because we have finals coming up I straight up don't have the time to wrangle another wagon together like I did with the Bulge wagon

-A

[usesPython]

And didn't expect you to settle for anyone, python.

They are in full on survival mode

If we couldn't get a Drew/Bulge wagon through with 50 posts per day + hours per day to dedicate to this game + being able to pressure the people tring us to get on the counterwagon then we're not gonna get it through in the middle of exam week + being V/LA + the wagon suddenly dissipating.

-A

[usesPython]

Like we've made ourselves abundantly clear how we'd rather the day to end, quit twisting our words

-A

[usesPython]

Does that type of interest come from receiving a red PM?

It comes from being in the closest thing to mountainous mutli-ball that'll be run on this site this year

-A

[usesPython]

Also I am not down with a furtive elim at any point this game

-A

It comes from being in the closest thing to mountainous mutli-ball that'll be run on this site this year

Is this your favorite game type?

Only thing that could make it better would be adding cults

-A

[usesPython]

We know that furtive never flips red this game because his defense of us would mean that the only world where scum!furtive was possible is a Python/furtive game (and that's not mechanically possible for us)

-A

[usesPython]

We know that furtive never flips red this game because his defense of us would mean that the only world where scum!furtive was possible is a Python/furtive game (and that's not mechanically possible for us)

how is you/furtive not mechanically possible?

It's not possible for

us

because we got a green PM

-A

[usesPython]

Can we just end this day. what is the point of keeping it going?

People gotta wait another 4 days to see if a Python/Drew/Bulge wagon is possible before everyone swaps to Mala at the last minute

-A

[usesPython]

Second I didn’t want to repeat what I did last game which fucked nailed me to the ground. I don’t want to make that mistake as town.

Which game and what happened?

-A

[usesPython]

Third
I have played with bulge and I’m not ready to end that slot without giving them a proper engagement which I haven’t been able to do

This makes no sense, if you want to interact with Bulge why are you trying to end the day early by putting us at E-1 in an Elements game

-A

[usesPython]

there have been plenty of reasons people have pointed out behind the votes and it seems like you're willingly ignoring those to be able to say "hurrrr they wanna kill me just because they don't like me" which is really not at all the case here

I mean the alternative is to believe that people aren't reading our posts to sort us when we're the primary wagon of the day or that people have impossibly high standards that we physically can't reach or that people are arguing in bad faith. "The mech is a distraction" and "We're not sorting people (properly)" were the biggest arguments thrown at us and like what?

If you don't like the mech then fucking skip it, just because it reaches the same conclusions for what to do as mountainous multiball doesn't mean that it was obvious that that's what the conclusion will be with the no-kill mechanics in place

And "We're not sorting people (properly)" like huh? We know Oclax doesn't consider metaing someones main to be solving but that's literally part of how we scumhunt and Aureal, furtive, and Black can all tell you about the time where we meta'd someone over an RVS vote in another game (As in, using someones RVS vote from game B to read them in game A). And as for you how much fucking more do you expect us to have been doing between reading (not ISOing, READING) through DN mafia to see if HPE and Kokichi had a point while metaing Black (Which if you don't believe we did how do you explain 622 and 727/739), defending ourselves from the shitpush on us today, wrangling a wagon on our scumreads, attempting to further solve Drew/Bulge (e.g. in 810/816/857/925), and solving for people unrelated to all of that (901/912/991/1003/1094/1095) to just name the recent stuff

-A

[usesPython]

And didn't expect you to settle for anyone, python.

They are in full on survival mode

btw I'll tell you the same thing I told osuka, if we're in full on survival mode how do you explain our actions in 773 onwards where we specifically started a Bulge counterwagon out of thin air (Count it, 0 votes on them when I started the wagon) when we could have easily just gotten on a Black counterwagon that was already there and had more support than the Bulge wagon

-A

[usesPython]

And didn't expect you to settle for anyone, python.

They are in full on survival mode

btw I'll tell you the same thing I told osuka, if we're in full on survival mode how do you explain our actions in 773 onwards where we specifically started a Bulge counterwagon out of thin air (Count it, 0 votes on them when I started the wagon) when we could have easily just gotten on a Black counterwagon that was already there and had more support than the Bulge wagon

-A

782 felt pretty survivalistic. You only went back to the Bulge wagon because you knew Bianco would vote there so I'm not sure why you're acting like you did it as some big scumhunting moment. And you didn't get on my cw because it was built by toothpicks and glue and you saw it inevitably falling apart, and it did

I want to say here that when I called you survivalistic, I never indicated this was a wolf behavior. Townies play survivalistic often. Your reaction and defense to it doesn't feel good

I'm phoneposting rn and this is prob the last post I'll be able to make for a bit cause V/LA but like I don't think I've ever seen you shade anyone this hard as either alignment and I don't think that comes from town!Black. It sure seemed like you were calling us scum with that statement and it's only when we showed why it's not survivalistic and why that's a bad way to push us that you suddenly changed your tune from "look at scum!Python trying to stay alive" to "Oh I actually wasn't calling you scum when I called you survivalistic, this doesn't change the strength of my sr on you at all"

[usesPython]

If what you're saying is true you would have cleared it up in 1076, I dont believe you

[usesPython]

No we meant after our 1076/1077 where we pretty clearly took your statement as a negative thing. We know you're not as bad at reading peoples emotional reactions as what you're implying you'd need to be to unironically think we didn't take it as a scumread

[usesPython]

If we have to lim outside of Drew/Bulge we'd prefer a Black lim over a Mala lim atm

[usesPython]

I think the meta case is bad, I want you limmed cause of the shading and general unreasonableness that I don't normally get from you

[usesPython]

Do you think my shading and unreasonableness is wolf indicative?

If I didn't I wouldnt be arguing to lim you over it

[usesPython]

Do you think my shading and unreasonableness is wolf indicative?

If I didn't I wouldnt be arguing to lim you over it

You know my scum game more than anyone here. I'm never unreasonable. (yeah wifom but it's true)

I find it odd you choose to believe that I'm a wolf here instead of a tilted townie

You're never unreasonable as town either, thats why I think it comes more from scum!Black

[usesPython]

Like tilted town doesn't need to manipulatively shade us like that

[usesPython]

Are you taking issue with us calling it shading at all or that were calling it manipulative shading

[usesPython]

Are you taking issue with us calling it shading at all or that were calling it manipulative shading

I mean if you are referring to the survivalistic post I wasn't shading there. I gave an answer to Drew as to why I think you would compromise

We're talking in circles at this point

[usesPython]

i made a couple necessary adjustments to my reading/catchup style this game so i probably wont disappear again but i sure would love to have a flip!

Python wagon is still looking juicy

Thank you for waiting until our V/LA started to seriously start campaigning for our wagon, we really appreciate not having the chance to defend ourselves

[usesPython]

That was the best post in the entire game so far

Bulge is locktown

I have literally never seen you play like this

[usesPython]

Do you want to engage with me Python or are you going to keep making subtle remarks about my playstyle? How are any of these questions helping you sort my alignment?

I'm pointing out the weird shit cause I can't do my standard casing style from a phone, thought I was pretty clear I think you're scum

[usesPython]

I think the meta case is bad, I want you limmed cause of the shading and general unreasonableness that I don't normally get from you

[usesPython]

Like thats what I've been getting from you for most of this game after I sheeped Kokichi's meta case, I don't think you're sorting us in good faith this game

[usesPython]

Are people really being blown away by a readslist with memes?

[usesPython]

We need to sort accurately since d1 or we lose, you can't do that with bad faith arguments and pushes that don't try to solve the game

[usesPython]

"Shading and general unreasonableness"

Nah, those are terrible reasons to think I'm scum. You're forcing this one

Whats the town!Black motivation for those things?

[usesPython]

There's a reason I haven't moved off of the Bulge wagon to put you at whatever E- that'd put you

[usesPython]

We're here to shoot 4 groupscum in a row, you're a bad lim rn cause you're kinda unpaired

[usesPython]

We'd rather lim you d3 when you've had more time to pair with people

[usesPython]

We're here to shoot 4 groupscum in a row, you're a bad lim rn cause you're kinda unpaired

I think you can pair me with Aureal or Bulge pretty easily. Have you really not seen any connections between my slot and others?

It's Bulge/Drew, if there's Black/Aureal connections point them out please

[usesPython]

nvm isoing aureal I can see it

[usesPython]

I'm down to lim Black then

VOTE: Black

[usesPython]

idk what E- that is someone go check

[usesPython]

This isn't normal logical python trying to figure out the best lim today

You are F L A I L I N G

actually just checked the scum pt and saw you in it

-C

[usesPython]

Logic nerds are gone you get the cool kid

-C

[usesPython]

Yes I totally just told you Aureal was my scumbuddy

You did yea

C

[usesPython]

This isn't normal logical python trying to figure out the best lim today

You are F L A I L I N G

I am Kira

C

[usesPython]

Also, were you two this spammy that game? I don't remember it being like this.

Nameless does the Alice does the half I got the and everyone knows more you post the cooler you are

C

[usesPython]

Hop on the python wagon everyone

I've played with town!Python twice very recently and this is not a town Python game

Their reads as town somewhat lack conviction but here they have been deadset on this weak Drew/Bulge associative for the entire day. Any attempts to solve outside of this pair have been weak and short-lived and one could argue that the only reason they've even looked outside this pair is to posture themselves on whatever the leading wagon ends up being

This slot flips red here

comparing me with those nerds is pretty cringe

C

[usesPython]

Also u forgot when nameless solved the entire game d1 we kno what we got

C

[usesPython]

And u forgot the deadchat from the other game where we were 100% convinced delta was scum from his first post d2, nice misrep tho

C

[usesPython]

Also u forgot when nameless solved the entire game d1 we kno what we got

C

Yeah even when Nameless solved D1 he still lacked conviction in the read

Here? Not so much. This isn't town!python at all

wym he spent the entire d1 tunneling u both

[usesPython]

bein yelled at to let a and nameless go back to studyin, ur lucky we got exams tomorro

C

[usesPython]

bein yelled at to let a and nameless go back to studyin, ur lucky we got exams tomorro

C

I have shit to say after tomorrow

-A

[usesPython]

bein yelled at to let a and nameless go back to studyin, ur lucky we got exams tomorro

C

I have shit to say after tomorrow

-A

There's progression here btw, C's just shit at explaining and we need a computer for this

-A

[usesPython]

Expect a case in 24 hours

-A

[usesPython]

We're solving the game and praying doc can get a proc off to be winning even with a python mislim, don't hammer until then

-A

[usesPython]

This one mostly means the "hmm maybe its townread".

I think Koki could still be scum but the self vote really throws me off, and I don't think he would make sense as an Aureal buddy. I'm not sure here but I'm not as convinced in Koki!scum as I was

Quoting this for the later case since this is the biggest scumslip this game, not ok with a Kokichi lim btw

-A

[usesPython]

Faster to ISO myself than it is to ISO you, it's essentially just egoing the post

-A

[usesPython]

I already know you're going to try to spin it as "Black is only solving for one pair! She's scum!"

Hopefully you have something better than that

Yeah pretty much. Town is genuinely solving for 4 scum, scum is genuinely solving for 2 scum that have to be paired. I think you were genuinely solving there, which is why that's the biggest scumslip since whether Kokichi and Aureal were paired is completely irrelevant to sorting either for town!Black but extremely relevant for scum!Black

[usesPython]

Like in town!Blacks world Python/Kokichi + Aureal/??? should have been completely possible

[usesPython]

To repeat myself, whether or on Aureal/Kokichi are groupscum should have no bearing on the tr towards either for town!Black, it's only scum!Black who knows that she's solving for one team instead of two

[usesPython]

Your argument falls apart because I still think Koki could be scum. I just don't think he's scum with Aureal.

Pedit: Python/Koki is possible, but you have to realize that including Aureal into my worldview changes things. I still think Bianco and you are scum, and Koki was already getting pushed out by the self vote

I have no problem with your scumreads, I have a problem with you tring kokichi because they're not paired with Aureal (or the other way around hard to double check on phone)

[usesPython]

To repeat myself, whether or on Aureal/Kokichi are groupscum should have no bearing on the tr towards either for town!Black, it's only scum!Black who knows that she's solving for one team instead of two

It's not a slip. I'm still solving for two teams even if I'm not doing it very well

A slip would've been "I don't think Koki is scum because Aureal can't be his partner"

Instead you got "I still think Koki might be scum but I don't think Aureal his partner"

You gave a tr on Aureal

[usesPython]

wait no I misread, you tr Kokichi

[usesPython]

This one mostly means the "hmm maybe its townread".

I think Koki could still be scum but the self vote really throws me off, and I don't think he would make sense as an Aureal buddy. I'm not sure here but I'm not as convinced in Koki!scum as I was

Faster to ISO myself than it is to ISO you, it's essentially just egoing the post

-A

I already know you're going to try to spin it as "Black is only solving for one pair! She's scum!"

Hopefully you have something better than that

To repeat myself, whether or on Aureal/Kokichi are groupscum should have no bearing on the tr towards either for town!Black, it's only scum!Black who knows that she's solving for one team instead of two

It's not a slip. I'm still solving for two teams even if I'm not doing it very well

A slip would've been "I don't think Koki is scum because Aureal can't be his partner"

Instead you got "I still think Koki might be scum but I don't think Aureal his partner"

You're contradicting yourself here, you saw the slip yourself so how can you call it not a slip

[usesPython]

You just told Drew you dont think Kokichi is scum

[usesPython]

Like you explicitly gave a Kokichi townread, which is it

[usesPython]

Osuka normally I'd save this kind of talk until postgame/deadchat since otherwise it gets tainted but at this point I'm just done. Are you even physically capable of talking to us without an insult coming out of your mouth?

Everything we brought up this game has been met with you calling it shit or otherwise being an asshole even when you can agree with the reads we're making and at this point what the hell is even the point of us playing if every time we do we have to deal with more toxic spew coming from you

-A

[usesPython]

Like christ Black's been shading and misrepping us for half the game and I still don't have as much of a problem with that as I do with your conduct this game

-A

[usesPython]

Please look at the wagon on us and tell us how we live past d2

You're smart. I'm not putting it past you to figure it out

We forgot to ask this earlier, but where exactly is this conception of us coming from?

-A

If you are town then scum will keep you alive since you are so misguided.

If you are scum(which is the only thing that makes sense here), other scum probably won't view you as a threat.

So don't you worry, I don't have a conception you are a smart player.

We weren't asking you

-A

Like wtf is even the point of quoting a question that's not even for you just to call us an idiot, what the hell's your problem

-A

Post Edit: Came off a bit meaner then I meant it, I mean that I get what you are doing as scum, but other scum would keep you alive since you are also misguided(unless this by design?) thinking you have caught scum(me).

It also boggles my mind that this all started because Bulge didn't really comment on me, and somehow that makes me look scummier then them lol.

Pre Edit: Again sorry, wasn't trying to insult you, just your play.

And on phone, didn't feel like editing down the post.

[usesPython]

Wrong thread mb