You could be anyone II - Game Over

[StrangerCoug]

Vote: FFAE00 FFED00

49 20 74 68 69 6e 6b 20 74 68 65 72 65 20 69 73 20 61 20 63 68 61 6e 63 65 20 79 6f 75 20 63 6f 75 6c 64 20 62 65 20 6d 61 66 69 61 2e

VOTE: PeregrineV for thinking I have the patience and the time to decode that crap.

Pancakes and bacon for the breakfast claim, though I rarely have the time to sit down for them.

[StrangerCoug]

Eight pages in half a day. Do any of you guys have a life!?

Liking IHNC, and liked FF before I read #139. I don't think Titus is the problem.

#152: I am generally serious period. Look at practically anything I've played, especially a game Thor665 was also playing—humor was never my strong suit. I don't think your vote is inherently scummy; I just think neither of you have played with me before.

#205: Well, excuse me for being a college student. I'll put as much effort in this game as possible but just because I don't follow your schedule and don't have as much time as you do doesn't mean I'm scum. The not "hav[ing] the patience and the time to decode that crap" was semi-serious: anybody can use Google but I was also doing homework at the time.

#219: Why the sudden move? At least you made a clear attempt at something decent against me.

#264 and #267: These posts are just... off. They seem lazy.

#266: I believe you've gotten over what caused it, but this is bullying. Play the game and put up with FF's behavior whether you like it or not. If it's outright abusive, the game mod is supposed to have an open ear for that.

UNVOTE: PeregrineV
VOTE: Nero Cain

FF isn't on the top of my town list but I think the townier things they did dwarf the posts of theirs I have problems with.

[StrangerCoug]

I am not putting up with her slot becoming a free mislynch just like in every game this year so far.

Then why did you vote her?

FoS: T S O

but @ strangercoug

why are you ignoring meh. you can't still be pissy over that retarded light switch argument

I simply didn't notice anything special that you did. I do think you're town, if you want my opinion on her.

[StrangerCoug]

EBWOP to #376: on you

[StrangerCoug]

stangercoug - this might change cos I am not getting what I need from him but I am going to work with ff creatures on this.

What do you need from me?

I am not putting up with her slot becoming a free mislynch just like in every game this year so far.

Then why did you vote her?

FoS: T S O

to prevent what I said occuring.

I have no idea what you think scum-TSO is doing here - trying to make a free mislynch on someone who has not even posted when it would be a) easier and b) far more helpful for my team to leave her around as dead weight in LyLo.

I think scum-TSO is scumslipping, that's what I think he's doing. You are voting a person you are calling a mislynch, not to mention that she's had only 30 hours to post. I also have a problem with you justifying your actions by saying scum would do something else. Don't feed me WIFOM.

UNVOTE: Nero Cain and demote to

FoS

VOTE: T S O

[StrangerCoug]

I have no idea how I'm "scumslipping", and you don't seem to either.

YOU DON'T CALL THE PERSON YOU'RE VOTING A "MISLYNCH", WHETHER IT'S INTENDED AS A PRESSURE VOTE OR NOT.

I will entertain your counterattack past this post once this gets past your head.

I'm voting a person so they will either play or replace out. You keep saying I'm "voting a person who is a mislynch! Ooooh, SCUM!" when

one vote is not going to fucking get Rach lynched.

It's still an anti-town use of your vote. There's 20 pages of information thus far—more than enough to have gotten a few sizable wagons—and you're wasting your time with a pressure vote at best. What do you think of everyone besides RachMarie?

Finally, I wasn't "feeding you WIFOM". I was feeding you the correct scum actions for scum-TSO.

No one said you actually had to do those as scum. That's why I said you were feeding me WIFOM.

You, apparently, also think scum-TSO is not following these - so you should probably explain why I'm so against optimal play.

This is an unreasonable request. I cannot read your mind.

Your hard defense of Rach for no reason really bothers me.

I am not defending Rach to any further extent than using

YOUR OWN WORDING

to demonstrate how your vote is completely backwards.

You're caught scum and you know it, T S O.

[StrangerCoug]

I have no idea how I'm "scumslipping", and you don't seem to either.

YOU DON'T CALL THE PERSON YOU'RE VOTING A "MISLYNCH", WHETHER IT'S INTENDED AS A PRESSURE VOTE OR NOT. I will entertain your counterattack past this post once this gets past your head.

Rach is mislynched in every game.

You either have never seen Rach play before or you're scum who wants her lynched. It's honestly that simple.

I can't both defend her and try to lynch her. Decide what I'm doing, if either.

This is proof of you not reading - I have been attacking Gemma and Tiphaine for the whole of the game so far.

Any more reads?

You don't know what WIFOM means.

Yes, I do. I've gotten scum lynched for making a WIFOM argument similar to yours. The rest of your response is being ignored.

You, apparently, also think scum-TSO is not following these - so you should probably explain why I'm so against optimal play.

This is an unreasonable request. I cannot read your mind.

This answer makes 0 fucking sense whatsoever and shows you have no response to the actual question.

How does it make "0 fucking sense whatsoever"? What kind of response did you honestly expect when you asked that question? How did you expect that response to help anyone?

[StrangerCoug]

@StrangerCoug:

Have you played with RachMarie before?

Not as far as I remember.

How much are you taking 316 in the context of 315?

I'm reading #316 as a continuation of #315.

Remind me to take a closer look at Wake88—he stands out, but I can't pinpoint it.

[StrangerCoug]

One, it's SC, not SG.
Two, I'm trying to figure out what it is with your posts. Something tells me I should be leaning some way or other on you, and I currently have no read.

[StrangerCoug]

SC then.

I think if something is telling or troubling you, then you should at least try to give voice to what it is that you are feeling, because as Town it should naturally be very easy for you to speak honestly your feelings. Take a few minutes if you must to at least come up with one sentence better explaining your feelings, please.

I've looked at your posts now, and I find they're rather unimpressive in terms of scumhunting. Then again, I think you're still trying to catch up.

[StrangerCoug]

If there are any other feelings about my posts you're having, then please share them here in detail.

I will.

[StrangerCoug]

I do not.

[StrangerCoug]

How do you feel about TSO saying "play or replace out" 11 pages ago to the only person who still has not even checked into the thread?

I don't think it'd be that out of place (though still a bit harsh) if he said it now, but I still disagree that what he essentially says is a pressure vote is going to do much about it. His vote is better where it is and where he's said his mouth has been.

Remind me to take a closer look at Wake88—he stands out, but I can't pinpoint it.

Is it because his catchup has nothing to do with the game... like at all? His posts are almost exclusively all pointing out hydra 'crumbs', flavor discussion, questions re: alt speculation, or requests for others to engage him.

What you're saying lines up well with my observations.

Why don't you come join me and get a Wagon running.

I want to give him a chance to post something decent, but if he fails to deliver I'll jump on board.

[StrangerCoug]

*writes Majiffy's name in the town column*

ack sorry all thought I had posted here had to hunt down the game in theme park (I generally use ego post)

I blame it on the vicodin I have been eating like candy for the dental work, I can't even work right now

Will read up and catch up on 25 friggen pages

yeah, no

I am thinking rach is scum guyz.

which puts an interesting spin on tso's vote and his hurried unvote the second she posted even tho it is crap. it looks like early pressure on a nonexistant scummate to me.

@ stranger kitty - what think you?

About whom, RachMarie or T S O?

[StrangerCoug]

Looking at that quote of myself there I see I used the word "lurk," though, and that was shameful. The game had been open less than 24 hours, sorry StrangerCoug.

It's alright. I don't have a scumread on you right now.

[StrangerCoug]

I have a good guess about who one of the FF heads is based on playstyle, but I'll keep it to myself.

I'm not liking IHNC. He's just spitting out reads without reasons. While I still have my reservations about T S O, IHNC

REALLY

needs to step it up.

Major HoS: I have no creativity

To the other people not providing reasons for their reads, I don't foresee this game letting me forget about you.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm scum because I misread and jumped on a perceived scumslip? Yeah, you know what I've had just about enough of your BS. VOTE: TSO.

That was one of the worse OMGUS votes I've seen, TD, but you know you're fucked so you're coming out swinging. I respect that.

And your response to TD is no better. You dismiss his case on you for no real reason. It's like you refuse to consider anybody who thinks you're scum to be town.

[StrangerCoug]

I feel happy moving off T S O at this point.

UNVOTE: T S O
VOTE: I have no creativity
See post #661 above.

[StrangerCoug]

Someone said we needed to step it up (hi sc).

but no. we are going to continue to be lazy assholes for day 1.

And what, exactly, is the town motivation to do so? Making it difficult for us to figure out why you think what you do is not exactly a desirable trait around these parts.

[StrangerCoug]

Is ff a hydra of marquis and ika? Cause it sure feels that way.

you lose all points with this post.

ika is in the "I have no creativity" hydra. obviously ff creatures are nacho and tammy. they are town can we let them do their thing

I had guessed Thor665 as one of the people in the FF hydra.

[StrangerCoug]

I have a good guess about who one asof the FF heads is based on playstyle, but I'll keep it to myself.

I'm not liking IHNC. He's just spitting out reads without reasons. While I still have my reservations about T S O, IHNC

REALLY

needs to step it up.

Major HoS: I have no creativity

To the other people not providing reasons for their reads, I don't foresee this game letting me forget about you.

Rereading. IHNC was not prompted for reads, and if they were it wasn't a request strong enough to significantly matter. I see random readslists as town things to do. The heads of that hydra are no exception. The random unjustified reads, as well as their RVS play, are both town actions of theirs. Leave creativity alone.

FFED00

I don't give a flying rat's butt about anyone's town meta. Or anyone's scum meta, before anybody brings that up.

[StrangerCoug]

Very well then, if you think it helps, it shouldn't be that difficult to find. I've been here for over six years and have lots of games under my belt.

[StrangerCoug]

661, 667, and 673 smack of a scum idea of where he was planning out his next course of action and then decided to just roll with it instead of waiting, especially the part where he references his own post that he might be moving soon.

What, exactly, do you think I was waiting for?

As for referencing my earlier post, #673 simply asks to refer to #661 for my vote reason. Any person can check that post and determine whether or not the vote reason is scummy. But the reference being scummy? What the hell?

[StrangerCoug]

May I get an answer to #758, please, TD?

[StrangerCoug]

Erm... 758 is my post... so, your answer is.... YES!

I meant my response to it in #776. My bad.

[StrangerCoug]

OK, trying to make sense of your post.

[StrangerCoug]

Sorry. Not voting a neutral read over a scum read at this point.

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: How many to lynch?

I'm disliking TiphaineDeath's response to Kthxbye. He responds to his request to elaborate on his scumreads by being as useless as he can help. It's like there's something to hide.
UNVOTE: IHNC
VOTE: TiphaineDeath

[StrangerCoug]

I'm tempted to say "how about both of you" at this point. Right now I think they've devolved into just tearing at each other, and I'm not getting anything of use from it.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm tempted to say "how about both of you" at this point. Right now I think they've devolved into just tearing at each other, and I'm not getting anything of use from it.

strangerkitty I am hardpressed to remember a single read that you had.

your big red letters post is what moved you into the townpile for me but you voted td as if you didn't even think that he would flip scum. <---- I consider you to be a pretty good scumhunter so the lack of impetus is throwing me off.

It's admittedly part me—I haven't been able to extract a lot of scumreads from all these posts. I'll have more time to go over these around lunchtime (I have to be ready to leave the house in less than ten minutes), but TSO has been in my scumpile before for the reasons in the "big red letters post".

[StrangerCoug]

I'm tempted to say "how about both of you" at this point. Right now I think they've devolved into just tearing at each other, and I'm not getting anything of use from it.

strangerkitty I am hardpressed to remember a single read that you had.

your big red letters post is what moved you into the townpile for me but you voted td as if you didn't even think that he would flip scum. <---- I consider you to be a pretty good scumhunter so the lack of impetus is throwing me off.

It's admittedly part me—I haven't been able to extract a lot of scumreads from all these posts. I'll have more time to go over these around lunchtime (I have to be ready to leave the house in less than ten minutes), but TSO has been in my scumpile before for the reasons in the "big red letters post".

OK, here goes:

• TiphaineDeath's connecting T S O and me is a little weird, but that's not the damning thing. He was asked to elaborate on why he thought the two of us and the FF hydra was scum and he responded by saying he wasn't going to repeat himself. That's making me question whether he's giving the whole story here.
  
• The other moderately strong scum read I have is I have no creativity for not backing up any of his reads.

I'm not currently comfortable lynching anybody else.

[StrangerCoug]

Can we just lynch someone already?

What's the hurry?

[StrangerCoug]

Can we just lynch someone already?

Can we just lynch someone already?

we have 12 days to lynch someone there's no rush.

I'm trolling because I'm also bored.

Can we just lynch someone already?

What's the hurry?

I'm trolling because I'm also bored.

And what are these posts together supposed to show?

I'm too jaded by the fakevig tendency these days for #1088 to have an effect on my read on IHNC.

[StrangerCoug]

claim in your next post or die.

Thank you for reminding me why I had you as a scum read.

[StrangerCoug]

claim in your next post or die.

Thank you for reminding me why I had you as a scum read.

^^^^
confirmed idiot scum.

Nice ad hom. Now explain yourself.

[StrangerCoug]

I think you are pushing something that's incredibly easy/lazy and very skin deep.

I was not asking you to explain why you think I'm scum (though thanks for actually doing a better job of accusing me this time). I was asking you to explain why you asked Hostile Intent to claim or die.

[StrangerCoug]

I was asking you to explain why you asked Hostile Intent to claim or die.

I was mostly fucking around though the first time I did want to see if he'd panic.

what do you think of his slot?

No read.

Don't get the Yiley wagon at all.

[StrangerCoug]

I also do not approve of titus avatar change

I'm not allowed to be one of the cool kids who av swaps :'(

This was GiF's (GuyinFreezer).

That sometimes happens to me, and I think your new one is cute.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm getting a feeling of "I'm right and you're wrong" from some of the recent posters that is really exasperating me. Majiffy is right; this game feels dead in the water.

[StrangerCoug]

would you like to claim?

he claimed flavor thats more then you have done atm

I want to cut your throat for this post. It's not funny.

No opposition to the Hostile Intent wagon that's growing.

[StrangerCoug]

Give me time to think about whether I believe Hostile Intent's claim, but I don't like the dancing around the issue that he's been doing.

i also wouldnt mind being dayviged if that means that SC gets lynched for being an obvious scum

If I were "obvious scum", then one would not need an explanation for why I am scum, yet I'm under the impression that the other player's opinions on me are mixed overall. Obviously, the rest of us don't see what you see. You have never posted a case on me (the most you've done with me is conjecture that I am Garmr's scumbuddy), so we can't see what you see beyond words you've never backed up. Until you actually post a decent case on me, you are white noise to me.

[StrangerCoug]

This is an SK claim.

He's not a cop cop. He is not a seer. He doubts his role could be necessary. That's not a watcher/tracker/gunsmith. That leaves FBI Agent.

Yet, an FBI agent would never toss doubt as to whether an SK is in the game or his role is necessity.

HI is the SK.

Sold.

UNVOTE: TiphaineDeath
VOTE: Hostile Intent

[StrangerCoug]

Why would an SK ever fakeclaim FBI agent day 1?

"Hey guys dont mind me, just confirming my own existence"

"You guys cant lynch me now cause I'm a highly specific cop that hits 1/25 players in a large game"

All it does is give town extra info before the first night, and its not a role that town HAS to keep alive.

I've hated everything that HI has done so far.... except his claim.

If Titus is right that Hostile Intent has claimed FBI agent and the SK figures that out, Hostile Intent is not going to live to see Day 2 in the first place. What compels you to keep him around?

[StrangerCoug]

What compels you to keep him around?

So you are arguing that we should lynch him but you think the sk would shoot him?

WTF is that?

The point I'm making is that Hostile Intent has shot any attempt of being of any utility to us.

• If he's the SK, all he'll ever give is "not SK" results, which tells us nothing about his claimed targets.
  
• If he's not the SK, then he's kill bait. The only two reasons the SK would not kill Hostile Intent are 1.) Titus is wrong and HI actually poses no threat to the SK or 2.) SK does not want to risk being watched.

What don't you understand?

[StrangerCoug]

Just leaving you with this: If there's a Serial Killer, and I'm just going to die tonight, what information are you gathering from lynching the FBI Agent?

A hell of a lot more information than you're going to give us from your investigations.

[StrangerCoug]

If Titus is right that Hostile Intent has claimed FBI agent and the SK figures that out, Hostile Intent is not going to live to see Day 2 in the first place. What compels you to keep him around?

So you think that theres a target in the game that is very threatening to any SK, and he's painted a giant target on his back and the SK is going to kill him tonight.

And your plan is to lynch him before night so the SK can kill an obvtown instead?

How do you know that the SK is planning on killing obvtown, and if Hostile Intent is telling the truth, what is preventing him from being obvtown to the SK? Your opposition to my vote on him is that I am potentially allowing something that is very likely to happen anyway whether HI is lynched or not, so what, exactly, are you getting at?

Just leaving you with this: If there's a Serial Killer, and I'm just going to die tonight, what information are you gathering from lynching the FBI Agent?

A hell of a lot more information than you're going to give us from your investigations.

You know... unless he catches the SK.

I addressed this earlier. If he's given that opportunity, the SK is concerned about a watcher (or is an idiot). If he has no such ability in the first place, then Titus's guess about Hostile Intent's claim is wrong.

Why would you fakeclaim FBI agent?

The same reason you would fakeclaim any other PR—to try to prevent being lynched. Why are you even asking this question?

[StrangerCoug]

.... What I'm getting at. Is that the existence of an FBI agent in this game is a threat to a potential SK. And that the potential SK has to consider the risk of being caught by the SK catching role.
And that you pushing to kill the SK catching role is freeing up the potential SK TO DO WHATEVER THE FUCK HE WANTS.

And that that HAS to be worse than leaving HI alive as SK bait for a night.

OK, so lynching HI unforces the SK's hand. That's only much of a detriment if HI is Mafia and SK buys HI's claim (and I'm hard-pressed to come up with a strategic reason why he wouldn't). Assuming the SK shoots randomly among the remaining players if HI is dead, the chances of an SK crosskill are not nonzero.

I addressed this earlier. If he's given that opportunity, the SK is concerned about a watcher (or is an idiot). If he has no such ability in the first place, then Titus's guess about Hostile Intent's claim is wrong.

So, you think that a potential SK would steer clear of HI because of a potential watcher. Great. For how long? A night? 2 nights? 3 nights? At some point, the SK is going to have to attempt to deal with HI or risk being caught.

I know that. I'm saying that the SK

COULD

steer clear of HI because of a potential watcher. Watcher targets HI, SK kills HI the same night, SK is bagged regardless of HI's alignment or actions.

Why would you fakeclaim FBI agent?

The same reason you would fakeclaim any other PR—to try to prevent being lynched. Why are you even asking this question?

Hey SC I'm gonna direct you to the answer to this rhetorical question in the same post I asked it.

Why would you fakeclaim FBI agent?

Thats like the worst fakeclaim ever.

Like at least if you fakeclaim cop or something theres an incentive to keeping you around, or you get to draw out a relevant CC

.

[/quote]
Like Titus, I've also been in games where scum (one of my scumbuddies, in fact—it was the first game I won as scum in two years or so) had fakeclaimed FBI agent. Ended up lynched the next day, too, if my memory serves me correctly. You reasking the question will not change my answer, and the more you try to stall Hostile Intent's lynch with no good reason, the more I think that Hostile Intent is not, in fact, the SK but rather your scumbuddy. You need to stop and think if HI's actions line up with his claim, and I think you're willfully ignoring them.

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: Put another opening quote tag before the one for #1511, please.

[StrangerCoug]

EBWOP: The last one for #1511

[StrangerCoug]

I said please >=(

[StrangerCoug]

SC is not an abstract thinker. That's part of the reason UDesign went so well for the scumteam. She's unlikely to preface anything with potential this or potential that.

Get my gender right, please.

[StrangerCoug]

Yeah. I used to joke that I was the opposite gender and half the age people thought I was.

[StrangerCoug]

Can we have somebody dayvig TiphaineDeath? I don't feel like moving my vote off Hostile Intent.

[StrangerCoug]

So you, like Mollie, are again providing examples of times where scum claim FBI agent and then get killed eventually.
If someone could explain to me how thats relevant that'd be great.

You asked why anyone would fakeclaim FBI agent You never asked if such a fakeclaim would work, and you've established that you think it wouldn't here.

[StrangerCoug]

I no longer feel it is right to have TheWayItEnds on my scumlist for his Hostile Intent stance. We've essentially argued into agreement; where we differ is the conclusion. If the Hostile Intent wagon dies I'll move to TiphaineDeath.

[StrangerCoug]

Coug, why are you only moving if my wagon dies? Do you believe you'll obtain more information from my lynch than his?

As much devil's advocate I've been playing, I

STILL

do not believe your claim because of the way you've been treating it before and after. Tiphaine is a less solid read than you and has been somewhat of an on-again, off-again scumread for me.

[StrangerCoug]

What information, aside from my role, do you learn from my lynch that you wouldn't learnn from his?

Not really anything since I am not pushing for an information lynch at this stage. Again, you're the more solid read.

And anyone who isn't already voting TiphaineDeath. Talk to me about this strangcoug/TSO relationship. Do you think it's being made up?

My answer to this should be obvious In any event, it's an absurd connection to be making, though I swear he's not the only one to think the two of us are scum together.

[StrangerCoug]

Hostile Intent (6): TiphaineDeath, Titus, vezokpiraka, StrangerCoug, Nero Cain, FFAE00 FFED00

Does this look like a damn townwagon to

anyone?

I literally trust 0 people on it.

So you have some sort of scumread on all six, do I understand your post correctly? If so, why do you believe nobody voting Hostile Intent is town?

[StrangerCoug]

Scumread =/= No trust.

OK, of those on the HI wagon, who are your

REAL

scumreads?

[StrangerCoug]

UNVOTE: Hostile Intent
VOTE: Tiphaine Death

Losing my patience with someone is "distancing" from that person? Am I not allowed to have emotions?

[StrangerCoug]

UNVOTE: Hostile Intent
VOTE: Tiphaine Death

Losing my patience with someone is "distancing" from that person? Am I not allowed to have emotions?

I've been blowing up a lot lately, he is directly referencing that in an attempt to get out from under perceived pressure. There are 0 votes on him, acting pressured without pressure is a scum tell.

This is an outright lie. You said:

Stranger Coug is a good player. I suspect he had a plan to be on TSO hard and get off him later for maximum distancing. He lost his patience, moved in a way that showed he was reacting to himself rather than outside stimuli, and I caught him at it.

You cannot seriously expect me to defend that without me talking about how I felt at that point, since how I felt at that point is exactly what you're talking about. Additionally, you make no demonstration as to how I was "reacting to [my]self rather than outside stimuli".

The line "Am I not allowed to have emotions," is inherently defensive and scummy.

See the above. This is not a fair counterattack in the slightest and serves only to turn my own words against me.

We're letting Hostile Intent live to see tonight whether I'm happy with the idea or not. We're lynching TiphaineDeath's lying, manipulative ass.

[StrangerCoug]

Good luck getting me to pay any more attention to what you're saying.

[StrangerCoug]

I wanted TD to hammer FF, but it's not like we're losing a big contributor to the game.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE: Hostile Intent

It's already been said.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm getting really suspicious of the people who want HI kept around. I don't think they are all scum, but my money is on at least one or two of those people being scum.

[StrangerCoug]

I get the issue about there being unlikely to be only one killing faction but we have no idea why there were fewer deaths than expected. The evidence points to Hostile Intent's claim being fake.

[StrangerCoug]

Then refute my statement. Don't just dismiss it with a single word that doesn't help me figure out what you think.

[StrangerCoug]

I get the issue about there being unlikely to be only one killing faction but

we

have no idea why there were fewer deaths than expected. The evidence points to Hostile Intent's claim being fake.

whos this we crap your spweing? do you have buddies?

VOTE: sc

Do you have any idea why there are fewer kills than expected, either? The town, silly!

[StrangerCoug]

that's really not something you can assume at all

To whom are you responding?

[StrangerCoug]

that's really not something you can assume at all

To whom are you responding?

you

Oh, so the town is omniscient?

[StrangerCoug]

@StrangerCoug - Did my explanation make sense? You asked for one then ignored it

I understand what's going on in your head now.

Do you have any idea why there are fewer kills than expected, either?

I'm think I could take a pretty good guess at why.

And it doesnt involve there only being one killing faction.

If you have to guess, you don't know, which was the entire point of my original post. I also do not currently believe it is uniball and view your strong multiball push as a towntell.

[StrangerCoug]

If you dont think its uniball then why are you pushing HI?

I think the chances are higher that he's SK than Mafia. My strongest Mafia read is currently I Have No Creativity.

What the hell is that softclaim? I kind of want you to shut the fuck up and not reveal information to scum that they don't need, but also have no idea what you're getting at

Then why are you asking about what you think is his softclaiming?

[StrangerCoug]

Because I have no idea why he would make that comment. I don't think it's pro-Town to suggest that he's responsible for stopping a kill, as he's either outing a PR we'll need or trying to take credit for cheap Townpoints. I'm not sure where he's going with the statement or how to react to it

I don't think the townpoints are actually cheap, as if he's scum, it requires his fakeclaim to already be thought out for his posting to be sensible. I feel the worst he's doing right now is shooting himself in the foot.

[StrangerCoug]

How many people pushing the HIWagon think he's Scum and how many think he's an SK?

I consider SK to be part of scum.

[StrangerCoug]

I understand what he's asking (and I had already answered the question with the intended meaning); I just want it clear to him that "scum" unqualified isn't used the same way by everybody here.

[StrangerCoug]

are you somehow advocating not lynching groupscum

I don't understand how you deduce that conclusion, since we should be lynching scum, whether groupscum or otherwise, and I cannot find anywhere in TWIE's recent posting that he specifically advocates an SK search right now.

Minor FoS: T S O

[StrangerCoug]

If hes groupscum then killing him doesnt do much for us. Like maybe we get rid of the roleblocker or something at best. Groupscum still gets their factional kill and the same amount of night kills still in place.

That says only that HI should not be lynched if he is groupscum. It is not an opposition to lynching any other groupscum candidates.

Have you considered Specsavers, Coug?

I've never even heard of it.

i love the fact that SC is saying we are mafia scum but never backs it up with a vote.

I simply think there's a higher reward for lynching my SK read. If I were a doublevoter you'd have my other one.

Seriously, you are not using your brain. You're just looking for the easiest lynch you can.

[StrangerCoug]

...Are you trying to commit suicide? I'm not going to grace that with a response.

[StrangerCoug]

Those making the argument that he's an SK likewise have a weak platform to stand on. There is 0 evidence to suggest that an SK exists. As previously stated, not even the existence of an FBI Agent is a reliable barometer.

So you're entertaining that the FBI agent could be a red herring role?

[StrangerCoug]

I'm saying, as I have been saying, that the wiki itself says that an FBI Agent Role does not guarantee the existence of an SK. If the wiki entry is saying that the Role is a red herring, I see no reason to think otherwise.

If my understanding of site meta is current, then red herrings are rare in non-bastard games (but a variant of what you say could be the case is something I've run before). It's nice that you are keeping an open mind but this is how I am operating.

[StrangerCoug]

UNVOTE: Hostile Intent
VOTE: I Have No Creativity

It's real lovely that he disappeared on us when the heat started building up on him. Maybe if I turn it up a bit, we'll get something from him that's actually worth everybody's time.

[StrangerCoug]

Im almost always around we just don't care.

That explains your vote, then.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm getting a town vibe from House's defense of T S O, and TiphaineDeath still makes me unhappy.

[StrangerCoug]

Getting the motivation for this game has proven to be on the hard side for me, too, Majiffy. I understand.

[StrangerCoug]

Whatever.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm getting a town vibe from House's defense of T S O, and TiphaineDeath still makes me unhappy.

Are you fucking reading?

This post tells me you literally did not read a word I posted.

House is scum. Explain why he's not or vote him. Simple as.

I read what you posted. I've seen people refuse to read anything before when they've joined in, so that's not alignment indicative. He also indirectly acknowledges that he's not omniscient, so that's not alignment indicative. Blowing your weak case to smithereens is what I find townie of him, and you're refusing to accept "not alignment-indicative" as a valid defense shows that you are close-minded. Demonstrate how you case is, in fact, alignment-indicative or come up with better.

I do agree that House was rather quick to the punch on Garmr, but that's not what I was addressing in my post.

[StrangerCoug]

Show me where he "blew my weak case" to smithereens. I read it and felt it was laughably atrocious. So you should show me where I'm going wrong.

Funny you accuse me of not reading and then show me that you aren't, either. You're quite terrible even if I were to consider House being scum. Here.

[StrangerCoug]

Okay, I'm going to highlight something for you here, Coug. What I'm about to highlight is in that post, 2140, of mine that you quoted.

"Show me where he "blew my weak case to smithereens."

I read it and felt it was laughably atrocious.

" <--- Do you see that, Coug? The bit where I said I

read?

Then why the hell did you ask me about where you "blew your weak case to smithereens" when I had already established that that post was what I was talking about? I reiterated why your case does not work. Instead of properly refuting his defense, you continue to peddle your crap case and OMGUS me when I call you out on it.

You are back up to my #2 scumread. If you do not stop and think about why your case is not getting an awful lot of buyers, you

WILL

get my vote.

[StrangerCoug]

Quite honestly, I don't give a damn what alignment people think I am right now. If it's town vs. town, it's town vs. town. If it's not, it's not. I certainly don't think it is.

VOTE: TSO since we're apparently through with each other.

[StrangerCoug]

...What hath God wrought? I don't know what to think of what House is doing.

[StrangerCoug]

Wake me up when something needs my attention.

[StrangerCoug]

@SC- Your presence on the JoshWagon has been requested.

I don't have a strong read on Josh at the moment.

Because the rest of the town are busy pushing scum-House.

Really? I've noticed he has a few votes, but I fail to see any strong push from anybody other than you. The extent of my problem with him is that he needs his sanity checked. His scumclaiming has caused him to go from probtown to unreadable for me.

[StrangerCoug]

*points to own profile*

I want one, but not

THAT

kind

[StrangerCoug]

To be fair, I'm having the hardest time in the world finding a girlfriend. Apparently I don't socialize enough.

[StrangerCoug]

Now I have House as borderline scum.

[StrangerCoug]

Can we have one of IHNC, TSO, or TD lynched, please? HI if we agree on the presence of an SK? Please?

[StrangerCoug]

@Titus

Just noticed something you keep referring H.I

as the sk

not scum.

The first thing that crossed my mind when considering the claim was "is he mafia fake claiming or sk" Town would be unsure of this. But you seem pretty god damn certain his a SK. Not one little post saying he could be 2nd party scum. Just a third party SK.

Why does this strike you as unusual? HI is my SK read as well and I have little to no reason to believe he's Mafia.

[StrangerCoug]

Liking pirate mollie.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm getting a town read from her defense. Although it's really more gut than anything I don't recall having a scum read on her all game.

[StrangerCoug]

house is town
tos is derp town
SC is still scum
garer is scum
HI is scum
titus can be town for now but she needs to not be like this

so who we lynching first?

You if you keep pulling names out of a hat without actually making cases. You're virtually a nonfactor.

[StrangerCoug]

house is town
tos is derp town
SC is still scum
garer is scum
HI is scum
titus can be town for now but she needs to not be like this

so who we lynching first?

You if you keep pulling names out of a hat without actually making cases. You're virtually a nonfactor.

Do not underestimate ika. I'd rather have this blankness helps me read him. He's not a cases kinda guy.

It may help you, but it doesn't help me. He can at least give me a damn clue.

[StrangerCoug]

In UDesign we didn't have the stagnation and general difficulty with motivation that we're having here.

[StrangerCoug]

UNVOTE: T S O
VOTE: Hostile Intent

Willing to give #2498 some credence.

[StrangerCoug]

@SC- What part of p2498 makes sense to you in a way that SK-HI would be a higher priority than GroupScum-Titus?

What the post really did was put Titus on the table for me. However, despite the way the post is phrased, I think lynching Hostile Intent tells me more about Titus than the other way around. I do not think lynching Titus first tells me anything about Hostile Intent unless we're in multiball, in which case the number of kills should pin down HI's alignment. On the other hand, HI being BP SK condemns Titus, as that means she knows for a fact that at least one kill did not go through, something town would not know.

[StrangerCoug]

@SC- What part of p2498 makes sense to you in a way that SK-HI would be a higher priority than GroupScum-Titus?

What the post really did was put Titus on the table for me. However, despite the way the post is phrased, I think lynching Hostile Intent tells me more about Titus than the other way around. I do not think lynching Titus first tells me anything about Hostile Intent unless we're in multiball, in which case the number of kills should pin down HI's alignment. On the other hand, HI being BP SK condemns Titus, as that means she knows for a fact that at least one kill did not go through, something town would not know.

this has already been covered by "do you know who likes to lynch indies it is scum that is who" and why this may not apply to titus. and yet you voted

with her

. so what you are saying here is that scum!titus "might" know if HI was bp, yeah? so why are you voting WITH her instead of trying to find scum? cos you haven't done that.

I have established my scum reads with some pretty reasonable certainty, pirate mollie. The only change to them since this post is that I now consider Titus-scum a real possibility. Do not simply say that I haven't been trying to find scum.

As for why I am voting with my scumread, getting rid of a third party serves both town interests and groupscum interests as it takes a kill with it. It's pretty universal to want to lose as few people as possible on your own side. If you can find a legitimate reason to accuse Titus and me of being scumbuddies based on my voting Hostile Intent, then I'd like to hear it.

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: Please note sig.

I have established my scum reads with some pretty reasonable certainty, pirate mollie. The only change to them since this post is that I now consider Titus-scum a real possibility. Do not simply say that I haven't been trying to find scum.

why exactly are you now considering titus!scum a real possibility?

I mean you are sheeping her HI!sk read I mean that could on some level mean that you are srsly looking for scum.

As for why I am voting with my scumread, getting rid of a third party serves both town interests and groupscum interests as it takes a kill with it. It's pretty universal to want to lose as few people as possible on your own side. If you can find a legitimate reason to accuse Titus and me of being scumbuddies based on my voting Hostile Intent, then I'd like to hear it.

in none of this have you answered as to why you are just now thinking that scum!titus is a real possibility. <---- this is the question.

you are dodging my question strangerkitty.

It was Josh_B's post that made me consider Titus-scum. You'll get a fuller answer around lunchtime Tuesday; I have more important stuff than Mafia right now.

[StrangerCoug]

Confirm vote.

Hostile Intent is scum or Titus is scum.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE: Titus

I think it's been explained to death already by other people.

[StrangerCoug]

Framer or Redirector. Done.

Much simpler. I was doing that yesterday. These were the likely conclusions.

Frame investigative target numbero uno by framer or redirect. Town PR has guilty. Two mislynches.


You would think by now there would be a cc or a guilty claim.

A standard framer doesn't mess with track investigations, Titus...

[StrangerCoug]

Framer or Redirector. Done.

Much simpler. I was doing that yesterday. These were the likely conclusions.

Frame investigative target numbero uno by framer or redirect. Town PR has guilty. Two mislynches.


You would think by now there would be a cc or a guilty claim.

A standard framer doesn't mess with track investigations, Titus...

You have read the title of the game right.

Of what relevance is that, and when did I say that no framers mess with track investigations?

[StrangerCoug]

So yeah... the only way Titus is scum is if I am scum too, which is kinda stupid because I'd be 100x more likely to bus the shit out of her for town cred than white knight her if we were both scum. Especially since I typically try to lynch her anyway.

Yeah. Way to try to save her butt with WIFOM.

HoS: House

[StrangerCoug]

Framer or Redirector. Done.

Much simpler. I was doing that yesterday. These were the likely conclusions.

Frame investigative target numbero uno by framer or redirect. Town PR has guilty. Two mislynches.


You would think by now there would be a cc or a guilty claim.

A standard framer doesn't mess with track investigations, Titus...

You have read the title of the game right.

Of what relevance is that, and when did I say that no framers mess with track investigations?

This backpedaling is shady as fuck, too.

How am I backpedaling? There is a difference between a standard framer and just any old framer. A standard framer causes people to investigate as guilty to a sane cop. Titus's claimed results would not be affected by such a framer. If there's a nonstandard framer, then it's possible that Titus's results were tampered with, but other than the fact that this is a theme game we have no evidence of nonstandard anything. I do not appreciate you twisting my words in order to save your scumbuddy.

[StrangerCoug]

There is no twist. Me claiming a track result makes zero sense as a fake claim.

Are you illiterate? I accused House of twisting my words in order to save you. I do not buy that anyone's results were twisted in any way.

In games without Cops, Framer/Tailor variants can exist that alter results given to other investigative roles (such as Tracker).

[/size]

OK. Still not buying that that's what happened.

The fact the Titus wagon skyrocketed to L-1 should speak to her alignment, for those of you who actually think past your emotions.

I think, given the circumstances, it's understandable.

[StrangerCoug]

sicne TWIE is either scum or just dense, everyone lets do an activity:

why is titus scum outside of "she tracked the fbi to the kill"?

since house is also cliam to be a pr why dont we just have her track him?

From what I get, Titus's problem is that her claims don't match up with Hostile Intent's claims, and HI is now known to have told the truth about his role. She is trying to bail herself out by claiming framer shenanigans, and I just plain don't see it. She's confscum.

Additionally, we're not having Titus track House whether she lives to tonight or not since he all but confessed he's her scumbuddy and has actively tried to stall her lynch.

[StrangerCoug]

Let's get the ball moving, guys. Nothing's going to make me happy except a dead Titus right now.

[StrangerCoug]

I understand your concern, but we have caught scum on our hands and she needs to go.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm not seeing a convincing reason to keep Jackal around, either.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE: House

Should be clear from Day 3 why I suspect him to be Titus's scumbuddy. If anybody wants me to reiterate, I will.

[StrangerCoug]

One question, and I'm sorry if it's already been asked, but if this is multiball, is the other not town aligned with town faction those in blue or do we think the blue are also town, just PR towns?

The OP pretty clearly states they're town PR's.

Too early in the Garmr-Ankamius argument to make a call, but it comes off weird in general—I'm not getting anything except they're slinging mud at each other. Expect me to keep an eye on both of them.

[StrangerCoug]

That was in reference to the argument itself. I do not currently consider you a lynch option.

[StrangerCoug]

That was in reference to the argument itself. I do not currently consider you a lynch option.

Ok so what are your lynch options.

Currently just House right now. I do not rely on meta to scumhunt, so that's why I have not jumped on pirate mollie.

Too early in the Garmr-Ankamius argument to make a call, but it comes off weird in general—I'm not getting anything except they're slinging mud at each other. Expect me to keep an eye on both of them.

I don't understand what this post was meant to accomplish.

It gets my thoughts out there! What else do you think it's meant to accomplish?

That would make sense since most mods don't allow scum to use their role

and

kill unless they are the last one standing.

Apparently, I am not "most mods".

The OP pretty clearly states they're town PR's.

Call me stupid or blind, but I fail to see where the OP pretty clearly states they are town PR's. Based on flips, I think it makes the most sense, but....we have an SK hunter (useful for a scum faction) and a time bomb (useful for a scum faction as well).

Could you be a dear and direct me to what you see that I'm missing that might clarify this up for me?

Already taken care of by d3x, but I'll happily oblige anyway:

Hostile Intent was Andy Murray, FBI Agent lynched day 2

Assuming non-bastard mod, power roles can pretty safely be assumed to be town unless otherwise specified.

TSO was Hitler, Town Bomb, killed night 3

Explicitly given to be town. The shade is different from the FBI agent but I don't think mods would be using similar colors for opposing factions.

[StrangerCoug]

YOU

are posting fluff that is not helping

ME

. That's what it's saying.

[StrangerCoug]

I still really do not understand your case on Garmr, so no.

[StrangerCoug]

Is everybody ignoring how House attempted to outright stall the Titus lynch!?

[StrangerCoug]

So bomb is kinda like PGO? I have never seen that pr before.

Will look carefully at the VCA when I am on my computer.

Bomb kills whoever kills them.

This. It's rare in my experience but I've used it from time to time.

[StrangerCoug]

PeregrineV can go into my town pile for the moment for his recent posts to House.

[StrangerCoug]

PeregrineV can go into my town pile for the moment for his recent posts to House.

I swear there has to be metrics that show scum posting goes like this

Whom are you attacking in this post and what is its point?

[StrangerCoug]

OK, so it's in support of my stance (which proposes House-scum).

[StrangerCoug]

I also hate that House is getting so much hate for ATEing when Mollie is doing the same thing.

I've seriously considered lynching House since Day 3 and I have no memory of accusing him of ATE. I have a bigger concern about his connections to Titus, as I've been saying.

OK, so it's in support of my stance (which proposes House-scum).

Only if you are comfortable painting everything to suit your bias.

Who the fuck wants to keep posting in a game when they are tunneled as scum right out the gate for no good reason?

What makes you think I care about whether you want to keep posting? At the very least, explain why you thought defending Titus was a good idea. It doesn't matter whether I'm right or wrong; resigning to your own lynch hurts your own side. If you have a scum agenda to be as useless as possible until you die, then by all means be my guest, but otherwise you need to step it up if you want to live.

[StrangerCoug]

What the fuck makes you think I give a damn about living?

Nothing, and I have a problem with that.

[StrangerCoug]

SC if you want a PL, just stop trying to mislynch me as scum and admit it's a PL.

Forget it. You want to keep up this act, fine. I know what you are anyway.

I don't care about living either.

the only reason I have not replaced out is cos jason is having a hard time finding replacements. it is a shitty game and a bunch of people were allowed to lurk the living fuck out of it. I have been saying for ages plz lynch me cos it will force garmr to do something otherwise than masturbate to the fantasy of my lynch.

house is whining about being death tunneled while I have been death tunneled like no other player in this fucking game. enjoyment was sucked out long ago I wish I could just be lynched and put out of misery.[/quote]
What makes you different is that you're not caught scum in my eyes (though I want to know what the hell you're doing, too). Quite honestly, I don't get what the wagon on you is about. You're SK? For what, exactly? Secret meta says you're scum? Why should I, the kind of player who screws meta in the butt, care about that?

I ain't afraid of no sk.

VOTE: Mollie

Hey SC, come regale us with stories of how this makes me scum!

Nah, I've got plenty already from your Titus connections.

[StrangerCoug]

You want a new record? Sure. Somebody pushing mollie is scum.

[StrangerCoug]

Fix your autocorrect, man.

[StrangerCoug]

Not lynching House

He is most clearly Town player here. Scum just doesn't hard defend a sinking ship like that

Not caught Titus-scum, I take it?

[StrangerCoug]

I do, however.

[StrangerCoug]

That is your prerogative, but it doesn't make the quoted post make any more sense

Then who or what was the "sinking ship"?

[StrangerCoug]

...I'm actually down for lynching Formerfish for #3595. That seems like an arbitrary reason to justify lynching pirate mollie, to whose lynch I am opposed.

UNVOTE: House
VOTE: Formerfish

[StrangerCoug]

SC if that were the only reason then sure. However, its not the only reason. Just me pointing out what I dislike about her most recent post. She is coming off fake as fuck with her poor me posting and deserves to hang.

House has also gone "poor me" and is also under suspicion; what do you make of him?

Serious question: when I flip town, what'll you guys do next?

What's the point of this question?

[StrangerCoug]

And the question is a legit question. Say I am already dead, now what?

I really do not foresee your alignment making much of a difference in how I approach the game after your death as I don't have you connected to anyone. Hence why I asked what the point of the question was. I interpreted it as an implicit attempt to scare people off your lynch, which is a pretty dirty trick.

Now go bus House.

[StrangerCoug]

I think there are scummier people than Ankamius but I'm not going to vouch for his towniness.

[StrangerCoug]

Oh, don't get me wrong—your case is the main reason I don't plan on saving him.

[StrangerCoug]

And that is unjustified because?

[StrangerCoug]

Oh, so I am supposed to exist in a vacuum. OK.

[StrangerCoug]

Then why do you think I am looking for outside justification for your lynch? Yes, you look suspicious to me, but I'm more likely to lynch Formerfish or House given the current state. It's a little late at night for me to fetch the post I said I would do this, but I do remember saying I'd look at the argument between you and Garmr, and Garmr's come out on top.

[StrangerCoug]

Then why do your posts look so jagged? You state the same point twice in the first post

I don't see how I'm doing that. They're about the same topic, but they're not the same exact thing.

and your mention about 'saving' me makes no sense with that reasoning at all.

Why is it weird in that context? If I refuse to vouch for your towniness, then it naturally follows that I won't defend you if you become a viable lynch. It's implicit that I would therefore support it.

[StrangerCoug]

Your 'saving' point doesn't make any sense because if you have to put that you think I'm scummy that many times, why would you you feel the need to save me from that situation in the first place?

I said I

WOULDN'T

, silly! Read!

I am the cop.

Night1: StrangerCoug is town
Night2: IamInnocent is scum
Night3: Nero is scum

Buying.

UNVOTE: Formerfish
VOTE: Nero

[StrangerCoug]

If I bite the dust tonight since I'm the only claimed innocent, my scumreads besides Nero Cain are House, Formerfish, and to a lesser extent Ankamius.

[StrangerCoug]

And now back to your regularly scheduled programming.

VOTE: Formerfish unless the cop has another guilty to give us.

[StrangerCoug]

Why the need to be so patronizing?

[StrangerCoug]

Why the need to be so patronizing?

Seriously, dude?

Yeah, seriously. You have a problem?

Because I replace into a game where my preds did next to nothing and get shit on as soon as I start posting because I have an unfavorable opinion about a certain player. Because no matter what I say I am going to get scum read. No case I put together or read I give is going to mean a thing.

Then make it mean something. You may be cleared by PV when he chimes in, but until then it's not going to look good on you to lash out at seemingly the slightest provocation when people say/imply they have a scumread on you.

[StrangerCoug]

...Yeah. I'd consider it bastard if there's a Mafia role that can mess with flips.

[StrangerCoug]

vote garmr

I wouldn't vote Garmr so fast even though 1.) I haven't been specifically SK-hunting and 2.) for pirate mollie to be the SK, her self-vote would have to have been a WIFOM tactic (it would be nigh impossible for her to win if her lynch actually went through). The cop is still alive and the Mafia kill is unaccounted for.

[StrangerCoug]

I refuse to believe anti-town is 4-1-20. That's ridiculous.

I don't find it that likely either. The point I was making is that I can see how Garmr drew the conclusion he did.

[StrangerCoug]

We have only one kill, most likely from the SK. It would make a lot of sense for the Mafia to kill the cop, but that's not what happened. Garmr's theory is plausible in my eyes, but the operative word here is "plausible"—he did not give conclusive proof that pirate mollie us the SK. And self-voting like pirate mollie did is not a sound move to be doing as SK with only one other kill (excluding the bomb, since the bomb cannot pick its own target). So that's why I didn't jump on mollie. For the same reason, I don't think House is the SK, either.

[StrangerCoug]

If there's a mafia member left, then they're probably alone. That means they're an ad hoc SK, but without Cop immunity or night kill immunity, and with associative tells/PoE against them.

SK is a larger threat to Town now

plz tell me how an sk is more of a threat than an ad hoc sole scum person.

like I am really interested.

and then I want you to go revisit perv's posit that there are about 6 or 7 scum.

and THEN I want you to go revisit the nks cos you obvsly didn't read my post I mean garmr has been trying to paint me as sk for 2 MONTHS. when the evidence points to the contrary unless jason did fuckery with flavour of the nks.

SC CLD YOU PLZ COMMENT ON THAT? I KNOW YOU MOD I AM TRYING TO DRAW ON YOUR MOD EXPERIENCE COS I AM NOT A MOD!!!!

In most of my games, each kill faction gets a theme to their MO's. I specifically try to avoid the exact same one twice in a game in most of my games. Jason may not mod the same way, so what may work for determining the presence of an SK in my games may fail in his (and vice versa). So I really can't give you a one-size-fits-all solution.

Yeah, I'm allergic to stupidity and that question made me break out in gives.

With all the shit fish has been getting, it's not rocket surgery why he has attitude.

I'd be damned to hell as a liar if I said there were never times town got frustrated. The point I was making is that treating us like crap is not how you convince someone that you do happen to be town.

[StrangerCoug]

Show where I've said it was a scumtell.

[StrangerCoug]

Show where I've said it was a scumtell.

Show where I said you said it's a scumtell.

Then why did you feel the need to tell me that treating people like crap is not a scumtell? I acknowledge it isn't.

[StrangerCoug]

The bomb was not "executed" and most mods would give the Mafia teams different names in a multiball. So I don't buy a second scumteam.

[StrangerCoug]

I am not liking td or sc at this point. mostly sc. td keeps using strange phrasing.

What don't you like about me?

[StrangerCoug]

I'm good with Garmr's plan. Don't lynch before we get the cop results in, but keep the information coming.

[StrangerCoug]

I need to get ready for bed but I have a bad gut vibe about Pine.

[StrangerCoug]

OK, now I'm starting to get the feeling she is playing the fool. Garmr basically sums up my concerns in #4014, and I also question why TSO "likely" blew up AJ when a bomb is a triggered role—her wording makes it sound like she's confusing it for the vengeful townie. I swear I've been in games when she's been better on the ball than this.

FoS: pirate mollie

[StrangerCoug]

"She" is pirate mollie, by the way. I wasn't responding to Garmr but he was talking about her in the post before mine.

[StrangerCoug]

you argued with me about light switches and srsly it doesn't get any dumber than that (acknowledging it took 2). I had you as town so much that i risked a fake hider claim AS TOWN. you are making the same mistake in that game that you are making here which is pursuing dumb avenues of thought (if you are town. if you are scum, carry on).

The light switches argument stemmed from a misunderstanding of the mechanics as laid out by the mod of that game, and I remember having how that mechanic worked correct. For what you are arguing to hold here, two things have to be true: 1.) the FBI has to be a red herring and 2.) the mod has to be using nonstandard versions of roles. Right now it's a stretch to believe that.

[StrangerCoug]

you argued with me about light switches and srsly it doesn't get any dumber than that (acknowledging it took 2). I had you as town so much that i risked a fake hider claim AS TOWN. you are making the same mistake in that game that you are making here which is pursuing dumb avenues of thought (if you are town. if you are scum, carry on).

The light switches argument stemmed from a misunderstanding of the mechanics as laid out by the mod of that game, and I remember having how that mechanic worked correct. For what you are arguing to hold here, two things have to be true: 1.) the FBI has to be a red herring and 2.) the mod has to be using nonstandard versions of roles. Right now it's a stretch to believe that.

you are trying to hold me to a static interpretation of the game. if you were town I feel like you wld at least entertain the possibility that I was right given ALL of the fucking nks have been done by a sk and only 2 (ignoring the bomb situ of aj) by scum? like

really

?

like nobody is addressing this except td and all he said was "oh xkills!!!".

You are ignoring the possibility of roles that can prevent a Mafia kill. Maybe they tried to kill a BP, maybe their kill target was saved by a doc or some other similar protection role, maybe they got blocked. (Another possibility is a missed deadline but in my modding experience that's rare.) Only the mod really knows right now. I am not holding you to a static interpretation of the game; you are holding yourself to a static interpretation of the game.

[StrangerCoug]

You are ignoring the possibility of roles that can prevent a Mafia kill. Maybe they tried to kill a BP, maybe their kill target was saved by a doc or some other similar protection role, maybe they got blocked. (Another possibility is a missed deadline but in my modding experience that's rare.) Only the mod really knows right now. I am not holding you to a static interpretation of the game; you are holding yourself to a static interpretation of the game.

you are proposing a scenario where scum only got in what 2 nks?

Yep!

Why would we ignore the bomb going off? Scum targeted tso, they died for the pick. Seems pretty simple to me. How do you think the bomb worked in this game? It seems like you are trying to act like he had a suicide vest on and went after AJ.

This is part of why I accused pirate mollie of "playing the fool". I can't see her ignorance of easily discernible facts as anything but contrived.

[StrangerCoug]

People need to stop attributing super human skill here with the missing night kills.

Who is "attributing super human skill" to the kills that are unaccounted for?

This game, in general, is set up for this to happen from time to time.

How do you know this?

[StrangerCoug]

And I meant the game of mafia in general, not this game specifically.

OK, that's out of the way.

[StrangerCoug]

Isn't it lovely that my two top scumreads are both hotheads?

I disagree with Kise on Garmr but don't think he's scummy.

[StrangerCoug]

Will someone please explain Garmr-scum to me?

[StrangerCoug]

Of course I'm serious, pirate mollie. Why else would I ask the question?

[StrangerCoug]

Of course I'm serious, pirate mollie. Why else would I ask the question?

he thinks kise is the doc and he just pointed it out.

I can see it as antitown but I think Garmr-scum would be subtler than that even with the encryptor dead.

[StrangerCoug]

If Garmr is scum and thinks Kise is the doctor he can off him himself. It's disadvantageous as both alignments to announce who you think are power roles out loud—as town, you help scum, and as scum, you risk drawing unwanted attention to yourself. I'm going to need more convincing than that to dispose of my Garmr-town read.

[StrangerCoug]

If Garmr is scum and thinks Kise is the doctor he can off him himself. It's disadvantageous as both alignments to announce who you think are power roles out loud—as town, you help scum, and as scum, you risk drawing unwanted attention to yourself. I'm going to need more convincing than that to dispose of my Garmr-town read.

stranger kitty, I had uber goober

tell

me why he was leaving me alive in a game once and town STILL wouldn't lynch him. pecan blatantly rolefished majiffy and pointed out that majiffy was a special but nobody wld lynch him cos "it was to obv to come from scum" and then fery did a metadive and decided he was town from it and pecan was endgamed. in that same game mosy faked a posting restriction then forgot about it and no1 wld lynch him cos fery said so. he made it to endgame too. in fact I think all of scum did except for tbone and the only reason that happened was cos I got his entire team to bus him. porkens finally might have gotten lynched but mosy, spyrella and pecan all mopped the floor with town.

I know you have heard the meme that every time some says "scum wld never do that!" some1 gets a scummy.

I am tired. this game has taken the life out of me. it has effected my other games even tho I was on a bit of a mafia high after reck and I winning as town in a recent micro. I am also still on a bit of a high cos I cam in second place when i hadn't played before and the only reason i lost to reck his dummy neighbour stacked science cards when reck said at the beginning of the game "guys I get a point for every science card played!" but losing to reck is forgiveable he has played the game a bunch of times. granted quadzypants is an excellent teacher and i definitely paid attention when he wld explain things to me. felt kind of bad when i beat him so badly.

I have played a looooooooooot of larges and i see town make the same mistakes over and over again. it is frustrating. you are saying garmr is town cos his town game is shitty and garmr is agreeing with you there is mistake about it calling out who you think the doc is is shitty. mebbe he is town I dunno i was mostly helping kise but after that callout garmr needs to go. if garmr is town the only way he is going to get better is if they get lynched for bad play. personally I think garmr is scum cos I wld like to think that he is better than this. but i also think pine looks scummier cos he is sheeping a bad case and is trying to pretend that it is an established fact. plus how aj was acting towards garmr too but i noticed that nero completely stayed away from him and that makes me go hhhhmmm.

I am still not certain about you, I am used to you being a stronger presence and while you are posting a good amount i am just not feeling your presence. but in case you are town i am trying to reach to you and move you in. you ignored my reach outs in playing cards and you saw what happened there. ffs I mean my townread on you was so strong i fake hid behind you and pie STILL lynched you.

so consider this an official reach out.

It is one antitown thing. I think it's a little extreme to be lynching Garmr over one antitown thing. Now, if Garmr starts acting legitimately scummy, I'll reconsider my stance, but as things currently stand, forget it.

[StrangerCoug]

@SC, I just traded with Garmr all yesterday+last night. I think my points about him and Nero are less liquid than him calling me doc.

OK, I see what you're talking about in #4104.

[StrangerCoug]

I get the feeling that Formerfish-scum clears pirate mollie, even from SK suspicion.

[StrangerCoug]

And town me? Cause that's going to happen.

Town-you isn't likely to change my reads on other people much. Right now the only way I'm seeing mollie-SK is if Garmr is scum (though pirate mollie isn't exactly excluded from being Mafia in my eyes—I haven't specifically been looking for an SK and have previously mentioned why I don't think she's it), and while I now understand where other people are coming from as regards him I think his townier posts outweigh his scummier posts at this point. The House-scum read, while still there, has drastically weakened over the course of the day and is now pretty much interchangeable with Ankamius.

[StrangerCoug]

I am still concerned about your connections with Titus. At this point you two are both on the scum side of neutral.

[StrangerCoug]

I am still concerned about your connections with Titus. At this point you two are both on the scum side of neutral.

You still didn't answer my question.

Why has your scum read of me drastically weakened over the course of the day?

You should have been clearer with your question—I thought you were asking me why I still thought you were scum at all, not why my read has weakened. The latter is because bigger fish have come up to fry right now with Formerfish and pirate mollie.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE: TiphaineDeath

Only vote that makes sense right now.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE: TiphaineDeath

Only vote that makes sense right now.

really

TiphaineDeath is the only living player other than TheWayItEnds currently in the neighborhood. TWIE claims d3x claimed doc in the neighborhood, and the next night, he died. This is a heavy indicator that someone in the neighborhood is scum, and there's evidence that TWIE isn't the scum in the neighborhood we're looking for. I'm iffy about the Kthxbye wagon, especially given the likely number of remaining Mafiosi—it reads like a desperate Mafia counterwagon to me.

[StrangerCoug]

Serial Killer (bulletproof?)

vs

Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Tailor
???

vs

Town Bomb
Town Doctor
Town Cop
Town FBI Agent
Town Neighborizor

I'm starting to wonder if a massclaim is viable here. If this is all the power town has, I'm reasonably sure we're dealing with a bulletproof SK and another goon or two. Pooooossibly a mafia bulletproof/watcher/?

I think we have plenty of time before we even need to worry about massclaiming.

[StrangerCoug]

That avenue of discussion has pretty much been resolved already.

Do you have reads outside of TD?

You still, and you fit the "pushing the counterwagon" criterion.

[StrangerCoug]

That's 1/5 of the playerlist that isn't you.

There's a higher proportion than that among the dead players that were scum, and by raw numbers we should be past the halfway point. Keep that in mind when you imply that I don't have enough suspects.

Any more?

There's pirate mollie's stuff from before she replaced out. Her replacement is still my number two.

[StrangerCoug]

Oh, I still care. I have nothing new to add, but I still care.

[StrangerCoug]

Town have probably have no roles that would be a danger to her

What leads you to this conclusion?

[StrangerCoug]

Why haven't you addressed any of my posts since I replaced in? I've been waiting, you know

I must have missed them; could you point me to them?

[StrangerCoug]

@sc
because if town had something that could pick up both mafia and sk then there would be no need for fbi agents.

True in itself, but not a satisfactory answer to my question, even if I factor in that the FBI agent is dead.

Why haven't you addressed any of my posts since I replaced in? I've been waiting, you know

I must have missed them; could you point me to them?

All of them?
I thought you had problems with pirate Mollie when she replaced out, why not engage at all with her replacement? Or comment on my exchange with garmr?

Your question led me to believe that you had a question outstanding that I needed to answer.

The major problem I had with her I described in #4016. She continually tried to push the idea that the Mafia couldn't have possibly missed two kills when there was already plenty of evidence to the contrary, and she pretty clearly (pretended that she, from my point of view) didn't know how the bomb role works. I can understand frustration clouding people's thinking but I don't think her mistakes are innocent. I haven't seen you do anything scummy on your own but it's going to take a lot of work out of you to improve my read on your slot. That said, to answer your other question, I think Garmr is losing his arguments with both you and TWIE, and he is

SLOWLY

starting to creep up into my scumlist as a result. Somebody to watch, but I'm hanging onto my vote.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm winning my argument with twie actually read what his proposing.

I'm not convinced anything's wrong with it.

[StrangerCoug]

I hate to break it to you, Garmr, but you're spamming the thread with the what and not exactly making the why clear to me.

so sc are you saying that the sk wants to shoot the dr when he/she could be picking better targets when he knows that while inspector/dr combo is around knowing that the mafia are in desperate search of that dr?

The doctor is going to be messing around with kills from

ANYBODY

.

your saying that sk wants to risk a cross kill and maybe another day votes?

Even if SK is gunning for Mafia to better his/her chances of making it out alive, there's still the town lynches to dodge.

your saying that mafia would put themselves in a bad position when they probably weren't going to be voted or lynched just to get sk to shoot someone that they could shoot themselves? Also if they do a tracker/watcher your saying they would say that dr is this person when they know the real dr is dex when they could just shoot dex and not have town suspect them in anyway the next day?

I'm so glad that this confusing mess is really just a WIFOM argument. I'm not even going to bother sorting out what this says.

[StrangerCoug]

1.Dr is going to protect the inspector for a while and it's not going to mess with sk kills just yet.

It will if the SK tries to kill the cop for some reason. The reason for trying to kill the cop doesn't have to be a good one; doc just has to correctly guess that his target would otherwise die that night.

2.that is not the point i was making the sk didn't shoot the suspected dr. Tell me if your point was reasonable why the sk didn't shoot the dr?

You are asking me to read the SK's mind. I can't do that.

3.That's because you can't you know I'm right and you goofed up lol.

First off, screw your haughty attitude.

Second, you can't simply claim that incomprehensible posts are right. Break it down bit by bit and explain in plain English why each bit is right.

[StrangerCoug]

1.Dr is going to protect the inspector for a while and it's not going to mess with sk kills just yet.

It will if the SK tries to kill the cop for some reason. The reason for trying to kill the cop doesn't have to be a good one; doc just has to correctly guess that his target would otherwise die that night.

The sk wasn't trying to kill the cop Sk and my guess is sk would target the dr latter rather than sooner. If the sk gets cleared be the cop as not mafia that would be beneficial for the sk. Your reaching man.

I am talking in a general sense. If the doc were to instead protect the FBI agent and the SK were to try to kill that, the doctor would still succeed in "messing around with" the SK's kill. So my point about the doctor's power still stands. Yes, the SK probably has some brains. That was never the point of my argument.

2.that is not the point i was making the sk didn't shoot the suspected dr. Tell me if your point was reasonable why the sk didn't shoot the dr?

You are asking me to read the SK's mind. I can't do that.

It's not hard of stretch to guess my answer is the best one by ohm's razor that sk obviously isn't to concerned with dr at the moment.[/quote]
Then explain why your answer is the best. I'm not going to blindly take the word of somebody I disagree with.

3.That's because you can't you know I'm right and you goofed up lol.

First off, screw your haughty attitude.

I feel confident you weren't reading the points and just agreeing with him because you thought it would flow that way in the future your trying to predict the flow with out looking at the reasoning or the now.[/quote]
And I feel confident that you suck at explaining why I shouldn't be agreeing with him. You're doing only half your job—you're pulling points from his posts that you disagree with, as you should be, but you're expecting me to understand that it is self-evident why his posts are bad. It isn't. Hence why I'm trying to push you for the reasoning.

I am asking you the question of why I would put myself in a bad position when I was in great one.

Which is classic WIFOM. Q.E.D.

[StrangerCoug]

the doctor power really hasn't came into effect yet

And it never will, since the doctor is also dead. Are you even paying attention?

Then find a better answer for me to compare it with. You haven't yet so obviously weren't prepared for this and wasn't expecting me to call you out on it.

I have not given you a better answer for you to compare it with because you do not need one to do as I have been asking. Do not say stuff you cannot back up. This should be a basic scumhunting rule.

It shows I don't care about my survival so much if you want town reasoning lol.

Good, because you've now surpassed Nachomamma's slot for my number two scumread. Keep it up and you'll have me convinced that the obvious answer as to who shot the doc is very likely to be the wrong answer.

Beside most of twie points are borderline wifom or useless. Like him trying to say I wanted sk in persific to shoot kise is wifom in it's self.

And what, exactly, gives you the right to pull the same tactic?

[StrangerCoug]

Also don't give me that cop investigated me there's the possibility that nero cain tailored you or that you are the sk.

Have I even

TOUCHED

the tailor topic before this post?

[StrangerCoug]

What I did could easily come from all 3 alignments your trying to prove it's one with out disproving the other 2 thus is wifomy. you try to push that I was reaching out to sk when most scenarios would have me trying to manipulate mafia. Thus what you started with is wifomy and can only get more wifomy. Your arguments go a whole 360 basically it goes

Takes two to tango, now doesn't it?

Seriously, I'd like to hear what other people think about my arguments.

[StrangerCoug]

Do I

LOOK

like TheWayItEnds to you?

[StrangerCoug]

Friday activity always sucks.

Anyways, last night was a guilty on Pine.

Vote: Pine

UNVOTE: TiphaineDeath
VOTE: Pine

Umm, no

Guilty on me is NOT actually possible. Peregrine V, I resent this gambit, you're going to get me killed for no good reason

...Is this post even worth my time and consideration? Why would a confirmed cop gambit!?

[StrangerCoug]

. She continually tried to push the idea that the Mafia couldn't have possibly missed two kills when there was already plenty of evidence to the contrary

I might be biased, considering I'm inhabiting her slot and all, but I don't actually think this is scummy. I think it would be pretty insane for an SK to be like "guys, there's no SK at all" when there very clearly is.

Show where I said pirate mollie said there was no SK. Also, I've actually advocated

AGAINST

your slot being SK given pirate mollie going into self-destruct mode.

she pretty clearly (pretended that she, from my point of view) didn't know how the bomb role works.

I think aj was sent to do the nk and that is why she was blown up

Is this not how the bomb role works?

OK, looking at pirate mollie's posts again, I'm going to drop that I think pirate mollie's not understanding the bomb role was feigned. Her posts line up closer to the bomb being an unfamiliar role to her, and it's not a common role in my experience (though one I've used on occasion).

Hmm. Kise might be scum after all. Mostly a gut feeling. There's no reason to put me back to L-1 unless he's hoping someone will quick hammer to deny Peregrine V's actual result

Why would a cop gambit by lying about who he investigated? It's something that can easily backfire if his "investigation" turns out to be wrong.

[StrangerCoug]

The possibility certainly exists that you are being bussed and that PV's days are numbered, but I'm still not seeing how the benefits of gambiting outweigh the risks. If you flip town, then so long as you're not miller, then either PeregrineV is exposed as scum or scum can use your mislynch as a launching board to get him mislynched as well.

[StrangerCoug]

First off, I didn't say

PV

was bussing you. One of my suspects, Garmr, was on your wagon post-investigation claim and unvoted to prevent an accidental hammer. Second, it makes little sense for me as scum to accuse my buddy of bussing by means of a faked investigation and voting his claimed guilty anyway.