Micro 895: Think Twice (Thanks for Playing!)

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Hello

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Stay positive friends

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Also gimme a hot sec to catch up I only /in’d bc I like the pl

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Also lol @whoever mislynched saudade

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Welcome to Micro 895!

Error 2095: Flavor not found

Spoiler: Playerlist (5/5)

• Saudade -
  Vanilla Townie
  
  
• eth0s
  
• NotMySpamAccount
  
• Volpe14
  
• tris

Spoiler: Events

this will probably never get updated just so you know

why are u like this

pls update the playerlist even if events never will be

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Did you know that out of all the universes, our universe has the lowest possible value for the number Pi?

what?

https://math.stanford.edu/~vakil/files/07-0333.pdf

this literally makes no sense, can u explain in plain English

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also past me was dumb bc why would u vote tris on p4 when she's already p clearly not gf

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incidentally it's bc she wasn't trying hard enough to look like town making her either town or goon, but the fact that she wasn't gonna be gf was a bad decision past me

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Replacing NotMySpamAccount.

anyone know if NMSA has established meta on preferring town or scum?

alternatively if he dislikes fast games?

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eth0s is either the most transparent player in the game or i can't read him at this current time

I don't get this, you're saying transparent town here?

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eth0s is either the most transparent player in the game or i can't read him at this current time

how transparent?

good q

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Quickhammering is also equal to getting insta-lynched in Day 2 regardless of flips so no /funsies

idk not a huge fan of this post and then later unvoting saudade while still calling him out

(1) if someone hammered THAT early in the game i think the flip would actually have been pretty good for reading the hammerer. Why would scum lynch their own buddy that early on?

If the answer is "to gain towncred" okay fine. And maybe that would work. But in a state where nothing at that point had really earned anyone town/scumpings (in my opinion) I just don't see a scum making that kind of play for towncred.

(2) If anything a future saudade flip should implicate me more for my intention to hammer post than a saudade scumflip should have if I quickhammered.

As far as the tinfoil idea that pops into my mind of a volpe/saudade team goes, I wouldnt think goon!volpe would even put gf!saudade to L-1.

But I do think that gf!volpe would potentially put goon!saudade to L-1 there and plan on pushing any potential hammerer the next day with some wifomy logic.

Aside from this paranoid situation I think volpe seems town in a vacuum. And saudade can be town for now until I figure out what the big deal about him is.

(1) I'm p sure I've seen a mini or marathon-mini where that's literally exactly what scum did and they won bc everyone said "oh but scum would never lolhammer their buddy in their first post"

(2) what?

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Quickhammering is also equal to getting insta-lynched in Day 2 regardless of flips so no /funsies

idk not a huge fan of this post and then later unvoting saudade while still calling him out

if someone hammered THAT early in the game i think the flip would actually have been pretty good for reading the hammerer. Why would scum lynch their own buddy that early on?

But, on the other hand, if town quickhammers town there, they'll probably get lynched the next day, and we'll lose. Kind of like what happened in the game we were in together.

As far as the tinfoil idea that pops into my mind of a volpe/saudade team goes, I wouldnt think goon!volpe would even put gf!saudade to L-1.[/quote]
not even with a warning not to hammer?

Aside from this paranoid situation I think volpe seems town in a vacuum. And saudade can be town for now until I figure out what the big deal about him is.

why does he get to be town rather than null?

Not loving elements so far.

why's that?
in my case, i like how he's approached his read on me so far

No one should particularly love me either since I have one real post and it revolves around tinfoil. So I'll give elements the benefit of the doubt since I don't really feel much to respond to either.

However I want him to keep true to 116 rather than just wait around to "be impressed" I guess you could say.

VOTE: elements

didn't he follow up on that in 119?

tris is my null read but my gut leans scum on that overall

Disregard this completely. I thought this was similar to scum!tris play in micro 883 but it is actually like polar opposite I think.

For context that is my only game with her before this one (I think)

what was that thing? unless you're holding it back to try to continue to read me.

She can be town for now too. But I would like more activity from her as well. Now that we are all here and at least posted some sort of opinions I'd like to know if anything particularly sticks out to them so far.

I don't think a read list is necessarily needed but any perceived meta changes/similarities, valid/invalid points, basically just anything to help form reads and get the ball rolling would be nice.

now, that you've allowed 3 people to be town, which do you think is actually scum?

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this is goodposting from tris

I like that she's calling out the same thing there that bothered me and that she's calling out the slightly excessive TRing for that point in the game

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lol eth0s have u rolled scum with ele twice in a row

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Aside from this paranoid situation I think volpe seems town in a vacuum. And saudade can be town for now until I figure out what the big deal about him is.

why does he get to be town rather than null?

which one

feel like ur being intentionally oblivious here eth0s

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Quickhammering is also equal to getting insta-lynched in Day 2 regardless of flips so no /funsies

idk not a huge fan of this post and then later unvoting saudade while still calling him out

(1) if someone hammered THAT early in the game i think the flip would actually have been pretty good for reading the hammerer. Why would scum lynch their own buddy that early on?

If the answer is "to gain towncred" okay fine. And maybe that would work. But in a state where nothing at that point had really earned anyone town/scumpings (in my opinion) I just don't see a scum making that kind of play for towncred.

(2) If anything a future saudade flip should implicate me more for my intention to hammer post than a saudade scumflip should have if I quickhammered.

As far as the tinfoil idea that pops into my mind of a volpe/saudade team goes, I wouldnt think goon!volpe would even put gf!saudade to L-1.

But I do think that gf!volpe would potentially put goon!saudade to L-1 there and plan on pushing any potential hammerer the next day with some wifomy logic.

Aside from this paranoid situation I think volpe seems town in a vacuum. And saudade can be town for now until I figure out what the big deal about him is.

(1) I'm p sure I've seen a mini or marathon-mini where that's literally exactly what scum did and they won bc everyone said "oh but scum would never lolhammer their buddy in their first post"

(2) what?

(2) is me saying that I typically disagree with the logic of "scum would quickhammer their buddy there" so a saudade scumflip should implicate me more for my intention to hammer post than it should've if I hammered him there

I mean, I think scum would consider it if they thought it would get them to endgame

I think impulsive scum would just do it

you're not impulsive scum, so the fact that you intended doesn't rly say anything about your AI imo?

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Aside from this paranoid situation I think volpe seems town in a vacuum. And saudade can be town for now until I figure out what the big deal about him is.

why does he get to be town rather than null?

which one

feel like ur being intentionally oblivious here eth0s

why would scum want to be intentionally oblivious towards a question they ask a counter question for

I literally don't know what you're saying

"towards a question they ask a counter question for"

what?

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lol eth0s have u rolled scum with ele twice in a row

you're his scummate so no

well I mean I'm leaning town on tris so I kinda think you are

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i don't know what you mean by transparent in this context?

As in obviously town or scum.
It was more of a post directed at eth0s.
Having skimmed a few pages I have discovered he is not.

@tris and elements

oh. I misread this. I thought he was talking about this game having not read it yet or something.

Tbh I would call myself the opposite of a transparent player.

And not because I'm really good at appearing town when I'm scum. More because I'm just bad at this game as either alignment

I mean MMRT is pretty contradictory of this

does elements call you out on that after it finishes?

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saudade would be my scum guess because volpe is townier than him in a vacuum

you stay town for pretty much just meta reasons, but your questions towards me were decent too

lol, tris do u TR eth0s

if it started after this little exchange can u lmk if his pocket is comfortable and warm or..?

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Mena you're picking the wrong person to try and mislynch here

lol okay

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haha its eth0s and element for scum

prob yes

why did u people mislynch saudade again?

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that wild guess aside tris why does it feel like you're asking questions for the sake of asking them?

My experience with town tris is that she asks lots of questions which I've already said and she's picked up on. So is it town tris in this scenario or scum tris trying to look town with questions. I'm going for the latter given there have been so many non question posts from her.
VOTE: tris

oof

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vc here

this went well huh chem

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holy fuck tris I thought I was high when I saw your profile picture change to a cat

I mean same tbh

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I'll give this game the love it deserves...

probably.

seriously am I going to hard carry this thing though?

There's two other people here doing exactly nothing they should be doing right now?

big oof past me, why would you do this

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here's a hot take:

Gun to my head tris has the most town equity rn. I don't think she is particularly towny but she's the best looking slot for me

better, past me, better

now unvote

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Anyone disagrees with that?

if yes why?

I think I understand where town!you would feel that way but I'm not sure I agree. Saudade kinda beat me to it but I have other reasons to be less certain on tris now

oh maybe you weren't trying to pocket tris after all but show ~*progression*~ on her

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VOTE: tris[//.vote]

OH MY GOD FUCKING FAT FINGERS WHAT AM I TO DOo

this isn't super AI but still prob enough to not lynch him D1

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can you hammer element so i can die in peace

oh, is it L-1?

VOTE: elements

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Did you know that out of all the universes, our universe has the lowest possible value for the number Pi?

what?

https://math.stanford.edu/~vakil/files/07-0333.pdf

this literally makes no sense, can u explain in plain English

i can but ill have to summarize two courses of infinitesimals which would cost you some big $ which you dont have

I'll send u nudes

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i don't really see why one of them can't be scum without the other.

yes

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oh wow, p11 and I can see why u wanted to keep pushing me as soon as I repped in eth0s

past me why did you make urself mislynch bait

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tris is my null read but my gut leans scum on that overall

Disregard this completely. I thought this was similar to scum!tris play in micro 883 but it is actually like polar opposite I think.

For context that is my only game with her before this one (I think)

Up until this point you had been playing a pretty damn passive game. Really making mostly joke posts or things just completely devoid of readable content. At first I incorrectly remembered that as being what you did in the miccros game. That was wrong. You played miccros by asking a lot of questions all the time. Like a LOT of questions. Almost every post at least to begin with. And a lot of those questions look pretty pointless in retrospect.

Then shortly after I made my stance on you, your play changed greatly and you start asking a bunch of questions, none of which seem all that important to me.

It feels like you just wanted to let the game state develop before really doing anything, and then once you did do something it heavily reminded me of your scum play.

There is one reason I don't feel this strongly enough to vote you, but it's somewhat conditional. I also think one of volpe/saudade need to go today anyway.

so

get the mislynch in volpe/sau

then push tris ftw D2

solid plan tbf, how's it working out for you

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eth0s your play here is so blatantly manufactured lol

rip town if we lose when you've clearly been setting the game up a v certain way since D1

also nice to see I was right when I said your positioning on tris was to show your ~*progression*~ there

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Like why do I need a plan for post flip? It's an awkward question. Especially in this setup

If you have no thoughts whatsoever about what happens when one of them flips, you saying one of them should flip is an un-grounded statement and it's basically a random lynch. You're better then that. At this point we want the flip that gives us the most information whatever they are given if town they don't die until the next lynch so can help out. Just by saying you want one of them to flip implies you think they give the most information upon flipping, so why you'd deny this I don't know or understand.
VOTE: eth0s

This game needs some spice.
VOTE: saudade

hmm

hmmmm

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the important thing for me is that i townread ethos which leaves you and volpe scum

I mean volpe play was p trash and volpe is not bad scum, which should give you some doubts there

so we're gonna need to talk about this bc I'm p sure you're town at this point and that eth0s has been setting my slot of the game losing mislynch

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I fail to see why lynching town day one in this set up would be such a catastrophe

This

it's not a catastrophe if we then lynch mafia

I think it might be better to lynch town first.
If we lynch scum day 1: One lot of day interactions + wifom on the wagon
If we lynch town day 1 and not GF day 2: 1 confirmed town to help us for a day plus 2 days of interactions and two wagons to look at.

lmao you let elements live another 4 pages after this

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are you saying you intentionally lynched town?

I'm saying it doesn't matter what he flips

yeah ele and tris aren't the same alignment

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Elements literally hasn't mentioned Volpe one or even acknowledged her existence unless you count how he would obviously have to when saying querying me about what my plan is.

it's funny bc I'm p sure that elements spent half his time talking about TL!partner (not sure how much he talked about you tbf) in MMRT so the fact that you're angling this as being indicative of me!scum is a lol when there's meta that this literally isn't a scumtell for him

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You can replace if you want but it's not gonna change my read.

Just because you've efforted harder than Tris in this game on average doesn't make you townier than her.

I see a clear pattern in your motivation whereas my ISOdive on Tris didn't make me feel strongly one way or the other. My gut leaned town but I felt it could go either way.

However with you I don't see any town motivation in your play

oh sweet irony

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Like why do I need a plan for post flip? It's an awkward question. Especially in this setup

If you have no thoughts whatsoever about what happens when one of them flips, you saying one of them should flip is an un-grounded statement and it's basically a random lynch. You're better then that. At this point we want the flip that gives us the most information whatever they are given if town they don't die until the next lynch so can help out. Just by saying you want one of them to flip implies you think they give the most information upon flipping, so why you'd deny this I don't know or understand.
VOTE: eth0s

are you saying you intentionally lynched town?

I would hammer tris over volpe

Volpe just really bad at the game

u think this is town!eth0s?

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idk why the others quoted, I only wanted 369 and 370 there

also you think tris is scummier than past me?

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I am disappoint that u lied to me about the hammer tho saudade

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if mena is town then he thinks he knows how to read me a lot better than he really does

but he's just playing aggro scum

I mean I'm really not, and I'm p sure you've been trying to set me as a mislynch

beyond that, I'm just p confident that tris is town and I was right on her last time I played w/ her too, which makes you scum by default

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I think you've pretty clearly faked an "ooh tris is scummy oh no wait I misremembered this thing LOOK EVERYONE I'M CHANGING MY TRIS READ I'm clearly showing you that tasty PROGRESSION"

the fact that you're relying on this now as a reason to TR you is more reason to be sceptical about it tbh

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I mean I'm obviously being productive and I'm basically out of my scummeta at this point for anyone who wants to check

I think you've deliberately set up the game with a ~*progression*~ on tris to try and get her to TR you for it because she feels like your read has shifted

then you get ele to quick hammer while volpe is on wagon, and you know that means ur gonna have to bus him today

so then you do that, count on tris to read you as town for changing you read on her, and try to get her to hammer me

it's why your "need sau/volpe to go today" thing was bad -- you were setting up around 3p lylo with tris, ele is your partner, so you needed to eliminate one of those two to leave the other as the target

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I mean kudos bc I do think your scum play here is better overall than MMRT and I think it was p good there

I'm just not naive enough to TR you for the same things twice when you're scum, and I think what you've done her plays exactly to your strengths

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I mean tbh I'd rather lynch you today bc I think ele is p obviously goon here but lynching someone other than obvscum is dumb when there's an outlier it could be tris deep wolfing and letting us TvT

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I just don't think that's as likely as you being scum tho

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I mean I'm not gonna town case my predecessor when I disagree with ~50% of their content but that doesn't change the fact that I'm town

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fypov yes, fmpov we should probably lynch eth0s

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Elements literally hasn't mentioned Volpe one or even acknowledged her existence unless you count how he would obviously have to when saying querying me about what my plan is.

it's funny bc I'm p sure that elements spent half his time talking about TL!partner (not sure how much he talked about you tbf) in MMRT so the fact that you're angling this as being indicative of me!scum is a lol when there's meta that this literally isn't a scumtell for him

okay if that's what you think then you should be suspecting tris over me since that was his most interaction by far.

I mean I think you've both been interacting with him and I don't see why I should take that as enough of a reason to override my TR on tris?

and also doesn't explain what is the more significant point which is you trying to push me/ele based on that when you know that ele, for all of his inability to hide being scum, doesn't have that particular scumtell

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I never would have done it saud, rip

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Like why do I need a plan for post flip? It's an awkward question. Especially in this setup

If you have no thoughts whatsoever about what happens when one of them flips, you saying one of them should flip is an un-grounded statement and it's basically a random lynch. You're better then that. At this point we want the flip that gives us the most information whatever they are given if town they don't die until the next lynch so can help out. Just by saying you want one of them to flip implies you think they give the most information upon flipping, so why you'd deny this I don't know or understand.
VOTE: eth0s

are you saying you intentionally lynched town?

I would hammer tris over volpe

Volpe just really bad at the game

u think this is town!eth0s?

again you just shade me instead of challenging what I said whatsoever

this isn't even me shading you, I think I'd been p clear that I thought you were scum by this point I wanted to know what the conf!town was thinking

like you're deliberately choosing to interpret that as shade when it just isn't

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if you're actually town eth0s then you need to stop and work with me instead of just pushing one angle on me bc rn I can't see myself voting tris over you

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like volpe's play wasn't good but I'm p sure I'm already out of my scum range here and if you're actually town you should be able to see that and stop just pursuing me

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it's textbook shading and if you're actually town here you're being so dense it's ridiculous

how is it shading when it's literally clear that I was SRing you already at that point?

shading is like casting suspicion on someone

if I say "oh, I think X is scum" and then ask someone "hey, why don't you think X is scum?" that's not shading because my position and what I want people to do is already clear

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you've read every single post I made this game with the assumption that I'm scum and you're just looking for reasons to scumread me

that is patently untrue

I came into the game catching up and knowing that saud was an IC and that meant there were two scum between (you, ele, tris)

I got to the point where I was increasingly confident on town!tris and that strongly implied scum!you so I read with that in mind

saying I came in deathtunneling you is false

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you're doing EXACTLY what you're accusing me of doing

no I'm pretty obviously not

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I think town you would at least be thinking here but instead you're just gonna keep pushing me without even raising the possibility to yourself that tris could be deepwolfing here and letting a TvT blow up

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like I'm trying to re-evaluate now that ele is conf!scum from no-one celebrating but you're just making it really hard :/

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I mean yeah I'm obviously gonna reread both of your ISOs as it's lylo

so why are you not giving me the same benefit of the doubt but insisting that I give that to you?

not even benefit of the doubt but why are you so locked on me

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We were in haunted village together

I haven’t made my mind up about Eth0s meltdown there yet but I’m glad he’s taking a break from the thread for a hot second either way

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Like I think I SR page 19 eth0s but I actually kind of TR page 20 Eth0s

Idk if I had to choose now I think tris is more likely town of the two of you

But yeah I wanna read both your ISOs before I make a decision

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Also it would be good if you could make that list tris bc either you’re wrong or you’re pocketing him here and have been playing a fuckin a + game

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@menalque could you give a summery of your case on ethos? it hasn't made sense to me.

that's bc I haven't cased him yet

that was just a catch up

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I don't really have time to hard sort this tonight but I might tomorrow afternoon

good to see that your "yeah, I'm gonna go reevaluate the game" was literally just "I'm gonna go case your predecessor" eth0s

that's cool of u

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I don't really have time to hard sort this tonight but I might tomorrow afternoon

good to see that your "yeah, I'm gonna go reevaluate the game" was literally just "I'm gonna go case your predecessor" eth0s

that's cool of u

This is a giant misrep and when you JUST replaced into the game and I already called who I thought the scumteam was before you even got in.... sorry about your luck but you took a scum slot.

please explain to me how that's a misrep

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I think town you would at least be thinking here but instead you're just gonna keep pushing me without even raising the possibility to yourself that tris could be deepwolfing here and letting a TvT blow up

I have literally never dismissed that idea once

huh okay I misread slightly I thought that you'd actually said you were gonna look at tris again but I think I just extrapolated from this

but honestly I find your continued tunnelling of my slot really fucking scummy

you say that you haven't dsimissed that idea but the way you're playing is showing that you pretty much have. you've obsessively focused on my slot and I don't think that's natural for town

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I'm gonna ISO eth0s first because I think from his entire reaction here he probably is scum and honestly eth0s if you're town and this is how you're choosing to deal with my slot (especially focussing on volpe who can't explain herself and I can't explain for her) then we prob deserve to lose

like I literally entered the game and you were going "oh sorry you're in a scumslot mena"

your entire behaviour has been geared towards getting me lynched or devaluing my presence in this thread rather than trying to sort me or let me have any impact in the game

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okay, let's go through the eth0s ISO then

I think his early posts are bad especially in light of the angles he's been taking later on

look at 123 -- makes a bad argument for why scum wouldn't hammer a buddy early on. Again, I am pretty sure that I've seen a minimicro where scum did exactly that. It was an old game I read through the wiki I think, I can try to find it but it'll be difficult.

but the main thing is that he starts this early, his 4th post in the game, suggesting that volpe would wanna put someone (in this case goon!sau) to L-1 and then push the hammerer D2. this becomes important later given his argument around ele/volpe. notice how he's also keeping distance from the read ("volpe seems town in a vacuum")

there's also the matter of elements. he v conspicuously greets elements when he comes into the thread, and is SRing him for his entrance at 124. now, I'm not sure, but I think that elements wasn't generally particularly seen as scummy when he entered by most of the thread. it was specifically eth0s who called him out early, and even then it was in a kind of weird way. ("No one should particularly love me either since I have one real post and it revolves around tinfoil. So I'll give elements the benefit of the doubt since I don't really feel much to respond to either.

However I want him to keep true to 116 rather than just wait around to "be impressed" I guess you could say.

VOTE: elements")

tbh that reads like distancing to me. he's not really trying to get elements through, but he is on a super early vote there. also just the fact that his first vote happened to be on the goon isn't something I love (as for town that should only be a 25% chance) but I'm not putting as much weight in it as this is a smaller game. it was for weak reasons though, and that should be ringing alarm bells for you.

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then regarding tris, immediately after this, he goes from "tris is my null read but my gut leans scum on that overall" (125) to "Disregard this completely. I thought this was similar to scum!tris play in micro 883 but it is actually like polar opposite I think.

For context that is my only game with her before this one (I think)" (126) and then to "She can be town for now too" (127)

I don't think this is organic. I think this is forced organic. I think probably he did have the thought about you being different between the two games, but I think the first was inserted to try and show that he had a sort of progression there --> from scum!tris to town!tris. I think town probably doesn't feel the need to actually put you in town here after realising their buzz is wrong. it's trying to make too much trajectory from too little information.

I actually think that 139 might be weird in terms of perspective too, actually? eth0s says "yeah, a townflip there means the hammerer is probably scum". so eth0s says that "If he and I are a team then why would I go through all of the trouble to explain why I don't think a quickhammerer would be his scummate there? If that were my angle I would have quickhammered him." only he

couldn't

quick hammer him bc he

knew

it was flipping town and was aware of how a town flip based on a super early quick hammer would look. so instead he ends up making the case that not quick hammering supports a world where he and saud aren't the team knowing that if saud does go down then he can use this to make him look townier.

honestly, that's not one of the stronger things about eth0s but I think it's still prob worth mentioning. if you think it doesn't make sense then maybe I'm just confbiasing.

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I think 140 is playing himself down as scum -- go and read some of MMRT tris, I'll link it (viewtopic.php?t=80648&f=23&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go). he was very nearly able to deep wolf his way through into the endgame there based on day play and honestly his only main error was going for a bad fake claim + getting spotted by one person who happened to have vig powers, so I don't think he's really bad at all as scum and I don't see the incentive for town!him not to just be truthful that he plays a good scum game. again, this isn't a major point and I don't think it's condemning of him, but I think it's interesting to look at how it fits into the pattern as a whole

143 makes me think that this is a setup that eth0s has been angling for since early game. that's a very early point to call out two people as not the same alignment imo, and doesn't really fit with someone who claims they don't think they're great at the game. if eth0s was planning to bus elements and go to 3p lylo with you + 1 of me/sau then it makes sense to get this out there early

then imo between 145 and 207 eth0s isn't really doing anything and is just trying to look busy (possible exceptions: 186, 188)

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I think 243 is artificial. can't really say more than that. I don't think your play particularly changed in between where eth0s thought it was different to your scum game, to where he thought you and elements couldn't be the same alignment but never took his SR of elements away, to here. I TR you throughout that and you're just gonna have to decide whether you think his perception of your game changing there was genuine or if it was him making something up because he felt like he had to produce something.

then 258 is where I have to approach this from my pov entirely but I think is also stronger evidence for him scum. he's happy with lynching between two town here. I think the plan is p clear for him. vote one, get elements to hammer, bus his buddy, pick on the other one to target in lylo.

262 is dual functional. it (1) sets up more of his 'progression' on you or (2) if the others seem receptive to it, gives him a chance of who to get ele to push between volpe/saud in the expectation that they might vote you in lylo. again, I know this isn't gonna be the most persuasive thing in the world because it's entirely fmpov, but if you take a second and look at while operating in the world of town!me I think you'll see the logic behind what I'm saying.

also, I misremembered about elements' interactions from last game. I think it was TL that I was mixing him up with. so no, he doesn't particularly interact with his buddies more than other members of town. (here is the elements ISO from that game viewtopic.php?t=80648&f=23&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go) but nor do I think he particularly ignores them. I don't see it being beyond scum!eth0s' range to tell ele to ignore someone in the PT to try and create false associationals especially if the plan all along was bussing, but yeah, this one isn't as strong as I thought

----

then there's just some basic contradictions between posts like 277 and 330. this whole period is kind of telling. he doesn't demonstrate where his supposed SR on you went, almost like it never existed at all. he goes straight for 334 where he's calling volpe scum with ele and bussing, including using 335 as support for this theory when he should know that it's no good for proof considering that ignored several slots in MMRT when they were town and actually did interact with eth0s (albeit not loads). again, just check the ISO I linked for him and see for yourself. I don't find it plausible that eth0s would just forget this when that game was so recent.

then 344 says that "one of the 3 of us is deepwolfing" yet despite his earlier expressed doubts about you, that disappears here and he never bothers to revisit your slot. why would you do that if you're sure that someone is deep wolfing and you had serious concerns about a slot earlier? I think the Occam's answer here is bc you need that person to vote with you in lylo and you don't wanna alienate them. he's showed enough doubt early on for you to not feel like you're being pocketed, then he completely forgets that he was skeptical of you (he still says he may have doubts but he never acts on them)

then there's a gap of some posts that I don't think are very AI. 365 is again relying on a bad reason to "confirm" volpe/ele as the team.

----

posts after this are from when I'm in the game but eth0s literally doesn't care about giving me the time of day. despite his beliefs of there being a deep wolf he's so set on it being me/ele that his aim from the moment I join is to keep up his momentum against my slot. (374, 392)

then I think I got it right about his progression on you being faked so that he can literally rely on it as a defence in 432

I think I've made it pretty clear here how his play has been manufactured, in response to 433. I don't think his reads really progressed -- they all seemed to basically end up where they started. tris is good. ele is scum. one of volpe/saud is scum.

he went for saying that one of volpe/saud needed to die D1. after that happens there's some humming and hawing but then he goes back to ele is scum, tris is town, and pushing the other of volpe/saud, in this case my slot.

I don't think that's a town/real progression. if you disagree, okay, tell me why? we're probably losing but I'm pretty sure eth0s is scum here

like there is no point where eth0s considers that you might be scum

in how he acts

despite having apparently had this opinion earlier and believing someone was deep wolfing. look at 439 for another example.

----

454 is honestly just a misrep, I didn't come into the game deathtunneling him and my ISO is literally proof of that. I came in knowing that there were 2/3 scum in (ele, eth0s, tris) and on reading through my early leans on tris were town. yeah, this meant that I started to think that eth0s' posts were prob from scum, alongside the constant attempts to shade me and push me from the moment I repped in, and I haven't seen anything to contradict this. but saying I did this from the moment I came in rather than reaching that conclusion when he had a 66% raw chance of being scum fmpov is just patently false

stuff like 464 is actually just him AtEing rather than engaging with what I've been saying. I think I've shown pretty clearly why his play is manufactured from where I'm seeing it.

468 I was saying how his play was obviously scummy once I'd started to see him as scum, something I never really did in MMRT because he hard pocketed me early on. but I think his overall play has been better because in this game he's clearly thought about his endgame and has been working to set that up, rather than playing on the fly like he was there. so even if Ive been better at identifying him as scum, doesn't mean that I can't think his scum game is overall better here, and I think that's p easy to understand

I honestly have no idea what tf is going on in his argument of 472. why in the world would I use the logic of my obviously about to be flipped scum buddy to try and get you lynched? that's just dumb af for me as scum and you trying to use that as a justification for "MENA IS SCUMCLAIMING" is just false as fuck

ignoring the stuff where he wildly misread your post bc that's probably NAI. I think the emotion overall is prob mildly scum!indicative tho, bc it seems more likely from scum being pissed off that a slot that was kinda dead and being resigned and was pretty well set for the game winning mislynch was replaced with me, and I do not get mislynched without fighting my arse off to make it clear that it's a mistake.

----

I think I've already laid out a thought process for scum you that makes significantly more sense than this one (510), it's up to tris to decide which one she thinks is right bc I'm p sure you're just scum

the way you've interacted around me just isn't town, sorry. if you were town you'd have had doubts here but instead you just tried to discredit me from the moment I repped in rather than wait to see if I would have any insights about the gamestate, and it's because you knew you had to act early and fast to stop me getting any sort of foothold in the game

if I'm wrong and it's tris scum then honestly you've played an appalling towngame and you need to reconsider how you approach these things in future because I don't see how you can expect to not be SR for going after a slot like this before they've even produced that much content

[Menalque]

VOTE: eth0s

tris if you're scum GG

if you want me to explain anything else from above, lmk

[Menalque]

like I've done everything I can to save this slot from being mislynched from an awful position and I don't think there's much else that I can do

if you wanna look at my case and tell me that comes from scum, okay, nothing else I can do. that's literally as town as I can get.

also worth noting just from a meta perspective that I am about a square mile out of my scum!meta here. every time I've been fucked as scum then I've just lurked out and prodged, and the resignation comes through. every time I've been looking like a mislynch as town I've fought like hell to stop if from happening.

I'll link a couple of my games to prove it

[Menalque]

it's very noticeable here: [link]viewtopic.php?t=80296&f=23&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go[/link]

and here: [link]viewtopic.php?f=23&t=80608&start=900[/link]

whereas you can see me fighting a mislynch against me here: [link]viewtopic.php?t=80240&f=56&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go[/link]

and especially here: [link]viewtopic.php?t=80540&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go[/link]

before you vote read my ISOs there and tell me whether I'm scum or town this game

[Menalque]

it's very noticeable here: viewtopic.php?t=80296&f=23&st=0&sk=t&sd ... r_sort=Go
and here: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=80608&start=900

whereas you can see me fighting a mislynch against me here: viewtopic.php?t=80240&f=56&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

and especially here: viewtopic.php?t=80540&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

before you vote read my ISOs there and tell me whether I'm scum or town this game

ebwop

[Menalque]

Like I really don't know how to reason with you if you're just being this blatantly hypocritical and stubborn so there's a good chance I'll ignore you and prod dodge until tris comes back and gives input if you're just gonna continue to do what you've done all game

p sure you've just realised that engaging with me is just gonna let me obvtown harder so you're gonna hope that your shitty case on volpe stands up and that tris votes me for it

if you're town then it's already gg scum and like I said you need to rethink how you approach a replace in because the stuff you're accusing me of is literally what you've done to me

I came in open minded but knowing that any of you had a 66% chance of being scum and reacted to your posts appropriately to that knowledge. you on the other hand have just tried to shade me nonstop throughout my play

[Menalque]

I think town you would at least be thinking here but instead you're just gonna keep pushing me without even raising the possibility to yourself that tris could be deepwolfing here and letting a TvT blow up

I have literally never dismissed that idea once

huh okay I misread slightly I thought that you'd actually said you were gonna look at tris again but I think I just extrapolated from this

but honestly I find your continued tunnelling of my slot really fucking scummy

you say that you haven't dsimissed that idea but the way you're playing is showing that you pretty much have. you've obsessively focused on my slot and I don't think that's natural for town

I literally went on a half page tangent about tris and even when I realized I misinterpretted something I still pointed out possibilities that come from scum!tris.

If I was scum I wouldn't be pushing you so hard. Volpe "thought" I was town and therefore wanted tris by PoE. Tris agreed with that you were scum by PoE before you even replaced in. If I was scum I would be letting both of your slots fight with each other and I would feign uncertainty on who to lynch.

But the reality is I'm town and town!volpe absolutely fucked this game over by repping out without responding to my criticism, or scum!volpe pulled a really cheap and stupid tactic because she was playing like obvscum.

stop trying to make me explain what I can't explain. idk why volpe believed you were town > tris, but if anything this is more evidence for me town. why do I come in and try to mislynch you if my predecessor was angling for a mislynch elsewhere? that's just dumb, and I think I'm p obviously not dumb, whatever else people might think about me. I'd be much better off trying to persuade you that you were wrong on tris if that were the case

also, I don't believe you about your point of letting us fight it out. I think that you know enough about me from MMRT where I was never really even considered as a mislynch throughout the game that you knew letting me get a presence established would be really bad for you as scum if I reached that conclusion. plus, my strength as a player is definitely knowing when someone is making a badly justified push on me, it's one of my main ways of catching scum. can't remember if I talked about that in MMRT or not, but anyway, the point is that scum!you after pushing me can quite reasonably assume that I'm gonna realise that you're scum. so you need to push me hard before I get into the game properly, which is entirely consistent with what you've done

[Menalque]

but keep coming at me eth0s, I'm not just gonna lie down and let you mislynch me. if you think that this play EVER comes from scum!me or that it's even vaguely within my range then you're clearly talking shit. so either you should be rethinking your play because we're gonna lose as you can't read me at all or you're ignoring what's blatantly in front of you which is me being towny as hell because you need to be intentionally oblivious to how town I am because you're hoping my mislynch is gonna win you the game

all tris needs to do is decide which is more likely here

[Menalque]

and for that matter, why do I put this much effort into a scum game where I literally repped in D2 and a loss wouldn't even vaguely be on me compared to volpe!scum

I would lose absolutely nothing as scum here to just half arse it and go along with what volpe was pushing. instead I came in, completely re-evaluated, and have been hard efforting throughout. that is so much more town!indicative for me than it is scum!indicative it's literally insane

[Menalque]

cool, I was right

not super surprised tbh

[Menalque]

tris if you wanna ask me any questions then go ahead but I've p much said my piece

I'm going to the movies in a minute so won't be able to answer until later/tomorrow tho

[Menalque]

I mean yeah, wrong person to mislynch, right person to actually lynch bc you're scum

again, why would scum!me come after you not after tris? you can't give me a good answer here because I wouldn't

[Menalque]

gonna be fun reading whatever BS you manage to come up with as to why my case is wrong

[Menalque]

tris I swear to god if you're trolling just please don't

I want to effort but not if you're just fucking with me

incidentally this is fake as fuck lmao

[Menalque]

I don't think town!you honestly ever has the thought "oh, tris might be trolling me" when you were scum reading me independently of that

such a blatantly LAMIST post

[Menalque]

I am. It was the Jeff Goldblum version of The Fly and it was pretty good imo. However, not sure it was worth 3 hrs of driving to see.

I missed 518, sorry. Or at least, I didn't realise you wanted me to respond to it. I think you're coming at that from the wrong perspective probably. I don't think it was about getting saudade lynched specifically. I think it was that by hammering there it was incriminating for volpe in a way that would set up lylo even with the knowledge that the goon was going to die for it. Plus it would give eth0s cred for his way too early elements call out and then let him bus hard and early D2 with it all seeming legit.

Like, being honest, ele doesn't have a great scum game. I hit him D1 in MMRT. From scum pov, what's the safer way to a win? (1) Hammer when someone is weak and try to win the 3p lylo, especially when the hammer looks bad for another slot who you can then relentlessly push from that point on, or (2) to try and guide it elsewhere/let the hammer happen more naturally (when there's always the possibility that might shift to one of you) in order to not incriminate elements and then count on him not being the lynch D2. I think that after eth0s' experience with him in MMRT he would probably strongly lean towards option (1) there.

[Menalque]

would also like the time to respond to eth0s' case on me because I think some of it is a steaming pile of horseshit

[Menalque]

also ftr tris, I don't blame you if you do hammer me in the end

I think this game was really, really hard to get to a correct solve in if you were playing in it from the beginning and as I said I think eth0s has played a v good scum game to be in this position

I had the advantage of coming in with fresh eyes and knowing that anyone I looked at had a high likelihood of being scum so I think it was easier for me

[Menalque]

would also like the time to respond to eth0s' case on me because I think some of it is a steaming pile of horseshit

when is this going to be?

Tomorrow

[Menalque]

If there’s any other questions you have prob ask them now and I’ll get to all of them then

I’m about to go to bed

[Menalque]

tris can you just end this already please

This is not town!eth0s pushing for the early hammer. This is scum!eth0s worried you might actually listen to me.

[Menalque]

Like I said, scum!me does not make this effort to actually save the game

From either side, you have to admit that I’m trying here. I just can’t be bothered to do this as scum, whereas when I’m town I hate, hate, hate being mislynched

Eth0s can sit there and call this AtE as much as he wants but the point holds that I find it really hard to convey emotion in a way that reads as genuine in my scumgames whereas when I’m town I get worked up pretty easily

I think I am very sortable through this if you take the time to look at a few of my games and see whether you think the emotion coming through reads as genuine or not

[Menalque]

too much AtE, too much self meta, just trying too hard to appear town rather than make a case that makes sense

I already made a case that makes sense and in a hot second I’m about to demonstrate why yours doesn’t

[Menalque]

But tbh I’m not surprised that you’re panicked about the fact that tris hasn’t hammered me yet, because you know that means she’s actually thinking about it

And the more she thinks the less of a chance you have here

[Menalque]

"there's also the matter of elements. he v conspicuously greets elements when he comes into the thread, and is SRing him for his entrance at 124. now, I'm not sure, but I think that elements wasn't generally particularly seen as scummy when he entered by most of the thread. it was specifically eth0s who called him out early, and even then it was in a kind of weird way. ("No one should particularly love me either since I have one real post and it revolves around tinfoil. So I'll give elements the benefit of the doubt since I don't really feel much to respond to either."

Earlier mena attacked me for apparently TMI'ing on elements by pushing him for something that didn't align with our last game where we were scum together (the fact that ele didn't engage volpe once this game).

Part of the reason I even SRed ele to begin with is his entrance and lack of analyzing anything is the EXACT same way he played in our last game. While I don't think I ever stated this it's important.

I already pointed out that I misremembered that. Trying to call me scummy for something that I already said I was at fault on (and therefore can't be trying to do anything with due to the admitted fault) when it's clearly NAI is gross. Also think that elements is noticeably more vapid in MMRT opening posts than in his opening posts here (even if both ISOs overall are quite empty) so that doesn't line up with the read eth0s is saying he had at that time.

"However I want him to keep true to 116 rather than just wait around to "be impressed" I guess you could say.

VOTE: elements")

tbh that reads like distancing to me. he's not really trying to get elements through, but he is on a super early vote there."

I wanted him to answer a question while I kept pressure applied. I really don't understand how that's scummy.

On a lesser note why would I go from voting my scumbuddy to not voting for the rest of the phase? That would just be idiotic as scum.

Which goes against what Mena thinks of my scumplay. In fact (and I know you and I apparently have differing playstyles here, tris) I haven't even voted at all since elements. I

have been extremely cautious and wanted saudade to fucking do something useful both times he "died"

. In fact I wanted you to chime in too, tris.

I mean, not really. If you look too confident then you look like you're TMIing. Your vote already accomplished the distancing you needed to get done, you don't want to look too keen for it. Also it's funny bc the ways in which you've been cautious fit well with scum!you. Rather than going for the big play of hard defending elements and trying to push me/volpe yesterday for the instant win, you decided to go for the safe plan of bussing. Also your play around saudade and needing the conf!town to do something was just obviously looking for town points

"then regarding tris, immediately after this, he goes from "tris is my null read but my gut leans scum on that overall" (125) to "Disregard this completely. I thought this was similar to scum!tris play in micro 883 but it is actually like polar opposite I think.

For context that is my only game with her before this one (I think)" (126) and then to "She can be town for now too" (127)

I don't think this is organic. I think this is forced organic. I think probably he did have the thought about you being different between the two games, but I think the first was inserted to try and show that he had a sort of progression there --> from scum!tris to town!tris. I think town probably doesn't feel the need to actually put you in town here after realising their buzz is wrong. it's trying to make too much trajectory from too little information."

yeah. because me not checking my past game with tris beforehand is telling of my alignment...

Okay eth0s, sure. I see you don't have a meaningful answer to this point.

"I actually think that 139 might be weird in terms of perspective too, actually? eth0s says "yeah, a townflip there means the hammerer is probably scum". so eth0s says that "If he and I are a team then why would I go through all of the trouble to explain why I don't think a quickhammerer would be his scummate there? If that were my angle I would have quickhammered him." only he couldn't quick hammer him bc he knew it was flipping town and was aware of how a town flip based on a super early quick hammer would look. so instead he ends up making the case that not quick hammering supports a world where he and saud aren't the team knowing that if saud does go down then he can use this to make him look townier."

lol

or to this

----

little interjection here. Just look at all the times he says "this isn't that strong of a point but idk it's strong enough for me to completely tunnel him without analyzing tris the entire game"

1. "but I'm not putting as much weight in it as this is a smaller game."
2. "honestly, that's not one of the stronger things about eth0s but I think it's still prob worth mentioning. if you think it doesn't make sense then maybe I'm just confbiasing."
3. again, this isn't a major point and I don't think it's condemning of him, but I think it's interesting to look at how it fits into the pattern as a whole
4. again, I know this isn't gonna be the most persuasive thing in the world because it's entirely fmpov
5. I don't see it being beyond scum!eth0s' range to tell ele to ignore someone in the PT to try and create false associationals especially if the plan all along was bussing, but yeah, this one isn't as strong as I thought
6.

so about that scum range? yeah it needs work.

there's a lot of other examples with slights in context but these are the big examples where he has to remind you how weak his case is

anyway

This is hilarious because you think you're scum casing me and you're literally town casing me. There's no incentive for scum!me to show weakness in what I'm right on and what I'm wrong on. Scum!me just pushes you as hard as I can, fakes absolute certainty in your alignment at this point, and shoehorns in anything that I can use to fit that narrative. Here, I'm wondering about what's actually useful for my read on you vs what isn't, which is classic town behaviour.

----

"also, I misremembered about elements' interactions from last game. I think it was TL that I was mixing him up with. so no, he doesn't particularly interact with his buddies more than other members of town."

lol

note that eth0s read this and still tries to smear me for it in the first point of this 'case'

"then there's just some basic contradictions between posts like 277 and 330. this whole period is kind of telling. he doesn't demonstrate where his supposed SR on you went, almost like it never existed at all. he goes straight for 334 where he's calling volpe scum with ele and bussing, including using 335 as support for this theory when he should know that it's no good for proof considering that ignored several slots in MMRT when they were town and actually did interact with eth0s (albeit not loads). again, just check the ISO I linked for him and see for yourself. I don't find it plausible that eth0s would just forget this when that game was so recent."

This is actually a valid point.

Luckily I only needed PoE on my side.

BTW look at this string of posts from volpe

admitting it because he literally doesn't have an explanation. at multiple points here he's just choosing to go "lol" or whatever rather than trying to rebut because he knows that trying to fake his thinking around this stuff is just going to leave him looking scummier than playing the role of town who cbf

From what I read last pages eth0s was town'ing it up against Elem and Saudade was like "who should I vote??", now he gets hammered and say that is quicklynching Elem tomorrow.

I can't see it other way than goon!Saudade/ Godfather!Elements here

They were getting PoE'ed by us therefore they made this theater.

I can be wrong but I don't think so

If saudade is town I think chances of Elem being GF are pretty good because I don't see that hammer coming from a goon too often

Like, he wasn't getting that much heat yet to hammer like that when if goon he would be expendable

/shrug

I think this game is won either way to be fair

I think the opposite. If saudade flips town I think volpe or tris is GF. Leaning volpe.

Goon absolutely makes that town!saudade hammer because it saves the GF from getting lynched the next day.

now why in the actual hell wouldn't scum!me just go along with her plan since she basically had just let me off the hook? Why would I push volpe so hard after this as scum if I could just help a town!her mislynch tris?

It was also blatantly obvious that the only reason volpe would assume the GF to be the quickhammerer (seriously she had been advocating for powerlynching a quickhammer all game) is because she is feigning ignorance for towncred. Like that's literally it. Point blank.

because old me was clearly being a fucking idiot here and going along with the logic of "elements!hammer = elements!GF" was moronic and you could pick up town points by pointing that out, and it also gave you an easy target. I honestly have no idea what volpe was thinking there or if they were actually high but it is what it is. Must've felt orgasmic when you saw them post that and realised you could keep pushing it all the way through the game.

"then he completely forgets that he was skeptical of you (he still says he may have doubts but he never acts on them)"

a

gain. This doesn't line up at all with how mena perceives my scumplay. He talks about how few mistakes I made in MMRT (a much longer and more complex game than this one) yet apparently I am just making blatant scummy mistakes all over the place this game? uh huh

.

I mean, you had the advantage of being able to pocket me in a PT in MMRT, and now I'm more tuned to look for scum!you as I just finished playing scum!you. The very fact that you're scum means you can't play a town game, regardless of whether you're often good at replicating it. And here it's a lot easier to identify precisely because of the smaller game forcing you to make scummier moves earlier or you lose.

"posts after this are from when I'm in the game but eth0s literally doesn't care about giving me the time of day. despite his beliefs of there being a deep wolf he's so set on it being me/ele that his aim from the moment I join is to keep up his momentum against my slot. (374, 392)"

lol

I'm just gonna highlight these because I've already explained the reason for them

"I honestly have no idea what tf is going on in his argument of 472. why in the world would I use the logic of my obviously about to be flipped scum buddy to try and get you lynched? that's just dumb af for me as scum and you trying to use that as a justification for "MENA IS SCUMCLAIMING" is just false as fuck"

yet that is actually exactly what he did

blah blah blah can't respond to my argument with an actual explanation and knows making one up will just make him look worse

"I think I've already laid out a thought process for scum you that makes significantly more sense than this one (510), it's up to tris to decide which one she thinks is right bc I'm p sure you're just scum"

the fact that he just felt "confident" enough to immediately vote me without anyone engaging to this shit is actually beyond me

bro it was literally you or tris lol, making my case on you made me feel confident enough that it was you that I didn't need to do tris as well

all in eth0s original quote bc honestly trying to deal with the formatting is a pain in the arse

[Menalque]

I'm around for a bit if you do need anything more from me tris

[Menalque]

colorful

I figured that if you had to read all that text I might as well make it pretty

[Menalque]

Eth0s:

too much AtE, too much self meta, just

trying too hard to appear town rather than make a case that makes sense

Also Eth0s after I post my rebuttal:

[Menalque]

Like bro I’m sorry I fucked up the easy lynch slot for you

[Menalque]

Eth0s, fmpov, there was scum in you and tris. Reading your ISO had me convinced that you were scum. I couldn’t see how you were not scum after reading it, and this is now confirmed by the lack of a tris hammer.

It’s not hypocrisy, but even if it was you’ve played long enough to know that hypocrisy isn’t scum!indicative. So the fact that you’re trying to use this as your big “gotcha” on me is honestly pretty revealing of the fact that I’ve debunked your other arguments and you’re now relying on ate and trying to catch me out.

Again, I don’t blame you. I would be kinda pissed too if my easy mislynch repped out into me and I came in this towny, but themes just the breaks.

[Menalque]

My case made perfect sense and if it hadn’t you’d have explained why instead of focusing on the semantics of my language use or just posting “lol” in response to a bunch of my points.

[Menalque]

I'm not going to keep arguing just because he has a lot to say. I already explained the entire gameplan that Volpe had. Mena's case on me simply doesn't make sense.

He's fighting really hard, which is what someone should do in his position, but I just don't have the energy to keep writing out paragraphs to convince one person who is hardly posting.

The ball is in your court Tris.

I don’t think town!you would give up this easily tbh. I think this is scum!you last ditch efforting to try and turn things around as the game is slipping away from you.

[Menalque]

Like I think scum is significantly more likely to just give up if they think their mislynch is coming compared to town who I think fight a lot harder. I might be extrapolating too much from my own behaviour here tho

[Menalque]

It's not just the hypocrisy that is important. It's that you acted like what I did was scummy, then you did it. But you took it one step further by being so confident that you were right (when apparently I couldn't be, from your perspective) that you were willing to lay down a vote.

So I do something you find scummy, you do the same but take it one step further, and apparently that is supposed to make sense for town!you.

It doesn't.

You literally tunnelled me from the moment I came in and tried to deny me any breathing space to act. That’s what I called out, you weren’t interested in sorting my slot by interacting with me, you just wanted to get me lynched. When I read through, I came to a scumread on you. I then paused, realised I could be wrong and it could be tris, decided to case both of you. While I was rereading your ISO for the case on you I became convinced that your actions this game were not from town, so I voted you. Turns out I was right.

This is the reality of what happened and it is very distinct from the way you’re presenting it.

[Menalque]

I already solved the game based on your prior slot. You tunneled me because you wanted to survive and thought tris would be easier to persuade than me.

Maybe you're right but originally I thought it would be easier for you to get me on tris than it would tris on me.

All of the "reality" AtE BS can just not be said though. The REALITY is that you are scum and you voted too fast and tris is probably going to give you a free win because apparently she's one of those that think scum won't come in and effort their ass off when they're backed into a corner.

I mean, I’m not AtEing here and I think that’s p clear? Claiming my use of one word is me AtEing is a stretch. What you’re doing in this post is very blatant AtE.

[Menalque]

I don’t think scum me ever comes in and decides to set you up vs set tris up, esp given that in this world that you’ve concocted where I’m scum past me was already setting up on tris. Going after you here is scum is so incredibly counter productive for scum!me, especially when I think we have good rapport normally.

[Menalque]

The fact is I came in, read through, and realised you were scum trying to set me up for a mislynch. What other option did I have but to come at you hard when the alternative was let you mislynch me for the win? But even then I didn’t come at you from the moment I entered in, which is what I’d do as scum, I came at you after reading and based on your bad push aimed at discrediting me.

[Menalque]

I mean I will, and I’ll do that as either alignment so I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here

Also outside of self-meta tris can very easily check my games and see that this isn’t at all in line with my scum!meta but is very in line with how I react as town when someone is trying to mislynch me

[Menalque]

I don't even need to involve meta to realize that my case on volpe was right. Her reaction was terrible and incriminating, and you are playing this game using survival instinct and self meta because you can't make a case one me that makes sense.

If my case doesn’t make sense go back and have another try and rebutting it. Because I already dismantled your first effort.

[Menalque]

I don't even need to involve meta to realize that my case on volpe was right. Her reaction was terrible and incriminating, and you are playing this game using survival instinct and self meta because you can't make a case one me that makes sense.

If my case doesn’t make sense go back and have another try and rebutting it. Because I already dismantled your first effort.

actually you didn't. Your rebuttle was garbage but I'm done playing this fucked up game where the decider won't even do anything. take your free win this game is fucking stupid

if it was really garbage, then I don't think it would be difficult/take very long for you to disbunk. the fact that you haven't done so and are instead resorting to just insisting that it's trash is revealing

[Menalque]

I'm not getting mixed up in all the AtE, but I'll say that I do believe you're upset even if it's not for the reasons you're professing, and I'm sorry about that

[Menalque]

Good choice

Congrats both of you, eth0s I hope no hard feelings that I picked you to push

I’m a little disappointed, sure, but I think I did the best I could when I was in a pretty screwed position *shrug*

[Menalque]

Ooi, what was it that made you vote me in the end tris?

Also thanks for modding chem

[Menalque]

Ooi, what was it that made you vote me in the end tris?

Also thanks for modding chem

townreading ethos. I got the overall sense that everything he was doing came from town. i didn't see the plan you were arguing he had was the most likely explanation. it was possible, but i thought is was more likely he was just town. one thing that helped towards the end was that he was getting upset, not just with me, but with saudade. i believed that was real frustration. me saying i was leaning towards voting ethos there was actually a lie, by the way.

also i decided volpe was scum. that was something i had started to suspect before ethos was arguing for it, and so that helped me feel like those feelings were accurate and not just something i had been convinced of.

when i skimmed some of your meta, it seemed you hadn't been in very many scum games, especially in this position, so i didn't buy the argument that you wouldn't be capable of putting up a fight like this.

This makes me feel better, thanks tris. I actually wasn’t sure if you not engaging that much generally was a strat or not, but either way I thought it was pretty good — going mostly off evidence that was already there and not letting yourself get overly influenced here. I might try something similar if I ever have to be in the hammer making position myself.

I wondered if it was a lie but couldn’t deny myself the false hope :p

Eth0s was just so damn towny, and I thought his frustration read as so genuine that I was really not optimistic after that and I would’ve felt bad targeting him for it.

[Menalque]

But I thought that going on with the strategy of targeting tris prob wasn’t gonna work from where I was entering. So I decided trying to create a bit of chaos was better, but sadly the only way to do that when the game had reached the size it was at was to change target abruptly.