Mini 2307 | Songs from Glee! | Endgame

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

as is tradition <3

Rude!
VOTE: Elements

[Elements]

Do you enjoy setup spec or are you just doing it for the sake of doing it?

[Elements]

let's think of flavour
the title is "songs from glee or smth"
time to think of stuff related to the voice
welp
the thing that I know are screamer
feels like mod would put in a compulsive screamer in there and a roleblocker with an binary investigative like cop

Just read teh flavour name and now understand

[Elements]

pls no wallpost

town

[Elements]

In general sheeping is Scummish

Scummish in that scum do it, or scummish in that you don't approve?

[Elements]

true sheeping is skill/confidence based, not ai.

I see we have a wavelength

[Elements]

pls no wallpost

town

scum

VOTE: elements

Parachute

[Elements]

VOTE: IAVH

[Elements]

I'm the easiest push here, come on

Yes

[Elements]

I'm the easiest push here, come on

Yes

wydm yes

Yes

[Elements]

elements isnt doing a ton to make me not wanna vote them which ironically makes me not wanna vote them as much

This is the sweet spot I try and live in

[Elements]

I get the sense we've had a lot of kind of waffly talk.

Do you think that waffly talk is bad for the game?

I think so tbh

Do you think all waffeling is nai?

[Elements]

I'm the easiest push here, come on

Yes

wydm yes

Yes

I really wanna pull the 'One Vote Away From Elimination' card kk

You're very defensive for being the first 'wagon' of the game. I wouldn't even say we're out of rvs yet

[Elements]

What makes you think I meant for you to understand

[Elements]

Bloop

[Elements]

Intent to hammer

[Elements]

VOTE: RN

[Elements]

Daisy, have you ever rolled scum in a forum game?

[Elements]

Oh damn
That's before you knew me!

[Elements]

@Elements Your vote is on RN right now, any particular reason why?

I wanted to change it and RN's pfp caught my eye

[Elements]

Why'd you want to change it?

No particular reason, just felt like it

[Elements]

I have noticed there's only 3 and a half days left so I should probably get some reads

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

If the idea was to provoke a reaction or a defense, then you should probably have considered the fact that there was already significant pressure on me. Seems like a lazy attempt to get on a wagon with the fallback defense of "reaction farming". Especially after you admit you don't have any reads.

I was never going to hammer you. And there are reactions to look at. E.g. the unvoting from you was quite slow and no one was rushing to your defence.
Daisy unvoted which I expected, and then re-voted you.
PP was the first to unvote you, mid conversation. But again, that was very just "I want to finish this chat" and nothing to do with your slot. (Although with my knowledge of PP I wouldn't put it past him to position himself to be able to do that)
So from the reactions to my "intent to hammer" I don't think that your scum partner was either active, or on your wagon around that time. Which is the majority of the player base. Making me think you're probably just town with an easily scumread play style, as you've been saying. Which is something I can empathize with as someone who used to get regularly voted out day two due to play style

[Elements]

Any scum partner on the wagon could easily have hopped off saying something like "still a lot of the day left, I don't want a hemmer yet" which is sort of what pp did. But only after there was interaction activity happening

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

If the idea was to provoke a reaction or a defense, then you should probably have considered the fact that there was already significant pressure on me. Seems like a lazy attempt to get on a wagon with the fallback defense of "reaction farming". Especially after you admit you don't have any reads.

I was never going to hammer you. And there are reactions to look at. E.g. the unvoting from you was quite slow and no one was rushing to your defence.
Daisy unvoted which I expected, and then re-voted you.
PP was the first to unvote you, mid conversation. But again, that was very just "I want to finish this chat" and nothing to do with your slot. (Although with my knowledge of PP I wouldn't put it past him to position himself to be able to do that)
So from the reactions to my "intent to hammer" I don't think that your scum partner was either active, or on your wagon around that time. Which is the majority of the player base. Making me think you're probably just town with an easily scumread play style, as you've been saying. Which is something I can empathize with as someone who used to get regularly voted out day two due to play style

Plenty of room for a partner in all of that; KKFC's theoretical partner could have just been frozen, bussing, not wanting to be obviously counterwagoning, simply absent, etc. I don't really agree with your gamestate analysis essentially, although I agree KKFC could easily just be scummy looking town. Generally scum don't defend scum that often anyways imo, especially at the point where KKFC was at. With the position KKFC was in me thinks scum would wanna keep their distance which would match the reactions you described.

I don't get the point of this. I jsut seems like you're saying "yea but scum can do that"
VOTE: sky

[Elements]

That such a meaningless thing to say

[Elements]

So what was your conclusion in the end Elements? Just to be clear - is it that KKFC is town because no-one reacted to the intent to hammer bar PP?

likely town yes

I ask because what Sky said is perfectly legitimate and I think it's wrong to be writing off what scum could and couldn't do D1.

It's a 9 player game. I think it's highly unlikely scum is going to bus their partner halfway through day 1 and then solo the rest of the game.
I just don't see it.
I'm not saying it's not possible, I just don't think anyone here is doing that.
I disliked sky's comment because you can say that about literally anything in a game of mafia.

[Elements]

were they all bussed to exile day 1?

[Elements]

no
who do you think kkfc's partner is?
assuming you're scumming them

[Elements]

did pp rejoin?

[Elements]

ngl, i didn't know who was at e-1 when i gave intent, I just saw someone say e-1

[Elements]

did someone else change their vote or is it still e-1?

[Elements]

I like you sky, you be town now
VOTE: Delta

[Elements]

Daisy just scumreads me when I play the game

[Elements]

last time I played chess in thread I was scum

[Elements]

last time I played chess in thread I was scum

fuck

]

[Elements]

last time I played chess in thread I was scum

wanna still play chess?
1.e4

Did you know there are chess tags?

[Elements]

I don't like IAVH this page at all

[Elements]

VOTE: IAVH

[Elements]

I don't want this around day 2

[Elements]

Is it better to have an uncooperative, tolling, maybe scum slot, or a likely scum slot that's playing the game in a way people can understand?

[Elements]

"you're scum because you're using meta and I sheeped you"

[Elements]

Daisy being enthusiastic day 1 is nai

[Elements]

If anything, Daisy being excited is a town trait

[Elements]

How can you possibly know if someone is a mislim

[Elements]

Daisy was using meta to push someone

[Elements]

How is that, as an action, scummy?

[Elements]

If anything, Daisy being excited is a town trait

oh yeah! I'm so excited to get voted and get so many people mad!
do I get the town trait yet? no I don't obviously
now, tell me, how is that being excited, where do you see it?

You're the one that said Daisy was excited. I am just responding to what your saying with my knowledge of her as a player

[Elements]

How is that, as an action, scummy?

oh great
when I do that in chat mafia it's scummy but now in forums here it isn't

Different people have different opinions

[Elements]

Do you scumread Sky?

[Elements]

is iavh at 3 votes now?

Yes

[Elements]

Why are we all giving read lists?
Are we not just telling scum who to kill?

[Elements]

mod still has 11 hours until he's due for a prod

{Gif with captain Holt saying "That is amazingly funny"}

[Elements]

VOTE: kitty

[Elements]

VOTE: kitty

Could you please share your reasoning for this?

I like having my vote on someone and kitty is the next person I plan on looking at I haven't sorted yet

[Elements]

Is you're read on me based solely on my intent to hammer post?

[Elements]

If I try to advance something D1 I usually get town killed so I stay on the sidelines on D1 usually nowadays, I'm better when there's a flip.

I'm gonna wait for this, then come back to the slot
VOTE: PP[/v] paranoia

[Elements]

If I try to advance something D1 I usually get town killed so I stay on the sidelines on D1 usually nowadays, I'm better when there's a flip.

I'm gonna wait for this, then come back to the slot
VOTE: PP paranoia

ebowp

[Elements]

VOTE: daisy

[Elements]

UNVOTE: Random Nurse

Is this because of the wall post?

[Elements]

PP and KT can be town for today

[Elements]

Still not a him

[Elements]

I would like those remaining four who voted for IAVH to very thoroughly explain why they limmed him.

The slot was actively detrimental to the game.
It the slot was scum, great.
If the slot was town, it won't be mislim bait in limlo, the thread won't be focused around it

[Elements]

Second thing, I've talked about this in Day 1 but my goal when reading Elements is to figure out how much agenda is behind their posting. If you're not seeing much rhyme or reason, chances are it's just town!elements doing things to poke/pressure/see how others react. If you're seeing El's votes/comments manipulating the gamestate, then it's scum!elements controlling the game.

question: do u think elements would adjust to this as scum knowing u know this?

I always try to adjust my scum play to match my town play when I roll scum

[Elements]

Second thing, I've talked about this in Day 1 but my goal when reading Elements is to figure out how much agenda is behind their posting. If you're not seeing much rhyme or reason, chances are it's just town!elements doing things to poke/pressure/see how others react. If you're seeing El's votes/comments manipulating the gamestate, then it's scum!elements controlling the game.

question: do u think elements would adjust to this as scum knowing u know this?

I always try to adjust my scum play to match my town play when I roll scum

Surely this is something everyone does

[Elements]

PP and KT can be town for today

Why specifically these two?

What does this question mean?

[Elements]

consider my vote spiritually on RN

[Elements]

I think for now I'm going to place my vote here. My gut is pinging hard on this slot.

VOTE: Penguin Power

Bad vote
VOTE: RN
E-1

[Elements]

I don't think I'm defending him that much

[Elements]

I think for now I'm going to place my vote here. My gut is pinging hard on this slot.

VOTE: Penguin Power

Bad vote
VOTE: RN
E-1

PP and KT can be town for today

If I try to advance something D1 I usually get town killed so I stay on the sidelines on D1 usually nowadays, I'm better when there's a flip.

I'm gonna wait for this, then come back to the slot
VOTE: PP paranoia

ebowp

You're right, I stand corrected

[Elements]

consider my vote spiritually on RN

[Elements]

Since that paranoia I have gained confidence in town!pp. I'm surprised you haven't. I was spiritually voting you so as not to put you at e-1 so early in the day but now it feels like the game is slowing. You then vote my top town read.

[Elements]

Do you think the scum team is me/pp?

[Elements]

where's my wall of text...I feel so left out.

Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text Text

[Elements]

Bloop

[Elements]

Do you think the scum team is me/pp?

I was thinking it could be PP and Skygazer, assuming there's only 2.

My 2 top town reads!
Woo!

[Elements]

Why is asking people to vote scum indicative?

[Elements]

I don't like Ele on p31...

what don;t you like about it?

[Elements]

I think for now I'm going to place my vote here. My gut is pinging hard on this slot.

VOTE: Penguin Power

Bad vote
VOTE: RN
E-1

Why do you think it's Daisy?

Spoiler: Daisy Quotes

Elements - Town lean. Elements posting with an agenda is scum, Elements posting without one is town. I'm yet to see an agenda.

Elements sticks out like a sore thumb for intending to hammer, and I'm side-eyeing em for that, but also this isn't out of character for em as either alignment so I'm not rly sure how to read it?

I will say El is now reading a bit different to me after revealing that the intent to hammer post had an agenda. As I've said before my read on Elements is based on whether their posts have a deep running agenda (scummy) or are mostly surface level and a bit trolly (townie). Revealing that the intent to hammer post had strong thought behind it surprises me a bit, tho I've been wrong here plenty of times before.

For the most part I agree with this logic, I think if KKFC has a partner it's probably somewhere in [RN, Kitty] for not being there to protect their partner (Delta would've fallen into this group but he sussed KKFC p hard when he came back) or if there is a paired scum around the push it would be in [IAVH, Elements]. Whilst Skygazer and PP organically accelerated the push in a way that felt natural and scumhunty, I had to work to get IAVH on the wagon in the first place and I think there's a reading of El's intent to hammer post where El could've just been trying to scare people away from the wagon with the reaction check explanation there to shield em.

For the most part I agree with this logic, I think if KKFC has a partner it's probably somewhere in [RN, Kitty] for not being there to protect their partner (Delta would've fallen into this group but he sussed KKFC p hard when he came back) or if there is a paired scum around the push it would be in [IAVH, Elements].

Elements could've been scum looking for a quick hammer but I think that's fairly unlikely considering the explanations we've received.

elements who could be paired with kkfc but otherwise i don't see scum motivation in their "intent to hammer" post

Is you're read on me based solely on my intent to hammer post?

Not solely, but it plays a big part in my read on you ya.

Second thing, I've talked about this in Day 1 but my goal when reading Elements is to figure out how much agenda is behind their posting. If you're not seeing much rhyme or reason, chances are it's just town!elements doing things to poke/pressure/see how others react. If you're seeing El's votes/comments manipulating the gamestate, then it's scum!elements controlling the game.

Predominantly based on the positioning of her read on me.
These quotes feel inconsistant to me. She makes it out to be very black and white; Tolly El is town, El with an adjenda is scum.
She then procedes to find an adjenda with my intent to hammer post and then rationalise her way back to a town read on me. In normal 2302 (the last completed game we have together) I was scum and she was town. She found an adjenda behind a post I made and then scum read me for the rest of the game (admitidley I was killed that night by a vig but you get what I mean). This adjenda-finding-scum-reading is very diferent here and I feel like she knows I'm town and is therefore forcing her read on me to be a town read despite the hard stance on me adjendaing being scum.

[Elements]

I wrote the word adjenda way too much in that

[Elements]

VOTE: daisy

[Elements]

I'll be around all day to vote to get someone through
my prefernce in no particular order is {Daisy/RN/whoever pp wants}

[Elements]

you beat me to it, but I think you're correct

[Elements]

i'm going to sleep now but seeing as penguin will be around that's all good

[Elements]

Daisy and Sky or Daisy and KKFC
Either way, Daisy is in my solve

[Elements]

Daisy and Sky or Daisy and KKFC
Either way, Daisy is in my solve

[Elements]

Sky, I'd appreciate it if you could full claim so I can decide if I believe you

Messenger + neopolitan vs mystery mafia pr
Or
Messenger + neopolotan + gated protective vs mystery mafia pr

I've put mystery mafia pr in but it could just as easily be 2 goons
In the 2 goon world, 3 prs, including a neo cop, seems quite town sided. That is my current basis for being dubious of the claim.

That and being burnt hard in a game where the town decided to blindly trust the doc claim that was previously the biggest scum read player in the game

[Elements]

What dies simple mean again?

[Elements]

i want kkfc today but lemme put some thought into this

Why kkfc over Daisy?

[Elements]

kkfc also started role fishing for an investigative result as soon as PP crumbed

Ooo where? I either missed it or have since forgotten

[Elements]

Was Katy also saying penguin was being manipulative with asking people to vote or was that just RN?

[Elements]

that happened on the same page penguin dropped the word "vanilla." feel like a town reaction to spotting the crumb would be to just be vague about it

Or just ignore it entirely

[Elements]

that happened on the same page penguin dropped the word "vanilla." feel like a town reaction to spotting the crumb would be to just be vague about it

Or just ignore it entirely

unfortunately i feel like it got to a point where everyone had hinted at seeing the crumb which is why i made my softclaim post

Except RN
I'm very bad at crumbling or being subtle about seeing crumbs which so I tend to avoid it

[Elements]

I'm also got to get back to work, hopefully I'll be able to float a bit for the next few hours but no promises

[Elements]

elements, could you talk more about what led you to scumreading oopsie yesterday?

scratch that i found your post about it

Since then I also think she joined the RN wagon too readily. Can't quote cos on mobile atm

[Elements]

Ah yes, you were the counterwagon. I know what's happened this game

[Elements]

Did you offer an alternative vote for the day at any point?

[Elements]

You still want kkfc today?

[Elements]

Kitty, come help us out

[Elements]

So you townread sky

[Elements]

gah i second guess myself too much

welcome to mafia

[Elements]

Bloop

[Elements]

Bloop

[Elements]

Sorry, couldn't resist

[Elements]

Reading todays posts from KKFC and they are

all

about how Daisy. Daisy's read on me is garbage, Daisy's voting pattern is bad, Daisy hasn't take a proper stance this game.
None of them are about me being scum.
The me/Daisy scum pairing is coming from a point of nessesity. The arguments are good because KKFC has been in a PT with Daisy all game. KKFC is using the Daisy!scum knowledge to push me as a partner without ever actually pushing me as scum.

If KKFC's best reads at this point are on Daisy!scum, why does he say a comprimise is me?

Let's just split the difference and get Elements.

Everyone

scumreads Daisy, so how am I a comprimise? (I'm aware that was said before the case, but think the point still stands)

The last two pages are just scum theatre to make me look more aligned with Daisy. KKFC's strong offence and Daisy's less so defence (sorry babes, but it's not your best work).

KKFC's case is very one sided - Daisy's interactions with and around me, and doesn't touch my interactions with and around Daisy.

Sky has already gone over the Daisy on KKFC side of interactions so I'd like to invite you to look through KKFC's iso and ctrl+f Daisy's name.
The stated read are "Town with reservaitons" "Null" with a PP/Daisy scum team suggested which was after PP crumbed the VT result.

There's also this which is kinda funny

Daisy pivot onto me seems kind of forced? Honestly I was super surprised when I saw her vote on me.

VOTE: daisy

VOTE: RN

The only other option available looks to be Daisy, but I would prefer RN.

And unless Sky has bamboozled us with a masterful fake claim I can VOTE: Daisy becuase she's scum

[Elements]

I said split the difference because everyone left in this game scumreads you

You would be the easy vote

The closest previously given reads before your post

i'll need to think a bit more on elements vs kkfc. i think oopsie is always scum here though.

[Elements]

Daisy hadn't posted for 2 and a half hours before you said that, so you weren't both talking at the time

[Elements]

I’m actually not sure what your endgame is here. After Daisy flips scum your case on me gets way worse.

How?

[Elements]

I’m on mobile so I can’t remember what was happening at the time. Was I not making a case for Daisy/you against Daisy’s case of Me/you?

Splitting the difference between these cases is just you

oh it was addressed to daisy?
I thought it was addressed to everyone

[Elements]

everyone voting for fast night yea?

[Elements]

Right off the bat do you think busses this hard are generally uncommon. By the balance of probabilities it’s way more likely that Daisy is scum pushing a bad case on me rather than scum bussing me

Probablity is a terrible argument. And Daisy has to push you as scum in this final 5 because 1 is cop confirmed and 1 basically everyone townreads due to the claim. So the three of us are locked into scumreading the other 2.

[Elements]

Bloop

[Elements]

I think that generally, probablility is a bad argument

[Elements]

people do unpredictable things

[Elements]

especailly in a social deduction situation when trying to get other people to think you're something you're not

[Elements]

Either she did this to bus me

This one

[Elements]

Because I know I'm town

[Elements]

Because I know I'm town

Very convincing

This means your vote yourself tomorrow yes?

[Elements]

What’s the endgame?

What is happening right now

[Elements]

Sadly my favorite joke is very much an "tell in person" joke

[Elements]

wait Daisy, are you a Dr Who fan?!

[Elements]

Doctor: we had to remove your colon

Me why

[Elements]

i have just googled "jokes that only work when written out"

[Elements]

Me: Earth isn't flat

Fiat earther: Correct

Me: What do you mean?

Fiat earther: It's shaped as a car

Me: What?

Fiat earther: I guess you read my name wrong

[Elements]

VOTE: sky
I love and have your new pfp

[Elements]

which then begs the quesion, why didn't you?

[Elements]

I cba to wait 12 hours for Kitty to come online
VOTE: Elements
gg

[Elements]

It was a fun game, very much enjoyed it

[Elements]

I don't know what we could've done at the end to win.
Kkfc was just too towny