Micro 65: No Town Lynched (Game Over)

[Thor665]

Vote: Nachomamma8

Let's 1 v 1 and see what happens.

[Thor665]

Myrk is also an acceptable lynch.

[Thor665]

Nor can you find a vote - what of it?

[Thor665]

Unvote: Nachomamma8
Vote: Red Coyote

Speed wagon ho!

@Myrk - we do not need to confirm.
Also, if you're town - replace out, I don't need someone who is going to be not interested in the game on my team.

[Thor665]

And no Fighting Falcon is doing it too?

Am I the only one who was asked to confirm via Pm prior to game start and he put up the note just to fake me out?

At least FF remotely did something pro-town with his first post in addition to confirming, but...bleh.

[Thor665]

Unvote: Red Coyote
Vote: Mykonian

L-1 on Myrk.
Trololololol.

Why don't you explain what you know about me as far as that comment making me scum?

[Thor665]

Link to a game where I'm made aware that you don't replace out?

Because currently your case is predicated on that.

[Thor665]

And as far as I can tell, the Thor love/hate machine works like this;

In game keep calling Thor full of himself.
After game, if your side is identical to Thor talk about how well he played.
If your side is different than Thor try to explain how it was mostly luck and/or you were 'on' to him.
Nominate Thor for a Scummy.
Rinse.
Repeat.

Total factual flow chart.

[Thor665]

we

Shos

don't want no hammer on page 1.

[Thor665]

And we should start calling them cop investigations.

[Thor665]

@Myrk - still waiting...

@Shos - Yes, what of it?

[Thor665]

I'm Norwegian/German/French/Native America/English aka a mutt.

[Thor665]

I could find you a place where I claimed town easily enough - though I do that as either alignment.
I can also find you games with me requesting other people replace out so as not to hurt my win chances...as either alignment.
The important question is if I have awareness that Myrk 'never' replaces out, because then that would prove that I was saying that just to be blustery.
I'm claiming I have no such awareness, and *that* is what Myrk should be proving, as without it his case is nonexistent.

Edit: Nacho is not a pansy at least.

[Thor665]

Dodge #2 just happened.

[Thor665]

That's interesting.

@Myrk - I don't care what you think I meant now, wanna give us a preview of your alignment?

[Thor665]

"Day phases end without a lynch if players elect to lynch a town-aligned player."

*cough*

In other news;

Myrk, why do you think this had to be a scum push when you think there was only one scum on you?
And, yeah, I can show quick Day 1 lynches on scum - can you show where I knew about how you never replace out?
I actually do agree that Shos looks fake there.
I agree that if you're town Fighting Falcon is obv. town.

[Thor665]

I'll be honest, you currently don't sound like a guy worried he's going to be night killed.

And, yeah, regardless of your alignment I think there is a scum on your wagon - it's simple maths.

[Thor665]

Or what, you'll stand around and call people stupid when you're confirmed town?

Other than FF being obv. town and Shos looking fake (and I did half of that for you...) - what reads do you have to give us prior to death?
Because if you're town I want them and you should want to give them.
And if you're scum then I want them.

[Thor665]

Heck, and if you were serious in your case on me, you would want to prove that prior to your death too.
You're allowed to claim scum and go quiet though.

[Thor665]

Claiming scum then?
So, now I know who's getting NKed too - the price of awesome.

Latter people will tell me I'm too full of myself

[Thor665]

(Fourteen)

I'll agree Shos is stupid on that point.

I'll also say you still look to be claiming scum.
Afraid to give opinions on players prior to flip?

[Thor665]

Okay, so with Myrk claiming scum scum will probably not be nightkilling him due to an unfortunate case of lynch.

If he is scum, FF is not auto cleared.
I would tend to say the dance with Shos feels all sorts of fake and derp.
Greg is obv. town.

My thoughts.

[Thor665]

I don't actually - I just try to fake it so people will think I'm clever later. Honestly I pulled all those names out of a hat and made up my opinions on them by throwing darts at a board of post-it notes with random town/scum value calls written on them.

It's a method.

[Thor665]

He is only cleared if Aru is town.
He is cleared because in a game like this - that's not a viable scum play to be the derp hammer, it's fine (and optimal) to be on the wagon, but the spotlight seat? Not so much.

You Myrk's scumbuddy? You did feel hyper fake when he got hammered, and you did blink when he got close.
Links to you blinking like that as town?

[Thor665]

Not Aru - Myrk...multi games iz win for Thor!

[Thor665]

I'll note that both of those obv. town statements are conditional upon Myrk's alignment flip.

I already explained FF's - yours would be best summed up as 'that wasn't a bussing post'

I can try to slow down for you if you need me to, but this isn't a Newbie and judging by your join date I have no idea why you're acting so shocked about the lynch.

[Thor665]

Gregory is town.
I like how he questioned the townread on himself, I like his interactions with myk, and I like his perception of F16.

Wouldn't call F16 town ever, though.

Even with a Myrk town flip?

Tell me more.

[Thor665]

@Shos - I looked through three and couldn't find a situation similar...is this definitely something you're doing a lot of?

@F-16 - do you think hammering a townie is a good scum gambit?

@Myk - if you are town than I'm not sure I ever want to be town with you in any game in the future. If you're town stop being sad that you were quickhammered and get involved to help town - that's called 'playing to wincon' or some such gobbldy-gook. If you're scum - continue as is.

[Thor665]

Wow, he's actually just trolling me now.

I'll be curious to see this flip now.

[Thor665]

Vote: Nachomamma8

It's mylo, let's do this.

[Thor665]

Good point, let's still lynch Nacho.

[Thor665]

@Shos - i do think he's fairly obv. town but am fine with you pressuring him to at least explain his logic.

What's your read on Nacho?

@F-16 - why wouldn't we do that, you think Nacho is town?

[Thor665]

It is you I am concerned about. If someone else had hammered, I wouldn't think they are obvious town, so the question is: why do you think I am obvious town?

A couple of possibilities for you here;

1. You are town and I am town - I have an accurate read, rejoice!
2. You are scum and I am town - Bwa-ha, you fooled me, rejoice!
3. You are town and I am scum - I have limited my ability to mislynch you later, rejoice!

So...?

It seems to me like a scum-strategy to elicit reactions from the other townies. Call someone obv-town and hope that the others are flabbergasted enough to say "No! how is he obvtown? Vote F-16." This of course would allow you to distance from a lynch.

Of course, I could be wrong, maybe you are just good as town and was accurate in reading me. But if you are scum, this is exactly the strategy I'd expect a smart player like you to use. If Shos is town, it's working. Same if Nacho is town. Same if Gregory is town. Nobody thinks I am town except for you. Which makes your strategy a good one.

[Thor665]

Why don't you have a read on Nacho yet? You were content to end the day, I figured that meant you had some decent reads.
Who do you have reads on?

[Thor665]

Because I agree with Myrk (except on how to play town, natch) in that there was scum on the wagon that lynched him.
I think you and Greg are likely town.
So.

[Thor665]

Thor is the next one in my list after you. He has yet to explain to me his train of thoughts about why you are so obvtown, and he continuously pursued me in questions of why I unvoted in L-1 iirc.

1. I *did* already explain it.
2. I did pursue you with those questions - how does that matter one way or the other?
3. Links to games you've played in with scum quickhammering Day 1?

@thor 109: apart from why-is-f16-so-obvtown-in-your-eyes-Smurfdamit-ffs, why is GREG town?? he literally posted TWICE.

I like how you ask me the same question three times in the post - go iso me, it can't be that huge, the question was answered.
I also explained my read on Greg too, so...?
And he only posted ONCE when I made that call.

[Thor665]

He is only cleared if Aru is town.

He is cleared because in a game like this - that's not a viable scum play to be the derp hammer, it's fine (and optimal) to be on the wagon, but the spotlight seat? Not so much.

Here's the quote - y'know, for the reading encumbered.

Bold tag fixed. (Equinox)

[Thor665]

Everything in this game is WIFOM. Every town action can be looked at and said of 'but scum might do that to look town' and every scummy action might be done because 'scum do it because it looks so scummy scum wouldn't do it'

It's a silly rebuttal that applies to everything.

2. Yes...and?
3. So you're saying that besides very recently you've never seen it happen? What makes you think it's such a likely scum move than?

My explanation with Greg is actually Nacho's - but I agreed with it. I won't quote it because your laziness is less than my laziness and so I don't care and have already proved that I am awesome and you can't read.

[Thor665]

But there is motivation for scum to *not* hammer like that.

[Thor665]

I mean, even look at his case on me (and, yeah, I know, it makes me laugh too) look at the level of complexity he is working with there as a conceptual standard. You think the guy claiming that as a scum plan is going to have as his scumplan 'lawl, quickhammah!'

Get back to me on that.

[Thor665]

@FF - you don't hammer a lynch as a 'Vig shot' they're totally different things.
Your case on me wouldn't make me smart scum.

I have addressed why I am voting where I am voting - if you think I'm doing it all to protect Shos then why aren't you voting me or him?

[Thor665]

I have no idea what post 118 means, to whom it is directed, and what it wants, so if I'm one of those, rephrase >_>

It's to you - I don't understand how you don't understand it but I'll try a rephrase for kicks.

He accuses people of convoluted plans - town or scum that suggests he plays via convoluted plans when scum himself because either he thinks it's reasonable to accuse someone of them, or he is being honest and really thinks like that.

You are accusing him of a very much *not* convoluted scum plan.

Connect the two concepts for me.


@Nach- Greg and FF are town reads for you, I'll go out on a limb that you think you are town. You don't even glance at me. Discuss.

M0ar Nacho votes pl0x!

Quote tag fixed. (Equinox)

[Thor665]

@Nacho - also, if you *are* going through Shos' stuff, I'll want to know if some of those speed hammerers have been flipped. Y'know, to prove he has any leg to stand on at all.

That saves me from having to read through any of those games, huzzah!

[Thor665]

Greg and FF are town reads for you, I'll go out on a limb that you think you are town. You don't even glance at me. Discuss.

I'd rather not.
If I'm ignoring you and
1. You are town and I am town - I'm not voting you, rejoice!
2. You are scum and I am town - Easier to mislynch me, rejoice!
3. You are town and I am scum - More ammunition for your ironclad case on me, rejoice!

Not the same thing - unless you're saying the Myrk wagon was pure town.

@thor: I do not understand what accusation I made that is so twisted and complex in your opinion that would make that first sentence logical to this case. my 'case' is based solely on that quickhammer until something else happens that would make me feel someone else is more worthy of a vote. there's really nothing complex here. (offtopic: if complex/twisted is not what you meant, then I have no idea what 'convoluted' is, I used a dictionary -_-)

I was talking about FF's case on me, not your case on him - it would make no sense to use your case on him to explain how he would think as scum.
Make sense now?

[Thor665]

Yeah, I'm going to put this off another day myself. I'm a little buzzed and want to do this with a clear mind. I know it's only six pages, but I want to be able to give Thor and Nacho a good once over.

[Thor665]

@FF - why not vote one of us now, then? Stop derping.

Greg and Red Coyote should also vote.

[Thor665]

@Red - I like your individual points but you just claimed that you see it as a situation where Shos/Nacho would make any sense at all - and it doesn't.
You're also ignoring that I explained my "slight-of-hand" point quite fully, and for someone reading so much I'm confused why you didn't address that in making the case on me, because it should either weaken or strengthen your prime point - instead you duck it.

What am I missing on both of those?

[Thor665]

I'm pretty sure the scum are Thor & Nacho. If I'm wrong about one of them, substitute shos in.

So really what you're saying is;

Scum is Thor/Nacho
or Thor/Shos
Or maybe Nacho and no Thor and no Shos.

[Thor665]

To your second point, I don't think you did. At least not in the way you're framing it.

Except I kinda did.

He is only cleared if Aru is town.
He is cleared because in a game like this - that's not a viable scum play to be the derp hammer, it's fine (and optimal) to be on the wagon, but the spotlight seat? Not so much.

[Thor665]

Heck, I explained it *before* I did the "slight-of-hand" So...yeah. Whassup?

[Thor665]

At this point, I think the possible scumteams, in order of likelihood, are:

[snip of derp]

So quit trying to take yourself out of the equation.

1. I didn't
2. You're the one who presented the reads weirdly considering this clarification. Why did you do it that way if it wasn't what you meant at all?

And you're misunderstanding me. I'm not talking about your read on F16. I'm talking about the way with which you presented it to F16. I mean, that's the whole point I was getting at.

Like, look, you're telling F16 that he should see you as town because either you have an accurate read on him

Actually, if you go back and read what I said, i said he shouldn't care why I had the read on him.
You said it was because I was avoiding explaining that read though...when I already had (and, for the record, I already had explained it and then had that derp demanding I explain it...so, yeah, the snark was totally a scum plan)

Tell me more.

[Thor665]

1. Um...you did notice that in the previous scum pairings I listed for you that I featured quite prominently - what the heck? If that is me trying to take myself out of the equation then *you* tried to take me out of the equation with your last list because you also had slots not involving me...explain?

Also, you didn't answer why you used such gakked up language if it wasn't what you meant.

2. It wasn't because I was avoiding explaining the read.

It's how you arrived at that read that counts.

Scum can say a player is obvtown because they know the setup. Town can say a player is obvtown because of an argument. Are both players right? Technically yes, but

they arrived to those conclusions for completely different reasons

. This is just the kind of three card monte trick I'd expect from you as scum.

Tell me more.

[Thor665]

1. I presented me as scum with Nacho 'first' as well, so I upheld your order...again, how did I try to fade out of the order by not including myself (or Shos) in a pairing you agree should not include either of us?

2. You started with saying it was because I hadn't explained my reasoning. When I pointed out I had explained my reasoning (even prior to my dodge) you changed the tune. Is that just me? Clarify your issue and also tell me how when you first brought it up you showed that this was your issue and I'll drop the whole thing.

[Thor665]

Oh, and yeah, your language was gakked up because you said Thor.Nacho with Shos if wrong about either - but really meant Thor/Nacho or Thor/Shos, or Nacho, but not with Shos or Thor. So, why say the initial thing where Shos was buddy with either if wrong about the other?

[Thor665]

@ RedCoyote, I get what you are saying regarding Thor's post to me. He says that if he is scum, and I town, I should rejoice since he made it more difficult for himself to mislynch me. But that's not all there is to it since he doesn't account for the fact that if he were scum, part of my goal as town is to lynch him - not just rejoice.

Which would hold true, if the question was you having a town read on me.
I was telling you I wouldn't justify a read on you - which is a totally different thing.

Why do you think Red Coyote looks town?

[Thor665]

post 156 kinda made me feel wierd about thor. it's all stuff that *can* be looked at as town but, that's not enough. Can you explain to me, once again, why you have a town read on F16? you said 'not just the quickhammer' - so that implies that quickhammering actually is a towntell in your eyes? please elaborate.

I have explained the quickhammer thing before.
I have explained it to *you* before.
So...?

My main problem with Thor is how he's treated his vote on me. If Thor thought I was scum and was being cagey to squirm away from him, there's no way in hell that he would let me straight up ignore him while he defended himself from everyone else. I mean, he tries to call me out on it, I sheep his own terrible reasoning, he calls me out on that, and I go back to ignoring, and he... starts arguing with RC?

Thor wouldn't ignore my dodges if he was town.
I'll admit he called me out on the dodges...but not *every* dodge.

Also, kindly ignore that he went after Red with a discussion largely about Red's take on Nacho and Thor.
Also ignore that the only posts I had since the last time I talked with Thor were admitting that I dodged Thor and going after Shos - I guess Thor could repeat what I'm openly admitting, but he didn't, so he is scum.

Nail that about right?

What's your read on Red Coyote and my interaction with him?

[Thor665]

@Nacho - you didn't respond to me responding to your 'Thor isn't responding to me' case.

[Thor665]

You're even voting me now, you can't play the 'I'mma ignoring him' game.

[Thor665]

So are you being cheeky scum or useless town?

[Thor665]

I see Thor is L-1, nacho is L-2.

If you're town - that alone is a clue.

[Thor665]

Nope, we be awesome discussion.

[Thor665]

I'm always willing to 1v1.

Especially when the guy hasn't even explained a vote on me, has avoided discussing me, and has called out as a scumtell 'chainsaw' on a guy who isn't even me and is the player he's actually made a case on who he hopped off of without so much as a bleat.

Also when the supporters are FF's "case" and Red Coyotes' case wherein I'm scum because of my interactions with Nacho...who is scum.

[Thor665]

I see Thor is L-1, nacho is L-2.

If you're town - that alone is a clue.

Also, I can't for the life of me understand what you're trying to say here.
Because my mind immediately jumps to both scum being on my wagon with town voting elsewhere, but that's clearly not what you were going for.

I'm saying scum are pushing my wagon and that's why it's larger.
Because I'm town.

@Red - In the least offensive way possible - the wall post of yours kind of hurt.
WHy not help me "bus" Nacho for lulz? Maybe explain why my scumtells of 'not tunneling' and 'saying something about my read which you decide is actually meant to be taken as someone else's read' makes me more likely scum than him, yeah?

[Thor665]

You do realize he did accuse me of that though, yeah?
How do you feel about Red's case on me?

[Thor665]

That was a terrible case full of derp, and if you're town you should have said it out loud first so people could have explained it to you.

I'm town.

Nacho needs lynching.
Red needs looking at.
Case on me is derptastic and you should all feel ashamed.
Nacho is mostly scum because he let it slide by and he's smart enough to understand how bad it was.
Oh vey, town, seriously?

[Thor665]

Good lord, and Greg is now the second person voting me while saying they think Nacho is crazy scummy.
What is this gak, does it make sense when you think it?

[Thor665]

Because I probably have the time I'm going to run through this because it annoyed me that badly.

Don't like it. As myk allready mentioned, town doesn't call itself town. scum does.

Town doesn't call itself town...scum does.
Newsflash: Every player in this game is claiming town.
Now, how does saying it out loud make me scummy? Oh, wait, it doesn't. Worst you can claim is that I'm trying to convinve people I'm town, but that's a null tell in most ways because town should be trying to do that too.

His vote is omgus and he keeps going on about myk not being overly motivated. Myk isn’t, true, but that doesn’t make his vote on myk any better.

My vote on myrk was not omgus except insomuch as it happened during RVS - my later case on myrk was *specifically* not omgus, and it makes me wonder if you even know what that means.
Also, read the rest of your sentence "Thor calls Myrk out for something Myrk is indeed doing...it doesn't make his vote better"
Um...yeah, that's actually the definition of making a vote better if you agree ith my reasons. So...what the heck, boy?

Early day 2 vote on nacho, as expected. He and nacho had Smurf reasons to be on the lynch.

"As expected"
Also known as "attacking someone I think looked scummy Day 1...y'know, like town would do.
The hell?

Yup, eighter you and shos are partners and are trying to get a counter wagon rolling. Or, you’re town and I’m probably voting a wagon where 2 scum or on already. 1st nacho, and 2nd…

Yeah...so both scum are desperately on Day 2 trying to combo work to lynch the raw powerhouse of scumhunting that is "obvious to vote scummy looking guy, Nacho" or...Thor isn't scum.
This isn't even a case on me, it's a case not to vote me.

Thor has been the most concerned about looking town of all players.

Again, not a scumtell - also, it does NOTHING to make me Shos' partner, which is now part of your derp logic here, so...?

While I feel nacho is scummy as hell, I guess it’s his playstyle. I’ve been wrong about him last time all game long, Don’t really thrust my gut read on him anymore.

You read Nacho as scummy, but you always do so...y'know, probably just got to ignore him because that's how to play the game, ignore the people you have trouble reading.
CERTAINLY we don't want to put attention and pressure on people who we are unsure of our ability to read.
Don't want to ask them questions or get their reads on ANYTHING, yup, that's how it's done.
Brilliant!

Nacho should be made to answer my last question to him, fyi.
Greg needs to learn his cases should be said out loud before voting - because he's not actually able to differentiate between a case and a 'well, let's do this' feeling.

Also, he should be made to explain who Cobalt is...I'm guessing Coyote, but...egads.

Random thought I just had: Is Red Coyote's QT name cobalt? I almost feel like it is.
Someone should probably check on that.

[Thor665]

Disregard. It isn't.

[Thor665]

Nacho - I hate your vote on me still

Greg's vote was still the worst though, especially when he tried to act like it was bad the town had been quickhammering.

[Thor665]

With a scum quickhammer and this town?

It's a win with an asterisk.

[Thor665]

I mean, dear lord, even look at Red's and FF's "cases" on me - total asterisk.

[Thor665]

I don't know why I suspected you, Thor. I guess when someone with two scummies including "best mafia performance" suddenly said I was obvtown for quickhammering, my first reaction was "wtf? Smart scum?"

And Thor, really, how the f*** were you so sure I was town? It was remarkable really how you figured it out. Also, Thor going up against Nacho made me believe one of them was scum.

I explicitly described how I got that read. Nacho even sheeped it, and you decided that made him town...though only because he had seen how badly you had reacted the first time. Maybe you should have instead asked how he agreed with my read if my read was so intrinsically mystical and strange?

Btw, Thor, can I steal your wiki layout? It is awesome.

Go for it.

[Thor665]

I would agree that Nacho won it for the town.
Town was working hard not to win too.