Open 611 - Making Friends and Enemies (Game Over!)

[Luna Fox]

Hello All!

[Luna Fox]

All i've said is hi and i got 2 votes already.
I'm so good at this.

[Luna Fox]

Also kill is town for not voting me.

[Luna Fox]

So in this setup Masons act like cops that recruit their town results huh.
If i take a wild guess it's a risk for scum to become way too town because Masons may target them, likewise probably being too scummy would make them likely to get lynched, considering im thinking scum might try to fly under the radar or stay "not townie enough" maybe my townhunt + PoE playstyle would be advantageous.

[Luna Fox]

Does anyone have any more insight in this? preferably anyone that has maybe played this setup before?

[Luna Fox]

would be advantageous.

Also i meant to say useful, not advantageous.

[Luna Fox]

What don't you like about my setup analysis.

[Luna Fox]

I'd admit, that is rather odd. Wouldn't Masons attempt to target scummy people or townish people alike? More so scummy players?

Because then they can surprise scum late game by having a bunch of conftowns without scum realizing.

[Luna Fox]

Besides, if Masons focus on towny players, while during the day phase we lynch scummy players it gives less spots for scum to hide in.
While if a scum can become super towny, and wont be lynched and Masons dont attempt to recruit them then they can easily coast until endgame undetected.
So i think this course of action will corner scum more easily.

[Luna Fox]

Your post was very much like fence sitting. You said they wouldn't be townie or scummy, but this is implying that players naturally scummy all the time.

Ok i guess this is a very good counterpoint.
Which is why I asked in my next post if anyone had any insight on this, because i may be thinking of it the wrong way.

However, i ask about this situation, imagine there's a player ppl suspect, then suddenly there's 2 ppl that now townread that player the next day, wouldn't that be too obvious for scum to find the masons?

[Luna Fox]

I'm asking because I want to know people's opinions.
I'm not fencesitting, i made my thoughts clear as day. Tho if people still can't understand them then they can ask.

[Luna Fox]

I mean the 2nd part of what i quoted.
How is insight not opinions?

[Luna Fox]

everyone who's posted so far is probably town

I kind of agree, not sure on ika tho.

[Luna Fox]

Heartless is town btw.

[Luna Fox]

I still don't understand why i'm being voted.
I'm being transparent with my thoughts.

[Luna Fox]

Literally everything you say is scummy as fuck.

You just gave a town read to Heart without even explaining the read.

It's more or less gut.
Their posting looks townie to me, I've always gone by always speaking what is in my mind, so i said it.

[Luna Fox]

Also please explain, how what im doing is scummy.
And please be honest whether you think if it's just scum motivation or just dislike the posting or play style.

[Luna Fox]

What's wrong with gut reads this early?
I'd argue that gut reads early are more common than later.

[Luna Fox]

I'm not a noob tho...

[Luna Fox]

I'm not really worried about the votes per se.
Im worried about the issue that i don't see the reasoning behind them.

[Luna Fox]

I see clear reasoning, you seem awfully ready to hand out town-reads.

I town hunt.

[Luna Fox]

I see clear reasoning, you seem awfully ready to hand out town-reads.

I town hunt.

So does scum

This doesn't make sense.
Scum knows who is town.
They fake scumhunting to achieve mislynches.
Never heard of scum fake townhunting.

Tho i guess it's easier for scum to townread ppl.

[Luna Fox]

Well either way.
Town hunting is my style.
And i'll keep posting my thoughts.
Wagon or no Wagon.

And i'll continue to do so until i die or we win.

[Luna Fox]

All ika did was sow suspicion on an analysis post.
I didn't like that, because it's like saying i shouldn't be analysis the setup or coming with a good game plan to help us solve the game.

[Luna Fox]

It felt like "Oh hey that post is scummy and im not going to say why and let town argue with each other".

[Luna Fox]

I explained the details of my game plan, this is not meta related.

Besides it's quite easy for scum to fake scumhunt when all they do is say someone's scum for post X and then leave and let the towns do the scumhunting and attack each other.

[Luna Fox]

My post was entirely serious.

[Luna Fox]

My post accomplished multiple things.
1) I laid my thoughts about the setup.
2) People dropped the RVSing because now they are focusing on some content i.e my post and all the reactions to it.
3) I have now townreads on multiple people based on their reactions to this.

I do have to say that my post accomplished the goal of getting us out of RVS and got us moving.

[Luna Fox]

That was a side effect that wasn't intended but i can deal with that.

[Luna Fox]

I'm around yes.
I dont know how you got rolefishing out of that post tho.

[Luna Fox]

I'm around yes.
I dont know how you got rolefishing out of that post tho.

mayeb not rolefishing but it did give me a vibe of stuff.

gun to the head right now, where ar eyour town/scum reads standing

Town: Heartless/kill/fire
In that order.
Scum: Was leaning you, but your latest posts are making me doubt it.

[Luna Fox]

It felt like "Oh hey that post is scummy and im not going to say why and let town argue with each other".

I explained the details of my game plan, this is not meta related.

Besides it's quite easy for scum to fake scumhunt when all they do is say someone's scum for post X and then leave and let the towns do the scumhunting and attack each other.

[Luna Fox]

While your reason for think that post is scummy is still kinda meh (i still don't see role fishing there), considering you came up with an entirely different reason than the rest means that your purpose wasnt to incite town into doing the scumhunting for you so that you could piggyback out of it, so i was wrong about your motives, and that's why im reconsidering.

[Luna Fox]

luna, you need to slow down

what you mean.

[Luna Fox]

acutaly the funny thing is that i made an near empty vote on a sigle post.

everyone else started putting random reasons in which i actualy find intresintg

Do you agree with their reasons?

you've got about 1/3 of the game posts so far. step away for a bit and let the game breathe and come back later when other ppl have said stuff.

I'll probably step away soonish anyway since it's getting late.

[Luna Fox]

Exp, you ever seen a townhunting playstyle? Serious question.
And in case the answer is no, how much mafia experience do you have?

[Luna Fox]

No, I don't know what you mean. I presume that it involves finding scum by clearing other players as town. Is it something specific to this setup?

Not exaclty "clearing" per se. But you're close.
I basically have an easier time on picking things that town does, rather than scum faking stuff, so usually i'll find scum by them being on the people i townread the least (or not townread at all) via the use PoE.

[Luna Fox]

I don't mind if you think it's stupid.
Think like we scumhunt in reverse then lynch from the people that are "the least townie".
You shouldn't be discrediting a whole playstyle before you see it yourself tho.
I think your hesitance to trust is due to lack of experience, and i dont necessarily think you're scum for it. But always remember that what you find scummy is not necessarily because the person is scum, it could also be a playstyle clash, or the way the person portrays their words.
This tends to lead me to a lot of false positives specially with more aggresive players, so i've taken on the townhunting playstyle instead.

[Luna Fox]

@Luna who is your strongest town read?

Heartless

[Luna Fox]

Luna: town, at least she's trying to reverse scumhunt or whatever. I don't have any problems with her setup speculation, as I said earlier.

Killthestory: slight town, gives me more of a tryhard town than tryhard scum vibe. Either way she's accusing people for dumb reasons.

Firebringer: town, I agree with #46 and he's contributing good points to discussion.

Gob: town for now from the few pretty good posts he's made, if he posted more I could be more sure.

Ika: null, I don't agree at all with what he's saying about Luna rolefishing and me being scum accusing everyone for solely playstyle differences but I guess he could just be town with a different perspective to me and an inability to spell coherently.

Heartless: slight scum, #124 is pretty bad. I think a town member wouldn't read literally everyone who has posted all at once so dismissively. Otherwise he hasn't said much of value.

This is the extent of everyone who has posted before you.
Remove Heartless since you're talking about his reads and you have.
Town, slight town, town, town, null.
Isn't this what Heartless is reading with the exception of you having a null in ika?

[Luna Fox]

Now Luna, convince me with your most recent posts you're actually town seeing as all I'm seeing is a bit of sheeping and useless reads.

It's not my job to try and convince you that i am town.
My job is to play to my playstyle and find scum in my own way (in this case via PoE after townhunting).
If you don't see me as town, then i can't help it, i'm already doing what i can.

[Luna Fox]

Probably doing Alchemy.

[Luna Fox]

I'm liking Alchemist's entrance a lot, he's town too.

[Luna Fox]

Btw, the only thing bothering about Exp wasnt the fact that he also townread everyone up until that point, but the fact that i can't see how gob is town, gob is just a big ball of null for me as of right now.

[Luna Fox]

He alludes that he explains everything and here:

Gob: town for now from the few pretty good posts he's made, if he posted more I could be more sure.

10/10 explanation.

[Luna Fox]

Oh it's all clear to me now
Firebringer is....


A SUMMONER!

Everytime he votes a player, that player appears in the thread!!!!

[Luna Fox]

Luna's Foxy read list version 1.0

Towny

Heartless
Alchemist21
ika
Killthestory

Nullish Town:

Firebringer

No idea yet:

Draynth
VeeGee
gob
ronit
GrayFoxxxx

Don't like so far:

Vedith
Expedience

Vote: Exp

[Luna Fox]

If anyone has any questions for a read except for those on "No idea yet" feel free to fire away.

[Luna Fox]

If anyone has any questions for a read except for those on "No idea yet" feel free to fire away.

Why are you town reading Heartless and Killthestory?
Both of them are null for me.

Kill gives me the impression of being an aggresive towny.
Antihero's posts of the hydra give me a gut town feel

P-Edit:(Re: Alch) That and i agree with most of the stuff he' said in 161 specially this:

I agree there was an inconsistency, but think it was the result of oversight on Luna's part.

Means he's not just looking to throw mud, but he's analysing whether it's scum motivation or just town that made a mistake (in this case an oversight), in which ase he's right in the assesment. Scum would probably see something like that and would use it as an excuse to pile on me.

[Luna Fox]

Could you explain the Vedeith read? When fire refused to do so I chalked it up as some kind of pressure vote, but since you're seeing something there too I'd like to know what I'm missing.

His read on Exp feels off.

[Luna Fox]

So let's talk about Exp's entrance

105 discredit of the town hunt strategy, again as i mentioned this was more of because of lack of experience so it's a null point.
108 mudslinging at kill for a playstyle difference.
111 wishy-washy stance (although he corrected this in his reads list)
posts 112, 115, 120 are all null because we're talking about what townhunting means.
128 Townreads everyone but ika and Heartless, gob townread is odd and unexplained, Heartless is scum for townreading everyone, which he's also doing.
132 An expansion of the Heartless townread.
134 Saying that the difference is he gave explanations for the townreads (why is he focusing on the fact that heartless didnt explain them, instead of asking for an explanation?).

What did you like about this.

[Luna Fox]

An expansion of the Heartless

townread

scumread.

EBWODP:

[Luna Fox]

But before Exo was posting, didn't you think of everyone as town but Ika? Please explain your point on him town reading everyone but Ika and Heartless. And what's odd about his read on Gob?

He's accusing Heartless of townreading everyone.
If you remove Heartless he's also townreading everyone (except ika who is a null).
He's accusing Heartless of not providing explanations (Yet he never asked for them).
He also never explained his Gob read or at least not like his other reads, this bothers me because of all the people that had posted at that point Gob is the only one im not townreading and idk why he thinks his posts are townie.

Exo actually believes that the reasons he gives are right and valid, even if not, believe me on this. I'm not saying I agree or disagree with any of his reads, but I like how he comes in, questions you for only town hunting (something I would do). 108 is a valid point about KTS. And to point the obvious out, he gives reasons for his reads, which is more than most have so far.

See and this is the kind of explanation i was looking for.

Again - How can my opinion on an entrance be the reason to go in your scum section (I assume that's what the section is).

It is not, if it was I would've named it so, but I left the naming vague and open to interpretation intentionally.

Either way im satisfied with your explanation of the Exp townread, i disagree with it, but It doesn't look fake, so you can be town too.

[Luna Fox]

It is not, if it was I would've named it so, but I left the naming vague and open to interpretation intentionally.

Although now that i mentioned this it probably wont have any effect on Exp anyways so im just going to say that it is a "People im disagreeing with and i would like to figure out why" list.

[Luna Fox]

Actually, look back through Expedience's ISO. It's not just Luna he attacked, but killthestory too. Then somehow, instead of pushing those two, he has both at the top of his Townreads, and uses the same reasoning he attacked Luna for to Townread her. I know this was after he got some pushback from others for attacking playstyle, but to me that kind of reversal looks more like scum trying to stay out of the hot seat.

It actually makes it even more odd when you think that ika attacked him for those 2 comments.

[Luna Fox]

i'm kinda' getting happy w/ tth's firebringer vote, ika

even though hes softing to be a mason right now?

Whyyyy would you mention this D:

[Luna Fox]

Besides, you don't always need a case to scumread someone; you just need to find solid evidence that they're playing with a scum mindset.

Or in my case, scumread because PoE

[Luna Fox]

Odd for Exp or for Ika? Not sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me here.

For Exp, I'm agreeing with you.

Like

>I dislike this post about townhunting
>I dislike this thing kill said looks like tryhard

>Ika votes Exp because of those

>Ok those 2 are town.

[Luna Fox]

I'm going to bash my head into a fucking wall because of these moronic comments.

this is unnecessary, remember that this is a game so let's all be nice to each other ok? ^_^

[Luna Fox]

@Mod: there was a vote at the bottom of 193

~Thanks, it's super early! Apologies.

[Luna Fox]

Unvote

Yeah i think Exp is being honest here.

[Luna Fox]

I like whoever head of Heartless is talking there.

[Luna Fox]

Now heartless is making me rethink my fire townread.

[Luna Fox]

Unvote
Vote: Firebringer

Gut read

(or is it?)

In all honestly i do find his posting and voting odd, and the fact that he wants to be a shitposter, the gut read statement was just a snark remark to his gob gut scumread (i dont even get a scumread there myself, just a bunch of null at worst)

[Luna Fox]

Ok

[Luna Fox]

I actually think that goodmorning and grayfoxx could be scum.
So you might have a point.

LURKERS = SCUM. LIKE 99% OF TIME! Well on homesite anyways

^
Might indicate goodmorning is town, the player he's replacing never read their role PM so this seems like a low blow, considering he's now voting town and goodmorning is probably still in the process of catching up.

[Luna Fox]

Naah, I am just trying to take these games less serious.
I had a meltdown yesterday on a game. I was so angry, don't want to be that angry at a game anymore.

Sigh...
Why do ppl do this.

[Luna Fox]

I meant violating the ongoing game rule.

[Luna Fox]

My head is spinning right now
I don't know what to think of Fire after reading 287

[Luna Fox]

You know what.
I'm just gonna ignore it... sigh.

[Luna Fox]

I am not even voting goodmorning atm.

You made that post when you were voting goodmorning so this isn't a counter argument.

[Luna Fox]

I already knew Grayfoxx was scum due to ongoing game slip (seriously GrayFoxx dont do that ever)
Also the reason i replaced out earlier was because of fire making an ongoing game comment that was bothering me too much and list mod suggested me to rep. out.