Newbie 1836 - Game over

[northsidegal]

hey all! i'm still a newbie but i've finished a few games by now.

what are everyone's thoughts on doing the bulletproof strategy, for those who know what it is?

VOTE: acid - i can't handle avatar changes.

[northsidegal]

if you guys don't want to do the strat i get that - it's a lot of mechanical talk to go through.

VOTE: voyc, serious vote.

[northsidegal]

1) First of all, how dare you, 2) I have to agree that your random vote post really comes across as being the kind of goofy-friendly that you can really only arrive at by calculated intent, and 3) from a bin of at least one player, it is possible to choose exactly one player to vote for from each bin and nobody can prove otherwise and I am obviously not going to miss a chance to exercise the axiom of choice on Gödel.

Don't these words look very opportunistic?

Its very "I'm gonna join the wagon because I really have no idea why". This really goes on the radar

do you think zitto is scum trying to get a quicklynch on godel? hopping on rvs wagons is usually a towntell to me.

[northsidegal]

Well, if someone claims BP that'd make them conftown

Wait a minute... when did this power role speculation start and why is this happening? Ya'll need to stop

zitto, this is exactly why i voted you. it seemed at that point that we weren't doing the bulletproof strategy and scarlet's thought process was clear enough that your question seemed like rolefishing.

what are everyone's thoughts on doing the bulletproof strategy, for those who know what it is?

How could I miss this I wanna vote this honestly

why?

[northsidegal]

zitto, this is exactly why i voted you. it seemed at that point that we weren't doing the bulletproof strategy and scarlet's thought process was clear enough that your question seemed like rolefishing.

I am a little confused, in as much as you have not voted for me and my only comment on the bulletproof strategy was "I don't think it's in the spirit of a newbie game and I don't think we should." Am I missing something or are you talking to someone else?

err, sorry, meant to say voyc.

[northsidegal]

i honestly have no clue on nsg's alignment; nsg is familiar with the "spew ur alignment game" and i'm going to try to make her play it

oh, is that what you were going for? i'm town, are you?

I keep flip flopping on Scarlet, but if I absolutely had to say one or the other, probably scum

what's that coming from?

[northsidegal]

do you think zitto is scum trying to get a quicklynch on godel? hopping on rvs wagons is usually a towntell to me.

Why would this be a town tell?

rvs wagons are an early way to generate content. it's unlikely that anyone actually gets quicklynched from them, so there's not a lot of risk associated with it.

@scarlet, were you considering voting Godel in post 45?
@northsidegal, what're your thoughts on acid?

Ohanaa are you going to join us sometime soon

so far this is seeming to me like acid's town meta, although i'm not sure i have enough experience with him to say anything conclusive.

[northsidegal]

Ohana made two posts, and the second one just felt off. I really wouldn't know how to explain further than that
I'll have to see when he posts more

This just supports my feeling that your read is not genuine.

I’m also doubting that you chose an open game that ended five months to be part of your reading material before joining your first game.

in the interest of fairness, the first couple of games that i read before i started playing were from january, march and april. it also seems unlikely to me that voyc would lie about reading an old game instead of also just using the excuse of seeing the avatar in the newbie queue.

[northsidegal]

sorry, i meant to post here yesterday but i figured i'd wait until voyc said something. i'm not really confident on anyone other than voyc. ohana or godel maybe?

[northsidegal]

i've had a few games finish over the past few days so i should be able to devote a bit more time to this game. this is what i'm feeling right now:
{nsg, scarlet}
{micc, acid}
{tne, ohana}
{zitto, godel, voyc}

[northsidegal]

can someone explain to me what Norths formatting represents. is it town at the top to scum at the bottom?

sorry, i should have explained this - yes, it's ranked from top to bottom as town to scum with people separated into levels.

i think someone asked for an explanaton of my scumreads, here they are:
i read zitto as a newbie rolling scum for his first game who doesn't have the experience of how townies think and act and so has to make it up. he's got kind of a mechanical tone that reads as more alignment-indicative than personality-indicative to me.
godel is acting skittish - it's not just that he doesn't have strong reads (which i don't think is a true scumtell), it's that he seems scared to express his reads.
i'm still uncomfortable with voyc's posting earlier in the day - nothing she's said so far has changed that.

[northsidegal]

Northsidegal - Pretty quiet since we've moved to discussing reads. Being busy happens, but I read clamming up as slightly scummy. I still read overall as town, but not nearly as strongly as before.

quelle coïncidence on the timing!

Santa hat avatar is the bee's knees, though.

thanks!

[northsidegal]

Acid - Extremely brief comments. Strong insistence on TNE as 'obviously town' with very little justification is extremely frustrating, and most posts include little explanation and lots of 'gut-instinct' justified reads. Why people say they are voting is as important as who they vote for.

this is acid's meta, as far as i can tell. moreover, that kind of playstyle is the meta of a lot of people on this site. i share your frustration with it but you have to recognize that it doesn't always come from scum.

[northsidegal]

yeah, i'm just gonna come out and claim. i'm bulletproof.

[northsidegal]

sorry for my apathy this game, but i just find it a little bit of a boring role to have.

[northsidegal]

wait, am i being counterclaimed or not?

i'm actually pretty surprsied that scum chose to take a shot at me, but thinking about it a bit more it tells me a lot. choosing to take out the conftown over the first two nights is a great long-term strategy for scum: deny town nightkill info for the first two nights and remove a conftown from lylo. this makes me thing that coming out of day one, scum were probably in a pretty secure position and decided to play the long game rather than removing a voice they really didn't want to be heard. this is all, of course, assuming that they picked up on all of the hints dropped that i was bp. otherwise, i might have just been chosen as a low-info kill. i don't see that as particularly likely, though.

50/50 chance then. Between earth and North. One is bullet proof. One is mafia. Oh F***.

Luckily, no matter what happens today we will have a caught scum. I think earth is telling the truth.

This is because of simple deduction. Thinking as mafia, the person who'd I want to kill would be the Towniest. In this game, it would mean myself, Micc and acid most likely. Not earth. However: what if something I said was likely needed by them? I thought North was BP due to an assumption. However, the mafia wouldn't want me to confirm them Town unless they weren't Town.

could you clarify what you're saying here? i'm not really understanding what you're getting at.

On top of that, earth is an experienced player. They wouldn't claim BP if they were mafia because it would mean that they'd be lynched the next Day, especially since we have one mislynch available. It would put us in a more precarious position, sure, but their interactions from yesterday could be analysed much more easily.

By process of induction, I believe North to be scum.

Either that or I'm stupid.

i'm still not sure if i'm explicitly being counterclaimed but if i am then i'd actually agree with you here - i'm not entirely sure why tne as scum would counterclaim me here.

[northsidegal]

Anyways, I don't believe nsg's BP at the moment.
Hey @nsg, why did you decide to claim?

i had planned to claim anyways today, even before scarlet asked me about it and before i saw that scum had shot me. it helps process of elimination the game down.

[northsidegal]

okay, tne scumclaimed. i thought about it for a bit and i don't see any way to reconcile what she's claiming with what i know to be true. plus, the way she went about this was incredibly scummy. like, given what you're saying you should have voted me the second that i claimed - instead, you just soft implied that you were counterclaiming, probably to guage everyone's reaction before deciding whether or not to follow through.
VOTE: thenewearth

[northsidegal]

H A H A H A H A H A

There's the "I'm got outed so I must vote the counterclaimer"

oh poor child

i mean, i don't think you're pulling some incredibly stupid gambit so yeah, you just scumclaimed. discredit me more, though.

[northsidegal]

I already said that I'm actually hesitant on claiming because of some past experience

Why do you think I said "Old thenewearth would have just counterclaimed instantly"

and if I actually counterclaimed I could have thrown the game

confscum, tbh

i think you just made that up to explain the "testing the waters" of the counterclaim. like, this should be giving everyone pause right now:

tne if somebody targeted someone then it's 100% confirmed fypov that nsg isn't bp

read: if it's actually tracker / bp there's no way for anyone to target anyway except nsg and get a no kill in the end

[northsidegal]

get a no kill in the end

I already explained the past experience which made me wishy washy and sloppy in counterclaiming

I mean I admit I was sloppy because trauma and paranoia but I was literally baking cakes and saying "GUYS I'M COUNTERCLAIMING BUT I'M SCARED THAT SCUM ACTUALLY NOKILLED LAST NIGHT"

so what changed your mind? there wasn't any new information between your initial softing and you counterclaiming that would have indicated one way or another if scum nokiled, so why didn't you say anything initially and why did you say something later? this is why you're lying. well, i know you're lying - this is why other people should realize that you're lying.

[northsidegal]

Please don’t waste space in this thread arguing with each other. I don’t think that’s going to be helpful here.

i'm not just trying to argue with her, i'm trying to convince people that i'm town. i'm not convinced that we can win this unless we lynch correctly today, so i need people to believe me.

[northsidegal]

the very second post i made was in regards to me being bulletproof. i explained a little more clearly in 65, but voyc's 31 seemed like rolefishing to me given what scarlet had picked up on and implied. i also thought scarlet picked up on me being bulletproof because she was the tracker, which is why i put her on the same level as me in my readslist:

i've had a few games finish over the past few days so i should be able to devote a bit more time to this game. this is what i'm feeling right now:
{nsg, scarlet}
{micc, acid}
{tne, ohana}
{zitto, godel, voyc}

[northsidegal]

Why does scarlet picking up on your bulletproof crumbing lead to you thinking she's a tracker?

the way she saw it so obviously made it look like she had info from the setup that a bulletproof was in the game, and the exact converse had just happened to me in a game that finished recently where i was the bulletproof looking at someone else's tracker claim. i think there was a crumb or a hint somewhere that made me think she was tracker over jailkeeper, but it might have just been me still in the mindset of that last game - either one pointed to a pr, anyways. i'll go back and look.

[northsidegal]

Don't scum have an incentive to look for and recognize PR tells as well? Did scarlet being scum cross your mind?

honestly, not really. like, combined with scarlet just seeming really towny to me, i feel like scum would try to give as little indication as possible that they'd picked up on something like that - they'd just share it with their scumbuddy. yeah, maybe it could just be a newbie thing but it really didn't seem that way to me. looking at what she said about me in 152 gives me the obvious impression that she wanted

me

to know that

she

knew, and i don't see why scum would do that.

[northsidegal]

okay, this shouldn't have happened. scarlet, i think it's time to come clean.

if i was wrong about this then i don't even know what i'm going to do.

[northsidegal]

i was trying to roleswap with scarlet. i know i probably shouldn't have done something so reckless in a newbie game but i was absolutely confident that that was what was going on. i initially wasn't sure if that was what was going on but her just outright asking at the start of day two made it seem obvious to me. it seems at first like we had gotten the worst case scenario where tne had tracked scum to scarlet, but after she claimed that micc was the one visited then i knew for sure that it actually was a scumclaim.

[northsidegal]

now, given the doctor claim i'm thinking that the far more likely scenario is that i misinterpreted things, attempted a really stupid play and almost guaranteed a scum victory.

[northsidegal]

i don't think there's anything i can do to change anyone's mind at this point, so i guess all i can say is that you should all thinking about what happens after i flip town.

[northsidegal]

worst game of my entire life, total embarassment.

i actually made the bulletproof claim when i wasn't paying attention and didn't notice that micc didn't die. sorry to godel for messing things up. good game to everyone, even still. i hope none of you take this game as an indication of how good i am at mafia – things aren't usually like this.