Mafia Invictus Redux [Game Over]

[SirCakez]

I'm hoarding all my posts this game so their value goes up

[SirCakez]

vla until monday

[SirCakez]

everyone who has posted so far is town, with the exception of dwlee (whose first post is nullishly scummy) and gamma (whose post i did not bother to read). please discuss.

lets go im in the town block

actually no Datisi is being kinda scummy

VOTE: datisi

[SirCakez]

VOTE: takotsubo syndrome
Definitely want more there

what is the "more" you are looking for? more content? it was like a few hours into the game when you posted that

Hi all. 125 posts per day doesn't seem like too much of a restriction.
I actually like Fey for bandwagoning to Datisi, but don't really have any opinion on the other votes or anyone else rlly

VOTE: Meuh
I feel like you're trying to do too much out of the gate? I mean, if you're town, I don't want to discourage you from solving. But it doesn't feel natural to me at least.

I like this post. Feels organic and kinda mirrors my thoughts as I've been reading.

81 - how can anyone have such a massive readslist on page 4? wtf? it feels pretty forced

94 - pretty good vibes from this post. I like Luke's thought process esp regards to Kovu.

[SirCakez]

more later left off around mid page 5 but i gtg

[SirCakez]

Im still out on vacation but I'm gonna try and skim to offer you guys something before I can give real content when I'm home Tuesday

[SirCakez]

nah I feel bad and it's not that much to read
also I got prodded so I feel I should post something

[SirCakez]

i was wondering why every fucking post was a wall post and then I remembered this game's post limits

[SirCakez]

yes. i was looking at his posts and the thought i was having was "get to the point already".

i know you're going to ask about it again so

- "but don't really have any opinion on the other votes or anyone else rlly"
- "I mean, if you're town, I don't want to discourage you from solving. But it doesn't feel natural to me at least."
- "I was put off by you immediately talking about which posts pinged you town/scum. And the tone you used really felt a bit odd because your reasoning seemed to consist of short, vague bursts of words. For example, "hints at actual scum hunting", "pretty solid vibes", ...
Those phrases had the effect of feeling not-genuine to me."

^^ the entirety of this last quote could be expressed in much less words. too much padding.

- "I don't see why early bandwagon votes are that bad, but I do think it still is generally thought of as "scummy"."
- "Tako genuinely could be scum though. I can agree that the content is not great there."

what i mean by "aren't directly related to solving the game" is that the idea that the person wants to express can be expressed in 10 words but they use 100 words to express it. it comes across as a fake attempt to boost their word-count while not adding content to the word count. if i get bored by reading the posts, it's usually a sign this is happening.

this attack on Val seems so forced. it seems pretty obviously to just be their posting style and it feels like Datisi just wants something to press on.
and I'm not feeling his excuses for being awkward early on. he's always awkward but this and some other posts feel outright scummy not just typical awkwardness.

i have a strong desire to kill the two people who wrote reads lists on page 6 and below and chose to include me on them with 0 posts.

LLD is town LOL

I would like to point out that Marci voted Datisi in post 19 saying "I THINK HE COULD BE SCUM"

But the reason being presented once he became a real wagon was because he was ignoring votes - which distinctly cannot be the reason why she voted him originally in post 19, because Datisi had zero posts between Baltar casting the first vote on Datisi and Marci voting Datisi

UNVOTE:
VOTE: marci

Doing my daily catch up currently, but I think fire's exchange with marci probing their thought process and how it doesn't actually track (posts 84 and 86), as well as Marci's tepid response, combined with luke's point here are pretty solid reasons to think Marci could be scum who got a little too overconfident early.

this post is kinda ringing alarm bells for me
this feels like such a weaksauce vote for Baltar it's basically just sheeping Luke and fire
marci doesn't even feel great but Baltar is inspiring no confidence here

Also, Marci going against a scumread on me? That’s new. I was expecting her to scumread me by now

Do you think it means anything in terms of her alignment this game?

Marci and I tend to read each other poorly, especially early on in games. A whole lot of inaccurate scumreading.
I still don't think it's unrealistic for Marci to feel neut about me here though.
What does feel off about it is her using this read on me to push back on Datisi. Even if she does feel neutral about me, I don't think she says this:

i also *shocker here* dont agree with meuh feeling off yet, i think she hasnt done much alignment indicative yet and i think ur hating on her for her basic personality

This does not really seem like a way to go after Datisi that I expect town!Marci to do.

Honestly my approach on reading Marci as of late is to just not do it on day 1
It's not worth the effort in forming a read that'll probably be poor and I'd rather spend that time and energy somewhere else.
I think I'm decent at reading Marci later on in the game with flips having happened so I'd rather do it then. (viewtopic.php?p=12746354#p12746354)
There's a need for it here though because of the wagon on her, and while I don't feel great about her, it's not as strong of a feeling as the one on Lavar.

Also I just found out you can highlight a part of a post before quoting it and it'll only quote that part??? That's so useful how did I not know this

if Marci is scum this is probably scum too

VOTE: takotsubo syndrome
Definitely want more there

what is the "more" you are looking for? more content? it was like a few hours into the game when you posted that

More content, more justification for the vote, anything telling of their alignment. I think their vote on Datisi was scummy. I wanted to throw a vote on them for pressure's sake.

however this is a solid answer to my question

maybe sircakez but thats because i don't like his starting post.

what was even wrong with my opening post?? I thought it was funny

Semi worried this is a noraa situation though.

I also don't like Baltar throwing hesitance into this wagon here

Elsewhere...

-Certain Dunn posts are making feel this is his town game. I usually catch onto him fairly quickly when he is scum and I am not feeling those vibes here.
-I feel okay townbinning Kovu based on page 7
-i'm seeing LavarManos votes and honestly the slot just feels like LHF in a game full of killer mafia players and I'm not interested in that wagon at all
-none of Bell's posts feel good like at all. he could def be scum too.

UNVOTE: til I'm read up

[SirCakez]

i only got to the top of page 10 but I have to go ugh

[SirCakez]

I have absolutely no time for this game today but a quick skim of last two pages shows me a Baltar wagon forming so I'm there

VOTE: baltar

[SirCakez]

FINALLLYYYYY HEREEEEEEE

[SirCakez]

Going to resume from the top of page 10 but feed me questions and anything you want to hear from me while I work on that!

[SirCakez]

I favor Datisi's response in 218 over Marci. It feels like Marci was trying to attack at things that weren't really issues if that makes sense?
And I like that Datisi went on to pressure someone else too. He avoided the sort of 1v1 death spiral that can kill games.

@baltar, give me your hottest take on this game, stat

hottest take is probably you could be scum here.

Second hottest (with absolute zero reasoning beyond GUT) is there's one scum in gorilla/gamma.


Mostly though, I think marci doesn't look great and that's about as LHF take as one can get right now.



On the town side, my takes right now are that fire, Dunn and Val are all town.

the most boring weaksauce takes possible from scum Baltar

- oof i don't like anything cakez has posted. esp 197, like i disagree with almost every point made here. and the last time i remember that happening it was scum. and from what i read of his past play in large themes what he's done so far feels a lot closer to how he struggled to get footing as scum

what do you disagree with?
I haven't been in this game at all because it literally started the day I left for vacation

Can someone vig sircakez.

why have you been completely obsessed with me this game?

[SirCakez]

I should give some bits of the game a reread because some of it I just don’t really remember or spent much energy on interpreting.
Not that much has been sticking to me thus far.
Dunn/Gorilla/Fire/VB/Lukewarm/Bell probably town here

Also what’s the expected number of scum here? 4? 5? Never played this big of a game on this site.

these reads suck how could you have VP and Bell as town? and what has Gorilla done really?

I’m willing to sheep you on this and my vote fulfills essentially the same purpose on Enchant than on Tako. I wanna see where this goes and you’ve had good vibes as of late anyways

why sheep Lavar here? that's such an odd pick to follow of all people this game

As a sidenote, I disagree with your Dunn townread - I think I've seen like 3 people say they townread him and to me he looks the same as he did in the last game I was in where he was scum (Slaughter Hour), and I don't remember him being different in World of Tomorrow where we were both scum with him either (though my memory of that game isn't great tbf and I checked out a bit after I died). Like I haven't seen him as town in ages and it's still early game, but his vibe still seems like *he exists a little bit but never sticks his neck out and makes a big deal of anything relevant*.

I don't think this looks like slaughter hour Dunn. He was way more apathetic there.

I have not read the game entire, yet it
Is thought by me — the wagon Bell attracts
Quite good may be. I cast our vote for him;
He has not here his normal tone he seems
To me to lack conviction that, when town
He has achieved in role PM, he with
Swift, easy facility presents in game


VOTE: Bell

My friend still stays with me in fair Madrid
No posts shall here forthcome until the morn
~Reason

this could definitely be a Bell scumbuddy
there's zero conviction in this vote and it feels like distancing IMO

[SirCakez]

I'm at e-4 I think. I don't either either Marci or I are good wagons.

literally a shitpost
Bell is so scum this game guys I've never seen him play as garbage as this as town

[SirCakez]

Meuh seems town to me.
Fire seems town to me.

Marci seems likely town to me, but I'm uncomfortable saying that when Lukewarm has a ping there. Then again, not listening to Lukewarm has been A+ the last 2 games lol.
Dwlee, I'm not sure they embarrass themselves by thinking the Marci/Bell wagon has scum in it as scum, it's fairly risky and gives them heat later that they don't really need.
Datisi, is just....Meh this game. They feel plain. But I don't know what to make of it.
Tbh, beyond a few sparks of slight creativity Baltar feels the same as last game. They got mad, but all I got from it was a brain dead vote on me, it was probably the worst vote this game, but hard to tell if it's just a character trait or not given they're relatively new to me.
I roughly agree with the universe aligning with Kovu, they're just as odd as usual. I dunno know that automatically makes them town but it might.
I actually think heart syndrome sounds vaguely town but they're sort of a none presence so it's hard to know for sure.

That's all I got so far.

This isn't antispew btw, in case you were wondering.

look how bad this readslist is
"maybe town but not sure"
"not sure if they do this as scum"
"don't know what to make o it"
"hard to tell what Baltar is doing"
"vaguely town and hard to know for sure"

these reads are trash. literally completely made up.

[SirCakez]

Bell’s recent string of posts is very townie-like and they’re probably my strongest townread rn. Both situationally and based on their own actions they should be town.

?????????????

honestly I'd love to hear more on the Bell TRs, cause this isn't exactly mirroring the bell!town I'm familiar with, this bell isn't doing too much, but it's also like half this freaking table is doing nothing, soooo idk, someone called enchant town right? I'm also really curious on that.... cause enchant is one that still has 0 content

thank you lion

we've been here 3 IRL days... and 8 of yall don't even have 10 posts, like, it's not that hard to ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME YOU SIGNED UP FOR...
Probably time to step away for now, but seriously, EIGHT of you can't even post 10 times???? and 1 of the 8 is literally a hydra that seems to care more about their gimmick than playing the game

this complaining is pointless but also probably town

...and how do those reads relate to the prospect of Bell flipping scum?

Both are being independently useless and bemoaning in their own way how people posting in the game right now, which is primarily coalescing around a Bell yeet today, fmpov.

It reads to me like an effort to shift the status quo without drawing too much attention.

how is being useless a scum tell? especially the kind of useless Kovu is being.
it's just not really scummy FMPOV like at all

Town andante wants blood. Kovu is a snoozefest of petty complaints.

what even... so I'm supposed to sit here screaming for blood all game? oh my bad, it's a little hard to do with 8 slots doing absolutely nothing to advance the game. Yeah I posted a readslist, so what? it was largely just asking a bunch of questions to people? you ever think I'm tired of playing like I'm "out for blood" Fey literally just spent a game yelling at me for "throwing" while I was town I figured, new account, we're keeping the tryhard mode, less "shenanigans" more organized thoughts... and you're shitting on me for what?? trying? giving reads? wow.. so freaking scummy

and this feels really genuine in a way that scum Andante is not

[SirCakez]

what do you disagree with?
I haven't been in this game at all because it literally started the day I left for vacation

from 197:
- i thought mueh's vote on takotsubo was good, so i wasn't really a fan of the questioning there
- strong disagree with your liking of lavar's post, and especially with the characterization of it as "organic", since i felt it was p stilted and unnatural sounding.
- kovu's readlist... eh, i can understand how someone might have that reaction, so not a strong disagree even tho i don't think it feels forced
- liking 94. i did not really like the vibes from luke in that post, the content was fine and i actually agreed with most of the things he said though, so i think its reasonable to like it fypov. something about the way he approached it though just pinged me a little, but looking back now i don't feel that as strongly

but still, uh, almost everything in the post, like i said. the biggest thing was the lavar post though

I didn't have a problem with the Tako vote I was unclear on what exactly Meuh wanted whether it was more vote on Tako or more content from them. I think Tako was and still is a decent vote (but obv not my preference atm)
The reason I said that about Lavar is because it was basically the same thought process I had and post I would have made at that point in time. like I can clearly see how a town brain got to that point. maybe organic isn't the right word but I can see a town mindset there. but I also understand why people could not like that post so whatever.

look how bad this readslist is
"maybe town but not sure"
"not sure if they do this as scum"
"don't know what to make o it"
"hard to tell what Baltar is doing"
"vaguely town and hard to know for sure"

these reads are trash. literally completely made up.

what makes you think that bell's d1 reads having words like "maybe" and "not sure" makes him more likely to be scum? like yeah you can call it "bad" but that sounds pretty zero level to me, and i don't really buy that your confidence here is legit

I've played with Bell town mannnnyyyyyy times. He has confidence in himself and he plays to actually scumhunt. these reads just look super forced and passionless.

[SirCakez]

if you claimed something I missed it or its in the 10 pages I'm still working on

And either scum read me every time you were scum or misread me with over a thousand posts.

where's the receipt for this?

I can't even remember the last time I scumread you

[SirCakez]

Still skimming, but is anyone else getting the feeling from the last couple of pages that Kovu really wants someone to scumread me for a lack of activity, and is getting frustrated noone is biting?

no this take sucks

all ill say is that it seems like u were premaking excuses

it is funny yes, it makes it seem like ur playing both stocks and mafia at the same time but yeah

okay

LLD is town LOL

Also, what in the actual...

it was half a joke but also I feel LLD would more likely make that post as town
I need a lot more from her though but I respect she was also V/LA

[SirCakez]

ok Bell has been softing some sort of confirmable PR whatever...we'll see
happy with my Baltar vote in the meantime he keeps posting crap on every page I read
few more to go but nearly done

[SirCakez]

we'll see
happy with my Baltar vote in the meantime he keeps posting crap on every page I read
few more to go but nearly done

Yes, I'm the one posting crap.

[SirCakez]

I could sheep Luke on Val from the case in 530
I think especially the points about 390 and 405 are solid, those Val posts didn't make any sense and seemed way too self-focused which I expect more from scum. And the point that Val is not really sorting just staying focused on like two things is also solid.

To save the posts for you of asking/questioning, etc, I'm Ydrasse.

oof I was getting ready to townbin Fey but now I'm not sure :/
Ydra is good enough to have faked everything Fey has done so far

Also it's weird to frame this as... an excitement thing, like. What. That doesn't make sense that you have to qualify it as excited = town or whatever you're doing here.

the most recent game i played with you is the one i'm using to read your emotional state as that game you linked was six months ago. you were EXTREMELY excited to play town in spring fling and i know you dislike playing wolf.

your argument with me early game felt like you were grasping at something to use to appear as if you're solving when you didn't feel like playing.

like if this is accurate Ydra is more likely scum here because I haven't really felt any passion or excitement from any of their posting

Also it's weird to frame this as... an excitement thing, like. What. That doesn't make sense that you have to qualify it as excited = town or whatever you're doing here.

the most recent game i played with you is the one i'm using to read your emotional state as that game you linked was six months ago. you were EXTREMELY excited to play town in spring fling and i know you dislike playing wolf.

your argument with me early game felt like you were grasping at something to use to appear as if you're solving when you didn't feel like playing.

Oh, I think I understand part of the disconnect here.

I play radically different on Ydrasse compared to my alts. Even if it's not different... logically I guess, I can't change how I think, I tend towards being... more like this during them. The alts that are obviously me but I don't out and say it but I type fancier.

Ydrasse is me as... Ydrasse, socially. This is me as Me, sort of Ydrasse, sort of not.

Also... I don't dislike playing wolf at all... in fact I enjoy it a lot, maybe more than town, just not when I roll it 10 times in a row.

how would you say Fey is different?

More sircakez votes. Please and thank you.

this push is just so obviously faked
what is Bell even so convinced off of here? I was on vacation for the entirety of the game to this point. and he even conceded that my attempt at content (which wasn't even great) during my V/LA was okay. but then he just rewinds and goes back to this. there's no town flow to his posting here.

[SirCakez]

okay my brain is hurting I don't want to post anymore

I want to kill one of these people (baltar, val, rhyme and reason, dwlee, tako/mala, marci)
these people are in my townbin (kovu, lavar, gamma, gorilla, luke, dunn)
everyone else whatever

[SirCakez]

I didn't realize Bell had softed PR until halfway through catch-up

[SirCakez]

Is your perception of RR entirely based on equity with Bell?

No I think they are also scummy in a vacuum

why were u still shadjng him tho?

Cuz the claim isn't proven yet and also he's pissing me off lol

[SirCakez]

Cakez I need something on why you think Lava is town please, I'm really thinking maf there, so I need you to really sell it to me/convince me please

Can you tell me why you think maf first?

[SirCakez]

I don't mind the Meuh vote on RR I was thinking about it myself

[SirCakez]

VOTE: marci
Reading up definitely fine with this wagon

[SirCakez]

I'm not interested in a LLD lim because her alignment will be more obvious if we give her a few more days right now it's a crapshoot

[SirCakez]

Lavar feels like a scum driven counter wagon y'all I have seen no signs this dude is scum

[SirCakez]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: lavar

Late day surprise wagon! My favorite.

oh HECK yeah let's go

VOTE: Lavar

Why is LLD on this list and not RR?

Why would we be on the list? Before this post basically nobody had called us town.

This bit is something I would see myself post as scum tbh

I can go find examples of me saying similar stuff as town if you'd like (but only if it would help, it's time-consuming). Or we can just ask the many other people in the game who are familiar with me if it's AI.

I very much want to see a counterwagon to marci for reasons I already laid out, so even though I just got town vibes on Lavar I think it's proper to VOTE: Lavar

I haven't heard from Mena yet but I would expect him to agree with me.

-Reason

I don't want Marci. I realise my opinion on the matter might not count for much when I've been floated as an alternative, but I'll give it, since my lack of involvement in the wagon so far is probably clue enough as gamma pointed out previously.

I got a slight town ping from 40, although I accept that sort of thing could come from scum surprised a made-up read was endorsed by a townie, I also think it would be some co-incidence to hit the same ping on the 8 players posted pre-marci entrance on page 1. My initial reaction to Lukewarms' push there was that is was opportunistic garbage, and seeing datisi wholeheartedly jump on and endorse it with 'lolscum' whilst trying to give justification (albeit shit ones) for everyone else sealed the deal for me that the case was crap. Having seen luke temper and then reverse it leads me to believe the case there was initially deliberately exaggerated and oversold, and in truth is probably +town for luke as well as marci.

I've been voting datisi since "RVS" too, although it was never actually an RVS vote. I've deliberately chosen to be cagey about my reads, which may have led to the impression there is a lack of scum hunting going on, too. Those are the reasons I see given for the wagon now, and I can't see them as scummy because I know there is at least one genuine thought process that results in those same outward signs.

I've not given too much though to LavarManos since I noted datisi's strange justification for that read, which when examined I strongly disagreed with, and thought had to be basically invented. I might have been hasty there, if for no other reason that nothing prevents scum from inventing reasons for giving a 'slightly scummy maybe?' read on a partner.

If this is the two we are going with;

VOTE: LavarManos

All of these people are null to scum - over half of the wagon and all of the later votes. Definitely could be scum driven.

[SirCakez]

And there was a big wagon on Marci who is pretty much a universal scum read. Why did that fall apart? Town evidence for Marci hasn't suddenly come to light

[SirCakez]

If there's gonna be a counter to Marci I'd rather do Val, RR or go back to Baltar

[SirCakez]

And there was a big wagon on Marci who is pretty much a universal scum read. Why did that fall apart? Town evidence for Marci hasn't suddenly come to light

^trying hard to save lavar.

Obviously lol I think he's town

[SirCakez]

did u miss that whole ass discussion me and luke had about my voting tendencies

who do you scumread besides datisi?

datisi, datisi, datisi, datisi, and datisi

sircakez

maybe luke idk i feel like even though i have a bad memory, i feel like nothing has really made me go ": O" in his posts

Marci isn't even trying to scum hunt look back at this post
She has developed nothing all game except for her repeated attacks on Datisi and me. I don't believe she's actually scum hunting.

[SirCakez]

All of these people are null to scum - over half of the wagon and all of the later votes. Definitely could be scum driven.

If the

later

votes are the scum ones then how is it scum-driven? Wouldn't it be town-driven but scum just decided to jump on? (And for scum to have a reason to jump on would pretty much necessarily imply that marci is scum, otherwise they wouldn't care, so it wouldn't make sense for one of these people to be the CW to marci.)

-Reason

Yes that's fair. More accurate would be that scum are taking advantage of town willingness to wagon elsewhere.

[SirCakez]

This is a game I am in.

Oh yeah I would for sure wagon this too

[SirCakez]

VOTE: LLD

Aye

Or this I didn't really have a read on Enchant but it's pretty crappy that this was the only thing he had to offer recently

[SirCakez]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: lavar

Late day surprise wagon! My favorite.

why should i vote lavar?

Hi all. 125 posts per day doesn't seem like too much of a restriction.
I actually like Fey for bandwagoning to Datisi, but don't really have any opinion on the other votes or anyone else rlly

VOTE: Meuh
I feel like you're trying to do too much out of the gate? I mean, if you're town, I don't want to discourage you from solving. But it doesn't feel natural to me at least.

VOTE: takotsubo syndrome
sorta sus that nobody has voted this slot yet

I find it weird that Val didn't reelly respond to anything Lukewarm said about him
VOTE: Val

She is here, and posting - but she is not championing me as the scummiest person in the thread lol

Nah I disagree. Feels like she has been attacking Datisi and VPB a lot. You aren't even calling her scum anymore. I scumread her recent posting style too.
VOTE: Marci

There's nothing wrong with any of these votes IMO

[SirCakez]

Yes that's fair. More accurate would be that scum are taking advantage of town willingness to wagon elsewhere.

Sure. And my understanding is that when picking a CW you want to have at least one scum in the two if possible; otherwise you get pretty much no info. So it doesn't really make a lot of sense to wagon marci alongside someone who's only likely to be scum if she also is. In fact, if marci is scum, then I think we'd want a townie to be wagoned alongside her, so that we can see what stances people take and why.

It's not too late for wagons to move around but if we do end up with two dueling wagons at the end of the day, and one flips town, it's probably a good idea to aim invictus shots at the other one, if there is no better target.

-Reason

I would rather the wagon just stays on Marci I don't want a counter right now. I'm just naming other people as possible votes for me going forward.

[SirCakez]

This is a game I am in.

Oh yeah I would for sure wagon this too

VOTE: LLD

Aye

Or this I didn't really have a read on Enchant but it's pretty crappy that this was the only thing he had to offer recently

why are those wagons better than the current ones we have? enchant is like a coinflip at this point and gives us no associative info so idk how you think that would be more pro-town than making people take a stance on marci vs lavar

I didn't say they were better wagons I'm just saying both look scummy and have given basically nothing recently so they are suspects I'm noting down.

[SirCakez]

Like the only reason I could get for people voting him is that his posting is a little stilted and that his self-admitted tinfoil of Datisi & Marci being scum together is bad. Like he knows nobody's going to agree with it, that's why he said it's tinfoil, and I still think his early posts were good with him flatly saying what he thinks but being open to looking at other things/potentially being wrong about early reads.

Exactly
There's not really anything I can point to for Lavar scum but many things I can for other people scum

[SirCakez]

I'm reversing my read on marci. Everyone wanting to wagon for the sake of having dueling wagons should explain why?
VOTE: Datisi as a placeholder

This makes 0 sense if Lavar is scum like c'mon

[SirCakez]

If I was scum here I would have dived on Lavar ages ago regardless of his alignment

[SirCakez]

Datisi (2) marcistar (19), LavarManos (950)

Look at this y'all
Marci is still on her page 1 vote and day 1 is almost over
She is not even really scumhunting

[SirCakez]

Because if Lavar is scum why does he leave the counter wagon to him and his best shot of surviving?

[SirCakez]

Because if Lavar is scum why does he leave the counter wagon to him and his best shot of surviving?

The Marci wagon pretty clearly has much less momentum that the Lavar one. I could see the vote just be a last-ditch attempt from Lavar to save themselves.

A Datisi wagon has even less interest then Marci

[SirCakez]

I did read that conversation fire but it didn't change my opinion

[SirCakez]

did you think the reasons weren't good? or do you still think that there aren't any reasons at all?

No I saw the reasons I just don't think they are indicative of Lavar being scum compared to why I think he's town

[SirCakez]

Yeah it was a really bad Dwlee post

[SirCakez]

Kovu is obvtowning so hard right now

[SirCakez]

VOTE: dwlee let's do it

[SirCakez]

Yeah but they are doing it even more

[SirCakez]

Nobody wants to lim Enchant because their slot is a nothing burger with no interactions to work with
Better to Invictus it

[SirCakez]

Ok but if Lava is scum why not just join the Datisi wagon outright?

[SirCakez]

I mean the Dwlee wagon

[SirCakez]

Hm okay I'll see what he does next

[SirCakez]

Dwlee has been in my pool for a few days for being useless and their recent popin to shade Lavar was really bad as I said a few posts ago

[SirCakez]

My point above being that the above post feels selective in that you don't include the information that doesn't support your viewpoint, or seem to care what I am doing because I'm not a popular wagon right now, which feels inconsistent

I ignored it because I've gotten tons of towntells from you earlier on so I didn't see the relevance

[SirCakez]

So enchant was in your pool too, but because enchant didn’t recently make bad posts you’re voting dwlee instead of enchant?
Your vote would be uselessly hanging off enchant if Dwlee had made a prod dodge post instead?

enchant wasn't in my pool until some shitposts he made later on

[SirCakez]

Datisi is not scum here his opening was questionable but he's towned it up a ton since that

[SirCakez]

What an ass day 1

[SirCakez]

I bet scum were all over the Lavar wagon the reasoning for it was so bad

[SirCakez]

VOTE: val89

[SirCakez]

Lld kill definitely seems like scum who are comfy but scared of being LLD'd

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Dunnstral

started okay, mostly fell off, vote on lavar kind of bad, not a lot of scumhunting.

I could sheep this
Dunn really fell off towards EoD1. Feels more like his scum meta again now and the Lavar vote was for sure bad.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Dunnstral

started okay, mostly fell off, vote on lavar kind of bad, not a lot of scumhunting.

What an ass day 1

I bet scum were all over the Lavar wagon the reasoning for it was so bad

I find it hard to believe that Cakez town read Lava as hard as he claimed day 1. I also didn't like the way that he engaged with the case on Lava itself.

It feels more like he is just trying hard to look like The Person Who Was Right.

VOTE: Cakez

Wow because I said Lavar was town all day 1 then he was town and I got frustrated that seems unusual? Forgive me for having a read correct

[SirCakez]

VOTE: SirCakez

Total scum move

[SirCakez]

Feels more like his scum meta again

Prove it

Show us how that's my scum meta

I easily could and you know that

[SirCakez]

I mean, I'm kind of coming round to you being town now after looking at your ISO again Cakez (plus S_S thinks you're town) but I had some pretty bad desire to kill you yesterday and that was definitely part of it, so I don't think Luke is crazy for thinking along the same lines

~Rhyme

You can think I'm scum but I hate that Luke is using me being correct about my Lavar read as the reason because it's like saying that I wasn't actually good enough to have just read Lavar correctly

[SirCakez]

why was datisi town... i really thought he was scum i feel so useless maybe i shouldnt be so one minded

we all know you're scum Marci you can drop the act

[SirCakez]

VOTE: val89

Do you scumread Dwlee?

Ya but going back to EoD1 wagons usually doesn't go great

[SirCakez]

why was datisi town... i really thought he was scum i feel so useless maybe i shouldnt be so one minded

VOTE: val89

Do you scumread Dwlee?

Where is Bell's "role confirmation"?

[SirCakez]

Ftr I turned around to town reading Datisi by the end of the day

[SirCakez]

"you're reading me wrong so you're scum" is not exactly the most convincing of cases.

"You are reading me wrong when you managed read Lavar (who appeared was being treated very similarly to me) correctly with an huge degree of confidence, so you're more likely scum than a player with excellent reads in these circumstances" is convincing, at least for me.

I don't think Lavar and you were really comparable because a wagon never got going on you and you're clearly posting differently then Lavar was

[SirCakez]

Did not mean to hit submit lol.

Cakez, a while back I did a bunch of meta to calculate Dunns dat 1 activity compared to his alignment, and found fairly consistently that he was more active as scum and more likely to just lurk our day 1 as town

It is not 100%, but across a multitude of games as both alignments, it was a pretty clear trend.

I do not think that the meta point you are making about Dunn is valid in any way.

I have found that Dunn activity level is pretty clearly tied to how invested he is in a game. That is independent from gis alignment but being scum inherently make him more invested, although he can get invested day 1 in games as town as well if for example he is excited by the set up or the player list.

I'm not arguing meta based on activity anymore

[SirCakez]

I have 0 interest in a gorilla wagon

[SirCakez]

If you were not talking about activity level, what were you referring to here.

His post quality
Ex; his vote on Lavar

[SirCakez]

To me, it's not that you were correct, but that you came to that town read very strongly without very good reasoning, and that you're now trying to use being correct on Lavar as a cudgel. You're playing an angle on that wagon that is very convenient if you're scum.

Huh? Where have I done this? All I've done is scumhunted based on who looked like scum pushing Lavar my stance on it was irrelevant to that sort of scumhunting

[SirCakez]

beep boop

[SirCakez]

It's literally what you're doing with dunn. You just posted about.

Dunn's vote on Lavar was bad regardless of my stance. Lavar flipped town and scum were almost certainly involved in the flip. It's like you're arguing we should just not be scumhunting based on Lavar being town.

[SirCakez]

Town enchant is freer and tosses votes around a lot more. This enchant knows he is probably going to get invictused and is trying to keep his head down mostly. That's my read based upon recent games I've played with enchant town.

that said this is a decent argument for Enchant scum. the guy has been totally useless.

[SirCakez]

reiterating that the gorilla wagon is horrible

[SirCakez]

What about you being able to confirm that Bell is town would have meuh "get rocked" for suspecting you?

I think the way I played that is pretty obviously town, which of course I'm subjective about, but objectively, if I'm scum and get that message, I doubt I come out immediately and start crumbing before Bell posts. Scum!VP would have waited for Bell to make the first move before posting. So ultimately, I think Meuh looks worse for attacking me baseless at day start.

this is just irrelevant scum!Baltar gains nothing from covering up the confirmation because it would just create a 1v1 with Bell and him

I don't like how they tried to shade me with meta that isn't true and then said they weren't talking about meta anymore when they pretty much still were

literally never said this but ok

[SirCakez]

Dunn's reaction to me calling him scum is really bad. It's exactly how he'd play this as scum (and has happened before) and I'm about to go find the receipts to prove it.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: dunnstral I think I was still on Val

[SirCakez]

In Slaughter Hour Dunn was scum who I spent a good amount of time pushing before he got killed

VOTE: dunnstral
I think this is now my strongest scumread
He is playing to his scum meta to a T - drive-by posting, lack of investment, few memorable posts or pushes
I can't really think of a scum team in this playerlist that doesn't have Dunn in it while I could see Peta or Unwnd not being in one

Unwnd if you are town here I could really use your thoughts on Dunn

Null

Thought town for a minute but changed my mind. Don't want to think about right now. Confident in solving later.

like this is one of those things that gives me pause w/unwnd because it seems like a weirdly artificial avoidance of Dunn when he just dropped big reads on most of the other players

like I make definite statements but I am open to changing my mind
i'm not some deathtunneler
no one has presented any reason for Dunn to be town so why would I change my mind on that?

as seen here

VOTE: SirCakez

Basically don't think Skitter scum defends Cakez the way she has if Cakez is scum

i would not make that assumption


granted on a gut level she's still town but i have nothing deeper until we get some form of actual flips and voting

Yeah alright I'll discard it

Are you fine with voting Dunn off? Assume no based on your posts

I'm not being voted off, I'm being voted into a duel. You should probably know that I'm, like, 70% likely to win anything that isn't complete rng here, even at a disadvantage, if we're being completely honest. Just saying. Oh also Cakez is scum.

then he IMMEDIATELY responds with OMGUS and starts trying to discredit me
EXACTLY what he's doing here guys

[SirCakez]

I also feel very comfortable with my townread on Lukewarm. I'm treating Kovu as town for reasons previously discussed. I still think Marci is more likely town than not.

I don't pretend to be able to read enchant particularly well, but their votes and other content we have has all made at least sense to me, neither am I detecting any difference between enchant here and town!enchant in the games I have seen. I have some sympathy for the argument that enchant will be a difficult sort and we might need to consider dealing with it sooner or later, but I think they deserve more of a chance for something else to happen to make that alignment more clear, and I'm not interested in a vote there today.

I want people to actually start reading my posts, so I will give justification elsewhere, but I wouldn't vote Dunn today either. I could probably be convinced to join a wagon on anyone else not mentioned, but my strong preference is for SirCakez, as indicated by my vote.

like all my scumspects suddenly developed scumreads on me after I laid out my scumpool yesterday and I don't think it's a coincidence

[SirCakez]

And again, I should note that for someone who allegedly believes I am being defensive, all Dunn seems concerned with is arguing against scumreads on him.

gorilla is seeing the same things I am

[SirCakez]

Cakez's D1, in particular his push on my slot, was pretty much exactly what I expect his towngame to look like. I don't know how well he can replicate that, but given that it often gets him into trouble, I wouldn't expect him to make an effort to replicate it as scum? Though of course I'm not totally sure.

I would think you being town would make Cakez look worse in your eyes, given that he would have then pushed you and two confirmed town players (also threw shit at me), all while being wildly overconfident Lavar was town pre-flip. That's a lot of red flags in my book. It's confusing you are reaching an opposite conclusion there without something you feel is absolutely outside his scum range.

I don't think RR is scum anymore and haven't for a while, ftr

[SirCakez]

He often makes weird pushes and is overly confident in things as town.

Are his reads terrible too? That's not necessarily my experience with Cakez

dude I celebrate if I get a read right lol

[SirCakez]

I also feel very comfortable with my townread on Lukewarm. I'm treating Kovu as town for reasons previously discussed. I still think Marci is more likely town than not.

I don't pretend to be able to read enchant particularly well, but their votes and other content we have has all made at least sense to me, neither am I detecting any difference between enchant here and town!enchant in the games I have seen. I have some sympathy for the argument that enchant will be a difficult sort and we might need to consider dealing with it sooner or later, but I think they deserve more of a chance for something else to happen to make that alignment more clear, and I'm not interested in a vote there today.

I want people to actually start reading my posts, so I will give justification elsewhere, but I wouldn't vote Dunn today either. I could probably be convinced to join a wagon on anyone else not mentioned, but my strong preference is for SirCakez, as indicated by my vote.

like all my scumspects suddenly developed scumreads on me after I laid out my scumpool yesterday and I don't think it's a coincidence

I would very much like to kill Cakez today if anyone else is interested.

Like, here he is pushing the idea that scum would scum read him for scum reading scum. Ignores the fact that he town binned Dunn Day 1, but Dunn was pushed him.

Spoiler: Dunn shading Cakez, while cakez is still calling dunn town

My point above being that the above post feels selective in that you don't include the information that doesn't support your viewpoint, or seem to care what I am doing because I'm not a popular wagon right now, which feels inconsistent

I ignored it because I've gotten tons of towntells from you earlier on so I didn't see the relevance

It also ignores the people who are scum reading him that are not in his scum pool. (Me, I am talking about me. He has done nothing but call me town, but is then calling other people suspicious for doing something that I am also doing).

Yeah and did Dunn spend any time day 1 pushing me? no he didn't. has he spent most of today sitting on me? yeah he has. what changed in the meantime? not rocket science

I didn't say people scumreading me are scum so your last bit doesn't make any sense
I'm saying that I think scum want to get rid of me at this point, assuming my scumreads rn are correct

[SirCakez]

i had to skim the last few pages because there were tons of walls and my brain is fried from my first day at my internship yesterday (should have been my second but lovely tech issues!!!)
I think my stances here are clear. I'd still be happy to lim Dwlee, Marci or Val on top of Dunn. We can do Enchant too, ig but that's boring.

[SirCakez]

How can you accuse me of not reevaluating when you just talked about how I was town reading Dunn so much day 1 and now I'm voting him

[SirCakez]

Or even, if you are really convinced that I am town, not realizing that that means that at least one townie has you as their absolute strongest scum read, and therefore a townie could legitimately think you are scummy here, and therefore people scum reading you would be kinda NAI

Like, either one of those would feel more natural then what I am seeing right now

This is again just not getting what I was saying
Where have I said that town can't be scumreading me right now? I never said that.

[SirCakez]

Okay I re-ISOed Dunn and they have not been on me as much as I thought
I will still stand by their recent reaction to me being bad

[SirCakez]

I specifically said that it seems weird that there is no hint at re-evaluating Me.

Especially given the context of how I have been approaching this game when compared to the people you are scum reading.

You have a pretty good PR claim why would I reevaluate you at this point? I feel fine townbinning you unless some evidence comes up you're fakeclaiming

[SirCakez]

Luke you're acting like every player in this game is the same person who I should treat exactly the same when y'all are different and honestly this conversation is just annoying me so I don't really want to continue because you clearly are not going to end anywhere but scumreading me so what's the point
Dunn I'll get to tomorrow I'm gassed rn

[SirCakez]

I specifically said that it seems weird that there is no hint at re-evaluating Me.

Especially given the context of how I have been approaching this game when compared to the people you are scum reading.

You have a pretty good PR claim why would I reevaluate you at this point? I feel fine townbinning you unless some evidence comes up you're fakeclaiming

It seems like Luke's role could equally be a scum role. Not sure what as described makes it town for sure. It comes down to whether you read his play as town, imo.

I feel the manner of his claiming was town. Like it makes sense to me why he claimed it from the town mindset - he needed help with the role and was worried he wouldn't get functionality out of it. ig it also depends on what it actually does when he gets the "match"

VOTE: Dunn
Was gonna wait for a response to my question but I don't think it will sway my read that much on the slot. I think the pattern Cake pointed out is right

ughh this gives me the ick it feels like their Lavar vote day 1

@Dwlee; I'm looking at the combined ISO for Arcade Pals and The Three Bears, and I'm not seeing this derisive OMGUS you described. Looks to me like Dunn was voting the hydra well before the reverse, and Noraa (baby bear?) didn't have a lot to say on him or Arcade, but it's a huge game to sift through. Help me out with a post number?

I don't think this looks like slaughter hour Dunn. He was way more apathetic there.

In Slaughter Hour Dunn was scum who I spent a good amount of time pushing before he got killed
...[snip]...
then he IMMEDIATELY responds with OMGUS and starts trying to discredit me
EXACTLY what he's doing here guys

SirCakez using the same game to reach two different conclusions on Dunn's alignment is a bit odd, too, no?

I already said this earlier but I'll reiterate that my read shifted from day 1 to day 2 bc Dunn started strong then had a wet flop of a day 2. I wasn't the only one who noticed his downshift d2 either.

[SirCakez]

The Dunn scum meta I was referring to before I mentioned his bad reaction was just a general poor quality of posts day 2. Like less engaged, less scumhunting, etc

[SirCakez]

Nah if anything I'd say it was bussing

[SirCakez]

Sorry I was misleading earlier
I just mean both votes seemed similar in regards to how you showed up midway through the wagon and popped the vote on without much leadup

[SirCakez]

I will try to get in here later but I'm feeling really awful rn :/

[SirCakez]

Sorry I owe you guys content

[SirCakez]

I'm really far behind so I'm gonna skim so I can give something

[SirCakez]

Ya but going back to EoD1 wagons usually doesn't go great

This might be pertinent, with the other EoD1 wagon now sat on E-2.

What makes you say this, Cakez?

Just experiences in the past where we double slimmed town day 1 and 2 in a row because people automatically go "oh one of them was town therefore the other must have been scum"

[SirCakez]

Last sentence kinda confusing. I want to vote cakez or my new shiny scumread more than Dunn

Weren't you just sheeping me on Dunn? This doesn't add up

[SirCakez]

I AM SO SORRY IM SUCH A BAD PERSON

Marci scum claiming

[SirCakez]

I mean, I have info that I'm almost certain clears cakez so yeah, he's not being limmed here

Remember in Ktane when you lied multiple times as town. You should stop doing that.

I know what Kovu is referring to it is legitimate not a lie

[SirCakez]

Mentally I'm just shot right now irl
if someone has something for me to sheep let me look at it otherwise I just want to lim a universal scumread
Sorry guys

[SirCakez]

I choose a player, and if we are Invictus targeting the same player, our Invictus target dies. I am functionally a gated vigilante. That is why, when Bell outed as confirmed town I asked him this question.

And this is a town claim even though Luke's reads are bad rn

[SirCakez]

Gorilla vs Luke is ass and obviously TvT

[SirCakez]

Ok, I actually think marci just claimed scum.

VOTE: Marcistar

This post.

Nah, kovu is town. This kind of ridiculousness is pretty town indicative, imo.

idk i remember when i was scum with andate in like holiday dance party she got townread for some shit similar to this

i dont see why what shes done is town indicative? like og i saw it but the more i look at it the more its similar vibes yknow?

Marci's main point is "I was scum with andante and she played like this" what? the lack of talking I'm doing? I literally have more posts than you. Similar vibes? the vibes are not similar at all. Holiday I was dead lost and didn't read any of the game. I even said that 50 million times in scum chat to yall. Here I'm actively around, sure this week got crazy, but I've still been here and responded to everyone saying Kovu. So what is this main argument you have for me being scum then? Cause I'm not seeing it.

It really feels like you're calling me scum for my "lack of spamming" here on day 2, but when I literally have more posts than you, 10 times more than mala, it's just like, what is the basis to your argument here for me being scum?

> I don't see what she's done that's town indicative
Ok um, didn't realize we were playing "Guilty until proven innocent" but, can you honestly give me towny points for everyone else here that you can't give for me?


So back to the main point, I truly believe this is a scumclaim from marci. she sees that I've been "lurking/coasting" and just goes "oh yeah, when I was scum with you you did that!!" like, why is that anyone's first thought, back to the 1 game you were my scum partner for a game in December... where I was home with family, and not thinking about literally any other game? I think the simple explanation is quite simply marci is just maf, and thinks this is a "good" argument to appear townier, but I quite simply don't buy it, and I don't believe there's good intentions behind it, pretty clearly looks like a scum claim to me.

Now marci, if you wanna back up this claim you're making with specific posts, I'd love to hear more, but if you thought I wasn't gonna stand up for myself, and that I'd be an easy push, you'd be mistaken.

I could definitely Lim Marci

[SirCakez]

VOTE: marci

[SirCakez]

Whatever I'm fine killing Marci here she has done fuck all all day

[SirCakez]

Can you guys not lim me til I have a chance to be here tonight
Thanks

[SirCakez]

I had Marci as scum literally all game
My reads have actually been pretty solid for once so I would like to actually stick around here

[SirCakez]

Y'all can tell me who to hood idc
I picked Bell because he's conftown so it was the obvious choice
I would have brought a scum buddy in if I was scum here and I would have easily gotten away with it because Kovu literally gave me like five options to choose

[SirCakez]

Okay here now

[SirCakez]

I want to get rid of Dunn. I think they're a likely Marci partner and they had a hand in the horrible gorilla wagon day 2.

VOTE: dunnstral

[SirCakez]

I agree with meuhs 2233 and think Fey looks considerably worse now

[SirCakez]

Now, why in the world Luke would vig shoot mala? no freaking clue…

Because you faked a clear on sircakez and made it look like somebody was lying about their role on balance

Also this is such bs

[SirCakez]

Meh.

I’m a two shot detective. Not outing my results since they’re useless and not entirely clearing so I don’t want people clinging to them later if I’m elimmed.

Fuck it, full claim time it is then, because this does seem like far too much power to be reasonable.

I am a Novice Traffic Analyst.

Anyone else in that hood that can corroborate either way?

There was reason I asked this, Kovu.

VOTE: SirCakez

No way these are both legit

[SirCakez]

Bell has been obsessed with killing me all game because he's mad I spent a lot of time pushing him day 1
Like can you go away please

[SirCakez]

I will fully admit my posting in the PT has been bad but Kovu literally swamped me with 20x the amount of posts I could put out with what I have going on right now and frankly I have never been one to use neighborhoods extensively

[SirCakez]

11. SirCakez - Neighborizer (Kovu N1, Bell N2)

Don't think this can be correct. Kovu referenced a discussion they had with fire about Lava's alignment pre-flip, which suggests they had to both be in the hood on D1.

Can we have confirmation from someone in the hood, please?

I think Fire and Kovu were in a hood from the very start, and Cakez’ hood is a separate thing altogether
I think hood 1 is Kovu, Fire
and hood 2 is Cakez, Kovu, Bell

This is correct

[SirCakez]

11. SirCakez - Neighborizer (Kovu N1, Bell N2)

Don't think this can be correct. Kovu referenced a discussion they had with fire about Lava's alignment pre-flip, which suggests they had to both be in the hood on D1.

Can we have confirmation from someone in the hood, please?

I think Fire and Kovu were in a hood from the very start, and Cakez’ hood is a separate thing altogether
I think hood 1 is Kovu, Fire
and hood 2 is Cakez, Kovu, Bell

Man I don't know about Fey anymore now that I'm read up
Their posting today is kinda town af

I just want to kill like Dunn and Enchant I think

[SirCakez]

"faked a clear" I didn't see Kovu claim a clear anywhere
Strong evidence I was town yeah but not like a cop clear

[SirCakez]

And nothing was faked anyways it's not like it was pulled out of nowhere Kovu had reason to think I was town from role

[SirCakez]

"faked a clear" I didn't see Kovu claim a clear anywhere
Strong evidence I was town yeah but not like a cop clear

I mean, I have info that I'm almost certain clears cakez so yeah, he's not being limmed here

I mean, I have info that I'm almost certain clears cakez so yeah, he's not being limmed here

Remember in Ktane when you lied multiple times as town. You should stop doing that.

it's not a lie this game, I'm quite certain it'll get revealed later, but yeah, people seriously need to stop thinking cakez is an actual wagon

like if you need to, just go lim me, then sheep me on cakez being town

If you want to shoot cakez, I would invictus with you there.

no

Stop faking clears on people.

IT'S NOT FAKE, LITERALLY STOP SAYING IT IS.

genuinely so freaking annoying, like I have a legit clear, then yall are all "Mala's soft is real!! must act as it is!!!" and mala just won't confirm it's real/do anything, yet we're not going "Get RR!!!" like, seriously. just leave cakez alone and stop freaking assuming I'm faking it

If you want to shoot cakez, I would invictus with you there.

no

Stop faking clears on people.

IT'S NOT FAKE, LITERALLY STOP SAYING IT IS.

This isn’t what someone with a real result would say, they would say, “actually yeah I lied” and then when you get shot, you demonstrated that you lied about lying.

... fine I'm lying. you happy?
(I genuinely still have clearing info for cakez, but must not be real so whatever)

Kovu that's why you don't fake PRs, people will think you are compulsive liar.
Also i am innocent child, thinking about revealing.

Guess fun isn't allowed when you're a stupid VT every single game... like, I finally have a cool role.. yet no one will just leave cakez alone, like, there's a giant Dwlee wagon, do people like it? hate it? like, go there sure, or marci or meuh. I don't care. but apparently my name has to be Mala and I have to do absolutely nothing to have my clears respected

I’m not assuming you’re faking it. I think you’re taking it because you’ve faked clears in the past and showed zero inclination you were going to take any feed back about it or even really acknowledged people’s concerns.

Sure thanks.

why do I care about your concerns with my clear?

you are not getting anymore info from me. cakez is town. do not invictus him

Mmkay I'll give you this I didn't remember their language being so strong

[SirCakez]

And nothing was faked anyways it's not like it was pulled out of nowhere Kovu had reason to think I was town from role

Why does your role make you town?

It doesn't really? I haven't said it does that was Kovu earlier. My point is that Kovu wasn't just randomly "lol I have a Cakez clear" something sparked that

[SirCakez]

I Would like other people's thoughts on the above if you have time and/or you've got a strong opinion on either of Fey/Dunn

I agree on Fey. I would be happy to lim there today.

I'm not so sure about Dunn. I've seen multiple pushes at him now, and I've never really seen any that persuaded me to consider placing a vote there. I feel the same about the case you make here. I don't have a strong town read here either, but I don't really think limming Dunn today is the play.

This is probably Dunn's scum buddy and that would explain why there are so many town PR claims

[SirCakez]

Also lol @ his PT posting picking up but not the thread posting because it sure is easier to post privately to a few than to everyone.

Huh? This didn't happen

[SirCakez]

so are we all gonna Invictus Dunn after I flip town

[SirCakez]

lol did Gamma scumslip????

[SirCakez]

I saw this happen once before in a game where someone wrote up a post in a scum PT then copy pasted it into the main game thread but didn't fix the URL links so it linked to the scum PT

[SirCakez]

so are we all gonna Invictus Dunn after I flip town

S_S and i are amenable to not doing you maybe, but you need to towncase yourself plus we need to talk live at some point when I’m free (not now, waiting for a friend I’m seeing a movie with)

If anyone hammers or pushes the cakez wagon through before we get the chance to do so, they get policy limmed tomorrow unless he reds btw. Even if it isn’t a scumclaim, it’s scum often enough to policy and such awful play that said person would be a liability anyway

Fair warning

~Rhyme

I hate towncasing myself because no one ever listens to it anyways

[SirCakez]

I also want to add on to my point that I wouldn't have neighborized conftown if I were scum here - not only did I neighborize conftown, but I neighborized BELL

BELL
WHO HAS BEEN TRYING TO KILL ME ALL GAME

[SirCakez]

I could have brought in a scum buddy and worked on snowing Kovu with them
or brought in a townie and worked on snowing them in the hood myself

no
I brought BELL
who has been intent on killing me the ENTIRE game

[SirCakez]

Yeah lmao.

Feels like a post that long is best served to a team asking “this good folks?”

this and that's exactly what it was the last time I saw this as a slip
lemme go find it

[SirCakez]

viewtopic.php?p=7334002#p7334002

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Dunn
back here

[SirCakez]

Enchant should have been Invictus-ed ages ago but so far it looks like everyone has been trying to hero shoot with their Invictus rather then clearing out the universal scum reads :/
well I guess Dwlee had to go but the others yuck

[SirCakez]

Kovu suggested Dwlee, Fire, RR, VPB and Bell

[SirCakez]

If I'm scum here it's obviously in my advantage to keep Kovu townreading me and a good way to do that is working them over in the hood
Adding probably the #1 person trying to kill me in Bell would accomplish exactly the opposite of that
As was seen at the beginning of today when Bell convinced Kovu I was mafia for a bit

[SirCakez]

Hell even just adding a less active town like Dwlee would have beaten adding Bell

[SirCakez]

Kovu suggested Dwlee, Fire, RR, VPB and Bell

fmpov this sure sounds like you didn't have an opportunity to add a scum buddy so idk why you said that was an option for you

vp and dwlee flipped town, bell and RR are conftown, im town

???

what did you mean by that

Those were the offered options by Kovu but I could have picked anyone and probably gotten away with it, it's hard to explain without seeing the PT posts but the suggestions weren't ironclad or anything

Y'all can tell me who to hood idc
I picked Bell because he's conftown so it was the obvious choice
I would have brought a scum buddy in if I was scum here and I would have easily gotten away with it because Kovu literally gave me like five options to choose

?

What is ?

[SirCakez]

Dunn has basically given up - all he has was a claim and no defense at all? Really?

[SirCakez]

Can you quote for me what you think I should respond to, SirCakez?

What do you even need? Say why you're town dude. It's what I've been doing today

[SirCakez]

so are we all gonna Invictus Dunn after I flip town

S_S and i are amenable to not doing you maybe, but you need to towncase yourself plus we need to talk live at some point when I’m free (not now, waiting for a friend I’m seeing a movie with)

If anyone hammers or pushes the cakez wagon through before we get the chance to do so, they get policy limmed tomorrow unless he reds btw. Even if it isn’t a scumclaim, it’s scum often enough to policy and such awful play that said person would be a liability anyway

Fair warning

~Rhyme

I hate towncasing myself because no one ever listens to it anyways

sure, but on this occasion we're conftown and are asking you to do so, and telling you that it is important for us in terms of sorting you

I also want to add on to my point that I wouldn't have neighborized conftown if I were scum here - not only did I neighborize conftown, but I neighborized BELL

BELL
WHO HAS BEEN TRYING TO KILL ME ALL GAME

I could have brought in a scum buddy and worked on snowing Kovu with them
or brought in a townie and worked on snowing them in the hood myself

no
I brought BELL
who has been intent on killing me the ENTIRE game

why is this better than bringing in Bell in the hopes that you could change his mind/pocket him via hood and thereby remove one of the key voices trying to get you killed?

~Rhyme

Because it's Bell he is not going to listen to me

[SirCakez]

Frankly I am not going to be able to give you the town case you want in the next few days bc I'm basically only phone posting. I can put together a quick hits list but I can't get elaborate.

[SirCakez]

I mean, that's unfortunate, but sure -- I'll take that over nothing

-defended Lavar all day d1 when he was the default mislim
-correctly read and pushed marci d2
-the stuff I said about how I wouldn't have picked Bell if I were scum in the hood
-continued to townread Luke despite being pushed by him and Kovu trying to convince me he was scum in the hood
-my reasoning for Dunn!scum is not something I would have pulled out as scum

[SirCakez]

(I'm stealing something fire said, but like, I noticed it too)

Sooo are all of yall ignoring the fact Dunn was at e-1 and enchant didn't hammer that? Like from enchant's POV, dunn like has to be maf here.. Enchant didn't want to hammer Dunn? ok, so enchant thinks dunn is town. then who are the 3 possible names for scum?

enchant and dunn are probably buddies!

We should just stop saying blah blah Invictus Enchant he will be taken care of and just kill him.

honestly a very good take

scum is probably just (Cakez, dunn, enchant) by PoE,

this is one of the most ridiculous scum team takes I've read recently LMAO

Cakez has been pushing Dunn pretty solidly and repeatedly pushed to kill marci - i guess it's technically possible that their solution to salvage the game is/was "turn it into a big bussing clusterfuck" but I feel like it's rarer for scumteams to actually go for that than maybe it should be?

ALSO
ever since I fucked up in Among Us Mafia and bussed my whole team I've stopped taking that approach to mafia. like I will bus maybe one person a game but I would not bus my whole team again because I got so much shit for it and it didn't even work.

Can you quote for me what you think I should respond to, SirCakez?

What do you even need? Say why you're town dude. It's what I've been doing today

So can you or not?

Because you didn't do what I asked here, you tried to turn it on me. I'm guessing you can't then and you were blowing smoke earlier.

Ok I'll throw you a bone
explain how you're playing here is different from how you'd be playing this as scum

Can someone scumcase me further than "Enchant is scum", i love reading jokes.

@Gammagooey
@SirCakez
@Fey

You are the designated someones, as the three pushing Enchant in some capacity today. Give us some reasoning and don't just ignore this.

I think his play around Marci was sketch as hell and if you look at his ISO he basically has spent all game voting town between Mala, Lavar, Dwlee, Gamma and most likely gorilla

[SirCakez]

VOTE: enchant sure

[SirCakez]

How many times do I have to say that Dunn is playing like his scum meta
I feel like I've said it so many times and yet people keep going "gawsh I have no idea why Cakez is scumreading Dunn"

[SirCakez]

And that's why I said if he wants something to respond to say how this is not exactly like what I expect him to do as scum here

[SirCakez]

This game is so obnoxious I really don't want to keep playing but I feel I owe y'all

[SirCakez]

I'm sick of being forced to defend myself over and over when I've been having a solid game and it feels like as soon as I try to let off the gas on defense I get swarmed again like on this page

[SirCakez]

Spoiler:

In Slaughter Hour Dunn was scum who I spent a good amount of time pushing before he got killed

VOTE: dunnstral
I think this is now my strongest scumread
He is playing to his scum meta to a T - drive-by posting, lack of investment, few memorable posts or pushes
I can't really think of a scum team in this playerlist that doesn't have Dunn in it while I could see Peta or Unwnd not being in one

Unwnd if you are town here I could really use your thoughts on Dunn

Null

Thought town for a minute but changed my mind. Don't want to think about right now. Confident in solving later.

like this is one of those things that gives me pause w/unwnd because it seems like a weirdly artificial avoidance of Dunn when he just dropped big reads on most of the other players

like I make definite statements but I am open to changing my mind
i'm not some deathtunneler
no one has presented any reason for Dunn to be town so why would I change my mind on that?

as seen here

VOTE: SirCakez

Basically don't think Skitter scum defends Cakez the way she has if Cakez is scum

i would not make that assumption


granted on a gut level she's still town but i have nothing deeper until we get some form of actual flips and voting

Yeah alright I'll discard it

Are you fine with voting Dunn off? Assume no based on your posts

I'm not being voted off, I'm being voted into a duel. You should probably know that I'm, like, 70% likely to win anything that isn't complete rng here, even at a disadvantage, if we're being completely honest. Just saying. Oh also Cakez is scum.

then he IMMEDIATELY responds with OMGUS and starts trying to discredit me
EXACTLY what he's doing here guys

I also feel very comfortable with my townread on Lukewarm. I'm treating Kovu as town for reasons previously discussed. I still think Marci is more likely town than not.

I don't pretend to be able to read enchant particularly well, but their votes and other content we have has all made at least sense to me, neither am I detecting any difference between enchant here and town!enchant in the games I have seen. I have some sympathy for the argument that enchant will be a difficult sort and we might need to consider dealing with it sooner or later, but I think they deserve more of a chance for something else to happen to make that alignment more clear, and I'm not interested in a vote there today.

I want people to actually start reading my posts, so I will give justification elsewhere, but I wouldn't vote Dunn today either. I could probably be convinced to join a wagon on anyone else not mentioned, but my strong preference is for SirCakez, as indicated by my vote.

like all my scumspects suddenly developed scumreads on me after I laid out my scumpool yesterday and I don't think it's a coincidence

I would very much like to kill Cakez today if anyone else is interested.

Like, here he is pushing the idea that scum would scum read him for scum reading scum. Ignores the fact that he town binned Dunn Day 1, but Dunn was pushed him.

[Dunn shading Cakez, while cakez is still calling dunn town]

My point above being that the above post feels selective in that you don't include the information that doesn't support your viewpoint, or seem to care what I am doing because I'm not a popular wagon right now, which feels inconsistent

I ignored it because I've gotten tons of towntells from you earlier on so I didn't see the relevance

[]

It also ignores the people who are scum reading him that are not in his scum pool. (Me, I am talking about me. He has done nothing but call me town, but is then calling other people suspicious for doing something that I am also doing).

Yeah and did Dunn spend any time day 1 pushing me? no he didn't. has he spent most of today sitting on me? yeah he has. what changed in the meantime? not rocket science

I didn't say people scumreading me are scum so your last bit doesn't make any sense
I'm saying that I think scum want to get rid of me at this point, assuming my scumreads rn are correct

Yeah and did Dunn spend any time day 1 pushing me? no he didn't. has he spent most of today sitting on me? yeah he has. what changed in the meantime? not rocket science

This is wrong.
He started scum reading you at the end of day 1. You were town reading him at the time. You scum reading him clearly had nothing to do with him scum reading you, since they happened in the other order. If anything, it looks like you OMGUS'ed him.

He is not sitting on you today, he has literally never voted you. He is voting gorilla.

I didn't say people scumreading me are scum so your last bit doesn't make any sense
I'm saying that I think scum want to get rid of me at this point, assuming my scumreads rn are correct

My point was that it felt like you were selectively applying things. Like, I saw your comment, but then no hint at you second guessing your read on me, and I immediately remembered this from Dunn day 1

My point above being that the above post feels selective in that you don't include the information that doesn't support your viewpoint, or seem to care what I am doing because I'm not a popular wagon right now, which feels inconsistent

It does feel like you are doing this imo.

Okay I re-ISOed Dunn and they have not been on me as much as I thought
I will still stand by their recent reaction to me being bad

Here is where you try to bring up meta again after that. It ends up being factually wrong in the way you are comparing the two games such that what you are comparing to hadn't actually happened in this game at all. It immediately gets called out by Lukewarm in the following post 1610. You go on to say I wasn't on you "as much as you thought" even though this is a binary yes/no you got wrong, and dropped the meta point in favor of "their recent reaction".

Now you're back to meta again. And there's no way you can have this case as scum. Except, what is your meta case right now?

I stopped arguing with Luke because he was not listening to me and kept moving the goalposts so I was like whatever I'll end this
Recently you've been obsessed with me and basically haven't done anything besides argue with me about my SR on you. That's why I came out and was like Dunn respond to something and you just came back and started slap fighting with me again. You're like...not doing anything here and that's what I meant by being bad recently.

[SirCakez]

I think I have this bad habit of simply dropping my thoughts on individual posts rather than the broader game someone is playing. This makes my reads harder to follow and it applies to how I was feeling about Marci.

I think this whole post from Meuh was townie and especially this bit. This feels like something you only notice as town.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: SirCakez

I count that as 4 votes on Cakez.

The pool of realistic non-"deep wolf" suspects is small enough to me that I think there has to be some busing going on somewhere when essentially all of them have had some sort of wagon of various sizes on them today.

I still think Val is scummy and posts like this exemplify why. He keeps jumping on and off of me whenever someone else gives a reason to push me but it doesn't seem like there's any thoughts from him backing it up.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: SirCakez

I count that as 4 votes on Cakez.

The pool of realistic non-"deep wolf" suspects is small enough to me that I think there has to be some busing going on somewhere when essentially all of them have had some sort of wagon of various sizes on them today.

Since Fey has come up I will say I think they are still a question mark but their claim and start of day today makes me not interested in a wagon there rn

[SirCakez]

I still want Cakez to say what the meta argument is. Or what they are talking about. Or just admit they are spouting nonsense.

Like whenever Dunn rolls in it's just shit like this and not anything that makes me think he's actually trying to find scum here

[SirCakez]

VOTE: SirCakez

I count that as 4 votes on Cakez.

The pool of realistic non-"deep wolf" suspects is small enough to me that I think there has to be some busing going on somewhere when essentially all of them have had some sort of wagon of various sizes on them today.

I still want Cakez to say what the meta argument is. Or what they are talking about. Or just admit they are spouting nonsense.

The sheer resistance to like every wagon makes me think we are onto scum and the remaining scum are being resistant. There should be at least three still.

[SirCakez]

Ignore those quotes as usual
I am fine killing Enchant as well

[SirCakez]

ok I just had a thought, maybe it's dumb but hear me out

am i 100% convinced enchant is maf? no, not at all

when i try to imagine what scum teams there could be, is enchant on the vast majority of them? yes

does enchant 100% need to be resolved before elo? yes

and the thing I realized is... even on the off chance that enchant is town here, im pretty sure scum would actually want them not to be limmed? like, think about it. if we flip someone else today, im guessing a lot of the town will be heading into the night with invictus on enchant. i know i probably will. people are tired of hero shots, and just want to narrow the poe. it makes sense. but thats actually shielding for scum. if they know that enchant is town, then they want everyone's invictus on them because invictus shots are much harder to predict compared to their ability to influence the lim during the day. limming enchant removes that shield and makes it harder for them to feel safe with their night kill

and the pretty likely alternative is that enchant is just scum. so it's a win win

VOTE: Enchant

I am starting to lean this way too

[SirCakez]

VOTE: enchant
Let's just get rid of him like fire said
He can't live to endgame anyways

[SirCakez]

Am I terribly convinced Fey is mafia? No, but I could be wrong. Could I go there at some point? Eh, okay.

Same

[SirCakez]

GG fun game and good players. Definitely a tough setup for scum but they deserved the win.

[SirCakez]

Fire you snowed the hell out of me