LOST (Game Over)

[Lukewarm]

Am looking for my Dad

VOTE: Pooky

Father?

[Lukewarm]

I’m to be insufferable all game. all fucking game..

I mean at least I can talk to the dead.

VOTE: dancingpuppets

I probably would not have revealed that until you learned something useful from a dead player, but :shrug:

[Lukewarm]

Also, Hi Mala!

[Lukewarm]

So the monster in black.
And then there’s the others.

Who would the rest of the bad guys be? Like traitors? Dead weight?
I never watched lost.

Didn't STD say that alignment was divorced from flavor?

[Lukewarm]

4. Mafia is not determined by flavor. That means roles were mostly selected at random to determine which roles would be mafia.

[Lukewarm]

OK. Well, unless I am forgetting something pretty massive, I have no idea what that means.

I am 100% granite.

I just lie here.

Are you The Black Rock?

Like the ship full of explosives.

[Lukewarm]

Roles and flavor are different things, no?

Yeah. I get the feeling that Flavor = Abilities, but flavor =/= alignment.

Which, Bell was at first asking who the bad guys were in the show, but given the rules that would be irrelevant.

[Lukewarm]

But Bell also figured that out before I commented, I just didnt fully read up before making that post lol

[Lukewarm]

Am looking for my Dad

VOTE: Pooky

Father?

Well, it appears that you flavor claimed Mr.Echo, so

[Lukewarm]

But Flavor is fun!

Spoiler:

Is joke

[Lukewarm]

I have achieved 2 Town Reads.

[Lukewarm]

Its you <3

[Lukewarm]

I just played 2 back to back games with you when you were scum. The vibes are right this time.

You seem hella relaxed. I also liked you calling me scum, because in both of those games I spotted you as scum pre page 10, so I feel like you would want to keep me in your good graces if you were scum again.

[Lukewarm]

aww so ur trying to make me blinded to u?

Also, yes.

[Lukewarm]

Never actually got round to watching Lost when it came out.

Me neither - we should do a watch party where we livetweet our reactions in this thread

Spoiler:

Only half joking

From a brief catchup it seems nobody here watched it. Heard it got rubbish towards the end anyway.

I loved the first like 4 Seasons of Lost. I watched it all with my sister as it aired, and then when I got married I rewatched the whole show with my husband. I definitely recommend anyone who has not seen it to give it a try.

(It does lose itself a little towards the end. Seasons 5 was good, but not great. Final season is kinda disappointing imo)

[Lukewarm]

what does knowing the flavor or not have to do with the game

I think that you could potentially guess someone's role based on their flavor. Like, if someone's Flavor is Jack, I would assume them to be a doctor tbh.

[Lukewarm]

Guess what PR i have as rock.

I am finding it a little hard to believe that your role is actually a rock tbh.

I am a character. A hydra claimed Jin. Pooky hinted Mr. Echo. The VT example in the OP was a secondary character named Ilana.

Lost has plenty of characters to flesh out the whole playerlist with named characters.

I kind of would have believed you could be "The Black Rock" though

[Lukewarm]

I think Luke is town!!!!!!

Yay!

Mala you were already the other town read that i had in post78.

So now we just town block with Marci.

We are killing it this game

[Lukewarm]

I think that we are wagoning Cephrir because he called Klick a Not Town Read, and Klick OMGUS'ed voted him, and this player list is full of sheep.

Better then anything I have to go on atm, but also not enticing for me to join.

Carry on.

[Lukewarm]

I actually have no idea why we're wagoning Cephrir BUT

He is probably the ONLY player on the site who rolls scum more frequently then I do

so it's a fine place to start

VOTE: Cephrir

Eventually you'd expect that heavy lean to equalize, yeah? So... shouldn't we lean town on him if we're going to draw conclusions based on rate of scum?

That's gambler's fallacy

So the opposite is the... inverse gambler's fallacy, and we should go with that instead? I'm not a stats guy so feel free to man-splain this for me

I think that Random.org gave Cephir just as much odds for being scum this game as anyone else, and arguing for

or

against voting him based on his past games is silly.

I am pretty sure that Pooky made his statement as a joke, and was mainly sheeping the wagon. I think that you are the only one trying to use it as a serious argument.

[Lukewarm]

also like what's the odds a plane full of people crashes on a mysterious island anyway

Depends on whether there is a mysterious psudo-diety-esque person or castrating events in order to make sure that it happened or not I guess.

But it is probably unknowable tbh

[Lukewarm]

Auto Correct can be wild sometimes lol

[Lukewarm]

I just played 2 back to back games with you when you were scum. The vibes are right this time.

You seem hella relaxed. I also liked you calling me scum, because in both of those games I spotted you as scum pre page 10, so I feel like you would want to keep me in your good graces if you were scum again.

This read was wrong the last time you posted it

My read on her that you just linked in that game is not the same as what I said this game.

In that game I did a full scum case on her, and I thought her reaction to that case was townie. That is irrelevant to this game, as I have not scum cased her lol

[Lukewarm]

No. You are comparing a read based on her general early prescence to a read based on how she responded under pressure. Those are distinctly different thing metrics.

Key words for the post you just linked:

My experience with scum marci has been -

that under pressure she ...

The way that she responded under pressure that game turned my read around on her for a while. But, I correctly scum read her based off of her early presence that game.

[Lukewarm]

Like, my last two games with Marci, she was scum, and I was really sure she was scum by page 5

Mafia Invictus Redux

I think marci is just scum here.

Moderators of the Discord Server

wdym you thought i already knew

I think that that was a faked dumb tell, and that you are scum.

Yes, in the Invictus game I talked myself out of it, and then back into it a couple times throughout the game.

But based on early vibes, I feel like I have done pretty decent at spotting her recently - and my read on her right now is an early vibes read.

And hell, I very well might talk myself out of before the end of the game, but at this moment, I am town reading her early posting

[Lukewarm]

OK, I accept your reasoning. I think that your second post here going into more detail about is a facet of your town play and something you are more likely to skip out on as mafia.

Hmmm

I feel like my incessant need to make sure that people understand what I am trying to say when they appear to not understand is not alignment indicative for me, but sure.

[Lukewarm]

Penguin, I think your point makes sense in a general statement context.

But frogster's example was that OTH was aware of the C+G hydra having a posting restriction.

So I don't think it makes sense in this specific case

[Lukewarm]

Which. Frogster apparently read enough of c+g to find them suspicious but not enough to realize they had a posting restriction

[Lukewarm]

Does town!Luke really have this much confidence in a town read that soon based on meta alone?

How much confidence do you think that I have in that read exactly?

luke town reads Mala in 78/166 from Mala's 2 opening posts. 2. opening. posts. I was thinking about Mala's potential power claim - being able to talk to the dead? Intitially sounds like a townie type power, but what if it's a scum power? That would be really powerful as well, being able to talk to the dead and make up dead town reads as they see fit. Plus I think you'd be more likely to just let that one slip early as scum to try to look like a town claim, cause if you're town and you just gave away a huge power like that, you're not even going to get a chance to use it as you're most likely going to be the first NK. So I'm not sure where this town read is coming from beyond potentially reading that power as a town power and not thinking it through?

I think that in general, early unprompted PR claims are more likely to come from town. And that is completely divorced from the claim itself.

But also, the claim itself seems like something that scum would in particular avoid claiming this early if real. And furthermore, a pretty risky thing to fake claim beacuse the mod confirmed that there is someone who can do that, and therefore could lead to a counter claim if faked.

All in all, claiming in that way period, and also the claim itself lend me to think it is more likely that Mala is town this game

Mildly annoyed that you landed on "Luke did not think it through" then asking me for follow up :/

[Lukewarm]

How much confidence do you think I have in you being scum right now?

I doubt you have much confidence at all in me being scum. You didn't even vote me lol.

You can follow up if you want (and you did!) but I wasn't really looking for your opinion on your ISO, I wanted frogster's

I did not really expect you to ask me my opinion on myself. More of a "Hey Luke, you have not really explained your town read on Mala. Why do you town read her." Instead of guessing, and then deciding that your own guess was a bad reason to town read her.

How much confidence do you think that I have in that read exactly?

You tell me?

This was also me pointing out that you said

Does town!Luke really have this much confidence

Instead of asking "Hey Luke, how confident are you in that Marci read?"

-----

I feel like looking at isos and just making statements about it, instead of asking the necessary follow up questions to really understand what you are looking at feels like an odd approach.

-----

As for answering the "You tell me?" aspect of how confident I am on the Marci read (and this applies to the Mala read as well):

Good enough for Day 1.

My general approach for day 1 in very large games is to have a pretty low bar of "good enough for Day 1" because there are simply too many players in the game to properly analyze everyone here.

My good enough for Day 1 list will slowly grow through out the day, and then when we reach the end I will look at the wagons to see if there is someone off that list being wagoned.

Unless something jumps out at me as particularly scummy. That can change the game plan. But unless that happens, thats really the best I can do when I am in a game with more then like 14 people alive and 0 flips

[Lukewarm]

I feel like looking at isos and just making statements about it, instead of asking the necessary follow up questions to really understand what you are looking at feels like an odd approach.

Yeah. Just spot checked this approach on Rad's completed game, and

ok, mq.bosco is townie

How are you getting this read? She has posted very little and her posts read null to me.

Like, there is a blatant disparity here.

I get the feeling that this is the difference between Town!Rad actually trying to understand, and scum!Rad just looking for things to call out.

VOTE: Rad

[Lukewarm]

There are a couple other reasons I don't trust Luke. I think 319 and 322 are potential shade

Yes that was shade. I found it mildly suspicious that you missed the posting restriction of one of the few slots you expressed a read on at that point, and did not like the way you tried to frame it as scummy for someone else to have read the post where C&G openly claimed they had a posting restriction.

I noticed it and didn't like it, so I pointed it out.

[Lukewarm]

I find it hilarious that you found 1 post in a past game where I do ask for a follow up from someone and claim I'm scum for it

No.

When I read your post, my thoughts were "this approach does not feel like someone who is actually trying to sort me"

But I was worried that it was a personality quirk that I was misreading as alignment. So I spot checked the only meta that I have avaliable to see if that was the case.

I did not think you were scum because of meta.

Also, 357 just feels to me like scum annoyed at the reason they are being called scum

You're going to meta read me on 1 completed game and your 13 minutes of researching it? My first game since 2014? lol

I

find it hilarious

that you found 1 post in a past game where I do ask for a follow up from someone and claim I'm scum for it.

That's right. I'm incapable as town of doing anything but asking people for follow ups and my strategy there can never, ever change, adapt, evolve, or do anything slightly different.

And oh look, Frogster responded with good content for everyone to read and analyze. I wish I had just asked you a question about your read instead of making all this happen instead.

What a fail move I made

Like. The amount of annoyed for the reason he perceived that I was using to scum read him feels out of line with a townie getting misread by a single player.

And also, he literally just moments ago was making comments about me possibly being scum, and there is not hint of him now saying that I am scum making a shit push.

[Lukewarm]

Like. The amount of annoyed for the reason he perceived that I was using to scum read him feels out of line with a townie getting misread by a single player.

Huh, the weirdest thing.

This post of yours annoyed the hell out of me, but I wasn't annoyed AT ALL before that. I was laughing having a good time with my sarcastic replies. Careful assigning emotion to forum text, you misread that one completely.

I'll go with Frogster's read here that it's a TvT, cause either town!Frogster's telling us his read and I get the sense that Frogster's no newbie, or scum!Frogster knows something special (this is not shade, I have no read on him right now, I repeat not shade, any scum would know something special, just saying).

Maybe annoyed was the wrong word. I apologize if that word choice bothered you.


A possible bettwr way to word that was: my vote elicited multiple paragraphs from you about how ridiculous it was for me to scum read you for that reason.

That response looked more in line with scum thinking they are playing well, but getting called scum anyways for a reason they perceive as bad, then a town player who just saw a Not Town Read call them scum

I used annoyed as a short hand for the above. Sorry again if that choice deminished your enjoyment of this game.

[Lukewarm]

I claim being in a PT with another player though

Hm.

I did not really plan on claiming, but I am also in a neighborhood with another player, and it is not Toog.

I am realizing that without flips showing that Me, my neighbor, Toog, or Toog's neighbor flipping as neighbors that it will actually be kinda messy for someone to claim it after the death of their neighbor.

[Lukewarm]

You can't townread anyone until you townread yourself

that's some deep shit Johnny

Spoiler:

[Lukewarm]

Malcolm, what's up?
How are you? Are you still getting eliminated every day 1?
How has all of the being eliminated effecting your playstyle this game or how do you predict it will if at all?

I've actually never been eliminated D1! As a general rule when I'm town I manage to get through the first day, but after that I'm sometimes eliminated. Either way I tend not to let it impact my playstyle all that much - I wouldn't even say I have that much of a specific playstyle for the most part, I simply analyse and try to find connections between different players but tend to be pretty uncertain in how I approach the game.

I kinda like this post as coming from a town mindset for Malcolm.

Because several of us here know he was eliminated day 1 as scum in the Web of Lies games (and is what Bell is refering to here I believe).

But he didn't even think of that game. His thoughts went to "I never get

mis

eliminated day 1." And [I'm town this game, so I am immediately comparing this game to my other town games] feels like a genuine thought process. While I would kinda expect scum!Malcolm to be more aware of the scum game where he crashed and burned

[Lukewarm]

Luke doesn't strike me as the type of player to go after if you're scum wanting to appear busy.

I have never played with Rad before, so he really only had this game to base that decision on. And I have been pretty tame this game if I do say so myself.

[Lukewarm]

oh snap forgot to add my main man Pengy

he should be on there I think.


Cult Recruitment Drive 1.0:

Pengy
Dunnstral
Malcolm
Bell
Klick
Cat Scratch Fever
Toogeloo


If you're on the above list, congrats you received a Townread of DUBIOUS accuracy and I will be recruiting you into my awesome cult for at least today.

This will entitle you to the following perks:

(1) Your choice of COLOR in the OFFICIAL PAGETOP SCOREBOARD
(2) A Nickname picked out by me[Please let me know if you want to opt out or if you do not like your nickname]
(3) Extremely well written fanfiction about your exploits on the Island[Please let me know if you want to opt out]
(4) Premium Front Row Seats to a Day One Bandwagon of Pooky's Choice[First Come First Serve, Suggestions Welcome!]
(5) Your profile picture edited into memes that may or may not accurately represent things that happened in the game.

I demand access to the cult.

Hell, you already put a nickname for me on the page top scoreboard, so I'm feel like I should already be in there by default.

Thank you for your understanding.

[Lukewarm]

I also didn't really care for Bella's recent postings.

She can be on the list of people that I am willing to vote today.

[Lukewarm]

Pooky
Penguin
Dunnstral
The toad
Luke
Rad
Tbone
CSF
Klick

I think are all Town.

This is not similar to my own townreads.

Penguin and Dunn have both hit the "good enough for Day 1" threshold for me.

Pooky is hard for me to be confident on, but I can totally see why someone would town read pooky here. I am hesitantly leaning that way too.

The Toad, TBone, CSF, and Klick are all slots that I have had little to no thoughts about so far.

I scum read Rad.

[Lukewarm]

I am roughtly at

Malakittens
Toogeloo
PookyTheMagicalBear
MalcolmTucker
Off the Hook (Gamma Emerald and Marcistar)
PenguinPower1928
Bell
Dunnstral

Being Town enough for Day 1

[Lukewarm]

Malcom why digging in so hard for Luke?

Galron, I am confused by this.

Are you asking why Malcom thinks it is hard for me to dig in?

Can you tell me what led to that question, because pretty sure that Malcolm never said that about me

[Lukewarm]

Malcom why digging in so hard for Luke?

I wouldn't say I've dug in particularly hard so far as such - just that I'm getting a decent town vibe from them. I wasn't keen on Frogster's push where they basically backed off at the same time but that was more me being suspicious of Frogster than anything else. But, of course, if Frogster is scum feels unlikely they'd want to throw any shade onto Luke at all this early in the game if Luke was a teammate. What's your feeling on Lukewarm yourself?

Luke started very serious out of the gate, like rvs didn't exist. Too much caffeine?

This is funny to me, because this is the least serious I have taken a game in a while.

I would not say that I was being particularly serious until the moment I did meta on Rad and voted him

[Lukewarm]

This is funny to me, because this is the least serious I have taken a game in a while.

Meh, I was being non-serious at the start of moderators as well.

But my point stands.

I was have purposefully tried to take this game less seriously, and this is the second time someone said that I was being extra serious early

[Lukewarm]

This is funny to me, because this is the least serious I have taken a game in a while.

Meh, I was being non-serious at the start of moderators as well.

But my point stands.

I was have purposefully tried to take this game less seriously, and this is the second time someone said that I was being extra serious early

Do you think it's more likely to come from mistaken town or scum trying to stir up trouble (or other?)

Luke's ISO reads like it's serious from the start

Luke's ISO reads like it's serious from the start, and all I really got out of it was 2 bad town reads and a lot of nothing.

Rad's prob town

Luke started very serious out of the gate, like rvs didn't exist. Too much caffeine?

It feels like Galron lifted the idea straight off of Rad.

I don't think that Galron and Rad are scum together, but I think that there is probably scum in the pair.

[Lukewarm]

My opinion on the Hydra posting restriction, is that if it is real he is likely in a neighborhood with Sun.

That would give the slot an outlet to talk as much as they waty, and a way to keep communicating after they have run out of words (Jin getting Sun to "translate" for him). We also know that there is at least 2 claimed neighborhoods at this point. Could be with Toog, or could be a 3rd hood.

That being said, I don't really have strong feelings about whether the PR restriction being town or scum indicative. I feel like, if it is real, STD had the idea as a way to represent Jin's flavor of struggling to communicate early on in the show before he learned english, and it likely would have been an idea before he randed the flavor alignments.

[Lukewarm]

Yep.

Restriction is real. It doesh't change anything alignmentwise.

Btw i am in good mood somehow, so i answer one question directed to me. Probably.

Is your flavor really a rock?

[Lukewarm]

PenguinPower1928

1928 is the pass code to unlock my laptop when it goes to sleep. Not sure how that ended up in my post tho lol

[Lukewarm]

Thank you

[Lukewarm]

While I don't agree with T-Bone's view re the faked restriction, I think he's town for suggesting it. Seems like a theory unlikely to come from scum.

Can you explain what my theory is in your own words, and why you don't think scum can?

To TBone - in the simplest terms, unless I'm misunderstanding you, your theory is that they have faked a posting restriction, no?

I don't think that it inherently can't come from scum - it just strikes me as a theory that's more likely to come from town trying to think things through and coming up with unique ideas and suggestions as to how other players are approaching the game.

This is a weird thing, but I kinda mindmeld with Malcolm with myself in a different game.

I also don't think that she would have chosen this particular angle to push even if she did decide to see if she could make it happen, because scum LLD would already know that the restriction is true.

Makes me feel better about calling Malcolm town.

Also, does make me feel better about T-Bone too.

[Lukewarm]

I appreciate your commitment to the bit.

I followed a link. I would like to just say that playing spyro blindfolded is both wild and impressive.

[Lukewarm]

People keep saying that I am scary as scum like I have not lost the last 6 scum games in a row, and only have a singular scum win on site.

I don't think that I am bad, because I definitely have all of the WIM in the world as scum, but I don't actually win as scum. >.<

[Lukewarm]

My PT partner brought up the fact that they don't trust me, that I could be scum, and that I basically asked for a free pass through Day 1.

For those not in the know, I was involved in a head on collision last Friday night. My kids were in the car with me. I was ambulances to the ER, but thankfully my kids walked away with minor injuries.

I am doing some daily physical therapy and we are working with lawyers and insurance right now, and in my down time I am trying to relax and rest.

I don't anticipate this being problematic beyond this week, but if people feel I'm getting a pass, or need to replace out, I will.

---

I have not read anything other than my PT. I actually didn't consider the possibility that my partner might consider us unaligned. Based on my show knowledge, I actually would have thought us Masons if my PM didn't specifically call us neighbors.

My role is Shannon, my partner is Boone. We are in a PT called Kissing Siblings, which I don't recall them being incestual at all, lol.

At any rate, I will get to this eventually.

Really sorry to hear about that Toog. Hope you recover quickly

---

They are incestuous. The show tries to do a weird "but they are just step siblings" thing, and has them hook up in a flash back scene before they got on the plane. Once they get to the island, Boone is in love with Shannon, but Shannon does not want to keep doing the incest. And he is mad at her for it.

[Lukewarm]

Isn't the Sibling role a variant Mason that knows the other's alignment but lacks a PT with them? If that's correct Toog's POV is 100% logical. Sure flavor and alignment are distinct but I don't believe the same could be said about role and alignment?

~GE

Their role PM says that they are neighbors.

They are siblings in flavor, not role.

[Lukewarm]

For me, I felt like Luke just stood out. Like there was 50 kids running around a room screaming and playing and Luke's in the corner with a cigar and a trench coat and big black hat covering his face.

I find it incredibly funny that this is your mental image for my presence this game.

From my POV, I was just shooting the shit talking about one of my favorite TV shows of all time, and joking with Pooky about whether or not he was my father. Was a good time for me lol

[Lukewarm]

I am definitely your father Luke

And you still won't let me into your cult?

Rude.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: Frog

[Lukewarm]

My scum read on Rad is softening.

Still okay with my frog vote, also would be down for a galron vote atm

[Lukewarm]

Luke's ISO reads like it's serious from the start

Luke's ISO reads like it's serious from the start, and all I really got out of it was 2 bad town reads and a lot of nothing.

Rad's prob town

Luke started very serious out of the gate, like rvs didn't exist. Too much caffeine?

It feels like Galron lifted the idea straight off of Rad.

I don't think that Galron and Rad are scum together, but I think that there is probably scum in the pair.

To be real with you, when I typed this post up, i actually started typing it up as

"I don't know if it is scum!Rad that threw that out there, and a town!Galron just believed him because he town read Rad, or if town!Rad made a point and scum!Galron latched onto it"

And then deleted the line, because the first half kinda didn't make anysense. And now that I am swinging back to thinking you could be town, it brings the second half of that thought back into the fore front of my thoughts.

Also, feels like he was fairly obsessed with me. And then that read is just gone.

He had like 2 total scum reads, me and frog. He town read you for scum reading me. He was so focused on calling me scum, he misread Malcolm's post about me. He repeated your argument about calling me too serious early on.

The way it dropped without comment of why, or any real engagement with me felt off. Going from Giving out town reads for scumreading me, and arguing with people that are starting to town read me, to just

Okay maybe luke is town

Doesn't feel particularly genuine.

[Lukewarm]

My scum read on Rad is softening.

Still okay with my frog vote, also would be down for a galron vote atm

Yaay Luke coming around.

Why are you reading Galron scum Luke? I find him to be unreadable atm.

Especially since Luke is currently voting me

with

Galron, it's a pretty silly position to take, unless they think Galron is bussing me, which is also silly.

I find you both independently scummy. You two are

probably

not partnered, but not really doing partners solves at this stage of the game.

[Lukewarm]

Bell, do you have thoughts on Frog or Galron?

[Lukewarm]

why is there 31 pages

-.-

Mala, if youre reading this

Spoiler:

[Lukewarm]

I wish I could vote 5-8 people right now.

You could always just put a list of people you'd be willing to vote for instead of actually voting

No order:

Pooky
Cephrir
Penguin(?)
Corwin
CSF

Yes! Pocketed!

[Lukewarm]

Bell, do you have thoughts on Frog or Galron?

I don't like them.

So you don't like them, but they are not on you list of vote considerations?

[Lukewarm]

I'm happy to take Luke's word on Marci tho. They haven't actually been wrong on them to my knowledge and I'm okay ignoring the weird vibes Gamma is giving off this game because why try to sort them if Marci is town.
logic'd

I don't have a perfect read rate on her.

But I do feel like my recent read rate on her has been pretty good.

[Lukewarm]

Rad cuzza what Luke said (also I'm in their pocket)

What did I say that would convince you that Rad is town?

I made a scum case on him, and then quietly revealed that my scum read softened

[Lukewarm]

And also, he literally just moments ago was making comments about me possibly being scum, and there is not hint of him now saying that I am scum making a shit push.

This one?

You think town is more likely to forget that their scum read could be scum when said scum read starts pushing them?

You think thats more likely then scum forgetting to fake maintain a faked scum read?

[Lukewarm]

I very much would have rayhered let Johnny answer that for himself...

[Lukewarm]

Low blow post on a VLA player aside, I feel a lot of manipulation coming from Bell's posts in the last 12 hours. Galton so helpfully quotes 941 for example. Bell is recanting now that there's pushback. Bell very clearly stated Corwin was lying about catching up. But in 941 we retcon to "oh well Corwin could just be scum because of random draw". (I am paraphrasing) Yeah, no shit. Then it's 'no big deal if we eliminate a content less player'. What a goalpost shift if I've ever saw one.

I'm also starting to find the way Bell decides whom to think could be scum or town to be arbitrary. I get that Bell is a meta player, and it's well documented I think meta is trash... but I feel Bell has applied this inconsistently thus far. Maybe someone else who feels like they use meta can comment on this. Some players get meta dives, some players get recollections from previous games, and some players Bell just takes someone else's word for it. I understand that not all 25 player slots can be treated equally 48 hours into the game. What Bell does feels to me more like just searching for an elimination for the sake of an elimination, rather than for the sake of eliminating scum. I know Bell has already said to the effect that he'll support any lim that isn't him but that's not really a defense for scummy behavior, just an excuse. It's way too early in the day phase for that.

The tl;dr is come to my aid trash meta users :p

All in all, I think that Bell is town so far.

Bell Alignment Flow Chart

Does Bell have more posts then me this game?

If yes->Town
If no-> Scum

That is a hyperbole, but the fact that he is the number two poster this game is a good sign for him in my opinion. Also tone stuff makes me think town.

I know Bell has already said to the effect that he'll support any lim that isn't him but that's not really a defense for scummy behavior, just an excuse. It's way too early in the day phase for that.

This line in particular feels like you read that line from him completely divorced from the context of the conversation where he said it

Spoiler: Relevant Quotes

I wish I could vote 5-8 people right now.

You could always just put a list of people you'd be willing to vote for instead of actually voting

No order:

Pooky
Cephrir
Penguin(?)
Corwin
CSF

Bell, do you have thoughts on Frog or Galron?

I don't like them.

So you don't like them, but they are not on you list of vote considerations?

There's a difference between who I'm willing to vote versus who I want to vote right now.
I'm willing to vote anyone but me if the argument or the circumstances are good enough.
I want to vote those people.

He had a distinct list of people he wanted to vote, I asked about 2 other people, he said that he would be willing to vote them (or anyone if he had too) but they were not his preference.

I feel like the context of that conversation makes the "It's way too early in the day phase for that." part of you point moot imo.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: BBT

wake up

Cephrir, are you secretly a Koba alt?

[Lukewarm]

Also Bell townlean for healthy caution in the PT

Bell had not claimed being in a PT with you.

[Lukewarm]

My PT partner brought up the fact that they don't trust me, that I could be scum, and that I basically asked for a free pass through Day 1.

It appears that Bell has been on an anti-lurker sentiment outside of just Corwinoid

[Lukewarm]

I don't agree with your interpretation of 878

There's a difference between who I'm willing to vote versus who I want to vote right now.
I'm willing to vote anyone but me

if the argument or the circumstances are good enough.

I want to vote those people.

I am interpreting this to mean that he would vote basically anyone other then himself if we were in the right circumstance, (such as being at deadline.)

But prior to reaching that circumstance, he has a list of people he would prefer to vote currently.

To me, that makes you saying that it is too early for that moot.

Not sure what you are interpreting differently.

[Lukewarm]

Bell, do you have thoughts on Frog or Galron?

I don't like them.

So you don't like them, but they are not on you list of vote considerations?

I took it in particular as a snarky response to this.

I asked why they were not being considered.

He said that he would consider anybody, but that doesn't make them his preference.

If you don't read it that way, I guess that fine.

[Lukewarm]

I guess I am just saying that it was said in a flow of conversation with me, and in that flow it felt natural. But :shrug:

[Lukewarm]

I am not really sure what use you feel is arbirary?

Some players get meta dives, some players get recollections from previous games, and some players Bell just takes someone else's word for it.

You mentioned meta dives, but i don't think he has done a single meta dive so far.

All I have noticed is regular comparisons to past games that he has played in, with a high frequency of those comments being directed at people he has played a lot of games with : like Pooky or Ceph.

Maybe if you grab particular examples of what you mean?

[Lukewarm]

Try to metaread me.

No <3

[Lukewarm]

Just to provide context where I'm coming from. In my experience it's incredibly easy as scum to manipulate players who rely on meta to form their reads. It's also incredibly easy as scum to fake the work of doing meta reads. So, when I analyze a player who says they are forming reads based on meta, the question is always ask myself is "is this real effort or fake?" Which I know is incredibly a vague thing to look for. It's always a feeling for me. Sometimes I get it right and sometimes I don't.

We probably also don't use the same terminology so me saying meta dive in retrospect is unhelpful.

Maybe you're right in that I'm mistaking familiarity/comfort with some players over others as being arbitrary.

I will try to iso Bell tonight to look for this in particular.

Also, I use meta dive to mean actively going out to read other games. CSF did one earlier for frogster

[Lukewarm]

Try to metaread me.

No <3

Why

Because I don't think meta is a good way to read you in games.

Your town play feels fairly erattic to the point that it is hard to find clear patterns between your town play and scum play

I generally just resort for gut reading you, and just praying that you somehow get resolved before end game

[Lukewarm]

I'm okay ignoring the weird vibes Gamma is giving off this game because why try to sort them if Marci is town.
logic'd

am ireally that strong townie to u?

He said that because he thinks I'm town bestie <3

[Lukewarm]

I opened up my phone planning to move my vote to Galron, but Frogs recent posts changed my mind for now.

That is all

[Lukewarm]

(Pooky don't be mad. I'm phone posting, so not gonna try and do a reads list in this post)

Johnny I would still like clarification on what part of what I said led you to believe Rad to be town

[Lukewarm]

Unreadable:

CaG
Mala

Why is mala in unreadable instead of null?

[Lukewarm]

[Townreads]:
Town Reads:
MalcolmTucker
PookyTheMagicalBear
Marcistar
Bell
Cat Scratch Fever humaneatingmonkey

Town Enough for Day 1:
Malakittens
Cephrir
Rad
Enchant
Dunnstral
T-Bone
PenguinPower

[Null]:
Dancing Puppets (Nancy Drew 39 and Titus)
Taly Toogeloo
Roden
The toad
JohnnyFarrar
Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9)

Kinda scummy actually, but his better half saves him:
Gamma

[Want to Murder]:
Scum Reads:
Galron
Frogsterking
Bellaphant (weakest read of the bunch)

I have retained no thoughts about these players:
BlueBloodedToffee
Corwinoid
Dwlee99
Klick

Pooky, my "I have retained no thoughts about these players" section is purposefully under the Want to Murder banner

[Lukewarm]

ok but she sounds way more stilted in pokemon dude lol

her scum game is like your scum game in terms of looking like a block of ice

Who is this abt?

~GE

Probably CSF?
-Guanine

This is the first post that actually bothered me wrt the post restriction. But this one did it.

There was no need for them to be the one to answer this question

[Lukewarm]

I even debated whether to lean town on Luke and decided it would be spicier if I did so.

I don't feel like I am a particularly spicy person to town read?

Off the top of my head, I can only think of one person who is vocally suspicious of me atp

[Lukewarm]

ok but she sounds way more stilted in pokemon dude lol

her scum game is like your scum game in terms of looking like a block of ice

Who is this abt?

~GE

Probably CSF?
-Guanine

This is the first post that actually bothered me wrt the post restriction. But this one did it.

There was no need for them to be the one to answer this question

We were doublechecking if we misinterpreted Pooky.
-Guanine

This one is a scum claim

[Lukewarm]

i should probably have better reads. how is this game 50 pages it feels like nothing has happened

Not enough people getting into shit fights. Smh

[Lukewarm]

Ceph you dirty piece of shit scum bag.

You are obviously scum that I cannot imagine myself ever changing that read, and am read to self vote on the promise that the town fucking kills you immediately after tomorrow.

(Please, please don't omgus me so that this turns into a 10 page shouting match that everyone then comments on and takes sides before eventually deciding we were tvt, and discounting the whole argument but then deciding to kill whoever we think was the most opportunitistic in the way in which they picked sides)

[Lukewarm]

<3

[Lukewarm]

Its true

I can't get a cooler nickname than "the mod"?

[Lukewarm]

Speak for yourself, I'm not being serious now

[Lukewarm]

You absolutely do not

I'd like you to give him one, yeah. I think whatever you used to have against read lists was borne of mostly stubbornness.

He already made one.

And someone else else already told pooky that he already made one

[Lukewarm]

Pooky, I forgot that Johnny should be moved up to "Town enough for day 1"

Incase you wanted that for your spreadsheet.

I am lowkey excited for the spreadsheet reveal. Fun exercise

[Lukewarm]

Ceph

T-bone

you dirty scum bag.

You are so obviously scum that I cannot imagine myself ever changing that read, and I am read to self vote on the promise that the town kills you immediately tomorrow.

(Please, please don't omgus me so that this turns into a 10 page shouting match that everyone then comments on and takes sides before eventually deciding we were tvt, and discounting the whole argument but then deciding to kill whoever we think was the most opportunitistic in the way in which they picked sides)

[Lukewarm]

Ceph

T-bone

you dirty scum bag.

You are so obviously scum that I cannot imagine myself ever changing that read, and I am read to self vote on the promise that the town kills you immediately tomorrow.

(Please, please don't omgus me so that this turns into a 10 page shouting match that everyone then comments on and takes sides before eventually deciding we were tvt, and discounting the whole argument but then deciding to kill whoever we think was the most opportunitistic in the way in which they picked sides)

Weak. You could learn a thing or two from Corwin

Mainly just laziness. It made more sense in the context of when I directed it at ceph.

It was the laziest way I could oblige your request

[Lukewarm]

Also, insomnia is a bitch

[Lukewarm]

Am looking for my Dad

VOTE: Pooky

Father?

So as I have just been laying here thinking about this game, I realized that if I leave this as is, since we don't actually flip in this game it might actually cause issues if I die night 1.

I don't actually need to find my dad.

That's all I really want to say on the matter

[Lukewarm]

It might make sense why I needed to clarify that later. Maybe.

It is unknowable

[Lukewarm]

Luke... I am your father.

You are about 50 pages late for this joke

[Lukewarm]

Am looking for my Dad

VOTE: Pooky

Father?

[Lukewarm]

Deadline: 9 days, 10 hours, 32 minutes

This day still has 9 days left?

That feels like forever

[Lukewarm]

Now my corvid.... Corwin, I'll defend your right to catch up to a point, and I don't care if you actually play Pooky's silly game. But like, you're demonstrating that you're not paying that much attention by using me as an excuse to cover for not providing reads. Provide them or not, but I cannot be your shield for the choices you make.

Check my history on that one if you want bro, I am staunchly against read lists and think they're easy ways to fake being involved without actually doing anything.

I'm just asking you for an ordered list of people, you don't even have to explain them

Of course such a list can be faked, but you have no other content to engage with

Right, because I have a third of the game I haven't read and probably half of the serious content based on the way people are posting here. And I literally started posting tonight with two slots that have my attention right now.

AND why in the world are you pressuring me to do something I think is a waste of time and easy to hide behind? And why are you saying I don't need to explain them then flipping around to "So we have content to engage with." You mean, so I can explain them?

I just want you to do it for the spreadsheet.

When it's got the whole pl, it's gonna be pretty lit with that whole perfect diagonal of white where the each player points to themselves on the other axis.

It will be beautiful. I mean, look at just the sample we got so far.

If you go all the way to the right of the image, you can already see the start of the white diagonal

[Lukewarm]

I do think some people need to back track a little and start taking safer reads/stances. Since a lot of times I feel like they're town binning people for poor reasons or just because they responded to them.

This is not something I intend to do on day 1 of a large game

[Lukewarm]

Don't do it Luke

What in the world is this in reference to?

[Lukewarm]

BlueBloodedToffee - ls
Dancing Puppets (Nancy Drew 39 and Titus) - t
Malakittens - n
Taly - n
PookyTheMagicalBear - lt
MalcolmTucker - lt
Galron -nlt
Cephrir - n
Frogsterking - ls
Roden - ls
Rad - nlt
Corwinoid - ls
The toad - t
Enchant - t
Dwlee99 - n
Bellaphant - n
Klick - n
Bell - ls
Dunnstral - nlt
JohnnyFarrar - n
Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9) - n
T-Bone - s
Cat Scratch Fever - nlt
Lukewarm - lt
PenguinPower - n

off the top of my head
ugh but im not happy w it so im gonna talk with gamma later

Marci, how is this a better system then just sorting them

[Lukewarm]

Also, I am only up to page 20 and I saw that Toog and Luke were in neighbourhoods. Has there been any news on the other people in there with them?

I'm with toog/taly. We don't know each other's alignments.

For the record, I have not been told the alignment of my hood partner either. But I am leaning town

[Lukewarm]

Yeah I get that, it was just something that popped into my mind as I saw neighbourhoods being mentioned.

I'm not saying elim someone because they're in a neighbourhood. But if they're scummy AND they're in a neighbourhood, well that's just a bonus.

Based on the mod comment about roles being determined before alignment, I believe that the hoods were arranged before the rand.

And there for people in hoods would have the same odds of being scum as anyone else in the game

[Lukewarm]

How come all of the leading wagons in this game are really bad?

scum are either strong players or lurking imo

If ceph flips scum, this becomes a funny post lol

[Lukewarm]

BlueBloodedToffee - ls
Dancing Puppets (Nancy Drew 39 and Titus) - t
Malakittens - n
Taly - n
PookyTheMagicalBear - lt
MalcolmTucker - lt
Galron -nlt
Cephrir - n
Frogsterking - ls
Roden - ls
Rad - nlt
Corwinoid - ls
The toad - t
Enchant - t
Dwlee99 - n
Bellaphant - n
Klick - n
Bell - ls
Dunnstral - nlt
JohnnyFarrar - n
Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9) - n
T-Bone - s
Cat Scratch Fever - nlt
Lukewarm - lt
PenguinPower - n

off the top of my head
ugh but im not happy w it so im gonna talk with gamma later

@Marci, what does “it” “is” and “nlt” stand for?

I believe its:
LeanTown
LeanScum
NullLeanTown

[Lukewarm]

Pooky is always town until he shows me otherwise

Rad cuzza what Luke said (also I'm in their pocket)

<snip>

The attitude you described out of Rad in the bottom of 360 felt townie to me

Johnny, I'm looking at your ISO, and I'm finding the bolded is a confusing way to describe why you think Rad is town.

At the bottom of Luke's 360 was used to scumread Rad. In fact, you seem to be townreading Rad

in spite of

what Luke said.

It kind of looks like you forgot why you were townreading Rad, and made up something after the fact tbh

Spoiler: post 360

Like. The amount of annoyed for the reason he perceived that I was using to scum read him feels out of line with a townie getting misread by a single player.

And also, he literally just moments ago was making comments about me possibly being scum, and there is not hint of him now saying that I am scum making a shit push.

Johnny I would still like clarification on what part of what I said led you to believe Rad to be town

Like I see what you're saying that you think Rad forgot his fake scumread of you when talking off the cuff, but I think scum Rad doesn't fail to be opportunistic there. The fact that he had that layup and didn't capitalize on it says he's less interested in winning an argument. Which plays townie in my ears

Another supplemental explanation that came later, but again, I feel like nothing Luke said convinced you of town!Rad.

I have a thought about this, but currently phone posting and not gonna try to dig for posts.

[Lukewarm]

Order matters very little, I'd prefer to do a tier-style list but figured it's most coherent to stick with the structure.

town

Galron
Rad
PookyTheFluffyBear

+ null

Dancing Puppets
Dunn
Bell
Dwlee99
Bellaphant
JohnnyFarrar
Lukewarm
Roden
Corwinoid

? null

Klick ***
MalcolmTucker
Cephrir ***
Malakittens
PenguinPower ***
Frogsterking
Cat Scratch Fever ***
Enchant

- null

BlueBlooded Toffee
The Toad
OffTheHook
T-Bone

***

= notes for people to look at next, or people I haven't actually give any skim at or contact with so far

For as little as the townbin is I'd fight for it.

Aren't you the one who had me and frogster as S+S in your notes? What changed?

[Lukewarm]

How come all of the leading wagons in this game are really bad?

scum are either strong players or lurking imo

If ceph flips scum, this becomes a funny post lol

I feel like it's also the type of post that can quite feasibly come from good/experienced scum? A lot of the time you assume scum maybe don't want to draw any attention to what the makeup of their team could be, but in a big game like this making associatives can be hard and I can see scum being more willingly to openly comment on what the scumteam may be like, even if only to misdirect.

It is a NAI post imo, but I realized it would be funny coming from scum ceph

[Lukewarm]

I do think some people need to back track a little and start taking safer reads/stances. Since a lot of times I feel like they're town binning people for poor reasons or just because they responded to them.

This is not something I intend to do on day 1 of a large game

Always be refining
-Bell

As I see new things, people can move up and down. I just meant i wasn't gonna "back track"

[Lukewarm]

Spoiler: Readlists So Far

Highlights so far:

BBT is the most susp'd person - 14 scumreads 0 townreads.
Lukewarm is the most townread person - 19 townreads 0 scumreads.

Does this mean that your gonna try to kill me now pooky?

[Lukewarm]

Nvm, found it. That’s pretty messed up on Sanae.
Well it’s not like it doesn’t make perfect sense for MALA to be the MiB but as someone mentioned, flavor/alignment.

I would guess hurley for talking to the dead, but :shrug:

[Lukewarm]

I plan to use my platform as Confirmed Town to start a new wagon tonight. Buy like, 5 hours from now.

Stay tuned

[Lukewarm]

Don't do it Luke

What in the world is this in reference to?

Taly brought up activity to read me

Oh lol

I think I sae Nancy say something similar, but decided it wasn't worth it since you were not actually a wagon lol

[Lukewarm]

I plan to use my platform as Confirmed Town to start a new wagon tonight. Buy like, 5 hours from now.

Stay tuned

Why the hell did I sign myself up for this?

Anyways, finally home. Guess I am gonna try and solve the damn thing.

[Lukewarm]

Klick why did you flip your read on me

I was thinking about how you would approach this as scum. At first I was thinking you wouldnt come for me early because youd see me as pocketable for you

But actually the timing along with the knowledge that bella is likely to sheep your vote per her implying as much makes it seem conveniently timed

Well to be completely honest all three of the players in my scumreads section are very weak reads and I'm a bit lost for direction. I've reconsidered and think that what you've posted so far could really reasonably come from you as scum. I think you're reacting fairly poorly under pressure and I could see it being the route you choose as scum here.

But like I don't feel strongly about it. Nothing feels right as scum atm. In contrast, everyone in the top rung of my townreads is a rather strong townread, as in I'd be surprised if they were scum

I like this post from Klick. It’s tends to be +town to be a lot more confident on your trs d1.

I don't have any statistics or anything, but this

feels

simply untrue.

Faking confident town reads is like one of the easiest things to do as scum lol

[Lukewarm]

Klick why did you flip your read on me

I was thinking about how you would approach this as scum. At first I was thinking you wouldnt come for me early because youd see me as pocketable for you

But actually the timing along with the knowledge that bella is likely to sheep your vote per her implying as much makes it seem conveniently timed

Well to be completely honest all three of the players in my scumreads section are very weak reads and I'm a bit lost for direction. I've reconsidered and think that what you've posted so far could really reasonably come from you as scum. I think you're reacting fairly poorly under pressure and I could see it being the route you choose as scum here.

But like I don't feel strongly about it. Nothing feels right as scum atm. In contrast, everyone in the top rung of my townreads is a rather strong townread, as in I'd be surprised if they were scum

I like this post from Klick. It’s tends to be +town to be a lot more confident on your trs d1.

I don't have any statistics or anything, but this

feels

simply untrue.

Faking confident town reads is like one of the easiest things to do as scum lol

I suppose but in general scum likes to push fake srs > having confident trs. But it’s not just having strong trs, it’s the he’d be surprised part but yeah, I guess that could also be fakable.

That is not my experience either as scum, or against scum. Forming strong town reads is both easier then faking a scum read (because you are just telling the truth for one, but lying for the other) and can also be used to pocket other people, eek into townblocks, ect. But probably not worth arguing the point with you

[Lukewarm]

Pooky is always town until he shows me otherwise

Rad cuzza what Luke said (also I'm in their pocket)

<snip>

The attitude you described out of Rad in the bottom of 360 felt townie to me

Johnny, I'm looking at your ISO, and I'm finding the bolded is a confusing way to describe why you think Rad is town.

At the bottom of Luke's 360 was used to scumread Rad. In fact, you seem to be townreading Rad

in spite of

what Luke said.

It kind of looks like you forgot why you were townreading Rad, and made up something after the fact tbh

Spoiler: post 360

Like. The amount of annoyed for the reason he perceived that I was using to scum read him feels out of line with a townie getting misread by a single player.

And also, he literally just moments ago was making comments about me possibly being scum, and there is not hint of him now saying that I am scum making a shit push.

Johnny I would still like clarification on what part of what I said led you to believe Rad to be town

Like I see what you're saying that you think Rad forgot his fake scumread of you when talking off the cuff, but I think scum Rad doesn't fail to be opportunistic there. The fact that he had that layup and didn't capitalize on it says he's less interested in winning an argument. Which plays townie in my ears

Another supplemental explanation that came later, but again, I feel like nothing Luke said convinced you of town!Rad.

I have a thought about this, but currently phone posting and not gonna try to dig for posts.

I am going to touch back base on this, because I also originally did not like this from Johnny at first, but once I asked him a few questions and looked back at the interaction, I actually ended up leaning back town on it.

Here are a string of posts all from the same page, back on page 15

First, there is the conversation that Johnny was already involved with (light posting with frog)

Spoiler:

I'm tempted to townread Johnny here.

Awww

Then, the immediate next post is my case against Rad.

Spoiler:

I find it hilarious that you found 1 post in a past game where I do ask for a follow up from someone and claim I'm scum for it

No.

When I read your post, my thoughts were "this approach does not feel like someone who is actually trying to sort me"

But I was worried that it was a personality quirk that I was misreading as alignment. So I spot checked the only meta that I have avaliable to see if that was the case.

I did not think you were scum because of meta.

Also, 357 just feels to me like scum annoyed at the reason they are being called scum

You're going to meta read me on 1 completed game and your 13 minutes of researching it? My first game since 2014? lol

I

find it hilarious

that you found 1 post in a past game where I do ask for a follow up from someone and claim I'm scum for it.

That's right. I'm incapable as town of doing anything but asking people for follow ups and my strategy there can never, ever change, adapt, evolve, or do anything slightly different.

And oh look, Frogster responded with good content for everyone to read and analyze. I wish I had just asked you a question about your read instead of making all this happen instead.

What a fail move I made

Like. The amount of annoyed for the reason he perceived that I was using to scum read him feels out of line with a townie getting misread by a single player.

And also, he literally just moments ago was making comments about me possibly being scum, and there is not hint of him now saying that I am scum making a shit push.

Johnny's very next post, and clearly made in response to my 360 is:

Luke reads great to me, y'all. No Luke or Rad votes today

This is actually the very first post where either Rad or myself show up in Johnny's iso.

So, it looks like Johnny did not think either of us were worth talking about. Read 360. Decided we were both town.

---

Then the post in question, where johnny is fairly clearly quick firing from memory why he town reads people

PookyTheMagicalBear
Rad
Corwinoid
Dunnstral
JohnnyFarrar
Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9)
T-Bone
Cat Scratch
Lukewarm

I reserve the right to add/remove

Pooky is always town until he shows me otherwise

Rad cuzza what Luke said

(also I'm in their pocket)
Corwin because some things are more important
Dunn looks solvey all over the dang place
Johnny because I like his butt
Hydra and TBone I covered
Cat Scratch has good vibes and I find myself agreeing with some of their takes

Luke cuzza that Rad case

and other general solviness. Plus us folks- that-have-actually-seen-lost have to stick together

So, while I struggled to see why what I said would result in Johnny deciding that Rad was town, it is actually incredibly consistent with what played out in thread.

Pedit: CSF, I was already working on it!

[Lukewarm]

Pooky, I was looking at your chart, and you have mine wrong.

I specifically wanted the "I have not retained any thoughts about this slot" people red

[Lukewarm]

After doing some reading, I am narrowed down where I want to move my vote to either Corwinoid and The Toad, but struggling to decided between the two.

Maybe they should just be dueling wagons?

[Lukewarm]

I don't actually know how to be town leader.

[Lukewarm]

Jesus

[Lukewarm]

Okay, I had been debating writing up a "I think that pooky would totally be down for doing this whole spread sheet thing as scum, because as scum he is not really reading the thread too closely, but this gives him a nice excuse to be active and posting, and look town, while really just having to keep an eye out for massive reads lists -- Plus, it is clear that pooky just had the idea that a massive table would be cool and I think he could both have that idea and decide to follow through with it as either alignment --- and like all in all, it is

probably[/i still more likely to come from town pooky, but I don't think people should just write him off as town just for it" But decided it wasn't worth it since, it felt like a lot to put out there to just land on "still leaning town, but don't forever bin"

But, I actually find that catch about his reads changing quietly on the spreadsheet as ++town for him.

Also, Rad moves from "town enough for day 1" to Town for finding that.

[Lukewarm]

After doing some reading, I am narrowed down where I want to move my vote to either Corwinoid and The Toad, but struggling to decided between the two.

Maybe they should just be dueling wagons?

Luke, are you still reading me as town? If so, I have some experience with scum!Corwin, so I don't mind doing an ISO dive on him now to refresh my thoughts and give an opinion. I can do it over the next 30-60min. Unfortunately I haven't read or played with a town!Corwin so I don't have a good comparison in that regard. Or we can do the dueling wagons like you suggest.

Just answered this question. And yeah. Would love to see your thoughts.

But also, I am going to bed. I got like 3 hours sleep last night, and it is now like midnight my time, and I cannot look at this screen for a single minute longer. But I will look for it when I wake up

[Lukewarm]

Okay, I had been debating writing up a "I think that pooky would totally be down for doing this whole spread sheet thing as scum, because as scum he is not really reading the thread too closely, but this gives him a nice excuse to be active and posting, and look town, while really just having to keep an eye out for massive reads lists -- Plus, it is clear that pooky just had the idea that a massive table would be cool and I think he could both have that idea and decide to follow through with it as either alignment --- and like all in all, it is

probably[/i still more likely to come from town pooky, but I don't think people should just write him off as town just for it" But decided it wasn't worth it since, it felt like a lot to put out there to just land on "still leaning town, but don't forever bin"

But, I actually find that catch about his reads changing quietly on the spreadsheet as ++town for him.

Also, Rad moves from "town enough for day 1" to Town for finding that.

Nightmare scenario:

Pooky+Rad scum team, and this is the most 5hbig brained plan, and I would happily lose to the scum team that came up with it, so gonna ignore that possibility

[Lukewarm]

Pooky before we get near a real flip, I think you should share your doc editing rights with someone you can trust, so we can keep up that spreadsheet in case you're targeted. Cause damn it's so good.

This feels like it would break site rules tbh

[Lukewarm]

Penguin and Dunn have both hit the "good enough for Day 1" threshold for me.

Luke, can you talk to me about this?

Apologies for going so far back, but it only takes a quick ISO. Where did the town read on Penguin come from?

Largely tone.

But also, his back and forth with Off the Hook (292-321) struck me as a town interaction. Penguin had not been properly interacting with much, but decided that that was the thing he was gonna dig in on. But kept it in theory. Did not structure it in a way to make OTH scum or Frog Town or anything.

Feel like scum!Penguin, who was sliding by on tone would have ignored, or at the very least not gotten so invested. OR he would have been doing it for a reason.

Felt genuine I guess.

Although, I have been kinda considering shifting him back down to null, because there has not really been anything memorable coming from the slot since.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: Roden

Feeling alright about Roden as possible scum at the moment.

Looking back and their reads list feels quite weak - the town section is quite generic with the exception of maybe Gaston. They have three SRs, one of whom is Toad, who their case against seems pretty weak, with C&G being another, again a SR that doesn't say much given their posting restriction.

While I'm reluctant to go too heavily on associatives early on I think Roden/Galron is a possible team - Roden's defence of Galron when they came under pressure didn't do much for me and felt like the type of early defence a scum teammate could easily make for their buddy.

I’m mulling back and forth whether his noncommittal read on me is possible a way to position to potentially push us later or why scum!Roden wouldn’t just straight up try to pocket me. Like I would expect Roden to tr me here, irrespective his alignment because there hasn’t been a single game that he hasn’t.

This feels like a town thought to me

[Lukewarm]

@Luke
I disagree on Galron, I may have asked you earlier about that read but haven't seen a reply.

I'm also confused on C&G being anywhere but null or off the table given how they can't actually communicate their thoughts in the thread.

What was the issue about Roden's defense, specifically?

Was all of this @me?

Once I get back to my computer I can make a post about galron, not sure what the rest would mean in reference to me because I have c&g null and don't remember saying anything about roden

[Lukewarm]

Hey @luke, why am I red for you? Can you come chat to me, I felt like we could have similar thoughts before (even when you were scum!) Some questions from you might help clarify my thinking overall.

I think this got missed too

Yeah sorry, I saw that post when I was was reading through on my phone, and forgot to come back to it when I was at my computer.

It was little things that made me squint when I saw your posts, and very little that I saw coming from you that stood out as townie. But was never anything major to the point that I was really interested in pushing you over the other slots I was more focused on at any given time.

---

I squinted at 427. Klick had put out a list of 7 town reads. You did not agree with 4 of them.

But the final line of that post was "The rest are town thoiugh, hard agree."

Like, it felt like it was framed such that you were mostly agreeing with Klick, while in context you were questioning more reads then you were agreeing with.

Felt off, and like you were not really being critical of klick reads despite it being one of the first substantive things I saw you comment on

---

I hated the "giving Roden a pass for today for his spoiler" line. (This was actually a pretty big one that stood out to me tbh)

---

I thought that your interaction with Frog in 466 and 467 was weird.

---

I actually liked your recent interaction with BBT though

[Lukewarm]

Also:

I was townreading Corwin - I think that he genuinely believes in 1742, and 1763 looks like a fairly complex thought even if I disagree with its conclusions.

Neither of these posts make me feel like the slot is more likely town.


1742 - I am not sure what makes this complex? The concrete points made are
:Reads lists bad.
:Maybe pocketing Bell??

The reads list one is super vague, does not actually tell me which, if any, of the reads they had issue with -- and also ignores the fact that that was not just a random, unsoliceted reads list. That was a post made in direct response to this post from Johnny.

ooooh, give me homework bb, my wallpost days are a bit behind me, me want conversation

Who are you familiar with here? I think you could give me some perspective on quite a few people

And the comment about Bell was basically "I feel better about Bell" which is some incredibly weak pocket attempting if that is what she was trying to do. (and ignores that if she wants to pocket bell, she has a whole PT in which to do it)

1763 - just reads to me as, "Mad that they got flack for being away when Mala was't" and I am unsure what makes that something that would bother town more the scum.

[Lukewarm]

Wow, what an odd conclusion to jump to. I can't quite describe my feeling...but it's like when you see a player post something and you feel they have a guilty mind about it.

+1

I don't actually think that that was a bad post from CSF. Here are the three posts, in a row, from a joint Frogster/Bella ISO around that time

Spoiler:

I'm going to go for a walk and get some fresh air so I can focus when I tackle 1967 and 1971.

VOTE: Johnny

[spoi/ler=]

For the record I like a frog vote. Dude seems shady. Lemme look at a plist and I'll give you the ones who should live to d2

Also Corwin talked a bit about his problems elsewhere, they're real and we should give him space.

Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9)
T-Bone

Can you go into these reads some more, and talk about why you're voting Frogster?

Post restriction has me curious. Not necessarily a townread but I would like to, y'know,

play

with Irch and RH9

I like T-Bone, and I don't think scum T-Bone picks a fight with the post restricted hydra here

Frogger seems to be... fake? Like sometimes they'll post something and I'll think to myself "there's no way they actually believe this"

Stand BACK while I post my ROCK SOLID D1 case on Frogger everybody. It'll have quotes and everything

[/s/poiler]

Johnny is the above still the best you have?

Because what you wrote about your read on me is terrible.

Wow fat fingers again, that was at Frogster

Do you think what Johnny wrote about his read on me is objectively terrible, or is it just me?

I mean I lean town on him so I think he's fine.

Trust me, I get the impulse when someone does something bad directed at you. It's something I fight all the time, not always successfully. I don't think you can objectively look at it since it's directed at you.

Yes and 1963 is bad even still. What caused Johnny's read to change, and if it did, why is he still voting me? I think scum!Johnny is too lazy to move his vote around, town!johnny moves his vote in 1963 if he hasn't done it already.

2080 is super town, tbone! What's your issue with cat.
?

UNVOTE: Johnny

VOTE: Bellaphant

[Bellaphant, ?, ?, ?, ?]

One way to read that is to ask, "what about 2112 made frogster decide that Bella was scum"

So, I can see where that question came from from CSF.

IMO, Frog's vote moving had nothing to do with the 1 post from Bella and more to do with the 28 posts from Johnny in the same span of time, so CSF's question was misguided, but I can see how you get there.

[Lukewarm]

I find it odd more people are commenting on 1763 than the original contradictor to explain it and a good chunk of the game is ignoring the question of where to look.

This is a good indication that people either need to slow down or scum are intentionally making the game too fast.

The question was answered.

Mala claimed her PR in her first post, in a way that I would not expect scum to do. Especially as it is a PR that I think that scum would not claim to begin with. (My answer, which Frog referenced back to when he answered as well)

Plus, her tone felt right when she was here (Cephrir's explanation, which I generally agreed with)

So, before she started lurking out, she started already at a town lean (for me at least).


--


Corwin's post tried to boil it down to :
I had lost posts, and got scum read
Mala had low posts, and was not getting pressure.

"CONTRADICTION"

I don't think that it was a contradiction for Frog to treat the two slots differently, because I also treated the two slots differently.

[Lukewarm]

I find it odd more people are commenting on 1763 than the original contradictor to explain it

Sorry, I guess I should have limited down the part that I was responding to to just this.

----


As for where to look, I would point you to pooky's spread sheet. He has compiled a large list of everybody's reads, so you can look to see who is being scum read by who, and who to look at yourself.

[Lukewarm]

Spoiler: Updated Chart So Far

So Far:

Top Townreads:

Lukewarm - 19 TRs
Rad - 17 TRs
Dunn - 16 TRs - 2 SRs
CSF - 14 TRs
Pooky - 14 TRs


Top Scumreads:

BBT - 12 SRs - 2 TRs
Toad - 11 SRs - 1 TR
Ceph - 8 SRs - 2 TRs


No Consensus:

Bell - 12 TRs - 7 SRs
OTH - 12 TRs - 5 SRs


Mostly Null:

D-Lee 3 TR 2 SR 17 Nulls
Bella 5 TR 1 SR 16 Nulls
C+G 5 TR 2 SR 15 Nulls

@Math

[Lukewarm]

I don't think you're scumreading pooky, I think townreads on pooky make you uncomfortable. And I think I know why

I personally don't think scum would mind pooky getting townreads too much tbh.

He is already a player that I think scum would want to night kill before end game, and I don't think of him as an easy player to miseliminate.

And he's not even trying to lead the town anywhere with those town reads.

If I saw him racking up a ton of town reads as scum, I'd probably just shrug and accept he is dealt with via night kills this game. And this is kind of how it feels scum have decided to treat me too.

I don't think they are currently worried about fighting against the most concensus townreads

[Lukewarm]

I do think some people need to back track a little and start taking safer reads/stances. Since a lot of times I feel like they're town binning people for poor reasons or just because they responded to them.

This is not something I intend to do on day 1 of a large game

Anyways, finally home. Guess I am gonna try and solve the damn thing.

After doing some reading

Does this make me scum too frog?

[Lukewarm]

I do think some people need to back track a little and start taking safer reads/stances. Since a lot of times I feel like they're town binning people for poor reasons or just because they responded to them.

This is not something I intend to do on day 1 of a large game

Anyways, finally home. Guess I am gonna try and solve the damn thing.

After doing some reading

Does this make me scum too frog?

I'm assuming this is a rhetorical question and you just wanted to make sure your posts are being seen.

No, I just hated 2414

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: mathblade

[Lukewarm]

Spoiler:

Yes and 1963 is bad even still. What caused Johnny's read to change, and if it did, why is he still voting me? I think scum!Johnny is too lazy to move his vote around, town!johnny moves his vote in 1963 if he hasn't done it already.

I stand by what I said earlier about the slot. "Haha yeah Frog's probably town" > followed by no unvote is a bad look regardless of Johnny's alignment. Now Johnny is attempting to frame his bad/scummy play as being my fault for saying something he can't be bothered to consider. Johnny is well within his right to play this way if he would like to, I just believe it makes him a good candidate to get booted off the island first.

I'd actually contend that this pushing on me is disingenuous and based on day old knowledge. I've made a POE that I'm slowly working through and have even ISOd YOU and you don't seem to have noticed or care. Why are you so against Pooky being townread? Why did you show up when Ceph voted you but not when I was talking about you yesterday?

You also claimed town!Johnny is too lazy to change their vote in 1963.

I'd actually contend that this pushing on me is disingenuous and based on day old knowledge. I've made a POE that I'm slowly working through and have even ISOd YOU and you don't seem to have noticed or care. Why are you so against Pooky being townread? Why did you show up when Ceph voted you but not when I was talking about you yesterday?

Not lining up with your earlier excuses:

I think you're overestimating town Johnny's effort levels

I haven't posted a gif as a pagetop because I can't be bothered to remember/figure out how to do it

I just don't agree with anything you are saying here.

I decided that i did not want you eliminated anymore like 20 pages ago, but my vote did not move because I did not know where I wanted it to go.

And then I really did not like the, earlier he said he was too lazy to figure out how to post a gif, and now he is talking about doing ISOs, so he is scum line.

Like, your saying that scum johnny made a big deal about mentioning how lazy he is as town, and then decided to start doing a POE list cross reference with Taly, then once he did that ended with a list of players to ISO dive, and started running through the list, commenting on each players iso.

That was also a completely self prompted affair, that he roped taly into doing with him. At a time when he had no votes on him, and even at the time when he was fully into the iso part, he had 2.

And you are framing that like it is more likely to be an scum inconsistency then a town one. That exact progression has been my own thoughts on the game. Telling Bell i can't be bothered to look back. Then being lost. Then doing a series of isos.

[Lukewarm]

Anyways, we are not killing Johnny today.

Help me kill Mathblade.

[Lukewarm]

Anyways, we are not killing Johnny today.

Help me kill Mathblade.

Ok

I help hide body.

Thank you for your support, but this post should have come with a vote

[Lukewarm]

Luke's 100% correct thoughts on Math's rep in:

2313: MathBlade prioritized reading his own slots iso on rep in.

You know who needs to make sure that they don't contradict the prior owner of thier slot?

Scum!

Case Closed.

---

But also, the way that he tried to latch onto corwinoid's post about Frog also felt weird.

I find it odd more people are commenting on 1763 than the original contradictor to explain it

Because, there is no sign Math actually did any of the follow up I would have expected from him if he was actually interested in this.

Like, checking to see if literally two posts after corwin's post, frog directly responded to it

{snip}

Not true, Luke and I both TR Mala slot. You can find the exact point I decided to rule out the Mala slot for D1 in my iso.

Or looking at Mala himself to see if there was a reason to think differently about the two slots.

[Lukewarm]

He is also conveniently landing on shading the slot that was the leading wagon in 11 out of 23 of this games Vote Counts, after skimming the vote count

[Lukewarm]

Maths just salty bc cori was salty bc I’m more obv town than they will ever be

Even when you are not reading the thread.

Spoiler:

And I know you are not reading the thread, because I left a message for you roughly 60 pages ago, and you never responded

[Lukewarm]

I have never cared about the reads of my predecessor upon replacing it.

I didn't mean checking reads.

I meant that as scum, you have to check if your predecessor did any claims or softs.

But :shrug:

I was already leaning scum on your slot prior to the rep in

[Lukewarm]

After doing some reading, I am narrowed down where I want to move my vote to either Corwinoid and The Toad, but struggling to decided between the two.

Maybe they should just be dueling wagons?

[Lukewarm]

Anyways, we are not killing Johnny today.

Help me kill Mathblade.

Why do you say we are not killing Johnny?

Because I am leaning town on him?

[Lukewarm]

I have never cared about the reads of my predecessor upon replacing it.

I didn't mean checking reads.

I meant that as scum, you have to check if your predecessor did any claims or softs.

But :shrug:

I was already leaning scum on your slot prior to the rep in

That doesn’t make sense and contradicts your prior post.

As I said I haven’t read anything. That post was linked I liked it and said so.

Why are you trying to manufacture it into something more than what it is?

I'm not sure what you think is a contradiction here. I never thought you cared about Corwin's reads. I thought you did an iso read of Corwin.

I saw you start getting into the thread. You said that you were going to skim vote counts. You said you did a Galron iso read. Then you quoted a post from your own slot from 30 pages ago.

From my pov, it looked like you went Mod iso -> Galron's iso -> Corwinoid's iso. I commented on that. Because, yeah. That seemed like an odd priority if you were town, but I could see scum needing to check for softs/claims.

You are saying that you did not do corwinoid's iso. It was actually that someone else linked the post. I see that CSF linked the post. So, sure. Happy to drop it.

However, that was not the backbone behind my vote on your slot. I had already narrowed who I wanted to vote down to your slot or the toad last night, before you ever repped in.

That was more of a "Here are new thoughts on the slot since the Math rep in"

I still think that it is weird that you saw that, but did not check to see if Frog ever responded. Or to look at Mala for yourself. But instead, said

I find it odd more people are commenting on 1763 than the original contradictor to explain it

Which I really did not like.

And that came on top of me already narrowing down to two people.

---

Since I narrowed it down to two people I was interested in, I saw movement happen in Malcolm's direction, and movement happen in Johnny's direction.

I think that both are town, so I decided it was past time for me to stop pussy footing it with my vote, step in to stop those two wagons, and vote one of the two that I was considering. (This should also answer your question on why I said that we were not killing Johnny today)

[Lukewarm]

That wasn’t a compliment. I recently played a game where we lost because NM deathtunnelled me for a nai opening post.

um...re-read my post?

I think that NM has above average reads tbh

[Lukewarm]

I think that NM has above average reads tbh

I've heard he has actually been doing a lot better than his previous meta.

Then neither of you read Schadd’s last game where he was one of the main reasons we lost,

I don't think that a having an example of a single bad game on any player is indicative of their abilities. Gonna drop this tho, he is not even here lmao

[Lukewarm]

I feel like Math's push onto Bell comes from him feeling the need to have somewhere to try to turn the discussion away from himself because I called him scum.

Instead of him actually thinking Bell is scum right now.

[Lukewarm]

I think that NM has above average reads tbh

I've heard he has actually been doing a lot better than his previous meta.

Then neither of you read Schadd’s last game where he was one of the main reasons we lost,

Wow - almost like one game doesn't define a player....almost.

Wow, like he did the exact same thing to another player before me - also deathtunnelled them for some ridiculous reason and obviously didn’t learn anything from that.

Every player has at least 1 bad scum read in literally ever single game that they play in.

Sounds to me like you just take it personally when someone incorrectly scum reads you, to the point of dragging it into different games. (This is not even the first time you have brought that game up)

I would very much prefer you not use this game as a place to bad mouth other players abilities where they are unable to comment to defend themselves.

So, I am asking you to please drop this conversation.

[Lukewarm]

I feel like Math's push onto Bell comes from him feeling the need to have somewhere to try to turn the discussion away from himself because I called him scum.

Instead of him actually thinking Bell is scum right now.

I literally invited you to make a case based on logic based on my predecessor.

How is that exactly turning the conversation away?

You really are grasping at straws here.

What part of asking me about my read precludes you from thinking "I need to start pushing in a different direction"

Because that was the point I was trying to get across. This feels like an argument about how I possibly used less optimal words to express that, and therefore it is to be dismissed entirely. Which is not a discussion I enjoy having on this site, though it does feel like I end up having those a lot.

I saw you actively responding to the fact that you were getting pressure.

Then latch onto a post to vote bell. Concluding that because you saw a single post talking about a video game, that you could then compare that to his entire prescence in a different game.

They seemed more contenty in WH13. Here it’s about a game.

It pings me wrong.

Trying to draw that comparison feels more like you were looking for someone to vote, then a real genuine basis for a scum read.

[Lukewarm]

Math reasonless 5 names can be scum even if impossible together

~Titus

Bell
Lukewarm
2-3 people on the Cephrir wagon at start

If only two then someone pushing me on replace in.

I like don’t have reads on half the game. So not sure what this serves

Pooky, I got a red read on the spread sheet now!

[Lukewarm]

4 8 15 16 23 42

These numbers seem to be coming up a lot in VCs.

I did a Google search and these numbers seem important to Lost.

Any suggestions Lost nerds?

they're the player numbers for the scum team, the mod put them in the first post as an easter egg

Unlikely. OP says 5 mafia.

And there are exactly 5 of those numbers that fall between 1 and 26, the number of players in this game

[Lukewarm]

Frogster, is there a reason that you are purposefully avoiding a Corwin/Math vote?

I seem to remember you having them in your scum reads for a while, but since I have suggested them as a player to be wagoned to day you have voted Bella->Ceph->Johnny->Me (lol)->Dancing Puppets

[Lukewarm]

Frogster, is there a reason that you are purposefully avoiding a Corwin/Math vote?

This was worded poorly.

Was originally "are you purposefully avoiding?" Meant to change it to "Is there a reason that you are avoiding" and the purposefully just got left behind lol

[Lukewarm]

Best Bird replaces PenguinPower

lmao

[Lukewarm]

Mala, were you aware that the OP says that there is a way in this game for the dead to communicate with living players? lol

[Lukewarm]

5. There are ways for dead players to interact with the game, so it's important to not spoil anything or talk about the game while it's ongoing with anyone.

This was a big part of me immediately believing that claim from you

[Lukewarm]

Okay, permanent spot on my scum reads list.

Who?

And lmao

Hi big bird!

He meant Penguin/BestBird.

Part of a running joke he has had with Penguin through out this day phase

[Lukewarm]

Reasons I think that Corwin was scum:

Johnny, you had an earlier town read on Luke, do you still feel that way and why?

Yeah, they haven't done anything to disturb that halo on their head. You think I missed something?

Not necessarily. My notes are "Dislike Frog and Luke, feels like ~350ish is s/s [\n] JF TR Luke?" so I've just been meaning to ask about it. Something wasn't rubbing right around then, but I suspect a lot of you have a better feel for him as a player than I do.

The copy paste off of the notes.

The notes look non-useful. But also, they literally never responded to the comments about their notes. They said nothing, but also never mention anything off of their notes again.

I actually think that if they had defended their notes usage I would have felt better about this. But the non-response just felt like them hoping it would go away.

---

Only person listed in his lowest tier for scum in 1442 was Mala. But then also seemed annoyed that he was being scum read for lurking.

Both of those are...

fine

on their own, but taken together rub me the wrong way. Like, how can you not be understanding of those scum reads, if you think that the scummiest person in the game is someone that the only words you put towards why you scum read them was

mala who's been both low activity and low content when she is posting.

---

A thought that started unrelated to Corwin was thinking about the way that the scum team is apparently treating me. When pooky posted the reads list, and I apparently had 19 town reads and 0 scum reads, I realized that that meant that at some point the entire scum team decided that it was not worth it to fight the growing consensus that I am town.

Obviously, the scum team would not have thought that out the gate. Early on there were a couple of people saying that they are hesitant to town read me in general (pooky, Bella) and some people outright scum reading me (Galron, Rad, Frog).

So the scum team should have thought that there would be possible support against me at some point (unless the scum team is exactly Pooky, Bella, Galron, Rad, Frog lmao), but then at some point this game decided to abandon hope of keeping me from becoming truly consensus.

And when I read through Corwin's iso last night, I felt like I saw that when I looked at his progression on me.

I started to gather up town reads, and he started trying to poke into them with 1107/1114. Floating me as one of his only two voiced scum reads, floating me as a partner to a fairly widely scum read player, and trying to talk Johnny out of town reading me.

But then he was met with strong backlash about his comment about his notes.

And that discussion was completely and totally dropped.

The next time I show up in his iso, almost all of the other reads lists have come out showing how consensus town read I am, and then I am not a scum read in his Reads list of 1442. No comment on anything I did making him think that I was town, no interaction with me, nothing.

And when it was brought up that I was not on there, here was his response.

Aren't you the one who had me and frogster as S+S in your notes? What changed?

That was me. I'm feeling Frog even less; you've just kinda dropped off my radar right now.

He scum reads frog even harder then before, but he just stopped thinking about me.

Which did not jive for me with the fact that his earlier working theory was that we specifically looked partnered. Because if he thinks two players look partnered, and then thinks that one of them is getting even more scummy, I just don't feel like you forget about that other player. If anything, he should have been looking at me even more??

[Lukewarm]

Thank you for doing what your hydra partner couldn't!

I am pretty sure that both the earlier posts refusing to elaborate, and that post elaborating were both coming from Nancy lol

[Lukewarm]

I think you're interpreting 1763 wrong Luke. He was making the comparison that not all low activity slots were being treated equally and was annoyed since it was his slot getting that unequal attention.

I am aware that the main basis for 1763 was annoyance at how he was being treated.

However, Mala was here in his reads list:

Town:
Corwinoid
Rad
Cytosine and Guanine (Ircher and RH9)
--
JohnnyFarrar
T-Bone
--

Null

Dancing Puppets (Nancy Drew 39 and Titus)
Taly Toogeloo
PookyTheMagicalBear
MalcolmTucker
Off the Hook (Gamma Emerald and Marcistar)
Galron
Cephrir
Roden
Dwlee99
Klick
Dunnstral
Lukewarm
PenguinPower
Bellaphant

--
BlueBloodedToffee
The toad

Frogsterking
Enchant
Bell
--
Scum

Malakittens

And, when I searched his iso as to why, that was the closest thing that I could find to a reason

[Lukewarm]

I plan to use my platform as Confirmed Town to start a new wagon tonight. Buy like, 5 hours from now.

Stay tuned

The time has arrived for me to take my place as town leader, and lead this town to a scum elimination.

If everyone can kindly vote Mathblade in their next post. Much appreciated.

Spoiler:

I'm only approximately 24 hours late lol

[Lukewarm]

tho I guess I could do it if I was a true tryhard

Pooky is it possible for bird to have this godawful a read on me and still be town here?

so it

is

literally just me saying that your slot is scum...and everything else was just chaff. cool.

No, I really don’t appreciate you continuing to mischaracterizing my posts. Just because I made this statement - in THIS post - doesn’t even remotely negate what I previously posted about your other reads. Are you even honestly trying to solve me or just continue to twist my words?

~N

You're in a hydra and I will respond to what your slot does as a hydra. Work it out in your hydra PT. I won't be acknowleding hydra dissonance here.

???

It’s MY posts you’ve been referencing, not Titus?

I believe all unsigned posts came from Nancy.

In my experience, Titus is pretty good about signing all of her posts when she is in a hydra

[Lukewarm]

I'm always down for yeeting Corwin

dude was scummy af when he was here

Do you think it makes sense that scum!Math wouldn’t know NM wasn’t actually a player in this game?

I am not sure why it would make more sense for town!math to have missed this then for scum!math to have missed it, and so I am treating it as entirely NAI

[Lukewarm]

I'm always down for yeeting Corwin

dude was scummy af when he was here

Do you think it makes sense that scum!Math wouldn’t know NM wasn’t actually a player in this game?

I am not sure why it would make more sense for town!math to have missed this then for scum!math to have missed it, and so I am treating it as entirely NAI

[Lukewarm]

I plan to use my platform as Confirmed Town to start a new wagon tonight. Buy like, 5 hours from now.

Stay tuned

The time has arrived for me to take my place as town leader, and lead this town to a scum elimination.

If everyone can kindly vote Mathblade in their next post. Much appreciated.

Spoiler:

I'm only approximately 24 hours late lol

So disappointed. I set an alarm for this yesterday. And this is what you give me? LATE?? I wanted something spicy.

If my scum read is on someone that you think is town, doesn't that inherently make it a spicy read from your POV.

[Lukewarm]

I'm always down for yeeting Corwin

dude was scummy af when he was here

Do you think it makes sense that scum!Math wouldn’t know NM wasn’t actually a player in this game?

I am not sure why it would make more sense for town!math to have missed this then for scum!math to have missed it, and so I am treating it as entirely NAI

My guy was clearly asking how NM was doing, not about his position in this game?

Huh. I read it the same way that Nancy read it the first time, but looking back at it now I can see it meaning

"Started providing content [in his games]" not "started providing content [in this game]"

[Lukewarm]

I wanted something new and exciting. You may as well have trotted out BBT, Frogster, or Ceph again!

I will have you know that when I looked at Corwin in Pooky's spreadsheet, there were only 4 out of 26 people with him down as red >.<

[Lukewarm]

The way that Nancy is responding to people scum reading her feels in line with how I have seen Nancy respond to people scum reading her as town.

Complete indignation at the idea that someone could think that she is scum, because she is so clearly incredibly town that you must be scum to not see it.

I have not actually read a scum game of hers to compare, but this recent bout of posting from her talking to Pengiun could be copy/pasted from any one of the 4 or 5 town games that I have read that she was in.

So, :shrug:

[Lukewarm]

Well, I guess it could be nai but it does possibly point to not being informed about the playerlist?

Yeah it’s weak but is it totally irrelevant?

The town and the scum team are equally informed of who is on the playerlist though is why I was saying it was NAI.

The only bonus information that scum!Math would have over town!Math is the scum team. And that would not help him know that NotMafia was not in the other 21 players on the playerlist.

However, I am now of the opinion that he never even thought that NM was in the game, so completely and totally moot

[Lukewarm]

Actually, does Titus feel strongly about her MathBlade townread?

Titus should answer this, but my only game experience with Titus and Math in the same game, Titus was town, Math replaced into a scum slot on Day 1, and Titus very strongly town read Math for the first like 70% of the game.

I got the feeling that with the familiarity between the two of them, Math knew what Titus would be looking for.

So, I think I will need her reasoning for the town read more then just her saying that she has it tbh.

[Lukewarm]

I'm really disappointed in all the town reads on me. If you're trying to pocket me...just know that it's working and I hate it. Someone spice up my life with a scumread please.

Rad started that wagon on you in response to this lol

[Lukewarm]

The way that Nancy is responding to people scum reading her feels in line with how I have seen Nancy respond to people scum reading her as town.

Complete indignation at the idea that someone could think that she is scum, because she is so clearly incredibly town that you must be scum to not see it.

I have not actually read a scum game of hers to compare, but this recent bout of posting from her talking to Pengiun could be copy/pasted from any one of the 4 or 5 town games that I have read that she was in.

So, :shrug:

I never copy/paste my posts unless, I’m posting an ISO from a previous game.

That was a figure of speech.

[Lukewarm]

I think he was using a figure of speech to illustrate you say you're obviously town in every game regardless of alignment.

T-Bone gets it !

[Lukewarm]

So, I think I will need her reasoning for the town read more then just her saying that she has it tbh.

Oh okay, for some reason I thought Titus was good at reading MathBlade. Maybe it was the other way around or maybe my brain just made it up :S

she is not good at reading mathblade rofl

Oh yeah, pooky was in that same game I was just talking about lol

[Lukewarm]

I need sleep.

I would love to wake up to a pretty mathblade wagon.

Good night!

[Lukewarm]

Updates:

DP => Scum
Mala => Scum

I feel like the fact that this whole conversation started with him saying it was an update made it clear he hadn't said it before this previously?

Rad. I would also appreciate more specifics , if you don't mind looking back over them

[Lukewarm]

I’m Sun. You can figure it out from there. If you can’t I’ll consult with my inner voice to me more explicit.

My opinion on the Hydra posting restriction, is that if it is real he is likely in a neighborhood with Sun.

That would give the slot an outlet to talk as much as they waty, and a way to keep communicating after they have run out of words (Jin getting Sun to "translate" for him). We also know that there is at least 2 claimed neighborhoods at this point. Could be with Toog, or could be a 3rd hood.

[Lukewarm]

@c+g

Do you have a hood read on Corwin/math?

[Lukewarm]

Math is town. told all of you naysayers, now hopefully you will take my reads seriously.

Is the "told all of you naysayers " because he claimed his hood?

Because we have at least 6 players in hoods this game. Don't think that is an alignment indicative role tbh

[Lukewarm]

I’m Sun. You can figure it out from there. If you can’t I’ll consult with my inner voice to me more explicit.

My opinion on the Hydra posting restriction, is that if it is real he is likely in a neighborhood with Sun.

That would give the slot an outlet to talk as much as they waty, and a way to keep communicating after they have run out of words (Jin getting Sun to "translate" for him). We also know that there is at least 2 claimed neighborhoods at this point. Could be with Toog, or could be a 3rd hood.

Can you like back off please if you’re town?

It’s hard enough trying to read everything and relay the hood properly and catch up.

If you think I am scum push me tomorrow or the next day

It’s really destructive and unfun to push me right now.

I was really hoping you’d see what I was saying if you’re town and why I scumread you.

I should not have had to claim here.

I'm off for bed.

I not sure why you responded to that post in particular, because that had nothing to do with your alignment and everything to do with me bragging about predicting your role existing like 1,500 posts ago.

Also not sure why the claim came now anyways. I've managed to rally what, 3 total votes against you? Lol

But regardless, I'm off for the night

[Lukewarm]

everything to do with me bragging about predicting your role existing like 1,500 posts ago.

2,300 even!

[Lukewarm]

Math is town. told all of you naysayers, now hopefully you will take my reads seriously.

Is the "told all of you naysayers " because he claimed his hood?

Because we have at least 6 players in hoods this game. Don't think that is an alignment indicative role tbh

It’s 100% not alignment confirming. I agree. It’s how I am playing it that is.

Why do you say at least 6 players have hoods? The game is bastard and the concept is people stranded.

I could see it possible scum can’t coordinate based on the lack of wagoning.

You and C+g are in a claimed hood.

Bell and taly are in a claimed hood

I have claimed to be in a hood, but my neighbor has not claimed.

That makes at least 6 people in hoods in this game

[Lukewarm]

I could see it possible scum can’t coordinate based on the lack of wagoning.

I have no reason to think that this is the case?

Scum team is already smaller then it probably should be for a game this size. I would feel pretty bad for them if they also don't even have day talk x.x

[Lukewarm]

There is a high likelihood you just spam the thread then I die and Jin can’t talk.

It is 2 am, and I have work in the morning probably won't be on for a while a pretty long stretch of time.

While I am advocating a wagon for for you, I never intended to speed elim you, or not even give you a chance to claim or anything.

Also, Jin claimed that their PR was day 1 only, so that last bit is not actually a real thing for anyone to worry about

[Lukewarm]

@c+g

Do you have a hood read on Corwin/math?

Yes.
-Guanine

CG had Corwin as town in their reads list, which I think we should take that to be their hood read on them to save them the words

[Lukewarm]

I could see it possible scum can’t coordinate based on the lack of wagoning.

I have no reason to think that this is the case?

Scum team is already smaller then it probably should be for a game this size. I would feel pretty bad for them if they also don't even have day talk x.x

I can. I have been scum without daytalk or night talk on MS before. We had to send PMs to the mod. It was a thing.

I could see something similar here.

It’s just really odd in 100+ posts we haven’t had a good wagon besides start of day.

There’s gotta be a reason.

A 26 player game with only 5 scum and no daytalk?

Yikes.

[Lukewarm]

I could see it possible scum can’t coordinate based on the lack of wagoning.

I have no reason to think that this is the case?

Scum team is already smaller then it probably should be for a game this size. I would feel pretty bad for them if they also don't even have day talk x.x

I can. I have been scum without daytalk or night talk on MS before. We had to send PMs to the mod. It was a thing.

I could see something similar here.

It’s just really odd in 100+ posts we haven’t had a good wagon besides start of day.

There’s gotta be a reason.

A 26 player game with only 5 scum and no daytalk?

Yikes.

My point in that post wasn't that it is impossible for a game to exist whete scum dont have day talk.

It was that, in this game in particular I doubt it because of the disadvantage already in place due to the size of the scum team.

That is already a decent point towards scum lack of an ability to coordinate a wagon. They don't have the combined voice/voting power scum teams normally have on day 1.

Also, there has been very little effort from the town for there to be someone trying to lead wagons either. (Part of why I thought I should try to do that)

[Lukewarm]

I am also unaware of what the lack of day talk had to do with the hoods.

You kinda duck tailed into the day talk thing from the hoods thing.

But, like you are in a hood and you say you are town, and say that you think that your partner is town.

So, what gets you from thinking you are in an all town hood to thinking scum doesn't have day talk?

[Lukewarm]

Are these not relevant to what you're talking about?

3. This game is bastard because it contains something bastard. It is relatively minor, don't expect tons of bastard mechanics.
7. Daychat and multitasking are in effect.

Oh. And also this apparently lmao

[Lukewarm]

I disagree with the lack of someone trying. We have too many heroes and it’s why I voted Frog.

You misunderstood my point. Can't be bothered to keep going.

Need sleep