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Post #103 (isolation #20) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:30 am
Postby Lovebird »
In post 98, Major Minor wrote:
Iconeum's push on BuJaber seems weak and phony. It basically comes down to "you didn't stop and rewrite your post to avoid possibly being read as scum for the contradiction" -- which, IMO, is a reason to point to Bu being TOWN, not mafia. Town doesn't have to go through that extra layer of thought because they aren't trying to hide who they are -- Mafia do. Would love to hear a response to this. The rest of Iconeum's stuff feels null at worst.
I dislike Lovebird's empty push on Iconeum, though. No reasons or anything? Feels opportunistic.
How is that opportunistic? What makes you assume I don't have a reason when you see something there yourself?
In post 115, Raskolnikov wrote:GL if you had to lynch 3 people right now, who would they be?
These are still weak reads but I'd go for:
Lovebird -- Still slightly pinged by that early and unnatural-seeming townread, and from her ISO. There's a lot of activity there but it doesn't read like scumhunting to me. It just looks like pecking (hah) at various things without enough reasoning for me to tell why.
ZZZX -- Mainly because his defensiveness is apparently not genuine and I question if that's town-motivated. Although if this is standard for him as you say, then I guess it may be NAI.
That's only two but that's all I've got here. Major Minor's 98 pings me slightly in ways I can't really put to words (too detached, I guess?) but that could be posting style for all I know. I don't scumread him in general yet.
I guess the theme drawing me towards Lovebird / ZZZX is "doesn't seem genuine". I'd rather see a lynch on that basis than on the basis of things that might just be playstyle and not really AI.
It seems inconsistent to me in what you attribute to playstyle and what you attribute to alignment.
In post 118, Raskolnikov wrote:GL are you secret scum hiding in town by not making any mistakes?
No, although I get the feeling scum are basically getting away with that. We need more pressure or direction or something right now, and less voting and scumreading on the basis of activity/lack of content. And more people posting in the evenings, Christ.
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Post #145 (isolation #25) » Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:53 pm
Postby Lovebird »
In post 130, GreenLiquid wrote:I consider insincerity in posts to have much more direct bearing on alignment because scum cannot be sincere by nature (they're not in the game to hunt scum). That's why, for instance, I question your really early townread, because I feel it's more natural for a townie to start a game feeling suspicious and looking for scummy behavior from other players (at least from my own experience) than to start off by townreading people. That, and there's a scum motive in throwing out an early townread that seems stronger than the likelihood that a townie would do the same. But you gave a reasonable explanation for it and that mostly mollified my initial scumread.
But, couldn't making early townreads be someone's style too? Besides, not like it was a choice, I just noticed something towny I thought, so said it.
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Post #146 (isolation #26) » Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:57 pm
Postby Lovebird »
In post 130, GreenLiquid wrote:Ico is null/leantown to me. I don't agree with your push on him -- his early posts don't seem empty to me, or at least not empty relative to what we've been dealing with this game. The only thing odd in my eyes is his 95 but I could be misunderstanding it.
What makes him leantown here? You only mentioned reasons for him not to be scum. And, I still think they're empty, though I guess that's lots of people. His stood out, though. Didn't think they were saying much.
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Post #285 (isolation #37) » Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:42 pm
Postby Lovebird »
In post 284, CheekyTeeky wrote:Just skimmed Lovebird, I can def see why theyre pinging people but I don't see them being scum either. I liked them looking to sort players from the get go in RVS - the whole Rask did a towny thing which I think is actually scummy but they were looking for clues none-the-less.
Chris/Rask both look to be posturing in RVS. Can anyone else see it?
Explain? You think it was scummy?
I guess I don't really remember anything chris said.
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Post #287 (isolation #39) » Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:44 pm
Postby Lovebird »
In post 278, GreenLiquid wrote:Iconeum is a town read for me, primarily because it seems like his pressure on BuJaber is motivated by trying to sort him and it seems like his reads are appropriately responding to what happens -- for instance, after we got clarification on BuJaber's pool logic, Iconeum accepted it and stopped pushing that piece. He doesn't seem like an especially strong game solver, but he does seem to be trying to reason through his reads at least.
I really don't see this. Don't think there's actually "sorting".
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Post #304 (isolation #47) » Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:03 pm
Postby Lovebird »
In post 300, BuJaber wrote:I think GL is scum. His push on me is bs and why anyone would defend Icon in this game is beyond me. He is a far better town player than this. He can't be defending him from a town pov. He must either know he's town or he is scum with him.
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Post #379 (isolation #51) » Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:04 am
Postby Lovebird »
In post 338, GreenLiquid wrote:The bit about defending Iconeum being scummy seems like it was tacked on to disguise this being an OMGUS vote. I don't get a sense of you having a strong scum read on him from your posting, certainly not strong enough to think that a player defending him is scummy.
I agree with this, was why I asked Bujaber that question about his read there. You think someone is scummy into voting someone else because they defend that scummy person seems like chainsaw, or something like that.
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Post #380 (isolation #52) » Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:05 am
Postby Lovebird »
In post 362, BuJaber wrote:Icon works as a potential lynchee that is not one of you 3 but if icon is town then I lynch what could potentially be a strong townie. (He seems like scum at the moment though so I am inclined to join a wagon there but I might not start one)
In post 383, Lovebird wrote:I was townreading him because seemed to be trying to sort people early, hadn't really seen anything that made me change my mind.
You'll be easily fooled by scum if you think this shallowly. What do you make of his OMGUS vote on ZZZX?
Idk, sometimes things just are like they seem. If it doesn't work out then I can rethink later. I'll look.
In post 79, ZZZX wrote:I can see a billion reasons to push that are legit, You picked the wrong one.
Did rask push inactivity as scum?
He is pretending to give content by doing that while he is just adding noise
In post 83, Raskolnikov wrote:I won't say it's content, but I also don't think it's noise. This game is objectively very slow and this is a lot less pages than usual by this time frame.
I think you might be defensive too as it feels like you're taking it as a direct scumread or shade on you but I don't feel like that's how it is.
In post 85, Raskolnikov wrote:I should bring up I like to POE and this kind of gamestate is not so has not been good for that.
I suspect through how most people are that 1 scum is uninvolved because I usually have more scumreads by now. I don't think this prediction is like bujabers though because I feel like this is based on (hopefully not inaccurate) reads and not whatever his was based on (I'm still not sure).
Anyone who has more than 1 or 2 solid reads at this stage is plain lying and talking bullshit or making up reads.