Mini Normal 2108 : 1st game

[BrightEyedFish]

VOTE: Wake88

Hello!

[BrightEyedFish]

EBWOP

My vote is on wake because this was going to be my excuse if I have trouble getting engaged on D1.

[BrightEyedFish]

EBWOP

My vote is on wake because this was going to be my excuse if I have trouble getting engaged on D1.

So do you find it scummy or is this a reason to rvs???

RVS for now. Even though the idea of pre-determined lurking is yucky.

I like to use VCA for my reads and VCA is useless until we get a flip so my D1s are also always yucky...

[BrightEyedFish]

As much as I would like to be able to confirm someone's alignment by their first post, I have yet to devise a good strategy on that front. My vote was RVS but Wake's post did feel a little off.

I've had my ass handed to me by conf bias a few too many times so I am always doubting my D1 and RVS reads. But you gotta start somewhere.

Man this game got serious quickly. I was hoping for more joke posts but I am not familiar with most of this playlist so let's see how it goes.

[BrightEyedFish]

I take that back it looks like I've played with 50% of this playerlist.

[BrightEyedFish]

EBWOP

My vote is on wake because this was going to be my excuse if I have trouble getting engaged on D1.

your excuse in this game in particular or in games in general?
have you used this excuse before?

Games in general. My reads on D1 are basically always gut/vibe/inconsistencies. I like to use VCA as a starting point for my more substantial reads and until we have a flip it's hard for me to start making associations.

For example:
I want to believe with all of my heart that this hectic/robb thing is scum theater. It could very well be, see I'm already heading in that direction.

[BrightEyedFish]

So bef, do you have any other thoughts on the game? Reads on anyone else?

The game got off to a blazing start, making me dizzy and paranoid.
Here is a shotgun reads list, and before anyone asks, these are all gut reads based on ISO reading:

bob3141 - null, 1 RVS post
Tchill13 - Town lean, his "i've changed" post seems genuine. However, alone it's not AI and could be a ploy.
Garmr - I don't get why he scum reads me but if this game is anything like my other games, I'll probably say something "scummy af" get a wagon on me (usually led by scum)
Robbnva - Null - The amount of posts makes me want to put Robb in the scum pile but I don't like committing too early.
Wake88 - My RVS vote is there now, but I feel fine leaving it there even out of RVS for now
skitter30 - I always think skitter is town and I'm pretty sure I've never played with scum!skitter. Just going on odds RN. Town.
Hectic - Hectic's post fit his name well. Scum lean just for the abrasiveness.
Rabid Schnauzer - I want to put Rabid in the scum pile but as I'm writing this I am getting the feeling that I am just scum reading the most active players.

[BrightEyedFish]

Thanks. Why do you like your wake vote? Do you think he has done anything scummy? if so what?

More like the opposite. He hasn't done anything towny to move it.

[BrightEyedFish]

@fish:

do you recall a game in which I was scum, you were town, and a neighborhood played a big role? I think (but not sure) skitter might have been in it too. I'd like to read it but can't find it. If you know what game that is please let me know. Thanks.

Maybe you're thinking of Pret Mafia

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=78424

[BrightEyedFish]

So the posts doubled after my

shotgun reads list

©RCEnigma

Which is a

shoot from the hip

,

not much thought

,

gut-based

lists. And let me add it was after

7 pages

.

As far as my Hectic read is concerned, I really can't tell if he is just

JK

or being

serious

and that's why I don't trust that slot.

[BrightEyedFish]

If I missed any specific question someone asked, just rnd meemi

[BrightEyedFish]

So the posts doubled after my

shotgun reads list

©RCEnigma

Which is a

shoot from the hip

,

not much thought

,

gut-based

lists. And let me add it was after

7 pages

.

As far as my Hectic read is concerned, I really can't tell if he is just

JK

or being

serious

and that's why I don't trust that slot.

My post on your reads list was serious, how does that affect your read on me knowing this?

It doesn't really affect my read on you.

When I said "serious" I meant more of your posting style in general. I'm having trouble viewing your posts as genuine as I get the feeling you are roleplaying to your handlename.

Do you have any other open alts that I might have played with before?

[BrightEyedFish]

There's been a stomach bug travelling around my house and hit me as well. But we're in the clear now. Catchup post(s) impending...

[BrightEyedFish]

Here are the most active players atm:

Robbnva
Tchill13

Rabid
Hectic
skitter

These groups are grouped by number of posts. Robb and tchill are way ahead of the other 3. With the rest of the players (including myself) are far behind in terms of shear quantity.
Alone these stats are nothing we can use to sort the players. However, scum has to been within these 5 players probably even multiple scums.

My wake vote started as a RVS and I just parked it there because I wasn't opposed, but wake is MIA now. If I wanted to vote a lurker I would think wake would be the closest to scum. But I'm more interested in the active posters now so:

UNVOTE:

but...

I do think at least one wake's scumbuddies would be picking up the slack in the active posters list.

Hectic's 344 feels an awful lot like coaching to me...

VOTE: Hectic

[BrightEyedFish]

im usually extremely inconsistent and if youve made statements similar but im completely igonring youre posts...

then im not seeing the statements. so i cant push you for those statements.

So you're just not reading my posts then?
(After the whole 'skitter is gud' thing?)

I've also given reads on bef and rabid on the previous page.
Hectic gut town, robb is scummy

Skitter is town.

[BrightEyedFish]

So you're just not reading my posts then?
(After the whole 'skitter is gud' thing?)

I've also given reads on bef and rabid on the previous page.
Hectic gut town, robb is scummy

im scum independent of robb though?

and i tend to ignore wall of china posts.

Posts like these make me want to SR tchill but I don't feel a case can be built right now. I just think all of tchill's posts have a inkling of scum in every post in every game.

[BrightEyedFish]

EBWOP

*can't be built

[BrightEyedFish]

Ok then

A) i strongly disagree that i'm manipulating what you're saying to make it look bad, i dont understand what you're saying and why you're making the pushes you are, you dont make sense and what you're pushing isnt consistent

B) you're scummy independant of robb, i'm not sure i agree with the assumption that scum!robb means you cant be scum, which is what your current argument is based on

C) i dont get why you arent pushing me for saying i want to sheep you on robb, you're basically ignoring that while pushing rabid for nearly the same thing

Do I have to choose between skitter and tchill now?

[BrightEyedFish]

it's really annoying, and scummy when a player says players are scummy without explaining why even when asked. It is also annoying when a player doesn't explain why they are town reading people and when shown really damning evidence to counter the town read and is asked to comment on it, ignores it completlt.

I have revised my lynch list to rabid/skitter/hectic/wake in that order. I actually think skitter may move ahead at some point because I don't see myself agreeing with much of anything she has said this entire game and the fact that she blatantly ignores important questions and can't be bothered to actually explain why she has the reads she has, leans super scummy.

I'm starting to doubt my skitter TR. This feels right in a weird way. It's like I don't want to get caught up in conf bias by SRing but I never really thought about it could go the other way with TRing skitter.

[BrightEyedFish]

@Skitter

Care to give us a shotgun read on everyone?

[BrightEyedFish]

this is why players like wake win as scum so easily.

active players egos force them to find scum in other active players because the "win" of this game is finding scum. If you can not find scum you subconsciously think you are not good at the game. Ppls egos cant take that.

im not talking about robb specifically but the site as a whole.

BEF/Bob/Wake/gamr have provided little to nothing.

almost 50 percent of the game.

I can practically guarantee you on math alone that one scum is in there.

You took the exact opposite of my approach. Can we both be right?

[BrightEyedFish]

BEF town game:
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=79261

BEF scum game:
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=77859

My Wiki is up to date with more samples of both alignments.

[BrightEyedFish]

Ok. Caught up now. I find it hard to comment on alot of these 1v1s we have going on as I don't want to feel like I'm intruding, this goes for IRL stuff as well. I tend to let people work it out themselves and only jump in if I am asked or I find some grave injustice.

So, since this game got away from me and I haven't found any real footing I'll try to correct course. However, I feel like people are using my "lynchbaity" style like a pawn and not really letting me speak for myself. I enjoy being defended of course but I just don't want people to get my ideas (if I ever have anything good) twisted.

[BrightEyedFish]

@Hectic

Can you rank these players for me in order from scum to town?

Robbnva
Tchill13
Rabid
skitter

[BrightEyedFish]

Looks to me like Hectic wants to be replaced by someone with a stomach bug

Is this a reference to me?

[BrightEyedFish]

Hectic's 344 feels an awful lot like coaching to me...

why would that be happening here and not in the scum pt?

bef is still townie

Before I wrote that I checked the OP and didn't see anything about scum having day talk. That's why I think it could be coaching.

[BrightEyedFish]

19. Private topics are open at all times. Roles which have private communication are permitted daytalk.

oh, must have missed it. I take back the coaching comment.

[BrightEyedFish]

If she and tchill are scum, then yes, the switch makes sense, precisely because he is at risk of a lynch going through.

I distance better than that as scum, thank you

The read switcj happened because i suddenly understood his pov and it made sense holistically

Why do people feel the need to say how they would play IF they were scum? Regardless of alignment, such statements are always scummy imo.

Is skitter a player who always talks about what scum!them would do when they are town?

[BrightEyedFish]

Unfortunately the reason why got deleted and probably can’t talk about but it’s enough for me to lynch today. I don’t see this slot being town.

+1. Unfortunate for the replacement, because I don't see it being redeemable. Its a LYLO nightmare, would basically be a coin toss for whoever is left at LYLO on this slot.

[BrightEyedFish]

I do think tchill vs garmr could be TvT tbh. tchill seems pretty confident in his meta read and his push feels real and I don't think scum!tchill would make a big push on town!garmr this early in the game.

That being said, I don't think garmr is scum, he just seems indifferent imo.

[BrightEyedFish]

if you think i'm scum here you must think i'm bad at it so gtfo

this comment comes specifcally with robb being my scum mate in mind.

this is just inaccurate. Ive pushed garmr and pressured/ vote hopped. I cant help if ppl refuse to pressure with me.

I guess it can't hurt. I'm not getting town vibes, not getting any really vibes from this slot. But since you have all but begged for help on this wagon, I'll oblige.

VOTE: Garmr

[BrightEyedFish]

GEEZ

Now I just want to lynch both tchill and garmr just to get them to stop. This feels like something personal and has nothing to do with this game.

@Garmr
Are you just OMGUSing tchill for his vote or are you still mad about another game?

Besides tchill who else do you find scummy?

UNVOTE:

Since this was a L-2 and now I am totally lost on both slots. I think it could still could be TvT but these 2 have something to work out that doesn't feel related to this particular game.

@tchill


I'm justgoing to stick with robb at least he hates everyone the same and besides he is putting in the most work.

VOTE: skitter

[BrightEyedFish]

btw, @ everyone - Hectic fake replaced out and told his replacement to claim macho cop. The mod deleted the post and issued a warning and hectic claimed that made him confirmed town. I feel like this information is useful. I wish the mod would not have deleted the post. bob and bef saw that post and can confirm.

I confirm.

[BrightEyedFish]

btw, @ everyone - Hectic fake replaced out and told his replacement to claim macho cop. The mod deleted the post and issued a warning and hectic claimed that made him confirmed town. I feel like this information is useful. I wish the mod would not have deleted the post. bob and bef saw that post and can confirm.

I saw it too, but I respect mod's decision and so didn't bring it up.

Where do bob and bef talk about it?

I don't think me or bob mentioned it.
It was a rage-replace out and who knows if it was anything other than WIFOM BS.

[BrightEyedFish]

@bef - bob mentioned it, you asked bob if it was a jab at you being sick. i don't think you actually talked about it other than that.

Oh I remember. He said something about a stomach bug and I thought it was a reference to my post before hectice replace out post...

[BrightEyedFish]

BEF what do you think of rabid?

Null on Rabid alone, including Menalque's posts, leaning scum. The fact that the replacement still has similar scumreads is disheartening. Feels like sticking to the script imo.

[BrightEyedFish]

BEF town game:
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=79261

BEF scum game:
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=77859

do we know why this post was made?

iirc
I think there was some discussion about why he thought I was a bad D1 lynch.

[BrightEyedFish]

VOTE: Menalque

I don't really trust the 2 on the Bob wagon right now and my TRs are on this slot, so I'll move my vote back there.

[BrightEyedFish]

That's L-2

[BrightEyedFish]

Do you have any independent reasons for why my predecessor was scum @bef?

I kind of thought he was "coaching" wake in one post. And I know that stretching and would also mean that wake is his partner but that was my "independent" reason. But as of now my main reason for voting you is sheeping my TRs.

What are your thoughts on creature?

[BrightEyedFish]

Can we BEF him now?

What does this mean?

[BrightEyedFish]

So we have 2 people at L-1 right now and neither t has claimed?

[BrightEyedFish]

I'm about to hammer Bob just because I hate NLs.

[BrightEyedFish]

Sadly menal isn’t at l-1

Bob moved his vote there. That should be 4 if the latest VC is correct.

[BrightEyedFish]

Wait to hammer. The menal wagon looks better. There isn’t a single townie player on the bob wagon.

I agree. But I don't want a NL.

[BrightEyedFish]

Wait to hammer. The menal wagon looks better. There isn’t a single townie player on the bob wagon.

I agree. But I don't want a NL.

why do you agree there's not a single townie player on the bob wagon, and why is my wagon better when I'm p sure you said you were voting me -- by your own admission -- because you were sheeping your TRs rather than actually SRing me?

I agree that I'd rather lynch you over bob.

[BrightEyedFish]

Tbh I'd prefer to lynch the hectic/Creature slot but it's way too late to get a new wagon.
I'm about to sign off for the night and robb said he wouldn't let us NL. So I'll just keep my vote parked here and let Robb or tchill end the day.

[BrightEyedFish]

okay why are none of the players on the bob wagon townie?

Going by math alone there has got to be town on both wagons. There is no way we have a 4 player scum team.

[BrightEyedFish]

okay why are none of the players on the bob wagon townie?

Going by math alone there has got to be town on both wagons. There is no way we have a 4 player scum team.

okay yes, obviously, that's still not really answering the question

rob said "none of the players on the bob wagon are townie"

you said "I agree"

I want you to explain why you agree with that assessment

I agreed that your lynch is preferable to bobs. I didn't agree to that I'm SRing all on the Bob wagon.

[BrightEyedFish]

I get why you would think that from the way I worded my post. I'll lro3should have flushed my "agreement" out more

[BrightEyedFish]

*I should gave flushed..

[BrightEyedFish]

*have

Geez

[BrightEyedFish]

okay seeing as we're at crunch time why is my lynch still preferable to bob? what's your actual take on my play beyond what your TRs think?

Who knows really. I mean we are all basing our votes on git at this stage. Soms people add meta or personal reasons to their reasons for voting. On D1s I'm practically always a sheep. I've been caught up in death tunnels a few too many times and they are never fun. I've became fan of VCA recently but VCA is also all gut until we get a flip and can start making associations.

Tl;dr
I can't name a good reason that is anything other than circumstantial to vote anyone right now

[BrightEyedFish]

Hello back to the friendly neighbor! (don't want to out your name but I will confirm if you choose to claim)

[BrightEyedFish]

(don't want to out your name but I will confirm if you choose to claim

"don't want to out your name but I will confirm if you choose to claim"

I will only out before if the other person wants me to or is in danger of a lynch. Don't want to give scum any info on a conftown if not needed.

[BrightEyedFish]

I really need BEF to come in and contribute more.

I don't want him getting mislynched for not being active.

TAADAA, ask and you shall receive...

Sorry. Been on daddy duty since my kids kindergarten is closed today and tomorrow but I'll post when I can.

The rational and statistically sound option is to lynch from the bob wagon. If that wagon was all town then we are doomed anyways.
Let's start at the beginning.

VOTE: skitter

[BrightEyedFish]

I really need BEF to come in and contribute more.

I don't want him getting mislynched for not being active.

TAADAA, ask and you shall receive...

Sorry. Been on daddy duty since my kids kindergarten is closed today and tomorrow but I'll post when I can.

The rational and statistically sound option is to lynch from the bob wagon. If that wagon was all town then we are doomed anyways.
Let's start at the beginning.

VOTE: skitter

Who's Conftown?

*cocks trigger*

Well, you can assume I wouldn't vote them.

[BrightEyedFish]

I need confirmation.

I'm not going to make assumptions based on vague hints.

If BEF can confirm someone is Conftown NOW IS THE TIME.

I feel differently. It's not my place to out this person atm. Don't you see that helps scum to POE as well.

[BrightEyedFish]

Bef you ought to unvote

I see your post and then that quote right underneath it.

[BrightEyedFish]

Not really but ok

Refusing to explain how you got your reads is scum indicative. I have yet to see you do anything to help town. So yes really.

Explain to me how having a Conftown on someone via Friendly but not sharing it during MYLO is not Scum indicative.

Why out it if they aren’t a threat to get lynched?

Because if we mislynch I wouldn't then SHOOT that person instead of Scum

Would you shoot skitter?

[BrightEyedFish]

Why are you being dumb?

Robb, do you understand we're in MYLO?

If BEF has a Conftown result, it needs to be shared now.

If we arein MYLO wouldn't scum just come out and hammer skitter for the win? I think the problem is that skitter is caught scum and thus no quick-lol-scum-hammer

[BrightEyedFish]

OK, I'm not playing this game if you fuckers don't want to work with Conftown Vig Duri MYLO. Fuck that. If you won't fucking share the information Town NEEDS then I'm calling out both you Robb and BEF as Scum. Town has absolutely NO reason to withhold such important information.

VOTE: BEF

Don't blame this all on me. You shot town last night and that put us in MYLO. Like I have said a billion times. I will not let the FN get mislynched and I think the benefits of the FN announcing himself to someone else tonight outweighs you shooting in the dark again.

[BrightEyedFish]

bef do you not understand that if we mislynch and wake shoots town tonight (hey maybe even your fn) it doesn't matter whether or not the fn announces himself to someone else, since the game will just be over

and isn't it better for the fn to conftown himself to everyone now instead of to just one other person tonight?

Well then maybe wake should holster tonight.

[BrightEyedFish]

BEF is Scum.

He is lying and will not help Town by revealing the Conftown.

He is lying, he is anti-Toen, and must by lynched today.

The FN could just out their role if they wanted. I just find it funny that skitter who has the leading wagon right now is pushing for info that will have no effect on those who are voting her.

[BrightEyedFish]

BEF is Scum.

He is lying and will not help Town by revealing the Conftown.

He is lying, he is anti-Toen, and must by lynched today.

The FN could just out their role if they wanted. I just find it funny that skitter who has the leading wagon right now is pushing for info that will have no effect on those who are voting her.

Reveal the FN or you're going to get lynched or shot.

I'll stay loyal. If the FN wants me dead then they can stay quiet as I'm lynched and that's on them. Besides it wouldn't matter anyway if we are doomed with a mislynch today.

[BrightEyedFish]

you realize that fn doesn't know your alignment, right?

like you're trying to get points with an fn that's probably going to be claiming anyways at the expense of pissing off the vig who wants to shoot you

We the FN might have some loyal modifier and that's why I announced that I received the greeting (I've have something similar in a past game go south because the recipient didn't announce). If the vig can't stay objective and shoots someone out of spite then I can't really do anything about that.

[BrightEyedFish]

At this point I don't even care if Skitter's Scum.

BEF withholding this vital information from me deliberately in MYLO when I am confirmed TOWN is intolerable.

If the day is over and you don't have the info you need going into the night then go ahead and shoot me.

But the day isn't over yet

. The FN has nothing to do with my read on skitter. Focus on that for now.

[BrightEyedFish]

of course vig + fn seems to poweful for a game this size but maybe we'd have a better sense of the setup if we massclaimed

pedit well while you're posturing hte day might end since, you know, you're enabling a quickhammer rn

Now that you are finished trying to discredit me as a player so you are moving to discredit my FN claim.

If you were town I'd bet you would have already been hammered. But alas, no hammer.

[BrightEyedFish]

you realize that argument only works if everyone has posted, right?

the people who could do the quickhammer haven't posted since you voted, so that argument is also meaningless

Who hasn't posted today?

[BrightEyedFish]

If Scum doesn't quickhammer while I sleep, we break BEF's neck when I wake.

Wait... isn't this the same logic you are criticizing me for when I say that scum hasn't quickhammered skitter?

[BrightEyedFish]

but seriously, this isn't getting anywhere... I'm getting voted for not announcing a conftown instead of people actually disagreeing with my skitter vote.

[BrightEyedFish]

If you won't help Town by revealing the FN, then this is how it goes down.

I will reveal when the time is right if the FN doesn't announce first. But again, trust me when I say it has nothing to do with my skitter vote. Can we focus on actual scum hunting right now?

The only reason I announced it is that the FN would know that there action went through.

[BrightEyedFish]

If you won't help Town by revealing the FN, then this is how it goes down.

You are literally with confirmed Town and refusing to share vital information WITH the Town.

How do you expect NOT to be seen as an enemy to Town doing that?

I am fighting with you conftown but I am also protecting another conftown. Don't kill the messenger.

[BrightEyedFish]

@Wake

Now, if you would just let the FN thing go while you answer this post:

Why do you TR skitter?

[BrightEyedFish]

i mean i asked you about y our vote on me but you ignored me so

I'm working my way through the bob wagon. You were the first stop and I think i don't need to go any further atm.

[BrightEyedFish]

Good. Gooood.

ALL players have had a chance to post, now.

Assuming Scum have Day Talk, they did not quickhammer on BEF for game.

SO, BEF is Scum. Scum would not wait to win the game when they could have quickhammered as I slept.
.

Yeah but I'm sure one scum (skitter) was already on my wagon.

I confirm Rob as the FN.

I'm VT. Skitter claim has to be bogus don't care about the other scum right now (probably garmr or tchill)... can't focus. Every game I'm in I eventually get mislynched. I guess it just my style and other town have no problem seeing me go. and I really don't get it. Blah Blah Blah lynchbait, blah blah blah for mechanical reasons it just gets frustrating. I get this is a game of manipulation but people always get tunneled on me and just will kill me out of spite.
I've really got to evaluate how to approach a game.

I'm VT and Rob is FN. That's all the info I have.

[BrightEyedFish]

robb hasnt agreed to send the message to me.

All players have posted and Scum didn't quickhammer.

You do realize you can say this same thing about skitter.

I don't know what else you want from me. I was wanting to scum hunt but you wouldn't let the FN thing sit aside long enough for me to talk about anything else and I couldn't really get invested in it.

I still think we HAVE to lynch from the bob wagon.

[BrightEyedFish]

who are you shooting?

It's too early to say.

lololololol

Isn't this the same thing you went all death tunnel on me on? Not wanting to give out my information????

Is this real life?

[BrightEyedFish]

I would totally OMGUS vote you right now if you weren't conftown

[BrightEyedFish]

Seriously though,

I have death tunneled before too and it lost us the game. (Sorry Nancy if you are reading this) So maybe it's karma and I deserve to be on the other end of it this time... but its so frustrating

[BrightEyedFish]

On the bright side, if you are lynched as Town then Robb is confirmed, and I'll have good odds of shooting Scum tonight.

Having doubts...

but it's hard to root for the team that's throwing you under the bus tbh. Skitter fits all criteria for scum and you are just staying on me because I didn't give you the FN info soon enough that had ZERO effect on either mine or skitter's slot.

[BrightEyedFish]

in fact you KNOW that town!rob is on the skitter slot and your biggest TRs skitter and tchill are sitting on me? Think about that...

[BrightEyedFish]

I've already said everything. I'm VT, rob is FN.

[BrightEyedFish]

I didn't fight with anyone.

I said I wouldn't let the FN get lynched and I kept my word. You were just hell bent on me outing someone when it was needed.

You got all caught up in that and scum latched on.

Of course you have the blame for my mislynch but since you are conftown you won't pay the price for it.

[BrightEyedFish]

Well. If this truly is mylo then its gg.

[BrightEyedFish]

And besides you got the info and STILL pushed for my lynch. This is 100% on you. But hey its just a game. Still don't throw blame where it doesn't belong.

[BrightEyedFish]

I just want you all to lynch skitter tomorrow. 100% scum there.

[BrightEyedFish]

Ohh actually im kinda glad. No active games for me right now. I need a little break.

[BrightEyedFish]

Last reads, BEF?

Assuming you're Town, they'd be extremely important to me.

Cross my wagon with Bob's wagon. There's your answer.

[BrightEyedFish]

Thanks for the game. Aside from the setup ot was a weird mix of personalities.

[BrightEyedFish]

Just made everything feel like a chore.